From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 00:22:28 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA11068; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 00:22:08 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 00:22:08 -0800 Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 02:23:23 -0600 (CST) From: "Frank C. Earl" X-Sender: fearl@localhost To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com cc: KeelyNet-L@lists.kz, vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: BAT Info In-Reply-To: <34D03D46.329C@keelynet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"DK0t12.0.hi2.j23rq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3572 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, Jerry W. Decker wrote: > Recently, someone posted a note about BAAT Corporation successfully > achieving 92 mpg from a bolt on engine modification. I haven't seen > anyone post any further info, so here is a short description that > includes the URL for their homepage... I've been interested since they spammed me twice with the investment request. Until I see a device, see the theory behind it's operation, and possibly see a patent on the thing, I don't usually believe anything anyone claims anymore. -- Frank Earl Earl Consulting Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Pursuant to USC 47, unsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address is subject to a $500 archival fee per copy. E-mail recieved after any reciept of this notice implys acceptance of these terms. A copy of USC 47 may be found online at http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/47/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 00:38:36 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA12195; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 00:36:25 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 00:36:25 -0800 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <7b231699.34d433de@aol.com> Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 03:35:40 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: The "Magnetic Paradox" experiment.... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 116 Resent-Message-ID: <"Bq8iv1.0.Q-2.7G3rq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3573 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi All, I have updated my web site with a very interesting experiment...This is the "Magnetic Paradox" experiment. You will find a very simple experiment about Electrodynamics that anyone can try. This experiment will show you that if you apply a "conventional" reasoning, many of you can't explain this "crazy" result.....Try this simple experiment, you will see what appends by yourself... Lets go, now, I shall explain you the problem : - Imagine a black box which has two connectors A and B on each opposite side. - Take one high impedance static millivoltmeter or better an oscilloscope. - Firstly, measure the voltage V1 on the left side of this Black Box between the points A and B. - Secondly, measure the voltage V2 on the right side of this Black Box between the points A and B.. What do you think about the voltages measured ? Is V1 measured potential the same as V2 or are they different ? Think for a few minutes about this, then see the solution at : http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/mpbbx.htm I hope that this will interest you, Sincerely, Jean-Louis Naudin 02/01/98 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 00:58:59 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA02896; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 00:58:49 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 00:58:49 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 02:59:05 -0600 (CST) From: "Frank C. Earl" X-Sender: fearl@localhost To: Free Energy List Subject: Rick Monteverde's lava rocks... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"os15C3.0.8j.7b3rq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3574 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: A while back, Rick had made an observation about an experiment he conducted, using some of the local rocks as dialectrics in a capacitor. One of the samples had a really unusual behavior in his measurements. I asked for a couple of samples to examine with a survey Geiger counter to see if there was any radioactivity present on a hunch. I got the box of samples in earlier this week (thanks Rick!) and while it's not conclusive, I thought I'd share a little of the initial results that I've been able to arrive at. Sample Measured Radiation ------------------------------------------------------------ Tuff from cone near Rick's house .05mr/hr(Avg) Dense black (basaltic?) rock Background Red scoria looking rock Background Large grey claster Background Small grey claster Background Background in my area (Flower Mound, TX) appears to be about <.01mr/hr. The tuff measured a definite reading ranging from .025mr/hr to .1mr/hr., averaging out to be something in the ballpark of .05mr/hr. Now, since it is rather low, the amount of radiation present may be in error due to instrument inaccuracies and my error and one should take this into account. Having said this, I do, however, feel that the rock in question is definitely hot. I plan on further testing which includes seeing if I can measure the same effect that Rick has with the tuff. I will share the results with all. -- Frank Earl Earl Consulting Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Pursuant to USC 47, unsolicited commercial E-mail sent to this address is subject to a $500 archival fee per copy. E-mail recieved after any reciept of this notice implys acceptance of these terms. A copy of USC 47 may be found online at http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/47/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 01:24:44 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA04584; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 01:24:25 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 01:24:25 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BD2E87.56DF9D80@pm3-125.gpt.infi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 31 Jan 1998 23:23:24 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Resent-Message-ID: <"Ul7nv2.0.W71.7z3rq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3575 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Kyle - > Chaio interprets this as not a true FTL > transmission, just group velocity. Didn't you mean "phase velocity"? If it's really group velocity... :) - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 01:54:10 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA21890; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 01:53:51 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 01:53:51 -0800 Message-ID: <34D43B2C.5CBD@xtra.co.nz> Date: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 22:06:52 +1300 From: Robbie Rowntree Reply-To: rown@xtra.co.nz X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: RRAMM E Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------36A555ED1B59" Resent-Message-ID: <"s06fF1.0.vL5.jO4rq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3576 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------36A555ED1B59 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Copyright Robbie Rowntree the gift for the RRAMME D you use 1 arm coil not in this unfolded shot and scrap the rest for a small piece of ferrite 2 magnets 1 top 1 bottom and 3 magnets at the tail, should be some new shots at my page that you havent seen of the cross plain top side -- **RRAMM** Good Waves Robbie Rowntree experimental research Self powered*Magnetic Motor*Electric Gen*Anti gravity drive http://www.primenet.com/~rags/tesla/rr.html mailto:rown@xtra.co.nz --------------36A555ED1B59 Content-Type: image/gif; name="uu.gif" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="uu.gif" R0lGODdh0wEgAaIAAP///wAA/wAAAP8AAAD//wAAAAAAAAAAACwAAAAA0wEgAQAD/wi63P4w ykmrvThrKLr/oLCNZGmeaKqubOu+cDyGwSM6NSjvfO//wKBw6OsEboyaA5lcHpnEqHRKrVqv Mo9C2eAyoNuHUostm8/otJrV6Yptb3eDvK7b7/h8UeBtyuc4cYFgeoWGh4h6bQB9C42NAGCQ kIwKi4mYmZqbQJdhgaBfoX5/loScqKmqqzaTgqQLkqOwjqest7i5douus5WApZ/Bn566xsfI UZ69w42yw7+lxcnU1dYphI+vwrG+zI5w1+Lj5BSn39wAA+vs7e4D0Ojg5fT1122U2g7v/P3u 8vki2bJHsGAmJAH/+FvXgCGDhfDm0ZI40KDFi3WgJHzYj/+WQ4nq+umbVRGjyZNTpkWDxS9d 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<19980201.073613.3622.0.tv@juno.com> References: <199802010534.VAA29188@denmark.it.earthlink.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-4,6-9,12-13,15-18 From: tv@juno.com (Tim D Vaughan) Resent-Message-ID: <"YcXqM2.0.SE2.Ak9rq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3577 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >http://members.tripod.com/~kilowattfree/ >Yes, I don't understand the testatika either, these pages described the >Linden experiment with a electret, which others, according to the notes, >tried without results. My tests may have been more along Hendershot- how can >a magnetic field affect an electrolytic capacitor? >-Dave Althought the above web page talks about doing this experiment with an electrec. I don't know of anyone who has. The magnet may have nothing to do with the effect, if any. I certainly know of no substantial effect a magnet would have on a dialectric like this. Tim ( tv@juno.com) _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 08:03:32 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA22909; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 08:03:16 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 08:03:16 -0800 X-Sender: rmuha@mail Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <01BD2E87.56DF9D80@pm3-125.gpt.infi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 11:02:57 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: ralph muha Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Resent-Message-ID: <"6YfoS3.0.nb5.2p9rq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3578 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Rick Monteverde wrote: >Didn't you mean "phase velocity"? If it's really group velocity... :) right, if something is traveling at C, and it's oscillating, it's phase velocity has to be greater than C. (wasn't there a discussion about this on vortex-l several months ago?) of course, there is Collins' argument, which goes like this: if we apply SR to EM, we conclude that anything travelling at C cannot oscillate, since it's clock will stop, such that the phase velocity does not exceed C... we only see the oscillation when the particle is detected (ie, when it crashes into something and drops out of lightspeed) r From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 09:29:21 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA00929; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 09:29:10 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 09:29:10 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD2F04.61B57AE0@pm3-116.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 11:27:28 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD2F04.61BEA2A0" Resent-Message-ID: <"0e-gC1.0.QE.b3Brq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3579 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD2F04.61BEA2A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: Rick Monteverde[SMTP:monteverde@worldnet.att.net] Sent: Sunday, February 01, 1998 3:23 AM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? >Kyle - >> Chaio interprets this as not a true FTL >> transmission, just group velocity. >Didn't you mean "phase velocity"? If it's really group velocity... :) >- Rick Monteverde >Honolulu, HI Well, thats not what several reports on the internet said. The Nimtz = experiment was concluded to be group velocity by some, but I don't see = how it could be misinterpreted. The beam of microwaves was sent out, = split in half, one half was sent through a waveguide, the other through = a barrier. The open air beam arrived at normal time, for light-speed = travel. The waves that went through the barrier arrived 4.7 times = faster, producing audible music when converted to sound. (by a speaker = of course:-) John Cramer is definately interested, and so is NASA, so that might tell = us something... Kyle R. 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6epWuc7srr5S/txeVZNXBvo1VSoRLKMAK8HC1olTif3LYcHGWMiiyrEAjGxlxzTZtllWsz/C 7Pg2+1nvdHZ7oCWthkRruNKmVkqnRa1qXasY1sL0tbNFV2xlS1vc4tW2k8ttb4m6W175lrbA 1Z5wVUtc9RmXtMhtn3I3y1yPOjey0LWfdBNL3fxZd6/Y/Z924cpdAXrXrOAtoHi3St4Fmlep 6F2oennKXgq6t6bw/ad8P0pfD9o3pfgtqH5Hyt/++pebAF6hgP1J4Poa2JAInqeC/8jgGDo4 jxDWoYSpSGEXWnh4GB6ihinGYS56mF0gHqOIsUXibZpYsiiOo4oLxeI+uvhKMCakqIw5S2NE 2phBOF6mjr/D42L62EBA3qWQsURkWRq5sUiupZKzwmRnOjlZUMamlNtFZXJaOa5YzrKWc8pl azoZzBsV8phbKmMzB1XEae6qgtl8WPW++bTSlTNwe1tn7KYWz/DV7J4JfF0/U5iugYYxVgmN 5KEemssrVfSbAdroQA8Y0pO25YUpfWkCNQvTm6ZKkTj96dctGdSjtuuWSX1qVKda1atmdZ0D AgA7 --part0_886360747_boundary-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 12:47:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA31221; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:47:01 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:47:01 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 10:47:06 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Rick Monteverde's lava rocks... Resent-Message-ID: <"S3R8g.0.cd7.3zDrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3581 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Frank - > I plan on further testing which includes > seeing if I can measure the same effect that > Rick has with the tuff. I had a feeling that tuff was hotter than the other stuff. I bet your read is real. It really had a different reaction on the DVM with that stuff between aluminum foil sheets, and it's much younger material. We're on one of those edge-of-the-island rifts here, and it cracked open some 50,000 years ago, something like that. The other lavas are much much older, millions of years old. Newer lavas generally have more radioactivity in them, from what I remember. I know it isn't much being so close to background, but I wonder if it's enough to make a difference. I'd like to try some of those uranium ores or clays. I'll have to try this sometime on Big Island lavas just weeks old. Of course we don't mail those out of state, though. ;) Hey - I just remembered - I've got antique glass tumblers made of "vaseline glass" - a uranuim compound makes their fluorescent yellow tint. I can line them with foil and compare them with plain glass tumblers. I'll post if I get anything. By the way, someone asked me to make sure that just two foil sheets with air between sheets weren't giving similar readings. I have some scrap sheets of printer's litho plate aluminum sheet of at least a square foot each and maybe ten mil or so thick. Spaced about a quarter inch apart on some small cardboard chips, the meter reads a steady zero using the same resistor setups as I had on the rocks. I also recently did a run with three caps ganged together in an insulated cooler, with a temp probe both inside and outside. The voltage definitely wants to track the temperature *outside* the cooler, but I was still getting too much drift with the temperature inside to really cut the issue convincingly. I'll have to fill a larger cooler part way with ice water with the caps in a shallow floating pan, something like that. Any ideas? I'm afraid any rinky-dink thermostat setup I try to build will just oscillate around too much. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 12:54:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA00545; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:54:31 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:54:31 -0800 Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:54:20 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802012054.MAA22784@germany.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: The "Magnetic Paradox" experiment.... Resent-Message-ID: <"N2BRj1.0.M8.54Erq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3583 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hello all, At 03:35 AM 2/1/98 EST, you wrote: >Hi All, > >I have updated my web site with a very interesting experiment...This is the >"Magnetic Paradox" experiment. >You will find a very simple experiment about Electrodynamics that anyone can >try. This experiment will show you that if you apply a "conventional" >reasoning, many of you can't explain this "crazy" result.....Try this simple >experiment, you will see what appends by yourself... > >Lets go, now, I shall explain you the problem : > >- Imagine a black box which has two connectors A and B on each opposite side. >- Take one high impedance static millivoltmeter or better an oscilloscope. >- Firstly, measure the voltage V1 on the left side of this Black Box between >the points A and B. >- Secondly, measure the voltage V2 on the right side of this Black Box between >the points A and B.. > >What do you think about the voltages measured ? >Is V1 measured potential the same as V2 or are they different ? > >Think for a few minutes about this, then see the solution at : > >http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/mpbbx.htm > >I hope that this will interest you, > >Sincerely, > >Jean-Louis Naudin > I did this experiment, and see uneven voltages Va= 51 mV, Vb= 4mV. I think the differences are due to the induced voltages in the loops forming the measurement circuit. I can see this by moving the measurement leads from one side to the other, or placing them parallel to the coil, and B field axis, to see the true loop induced voltage, for each half of the loop: (Va+ Vb)/2. The total voltage induced in a single wire turn = Va +Vb. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 12:56:23 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA11081; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:55:27 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 12:55:27 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BD2F04.61B57AE0@pm3-116.gpt.infi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 10:53:57 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Resent-Message-ID: <"G9KS63.0.1j2.u4Erq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3582 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Kyle - > John Cramer is definately interested, and > so is NASA, so that might tell us > something...John Cramer is definately > interested, and so is NASA, so that might > tell us something... Ok, well that's great. I misunderstood then when you seemed to cast this one off citing group velocity, because when someone (not meaning you specifically but anyone in general) pooh-poohs FTL experiments, they might say "oh, that's just *phase* velocity". But when it's group velocity of course, then the stuff involved is travelling FTL. Open a subspace channel Lt. Uhura... - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 13:57:23 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA14885; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 13:57:02 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 13:57:02 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 11:57:04 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Rick Monteverde's lava rocks... Resent-Message-ID: <"7Kad8.0.Fe3.i-Erq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3584 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Just tried the uranium tumbler and another light blue tumbler which were apparently from the same mold, and there doesn't seem to be anything unusual about the vaseline glass when they were lined inside and out with separate pieces of aluminum foil and tested on the DVM. Both show fairly steady at just a few mV, about the same as the leads hanging free. Just air and static. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 14:46:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA26365; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 14:46:24 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 14:46:24 -0800 (PST) From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: testatika and capacitor anomolies Date: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 22:44:58 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <34d4f90e.628788@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <199802010534.VAA29188@denmark.it.earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <199802010534.VAA29188@denmark.it.earthlink.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mk1-63.0.qR6.-iFrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3585 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 31 Jan 1998 21:34:10 -0800 (PST), dave dameron wrote: [snip] >Yes, I don't understand the testatika either, these pages described the >Linden experiment with a electret, which others, according to the notes, >tried without results. My tests may have been more along Hendershot- how can >a magnetic field affect an electrolytic capacitor? >-Dave > Actually I tried an impoverished little experiment along those lines once, precisely because I thought it might. A relativistic treatment of magnetism (or current really) leads to the conclusion that a magnetic field can be viewed as a pseudo electric field at right angles to the magnetic field. I wondered therefore if this pseudo electric field could be used to create a charge on a capacitor. I still wonder :). Regards, Robin van Spaandonk -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on temperature. "....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." PS - no SPAM thanks! -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 16:29:20 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA11282; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 16:29:05 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 16:29:05 -0800 Message-Id: <199802020029.WAA20437@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: not so good indeed ! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 22:31:34 -3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: testatika and capacitor anomolies Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199802010534.VAA29188@denmark.it.earthlink.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Resent-Message-ID: <"DJuiV1.0.il2.FDHrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3586 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > > > Yes, I don't understand the testatika either, these pages described the > Linden experiment with a electret, which others, according to the notes, > tried without results. My tests may have been more along Hendershot- how can > a magnetic field affect an electrolytic capacitor? > -Dave > Maybe if the capacitor's outside can acts like a shorted coil inside the magnetic field ? Marcelo From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 18:11:16 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA23590; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 18:11:12 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 18:11:12 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34D50D51.B71@xtra.co.nz> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 13:03:29 +1300 From: Robbie Rowntree Reply-To: rown@xtra.co.nz X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: coil winding Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"vQbMb3.0.Vm5.-iIrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3587 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: 5:29 PM 2/1/98 This shows a method for forming Rowntree coils these coils are the copyright of Robbie Rowntree and subject to the conditions 1,2 of my curse, dispensation may be granted on condition 1 if asked for. The blue magnets are weak rods same pole same end and wire .125, green are teflon , red is a neo magnet, and a mount point and bolt are show en. place disc 2 on 3 tapeted together magnets thread wire with enough to exit with excess at exit point place a larger wire back to start spiral on, fit teflon cup cake disc start spiral winding place teflon 2 then ferrite disc 1 careful ease disc onto mount something in between helps, do spiral ease out teflon former and wire Zap cyanoarcrylate thin ! needs to get to core [there are special accessories nozzles use them] to stop unwinding from centre . It pays to take the edge off ferrite holes they cut wire. This will build a very powerful coil, depending on the number of cells .125 wire =32 inches long plus the distance from cell to switch, each cell 40 amp turns x lets say 50 cells 2000amp turns in say the head plus 2000 in the legs 4000 amp turns, you need the switch outs 1 to 3 cells per switch . discs are 9mm ferrite rod cut to lenght 1mm hole -- working on switch design **RRAMM** Good Waves Robbie Rowntree experimental research Self powered*Magnetic Motor*Electric Gen*Anti gravity drive http://www.primenet.com/~rags/tesla/rr.html mailto:rown@xtra.co.nz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 18:57:05 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA29265; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 18:56:40 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 18:56:40 -0800 (PST) To: freenrg-L@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 18:31:46 -0800 Subject: testatika & Bruce Perreault Message-ID: <19980201.183551.11070.7.tv@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-6,8,10-23 From: tv@juno.com (Tim D Vaughan) Resent-Message-ID: <"x6HMS1.0.997.cNJrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3588 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Anybody know anything about this ? Found this anouncement on Bruce Perreault's web page: < http://www.cyberportal.net/nuenergy/main.html > > Nu Announcement Jan. 27th, 1998 >A Radiant Energy Demonstration will be presented in a few months. A video >will be made available to those who are unable to attend. This is being done >to AUTHENTICATE my discovery. >Calvin Bahlmann of International High Technology will be demonstrating a >device that is similar to the TESTATIKA (SWISS ML) MACHINE. This is >made possible from critical information obtained from The Boston Museum >of Science. The Museum had such a device on display up and running from >about, roughly, 1986 to 1997, ten years! >At the end of the conference we will tell ALL! Wonder if it is a Jefimenko type electrostatic motor ?? Tim _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 1 23:26:39 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA29432; Sun, 1 Feb 1998 23:26:32 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 1 Feb 1998 23:26:32 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <162dc0a4.34d574da@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 02:25:12 EST To: freenrg-L@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: New design, this might work! LaFonte home page Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"HBMXs3.0.iB7.bKNrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3590 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi all, Please take a look at my new design and tell me what you think. This might work! Thanks, Butch LaFonte http://members.aol.com/HLafonte/LaFonteGenerator4.html From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 08:30:24 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA14058; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:30:07 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 08:30:07 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 09:43:47 -0500 From: Jochum Pihl <106635.3612@compuserve.com> Subject: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Sender: Jochum Pihl <106635.3612@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:freenrg-l@eskimo.com" Message-ID: <199802021129_MC2-3194-E3AF@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id IAA14033 Resent-Message-ID: <"LKs_6.0.WR3.DIVrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3593 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Was it the frequensy or the wavelength that was altered in the quick waverythms of Mozarts 40th symphony that was altered as the speed increased? or was it both so that we had an enormous microwave with a quick frequency? That is of course assuming that v=f * lambda. In any case we can perhaps play this tune in our microwaves and heat our food 4.7 times quicker. This does however not tell us that matter can travel faster then c, but if electromagnetic waves travel at this speed it might mean that matter will be able to travel at speed 4.7 times greater then it normally would. And that matter can be infinate at 4.7c instead of c. Or what does Mr.Kyle Randall Mcallister say to this. Best regards , Johan Pihl 'Tomorrow we wont know anything we'll disprove all our illusions and build a monument to non-excistance.' From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 11:03:44 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA13597; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:03:36 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:03:36 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:03:23 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"_5mc73.0.6K3.6YXrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3594 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi all, There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my post? Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least get my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. Thank you very much, Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 11:14:53 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA13438; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:14:37 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:14:37 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:13:01 -0700 (MST) From: Steve Ekwall X-Sender: ekwall2@november To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte In-Reply-To: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"IwvIX1.0.tH3.RiXrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3595 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Get it / Got it / & it's Good:) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 11:20:02 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA13988; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:19:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:19:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980131131429.00e0c4a8@palacenet.net> X-Sender: mules@palacenet.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 1998 13:14:29 -0600 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Jack DeMule Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte In-Reply-To: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"blooh.0.PQ3.OnXrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3596 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello... I get them, and I read them. Thank you. Best Regards, Jack ---------------------------------------------------------- "...and I work among cries and clatters like a venomous beaver in a parrot house. A letter full of nothing. Yours," -signed Dylan mules@palacenet.net ---------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 11:43:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA18219; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:42:46 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:42:46 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802021940.LAA08144@mailtod-151.iap.bryant.webtv.net> From: B777b77@webtv.net (R B) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:40:39 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Resent-Message-ID: <"rQSq2.0.SS4.i6Yrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3597 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Getting it. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 11:42:32 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA25458; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:42:26 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:42:26 -0800 From: PeteB13@aol.com Message-ID: <254747f2.34d62165@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:41:23 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Excuse me Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 165 Resent-Message-ID: <"wFnrL2.0.cD6.W6Yrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3598 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I was wondering if you could all do me a favour being as I am new to this list. Could one of you tell me what we are allowed or rather meant to discuss on this list, as I am not quite sure on this BTW, for those of you who are curious, then I am 15 and currently taking GCSE Electronics, and Physics (I think those ones are the ones that matter on here?) Anyway, if you could all help me out from time to time, then I would be very greatful. One more thing, does Bill Beaty sometimes post to this list? Till the next time, Pete From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 11:45:16 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA26768; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:45:03 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 11:45:03 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:38:04 -0600 (CST) From: HackEd To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Excuse me In-Reply-To: <254747f2.34d62165@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"wFAJD.0.5Y6.z8Yrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3599 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Mon, 2 Feb 1998 PeteB13@aol.com wrote: > I was wondering if you could all do me a favour being as I am new to this > list. > > Could one of you tell me what we are allowed or rather meant to discuss on > this list, as I am not quite sure on this > > BTW, for those of you who are curious, then I am 15 and currently taking GCSE > Electronics, and Physics (I think those ones are the ones that matter on > here?) > > Anyway, if you could all help me out from time to time, then I would be very > greatful. > > One more thing, does Bill Beaty sometimes post to this list? > > Till the next time, > Pete > We are discussing the possibility of creating Free Energy. Such as Cold Fusion and such. Also anything that has to do with Keely and such passes along here too. By the sounds of it you should go along really good here. And yes, Bill has been known to show his face from time to time :) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 12:16:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA24269; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:15:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:15:55 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:14:08 -0800 X-Intended-For: Message-Id: <199802022014.MAA08531@slave2.aa.net> X-Sender: knuke@pop.aa.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@aa.net (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Rick Monteverde's lava rocks... Resent-Message-ID: <"bk2sP.0.4x5.qbYrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3600 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi There Rick, On 2/1/98, you wrote: >Hey - I just remembered - I've got antique glass tumblers made of "vaseline >glass" - a uranuim compound makes their fluorescent yellow tint. I can line >them with foil and compare them with plain glass tumblers. I'll post if I >get anything. You probably already know this, but if you you were on the Vortex Group when we were discussing the possible why's and wherefore's of how my device propelled itself, you may recall we discovered that the ceramic tiles that were in my kitchen next to the device were a bright yellow color, and that subsequent investigation with a Geiger counter revealed that they were coated with "yellow cake", a uranium oxide glaze. I also found that when I rubbed the tiles with a cloth or a sponge, like you normally do to clean up cooking spatters etc., that the cloth or sponge would become radioactive as well. My understanding is that the daughter products from the decaying uranium (thorium, radium, radon, etc., etc.,) would not be bound by the ceramic glaze, and would come off when it came into contact with anything (like milk or juice or lips - you get the idea). There were a number of people that told me about another consumer product called FiestaWare, a line of ceramic dishware (plates, bowls, etc.) that used this uranium glaze to make them a very colorful, bright yellow and red. Needless to say, I wash these tiles very rarely anymore, and when I do, I wear gloves and I use special rags that I've designated for this purpose. When the reports from various researchers came out regarding the LENT processes were first coming out claiming aneutronic transmutation, I was tempted to make an experiment with these used wash rags. I took a couple of the rags and placed them in a cooking pot, and filled it with tap water. I stirred the water around to get whatever knuklear products were on the rags into the water, and them I pumped this soup into one of my cavitation devices. Well, I was excited, rushed and so forth, so I didn't take the time to set up my Geiger counter before the run, and so I can't tell you for sure what exactly happened, but a couple of interesting things did happen. First of all, the bubbles that were produced by the cavitation processing were much, much larger than the normal, almost invisible bubbles that I usually get. This could be attributed to residual surfactants (soap or detergent) on the wash rags. I didn't use any soap when I was cleaning the tiles, but the rags were old, cut-up bluejeans, and there is usually soap remaining in any material that has been laundered. The second thing that happened was that I immediately fell horribly ill. I don't know if it had anything to do with the experiment, or if it was simply due to the fact that I had been working 48 hour days for months on end. I have been working this kind of schedule for years, and I never get sick, but this illness lasted for over two weeks. After that incident, I read Seth Putterman's latest sonoluminescence patent which disclosed fusion in a cavitation device _with_ neutron production when "at least" tritium and deuterium were present in the liquid. That was enough to convince me not to do any more experiments along those particular lines until I had the proper shielding, monitoring etc., in place. I just wanted to pass this along in case you were going to work with this stuff. You should have a badge or a monitor or something, so that if you do start nuking yourself, you can at least shut the thing down before _you_ start glowing in the dark. Also, these daughter products of this yellowcake may or may not rub off of these tumblers, I don't know, but I would want to check for that before letting anyone use them for drinking. Good luck to you, -Knuke From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 12:21:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA10222; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:21:20 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:21:20 -0800 Message-ID: <34D62A9F.42E2@post3.tele.dk> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 21:20:47 +0100 From: Martin Bech Reply-To: ms-bech@post3.tele.dk X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte References: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"21yWo2.0.YV2.-gYrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3601 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Yep, its getting through to me too. Don´t stop writing... Rgds. Martin Bech From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 12:21:32 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA10263; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:21:26 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:21:26 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD2FE5.99F92460@pm3-146.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:19:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD2FE5.9A00C580" Resent-Message-ID: <"tQ0p5.0.6W2.4hYrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3602 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD2FE5.9A00C580 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: Jochum Pihl[SMTP:106635.3612@compuserve.com] Sent: Monday, February 02, 1998 8:43 AM To: INTERNET:freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? >Was it the frequensy or the wavelength that was altered in the quick >waverythms of Mozarts 40th symphony that was altered as the speed >increased? or was it both so that we had an enormous microwave with a = quick >frequency? That is of course assuming that v=3Df * lambda. >In any case we can perhaps play this tune in our microwaves and heat = our >food 4.7 times quicker. I am not quite sure what the frequency was, but the paper I read did say = that the time it took to travel was 81 picoseconds, with no pulses = exceeding 80 picoseconds in rise. John G. Cramer said this puts = Einsteinian Relativity in great threat. The best description of G. = Nimtz's device was this: A microwave transmitter, a waveguide that = splits the signal in half, one half travelling through open air to a = reciever where its arrival time is measured. The other half is sent = through a modified waveguide of equal length, and its arrival time is = measured. The waveguide signal arrived 4.7 times faster than the open = air one, speed measured to be 4.7c. >This does however not tell us that matter can travel faster then c, but = if >electromagnetic waves travel at this speed it might mean that matter = will >be able to travel at speed 4.7 times greater then it normally would. = And >that matter can be infinate at 4.7c instead of c. Or what does Mr.Kyle >Randall Mcallister say to this. Theoretically, the experiment shouldn't have happened; its a clear = violation of Einsteinian Relativity. However, if one accepts the = existence of an absolute background time, the experiment is perfectly = valid. As for a speed limit, there is apparently none. Depending on how = you did it, with an absolute background time there is no limit to how = fast you could travel, as far as I can see. As for matter travelling = FTL, it might not be able to. I don't think it can. But there are still = many ways to get from distant points and get back in time to have lunch. = 1. Space warping (such as an alcubierre drive), 2. Wormholes, 3. = "Hyperspace" jumps (seriously being looked into by NASA), and many = others. Best Regards,=20 Kyle R. 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Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:25:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD2FE6.6F758C00" Resent-Message-ID: <"zug5e2.0.o83.hmYrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3603 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD2FE6.6F758C00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: HLafonte@aol.com[SMTP:HLafonte@aol.com] Sent: Monday, February 02, 1998 1:03 PM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte I read them. I'm just more into gravity control, nature of the possible = ether, zero-point-energy, and faster than light travel/communication. = Free energy is fine though. Depending on who you let have it... Just = remember: That 'free' energy has to come from somewhere:-) Kyle R. Mcallister ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD2FE6.6F758C00 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IicUAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAIAEAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAARwAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGZyZWVucmctbEBlc2tp bW8uY29tAFNNVFAAZnJlZW5yZy1sQGVza2ltby5jb20AAB4AAjABAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAD MAEAAAAVAAAAZnJlZW5yZy1sQGVza2ltby5jb20AAAAAAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4AATABAAAA FwAAACdmcmVlbnJnLWxAZXNraW1vLmNvbScAAAIBCzABAAAAGgAAAFNNVFA6RlJFRU5SRy1MQEVT S0lNTy5DT00AAAADAAA5AAAAAAsAQDoBAAAAAgH2DwEAAAAEAAAAAAAAAlo0AQSAAQAlAAAAUkU6 IFBvbGwgb2YgbGlzdCwgZnJvbSBCdXRjaCBMYUZvbnRlADgMAQWAAwAOAAAAzgcCAAIADgAZACYA AQAnAQEggAMADgAAAM4HAgACAA4AFgAWAAEAFAEBCYABACEAAAAzMzY0RjcyMkQ2OUJEMTExQTc1 RUU4RTAwQUMxMDAwMAAGBwEDkAYABAQAABQAAAALACMAAAAAAAMAJgAAAAAACwApAAAAAAADAC4A AAAAAAMANgAAAAAAQAA5AGBaV7kYML0BHgBwAAEAAAAlAAAAUkU6IFBvbGwgb2YgbGlzdCwgZnJv bSBCdXRjaCBMYUZvbnRlAAAAAAIBcQABAAAAFgAAAAG9MBi5V21IDIOb1hHRp17o4ArBAAAAAB4A HgwBAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAfDAEAAAAXAAAAc3RrQHN1bmhlcmFsZC5pbmZpLm5ldAAAAwAG EM5fmOQDAAcQdgEAAB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAC0tLS0tLS0tLS1GUk9NOkhMQUZPTlRFQEFPTENPTVNN VFA6SExBRk9OVEVAQU9MQ09NU0VOVDpNT05EQVksRkVCUlVBUlkwMiwxOTk4MTowM1BNVE86RlJF RU5SRy1MQEVTS0kAAAAAAgEJEAEAAABmAgAAYgIAABYEAABMWkZ1kaH2pP8ACgEPAhUCpAPkBesC gwBQEwNUAgBjaArAc2V07jIGAAbDAoMyA8YHEwKALn0KgAjPCdk7FM8yNR41AoAKgQ2xC2BuZzG4 MDMzCvsS8gwBYwBABiAKhQqLbGkxODDBAtFpLTE0NA3wDNCzG5MLWTE2CqADYHQFkH0FQC0dtwqH HGsMMB02Rh0DYToevh02DIIgSEyiYQISZUBhBvAuBaCAbVtTTVRQOiJ+fl0eXx9tBmACMCCfIatN IQIgZGF5LCBAZWKEcnUKwHkgMDIpYFAxOTk4KkA6GAAgzFBNJO8fbVRvJy8hq4MDUAnhcmctbEAH kDprB3BvIzIrHyX+dWJuah1xLT8hq1AG8AMgb2RmIBrwc3QpYANSIKhCdXQRsCAigEYisjMZvxrD MzYcNxkJSSABFNBhZCB0aGVtSi45UCc1sGp1NUAgiwRgFNAgC4B0byAJwPBhdml0KfAFoAIwA2Di bClgbmF0CHA68DTx0TnRIHBvBBBpAmA68CsSADngcilgegSQby3bPVA7ES0J8ASQZylRAHD5ObBm YTVABJA5wQORGvAcZ2gFQDwQO4BlbC+pI0FtdQMAYzyAaQIg/zoQIFAJ4D3QPxM7AAQgG2AfPxA5 wQhgQKA6EERlcLUJ8GQLgGc04AOgd0OQ3CB5CGA1EBIAIBHAQRDJOwB0LkYAIEo6ghTQbweABtAE kDLAVBHABUAn/S8SJ0KGEcAEIDsxI0E68B01g3NI4UTQBJBlOi1SKTasS3k9sVI6EE3/QcA0wDUx BJA4PR02CoUT8QIATlAAAAMAEBAAAAAAAwAREAAAAABAAAcwoMNuRBgwvQFAAAgwoMNuRBgwvQEe AD0AAQAAAAUAAABSRTogAAAAAAMADTT9NwAALhA= ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD2FE6.6F758C00-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 12:31:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA14821; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:31:48 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:31:48 -0800 Message-ID: <34D62D1B.4B2D@spu.edu> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 12:31:24 -0800 From: TK Reply-To: tnk@spu.edu Organization: me X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte References: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"-Sn3A.0.Md3.oqYrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3604 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I find your posts to be rather informative. Keep up the quest. TK HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > > Hi all, > There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many > people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my > post? > Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least get > my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. > Thank you very much, > Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 12:44:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA29267; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:44:17 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:44:17 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: leoguitar@mail.vossnet.de X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 21:42:32 +0100 Message-Id: <19980202214232.457c4a8d.in@pop3.vossnet.de> Resent-Message-ID: <"r4vl63.0.B97.M0Zrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3605 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 14:03 02.02.1998 EST, freenrg-l@eskimo.com wrote: >Hi all, >There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many >people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my >post? >Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least get >my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. >Thank you very much, >Butch LaFonte > Me. Thanks, but you have to explain your pictures much better. This way you do it, nobody seems to pay attention. Keep up the good work ! Regards, STefan. > > -- Hartmann Multimedia Service Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany http://www.harti.com email: harti@harti.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 12:53:42 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA00940; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:53:24 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 12:53:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34D631C6.BEE5DE4@pavilion.co.uk> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 20:51:21 +0000 From: Robert Dowse Reply-To: redesign@pavilion.co.uk Organization: R.E.Designs X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte References: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"gxU7U2.0.ZE.09Zrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3606 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I get it and read it and it's good keep on going!!! Thanks RD From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 13:18:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA04599; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:18:29 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:18:29 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <23b0bad.34d6349d@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:03:23 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"T4DWZ2.0.j71.RWZrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3607 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-02 15:29:52 EST, you write: << File: Unknown (1568 bytes) DL Time (14400 bps): < 1 minute >> Kyle, I could not open file, could you send it in gif format? What was subject matter? Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 13:25:26 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA29319; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:24:51 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:24:51 -0800 From: "Michael W. Kiser" To: Subject: RECEIVED Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:22:07 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd3020$9da588c0$471cc1cf@mkiser.swbell.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"2Dpgj1.0.w97.YcZrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3608 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com -----Original Message----- From: HLafonte@aol.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, February 02, 1998 1:12 PM Subject: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte >Hi all, >There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many >people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my >post? >Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least get >my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. >Thank you very much, >Butch LaFonte > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 13:27:22 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA30502; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:27:10 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:27:10 -0800 Message-ID: <34D63611.2082@xtra.co.nz> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:09:37 +1300 From: Robbie Rowntree Reply-To: rown@xtra.co.nz X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Arno.Jones@Ventana.com CC: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: up date Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------B9D29CB787A" Resent-Message-ID: <"JxraL3.0.GS7.feZrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3609 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------B9D29CB787A Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 5:29 PM 2/1/98 This shows a method for forming Rowntree coils these coils are the copyright of Robbie Rowntree and subject to the conditions 1,2 of my gift of christmas, dispensation may be granted on condition 1 if asked for. The blue magnets are weak rods same pole same end and wire .125, green are teflon , red is a neo magnet, and a mount point and bolt are show en. place disc 2 on 3 tapeted together magnets thread wire with enough to exit with excess at exit point place a larger wire back to start spiral on, fit teflon cup cake disc start spiral winding place teflon 2 then ferrite disc 1 careful ease disc onto mount something in between helps, do spiral ease out teflon former and wire Zap cyanoarcrylate thin ! needs to get to core [there are special accessories nozzles use them] to stop unwinding from centre . It pays to take the edge off ferrite holes they cut wire. This will build a very powerful coil, depending on the number of cells .125 wire =32 inches long plus the distance from cell to switch, each cell 40 amp turns x lets say 50 cells 2000amp turns in say the head plus 2000 in the legs 4000 amp turns, you need the switch outs 1 to 3 cells per switch . discs are 9mm ferrite rod cut to lenght 1mm hole. RRAMME D is a single loop arm coil, Ferrite square on rocker, repo magnets are wound with coils, blue is an atempt to show the pumped magnetic feilds I think the way to power this is to feed the output to a battery and from there power a small DC motor with conrod to rocker , it avoids high amp switching problems and is easyer to understand. Pumping......the MM to EM......now were was I. -- **RRAMM** Good Waves Robbie Rowntree experimental research Self powered*Magnetic Motor*Electric Gen*Anti gravity drive http://www.primenet.com/~rags/tesla/rr.html mailto:rown@xtra.co.nz --------------B9D29CB787A Content-Type: image/gif; name="d1.gif" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="d1.gif" R0lGODdhFwJEAZEAAP///wAAAAAA//8AACwAAAAAFwJEAQAC/4SPqcvtD6OctNqLs968+w+G jgAIJokF4sq27gvH8kzX9owepykFqnoLCofEovGITIpyutKOifAdgMqq9YrNarcPn/cLDovF C6iTZ0BPqVOu+w2Py+eUsf2O/yZIp3Sax5YQSEdYaHiI+CIVshgFENbnN6WmMJh4ifloKbjp MBbRyLkQmplI2nFqFiDgJdlo1lYqi3ha2blpB1GrOdo5K7erkaoQCbYHFOr7u3y46xwYvMYQ zWxIfTG8p6anw/pTWR2ectoa9UPVmH7Oa84uVa4JL92+Br3enmyvLH50bZHdDc2qequ8NXHE L2EXbgaMEVyk7iG7hg7JxCNnT+JDNv9h5lGUp1CJvwoA/5DwwQSMCSmqQroUNbEVPJkQ7330 SBNZTY+cOt6c+U7dOZ04972sMbJOIDMrgeSg4m3RSUFHX9aKSHFeUHpZu7pDB3aaT69YY4Y1 67CqkaQTSDEdKKlhiYslQD5Sq/DqWbNZ83HFWvZZvaKEyRL9yBDvELY9lmpjFVcu5MGjFPPb 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Aidinis" To: Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 23:38:24 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01BD3033.A71CF4C0" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"l478c2.0.my1._oZrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3610 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BD3033.A71CF4C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, I'm getting it, reading it, enjoying it ;-) ------=_NextPart_000_01BD3033.A71CF4C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Yes, I'm getting it, reading it, = enjoying it ;-)

------=_NextPart_000_01BD3033.A71CF4C0-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 13:41:06 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA04519; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:40:55 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:40:55 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <7d259bdd.34d63c41@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:35:59 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Is there a point where movement is without back EMF? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"_A4vn.0.261.YrZrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3611 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi all, This has been on my mind for some time. What if you had two electro-magnets pole to pole in a repelling mode and the magnetic fields were of the highest possible strength within reason, I have wondered if the following could happen? Would it be possible for this repulsion force of very great strength could push the two electro-magnets apart a distance so small that it would be hard for instruments to measure the distance and no back EMF to be produced by this movement? If so, then you have work, (force x distance) but you don't pay for it with a back EMF. This would be only if you opened the circuit before the current impulse completed the wire length ( remember, it starts out in both directions till it meets at half the circuit length). What I'm trying to say is, maybe there is a point where force becomes so great, distance moved so small, that no back EMF is generated. Then the collapse of the coil could recover the energy put into the coils (minus the energy that goes to overcoming resistance, ect. Just for theory Comments, Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 14:57:28 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA20725; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:57:14 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:57:14 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <772e6559.34d64e21@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:52:14 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Need better descriptions on generator and HELP! Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"9Kv9v2.0.f35.7zarq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3612 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Someone on the list has said, Hi Butch, I have been looking at your emails, and started to review your WWW page about your generator. Have not studied enough to determine how the device should work. Will try to set aside some time, and study it a bit more. Could you explain it a bit more? Do you have more info on the design? Things like: A - design for switching the coils B - perhaps some Quickfield graphs of Strength/Flux Density and the critical areas.....during different phases of operation. C - perhaps some magnetic flux flow diagrams or animated GIFs? D - more info on effects that device relies on. So based on a quick read here are my questions: A - What phase of development is the device in -- do you have a prototype? B - How do you plan to keep the 4 internal magnets in a fixed position? I assume you mean that the 4 internal magnets stay in the same relative position as the external "C" channel. C - What function do the coils have? The coils are powered?...... Or are you relying on the flux change to produce current in the coils? If powering, where is the O/U process occurring? Why is it different from other coil powered "flux-gate" designs [like G. Watson's RMOG] D - Will this device be self-running? Your description of the design is not intuitive....And it's not clear why it might be O/U. [at least not me!] Perhaps more explanation of the processes involved would spur some discussion on the list. Not trying to be critical -- I really do want to understand the device....just not enough info on your page. snip> In the future I will put better descriptions on the web site. I sometimes forget that I designed it in my head and I can "read between the lines". I will also add more drawings in sequence so the operation can be understood better. As I have said, I do not want to patent any overunity device (that works) but I would like to have my name on it to help me with support for fugture projects. I do not have the lab equipment at the moment to prove the positive results I get. I need help with quickfield simulations, drawing animation, ect.. I have been using "junk" to build prototypes and if I get positive data from quickfield ect. I will invest money in a quality prototype. I am trying to learn quickfield but it is going to be slow. I will start work on web site today. Thanks for your input. Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 15:01:13 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA24900; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:01:04 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:01:04 -0800 X-Sender: rayf@mail.naxs.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: rayf@naxs.com (Ray Fletcher) Subject: Re: RECEIVED Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:57:22 -0500 Message-ID: <19980202225721125.AAA198@LOCALNAME> Resent-Message-ID: <"i03OO1.0.z46.l0brq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3613 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello Butch Yes I did get it. Thanks and keep up the good work. Ray At 03:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: > >-----Original Message----- >From: HLafonte@aol.com >To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Date: Monday, February 02, 1998 1:12 PM >Subject: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte > > >>Hi all, >>There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many >>people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my >>post? >>Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least >get >>my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. >>Thank you very much, >>Butch LaFonte >> > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 15:32:06 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA32756; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:31:58 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:31:58 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <708604dd.34d64fd5@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:59:31 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Please reply privately to my list poll Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"R86Sj1.0.d_7.iTbrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3614 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Please reply to me directly so as not to load the list. Thanks for your response on this poll, it is good to know someone is seeing all this work! Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 15:37:26 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA01560; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:37:18 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:37:18 -0800 From: Jiyani@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:16:14 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RECEIVED Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 49 Resent-Message-ID: <"yWFqJ2.0.AO.hYbrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3615 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Loud and clear here. Jiyani From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 16:00:08 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA07510; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:59:59 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:59:59 -0800 Message-ID: <34D65DF9.E22E797@mindless.com> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 12:59:54 +1300 From: Matthew Mills X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "freenrg-l@eskimo.com" Subject: Where do I find the file teslafe.zip Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BWXES1.0.Fr1.ztbrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3616 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi ppl , Im new to this list and was wondering if someone knows where I can get the files contained in the zip file teslafe.zip On most mirrors of the keelynet server I can find teslafe1.asc and teslafe2.asc but I can't find the gifs mentioned in these texts. Thanks, Matt. (From New Zealand) (Interested in HV electricity, Tesla coils, Static Electricity, magnetism and Free Energy theory) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 16:51:38 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA09098; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:51:21 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 16:51:21 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34D66BA4.4342@ix.netcom.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 19:58:12 -0500 From: "Dana K. Loan" Reply-To: loan@ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte References: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"i-T3Q1.0.1E2.6ecrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3617 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > > Hi all, > There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many > people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my > post? > Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least get > my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. > Thank you very much, > Butch LaFonte I get your posts and keep them coming. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 17:00:23 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA23085; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:00:13 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:00:13 -0800 Message-ID: <34D66D6C.4A43@ix.netcom.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 20:05:48 -0500 From: "Dana K. Loan" Reply-To: loan@ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? References: <3.0.1.32.19980129132154.00c92744@palacenet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"msf4y.0.We5.Rmcrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3618 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Is there any hard experimental evidence that precludes the possibility of FTL? Jack DeMule wrote: SNIP > I don't know if FTL transmission of anything is possible. > There are some interesting experiments, that don't have any > obvious flaws, which indicate that _something_ does happen > at the speed of light causing the correlation that is observed. > > There is a lot of bad science... sloppy experiments, defective > logic... but when it's wrapped up neatly enough people Buy into it. > I'm amused by the ability of a few mathematical symbols to make > people believe in things that cannot be proven... This is true > in every camp. People then look for clever ways to prove their > theory mathematically and this is good... but it's _not_ proven, > and still remains a theory until the body of supporting > experimental data, data from experiments reproducible by anyone > with the were-with-all, can be provided. > > And now, I'll climb down from the soapbox. > > Best Regards, > Jack > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > "...and I work among cries and clatters like a venomous > beaver in a parrot house. A letter full of nothing. Yours," > -signed Dylan > > mules@palacenet.net > ---------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 17:03:00 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA11094; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:02:53 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:02:53 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34D650EA.1117@worldnet.att.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:04:11 -0800 From: Wm Perry Reply-To: wperry3092@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte References: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"TqwzE.0.Ej2.wocrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3619 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com i see your posts.HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > > Hi all, > There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many > people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my > post? > Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least get > my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. > Thank you very much, > Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 17:03:50 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA24026; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:03:33 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:03:33 -0800 Message-ID: <34D66CFE.F88FA8D@ihug.co.nz> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 14:03:59 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte References: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"1rQ6t3.0.It5.Zpcrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3620 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Just gets hard to follow some of your ideas, you have so many ;) HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > Hi all, > There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many > people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my > post? > Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least get > my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. > Thank you very much, > Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 17:08:00 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA25086; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:07:53 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:07:53 -0800 Message-ID: <34D66E02.9D6C4002@ihug.co.nz> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 14:08:19 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Is there a point where movement is without back EMF? References: <7d259bdd.34d63c41@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"grurK2.0.p76.ctcrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3621 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Well there should be, by speed of light in conventional theory at least. HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > Hi all, > This has been on my mind for some time. What if you had two electro-magnets > pole to pole in a repelling mode and the magnetic fields were of the highest > possible strength within reason, I have wondered if the following could > happen? > Would it be possible for this repulsion force of very great strength could > push the two electro-magnets apart a distance so small that it would be hard > for instruments to measure the distance and no back EMF to be produced by this > movement? > If so, then you have work, (force x distance) but you don't pay for it with > a back EMF. This would be only if you opened the circuit before the current > impulse completed the wire length ( remember, it starts out in both directions > till it meets at half the circuit length). What I'm trying to say is, maybe > there is a point where force becomes so great, distance moved so small, that > no back EMF is generated. Then the collapse of the coil could recover the > energy put into the coils (minus the energy that goes to overcoming > resistance, ect. > Just for theory > Comments, > Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 17:18:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA28782; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:18:39 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:18:39 -0800 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 19:19:54 -0600 (CST) From: "Frank C. Earl" X-Sender: fearl@localhost To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte In-Reply-To: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"YT6AX3.0.M17.i1drq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3622 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Mon, 2 Feb 1998 HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least get > my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. Count me as one that is reading your posts. I'm reading them and pulling in the information and examining it as it comes in. Keep it coming in. Frank Earl- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 17:21:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA29691; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:21:08 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:21:08 -0800 Message-ID: <34D6711A.27D6118F@ihug.co.nz> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 14:21:31 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Need better descriptions on generator and HELP! References: <772e6559.34d64e21@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"vUwUs.0.qF7.24drq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3623 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Study each design a bit slower and tell us what the fate of it was before you go on to the next. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 17:49:49 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA19769; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:49:38 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:49:38 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <6717247a.34d6752a@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:38:47 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"EKV5K.0.mq4.lUdrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3624 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-02 20:28:20 EST, you write: << Just gets hard to follow some of your ideas, you have so many ;) >> I am going to stay with this one for a long time! Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 17:54:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA20507; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:54:18 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 17:54:18 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34D676FF.829440E8@idt.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 20:46:39 -0500 From: Josef Katz X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? References: <199802021129_MC2-3194-E3AF@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Zl7iW.0.K05.8Zdrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3625 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Can someone please explain me about this 4.7c expirament? ie. how was it done, what sort of equipment, etc... thanks -joey katz "Do this or you're a dead man? Death - been there, done that!" Sheridan, Babylon 5 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 18:01:55 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA22127; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:01:23 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:01:23 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul Brown" To: Subject: Re: testatika & Bruce Perreault Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:57:29 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd3047$1552c880$84a99bcf@isonix> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"qYT2-2.0.bP5.afdrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3626 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com -----Original Message----- From: Tim D Vaughan To: freenrg-L@eskimo.com Date: Sunday, February 01, 1998 7:56 PM Subject: testatika & Bruce Perreault >Anybody know anything about this ? > >Found this anouncement on Bruce Perreault's web page: >< http://www.cyberportal.net/nuenergy/main.html > > >> Nu Announcement Jan. 27th, 1998 > >>A Radiant Energy Demonstration will be presented in a few months. A >video >>will be made available to those who are unable to attend. This is being >done >>to AUTHENTICATE my discovery. > >>Calvin Bahlmann of International High Technology will be demonstrating a >>device that is similar to the TESTATIKA (SWISS ML) MACHINE. This is >>made possible from critical information obtained from The Boston Museum >>of Science. The Museum had such a device on display up and running from >>about, roughly, 1986 to 1997, ten years! > >>At the end of the conference we will tell ALL! > >Wonder if it is a Jefimenko type electrostatic motor ?? > >Tim > > Hi Tim, It is an interesting announcement. I have never heard of Calvin Bahlmann or his company International High Technology. The note about the Boston Museum is inclear; did the Boston Museum have a Testatica machine operating for 10 years or (more likely) a simple Whimhurst machine, which is not self running? I hear Bruce make a lot of claims, but I am not aware of anyone whom has seen anything come from Bruce yet. Several years ago, you had a high voltage power supply or possibly it was just a transformer I believe from an MRI; do you still have access to this? I am interested in acquisition. How much and where is it? Take Care, Paul Brown brownpm@concentric.net _____________________________________________________________________ >You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. >Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com >Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 18:04:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA06405; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:04:38 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:04:38 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3015.8C07A680@pm3-135.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:02:51 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id SAA06370 Resent-Message-ID: <"EpXgz1.0.tZ1.qidrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3627 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ---------- From: Dana K. Loan[SMTP:loan@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Monday, February 02, 1998 7:05 PM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? >Is there any hard experimental evidence that precludes the possibility >of FTL? Not really. The only thing that precludes it is Special Relativity, and there are alternatives to SR that explain everything we've observed, and allow FTL. Also, it appears impossible to create a valid quantum gravity theory with relativity. As for eviden ce FOR FTL, it exists. The Nimtz experiments, the proofs of quantum nonlocality, etc. all add evidence. All that is needed to allow FTL is an absolute rest frame/absolute time (apparent time can change, but absolute time remains constant). This prevents c ausality violation of FTL travel. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 18:10:33 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA07811; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:10:12 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:10:12 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:01:06 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Need better descriptions on generator and HELP! Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"5BhKX1.0.mv1.2odrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3628 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-02 20:31:41 EST, you write: << Study each design a bit slower and tell us what the fate of it was before you go on to the next. >> John, In the past I have not had the resources to test or simulate my ideas (lab, quickfield, money, ect.). I think with a little help from the list and my banker, I can start to follow thru with my ideas. I have just written them off as failures in the past do to lack of resources for testing, building ect.. I was hoping that someone might be able to do something with my ideas for their own profit, as that is better than me just throwing them away as failures. I am going to stick with this latest one till I'm sure it's a total failure. One last thing, I do not want any rights to any o/u device I invent. Just that it is called by my last name. This will give me a little credibility as a designer for future projects. Thanks, Butch LaFonte LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 18:41:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA16166; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:41:26 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:41:26 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD301A.AC6F4C20@pm3-135.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:39:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD301A.AC6F4C20" Resent-Message-ID: <"2LDEV1.0.Py3.KFerq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3629 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD301A.AC6F4C20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: Josef Katz[SMTP:joeyk19@idt.net] Sent: Monday, February 02, 1998 7:46 PM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? >Can someone please explain me about this 4.7c expirament? ie. how was = it >done, what sort of equipment, etc... >thanks >-joey katz A professor named Gunter Nimtz in Germany built a machine with his = collegues that sends signals faster than light. Basically, it is a = waveguide that splits microwaves in half, sends one half through open = air to a detector, and the other half through a special waveguide of = equal length as the open air path. The arrival times of the signals are = measured at the detector. The open air microwave signal arrived at light = speed. The waveguide signal arrived 4.7 times faster, indicating that it = travelled 4.7 times the speed of light. The first signal was iffy, as it = was just microwaves. The second signal that confirmed it was Mozart's = 40th Symphony encoded as microwaves. The phase velocity didn't just go = FTL, but the music itself arrived FTL. The only official statement = regarding it being false was: "There must be some mistake. Its as if = someone said Australia wasn't there even though all the evidence points = to it." Seems to me that the relativists are saying FTL isn't there even = though the evidence points to it. Best Regards, Kyle R. 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I was wondering if it bothered you that the response you're getting was small, but I'm guessing, and by the response to your query it's probably a good guess, that lots of us read your posts and mull it over a bit. But the thing is, there have been so many of these magnetic motor attempts over the years, and in theory, some of them look good. But since they never seem to work, about all you can do is say "try it and see". With that in mind, perhaps trying to come up with other more meaningful comments on theoretical designs is frustrating for people, so they just give it a pass. I think the whole list hopes you get it working, and I think your posts and diagrams are appreciated in the mean time. Please keep it up. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 20:15:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA03198; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:15:51 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:15:51 -0800 Message-ID: <34D69A42.4E79@ix.netcom.com> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 23:17:06 -0500 From: "Dana K. Loan" Reply-To: loan@ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? References: <01BD3015.8C07A680@pm3-135.gpt.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"F_UOZ3.0.ln.rdfrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3631 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Kyle R. Mcallister wrote: > Thanks...I didn't really think there was. Just thought I might have missed something. Any idea where I can get DETAILED info on the Nimtz experiments? > >Is there any hard experimental evidence that precludes the possibility > >of FTL? > > Not really. The only thing that precludes it is Special Relativity, and there are alternatives to SR that explain everything we've observed, and allow FTL. Also, it appears impossible to create a valid quantum gravity theory with relativity. As for evid ence FOR FTL, it exists. The Nimtz experiments, the proofs of quantum nonlocality, etc. all add evidence. All that is needed to allow FTL is an absolute rest frame/absolute time (apparent time can change, but absolute time remains constant). This > > Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 20:27:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA12085; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:26:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:26:19 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802022014.MAA08531@slave2.aa.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 18:23:43 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Rick Monteverde's lava rocks... Resent-Message-ID: <"emsqw3.0.jy2.enfrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3632 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Knuke - Thanks for the warning about the possible radiation hazards here. In Fiesta Ware, the glaze is concentrated and sits all on the outside. It might be a bit hotter than the vaseline glass for this reason. The glass contains the material diffused and fused within it, so it won't rub off very much, nor is it as concentrated. The vaseline glass I have (couple of pitchers, a tumbler, and some small dishes) just sits in a display cabinet and looks pretty, and I've always heard that they aren't much of a danger as long as you don't use them every day and sleep with them next to your head every night. As for the experiment, nothing at all looked any different from the control tumbler which was from a very similar or perhaps identical mold. And, I still feel fine. The tumbler's back in the cabinet with it's hot little friends, probably trying to irradiate the colbalt in my blue glass. :) - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 20:42:26 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA14377; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:42:16 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:42:16 -0800 (PST) From: Richmon21@aol.com Message-ID: <32314577.34d69c5b@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 23:26:01 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: RECEIVED Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 49 Resent-Message-ID: <"XGq5f2.0.WW3.W0grq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3633 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I got your post From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 20:47:58 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA15609; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:47:48 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:47:48 -0800 (PST) From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <52d2832b.34d69edb@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 23:36:38 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Is there a point where movement is without back EMF? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"BbIJT1.0.cp3.l5grq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3634 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-02 16:43:05 EST, you write: << Would it be possible for this repulsion force of very great strength could push the two electro-magnets apart a distance so small that it would be hard for instruments to measure the distance and no back EMF to be produced by this movement? If so, then you have work, (force x distance) but you don't pay for it with a back EMF. This would be only if you opened the circuit before the current impulse completed the wire length ( remember, it starts out in both directions till it meets at half the circuit length). What I'm trying to say is, maybe there is a point where force becomes so great, distance moved so small, that no back EMF is generated. Then the collapse of the coil could recover the energy put into the coils (minus the energy that goes to overcoming resistance, ect. >> Well, not according to conventional theory. Without getting into the various laws, etc. involved, the slight movement of one coil relative to the other changes slightly the number of flux linkages each coil "sees" from the other. This change in flux linkages is the source of the "back EMF" you are referring to. There is no delay (as long as motion is slow compared to c) between the the movement and appearance of the back EMF, so quickly turning off the current, which requires time for the fields to collapse, does not sound promising. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 20:56:12 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA13372; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:56:02 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 20:56:02 -0800 Message-ID: <001f01bd3060$3d06ee60$323f6018@nsew.gte.net> From: "Chris Needy" To: Subject: Knuke getting sick with radiation Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 23:57:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"WEhMD1.0.mG3.XDgrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3635 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Knuke, Be real careful with that stuff. You said you got sick. Understandably so. Just being around that stuff with hardly any contact can make some humans very ill. Take some extra niacin and the body flush from it will help pull that radiation effect out. Take the niacin (not niacinamide) with a balanced supplement of other vitamins. To get a good flush take 50-100 mgs. on a partially empty stomach. Do yourself a favor and read the book "All about Radiation" by L. Ron Hubbard and a Medical Doctor. Chris Needy Clearwater, FL. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 21:54:24 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA24771; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:54:14 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 21:54:14 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34D69544.FBA@worldnet.att.net> Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 19:55:48 -0800 From: Wm Perry Reply-To: wperry3092@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: serious question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4mYwe2.0.y26.34hrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3636 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hey list, I know this may sound stupid, but here goes: If one were to take some sort of electrostatic generator such as the Wimshurst and take the output of it, charge a sort of big quick charge capacitor (leyden jar), when the charge gets big enough to jump across a spark gap, the resulting power could be dumped through a step up transformer, filtered, rectified and turned into DC, then charged into another capacitor (leyden again), and the resulting big charge could be used to power an electrostatic motor. The turning of this motor could be coupled by a mechanical shaft, to the Electrostatic generator, to turn it. Would this work as a sort of nonstop (i.e. perpet motion)? At first when I asked myself this question, I said "No, William, it oculdn't because the input power of a transformer must ALWAYS equal the output power. But it was then that the proverbial light bulb went on and I said "But, an electrostatic motor runs on the voltage across the gap between the stators and the rotor. Even if the current was miniscule, it wouldn't matter." If anyone has any sort of criticism on this idea, please post. WILLIAM From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 22:19:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA06564; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:19:28 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:19:28 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 18:21:13 +1100 Message-Id: <199802030721.SAA13819@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@mail.sa.ozland.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Geoff Egel Subject: Re: testatika and capacitor anomolies Resent-Message-ID: <"6JVM93.0.Tc1.kRhrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3637 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:31 PM 1/30/98 -0800, you wrote: >Hi Jeff, > >You do in fact have a very good web page. Thanks for making this info >available. >http://geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 > >The thing you describe bellow sounds sorta like the famous Henershot >generator. >Could you describe it more in detail ? I am not sure I follow. > Unfortunately as I said in my posting I have been unable to repeat the experiment it may have things in common with the hendershot design although I am unaware of it. I was winding other coils at the time I say the resulting action as described in a previous posting that you have read. The toriod was resting on a wooden table and I accidently dropped the electroyle capacitor I not sure what the value was but it normally size one you use in Stablished DC rectified AC current application. I left it there as I did not need it and saw the the resulting sparking. If I can recall correctly I charged it to 50 Volt about twice the normal rating. with a variation of an alexander type dynamo if I can remember correctly. Geoff >Tim > >>Try putting the charged electroyle capacitor and inside a >>alternating toriod field and put the connecting leads just short of >>shoting out. The toriod I used was some copper magnet wire wound on a >iron >hitching ring about six inches in diameter. The actual ring about 1 >inch thickness. > >>I actually did this by accident and it gave off a electrical >discharge >>at iregular periods for about a hour of an hour while I watched it in >amusement. >>I though the capacitor would discharge and then stop but it continued. > >>Until I distrubed it to find out what was happening and snuffed it out.. >>unfortunately forget how I did it ,as it was several years ago and I >>have been unable to reproduce the experiment or worked how I did it. >> > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 22:30:32 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA28572; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:30:09 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:30:09 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:28:46 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802030628.BAA07375@freenet6.carleton.ca.carleton.ca> From: dy288@freenet.carleton.ca (Gregory Watson) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Knuke getting sick with radiation Reply-To: dy288@freenet.carleton.ca Resent-Message-ID: <"HrEYv1.0.G-6.kbhrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3638 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com C. Needy wrote: >... >Do yourself a favor and read the book "All about Radiation" by L. Ron >Hubbard and a Medical Doctor. Actually, L. Ron Hubbard wrote science *fiction*; he then went on to form a cult based on it. He was not an expert regarding radiation. Greg From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 22:33:08 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA09212; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:32:48 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:32:48 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 18:34:32 +1100 Message-Id: <199802030734.SAA13964@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@mail.sa.ozland.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Geoff Egel Subject: Re: testatika and capacitor anomolies Resent-Message-ID: <"4kQ2O.0.rF2.Fehrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3639 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:34 PM 1/31/98 -0800, you wrote: >Hi Tim, Geoff and all, >At 07:23 PM 1/31/98 -0800, you wrote: >>>Do you have any more details about the capacitor: value, voltage rating >>and >>>applied voltage, spark gap, etc? My experiments have shown no changes >>with a >>>14000uF capacitor in the bore of an electromagnet, either DC or AC >>powered, >>>about 10000 Amp turns, or a large pulse current from another capacitor >>bank. >>>-Dave The capacitor I used if was a normal Blue large capacitor as used in AC retified to DC power supply less than 50 volts as this is what I believed I charged it to as I remember maybe a 12 or 24 volt rating The capacitor was blue in colour and was charge to 50 volts using a variation Alexander dynamo idea ,it could charge capacitor but usually shorted out when I tried to run anything else from it. The capacitor was charged but not connected to the generator when serendipty took a hand. and iside a large donut coil or another name a Toriod coil wound on a iron ring (single layer) I believe again if I can remember correctly the capacitor was about 1 and 1/2 to 2 inches long and no more than 1 inch in diameter or there abouts. I did this several years ago and some of the details have faded into the background. I though nothing of it at the time but wish now I had kept notes Geoff http://geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 >> >>The thing that started this was a discussion of the Swiss testatika >>machine invented by Paul Baumann a member of the Christian commune >>Methernitha in Linden, Switzerland. Checkout Solaris web pages at: >> >>http://members.tripod.com/~kilowattfree/ >> >>and >> >>http://geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 >> >Yes, I don't understand the testatika either, these pages described the >Linden experiment with a electret, which others, according to the notes, >tried without results. My tests may have been more along Hendershot- how can >a magnetic field affect an electrolytic capacitor? I not sure myself (geoff) >-Dave > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 22:34:03 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA09616; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:33:53 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:33:53 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: eskimo.com: billb owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:33:45 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: testatika & Bruce Perreault In-Reply-To: <01bd3047$1552c880$84a99bcf@isonix> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"7tcjv.0._L2.Efhrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3640 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Paul Brown wrote: > >>made possible from critical information obtained from The Boston Museum > >>of Science. The Museum had such a device on display up and running from > >>about, roughly, 1986 to 1997, ten years! Hmmmmm. I was Electrical Engineer there until 1989. The above msg could refer to two different things: the disk-motor we built for our hand-cranked Vandegraff generator exhibit (included one of my pop-bottle motors!) Or, it could refer to the fake Perpetual Motion Machine contest. This was built by "Dadaelus", the humor writer for the British magazine New Scientist. It ran on hidden batteries, and was an extremely devious but intentional hoax. It looked like an ever-turning bicycle wheel with big magnets, eccentric cam capacitors, and other weird stuff attached. There was a $2000 prize offered for anyone who could explain in detail exactly how the hoax was accomplished. In 1989 there was a tie, a child and an adult both guessed the technique within the same week. I think that the device was kept on exhibit for years afterwards, though. No Wimshurst machines there, except the old Edmund Scientific types used on the travelling demonstration carts. (note: the pop-bottle motor came first. Later I designed the flat version made from acrylic and aluminum foil. There was also a "Franklin's Wheel" made of acrylic rods with thimbles on the ends.) ((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))) William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb@eskimo.com www.eskimo.com/~billb EE/programmer/sci-exhibits science projects, tesla, weird science Seattle, WA 206-781-3320 freenrg-L taoshum-L vortex-L webhead-L From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 2 22:57:38 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA15267; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:57:20 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 22:57:20 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 18:59:06 +1100 Message-Id: <199802030759.SAA14210@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@mail.sa.ozland.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Geoff Egel Subject: Re: RECEIVED Butch Resent-Message-ID: <"JWAyr2.0.Sk3.F_hrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3641 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 03:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: > >-----Original Message----- >From: HLafonte@aol.com >To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Date: Monday, February 02, 1998 1:12 PM >Subject: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte > > >>Hi all, >>There is something I have been curious about for awhile. That is how many >>people on the list read my posts or for that matter how many people get my >>post? >>Please hit your reply button and send anything to let me know you at least >get >>my post. If nothing else, just put received on subject. >>Thank you very much, >>Butch LaFonte >> >I am getting your posts and diagrams Butch Geoff > >http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 00:31:24 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA28282; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 00:31:12 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 00:31:12 -0800 From: "Paul Brown" To: Subject: Re: testatika & Bruce Perreault Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:30:28 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd307d$fb72ec60$aea99bcf@isonix> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"85CUy.0.kv6.FNjrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3642 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com -----Original Message----- From: William Beaty To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 12:39 AM Subject: Re: testatika & Bruce Perreault >On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Paul Brown wrote: > >> >>made possible from critical information obtained from The Boston Museum >> >>of Science. The Museum had such a device on display up and running from >> >>about, roughly, 1986 to 1997, ten years! > >Hmmmmm. I was Electrical Engineer there until 1989. The above msg could >refer to two different things: the disk-motor we built for our >hand-cranked Vandegraff generator exhibit (included one of my pop-bottle >motors!) > >Or, it could refer to the fake Perpetual Motion Machine contest. This was >built by "Dadaelus", the humor writer for the British magazine New >Scientist. It ran on hidden batteries, and was an extremely devious but >intentional hoax. It looked like an ever-turning bicycle wheel with big >magnets, eccentric cam capacitors, and other weird stuff attached. There >was a $2000 prize offered for anyone who could explain in detail exactly >how the hoax was accomplished. In 1989 there was a tie, a child and an >adult both guessed the technique within the same week. I think that the >device was kept on exhibit for years afterwards, though. > >No Wimshurst machines there, except the old Edmund Scientific types used >on the travelling demonstration carts. > >(note: the pop-bottle motor came first. Later I designed the flat version >made from acrylic and aluminum foil. There was also a "Franklin's Wheel" >made of acrylic rods with thimbles on the ends.) It sounds like an enjoyable occupation. I am sure you liked your job there. I do not know what Bruce is referring to. It seems that I can not have any type of conversation with the man without it becoming agressive and rediculous. I suppose time will tell for sure. I just do not see how any demonstrations of influence type machines are going to provide the answer as to how the Testatika machine works. Of course, as you mentioned; possibly Bruce is calling the Testatika machine a hoax, just like the powered demo you described. I simply do not know. My interest is in the fact that Bruce is working with radioactive materials. Further, he is telling other people to work with the same materials. He is posting info and pro-nuke propoganda that radiation is not harmful. I have tried to offer constructive criticism and advice in handling procedures since I do not want to see anyone hurt by mishandling of these potentially dangerous materials. All who were present at the Meeting of the Minds in Temecula, CA, 1987, saw first-hand the radiation burns that I had suffered. Six of my fingers were swelled twice their normal size and almost one continuous white blister, at that time. I had working hardware, but it almost cost me six fingers. Anyway, contrary to the claims made by Galen Winsor and Bruce Perrault; radiation can not be dealt with in a haphazard manner. The potential for harm does exist. Paul Brown > >((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))) >William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website >billb@eskimo.com www.eskimo.com/~billb >EE/programmer/sci-exhibits science projects, tesla, weird science >Seattle, WA 206-781-3320 freenrg-L taoshum-L vortex-L webhead-L > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 01:07:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA09263; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:07:27 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:07:27 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34D6F912.2B9F@keelynet.com> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 03:01:38 -0800 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Where do I find the file teslafe.zip References: <34D65DF9.E22E797@mindless.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wvwOo2.0.dG2.Cvjrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3643 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Matt! The Teslafe1 and Teslafe2 are both online at; http://keelynet.com/energy/teslafe1.htm http://keelynet.com/energy/teslafe2.htm if you are still interested... -- Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-8741 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 01:20:18 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA02697; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:20:10 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 01:20:10 -0800 From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: testatika and capacitor anomolies Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 09:19:54 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <34d6b31a.98159360@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <199802010534.VAA29188@denmark.it.earthlink.net> <34d4f90e.628788@mail.eisa.net.au> In-Reply-To: <34d4f90e.628788@mail.eisa.net.au> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pRLxE1.0.-f.85krq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3644 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Sun, 01 Feb 1998 22:44:58 GMT, Robin van Spaandonk wrote: >On Sat, 31 Jan 1998 21:34:10 -0800 (PST), dave dameron wrote: >[snip] >>Yes, I don't understand the testatika either, these pages described the >>Linden experiment with a electret, which others, according to the notes, >>tried without results. My tests may have been more along Hendershot- how can >>a magnetic field affect an electrolytic capacitor? >>-Dave >> >Actually I tried an impoverished little experiment along those lines >once, precisely because I thought it might. A relativistic treatment >of magnetism (or current really) leads to the conclusion that a >magnetic field can be viewed as a pseudo electric field at right >angles to the magnetic field. I wondered therefore if this pseudo This should have been "at right angles to the current". >electric field could be used to create a charge on a capacitor. I >still wonder :). [snip] Regards, Robin van Spaandonk -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on temperature. "....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." PS - no SPAM thanks! -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 05:35:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA16176; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 05:35:39 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 05:35:39 -0800 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <23d27e8.34d71d16@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:35:15 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, egel@main.murray.net.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: How to build the Testatica and more.... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 116 Resent-Message-ID: <"0rxgs1.0.fy3.gqnrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3645 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi All, I have updated my web site with some intresting news... After the crazy "Magnetic Paradox...", today, you will find : - The complete detail for building the "Testatica" generator and the process explained for converting electrostatic energy into electrodynamic power (by courtesy of Nelson Camus), - Many informations about Nelson Camus' technologies : - The "Nithium" Cold Fusion reactor, - The "Nithium" Turbo-Battery, - and the personal biography of Nelson Camus.... More to come very soon.... All these informations may be found at : http://members.aol.com/overunity2/nelson/nelson.htm I hope that this will interest you, Sincerely, Jean-Louis Naudin ( France / GMT+1 ) ( This mail has been sent at 1315 GMT on February 3, 1998 ) Email : JNaudin509@aol.com my Overunity WEB Server : http://members.aol.com/JNaudin509/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 06:52:03 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA04573; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:51:55 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 06:51:55 -0800 From: PeteB13@aol.com Message-ID: <606145d0.34d72ef5@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 09:51:31 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Tesla coils Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 165 Resent-Message-ID: <"7Trjr3.0.M71.9yorq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3646 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This happens to be a very interesting subject for me, and an intrigueing (not sure of spelling) one at that. Something that has always fascinated me is how they actually work? Are they dangerous? What are they used for? Are they in any way related to Plasma balls? If anyone can shed any light on this for me, in english :P, then please do. Pete From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 07:43:59 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA20967; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:43:43 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:43:43 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:42:41 -0500 From: Jochum Pihl <106635.3612@compuserve.com> Subject: RECEIVED Sender: Jochum Pihl <106635.3612@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:freenrg-l@eskimo.com" Message-ID: <199802031042_MC2-31B2-1F3B@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id HAA20942 Resent-Message-ID: <"L7BOq.0.W75.kiprq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3647 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com received From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 07:44:21 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA21172; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:44:15 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:44:15 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:42:37 -0500 From: Jochum Pihl <106635.3612@compuserve.com> Subject: RECEIVED Sender: Jochum Pihl <106635.3612@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:freenrg-l@eskimo.com" Message-ID: <199802031043_MC2-31B2-1F39@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id HAA21113 Resent-Message-ID: <"05iXi.0.bA5.Ejprq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3648 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com received From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 07:44:29 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA21201; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:44:21 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 07:44:21 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:42:32 -0500 From: Jochum Pihl <106635.3612@compuserve.com> Subject: RECEIVED Sender: Jochum Pihl <106635.3612@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:freenrg-l@eskimo.com" Message-ID: <199802031043_MC2-31B2-1F36@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id HAA21158 Resent-Message-ID: <"J47Pr.0.6B5.Jjprq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3649 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com recieved From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 08:55:25 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA16067; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:54:59 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 08:54:59 -0800 Message-ID: <34D74C98.764AF4F1@midusa.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 10:58:00 -0600 From: Jon Flickinger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Poll of list, from Butch LaFonte References: <5363ad2d.34d6187d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OSsvw3.0.yw3.Wlqrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3650 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Butch, I receive and read your posts as well as your web site. Continue your efforts and if I feel I can contibute in any way, I will! Jon Flickinger From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 10:52:36 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA29617; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:52:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 10:52:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34D7652D.9C0D7670@worldonline.nl> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 19:42:53 +0100 From: Ronald de Mol Organization: World Online X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, Ronald de Mol Subject: Re: Where do I find the file teslafe.zip X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <34D65DF9.E22E797@mindless.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"7mBMW2.0.bE7.JTsrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3651 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Matthew Mills wrote: > > Hi ppl , Im new to this list and was wondering if someone knows where > I can get the files contained in the zip file teslafe.zip On most mirrors > of the keelynet server I can find teslafe1.asc and teslafe2.asc but I > can't find the gifs mentioned in these texts. > > Thanks, > > Matt. (From New Zealand) > > (Interested in HV electricity, Tesla coils, Static Electricity, > magnetism and Free Energy theory) 1994 Sep 18 9.5K ftp.djk.se/pub/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/diagrams/TESLAFE1.GIF 1994 Sep 18 7.5K ftp.djk.se/pub/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/diagrams/TESLAFE2.GIF 1993 Feb 1 27.9K ftp.djk.se/pub/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/energy/teslafe1.asc 1993 Feb 1 15.4K ftp.djk.se/pub/elektromagnum/physics/KeelyNet/energy/teslafe2.asc 1994 Nov 25 16.3K ftp.funet.fi/pub/sci/electrical/tesla/misc/keely.teslafe.zip -- Regards, Ronald de Mol. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 11:55:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA28995; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:55:03 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:55:03 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802031954.AA12548@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 98 08:36:07 -0500 To: Subject: Re: Where do I find the file teslafe.zip Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3KFZM.0.l47.LOtrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3652 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Matt, You wrote, >Hi ppl , Im new to this list and was wondering if someone knows where >I can get the files contained in the zip file teslafe.zip On most >mirrors of the keelynet server I can find teslafe1.asc and >teslafe2.asc but I can't find the gifs mentioned in these texts. I have links to all the stuff contained in the zip file. Take a look at my alt-energy WWW page -- http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Downs/9954/physics.html -- , and under the "Power Generation and Physics" paragraph you will see some dialog along with links to the original Telsafe1.asc and the Keelynet thoughts on it [telsafe2.asc, 7017gt.asc, and GIFs.]....along with my own thoughts that I should update to my current views. Also see http://www.keelynet.com/index98.htm#energy -- Jerry Decker recently re-posted some of the Tesla F/E stuff...along with an additional document. Good luck in your research. Anton Rager Denver, CO arager@McGraw-Hill.com [WK] arager@idcomm.com [HM] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 11:55:19 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA29036; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:55:12 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 11:55:12 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802031954.AB12576@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 98 08:51:38 -0500 To: Subject: Re[2]: Need better descriptions on generator and HELP! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"adJyG.0.Z57.SOtrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3653 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch LaFonte Wrote, >In the past I have not had the resources to test or simulate my ideas (lab, >quickfield,money, ect.). I think with a little help from the list and my >banker, I can start to follow thru with my ideas. Butch, There are several of us here with a grasp of Quickfield and other modeling tools......Quickfield is free -- you just need a CPU and some imagination for converting 3D stuff to 2D models. If you can articulate your ideas a bit clearer, perhaps some of the rest of us will be able to think it thru with you. Sorry -- can't bankroll you thought.... ;) I do however, have a bunch of 486 DX/2s in my basement as well as a couple Pentium systems [Linux/X and DOS] that could be utilized for modeling stuff....[I use the Pentiums on a regular basis, but the 486's are mostly idle] BTW -- with giving away your ideas, the banker won't be real supportive ;) I'm also doing magnetic motor research -- and sticking with it until the horse is definitely dead. Thanks for sharing your ideas with us. Anton Rager Magnetic Motor Research http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Downs/9954/torque-motor.html Denver, CO arager@McGraw-Hill.com arager@idcomm.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 12:47:30 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA08180; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:47:14 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:47:14 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: eskimo.com: billb owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:47:01 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Came to me while commuting... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"P3UMR.0.c_1.F9urq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3654 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com HOW TO CLIMB A MOUNTAIN (w/thanx to T.S. Kuhn and M. Planck) Rush briefly upwards while stepping on the hands and faces of colleagues. Build a well-defended base camp. Attack anyone who tries to proceed upwards past you. Convince yourself that the rest of the mountain doesn't exist. After decades finally die, which leaves your camp undefended. Other mountaineers repeat the process. ((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))) William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb@eskimo.com www.eskimo.com/~billb EE/programmer/sci-exhibits science projects, tesla, weird science Seattle, WA 206-781-3320 freenrg-L taoshum-L vortex-L webhead-L From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 13:15:01 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA15454; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:14:52 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 13:14:52 -0800 Message-ID: <34D78735.19FFAE0@idt.net> Date: Tue, 03 Feb 1998 16:08:05 -0500 From: Josef Katz X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? References: <01BD301A.AC6F4C20@pm3-135.gpt.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"99EAN.0.Mn3.AZurq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3655 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com What kind of wave guide? -joey katz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 14:39:14 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA06443; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:38:58 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 14:38:58 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802030628.BAA07375@freenet6.carleton.ca.carleton.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 12:37:06 -1000 To: freenrg list From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Knuke getting sick with radiation Resent-Message-ID: <"cHcS41.0.aa1.0ovrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3656 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greg - > Actually, L. Ron Hubbard wrote science > *fiction*; he then went on to form a cult > based on it. He was not an expert > regarding radiation. He did write science fiction. But he didn't "form a cult based on it". I don't want to feed the potential for another 'religious' tit-for-tat thread here, and I'm not a Scientologist. But I know Hubbard's processes for reducing pollution, drugs, and radiation in the body have been endorsed by quite a few non-Scientologist medical doctors, and have been proven in medical tests to work reliably. Don't hit on me for the references, I read them years ago, and it wasn't Scientology literature. These very important and useful facts get overridden in the popular media and groupthink by the "cult" stories; so as usual, what's really important gets lost. Don't trust everything you you see in the popular media, they're way full of it. Their paycheck is proportional to the depth of the negativity and controversy they can generate. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 15:53:36 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA21181; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:53:30 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 15:53:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:52:09 -0600 (CST) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC Knuke getting sick with radiation To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"oSVxf1.0.rA5.utwrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3657 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Tue, 3 Feb 1998, Rick Monteverde wrote: > Greg - > > > Actually, L. Ron Hubbard wrote science > > *fiction*; he then went on to form a cult > > based on it. He was not an expert > > regarding radiation. > > He did write science fiction. But he didn't "form a cult based on it". > > I don't want to feed the potential for another 'religious' tit-for-tat > thread here, and I'm not a Scientologist. But I know Hubbard's processes > for reducing pollution, drugs, and radiation in the body have been endorsed > by quite a few non-Scientologist medical doctors, and have been proven in > medical tests to work reliably. Don't hit on me for the references, I read > them years ago, and it wasn't Scientology literature. These very important > and useful facts get overridden in the popular media and groupthink by the > "cult" stories; so as usual, what's really important gets lost. Don't trust > everything you you see in the popular media, they're way full of it. Their > paycheck is proportional to the depth of the negativity and controversy > they can generate. > > - Rick Monteverde > Honolulu, HI > > The journal of FASE (the Foundation for Advancement in Science and Education, formed by various medical doctors, scientists and educators including Jaime Escalante) has done extensive testing and research surrounding Mr. Hubbard's purification program with very positive results. I have their address if anyone wishes to contact them. Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 16:36:44 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA28278; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:36:36 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:36:36 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul Brown" To: Subject: Fw: Fw: testatika & Bruce Perreault Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:34:40 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd3104$ae0c16e0$e2a89bcf@isonix> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"7kJZV.0.jv6.IWxrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3658 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com -----Original Message----- From: john moreland To: Paul Brown Date: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 8:31 AM Subject: Re: Fw: testatika & Bruce Perreault >Paul, > Bruce has spent hours on VDO phone telling me about the wonders of >this motor. The one he is speaking of is the one with the hidden >bateries. Bruce was convinced that it somehow used the magnets to >re-charge the batteries and died when the batteries could no longer take >a charge or had leaked and were destroyed. I kept telling him there was >no future in this as it was a well known hoax, but you know bruce. Once >he gets something in his head it is going to work, if nowhere else in >his mind and on his web page. He is realy hurting the free energy >movement. > On the testiraka referance on bruce's page, have you ever heard of >this guy Calvin Bahlann? > >Thanks, >John > >Paul Brown wrote: >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: William Beaty >> To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >> Date: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 12:39 AM >> Subject: Re: testatika & Bruce Perreault >> >> >On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Paul Brown wrote: >> > >> >> >>made possible from critical information obtained from The Boston Museum >> >> >>of Science. The Museum had such a device on display up and running from >> >> >>about, roughly, 1986 to 1997, ten years! >> > >> >Hmmmmm. I was Electrical Engineer there until 1989. The above msg could >> >refer to two different things: the disk-motor we built for our >> >hand-cranked Vandegraff generator exhibit (included one of my pop-bottle >> >motors!) >> > >> >Or, it could refer to the fake Perpetual Motion Machine contest. This was >> >built by "Dadaelus", the humor writer for the British magazine New >> >Scientist. It ran on hidden batteries, and was an extremely devious but >> >intentional hoax. It looked like an ever-turning bicycle wheel with big >> >magnets, eccentric cam capacitors, and other weird stuff attached. There >> >was a $2000 prize offered for anyone who could explain in detail exactly >> >how the hoax was accomplished. In 1989 there was a tie, a child and an >> >adult both guessed the technique within the same week. I think that the >> >device was kept on exhibit for years afterwards, though. >> > >> >No Wimshurst machines there, except the old Edmund Scientific types used >> >on the travelling demonstration carts. >> > >> >(note: the pop-bottle motor came first. Later I designed the flat version >> >made from acrylic and aluminum foil. There was also a "Franklin's Wheel" >> >made of acrylic rods with thimbles on the ends.) >> > >> >((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))) >> >William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website >> >billb@eskimo.com www.eskimo.com/~billb >> >EE/programmer/sci-exhibits science projects, tesla, weird science >> >Seattle, WA 206-781-3320 freenrg-L taoshum-L vortex-L webhead-L >> > >> > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 16:49:10 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA15008; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:48:55 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 16:48:55 -0800 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 19:49:34 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802040049.TAA25593@freenet3.carleton.ca.carleton.ca> From: dy288@freenet.carleton.ca (Gregory Watson) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Knuke getting sick with radiation Reply-To: dy288@freenet.carleton.ca Resent-Message-ID: <"cb5na1.0.Ag3.phxrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3659 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I stand corrected; and apologize for writing too hastily. I'll look into info on the subject. Greg p.s. I'm not the Greg Watson having to do with PMOD, RMOG and SMOT > >Greg - > > > Actually, L. Ron Hubbard wrote science > > *fiction*; he then went on to form a cult > > based on it. He was not an expert > > regarding radiation. > >He did write science fiction. But he didn't "form a cult based on it". > >I don't want to feed the potential for another 'religious' tit-for-tat >thread here, and I'm not a Scientologist. But I know Hubbard's processes >for reducing pollution, drugs, and radiation in the body have been endorsed >by quite a few non-Scientologist medical doctors, and have been proven in >medical tests to work reliably. Don't hit on me for the references, I read >them years ago, and it wasn't Scientology literature. These very important >and useful facts get overridden in the popular media and groupthink by the >"cult" stories; so as usual, what's really important gets lost. Don't trust >everything you you see in the popular media, they're way full of it. Their >paycheck is proportional to the depth of the negativity and controversy >they can generate. > >- Rick Monteverde >Honolulu, HI > > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 17:20:12 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA21416; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:20:01 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 17:20:01 -0800 From: "Paul Brown" To: Cc: Subject: Fw: Radium Chloride Wanted. Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 18:19:20 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd310a$ebaa9160$e2a89bcf@isonix> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"JirBU3.0.WE5._8yrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3660 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com -----Original Message----- From: Paul Brown To: KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Date: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 6:08 PM Subject: Re: Radium Chloride Wanted. > >-----Original Message----- >From: Dave >To: KeelyNet-L@lists.kz >Date: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 5:52 PM >Subject: Radium Chloride Wanted. > > >>Where can Radium Chloride be purchased from? >> >>Dave. >> >It requires a license. Depending upon where you live, the license is either >issued by the State Health Department or the NRC (National Regulatory >Commission). The rules have changed in this country greatly since the 1930's >when radium chloride was used in luminous paints as well as medicinal uses. >Today, it is highly controlled and very hard to get ahold of. One of the >conditions of the license is that you provide financial assurance or a bond >for the disposal costs involved relative to your possession of the material. > >Radium is also a Radon generator. The first daughter product is radon which >is a gas and easily inhaled. With a 1600 year half-life, your body burden >with radium is very high. That is, you will keep it with you for a very long >time. I am not saying that radium can not be handled safely, just that the >potential for harm is substantial. I reccomend further investigation into >the claims before anyone goes out and tries to get radium. > >A further factor is the costs involved. Radium is very expensive in any >quantity. It takes some 40 tons of uranium ore to yield only one gram of >pure radium metal. Radium chloride is much cheaper to produce but still >costs about $30,000 per gram. > >I can provide a great many more details, if it is of value. I just wanted to >post the warning before anyone goes and hurts themselves. My experience and >life work has been with the conversion of radioactive decay to electricity. >This is something that I know-handling of radioactive materials. > >Paul Brown > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 18:25:06 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA09987; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 18:24:53 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 18:24:53 -0800 Message-Id: <199802040225.AAA13893@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: not so good indeed ! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 00:27:49 -3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: serious question Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br CC: KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Priority: normal In-reply-to: <34D69544.FBA@worldnet.att.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Resent-Message-ID: <"Qyy2h2.0.lR2.n5zrq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3661 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com William wrote : > > If one were to take some sort of electrostatic generator such as the > Wimshurst and take the output of it, charge a sort of big quick charge > capacitor (leyden jar), when the charge gets big enough to jump across a > spark gap, the resulting power could be dumped through a step up > transformer, filtered, rectified and turned into DC, then charged into > another capacitor (leyden again), and the resulting big charge could be > used to power an electrostatic motor. The turning of this motor could be > coupled by a mechanical shaft, to the Electrostatic generator, to turn > it. Would this work as a sort of nonstop (i.e. perpet motion)? I was thinking on a rotary variable capacitor instead of leyden jars. When the variable capacitor is totally open, charge it with a spark from the Wimshurst generator. When the capacitor closes, connect it to a load. This way, the high voltage - low current charging the open capacitor will be transformed into a low voltage - high current when the capacitor is closed. As the capacitor is rotating, the cycle is repeated at a given frequency. Questions : 1. What would be the voltage ratio between the open/closed capacitor ? 2. What would be the speed of rotation ? 3. Are there any chances of OU with such a device ? Your comments, please. Marcelo From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 19:00:22 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA24013; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 19:00:15 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 19:00:15 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <9edc3374.34d7d880@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 21:54:54 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Sticking with "Big Y" the most promising of 100 designs Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"Evo261.0.1t5.zczrq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3662 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com After looking over all of my more than 100 designs, I have decided to focus all my time and resources on the "Big Y" design. There was a quickfield simulation on Greg Watson's web site, but only the text is coming up now. I will check with him to see what the problem is. I will put drawings on my web page as soon as possible. A description of operation will be better this time than in the past. Thanks, Butch Note: Someone on the list sent me a post stating that they had got some very interesting results using a coil with the "Big Y" design. To save me from having to go thru all my backup tapes, could you please contact me. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 19:41:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA28032; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 19:41:19 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 19:41:19 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980201213717.00cc6c6c@palacenet.net> X-Sender: mules@palacenet.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sun, 01 Feb 1998 21:37:17 -0600 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Jack DeMule Subject: Re: serious question In-Reply-To: <199802040225.AAA13893@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> References: <34D69544.FBA@worldnet.att.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"AC-Cl2.0.ur6.UD-rq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3663 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello Marcelo, all... At 00:27 2/4/98 -3, Marcelo Puhl wrote: >This way, the high voltage - low current charging the open capacitor will be >transformed into a low voltage - high current when the capacitor is closed. >As the capacitor is rotating, the cycle is repeated at a given frequency. > >Questions : > >1. What would be the voltage ratio between the open/closed capacitor ? The same as the capacitance ratio. >2. What would be the speed of rotation ? Any speed you like, although the greater speeds should have increasing losses. >3. Are there any chances of OU with such a device ? Not that I can see. PS. William's idea, employing a spark gap as part of the HV DC to AC converter, can be found in Tesla's writings. Best Regards, Jack ---------------------------------------------------------- "...and I work among cries and clatters like a venomous beaver in a parrot house. A letter full of nothing. Yours," -signed Dylan mules@palacenet.net ---------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 21:06:09 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA11806; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 21:05:50 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 21:05:50 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 00:03:45 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Greg Watson, "Big Y" Quickfield working fine now, Thanks! Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"xeQJH2.0.Cu2.fS_rq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3664 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greg, Thanks, working fine now Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 3 21:07:46 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA09956; Tue, 3 Feb 1998 21:07:39 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Feb 1998 21:07:39 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <263fa5e9.34d7f620@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 00:01:18 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: "Big Y" Quickfield simulation on LaFonte home page & drawing Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"4fgjD.0.SR2.PU_rq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3665 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com More to come Tomorrow! Thanks, Butch LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 08:07:33 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA12109; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 08:07:22 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 08:07:22 -0800 (PST) From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <728960cb.34d891e3@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:05:52 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Testatika and Overunity..... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 116 Resent-Message-ID: <"ZWQJ52.0.6z2.t89sq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3666 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Dear All, You will find in my web site, two very interesting documents written by Cyril Smith: The first document is about "Testatika and Overunity" at : http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/testacmt.htm The second document is about the "Magnetic paradox" solution detailled at: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/mpsolved.htm I think that this will interest you, Sincerely, Jean-Louis Naudin 02/04/98 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 08:40:59 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA18393; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 08:40:43 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 08:40:43 -0800 (PST) From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802041639.AA11243@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Wed, 04 Feb 98 09:31:01 -0500 To: Subject: Barkhausen Detector Info........ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"P8slz.0.FV4.6e9sq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3667 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Anyone built the Barkhausen Effect Detector outlined by Bob Shannon? I'm about to start winding my coil, but wanted to see what others think of this detector/generator. Would appreciate any design enhancements or ideas. Some questions: - What is the best coil core material? - How strong should the magnetic field be? Would 1"x .5" x .5" NIBs work? [I have about 8 of them] - What are ways to boost the effect? Could the coil output be directed to another coil to create additional magnetic disruptions and amplification? - What is Bob's Super Regenerative Detector? Anyone have a schematic? - What sorts of output should I expect ---- 1mv, 10mv, 100mv...? Along the same lines, has anyone attempted to build a Coler device? [The one with 6 magnets in a hexagon pattern] Could someone explain his magnet/coil winding process a bit more for me? Am I correct in assuming that each core has two coils.....one terminating into the core [both ends] and the other in a more normal configuration? What size caps would be best suited? As always, I seem to have more questions than answers....... Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com [WK] arager@idcomm.com [HM] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 11:17:28 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA18060; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:17:10 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:17:10 -0800 From: tv@juno.com To: vortex-L@eskimo.com Cc: freenrg-L@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 11:15:16 -0800 Subject: radioactive testatika Message-ID: <19980204.111518.3398.2.tv@juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,7-8,10-11,13-14,17-21 Resent-Message-ID: <"vu9JZ1.0.sP4.pwBsq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3668 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com It maybe dangerous, but I am quite sure the Nelson Camus' explanation for the testatika of putting Ra inside capacitor could be made to work in a high voltage oscillating circuit. As the radioactive capacitors would become charged, the alpha emissions would start to depolarize the dielectric which would decrease the dielectric constant. This would have the same effect as pulling the capacitor plates apart while they are charged which requires work and would add energy to the circuit. I have heard a rumor that one visitor smuggled a miniature russian geiger counter with him to see a demonstration of testatika. It was hot ! Also, where else might one be able find old stocks of glow in the dark watch dial paint than Switzerland ! However, in order to get that much power from radium seems anomolous to me in any case just based on simple "particle power" calculations from the CRC physics and chemistry handbook. Tim ( tv@juno.com ) _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 17:50:40 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA19800; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:50:29 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 17:50:29 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <5cda05ed.34d91a51@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:47:58 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Is there a list of people on the list? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"PC6z1.0.Gr4.YhHsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3669 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Does anyone know if there is a list of people on the list. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 20:28:46 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA10881; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:28:01 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 20:28:01 -0800 Message-ID: <34D93FA5.63C6@spu.edu> Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 20:27:17 -0800 From: TK Reply-To: tnk@spu.edu Organization: me X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Testatika and Overunity..... References: <728960cb.34d891e3@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"o53_l.0.uf2.F_Jsq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3670 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I agree with the likelihood of the testatika device being closely related to the device shown at http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/testacmt.htm Electrical energy production from radioactive decay has already been documented by many others, as is shown by the list of just a few of the patents found in a search of the IBM patent server site. I think the testatika is most likely just an optimized form of one of these devices for converting the products of radioactive decay into electricity. A very interesting subject in and of its self, though, and worth taking a look into for possible widespread uses of this technology. Imagine, a battery powering your CD player with a life expectancy greater than your own life expectancy! I have listed below some patents I found on a quick search of the IBM patent server that might prove interesting to some of you thinking about building the nuclear testatika-type ideas. TK tkirk@hotmail.com ----------- !! patents dealing with nuclear battery type devices (Paul Brown's - very interesting) http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=4835433 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=5111099 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=4489269 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=5608767 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=3767947 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=3934162 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=5590162 ------ ?? questionable, but possible related patents http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=5079469 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=3836836 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=5443657 ----- Safety! (radiation detection) http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=5616928 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=4336532 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=5218208 http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=4644167 ------- ! non nuclear, but interesting. possible o/u? http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=4772816 JNaudin509@aol.com wrote: > > Dear All, > > You will find in my web site, two very interesting documents written by Cyril > Smith: > > The first document is about "Testatika and Overunity" at : > http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/testacmt.htm ... > Jean-Louis Naudin > 02/04/98 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 21:07:03 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA22541; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:06:43 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:06:43 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 23:57:54 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: What is name of coil with currents that go in opposite directions? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"0KmYt2.0.5W5.WZKsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3671 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com What is the name of the type coil that has two seperate circuits in one coil (runing side by side) that have current flow in opposite directions. The two magnetic fields from these circuits cancel out any self inductance in the coil I believe. Thanks, Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 21:29:20 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA26781; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:29:00 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:29:00 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980204232310.00765a78@palacenet.net> X-Sender: mules@palacenet.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 04 Feb 1998 23:23:10 -0600 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Jack DeMule Subject: Re: What is name of coil with currents that go in opposite directions? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"03siP2.0.GY6.MuKsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3672 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Butch, all... At 23:57 2/4/98 EST, HLafonte@aol.com wrote: >What is the name of the type coil that has two seperate circuits in one coil >(runing side by side) that have current flow in opposite directions. The two >magnetic fields from these circuits cancel out any self inductance in the coil >I believe. Finally, you ask a question that I can answer... I think. I think you mean a BALUN (for BAlanced to UNbalanced), or common mode choke. Same thing, different names, depending on the application. Best Regards, Jack ---------------------------------------------------------- "...and I work among cries and clatters like a venomous beaver in a parrot house. A letter full of nothing. Yours," -signed Dylan mules@palacenet.net ---------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 21:50:02 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA31604; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:49:55 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 21:49:55 -0800 From: herda@unidial.com Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 05:49:48 GMT Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: Radium Chloride Wanted. Resent-Message-ID: <"a82Zz2.0.ij7.2CLsq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3673 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Yeah, I've got some radium for you. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 4 22:48:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA11886; Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:48:00 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:48:00 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 1998 22:46:35 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802050646.WAA00326@sweden.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: What is name of coil with currents that go in opposite directions? Resent-Message-ID: <"qGs742.0.dv2.T2Msq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3674 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 11:57 PM 2/4/98 EST, you wrote: >What is the name of the type coil that has two seperate circuits in one coil >(runing side by side) that have current flow in opposite directions. The two >magnetic fields from these circuits cancel out any self inductance in the coil >I believe. >Thanks, >Butch LaFonte Self inductance implies only one circuit, so if you have 2 coils wound with turns side by side, the 2 "ends" connected and the 2 "starts" the external leads, then you have a "non-inductive" winding or "bifilar coil, windings opposed". But this is a circuit description, not the name of a coil. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 12:10:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA16219; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:10:44 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 12:10:44 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: "TheEdge" From: "TheEdge" To: Subject: Wanted: frequency generator schematics Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 14:53:36 -0000 Message-ID: <01bd3245$d6958fa0$2d66efcf@TheEdge.amdyne.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"tZ9hE1.0.Kz3.2pXsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3675 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Dear list subscribers, Could somebody refer me to a website, or fax to me, schematics for a frequency generator for generating resonating frequencies. Please respond if you can provide this information for me. Thank you. Sincerely, Matt - TheEdge@amdyne.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 13:02:02 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA23354; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:01:50 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:01:50 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DA2376.C3EC78F8@ctv.es> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 21:39:19 +0100 From: Vicente Jose Ramos Orenga Reply-To: vramos@ctv.es X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: TheEdge CC: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Wanted: frequency generator schematics X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <01bd3245$d6958fa0$2d66efcf@TheEdge.amdyne.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BEkJF3.0.mi5.wYYsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3676 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com TheEdge wrote: > Dear list subscribers, > Could somebody refer me to a website, or fax to me, schematics > for a > frequency generator for generating resonating frequencies. Please > respond > if you can provide this information for me. Thank you. > Sincerely, > Matt - TheEdge@amdyne.net Which frequency range you need? Vicente -- Vicente Jose Ramos Orenga E-mail: vramos@ctv.es Home Page: http://www.ctv.es/USERS/vramos/home.htm Burriana (Castellon) SPAIN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 13:47:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA00529; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:47:00 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 13:47:00 -0800 (PST) From: PeteB13@aol.com Message-ID: <394c8683.34da32e2@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:45:04 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: ?? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 165 Resent-Message-ID: <"uASVH2.0.A8.JDZsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3677 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Is it me or did I ask this list what a tesla coil is? - I don't think I posted it to the wrong address, but what I asked was: What is a tesla coil? what does it do? what is it used for? is it dangerous? Please don't snigger or laugh at these questions, as you may or may not know, but I am new to this sort of thing, and that is why I joined this list, to learn. So please, if you could be so kind as to answer these seemingly easy and relative questions, then I would be greatful. Tell the next time, Pete From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 14:41:14 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA07223; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 14:41:05 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 14:41:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <01BD3254.718AB7C0@pm3-150.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 16:38:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3254.7193DF80" Resent-Message-ID: <"AF8FK.0.lm1.-_Zsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3678 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD3254.7193DF80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: Josef Katz[SMTP:joeyk19@idt.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 1998 3:08 PM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? >What kind of wave guide? I'm not really sure exactly what kind it was. Kyle R. Mcallister P.S.: I'll see what else I can dig up about it. Has anyone heard any = news from NASA about the superconductor/gravity experiment? I emailed = Marshall spaceflight, but can't get an answer. ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD3254.7193DF80 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IgoWAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAIAEAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAARwAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGZyZWVucmctbEBlc2tp bW8uY29tAFNNVFAAZnJlZW5yZy1sQGVza2ltby5jb20AAB4AAjABAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAD MAEAAAAVAAAAZnJlZW5yZy1sQGVza2ltby5jb20AAAAAAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4AATABAAAA FwAAACdmcmVlbnJnLWxAZXNraW1vLmNvbScAAAIBCzABAAAAGgAAAFNNVFA6RlJFRU5SRy1MQEVT S0lNTy5DT00AAAADAAA5AAAAAAsAQDoBAAAAAgH2DwEAAAAEAAAAAAAAAlo0AQSAAQAuAAAAUkU6 IFNwZWNpYWwgUmVsYXRpdml0eSBvciBMb3JlbnR6IFJlbGF0aXZpdHk/AJoQAQWAAwAOAAAAzgcC AAUAEAAmAAgABAAeAQEggAMADgAAAM4HAgAFABAAJAAmAAQAOgEBCYABACEAAAA5M0VCQ0EyNDQ3 OUVEMTExQTc1RUU4RTAwQUMxMDAwMAAmBwEDkAYAJAQAABQAAAALACMAAAAAAAMAJgAAAAAACwAp AAAAAAADAC4AAAAAAAMANgAAAAAAQAA5ACCyO7uGMr0BHgBwAAEAAAAuAAAAUkU6IFNwZWNpYWwg UmVsYXRpdml0eSBvciBMb3JlbnR6IFJlbGF0aXZpdHk/AAAAAgFxAAEAAAAWAAAAAb0yhrsydW0C gp5HEdGnXujgCsEAAAAAHgAeDAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAB8MAQAAABcAAABzdGtAc3VuaGVy YWxkLmluZmkubmV0AAADAAYQmdhtmgMABxBuAQAAHgAIEAEAAABlAAAALS0tLS0tLS0tLUZST006 Sk9TRUZLQVRaU01UUDpKT0VZSzE5QElEVE5FVFNFTlQ6VFVFU0RBWSxGRUJSVUFSWTAzLDE5OTgz OjA4UE1UTzpGUkVFTlJHLUxARVNLSU1PQ09NUwAAAAACAQkQAQAAAH8CAAB7AgAAvgQAAExaRnUB FWkM/wAKAQ8CFQKkA+QF6wKDAFATA1QCAGNoCsBzZXTuMgYABsMCgzIDxgcTAoO6MxMNfQqACM8J 2TsV/3gyNTUCgAqBDbELYG7wZzEwMxQgCwoS8gwBGmMAQCAKhQqLbGkxBDgwAtFpLTE0NM8N8AzQ HMMLWTE2CqADYPZ0BZAFQC0e5wqHHZsMMHUeZkYDYTof7h5mDIIgBEpvEfBmIEthdAB6W1NNVFA6 agBvZXlrMTlAadBkdC5uEgBdH48gnS8GYAIwIc8i21QKUHNkCGF5LCFwZWJydTkKwHkgGTAqMCTw OTiQIDM6MCtQUE0lr3kgnVRvJ+8i2wNQCeFyUGctbEAHkGsHcG8aLgWgbSvvJr51YmonHqEuDyLb UmUzkFNwDwWQBzE1YQtgdGl2abZ0KsAFsUwFsCexejYpZj8a7xvzMzYdZxo5Pu8LRhQiDAEeZlcR wAVAMKAMbmQ20CPgd2F2ZeggZ3UlIGU4NjscG0yBOe8gSSdtIG4egNYgFgAHQGwqwHMIcD2A1GV4 ANB0QhF3PJc2oIk9QXMuOExLeWw9gHRSLgXQY0HxBAAekHLhOExQLlMuM5BBUEIAv0IwCeBDBDZA EfBBQCBFkAEDoGRpZyB1cCDfAaAIYAVANqBFYEhD8ElQ7G55AiA9gGhB4AsgSjIfQYAH0AQgA1IH sEFTQd1JVXRKsEIxNcByBaA88PZ1HrAFsC8JwD1gNqJCkNdNAQdxAjA/SIFlAMADEL8JgAXQEdER wEeCP5BjGMFpSQBodCowYkmRSLEn/QVAZxIASjFKMQPgBJBEFn85Lzt/OE85X1RPP5IVIQABWNAA AwAQEAAAAAADABEQAQAAAEAABzBAy3mFhjK9AUAACDBAy3mFhjK9AR4APQABAAAABQAAAFJFOiAA AAAAAwANNP03AADTIQ== ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD3254.7193DF80-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 15:11:28 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA11579; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:11:20 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:11:20 -0800 (PST) From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802052309.AA08401@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 98 16:04:52 -0500 To: Subject: Re: ?? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"s2yWo3.0.nq2.LSasq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3679 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Pete, >Is it me or did I ask this list what a tesla coil is? - I don't think I posted >it to the wrong address, but what I asked was: Didn't see it come thru. Did you get a copy from the list reflected back to you? >What is a tesla coil? I'm no expert on this, but my understanding of it is that it is a specially wound coil that produces high voltage. There are lots of internet sites that have lots of info on these devices. Try Infoseek and enter +tesla +coil This is not a free energy or O/U device [AFAIK]. Perhaps some HV effects would be relevant to this forum, but I would try Vortex-L. what does it do? It's an A/C transformer. Takes low voltage/high amps and converts to high voltage/low amps. Very efficient. what is it used for? Primarily used for high voltage experiments.....Like making lightning and such....Nikola Tesla used it to explore many HV things.....like X-rays, Neon lighting, fluorescent lighting, radio communications and many other curious things. Derivatives of it are currently used in many HV devices. >is it dangerous? Yup. Tesla combined his with an oscillator/alternator, and at higher frequencies was able to make the outputs safer for humans. At lower frequencies [like 60hz], the output will kill you dead. I would recommend checking out a few books on Nikola Tesla. [bookstore or library]. He invented the Tesla coil about 100yrs ago......among many other important things, and most folks don't know anything about him. He refers to this device in much of his writings. Hope that steers you in an informative direction. Others may have more info Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com [WK] arager@idcomm.com [HM] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 15:23:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA12126; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:23:26 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:23:26 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <12ec7c49.34da49dc@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:23:05 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What is name of coil with currents that go in opposite directions? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"u4l4R2.0.Kz2.hdasq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3680 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-05 01:52:06 EST, you write: << Self inductance implies only one circuit, so if you have 2 coils wound with turns side by side, the 2 "ends" connected and the 2 "starts" the external leads, then you have a "non-inductive" winding or "bifilar coil, windings opposed". But this is a circuit description, not the name of a coil. -Dave >> Dave, Thanks for the help! Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 15:25:12 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA12600; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:25:06 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 15:25:06 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <9c4b3e4a.34da4a3d@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 18:24:43 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What is name of coil with currents that go in opposite directions? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"IXdZ61.0.b43.Efasq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3681 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-05 00:34:01 EST, you write: << I think you mean a BALUN (for BAlanced to UNbalanced), or common mode choke. Same thing, different names, depending on the application. >> Jack, Think for the help! Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 17:23:32 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA04689; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:23:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 17:23:06 -0800 (PST) From: bpaddock@csonline.net (Bob Paddock) To: TheEdge@amdyne.net Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Wanted: frequency generator schematics Date: Thu, 05 Feb 1998 20:17:28 -0500 Organization: is mostly via piles Reply-To: bpaddock@csonline.net Message-ID: References: <01bd3245$d6958fa0$2d66efcf@TheEdge.amdyne.com> In-Reply-To: <01bd3245$d6958fa0$2d66efcf@TheEdge.amdyne.com> Lines: 20 Resent-Message-ID: <"E6dXf3.0.691.qNcsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3682 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > Could somebody refer me to a website, or fax to me, schematics for a >frequency generator for generating resonating frequencies. Please respond >if you can provide this information for me. Thank you. Since you didn't say what frequency I'll guess it is the lower end of the spectrum: Look at http://www.maxium.com for their MAX038 IC. It will do .01 Hz to 20 MHz, they have a app. note on it as well. Will do Triangle, Sine, and Square Wave. -- For information on any of the following check out my WEB site at: http://www.biogate.com/bpaddock/ Chemical Free Air Conditioning/No CFC's, Chronic Pain Relief, Electromedicine, Electronics, Explore!, Free Energy, Full Disclosure, KeelyNet, Matric Limited, Neurophone, Oil City PA, Philadelphia Experiment. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 5 22:38:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA21503; Thu, 5 Feb 1998 22:37:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 5 Feb 1998 22:37:07 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 01:35:10 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Bifilar coil, very interesting questions? Way to overunity? Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_886746910_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"fzvAy.0.tF5.G-gsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3683 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_886746910_boundary Content-ID: <0_886746910@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Hi all, I've been looking at the bifilar coil as a means of switching in the "triangle" area of the "Big Y" design of mine. The two seperate circuits runing side by side with their currents going in opposite directions, cancels out self induction of the coil as I under stand it. This opens up some very interesting possibilities. Here are some statements and questions for you on the list if you care to look. 1. The energy in the magnetic field when the current is steady is potiental energy that will be returned to the wire at a higher voltage but lower current, if, only one of the circuits is broken. If both are broken at the same time, they cancel each other out. 2. If magnetic fields are built up during the current rise, then this should be potiental energy that will be returned to the wire at normal voltage and current rate. It's a kind of storage device as I see it for electricity that can be delivered back to the circuit at the same voltage and current it was stored at. This voltage and current is the same voltage and current that the circuit would experience if the coil was not there in the circuit to begin with. 3. Here is a very important question about this coil. If you had a steady state current flowing in this type coil and you move a magnet toward the coil surface (on the side, not the ends where the core openings are, and a second magnet of an opposite pole was place on the opposite side of the coil, would the magnetic field total energy increase as you moved these two magnets toward the surface of the coil? If so how would the current/voltage flowing in the circuit be effected as you did this? Would it stay the same? Would it increase, or decrease? If the circuit was opened, would the energy in the magnetic fields provided by the magnets placed up close to the coil be released into the circuits as additional electrical energy but at the same voltage/current as the original circuit voltage/current? Would this be done with no back EMF? If so, then THIS COIL COULD BE USE AS AN ON/OFF SWITCH that does not produce a back EMF in the circuit (remember, these fields cancel each other out, doing away with self inductance).The energy is put into the circuits where it can be recovered! Then if used in a proper fashion between two magnets in a stator rotor configuration, well it just opens up so many possibilities. See attached drawing. Comments please, Thanks, Butch Note: I will run test tomorrow on coil with magnets as described above. --part0_886746910_boundary Content-ID: <0_886746910@inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: image/gif; name="BUTCH107.GIF" Content-transfer-encoding: base64 Content-disposition: inline R0lGODlhDQK9AfcAAAAAAIAAAACAAICAAAAAgIAAgACAgMDAwMDcwKbK8ICA/4AgYP//wKDg 4GAAgP+AgACAwMDA/wDP/2n//+D/4N2cs7OP7ipv+T+4zUiENpWMQY5eQqBiemJPrB0vvihm dgBFAEU+AWooE4U5akoyhQQEBAgICAwMDBERERYWFhwcHCIiIikpKTAwMF9fX1VVVU1NTUJC Qjk5OQAHAA0AALeZgYSZtL29kH9/YGBgfwAOABsAACgAAAgJKwAdADkAAAAAmwAlAEkAABER OwAvAF0AABcXRQA6AEkRERwcUwAW/ysA/yEhbFkUFABRAEcaahkyZwBhAAAx/2EA/1MgexZD Zy4u4iZZFlFGBGguSQdSj2oYuJAjFQBT/6MA/2pKEnUzbEpBmjdlC6QsFYMfsU4s/yBRtghk km9WC1lDrTZyErAzFwChAHdfH4lHcbBDHLctfQCGlXpuIyafAHOpAQDKAKxbASAdwpRScCSq TAqUiTZue0R1kP8AqABx/98A/1aRSjRI+MwyguRBcGjKATa8QgCa/5Yit4V9MyW3jDZa7Vz/ AP9IACKbokLPTcJYUiDTlaUk4HNWtampANBvPGefWInPC/+sAKcu/uJZf0zcZ/8Y/zp9/7HQ 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WNrnNakJDTs/4853sjGe1Wled2K3PnDyaH7sW13PqEnPBBJvgZPz5yXBsiN5JlSNC43cKj3Y uu/lM5gWFKcqH2dRe21UltoUWdI6KVIu7tCUv4qhDH94phcO0YjKwkuUaCjEcl6TiYnMViFN WKTnESWKOKVqVa16VaxmVatb5WpXvfpVsIZVrGMlaxoDAgA7 --part0_886746910_boundary-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 11:26:39 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA00954; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:26:23 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 11:26:23 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802061926.AA07269@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Fri, 06 Feb 98 12:14:11 -0500 To: Subject: Re: Bifilar coil, very interesting questions? Way to overuni Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"5BF8u2.0.kE.TFssq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3684 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch, Interesting notes...Let us know how the test goes. Two thoughts on the Quickfield stuff Greg did for you [actually dream-state stuff, but I remembered it this morning when I woke up....] 1 -- as the attractive magnet pulls away from the other two, a fairly chaotic region begins to appear between the two opposing and the one attractive magnet. Could this be a key to better Barkhausen or solid state energy extraction from magnets/coils? Perhaps that chaotic region may produce more background fluctuations? 2 -- Had a dream about that blue hole area being a swirling magnetic vortex at the boundary areas.......just a dream, but made me think...could a rotating field be produced with permanent magnets? Oh well.....look at what going to bed at 4:30am and getting up at 8:30am does to the noggin..... Hope it helps. Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 14:50:25 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA30697; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:50:19 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 14:50:19 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:49:27 EST To: newman-l@emachine.com Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Maybe Joe is right about gyroscopic particles Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"rJF833.0.QV7.eEvsq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3685 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I have been doing research on bifilar coils and the very interesting behavior they exhibit with respect to the canceling of self inductance in the coil. This is done by having the currents flow in opposite directions in two seperate circuits wound side by side on the spool. This makes me think that if the fields were non dynamic this opposing field effect would have no effect on the induction of the coil. If the fields do have dymanic elements to them, then I can see how they would cancel each other out. Maybe Joe Newman is on the right track with his gyroscopic particles. Thanks, Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 17:57:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA17457; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:57:19 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 17:57:19 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:56:36 EST To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What happened to America? New world of crime? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"o4r1h2.0.cG4.zzxsq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3686 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Recently I've read that the police in our so-called free country of America are looking into installing microwave beam emitters in their cars for the purpose of frying the computer systems in automobiles in order to stop what they think are offenders of justice. Does anyone know how practical and effective this technology is? I would like to build such a device as a procaution against such police-state tactics. Any advice wiuld be appreciated. Peter, I can see that technology geting into the wrong hands and opening up a whole new world of crime! Just think, a sicko could go riding at night, find a good looking girl, wait till he followed her to a part of the road where there were no people around and then disable her car with the push of a button! That device could be used for countless crimes. It could be aimed at low flying aircraft also. I hope it does not get developed. Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 18:10:11 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA20075; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 18:10:04 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 18:10:04 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 21:09:47 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Bifilar coil, very interesting questions? Way to overuni Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"UVo_D1.0.Yv4.w9ysq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3687 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-06 14:28:57 EST, you write: << Oh well.....look at what going to bed at 4:30am and getting up at 8:30am does to the noggin..... Hope it helps. >> Anton, Thanks for the input, I'll add them to my list on this project. Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 18:56:03 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA29499; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 18:55:52 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 18:55:52 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DBF6CA.2714@tiac.net> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 1998 21:53:14 -0800 From: Bob Shannon Organization: Fair at best X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: What happened to America? New world of crime? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"KS3B_1.0.mC7.rqysq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3688 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > Peter, > I can see that technology geting into the wrong hands and opening up a whole > new world of crime! Just think, a sicko could go riding at night, find a good > looking girl, wait till he followed her to a part of the road where there were > no people around and then disable her car with the push of a button! That > device could be used for countless crimes. It could be aimed at low flying > aircraft also. I hope it does not get developed. Actually, small aircraft engines do not need an electrical system to run at all. The device in question fries the chip in the fuel injection and spark control systems. A good, old fassioned diesel truck would roll right by the thing too. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 19:06:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA31200; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 19:06:36 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 19:06:36 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <76927255.34dbcfa3@aol.com> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:06:09 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What happened to America? New world of crime? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"Js3Ws1.0.Pd7.w-ysq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3689 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-06 21:57:23 EST, you write: << Actually, small aircraft engines do not need an electrical system to run at all. The device in question fries the chip in the fuel injection and spark control systems. A good, old fassioned diesel truck would roll right by the thing too. >> Bob, I was thinking of fly by wire air buses, no mechnical flight control linkage. Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 20:07:18 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA08397; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:07:08 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 20:07:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:05:46 -0600 (CST) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: What happened to America? New world of crime? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"sqL_S.0.632.ftzsq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3690 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Fri, 6 Feb 1998 HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > Recently I've read that the police in our so-called free country of > America are looking into installing microwave beam emitters in their > cars for the purpose of frying the computer systems in automobiles in > order to stop what they think are offenders of justice. > Does anyone know how practical and effective this technology is? > I would like to build such a device as a procaution against such > police-state tactics. > Any advice wiuld be appreciated. > > Peter, > I can see that technology geting into the wrong hands and opening up a whole > new world of crime! Just think, a sicko could go riding at night, find a good > looking girl, wait till he followed her to a part of the road where there were > no people around and then disable her car with the push of a button! That > device could be used for countless crimes. It could be aimed at low flying > aircraft also. I hope it does not get developed. > Butch > My guess is that such a device would fry the driver before it would fry the microprocessor. The boards those devices are built on are usually RF-shielded pretty well. I don't think any microwave beam of the power level required will leave the driver unharmed. In this lawsuit-happy civilization of ours, I doubt the use of such devices would last long. Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 22:10:12 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA23037; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:09:52 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 22:09:52 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: "TheEdge" From: "TheEdge" To: Subject: Frequency Generator Schematics Wanted Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 00:46:24 -0000 Message-ID: <01bd3361$d13508c0$3f66efcf@TheEdge.amdyne.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"4dOff2.0.id5.hg_sq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3691 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Dear list subscribers, Let me provide more detail on what I am looking for. I apologize for lack of detail in my first posting. I would greatly appreciate it if anybody who knows of a website that has schematics for a SAFE ultrasonic frequency generator, capable of generating resonating frequencies of various substances. If anybody knows of a website with these schematics, or if anybody has built one or has schematics of one that they could fax or mail a copy of to me (I will send shipping money), please respond to this posting. Thank you. Sincerely, Matt - TheEdge@amdyne.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 6 23:34:58 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA04549; Fri, 6 Feb 1998 23:34:38 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 6 Feb 1998 23:34:38 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <264a0899.34dc0e3b@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 02:33:13 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Cc: newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: What is the principle magnetic shields work on? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"thIM21.0.y61.Cw0tq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3692 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com (Mu metal type shields) What is the principle magnetic shields work on? Do they block flux by pulling the flux into the shield? Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 00:50:52 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA14907; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 00:50:46 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 00:50:46 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DC2039.64733935@ihug.co.nz> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 21:50:02 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: What is the principle magnetic shields work on? References: <264a0899.34dc0e3b@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LyXXN3.0.oe3.a12tq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3693 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Yes HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > (Mu metal type shields) > What is the principle magnetic shields work on? Do they block flux by pulling > the flux into the shield? > Thanks, > Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 03:20:04 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA26218; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 03:19:52 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 03:19:52 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DC3FE3.1320@xtra.co.nz> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 00:05:07 +1300 From: Robbie Rowntree Reply-To: rown@xtra.co.nz X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com CC: USA-TESLA@list.iex.net, Arno.Jones@Ventana.com Subject: RRAMM E update Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"td3vu3.0.TP6.KD4tq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3694 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com 8:19 PM 2/7/98 coil disc up date : the disc coils cells as shown are just to tedious to build this way so,[ dont know what I was thinking about] gap ferrite 1.5 mm or so wind 400? turns. 350, 351, 350, 350,OH! buggier lost count. you still need hole in centre for mandrel , teflon, plastic if you leave there. I think if you leave both wires accessible its easyer to string coil cells in series or parallel as needed . also around repel magnets ,wind coil cell ring 3mm wide to fit outside, removable ,teflon wrap magnet, 400 turn each?, 4 each magnet or 8 each stack, yes sounds a lot.do you think this will be effective ,am I catching core flux angular momentum , return flux angular momentum, or both, will I need to divert return flux so much still to learn. Switch is designed, mercury ,6 star,3 shorts per coil ,6 per cycle better utilization of 3 possible flux paths, thinking larger energy flow from nothing to .. steady state no flow, to max very large fast rise of M momentum into E momentum. have an old flying buddy who does, makes jewellery I'll get him to make switch on monday ,its a long bike ride be good to get outside. **RRAMM** Good Waves Robbie Rowntree experimental research Self powered*Magnetic Motor*Electric Gen*Anti gravity drive http://www.primenet.com/~rags/tesla/rr.html mailto:rown@xtra.co.nz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 05:14:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA09602; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 05:14:30 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 05:14:30 -0800 (PST) Old-X-Envelope-To: Message-ID: <34DC5DF9.9E46CFD9@ctv.es> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 14:13:30 +0100 From: Vicente Jose Ramos Orenga Reply-To: vramos@ctv.es X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: What happened to America? New world of crime? X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <76927255.34dbcfa3@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"VIruy3.0.xL2.pu5tq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3695 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 98-02-06 21:57:23 EST, you write: > > << Actually, small aircraft engines do not need an electrical system > to run > at all. > The device in question fries the chip in the fuel injection and spark > > control systems. A good, old fassioned diesel truck would roll right > by > the thing too. > >> > Bob, > I was thinking of fly by wire air buses, no mechnical flight control > linkage. > Butch Hi all,I'm waiting them with my VW Golf (Diesel, of course, 4'5 litres each 100 Km). Vicente. -- Vicente Jose Ramos Orenga E-mail: vramos@ctv.es Home Page: http://www.ctv.es/USERS/vramos/home.htm Burriana (Castellon) SPAIN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 07:34:17 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA02183; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 07:33:45 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 07:33:45 -0800 (PST) From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <9c502ebd.34dc7e5d@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 10:31:39 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: What is the principle magnetic shields work on? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"8Ivod3.0.-X.Ix7tq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3696 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-07 02:35:30 EST, you write: << What is the principle magnetic shields work on? Do they block flux by pulling the flux into the shield? Thanks, Butch >> I think the effect is similar to your description, but the principle is one of solving the field equations for the shield and the nearby free space and using the boundry conditions with the actual source fields that are there. In practice, for a prudent person that usually means finding a good simulation program to use. There may in fact be an accurate descriptive explanation for the shielding effect, but I am not aware of it. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 07:58:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA07527; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 07:58:24 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 07:58:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DC9F49.2557@keelynet.com> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 09:52:09 -0800 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: New Water Fuel Discovery Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YiGHq1.0.Wr1.UI8tq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3697 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Folks! A new method of converting water to gas, if you are interested, check out; http://keelynet.com/energy/valhyd.htm -- Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 09:35:08 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA27397; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:34:43 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 09:34:43 -0800 (PST) From: RoConroy@aol.com Message-ID: <2838a6f4.34dc9acb@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 12:32:57 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Maybe Joe is right about gyroscopic particles Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"q_3502.0.ph6.ei9tq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3698 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-06 18:00:31 EST,Butch,you write: << Maybe Joe Newman is on the right track with his gyroscopic particles. >> I must have missed Joe Newman's discussion on gyroscopic particles, but if you take elemental particles in general, the gyroscopic forces created by circular neutrino orbits must balance out, otherwise you wouldn't be able to stand up out of bed in the morning. That would require a minimum of 4 balancing orbits, pairs of which track the same 2 race courses in oposite direction. I think the more appropriate solution would be 6 balancing individual orbits. Using Tau elements these particles can combine into larger compounds with no interverence of orbits, and at the same time concelling any overall gyroscopic forces. Bob http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/robert_conroy/molecula.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 14:26:00 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA19422; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 14:25:36 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 14:25:36 -0800 Message-ID: <34DCB8A9.3AEC@gorge.net> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 11:40:26 -0800 From: tom@gorge.net (Tom Miller) Reply-To: tom@gorge.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: What is a Tesla Coil (was: ??) References: <199802071735.JAA27614@mx2.eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mND0g3.0.Il4.TzDtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3699 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Anton Rager wrote: > what does it do? > It's an A/C transformer. Takes low voltage/high amps and converts to high > voltage/low amps. Very efficient. If memory serves, Tesla used a big capacitor to build a charge to the point that it jumped a spark gap, momentarily causing a current to flow through a primary of a few turns. These turns were around, but at a distance (up to several feet) from the secondary coil. The secondary was (AFAIK) a long cylinder,(coupled to a large capacitance) whereas the primary was flat or spiral (flat). His point was to vary the "oscillations" (frequency) of the primary, by varying the spark gap, so that it "resonated " with the secondary. The apparatus can change low voltage, low frequency, (or DC) low amperage into high frequency, high voltage. AND According to tesla, NOT *low* amperage (as in the common transformer) but ALSO HIGH{ER) AMPERAGE!!!! It is appalling that a device which was explicitly claimed (by Tesla himself, who is not known as a fool or liar) to change LOW power to HIGH power (isn't this overunity?) is almost always built for the explicit purpose of "MAKING BIG SPARKS." Tom Miller From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 15:19:49 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA07382; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 15:19:39 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 15:19:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980207171355.00c997f4@palacenet.net> X-Sender: mules@palacenet.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 17:13:55 -0600 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Jack DeMule Subject: Re: What is a Tesla Coil (was: ??) In-Reply-To: <34DCB8A9.3AEC@gorge.net> References: <199802071735.JAA27614@mx2.eskimo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"2AzCy3.0.Fp1.8mEtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3700 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 11:40 2/7/98 -0800, Tom Miller wrote: >It is appalling that a device which was explicitly claimed >(by Tesla himself, who is not known as a fool or liar) to >change LOW power to HIGH power (isn't this overunity?) is >almost always built for the explicit purpose of I have Almost every scrap of paper available to the public that was penned by Tesla, his notebooks, patents, etc.... I have most of the books that have been written about him too. I'm sorry, he never made that claim. A tesla coil is a resonant circuit and behaves accordingly, which Tesla understood quite well... it's not O/U at all. If anyone is interested in a very good, easy to read book, on the practical aspects of tesla coil construction, and design, I recommend Modern Resonance Transformer Design Theory by D.C. Cox Available through, Tesla Book Company P.O. BOX 121873 Chula Vista CA 91912. Building huge tesla coils for high power physics labs, and smaller ones for museums is his business. He does very good work. He has also written other books and made a video tape. His company is Resonance Research Corp. RTE. 1, Shady Lane RD. Baraboo, WI 53913. Best Regards, Jack ---------------------------------------------------------- "...and I work among cries and clatters like a venomous beaver in a parrot house. A letter full of nothing. Yours," -signed Dylan mules@palacenet.net ---------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 15:26:52 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA14407; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 15:26:46 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 15:26:46 -0800 Message-ID: <34DD08A6.593F@keelynet.com> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 1998 17:21:42 -0800 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: New Water Fuel Discovery References: <34DC9F49.2557@keelynet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"STgbG.0.wW3.qsEtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3701 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Folks! This is an excerpt from the Spanish water to hydrogen press release that is posted at http://keelynet.com/energy/valhyd.htm > "Hydrogen extracted from a half-litre of water can fuel a car from > Bilbao to Valencia," or 390 miles, El Pais quoted Cervilla as saying. Half a litre, no electricity, nearly 400 miles, pretty good. Wonder if its one of those tiny two cylinder cars? -- Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 17:08:22 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA23817; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 17:08:15 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 17:08:15 -0800 (PST) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 13:22:33 -0500 Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Message-ID: <19980207.134745.6398.0.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <01BD2E3D.A44F8700@pm3-160.gpt.infi.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-12 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"jL38y3.0.0q5.yLGtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3702 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Sat, 31 Jan 1998 11:44:50 -0600 "Kyle R. Mcallister" . >I could go on and on. Suffice to say that it is very arrogant on the >part of Relativistic Physicists to discount Lorentz Relativity and FTL >travel when there is evidence pointing to them. Evidence that does not >support Special Relativity. The old saying is true: Nothing ever >changes. > What would be a good reference that fully explains Lorentz Relativity? Steve Heckman _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 17:30:40 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA07019; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 17:30:34 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 17:30:34 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 14:02:23 -0500 Subject: Re: What happened to America? New world of crime? Message-ID: <19980207.140514.6398.1.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <34DBF6CA.2714@tiac.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-12,16,19-20,22-23,25-29 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"gyR8z.0.Xj1.rgGtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3703 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Fri, 06 Feb 1998 21:53:14 -0800 Bob Shannon writes: >HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > > >The device in question fries the chip in the fuel injection and spark >control systems. A good, old fassioned diesel truck would roll right >by >the thing too. > > It would have to be an old-fashioned diesel. I maintain the communication system for both VDOT and State Police, and we have all sorts of interference problems with our two-way radios shutting down engines, etc. So many computers in modern vehicles. The diesels dump trucks VDOT is using actually have more problems....the problems with the police cars is mostly the computers radiating into the two-way radios. Haven't seen anything about a device to shut down other vehicles though... If you think the police are a problem, just turn on your scanner and listen to all the fun they have every night! Steve Heckman Steve Heckman _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 19:44:06 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA13809; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 19:43:53 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 19:43:53 -0800 (PST) From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: New Water Fuel Discovery Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 03:42:26 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <34ee293f.231048109@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <34DC9F49.2557@keelynet.com> In-Reply-To: <34DC9F49.2557@keelynet.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Zcf-82.0.fN3.tdItq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3704 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Sat, 07 Feb 1998 09:52:09 -0800, Jerry W. Decker wrote: >Hi Folks! > >A new method of converting water to gas, if you are interested, check >out; http://keelynet.com/energy/valhyd.htm >-- > Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com > http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" > Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 > KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 > Note that the third ionisation potential of molybdenum is 27.16 volts, making it a possible catalyst in a Mills hydrino type reaction. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on temperature. "....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." PS - no SPAM thanks! -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 7 20:57:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA22180; Sat, 7 Feb 1998 20:57:40 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 7 Feb 1998 20:57:40 -0800 (PST) From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: New Water Fuel Discovery Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 04:56:17 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <34f22f40.232586055@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <34DC9F49.2557@keelynet.com> <34DD08A6.593F@keelynet.com> In-Reply-To: <34DD08A6.593F@keelynet.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"VzEL21.0.TQ5.2jJtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3705 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Sat, 07 Feb 1998 17:21:42 -0800, Jerry W. Decker wrote: [snip] >Half a litre, no electricity, nearly 400 miles, pretty good. Wonder if >its one of those tiny two cylinder cars? [snip] It wouldn't surprise me in the least if the newspaper got the quote wrong ;). Regards, Robin van Spaandonk -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on temperature. "....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." PS - no SPAM thanks! -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 04:58:59 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA29923; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 04:58:50 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 04:58:50 -0800 Old-X-Envelope-To: Message-ID: <34DD6E4D.E38B4A50@ctv.es> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 09:35:26 +0100 From: Vicente Jose Ramos Orenga Reply-To: vramos@ctv.es X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: ATG X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"fSU-B1.0.SJ7.9mQtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3706 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi all, The ATG's page online again: http://www.compassnet.com/~isworld/ Vicente. -- Vicente Jose Ramos Orenga E-mail: vramos@ctv.es Home Page: http://www.ctv.es/USERS/vramos/home.htm Burriana (Castellon) SPAIN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 10:46:04 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA00492; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 10:45:46 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 10:45:46 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DDFDC9.CB2BA6FB@psu.edu> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 1998 13:47:37 -0500 From: Scott Peterson Reply-To: sdp127@psu.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: What happened to America? New world of crime? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"k9e253.0.a7.NrVtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3707 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > Recently I've read that the police in our so-called free country of > America are looking into installing microwave beam emitters in their > cars for the purpose of frying the computer systems in automobiles in > order to stop what they think are offenders of justice. > Does anyone know how practical and effective this technology is? > I would like to build such a device as a procaution against such > police-state tactics. > Any advice wiuld be appreciated. > Sounds like an EMP gun. I've seen\read about 2 different types. One is a wire guided "platform" that is launced from the police car, on the road, and has either an EMP or explosive charge. (yes, its exaclty like the movies!!) the other is a short range,directed, emp burst. No wires or nothin'. A bunch of new weapons are being developed under the guise of "non-lethal". These kinds of budgets are increasing rapidly. I've also read alot about the militarization of the police force. : ( To me, most of it sounds like new forms of riot control. anyway... Here are only a couple links just as illustrators... EMP stuff... http://www.jya.com/emp-merkle.htm http://www.lucifer.com/exi-lists/extropians/1281.html (follow the threads...) general... http://www.ccrkba.org/pub/rkba/general/haus220.html http://www.calyx.com/~refuse/ndp/062297swat.html http://MediaFilter.org/index/ http://censored.sonoma.edu// http://owww.cecer.army.mil/facts/sheets/FL16.html http://www.infowar.com/class_1/class1_9.html-ssi From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 11:07:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA03622; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:07:32 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:07:32 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <6f3c99c1.34de01fb@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 14:05:29 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: This was not a post from Harold LaFonte Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"zEjdV2.0.Nu.m9Wtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3708 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-08 13:53:16 EST, you write: << HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > Recently I've read that the police in our so-called free country of > America are looking into installing microwave beam emitters in their > cars for the purpose of frying the computer systems in automobiles in > order to stop what they think are offenders of justice. > Does anyone know how practical and effective this technology is? > I would like to build such a device as a procaution against such > police-state tactics. > Any advice wiuld be appreciated. >> This was not a post from Harold LaFonte, I only responded to it. Thanks, Harold LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 11:47:05 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA26138; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:46:58 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:46:58 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802081946.AA11150@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Sun, 08 Feb 98 10:41:26 -0500 To: Subject: Re: What is the principle magnetic shields work on? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3AeCN1.0.IO6.nkWtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3709 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com >(Mu metal type shields) >What is the principle magnetic shields work on? Do they block flux by >pulling the flux into the shield? >Thanks, >Butch I also posted a question on MU Metal shield properties a few hundred messages ago. Does anyone have any info? I have found some resellers, but would prefer to study without bantering with salesoids. Anyone know how these things work....and how they interact with magnetic fields? Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com [WK] arager@idcomm.com [HM] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 11:51:20 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA26983; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:51:16 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 11:51:16 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3498.61C33BA0@pm3-120.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 08:31:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3498.61C33BA0" Resent-Message-ID: <"D5sC33.0.Vb6.ooWtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3710 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD3498.61C33BA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: Stephen L Heckman[SMTP:steve-nyeoka@juno.com] Sent: Saturday, February 07, 1998 12:22 PM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? >What would be a good reference that fully explains Lorentz Relativity? >Steve Heckman Well, the site I usually use http://monet.physik.ubaclu.ch/~schatzer/space-time.html seems to currently be down. I know a few other addresses, and I'll post = them later when I can. (I've got some work to do). BTW: This isn't known = much, but General Relativity is an ether theory. Einstein himself said = this. And if anyone is interested, I may have figured out the operating = principle behind the gravity resonance coil. Best Regards, Kyle R. 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The experiment I'm proposing doesn't require me to know what is doing the pushing, or how, but only tests the idea that some unspecified kind of "flow" of some kind of unknown "gravity stuff" is responsible for gravitational force. I would appreciate any comments or criticisms of the experiment I have in mind. I would also appreciate any data or experimental results that are related to this experiment. The basics will be found at http://www.rio.com/~reboot/Grav1.htm Results and observations will be posted to the website as they happen. Thanks. Gary Shannon From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 14:11:01 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA04055; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 14:10:50 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 14:10:50 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802082058.MAA14754@rio.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 12:10:54 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Proposed Gravity Experiment Resent-Message-ID: <"0v-Nk.0.B_.frYtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3712 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Gary - I like it. My only question just now would be how are you going to determine that an area of reversed force isn't just the area where the E field begins to curve back around towards the opposite electrode? I've been trying to design a setup that would help distinguish the alleged Biefeld Brown force from electrostatic forces through an arrangement of suspended masses of different weights, composition, and surface area. The idea of course would be to measure a deflection of the suspended bobs and find a correlation to the mass of the bobs, but that tends to diverge from differences in composition and surface area at the same time. Shielding could also be attempted, although at high static voltages that's usually moot. In any case, the mapping out and characterization of the field of effect surrounding HV electrodes would probably be useful in terms of proving the BB effect to be a genuine phenomena separate from E forces. Other people do these experiments from time to time, see some effect, and declare success without addressing obvoius issues of electrostatic and sometimes even ion-dynamic forces contaminating their results. The effect we're looking for is probably very slight and can be easily hidden or 'faked' by such conventional forces. Good luck on your experiments, and please post updates here! - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 18:50:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA26181; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 18:49:40 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 18:49:40 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:49:25 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Cc: newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Looking for bifilar coil quickfield simulation! Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"JHx_q3.0.xO6.1xctq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3713 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Does anyone out there have or know of someone who has a bibilar coil quickfield simulation? I would like to see how far the fields reach out from the coil when the current is steady state. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 21:03:40 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA25225; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:03:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:03:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:01:52 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802090501.VAA07901@italy.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: mrandall@mail.earthlink.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Michael Randall Subject: Re: New Water Fuel Discovery Resent-Message-ID: <"ZUD5-1.0.y96.Kuetq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3714 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 05:21 PM 2/7/98 -0800, you wrote: >Hi Folks! > >This is an excerpt from the Spanish water to hydrogen press release that >is posted at > http://keelynet.com/energy/valhyd.htm > >> "Hydrogen extracted from a half-litre of water can fuel a car from >> Bilbao to Valencia," or 390 miles, El Pais quoted Cervilla as saying. > >Half a litre, no electricity, nearly 400 miles, pretty good. Wonder if >its one of those tiny two cylinder cars? This process looks similar to Francisco Pacheco's hydrogen generator (3,892,653) in which the metal electrode is consumed in the process of decomposing water. Francisco used magnesium though. -Michael > Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com > http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" > Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 > KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 21:41:23 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA01999; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:40:59 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:40:59 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 21:39:35 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802090539.VAA29328@iceland.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Resent-Message-ID: <"kPO1W.0.6V.eRftq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3715 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Kyle and all, At 08:31 AM 2/8/98 -0600, you wrote: > >>What would be a good reference that fully explains Lorentz Relativity? > >>Steve Heckman > >Well, the site I usually use >http://monet.physik.ubaclu.ch/~schatzer/space-time.html >seems to currently be down. I know a few other addresses, and I'll post them later when I can. (I've got some work to do). BTW: This isn't known much, but General Relativity is an ether theory. Einstein himself said this. And if anyone is interested, I may have figured out the operating principle behind the gravity resonance coil. > >Best Regards, >Kyle R. Mcallister > Yes, I would like to hear your GRC theory. Have you heard of anyone who has built one and has gotten any unusual results? -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 8 22:09:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA05587; Sun, 8 Feb 1998 22:09:45 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 22:09:45 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802090609.WAA15662@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: Proposed Gravity Experiment Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 22:05:37 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ZbPF-3.0.AN1.csftq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3716 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com First, since the period of a pendulum depends on g, and not on the mass of the pendulum a Biefield-Brown type pendulum can be used to settle the question of whether the resulting weight loss is due do a loss of mass (which would not effect the period of the pendulum), or to either a change in the local gravitational attraction OR the production of some kind of downward force, both of which WOULD effect the period of the pendulum. If charging a capacitive pedulum does effect the period then we will know that effect is the result either of some local alteration of the g-field, or of the creation of some downward force (perhaps ionic wind, or electrostatic repulsion). But at least we will have eliminated loss of mass as a cause. If there is NO effect then either mass is lost, OR the degree of charging was insufficient to cause a change. Weighing the apparatus in both a charged and uncharged state would settle the question of whether the charge was sufficient to cause an observable weight loss. As for the case when there IS a change in the pendulum period, another experiment could be constructed which would have the same degree of electrostatic effect without the element of stored charge on a capacitor. If this experiment also yeilds a change in pendulum period then we can probably conclude that the Biefield Brown effect is due to ionic wind, drag induced by the ion cloud around the capacitor, or some other electrostatic force. If the non-capacitive experiment yeilds no change, or a change significantly different from the capacitive case then we might be able to conclude that any difference is due to alteration of the local g-field in the capacitive case. As for distiquishing between the reversed gravitational effect and the curving of the field that you mentioned, I need to work out the geometry of the "lines of force" and see how far ABOVE, or BELOW the device I should be able to measure the effect. With any luck I can position the sensors for this change far enough above or below the device to eliminate most of the electrostatic effect. At any rate, if it is a g-field change putting the measuring device in a Faraday cage should eliminate electrostatic effects anyway. This would be similar to the experiment of Dr. Francis Nipher at Washington University. In 1917 Dr. Nipher repeated the Cavendish experiment with electrostatically charge balls. Using different mass balls and various sheilding methods he was able to demonstrate that a charged body does have an effect on the gravitational constant independant of electrostatic effects. (recently reprinted in "Homemade Lightning by R.A.Ford and available from TAB Books) --Gary. ref: http://www.rio.com/~reboot/Grav1.htm ---------- > From: Rick Monteverde > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Proposed Gravity Experiment > Date: Sunday, February 08, 1998 2:10 PM > > Gary - > > I like it. My only question just now would be how are you going to > determine that an area of reversed force isn't just the area where the E > field begins to curve back around towards the opposite electrode? > > I've been trying to design a setup that would help distinguish the alleged > Biefeld Brown force from electrostatic forces through an arrangement of > suspended masses of different weights, composition, and surface area. The > idea of course would be to measure a deflection of the suspended bobs and > find a correlation to the mass of the bobs, but that tends to diverge from > differences in composition and surface area at the same time. Shielding > could also be attempted, although at high static voltages that's usually > moot. > > In any case, the mapping out and characterization of the field of effect > surrounding HV electrodes would probably be useful in terms of proving the > BB effect to be a genuine phenomena separate from E forces. Other people do > these experiments from time to time, see some effect, and declare success > without addressing obvoius issues of electrostatic and sometimes even > ion-dynamic forces contaminating their results. The effect we're looking > for is probably very slight and can be easily hidden or 'faked' by such > conventional forces. > > Good luck on your experiments, and please post updates here! > > - Rick Monteverde > Honolulu, HI > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 00:04:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA08400; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 00:04:32 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 00:04:32 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802090609.WAA15662@rio.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 8 Feb 1998 22:04:39 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Proposed Gravity Experiment Resent-Message-ID: <"plkOR3.0.932.FYhtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3717 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Gary - > As for the case when there IS a change in the > pendulum period, another experiment could > be constructed which would have the same > degree of electrostatic effect without the > element of stored charge on a capacitor. That sounds like a knife sharp enough to pare the effect away from the conventional. I'm a fan of comparisons and null/calibration runs. They are so important in proving CF effects, and are often overlooked by the skeptics while they invent wild reasons that the excess heat seen in a working cell can't be real. Point them back to the control runs, ask why their 'new physics' doesn't work there, and they're usually pretty silent. I hope this works. I'd really like to be able to point to some solid experiments showing that BB is real - if indeed it is. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 00:33:52 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA16646; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 00:33:43 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 00:33:43 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802090828.AAA20992@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: Proposed Gravity Experiment Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 00:33:17 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"JavW72.0.-34.bzhtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3718 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com FYI: I added a link to some more info on the Nipher experiment to my web page. If repeatable this could shed some light on the subject. --Gary. ---------- > From: Rick Monteverde > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Proposed Gravity Experiment > Date: Monday, February 09, 1998 12:04 AM > > Gary - > > > As for the case when there IS a change in the > > pendulum period, another experiment could > > be constructed which would have the same > > degree of electrostatic effect without the > > element of stored charge on a capacitor. > > That sounds like a knife sharp enough to pare the effect away from the > conventional. > > I'm a fan of comparisons and null/calibration runs. They are so important > in proving CF effects, and are often overlooked by the skeptics while they > invent wild reasons that the excess heat seen in a working cell can't be > real. Point them back to the control runs, ask why their 'new physics' > doesn't work there, and they're usually pretty silent. > > I hope this works. I'd really like to be able to point to some solid > experiments showing that BB is real - if indeed it is. > > - Rick Monteverde > Honolulu, HI > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 02:11:22 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA24023; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 02:11:10 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 02:11:10 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19980209100914.9566.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [207.149.68.40] From: "CJT Enterprises one" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 02:09:13 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"XsoNY.0.Gt5.yOjtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3719 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Why is it that people assume Realtivity is no longer a theory but fact. Just seems that is the way people look at it on this list. It has never been proven conclusively and never will. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 02:31:13 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA25496; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 02:31:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 02:31:07 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19980209102838.11259.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [207.149.68.40] From: "CJT Enterprises one" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Knuke getting sick with radiation Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 02:28:38 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"wpqX52.0.HE6.ghjtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3720 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com For the radiation get Potassium Iodide and Miso soup and you will be cured...cures radiation sickness ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 04:25:11 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA01095; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 04:25:03 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 04:25:03 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19980209120254.23465.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [207.149.68.40] From: "CJT Enterprises one" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Re[2]: Need better descriptions on generator and HELP! Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 04:02:53 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"bUXvf3.0.0H.TMltq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3721 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com what is the web address of Quickfield Chris ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 05:16:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA07181; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 05:16:22 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 05:16:22 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <52e65b14.34df0126@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 08:14:12 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Re[2]: Need better descriptions on generator and HELP! Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"ePKVR1.0.rl1.Y6mtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3722 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-09 07:34:44 EST, you write: << what is the web address of Quickfield Chris >> QuickField support site Hope this helps Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 11:24:11 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA13126; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:23:57 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 11:23:57 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <7c871a83.34df57c0@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:23:42 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Cc: newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Maybe my most important post to date (Butch) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_887052222_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"Sog6f2.0.-C3.BVrtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3723 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_887052222_boundary Content-ID: <0_887052222@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII The attached drawing shows a bifilar coil with a permanent magnent that has just moved into alignment with the coils N and S poles. The poles of the coil have both N and S poles at both ends due to the nature of bifilar coils, see JLN Labs - The TEP Project - Bifilar VS Buck... . These coils are simply, two seperate circuits (wires) put side by side and wound on a spool in the same fashion you would wire a convential coil, air core or otherwise. The current flows in opposite directions to each other in the two circuits. This cancels out any self induction of the coil and no back EMF is produced by the coil. The coil acts as straight wire to a certain degree. Now if you move a permanent magnet into alignment with the coil as in attached drawing, ONLY one of the flux fields will show an increased in strength. The one that is flowing in the same direction as the permanent magnet. Now if you increase the current flow in the other circuit at the same time so that the magnetic fields stay the same strength, then you have created a path of less resistance for the flux of the permanent magnet and you have done it without any back EMF being produced in the coil. When the coil is switched off, both circuits open, you have the magnet's flux passing thru only air and copper. This path now has a high resistance to flux passage. The problem with magnetic "on /off " switches in the past has been, the faster you switch them for a given force they must provide, the more energy they require. With this bifilar switch, the faster the switching, the less energy required due to the absence of back EMF in the bifilar coil. So if you have a rotor/stator (dc generator) that has its drag forces canceled out buy a balance system, see overunity site update page The Werjefelt papers October 21, 1997, then you can turn this balance system on and off in a fashion that uses less energy than the stator coil produces as the RPM increases. The switch could also be used in the "Big Y" design of mine, see LaFonte Generator Home Page . The controller would have to be very accurate in controlling the current to keep the fields equal, but I believe it can be done. The current, if part of a super conducting tank circuit, would cycle over and over again doing the same work each cycle for the switch. I will run more test and also update my web site. If this switch works, consider it public domain, all I ask is that it be called by my name (LaFonte). Any comments, good or bad, please! 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Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:49:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3561.7F80F6E0" Resent-Message-ID: <"s9cYL3.0.T35.Uvrtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3724 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD3561.7F80F6E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: dave dameron[SMTP:ddameron@earthlink.net] Sent: Sunday, February 08, 1998 11:39 PM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? >Hi Kyle and all, >At 08:31 AM 2/8/98 -0600, you wrote: >Yes, I would like to hear your GRC theory. Have you heard of anyone who = has >built one and has gotten any unusual results? >-Dave No, I havent heard of anyone building it, but it seems possible that it = can work. The hoop coil in the center generates a magnetic field = according to the right hand rule. No strangeness about that. The outer = coil makes a circular magnetic field surrounded with an A-vector field. = A vector fields are postulated to interact with the Zero-Point Flux. = According to theory, using an A field to interact with ZPF and coupled = with a magnetic field, it is possible to generate: A. A distortion in = local spacetime, and B. A unidirectional propulsion requiring no = propellant (a 'space drive' as its been termed). The odd = voltages/currents used in the GRC along with its dielectric between the = two coils may serve to increase/alter the effect. Somewhat similar to T = Townsend Brown's work with HV capacitors. Just so the group knows it, = I'm a skeptic. But I'm an open minded skeptic. I intend to test out a = smaller model of the GRC when I get the money. Anyone know where I can = get a cheap neon sign transformer? Kyle R. 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Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:52:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3562.05032040" Resent-Message-ID: <"BN-2G1.0.4H5._xrtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3725 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD3562.05032040 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: CJT Enterprises one[SMTP:cjt642@hotmail.com] Sent: Monday, February 09, 1998 4:09 AM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? >Why is it that people assume Realtivity is no longer a theory but fact. = =20 >Just seems that is the way people look at it on this list. It has = never=20 >been proven conclusively and never will. =20 Its not well known or publicized, but the famous Michaelson-Morley = experiment results DID show an ether drift, albeit smaller than = expected. Then again, if we're in a gravity well, who's to say we would = get full force ether wind? Also: a radar experiment that reflected radar = waves off Venus' atmosphere indicated a velocity of not C, but C+V! = Naturally, no comment from the relativists. Perhaps someday. Kyle R. 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Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"yRMy8.0.eV3.eLttq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3726 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello All, I know there is a significant amount of expertise here on the list --- why is there so much apathy to helping other folks out? Only seems to be good discussions here after someone posts incorrect data. Is that the only way to spur discussion? Is the everyone on the list just too overwhelmed by the volume to respond? My apologies for the crabbyness.....I have posted several articles with no feedback from the list. Let's go over them again. 1 - Barkhausen Effect Detector/Generator -- Who's played with it. Show of hands please. I know that at one point Bob Shannon himself was on the list....Bob? 2 - Mu Metal -- Anyone have pointers or info on how the material actually shields? How does it interact with magnetic flux. Is there attraction/resistance involved with the shield moving in a field? 3 - Coler Device "Magnetstromapparat"-- How are the coils wound. Anyone tried to build one? Again -- show of hands please. I now know for a fact that there is more info out there..... Finally found some links on my own, so I think I am beginning to get a better idea of the winding config. Now -- I am resourceful and can find information on my own, but this is supposed to be a forum for _sharing_ information about the F/E - O/U field. All of these questions have been on topic....and have had absolutely no answer. Frustrated in Denver, Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com arager@idcomm.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 14:18:19 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA29471; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:18:10 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:18:10 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802092217.AA20400@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Mon, 09 Feb 98 15:11:03 -0500 To: Subject: Re: Maybe my most important post to date (Butch) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bXfQ-3.0.JC7.V2utq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3727 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Bruce, Interesting. I'm assuming that the coil will use a ferrite core? Otherwise you won't be generating a magnetic field from the coil -- right? [my ignorance is assuming that a ferrite is needed to make an electro-magnet]? If so, then I am having problems following why the flux would not be traveling thru the ferrite core when the coil is switched off..... Am I missing something? Hm....I wonder if this can be simulated in QuickField? Will try it tonite. BTW -- could you expand on the 'Y' design a bit more? Which part will be rotating/moving? Which direction is rotation? All for now, Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com [WK] arager@idcomm.com [HM] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 14:22:33 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA00602; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:22:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:22:06 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 17:20:01 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com Cc: SBouchillo@aol.com, GAGIJACK@aol.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Help me shut my father inlaw up! (off topic) (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"wsGtY3.0.F9.76utq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3728 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com My father inlaw says the millennium starts January 1, 2001 Now, I have looked at sites on the web, and there are a lot of different views as to when the millennium starts, it's gets into calendars, religions, ect. , so I want to prove my point this way. 1. If you have only 365 days in a year, no leap years. 2. You wanted to find out when 2000 years came to an end and the first second of the next 1000 years started. 3. Each minute had, 60 seconds, each hour 60 minutes, each day 24 hours, each year 365 days. 4. Christ has not been born yet. 5. The first millennium will start the instant Christ is born. 6. God has a stop watch that he will hit the start button on the instant Christ is born. 7. The stop watch will start at zero and move to one second during the first second after Christ's birth. 8. The stop watch starts ticking. 9. 2000 years later to the second, the new millennium (which is simply 1000 years that are made up of 365 days that are 24 hours long, that consist of 60 minute hours, that consist of 60 second minutes) starts and the second millennium ends, not 2000 and 1 years. 10. I'm I correct or not, yes or no Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 14:28:26 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA31660; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:28:17 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:28:17 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:23:40 -0600 (CST) From: HackEd To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Help me shut my father inlaw up! (off topic) (Butch) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"Kkulk3.0.ak7._Butq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3729 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Mon, 9 Feb 1998 HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > My father inlaw says the millennium starts January 1, 2001 > Now, I have looked at sites on the web, and there are a lot of different views > as to when the millennium starts, it's gets into calendars, religions, ect. , > so I want to prove my point this way. > 1. If you have only 365 days in a year, no leap years. > > 2. You wanted to find out when 2000 years came to an end and the first second > of the next 1000 years started. > > 3. Each minute had, 60 seconds, each hour 60 minutes, each day 24 hours, each > year 365 days. > > 4. Christ has not been born yet. > > 5. The first millennium will start the instant Christ is born. > > 6. God has a stop watch that he will hit the start button on the instant > Christ is born. > > 7. The stop watch will start at zero and move to one second during the first > second after Christ's birth. > > 8. The stop watch starts ticking. > > 9. 2000 years later to the second, the new millennium (which is simply 1000 > years that are made up of 365 days that are 24 hours long, that consist of 60 > minute hours, that consist of 60 second minutes) starts and the second > millennium ends, not 2000 and 1 years. > > 10. I'm I correct or not, yes or no > > Thanks, Butch > This doesn't have alot to do with the list, but it has been brought up nationally. If you want the scientific answer, I can't help you, but this is the obvious question: When was Christ born? The VERY Start of 0AD, or 1AD? If it was 1, then it starts Jan 1st, 2001. If it's 0ad, then it starts Jan 1st, 2000. Which ever way you look at it, those are the only two possiblities. Either he was born 1ad, or 0ad, your choice. I couldn't tell you that as I'm only 13, but I'm sure an astrologist could help. I could see why you would have trouble with this, as I've heard much controversy. But here is the thing, did the year start off 0 years PAST, or the 1st year? In other words, 0000 or 0001 respectively. That is a fact, no matter what. The only thing is, is it passed or place? Ask a scientist that one... From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 14:42:05 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA01429; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:42:01 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:42:01 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:41:27 -0700 (MST) From: Steve Ekwall X-Sender: ekwall2@november To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Help me shut my father inlaw up! (off topic) (Butch) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"uxTqO.0.EM.uOutq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3730 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Mon, 9 Feb 1998 HLafonte@aol.com wrote: -snip- > My father inlaw says the millennium starts January 1, 2001 YEP! :) -snip- > 7. The stop watch will start at zero and move to one second during the first > second after Christ's birth. > > 8. The stop watch starts ticking. your 'Clock' will tick for 365 days and He will finally TURN "1 year!" That is our calender year "0001 or 1001 or 2001, get it??" > 9. 2000 years later to the second, the new millennium (which is simply 1000 > years that are made up of 365 days that are 24 hours long, that consist of 60 > minute hours, that consist of 60 second minutes) starts and the second > millennium ends, not 2000 and 1 years. > > 10. I'm I correct or not, yes or no > Thanks, Butch So, you won't have 2000 years, until the last second of the last day.. Which if your there to watch willbe Jan 1 just turning 2001 our time. however, I think there will still be a BIG Celebration of people on New Years Eve 1/31/1999 ragardless. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 14:47:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA05319; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:47:01 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 14:47:01 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <183afeec.34df86e1@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 17:44:46 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Maybe my most important post to date (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"oVAtP3.0.-I1.UTutq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3731 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-09 17:29:01 EST, you write: << If so, then I am having problems following why the flux would not be traveling thru the ferrite core when the coil is switched off..... >> Anton, The coil is an air core coil, the ferrite is not needed Will get back to you Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 15:01:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA08541; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:00:54 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:00:54 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 18:00:36 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Help me shut my father inlaw up! (off topic) (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"Ea-ZC.0.752.Ygutq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3732 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-09 17:54:10 EST, you write: << My father inlaw says the millennium starts January 1, 2001 YEP! :) >> Steve I know that as the calendar goes it's right, I mean as far as the stop watch reads. Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 15:05:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA09712; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:05:37 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:05:37 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19980209170041.006a83ac@palacenet.net> X-Sender: mules@palacenet.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 17:00:41 -0600 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, From: Jack DeMule Subject: Re: Gripes and Frustrations! In-Reply-To: <199802092130.NAA14254@mx1.eskimo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"66-iy1.0.eN2._kutq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3733 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 14:14 2/9/98 -0500, arager@mcgraw-hill.com wrote: > 2 - Mu Metal -- Anyone have pointers or info on how the material > actually shields? How does it interact with magnetic flux. Is there > attraction/resistance involved with the shield moving in a field? These materials have very high permeability (~100,000) which means they represent a low impedance path for the magnetic streamlines. _They act to shunt to the magnetic field._ They are usually used to shield sensors like photomultipliers and CRTs from low frequency magnetic fields. The most popular alloys are Mu-metal, and Co-netic. They should be annealed after forming to perform well. I recall them as being non-magnetic alloys. As far as attraction/resistance they act as any similar metal would. Their only noteworthy attribute is their high permeability, which makes them useful as a magnetic shield. An equivalent shield of lower permeability material would have to be much thicker, and heavier. Try an Altavista search on Magnetic Shield Corp, Advance Magnetics, MuShield.... Best Regards, Jack ---------------------------------------------------------- mules@palacenet.net ---------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 15:16:52 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA10928; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:16:37 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 15:16:37 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <74947a7e.34df8de1@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 18:14:39 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Help me shut my father inlaw up! (off topic) (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"jnAOp2.0.Xg2.Gvutq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3734 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-09 17:54:10 EST, you write: << your 'Clock' will tick for 365 days and He will finally TURN "1 year!" That is our calender year "0001 or 1001 or 2001, get it? >> Steve, When your baby has been alive 6 months, do you tell people it is 1 year and 6 months? When it's been alive 100 years will it tell people it's going to be 100 years old in another year? Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 16:53:58 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA01777; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:53:34 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 16:53:34 -0800 Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 19:53:13 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802100053.TAA12827@freenet6.carleton.ca.carleton.ca> From: dy288@freenet.carleton.ca (Gregory Watson) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Help me shut my father inlaw up! (off topic) (Butch) Reply-To: dy288@freenet.carleton.ca Resent-Message-ID: <"tFtQp2.0.fR.DKwtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3735 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hey Butch, Millenium #1: Jan. 1, 0001 - Dec. 31, 1000 Millenium #2: Jan. 1, 1001 - Dec. 31, 2000 Millenium #3: Jan. 1, 2001 - Dec. 31, 3000 and so on... There was no year "0000" - the calendar started with year "0001" or just 1 (unlike birthdays) Then again, wouldn't the new millenium start Dec. 25, 2001 (or sometime in August, or 35 some-odd years later? ;) ) Greg >On Mon, 9 Feb 1998 HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > >> My father inlaw says the millennium starts January 1, 2001 >> Now, I have looked at sites on the web, and there are a lot of different views >> as to when the millennium starts, it's gets into calendars, religions, ect. , >> so I want to prove my point this way. >> 1. If you have only 365 days in a year, no leap years. >> >> 2. You wanted to find out when 2000 years came to an end and the first second >> of the next 1000 years started. >> >> 3. Each minute had, 60 seconds, each hour 60 minutes, each day 24 hours, each >> year 365 days. >> >> 4. Christ has not been born yet. >> >> 5. The first millennium will start the instant Christ is born. >> >> 6. God has a stop watch that he will hit the start button on the instant >> Christ is born. >> >> 7. The stop watch will start at zero and move to one second during the first >> second after Christ's birth. >> >> 8. The stop watch starts ticking. >> >> 9. 2000 years later to the second, the new millennium (which is simply 1000 >> years that are made up of 365 days that are 24 hours long, that consist of 60 >> minute hours, that consist of 60 second minutes) starts and the second >> millennium ends, not 2000 and 1 years. >> >> 10. I'm I correct or not, yes or no >> >> Thanks, Butch >> >This doesn't have alot to do with the list, but it has been brought up >nationally. If you want the scientific answer, I can't help you, but this >is the obvious question: When was Christ born? The VERY Start of 0AD, or >1AD? If it was 1, then it starts Jan 1st, 2001. If it's 0ad, then it >starts Jan 1st, 2000. Which ever way you look at it, those are the only >two possiblities. Either he was born 1ad, or 0ad, your choice. I >couldn't tell you that as I'm only 13, but I'm sure an astrologist could >help. I could see why you would have trouble with this, as I've heard >much controversy. But here is the thing, did the year start off 0 years >PAST, or the 1st year? In other words, 0000 or 0001 respectively. That >is a fact, no matter what. The only thing is, is it passed or place? Ask >a scientist that one... > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 17:17:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA29296; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 17:17:31 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 17:17:31 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DFAAB5.334D5D8B@midusa.net> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 19:17:41 -0600 From: Jon Flickinger X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Gripes and Frustrations! References: <199802092130.NAA14254@mx1.eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"P62-k3.0.a97.bgwtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3736 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com arager@mcgraw-hill.com wrote: [snip] > 3 - Coler Device "Magnetstromapparat"-- How are the coils wound. > Anyone tried to build one? Again -- show of hands please. I now know > for a fact that there is more info out there..... Finally found some > links on my own, so I think I am beginning to get a better idea of the > winding config. Hi Anton, In reference to "3" above, check out Harold Aspden's paper on Hans Coler at- http://www.energyscience.co.uk/le07.htm He gives his theory of operation for the Magnetstromapparat which may be of interest to you. He also has other info concerning construction, etc on other pages of his site. Hope this is of some help to you! Jon Flickinger From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 18:11:58 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA09048; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 18:11:47 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 18:11:47 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DFE0ED.7145@tiac.net> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 21:09:01 -0800 From: Bob Shannon Organization: Fair at best X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Gripes and Frustrations! References: <199802092130.NAA14254@mx1.eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lnF4q1.0.HD2.XTxtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3737 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com arager@mcgraw-hill.com wrote: > > Hello All, > > I know there is a significant amount of expertise here on the list --- > why is there so much apathy to helping other folks out? Only seems to > be good discussions here after someone posts incorrect data. Is that > the only way to spur discussion? Is the everyone on the list just too > overwhelmed by the volume to respond? People get busy, often with things as common as day to day life.... > My apologies for the crabbyness.....I have posted several articles > with no feedback from the list. Let's go over them again. > > 1 - Barkhausen Effect Detector/Generator -- Who's played with it. > Show of hands please. I know that at one point Bob Shannon himself was > on the list....Bob? Sorry for not getting back to you right away. I'm here, how can I help you? IF you like, send me a SASE, and I'll send you a strip of selected core material, and maybe an old pre-wound coil from a prototype, will this help? Several people on freenrg-l have built working detectors, three or more anyway. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 18:19:24 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA20969; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 18:19:13 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 18:19:13 -0800 Message-ID: <34DFB8CF.8A91210E@microtronics.com.au> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:47:51 +1030 From: Greg Watson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: List Server Freenrg , List Server Vortex , List Server Newman Subject: Re: PMOD Project References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"NJMsF3.0.J75.Uaxtq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3738 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Steve Ekwall wrote: > > On Mon, 9 Feb 1998, Rob King wrote: > -snip- > > I notice that nobody has mentioned any research to do with Greg for > > quite some time. > > Was it an April fool joke that went on a bit long or what? > > > > So Greg, how are you progressing with this 10kw domestic generator? > > If the PMOD project does work it may explain where Stan Meyer got his > > excess hydrogen/oxygen from, but then again he couldn't prove it in a > > court of law and this would make him a liar or something. > > > -snip- > > Rob, > I sent out a 'SMOT Ping1' subject header here this last week-end to Greg, > and got back a personal e-mail quote as follows: > > " [lurking] <--My ? for still on line (y/n/lurking?) > > I CAN"T Comment " > > ---- > The above quoted message is 100% the entire reply (LESS header) > ---- > Sounded like (with the capitalized double-quote CAN"T) legal observance on > his part is being maintained to the letter. > > I will respect that and the fact that when he previously stated that when > he could say something, it would be here FIRST on the v-list. > > -=se=- > saddly, > 'nuff said, i guess by all. > hope this is the Best/Fastest way for all the world to benefit. Hi All, I am currently restrained from ANY comments on ANYTHING even close to my research. In the meantime, I would suggest you check out : 1) US patent 4,897,592 Http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=4897592 2) Tapping Zero-Point Energy Http://www.livelinks.com/sumeria/free/zpe3.html From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 18:33:12 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA12867; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 18:32:36 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 18:32:36 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DFBDE8.C1D@ix.netcom.com> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 21:39:36 -0500 From: "Dana K. Loan" Reply-To: loan@ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Help me shut my father inlaw up! (off topic) (Butch) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"n7t7q2.0.p83.omxtq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3739 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 98-02-09 17:54:10 EST, you write: > > << My father inlaw says the millennium starts January 1, 2001 > YEP! :) >> > Steve I know that as the calendar goes it's right, I mean as far as the stop > watch reads. > Butch If the Gregorian calendar started at year "0000 and one second" wouldn't the second milenium start at "2000 and 1 second" roughly speaking of course? Dana From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 19:01:52 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA19160; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 19:01:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 19:01:19 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DFC4A5.3BF1@ix.netcom.com> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 22:08:21 -0500 From: "Dana K. Loan" Reply-To: loan@ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Gripes and Frustrations! References: <199802092130.NAA14254@mx1.eskimo.com> <34DFAAB5.334D5D8B@midusa.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LFlGp1.0.Ch4.vBytq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3740 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Jon Flickinger wrote: > > arager@mcgraw-hill.com wrote: > > [snip] > > > 3 - Coler Device "Magnetstromapparat"-- How are the coils wound. > > Anyone tried to build one? Again -- show of hands please. I now know > > for a fact that there is more info out there..... Finally found some > > links on my own, so I think I am beginning to get a better idea of the > > winding config. Anton, I think I've replied maybe three times to anything on this list and I've been on it (hovering/reading/soaking_it_in) for about three months now. A major part of the problem is that references are to certain experiments/results by the experimenter's name and that throws me. I may have known about the experiment or the (usually interesting/abnormal) result but didnot remember the name associated with the experiment/result. Case in point the Coler effect. I had no idea what you meant until I followed someone elses link and got an update! Turns out that the Coler results are at THIRD level on my reproduction/verification list (First level is Thomas T. Brown's electrostatic propulsion experiments...personal interest!) Maybe other folks on the list just can't keep up with your references without a reminding nudge/link. I know whenever some new reference comes up I usually have to wait for a couple of responces to get a link or a text reminder of the subject matter to realise that I knew what it was all about but by then I'm way behind the discussion curve. I may not be as smart as most on this list but I can generally catch up and follow long discussions but contributing falls way behind. Is this just me or are we all trying to keep up with too many possibilities at once? Nough said Dana From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 20:35:47 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA07788; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 20:35:37 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 20:35:37 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DFD95B.2CB5@gorge.net> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 20:36:43 -0800 From: tom@gorge.net (Tom Miller) Reply-To: tom@gorge.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: What is a Tesla Coil (was ??) References: <199802091924.LAA13245@mx1.eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"NQ05N1.0.bv1.Naztq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3741 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Jack DeMule wrote: > I'm sorry, he never made that claim. Well... Hummmmph. Well... I peronally can't claim to have a photographic memory which would allow me to make such a blanket statement. 8^) In fact, I have forgotten a good portion of what I have read over the years. But, I tend to remember (what little I remember) *accurately*. Especially something of this kind of import. Unfortunately, I cannot remember which of the "standard" books on Tesla carried this quote. And I don't have the time (right now) to order all of the books I have read from the library, and go through them to find the exact location. If someone has the books, you might look in the "Colorado" timeframe, when Tesla was "making lightning," and burned out the municipal generator. Whether it is true, or not, or whether he was falsely quoted, I have no way of knowing. But I am certain that he was so quoted, and in a commonly available source. Tom Miller From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 22:25:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA11829; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 22:25:21 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 22:25:21 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980210002050.00e36130@palacenet.net> X-Sender: mules@palacenet.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 00:20:50 -0600 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Jack DeMule Subject: Re: What is a Tesla Coil (was ??) In-Reply-To: <34DFD95B.2CB5@gorge.net> References: <199802091924.LAA13245@mx1.eskimo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"_fuj4.0.fu2.FB_tq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3742 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello... At 20:36 2/9/98 -0800, Tom Miller wrote: >Jack DeMule wrote: > >> I'm sorry, he never made that claim. > >Well... Hummmmph. Well... I peronally can't claim to have a >photographic >memory which would allow me to make such a blanket statement. I've heard this resonance is OU claim coupled with Tesla's name before. I checked my references, and remember the result. No photographic memory required. That particular claim has been made time and time again by people with out the foggiest clue about what a Tesla coil is... or a defective understanding of it's principles. Resonance is a marvelous thing, and the can produce spectacular results, but none even close to over unity. >If someone has the books, you might look in the "Colorado" timeframe, >when >Tesla was "making lightning," and burned out the municipal generator. I believe he did do those things, at least they recorded in his notebooks. >Whether it is true, or not, or whether he was falsely quoted, I have no >way >of knowing. But I am certain that he was so quoted, and in a commonly >available source. Then he was misquoted... I hate that. His mathematical models of the magnifying transmitter and other "Tesla coils" were expressed in his writings. He often envisioned mechanical models, mechanically resonant systems... but hey, they worked Best Regards, Jack --------------------------------------------------------------- And he established three seasons, summer, winter, and autum third, and a fourth, spring, when everything blooms but there is not enough to eat. -Hipponax mules@palacenet.net --------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 9 23:19:23 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA18168; Mon, 9 Feb 1998 23:19:17 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 23:19:17 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 00:18:46 -0700 (MST) From: Steve Ekwall X-Sender: ekwall2@november To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: [OFF TOPIC] Help me shut my father inlaw up! (off topic) (Butch) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"C2FMk1.0.nR4.pz_tq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3743 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Mon, 9 Feb 1998 HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 98-02-09 17:54:10 EST, you write: > > << My father inlaw says the millennium starts January 1, 2001 > YEP! :) >> > Steve I know that as the calendar goes it's right, I mean as far as the stop > watch reads. > Butch > Yep, but apples to oranges. birth of christ = an event. year = a number 2000 years FROM event Your Correct. 2000 year millenium = 2001... Don't forget even computers start out at ZERO then 1,2,3,4..... ------------- In the above, your both right, sorry I didn't clarify more. If your celebrating the (exact second) birth of christ (which even with astrologers/historians/time travelers... you would start your 'stop-watch'at that moment and GAIN a (number) year. your 0=1/go! Your Right if go = 1! (but it won't be a year (number) until 365 days. -- Stop-watch not going = 0 If your in millenium NUMBERS, your in consecutive digits 0,1,2,3,4.... being numbers, you'll have to wait until it is filled: 00.97 00.98 00.99 then your "1" at 1.00 --> 1.01 1.02 +...... BASE-LINE is apples to oranges... but hey, I'm only 4* & 3/4 till my birthday too :) ------- p.s. j.deckers was right about this being off topic.. If you would like further pro/con ya/nay's +/- please mail-me off list.. another example is " I've got 11 fingers, and CAN PROVE it! " Holding up both hands and I'm counting the left hand first I say (counting backwards) as you think I have just 10, so we'll start: * * * * * 10 9 8 7 6. ---then count on the other (right) hand * * * * * 1 2 3 4 5. 6+5=11! fingers by that apple & oranges count! :) same diff: Their all good numbers & all good fingers. Event (birth) = 2000 / Millenium (date/number) = 2001 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 00:32:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA28821; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 00:31:59 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 00:31:59 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 00:31:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802100831.AAA19501@iceland.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: homopolar (Faraday) generator Resent-Message-ID: <"aOGkp.0.727.z11uq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3744 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Don Lancaster has another article on homopolar generators in March, 1998 "Electronics Now". He mentions Bill B's site very favorably. He asks if a permanent magnet is rotated along its axis, does the field (lines) rotate, or is a "uniform" field uniform? Does anyone have any comments? I am setting up an air bore electromagnet that I can insert a rotating steel shaft, that will become a rotating magnet. Can I tell if the magnetic field from the end of the shaft rotates with it, or are somehow tied to the fixed coil? Should the ferromagnetic portion of the field be considered different? -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 01:29:25 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA03824; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:29:20 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 01:29:20 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802100831.AAA19501@iceland.it.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 9 Feb 1998 23:29:24 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: homopolar (Faraday) generator Resent-Message-ID: <"QIQuB1.0.fx.lt1uq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3745 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Dave - Experiments show that the field of a symmetrical magnet which is rotating about its magnetic pole shows no rotational properties. In other words, it will not induce current in a conductive disc in a homopolar as is seen when the disc itself is rotating in relation to the magnet. This one trips people up as lot. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 05:34:28 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA02577; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 05:34:12 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 05:34:12 -0800 (PST) From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <130e2c6f.34e056f7@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 08:32:37 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Interesting motor design..... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 116 Resent-Message-ID: <"P1Bvi.0.Ae.IT5uq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3746 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi All, I have updated my web site with an interesting motor design. This motor is based on the diagram below, courtesy of Nelson Camus. Nelson Camus has said to me that : "This motor is able to run by itself and give FreeNRG from the magnets when the aluminium sheets are removed from the blocking position (between the magnets). After they are removed, the motor starts itself without stopping, like a real perpertual motion motor. The coils 1,2,3,4 are used only for tapping the magnetic energy and convert it into useable electrical power........" You will find all informations and diagrams at : http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/qmmv8.htm I think that this will interest you, Sincerely, Jean-Louis Naudin 02/10/98 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 07:55:03 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA01336; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 07:54:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 07:54:07 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 07:28:36 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802101528.HAA14126@sweden.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: homopolar (Faraday) generator Resent-Message-ID: <"e2HfW.0.lK.LW7uq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3747 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Rick and all, At 11:29 PM 2/9/98 -1000, Rick Monteverde wrote: > >Experiments show that the field of a symmetrical magnet which is rotating >about its magnetic pole shows no rotational properties. In other words, it >will not induce current in a conductive disc in a homopolar as is seen when >the disc itself is rotating in relation to the magnet. This one trips >people up as lot. So there are no "lines" attached to the symmetrical magnet? > I measured the small homopolar output in the normal case with the disk rotating and magnet fixed, and both the disk and magnet rotating. In the second case, I quessed it was induction from the rotating magnet into the leads to the voltmeter forming a loop. This is why I'm investing induction, either a conductor cutting flux, or change in flux in a loop. Since about all voltage measurements require a loop, one text states these 2 are the same. I am trying to figure mhow to wire a toroid "disk" where the voltages of each loop add, not cancel, so I can remove the test lead error. I know this can be done in a Gramme motor where the field is radial and the toroid is wound on a ferromagnetic core so the inner wires don't "see" the flux, that is, in the flux cutting model, not the change in a loop. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 09:42:59 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA24268; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:42:47 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 09:42:47 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802101742.AA23319@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 98 10:32:01 -0500 To: Subject: Re[2]: Gripes and Frustrations! - additional Coler Link Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8OfAW1.0.zw5.L69uq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3748 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com >In reference to "3" above, check out Harold Aspden's paper on Hans >Coler at- > >http://www.energyscience.co.uk/le07.htm > >He gives his theory of operation for the Magnetstromapparat which may >be of interest to you. Thanks. That was the inital link that caught my eye. I was confused about the coil winding. Here's a archive of an older Solaris document that shows the winding details see http://www.dnai.com/~zap/coler.htm Anton Rager Denver, CO arager@McGraw-Hill.com arager@idcomm.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 11:06:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA22515; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 11:06:22 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 11:06:22 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 14:05:14 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Bifilar switch drawing on web site (Butch) Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"lDEcl2.0.GV5.dKAuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3749 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com My bifilar switch drawing is now on web site for those who had trouble viewing it. Thanks, Butch LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 11:50:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA05404; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 11:50:30 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 11:50:30 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802101950.AA16319@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 98 12:43:58 -0500 To: Subject: Re: Bifilar switch drawing on web site (Butch) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bubDH1.0.JK1.4-Auq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3750 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch, Played with a home-made coil last nite [not a bifilar] -- I think I see what you're talking about. Same coil with nail [iron] core makes good, strong electro-magnet when powered by 9V battery. Remove nail, and no longer attracts other ferrites, but will attract/repel from neodymium magnet placed near ends [direction of movement depends on magnetic polarity] while powered. Effect dies with no power. Did not notice a difference in flux strength when placing magnets on either end simultaneously [regardless of polarity], but the distance between magnets was about 3"......just about where the fields start diminishing. My test setup is also not very sturdy, and the coil moves around a bit [horizontal coil with leads terminating into a breadboard, 9V battery leads also terminate into board, coil held in air by wire leads, whole mess on kitchen table.] While this is probably a very basic concept, I never really realized this effect. Thought a ferrite coil was needed for magnetic interaction...this is why I don't do this for a living ;) So -- I guess I follow what your original description was saying. The fields produced by the coil will "conduct" the magnetic flux of the permanent magnets creating some form of attraction or repelling action towards the coil? Meanwhile the bifilar configuration will minimize/prevent backEMF from draining energy? Will try to wind a bifilar air coil tonite and play a bit.....And try not to crush my pinkies again -- ouch! Anton Rager Denver, CO arager@McGraw-Hill.com [WK] arager@idcomm.com [HM] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 12:05:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA16700; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:04:51 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:04:51 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <969e84f7.34e0b198@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 14:59:15 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Bifilar switch, Anton testing Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"z9DL01.0.j44.UBBuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3751 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-10 14:52:37 EST, you write: << Will try to wind a bifilar air coil tonite and play a bit >> Anton, You are getting close, let me know how the test go. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 12:50:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA18356; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:49:55 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:49:55 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 12:49:45 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802102049.MAA26934@denmark.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Butch108 Fig. Resent-Message-ID: <"juh1t.0.eU4.nrBuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3752 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Butch and all, The air core is magnetically linear. So I don't see how the zero net bifilar field will affect the permanent magnet lines. Even for a non-cancelling coil, such as a normal solenoid, wouldn't the total field just be the sum of the magnet's + solenoid, in air (superposition)? Or are you considering that the solenoid field will change the domains of the permanent magnet? -Dave >Thanks, >Butch >Attachment Converted: C:\EARTHLNK\BUTCH108.gif > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 13:28:10 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA27281; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:27:57 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:27:57 -0800 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:27:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802102127.NAA28913@iceland.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Bifilar switch drawing on web site (Butch) Resent-Message-ID: <"CG2rs.0.4g6.OPCuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3753 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Anton and all, At 12:43 PM 2/10/98 -0500, you wrote: > > Butch, > > Played with a home-made coil last nite [not a bifilar] -- I think I > see what you're talking about. Same coil with nail [iron] core makes > good, strong electro-magnet when powered by 9V battery. Remove nail, > and no longer attracts other ferrites, but will attract/repel from > neodymium magnet placed near ends [direction of movement depends on > magnetic polarity] while powered. Effect dies with no power. >> It's amazing how much the ferromagnetic material (nail) increases the B field. The field is there without the nail, but much smaller. I have found you need 10,000 or so Amp-turns in an air core solenoid to approach the field of a typical small ceramic magnet. It's fun to investigate, though, as there are no "hard" pole pieces, just "air" in and around the electromagnet. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 14:41:46 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA23819; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 14:41:11 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 14:41:11 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34DF9D1C.173E@xtra.co.nz> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 13:19:40 +1300 From: Robbie Rowntree Reply-To: rown@xtra.co.nz X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Knuke getting sick with radiation References: <19980209102838.11259.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"qrLni3.0.3q5.5UDuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3754 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com CJT Enterprises one wrote: > > For the radiation get Potassium Iodide and Miso soup and you will be > cured...cures radiation sickness > large dose's of alcohol help also but that creates another problem -- **RRAMM** Good Waves Robbie Rowntree experimental research Self powered*Magnetic Motor*Electric Gen*Anti gravity drive http://www.primenet.com/~rags/tesla/rr.html mailto:rown@xtra.co.nz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 14:51:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA25694; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 14:51:40 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 14:51:40 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 17:44:14 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Butch108 Fig. Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"j4VQa2.0.LH6.vdDuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3755 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-10 15:58:54 EST, you write: << The air core is magnetically linear. So I don't see how the zero net bifilar field will affect the permanent magnet lines. Even for a non-cancelling coil, such as a normal solenoid, wouldn't the total field just be the sum of the magnet's + solenoid, in air (superposition)? Or are you considering that the solenoid field will change the domains of the permanent magnet? >> Dave, At the monent I am runing tests to see how these fields (bifilar) interact with magnets. I'm trying different things with one field up, the other rising, with and without the magnets moving and so on. I wish I could see a quickfield simulation of a bifilar coil field going up and down. I'm still trying to learn Quickfield at this time. You are probably correct about the magnets not having an effect on the bifilar coil, but I'm going to try to "trick" it. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 19:08:50 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA08510; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:08:20 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:08:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <01BD3667.950F9640@pm3-142.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: Biefield-Brown Effect Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:05:12 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx2.eskimo.com id TAA08482 Resent-Message-ID: <"-Smjt.0.q42.XOHuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3756 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greetings: I read a web page produced by NASA that claimed the Biefield Brown Effect did not exist. Is this true? What experiments have been carried out on this subject? What would I need to perform these experiments (if any). Best Regards, Kyle Randall Mcallister Email: stk@sunherald.infi.net Phone: 228-875-0629 Fax: 228-872-5837 P.S.: Is it just me, or is there very little interest in altering the properties of spacetime on this list? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 19:43:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA13764; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:43:28 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:43:28 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34E10308.242@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 17:46:48 -0800 From: Wm Perry Reply-To: wperry3092@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: gravity wave circuit ideas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"W6R1x.0.wM3.SvHuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3757 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I have recently found sites and postings about the supposed Gravity Wave Circuits. (howonec, etc. hope i spelled it right). I have three (3) ideas I would like to explore but am limited on time and resources. Although I know these have no REAL direct relation to Free energy and the such, here goes: 1. In all the descriptions and pictures or diagrams, I've noticed that they all require some kind of shielding to block out EMI. One such shield was the Faraday cage (i think it is called, the one which is the metal enclosure which is grounded). I wonder if WATER might prove as an effective shield. It has been known for a long time that radio frequencies (other than ELF), cannot penetrate ocean water. I think that if one would build an enclosure which would sit in say a 10 or 20 gallon aquarium and ground it, it would prove to be an even better shield than just one or the other. If this proved effective, I think that it would be possible to install an array on a submarine (which is essentially a HUGE Faraday cage!) and use that platform to work that magic. 2. Another idea (really a problem I'm having) is whether some kind of sonic wave, i.e. automobiles driving down the road, could affect the output of the sensor if they could slightly vibrate plates on the detector capacitor, which if I'm not mistaken, would change the capacitance value. if this is so, it would be essential to isolate it with some kind of rubber mount or other acoustic insulator. 3. Would the said Gravity Wave Detector detect any kind of Gravitational Anomalies arising from a nuclear reaction process, as this essentially reduces the mass of the radioactive material? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 19:51:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA13235; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:49:56 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:49:56 -0800 Message-ID: <34E104D8.261E@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 17:54:33 -0800 From: Wm Perry Reply-To: wperry3092@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Biefield-Brown Effect References: <01BD3667.950F9640@pm3-142.gpt.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"HhxZM3.0.TE3.X_Huq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3758 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Kyle R. Mcallister wrote: > P.S.: Is it just me, or is there very little interest in altering the properties of spacetime on this list? Actually Kyle, I've been trying to figure out a way in my head (as limited as that might be) to build an extremely HV capacitor which could be modulated (i.e. charged and discharged) at say,100-10000Hz. I believe this would create a slight gravitational distortion due to the deficiency and then excess of electrons in the one plate, (yes I envision one plate the other being mother Earth), which if detected could somehow be demodulated into some kind of intelligible information. If I seem to be on the Weird & Wacky track, let me know your input. Speaking of which, how would one go about rectifying something on the order of 20-30Mv? WILLIAM From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 20:51:49 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA25118; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 20:51:41 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 20:51:41 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BD3667.950F9640@pm3-142.gpt.infi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 18:50:07 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Biefield-Brown Effect Resent-Message-ID: <"AO8dZ.0.M86.QvIuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3759 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Kyle - > I read a web page produced by NASA that > claimed the Biefield Brown Effect did not > exist. That's funny, I just read one that claims that *NASA* doesn't exist. Crazy internet. You wouldn't happen to have the URL, would you? > P.S.: Is it just me, or is there very little > interest in altering the properties of > spacetime on this list? I find the spacetime properties on this list to be perfectly suitable, and have little interest in altering them. But I'd sure like to alter the ones in the vicinity of my benchtop, or better yet, in the vicinity of NASA! - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 21:00:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA10598; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:00:50 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:00:50 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34E10308.242@worldnet.att.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:00:54 -1000 To: freenrg list From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: gravity wave circuit ideas Resent-Message-ID: <"sUzRq1.0.Sb2.12Juq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3760 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com WPerry wrote: > I think that if one would build an enclosure > which would sit in say a 10 or 20 gallon > aquarium and ground it, it would prove to be > an even better shield than just one or the > other. Very close to my house is steep sided cove with some shallow water sea caves where I was thinking of trying the Hodowanecs. Good salty water near shore here too; good shielding. But a good faraday shield should do fine anyway, as the extremely long and short waves are going to get at you in any case. The biggest problem I'm having at the moment with the Hodowanec's is getting past the notion that all that noise you hear from them isn't just the microscopic thrashing of matter at room temperature, and has little or nothing to do with signal from elsewhere. Proving that wrong would require a pair or more of Hodowanecs separated by some distance and shown to detect some non-EM signal at the same time. That signal would have to be often enough and/or complex enough to be convincing that it wasn't just the coincidence of richly chaotic signals temporarily matching up to some degree. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 21:02:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA11318; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:02:39 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:02:39 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 00:01:24 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: New idea for bifilar "Big Y" on web site (Butch) Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"EqIyr1.0.im2.i3Juq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3761 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Please take a look at drawing butch110.gif on my web site LaFonte Generator Home Page . It is a new idea for the "Big Y" design. See if you agree that the two wires will act the same as a bifilar coil ( same wiring and current layout). That is, will the self inductance be canceled out as the current builds up and also, after the current is stable and the wires are moved into the magnetic field of the magnet, will the flux take this path, and as the wires are being pulled to the magnet, will the self inductance still be canceled out in the two wires (no back EMF). Comments please! Thanks, Butch http://members.aol.com/HLafonte/LaFonteGenerator4.html From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 21:38:06 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA01338; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:37:59 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:37:59 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34E11CC8.2EA5@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:36:40 -0800 From: Wm Perry Reply-To: wperry3092@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: gravity wave circuit ideas References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pGhhE3.0.iK.qaJuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3762 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Rick, Thanks for the feedback. I live on the island as well, I may have to one day check out this cave you're telling me about. William From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 21:37:48 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA18165; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:37:43 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 21:37:43 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 19:37:47 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: New idea for bifilar "Big Y" on web site (Butch) Resent-Message-ID: <"GNpTa.0.kR4.caJuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3763 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch - "[...] will the self inductance be canceled out [etc...]" Forgive me if this sounds pushy because I don't mean it that way. Are you getting close to trying out any of these designs? It's because this kind of thought experiment is really hard to figure out. And so many people have tried these things before and failed that I think it tends to render thought experiments in this area moot anyway. I know you're hoping someone might be able to point out some obvoius flaw that would save you the trouble of trying out one particular design, and that's a perfectly legitimate call, of course. But this is the edge...you know? You're going to have to try them sooner or later to get the real answer, no matter what anyone says about them one way or the other. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 22:06:52 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA23779; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:06:47 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:06:47 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <34E11CC8.2EA5@worldnet.att.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 20:06:51 -1000 To: freenrg list From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: gravity wave circuit ideas Resent-Message-ID: <"FcSeo.0.Mp5.r_Juq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3764 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com William - > Thanks for the feedback. I live on the island > as well, I may have to one day check out this > cave you're telling me about. Hey neighbor - I live in Hawaii Kai, and the place I was thinking of is by the "toilet bowl" out at Hanauma bay. The overhangs and interior of the bowl itself are pretty good except for the surge in there, but there's that tunnel outside the bowl in the side of the cove that's even more closed off by rock and generally has much less surge. That's the one where people slide into the small opening in the rocks along the north side of the cove, and everyone watches expectantly to see if the person makes it out to the open water. You could set a sealed gizmo in one of the potholes in the floor of the cave on a calm day and the surge wouldn't move it around. Hanauma bay in general is a good place to access fairly calm clear water any time you need it. Really just a matter of waterhousing the gizmo. Let's see...checklist: handtruck full of air tanks, aluminum lounge chair, extra lead weights for the chair, back issues of "Infinite Energy" soaked in Thompson's Water Seal - what a way to spend the afternoon. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 22:19:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA06723; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:19:08 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:19:08 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <70a45ab7.34e14287@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 01:17:41 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: To Rick on posts from me (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"_xt5R2.0.ye1.PBKuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3765 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-11 00:39:46 EST, you write: << You're going to have to try them sooner or later to get the real answer, no matter what anyone says about them one way or the other. >> Rick, You are right. I do try to do as many tests as I can, but I put them on the list to try and see as you said, if some one knows right off if it will not work. If the reason it will not work is very clear to me, it saves me a lot of time. If someone wants to continue with it, they have it there. I also put them there for "food for thought". Lots of people have told me that they have stopped working on any projects, and the posts will get them to thinking again. I also hope that someone might say to themselfs, that will not work, but I wonder if this will, and go on to discover something of their own. I am a big believer in "brain storming" . That is, throwing in all kinds of ideas that come to mind, and many projects have come up with great ideas this way. I probably need to slow down on the ideas to the list, but I love to throw an idea at a group of people to get an opinion. Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 22:40:46 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA10512; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:40:40 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:40:40 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:39:20 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802110639.WAA03986@germany.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: New idea for bifilar "Big Y" on web site (Butch) Resent-Message-ID: <"N_fcb3.0.9a2.cVKuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3766 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Butch, At 12:01 AM 2/11/98 EST, you wrote: >Please take a look at drawing butch110.gif on my web site >LaFonte >Generator Home Page If flux can travel between the 2 wires, isn't it more like a 1 turn loop than a bifilar winding? Axis of loop field = permanent magnet's. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 10 22:42:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA30584; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:42:37 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:42:37 -0800 Message-Id: <199802110643.WAA08297@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: Biefield-Brown Effect Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 22:44:21 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"EvBJk3.0.nT7.RXKuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3767 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com A "Biefield-Brown" type effect was first noted by Dr. Francis Nipher at Washington University back in 1916. Check http://www.rio.com/~reboot/Nipher.htm for a short blurb on his experimental setup. --Gary ---------- > From: Rick Monteverde > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Biefield-Brown Effect > Date: Tuesday, February 10, 1998 8:50 PM > > Kyle - > > > I read a web page produced by NASA that > > claimed the Biefield Brown Effect did not > > exist. > > That's funny, I just read one that claims that *NASA* doesn't exist. Crazy > internet. You wouldn't happen to have the URL, would you? > > > P.S.: Is it just me, or is there very little > > interest in altering the properties of > > spacetime on this list? > > I find the spacetime properties on this list to be perfectly suitable, and > have little interest in altering them. But I'd sure like to alter the ones > in the vicinity of my benchtop, or better yet, in the vicinity of NASA! > > - Rick Monteverde > Honolulu, HI > > > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 03:38:40 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA00127; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 03:38:31 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 03:38:31 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34E18D80.ED8F2D57@ihug.co.nz> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:37:39 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: New idea for bifilar "Big Y" on web site (Butch) References: Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------D951F595041EA94BF034CEE4" Resent-Message-ID: <"C4JKR.0.t1.rsOuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3768 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------D951F595041EA94BF034CEE4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Two magnetic fields of equal strength and opposite polarity can alter the permeability of iron (actually they only use up the permeability) just look at a transformer, the magnetic fields of the primary and secondary are almost equal in strength and opposite in polarity, they are often would on top of each other so to be similar to a bifilar, but despite there being little net magnetic field the iron is full to capacity with canceled flux. But I don't know if you can change the permeability of air though. There is a patent for a transformer with three primaries and secondarys with each pair of *p&s at right angels to the others, it was found that the magnetic field of one set didn't change the permeability of iron at right angels to it, so three transformers could live on one core with each p&s set not interfering with the others, so don't use a magnetic field at right angels to change the permeability of anything. *Primaries and secondarys John Berry HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > Please take a look at drawing butch110.gif on my web site LaFonte > Generator Home Page . It is a new idea for the "Big Y" design. See if > you agree that the two wires will act the same as a bifilar coil ( > same wiring and current layout). That is, will the self inductance be > canceled out as the current builds up and also, after the current is > stable and the wires are moved into the magnetic field of the magnet, > will the flux take this path, and as the wires are being pulled to the > magnet, will the self inductance still be canceled out in the two > wires (no back EMF). Comments please! Thanks, Butch > http://members.aol.com/HLafonte/LaFonteGenerator4.html --------------D951F595041EA94BF034CEE4 Content-Type: image/gif; name="BUTCH.GIF" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="BUTCH.GIF" R0lGODdhgALgAfcAAAAAAIAAAACAAICAAAAAgIAAgACAgMDAwICAgP8AAAD/AP//AAAA//8A /wD//////wAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACwAAAAAEwH1AAAI/wAfCBxIsKDBgwgTKlzIsKHD hxAjSpxIsaLFixgzatzIsaPHjyBDihxJsqTJkyhTqlzJsqXLlzBjypxJs6bNmzhz6tzJs6fP n0CDCh1KtKjRo0iTKl3KtKnTp1CjSp1KtarVq1izat3KtavXr2DDih1LtqzZs2jTql3Ltq3b t3A9AphLt67du3jz6t3Lt6/fv4ADB46rEECCw4gTK17MuLHjx5AjS55MufJkAIQTGrbMubPn z6BDO8ac+eBm0ahTq17NmXTpgqdZy55NG7Xr1wNj197Nu3fj27gf6PZNvPhs4LiHG1/O/DPy 18qbS58O+Xnp6NSza09gPTP27eCZd/8n/D28ed/j45Y/z552erjr28tX/f5t/Pn4Qdd3ez+/ f8v7tdXffwRGFiBbAxaoIGMHrpXgghAe1qBaD0a44IRpVWhhgRiipeGG/3V41ocg5ieiWSSW ON+JZaWoYnsskuWihILVaOONONYlWoxjzcidWC7yCGRqQiIVZHAE+VjkUUciKZCSQ4a25FdQ htWkk1WCdSWSWVK5o5NPEhmlfmAKJ6aVX4LZpVfD6SjZlGyeqaViscUHZ1dr4klna2XmyVWb A975p5xeMnifoFv5mehjdvZJaJyJ1fmmo7aNiZibBlKa5pxSatopmp9i+aieoXI5ak45/rVj qn9ZpehNABz/IOustNZq66245qrrrrz2WiuiNb1qU6y+FmvsscgWCyxNwgab7LPQRuvrsjM1 y6y02GaLLbUyWVuttuCGq6yrp+JErLjopksrtzF526268KbLLkzuthvvveDO+1K99OLrr7T6 usTvvv8WnGzALQ0ssMEMj1uVwgk3LPGuCLMEscUTZ3xrxStd3LHGIM/KsUoekxxyyCOnVLLK J4OcMkorw9yyxi+fFLPNx7Kqs185k1upT+dOy1PQvdZs0s1H97wT0bwaXRLShe0stY2mTW11 Xz1BrdnVXPNVdddg05V1uRyFbXZdX5/N9dg/i6T22Wm/PTXbm4Ykd9hx360z3aWC/6R313n/ nSPfZI4k+NWBH0710GRvpPjcBj3OKuHOkST5zolf3irjbduteaqZf+4153X7LTqOoZ+eF+We Uav6jam/bhfrnbkuu2Cx3z4X7XwarjtguevOO4CW/745bMbvNXxltic/OvLO47U8Zc1Hv3rk 1t81/WXFZy899t6LTXrfH4X/PfTmbz+p7+ajDX764xfudvvuox+++pmyT/9z++NfXff9e9/9 4lc5/dEveLfzH6MAeEABek+Bo2Fg+xAoOwj+RoLws98DCdg6DA5Qg9mzIIM8uEEQWk+Ei6le A00YPRTSiYQhdGAMl9Y4jexPfCx0ngsjBcMTytCHNOyc6f9uSMHX7fBSPWzhD5UYxNKV74b8 W6FOtIYQKEZxghysXRJ1uEQuNpF8coFiEVV3RAltMXljPF0Zf2RALOYQjVns3fyI2EU4flF+ nqPjG423RhW6MUlSRFUNM2LFNIquj2fkYx0VeccCzjGAe/wdItuYQUD+UZBCfKIeLVlJTDox jJvMTSDNNUiMFHKRkowj8YCmtCm2cipUdFvOnPdKqcTSbjPLmNMsV8p35VJiuzRcL+31y4YF 023D7FcxGXZMuyWTYMs0WDP99syFRbNg0yxfNSN2zX9lUy7bxFg3/fXNjtzSb+Mkp88+aa50 4qucZQvnx9wZL3g6Tp4moye87Gn/Q3yyTJ/q4ich/SkzgMprnWBsp0HRJVBTEtRmVpzcwx5q JIpyip1ZOadWNAoUjmLFo0CzaKEw+lGRQoqkV2lTpLgnqkwuik6nOZSaTEoUlW5Gpi1FKUIl xB2ers9ULt1oCnmKU6DqdKJ76mlRgwNSysV0qcmh6VBUeimWGjWhGZXqS49KlaYilauw1KpQ g5pVsqpHrB1Fa0nNmlK1tpWtO3UkU906yavikVRgdRBdVcm8mcL1q1g9q20iyqq9dvVFiOVh ThP7ooY2krEbcuwUIYtYyXqSsiCyLCkxWyLNwoqznfUraC3k2WGNNrKiPe2FUqtaDrG2tSF6 LWxNJNvZkq6otraFEW5ze57SBou3sV0scOXjW2YNl7bCPW5vd6vc7BS3Ws0lLnOjK53ndou6 7LFuuwjLXe2W6bvgDa94x0ve8pr3vOhNr3rXy972uve98I2vfOdL3/ra9774za9+98vf/vr3 vwAOsIAHTOACG/jACE6wghfM4AY7+MEQjrCEJ0zhClv4whjOsIY3zOEObyQgADs= --------------D951F595041EA94BF034CEE4-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 11:37:58 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA10909; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:37:46 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 11:37:46 -0800 (PST) From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802111936.AA29040@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 98 10:04:27 -0500 To: Subject: Bifilar switch, Anton testing - Part II Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"MBq1n2.0.Lg2.7uVuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3769 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello Butch/All, Wound up a bifilar coil last nite and did some tests. Didn't find anything real suprising/conclusive, but did notice a couple points that may be of interest for other experimenters. First -- Here's what my coil is: - wire is #22 RadioShack solid core/plastic insulated - wound around 2" long nail [flush head] - winding is two #22 wires laid down in parallel. Used "modified" technique of winding -- wind one layer, straight run back to starting end, wind next layer.....so on. - about 48 or 49 windings for each wire [98 or so total windings] - 4 layers of 11-13 windings - liberal amounts of duct tape to hold layers in place - dimensions of coil = 1 3/4" long x 3/4" wide. - wires exit on either end -- not on same end like JNL labs. We'll call them winding A and winding B - A enters at one end and exits at other. B enters at same end as A and exits at other also. Power is 3 9V batteries wired in parallel. Single power source supplies both windings. Not the best supply, but it works. Will look into something more stable next, and try some other configurations. So here's some of the tests I tried - Nail core 1 - power to winding A only. Normal, but weak electromagnet with nail core - main part of strength seems to be along center of nail -- not end. - = S, + = N 2 - power to winding A and B with polarity reversed between A and B windings - very, very slight ferrite attraction along nail. See my notes at end of document -- I think it's influenced by unequal resistance between windings. Will need to check resistance to be sure. Air Core 1 - Power to winding A only. Magnetic field detectable with other magnets. - = S, + = N 2 - power to wind A and winding B with polarity reversed between A and B. No observable effect/interaction with other magnets. Cannot detect flux change [by feel only -- not at all accurate] with coil on vs coil off. [tried opposing and attracting magnets of differing strengths] Conclusion -- This is by no means scientific, but I cannot see any field or flux transfer changes from my bifilar coil. Nothing noticeable seems to happen -- Something like Quickfield is needed to model what happens to flux density and such. Notes: The one thing I learned is that when using a single power source for both windings [A & B], the winding with the least amount of resistance will get more of the current....and produce a more dominant field. While this seems obvious, it needs to be considered. I had all this on a breadboard, with my battery leads connecting to the A winding side first -- then I had jumpers over to the B winding [reversed polarity] to run it in parallel. This configuration produced a slight magnetic interaction from the coil -- with similar effects to powering just the A winding....this appears to be because the A winding has less resistance [due to jumpers to B coil]. When I modified the battery connects to where + terminated to the A coil, and - terminated to the B coil, the coil became magnetically benign. All for now. Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com [WK] arager@idcomm.com [HM] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 12:31:59 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA19014; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 12:31:35 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 12:31:35 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <53823016.34e20a10@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:29:02 EST To: arager@mcgraw-hill.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: New type of bifilar coil Content-type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"17pLU.0.ze4.agWuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3770 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Anton, and all Look at this and tell me what you think. It would be high amp but low resistance. I can't wait to see what the inductive time constant will be. Thanks, Butch On my web site, butch111.gif LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 14:13:49 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA03515; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:13:32 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 14:13:32 -0800 Message-ID: <34E22235.7AED06FB@microtronics.com.au> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 08:42:05 +1030 From: Greg Watson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: List Server Freenrg , List Server Newman , List Server Vortex Subject: Suggested Research Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"GRfKs2.0.Js.3AYuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3771 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi All, I am currently restrained from ANY comments on ANYTHING even close to my research. However I can still point you in a direction of something that is parallel and very interesting. Hyde claims in the body of the patent that his device produces 10 times more output than input. This is the strongest OU statement I have encountered in a US patent. My crude but developing, understanding of ZP fields suggests that his device might work. Jean-Louis has done work with electrostatics and should be able to build a test device. Please note that the claimed OU effect ONLY occurs at high rpm with very short duration electrostatic pulses which push past the NORMAL reaction time of the device. This is where a tie to my PMOD research comes in. Pushing systems past their reaction envelope (where, for a short time, cause & effect breaks down) may be what opens the door to a balancing energy input from the ZP field. Here are the links : 1) US patent 4,897,592 Http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=4897592 2) Tapping Zero-Point Energy (Last half contains an analysis of the Hyde device) Http://www.livelinks.com/sumeria/free/zpe3.html Best Regards, Greg From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 15:43:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA20574; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:42:43 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:42:43 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <68894aee.34e236c5@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:39:47 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Does one straight wire have self inductance? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"6Rxp02.0.H15.jTZuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3772 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi all, I was once told by a physics professor that a long straight wire had no self inductance, or back EMF. I disagree. Comments, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 15:44:24 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA30272; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:44:18 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 15:44:18 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3714.6CE40B80@pm3-120.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: RE: Biefield-Brown Effect Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:42:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD3714.6CED3340" Resent-Message-ID: <"xCLnh1.0.jO7.GVZuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3773 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD3714.6CED3340 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: Rick Monteverde[SMTP:monteverde@worldnet.att.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 1998 10:50 PM To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Biefield-Brown Effect Kyle - >That's funny, I just read one that claims that *NASA* doesn't exist. = Crazy >internet. You wouldn't happen to have the URL, would you? http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/WWW/PAO/html/warp/possible.htm >I find the spacetime properties on this list to be perfectly suitable, = and >have little interest in altering them. But I'd sure like to alter the = ones >in the vicinity of my benchtop, or better yet, in the vicinity of NASA! >- Rick Monteverde >Honolulu, HI Well, it seemed no one was interested in how to alter spacetime. I'm = actively trying to find a way using A-vector fields. Some of my ideas = include gyroscopic apparatus. I wish there were people interested in = this kind of thing. Kyle R. 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I'm >actively trying to find a way using A-vector fields. Some of my ideas >include gyroscopic apparatus. I wish there were people interested in >this kind of thing. > >Kyle R. Mcallister By all means -- If you get a working device -- publish, publish publish! After you invest heavily in the next Kentucky Derby, of course. Seriously, this list tends to center around F/E and O/U type stuff...now if you could combine the Biefeld-Brown Effect, Time/Space distortion, and free energy into one...............we would probably have lots of crossposting to keep up with ;) Perhaps you should try vortex-l for time/space type stuff. Another list that may be interested and/or provide good feedback is the antigravity list....although it seems to be almost dead now..... Here's the info if you want to subscribe: Vortex-L send message to majordomo@eskimo.com with the following text in the message body: subscribe vortex-l AntiGravity send message to majordomo@primenet.com with the following text in the message body: subscribe antigravity Good luck, Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 17:00:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA03477; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:00:36 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:00:36 -0800 (PST) From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802120058.AA25402@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 98 17:47:37 -0500 To: Subject: Bifilars for creating Longitudinal Waves? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"gs2xg2.0.Es.ocauq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3775 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello All, Ran across this link while looking for more info on bifilars...... http://www.wfu.edu/Academic-departments/Physics/demolabs/demos/3/3B204 5.html Seems that it was once an educational experiment that strung multiple bifilars [magnet cores?] across a frame. This configuration produced some sort of longitudinal waves....Any ideas how this works? It's probably nothing......How does the rest of the group read this? Anton Rager Denver, CO arager@Mcgraw-Hill.com [WK] arager@idcomm.com [HM] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 18:13:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA15591; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:12:50 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:12:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980212100938.006edb54@cyllene.uwa.edu.au> X-Sender: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:09:38 +0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: John Winterflood Subject: Re: Bifilars for creating Longitudinal Waves? In-Reply-To: <199802120058.AA25402@interlock.mgh.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"y4Jcu1.0.Wp3.Wgbuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3776 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Anton Rager wrote: >Ran across this link while looking for more info on bifilars...... > >http://www.wfu.edu/Academic-departments/Physics/demolabs/demos/3/3B2045.html > >Seems that it was once an educational experiment that strung multiple >bifilars [magnet cores?] across a frame. This configuration produced >some sort of longitudinal waves....Any ideas how this works? > > >It's probably nothing......How does the rest of the group read this? You're right, it's nothing! The "bifilar" refers to the fact that *two* threads are used to suspend each magnet. The permanent magnets so suspended interact with each other propagating the "longditudinal wave" of their swinging towards and away from each other! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 18:32:52 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA06718; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:32:01 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:32:01 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980212103034.006b41c0@cyllene.uwa.edu.au> X-Sender: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 10:30:34 +0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: John Winterflood Subject: Re: Does one straight wire have self inductance? In-Reply-To: <68894aee.34e236c5@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"D2q7X.0.re1.Wybuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3777 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch wrote: >Hi all, >I was once told by a physics professor that a long straight >wire had no self inductance, or back EMF. I disagree. >Comments, I agree with you, a wire has self inductance - simply because it produces magnetic field energy around it when current passes through it. Winding it into a coil increases this effect as the number of turns squared, but the effect is there with no additional turns (you have to have at least a single loop for current to be able to flow - but large sections of the loop can be straight). And where you have inductance, you also have "back EMF" - as the magnetic field collapses it produces an EMF which tries to prevent the current changing. The thinner the wire, the more inductance per unit length, and the less self capacitance per unit length (yes a wire also has self capacitance - you can place a finite charge on it and it sits at a finite voltage C=Q/V). From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 18:39:19 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA08992; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:39:02 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:39:02 -0800 Message-Id: <199802120239.SAA18921@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: Re[2]: Biefield-Brown Effect Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:44:16 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"zs8dd1.0.AC2.33cuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3778 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ---------- > From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re[2]: Biefield-Brown Effect > Date: Wednesday, February 11, 1998 2:01 PM > > Seriously, this list tends to center around F/E and O/U type > stuff...now if you could combine the Biefeld-Brown Effect, Time/Space > distortion, and free energy into one............... If Biefield-Brown sheilds or alters mass of, or gravity around a charged capacitor then a Biefiled-Brown "paddle-wheel" would give you all the free energy you want. If a bunch of very low leakage capacitors were charged up and arranged around such a wheel, those which were oriented negative side down would weight less, and as they rolled around to the other side of the wheel they'd be positive side down and, presumably, weigh more. So the heavy side of the paddle-wheel would keep on falling. In fact, if the capacitor plates were sealed in plastic to virtually prevent leakage one charge would last a long, long time. And the wheels just keep on turning..... --Gary. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 18:45:23 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA21217; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:44:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:44:19 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <21fb32c6.34e26150@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 21:41:18 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Does one straight wire have self inductance? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"_4WJq1.0.OB5._7cuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3779 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-11 21:35:56 EST, you write: << The thinner the wire, the more inductance per unit length, and the less self capacitance per unit length (yes a wire also has self capacitance - you can place a finite charge on it and it sits at a finite voltage C=Q/V). >> John, Thanks for the information! Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 18:53:36 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA14004; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:53:25 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:53:25 -0800 X-Sender: "Stefan Hartmann" X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Magnetic vortex whirlwind, magnetic tornado ? Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 03:53:35 +0100 Message-Id: <19980212035335.0cd512ad.in@pop3.vossnet.de> Resent-Message-ID: <"fCrv32.0.jQ3.YGcuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3780 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi, has anybody already experimented with trying to build a permanent magnetic vortex ? Maybe one can arrange permanent magnets this way to produce a permanent magnetic vortex field inside a plastic zylinder housing and try to see, if a rotor permanent magnet underneath the permanent magnet vortex stator will begin to spin ?? A few people I know witnessed a few years ago a very "weird" inventor showing somthing simular which really turned very fast, when spun up by hand and running perpetually. Unfortunately this inventor I was also in contact with disapeared and he never told us, how his magnetic turbine was running. Any idea how permanent magnets could be stacked to give a vortex field ? Maybe Quickfield simulation would help... Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 18:56:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA22931; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:56:14 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 18:56:14 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: "Stefan Hartmann" X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Magnetic vortex whirlwind, magnetic tornado ? Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 03:56:47 +0100 Message-Id: <19980212035647.0cd7fc15.in@pop3.vossnet.de> Resent-Message-ID: <"P0-3v3.0.Ac5.CJcuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3781 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi, has anybody already experimented with trying to build a permanent magnetic vortex ? Maybe one can arrange permanent magnets this way to produce a permanent magnetic vortex field inside a plastic zylinder housing and try to see, if a rotor permanent magnet underneath the permanent magnet vortex stator will begin to spin ?? A few people I know witnessed a few years ago a very "weird" inventor showing something simular which really turned very fast, when spun up by hand and running perpetually. Unfortunately this inventor I was also in contact with disapeared and he never told us, how his magnetic turbine was running. Any idea how permanent magnets could be stacked to give a vortex field ? Maybe Quickfield simulation would help... Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 19:56:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA01946; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 19:56:04 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 19:56:04 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <3e4417b9.34e271be@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:51:24 EST To: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Two straight wires? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"yjCac2.0._T.HBduq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3782 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com John, If two straight wires are ran side by side, almost touching, and the current in the wires is in opposite directions, do you think they would have any self inductance/back EMF. If so, would it be less than a single wire, same, or somewhere between? Would they cancel each other out, with respect to back EMF? Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 21:42:57 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA30666; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 21:42:46 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 21:42:46 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 21:22:44 -0500 Subject: Re: Special Relativity or Lorentz Relativity? Message-ID: <19980211.213742.3422.1.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <01BD3561.7F7955C0@oemcomputer> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-7,11-13,15-22 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"4XeFo.0.2V7.Kleuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3783 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Mon, 9 Feb 1998 13:49:08 -0600 "Kyle R. Mcallister" writes: > Anyone know where I can get a cheap neon sign transformer? > >Kyle R. Mcallister A co-worker of mine bought a "igniter" for a oil furnace. Probably lower voltage, but is designed to sustain a continious arc. They run about $35 new, may be able to get one "used" if you call a Heating/Cooling business. > ...A- vector fields are postulated to interact with the Zero-Point Flux. > According to theory, using an A field to interact with ZPF and coupled > with a magnetic field....etc. BTW, anyone have a good basic reference for A-fields. Steve Heckman _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 22:13:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA04486; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:13:35 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 22:13:35 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 21:56:22 -0500 Subject: Re: Biefield-Brown Effect Message-ID: <19980211.215805.3422.3.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <01BD3714.6CE40B80@pm3-120.gpt.infi.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-10,14-17,22-23,25-29 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"uyvxH3.0.u51.DCfuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3784 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Wed, 11 Feb 1998 17:42:27 -0600 "Kyle R. Mcallister" >Well, it seemed no one was interested in how to alter spacetime. I'm = >actively trying to find a way using A-vector fields. Some of my ideas >include gyroscopic apparatus. I wish there were people interested in = >this kind of thing. > >Kyle R. Mcallister > I am interested. But I am also scrambling to keep up with all the e-mail, running down sources, and just sorting out what I have and filling in the gaps. I have been planning to organize all my files and then fill in any gaps....hardly got started! Things like work, sleep and home repairs keep getting in the way! Downloaded one of Bearden's articles from Virtual Times (yes, Butch, it was one you mentioned, I saw it before but I decided to take a better look at the "regauging" idea)....I printed it out and it was 36 pages long (and I need to go back and get the footnotes!). It will take awhile to digest something that big. And I still need to somehow find time to prototype a hybrid smot using electromagnets! Steve Heckman _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 23:04:06 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA15205; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:03:46 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:03:46 -0800 Message-ID: <34E29EED.6D923150@ihug.co.nz> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:04:14 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Magnetic vortex whirlwind, magnetic tornado ? References: <19980212035647.0cd7fc15.in@pop3.vossnet.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Bru9n1.0.Sj3.Gxfuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3785 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I have always wanted a permanent magnet magnetized by a helical winding so that the field would spiral out of the poles causing magnets to rotate, but you can see the same effect in Minato and Peregrinus motors with out any special magnets. John Berry Stefan Hartmann wrote: > Hi, > > has anybody already experimented with trying to build > a permanent magnetic vortex ? > > Maybe one can arrange permanent magnets this way > to produce a permanent magnetic vortex field inside > a plastic zylinder housing and try to see, if a rotor permanent magnet > underneath the permanent magnet vortex stator will begin to spin ?? > > A few people I know witnessed a few years ago a very "weird" inventor > showing something simular which really turned very fast, when > spun up by hand and running perpetually. > Unfortunately this inventor I was also in contact with disapeared > and he never told us, how his magnetic turbine was running. > > Any idea how permanent magnets could be stacked to give a vortex > field ? Maybe Quickfield simulation would help... > > Regards, Stefan. > -- > Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann > Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany > Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 > email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com > Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 11 23:36:53 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA04850; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:36:00 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 23:36:00 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980212153413.006eedec@cyllene.uwa.edu.au> X-Sender: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:34:13 +0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: John Winterflood Subject: Re: Two straight wires? In-Reply-To: <3e4417b9.34e271be@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"kvXai.0.hB1.UPguq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3786 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch wrote: >If two straight wires are ran side by side, almost touching, and the current >in the wires is in opposite directions, do you think they would have any self >inductance/back EMF. If so, would it be less than a single wire, same, or >somewhere between? Would they cancel each other out, with respect to back EMF? Yes they would have some self inductance - due to the remaining magnetic field primarily between them. The closer you get them together, the less the inductance they have (and the more capacitance they have). It would be much less than a "single wire" considering that a single wire has to return somehow to complete the circuit. I seem to remember something about the inductance being proportional to the area of the loop around which the current flows (and to the number of turns squared). So if you want a big inductance - make the loop the size of your room. If you want it small, lay the wires side by side. If you put one conductor inside the other (ie as in shielded or coax cable) then all the magnetic field is contained in the gap between the inner and outer conductors and none escapes outside the cable sheath. Even in this case they have inductance. In fact the impedance of transmission lines formed by parallel side-by-side wires or by coaxial wires is determined from the ratio of the inductance to the capacitance per unit length. Thus if you want a high impedance cable (such as for a CRO lead to match a high impedance input) then you make the inner conductor as fine as possible compared to the gap between conductors. You get large inductance but minimum capacitance. If you go the other way - thick inner core with a very small gap to the sheath - then you get very small inductance (not much room for magnetic field) but large capacitance. Back EMF goes with the inductance. However when you start constructing transmission lines and terminating them correctly, then what might have appeared as a back EMF (pretty minute) when you apply a current to the end of a pair of parallel wires (transmission line) shorted at the far end, can be made to dissapear entirely by terminating the far end with the correct impedance. But we really are talking minute back EMF pulses here. I don't quite know what your application is - I haven't time to follow every thread here. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 00:34:10 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA09919; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:33:52 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:33:52 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 00:32:25 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802120832.AAA22275@italy.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Bifilar switch, Anton testing - Part II Resent-Message-ID: <"aYy5H3.0.uQ2.kFhuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3787 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Anton and Butch, At 10:04 AM 2/11/98 -0500, you wrote: > > Wound up a bifilar coil last nite and did some tests. Didn't find > anything real suprising/conclusive, but did notice a couple points > that may be of interest for other experimenters. > > First -- Here's what my coil is: > - wire is #22 RadioShack solid core/plastic insulated > - wound around 2" long nail [flush head] > - winding is two #22 wires laid down in parallel. Used "modified" > technique of winding -- wind one layer, straight run back to starting > end, wind next layer.....so on. > - about 48 or 49 windings for each wire [98 or so total windings] - 4 > layers of 11-13 windings > - liberal amounts of duct tape to hold layers in place > - dimensions of coil = 1 3/4" long x 3/4" wide. > - wires exit on either end -- not on same end like JNL labs. We'll > call them winding A and winding B - A enters at one end and exits at > other. B enters at same end as A and exits at other also. > > Power is 3 9V batteries wired in parallel. Single power source > supplies both windings. Not the best supply, but it works. Will look > into something more stable next, and try some other configurations. > The wire has a resistance of about 0.1 Ohm, so it will go good for you to find a AC supply. Current with 9 volt batteries is unknown. Something that can supply variable DC or variable current limit, solid state or as simple as a rheostat. > So here's some of the tests I tried - > > Nail core > 1 - power to winding A only. Normal, but weak electromagnet with nail > core - main part of strength seems to be along center of nail -- not > end. - = S, + = N > 2 - power to winding A and B with polarity reversed between A and B > windings - very, very slight ferrite attraction along nail. See my > notes at end of document -- I think it's influenced by unequal > resistance between windings. Will need to check resistance to be sure. > > Air Core > 1 - Power to winding A only. Magnetic field detectable with other > magnets. - = S, + = N > 2 - power to wind A and winding B with polarity reversed between A and > B. No observable effect/interaction with other magnets. Cannot detect > flux change [by feel only -- not at all accurate] with coil on vs coil > off. [tried opposing and attracting magnets of differing strengths] > > The best Simple detector I've found is a compass. You can see where the fields drop off to less that the earth's, way beyond where you can "feel" it. > Conclusion -- This is by no means scientific, but I cannot see any > field or flux transfer changes from my bifilar coil. Nothing > noticeable seems to happen -- Something like Quickfield is needed to > model what happens to flux density and such. > > Notes: The one thing I learned is that when using a single power > source for both windings [A & B], the winding with the least amount of > resistance will get more of the current....and produce a more dominant > field. While this seems obvious, it needs to be considered. I had > all this on a breadboard, with my battery leads connecting to the A > winding side first -- then I had jumpers over to the B winding > [reversed polarity] to run it in parallel. This configuration > produced a slight magnetic interaction from the coil -- with similar > effects to powering just the A winding....this appears to be because > the A winding has less resistance [due to jumpers to B coil]. When I > modified the battery connects to where + terminated to the A coil, and > - terminated to the B coil, the coil became magnetically benign. The best way to have the currents in both coils equal is to wire then in series. The 2 "starts" to the supply and the ends connected together. If you are talking Amps, clips are better than the white solderless breadboards. > All for now. > > Anton Rager > arager@McGraw-Hill.com [WK] > arager@idcomm.com [HM] > -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 01:18:39 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA01063; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:18:27 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:18:27 -0800 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:18:17 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802120918.BAA10071@germany.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Does one straight wire have self inductance? Resent-Message-ID: <"XZhVv1.0.NG.Wvhuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3788 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi John and all, At 10:30 AM 2/12/98 +0800, you wrote: >I agree with you, a wire has self inductance - simply because >it produces magnetic field energy around it when current >passes through it. Winding it into a coil increases this >effect as the number of turns squared, but the effect is >there with no additional turns (you have to have at least a >single loop for current to be able to flow - but large >sections of the loop can be straight). And where you have >inductance, you also have "back EMF" - as the magnetic field >collapses it produces an EMF which tries to prevent the >current changing. > >The thinner the wire, the more inductance per unit length, and >the less self capacitance per unit length (yes a wire also has >self capacitance - you can place a finite charge on it and it >sits at a finite voltage C=Q/V). Yes this inductance, capacitance per unit length made it hard for me to understand how to get faster than light propagation on a wire "transmission" line- Milne experiments. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 01:18:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA01107; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:18:36 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:18:36 -0800 Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 01:18:24 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802120918.BAA10090@germany.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Two straight wires? Resent-Message-ID: <"oQW5h3.0.8H.evhuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3789 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Butch, At 10:51 PM 2/11/98 EST, you wrote: >John, >If two straight wires are ran side by side, almost touching, and the current >in the wires is in opposite directions, do you think they would have any self >inductance/back EMF. If so, would it be less than a single wire, same, or >somewhere between? Would they cancel each other out, with respect to back EMF? >Thanks, >Butch > Between the wires the fields ADD. It is like a hairpin coil. So, Yes, there is inductance, more than a single wire, not a loop. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 11:13:55 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA27070; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:12:32 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:12:32 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: bfox@istar.ca (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Byrun Fox Subject: Re: Bifilars for creating Longitudinal Waves? Message-Id: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:12:34 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <"7IHWn.0.qc6.Ocquq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3790 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Anton: I tried to get the Bifilar page at WFU but your address didn't work for me. Could you double check it. Thanks, Byrun. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 11:18:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA28175; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:18:13 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 11:18:13 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <76a30386.34e34a79@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:16:07 EST To: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Two straight wires? What I'm trying to do Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"7xbwI3.0.5u6.nhquq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3791 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-12 02:36:21 EST, you write: << I don't quite know what your application is >> John, What I'm trying to do is design a configuration of wires that produces a large magnetic field/fields that allow the configuration to be pulled to a permanent magnet but in the process of moving to the permanent magnet develope as LITTLE as possible back EMF. Also, as the current builds up in the wire configuration, produce as LITTLE back EMF as possible. Take a look, if you have time, at my web site and the last two drawings will give you an idea of what I am trying to do. LaFonte Generator Home Page I tried using bifilar coils but, the permanent magnet would not attract the coil when both circuits had current flowing. I am trying to design an on/off magnetic switch that doesn't use more energy as the switch on and off duration for a given force, becomes shorter. The faster the switch on/off duration, (for a given force) the less or same amount of energy, not greater energy use as switch speed goes up. Thanks for all your help, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 14:45:46 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA00797; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:45:24 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 14:45:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34E37ADD.3E074C31@microtronics.com.au> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:12:37 +1030 From: Greg Watson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: List Server Freenrg CC: List Server Vortex Subject: Re: Suggested Research References: <3.0.1.32.19980212163055.006d8e40@pd.uwa.edu.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Yb_QI.0.HC._jtuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3792 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com John Winterflood wrote: > > Hal Puthoff wrote: > > > >A very knowledgeable experimenter I know built the Hyde device with great > >attention to detail and it did not work. Even Moray King, who first brought > >the Hyde device to everyone's attention several years ago, has not been able > >to verify that it works. So I would not take this as a solid stake in the > >ground. > > Thanks Hal. That is the sort of information we need to save wasting > everybodies time. If Moray King has not been able to verify it one > wonders where he gets the "private communication" references from > (see end of his "Tapping Zero Point Energy" paper). I suppose > he just took Mr Hyde at his word. I wonder if there is a second > witness anywhere else in the world willing to back up Mr Hyde's > word? Anyone know? > > I seem to remember someone important saying something about truth > being established "at the mouth of two or three (independent) > witnesses". That is what we badly need for these overunity claims. > If there was a second witness to Greg's rollaround it would be > wonderful but I failed to find one (I tried Epitaxy but he never > responded). One would think that it would have been so simple > for some independent person who lived near to have dropped by > to be able to say "no wires, nowhere really to hide a battery, > and yes it goes around and around!" I can't understand why Greg > got shirty when it was suggested that someone else took a look. > But then neither could many of us understand why he was apparently > so open about it in the first place. Altogether a strange chapter > in the book of FE. While Epitaxy was the only rollaround verification, there are several rollaway verifications. As to my getting shity, that is not the case. To achieve a very large capital injection, I approached 3 local people who I thought I knew and could work with. A letter of agreement was created and signed to form the first link in a series of events which would result on the formation of a Non-Profit Research company (DMEC). I believed the process would only take a few weeks. To make a now long story short, things haven't gone well. My goals and those of the investors are not working out the same. DMEC still hasn't been formed and I have been told I will get a restraining order placed on me if I break the terms of the agreement. The agreement becomes void in May. If DMEC moves ahead, the SMOTs will ship, if not, they will ship in May and Hal's will be delivered in person. > Incidentally if you take a look at the Hyde patent and the circuit > supposedly for "multiplying current conducted .. while reducing > potentials" then it seems he didn't have much of a clue about how > diodes and capacitors work when interconnected. Unless there is > some accidental stray inductance having some effect of which he > seems unaware, then I would guess that he could have replaced his > 12 diodes and 6 capacitors per stator plate pair (~2000 capacitors > and diodes according to King) with a bridge rectifier per pair and > a single capacitor for the whole lot. Believe that would eliminate the effect King discusses in his paper. > This is not something that > inspires my confidence in Mr Hyde's prowess! So what if Hyde is not a electrical engineer or maybe he found that the circuit worked better than a bridge for his needs. My point in bringing up the device was to show a direction of research which runs parallel to the nanosecond PMOD and ties into Newman with his very large inductance coils with their many seconds of CRT. Two way energy conversions systems have what I call a CRT (Critical Reaction Time). This I define as the time it takes for the system to reflect a change in the load condition back to the source and for the source to react and resupply the load with more / less power. This time is finite and varies with the dynamics of the system. It appears that when you push a two way conversion system beyond its CRT (in most cases, you have to design for this to happen) you may open the door to balancing energy input from the ZP field as cause and effect breakdown. > Thanks again Hal, I have asked Hal for details of the Hyde replication. Sometimes when we replicate, we improve. > John Winterflood Greg From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 15:43:10 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA10947; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:43:03 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:43:03 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:38:06 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: (From Butch) Take a look at this, this could be it! Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"DA43L2.0.xg2.3auuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3793 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi all, Take a look on my web site at my new design. I'm typing operational description and it should be on site in 2 hours. The drawing is there now. Look how the coil goes all the way around the stator and any current generated by the rotor is distributed around the stator in an even fashion. No drag or repulsion force is local to the rotor. I like to think this is getting pretty darn close, if not already there! Comments after discription, please. Thanks, Butch LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 15:49:06 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA08457; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:48:51 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:48:51 -0800 Message-ID: <34E38A1A.465EABCD@microtronics.com.au> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 10:17:38 +1030 From: Greg Watson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: List Server Freenrg CC: List Server Vortex Subject: Simple Experiment Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"DQJhg.0.y32.Yfuuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3794 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi All, Here is a real simple experiment. You will need : 1) Large inductance air core inductor with high resistance (Borrow a large coil of fine wire). 2) Small Battery. 3) 100 Ohm resistor. 4) Ferrite / Steel Rod. 5) Some hookup wire. 6) Switch. 7) Foam pad. Setup : 1) Place foam pad on bench with coil on top and hole upward. 2) Connect battery, switch, resistor and coil in series, in this order. 3) Connect free battery terminal to free coil terminal. 4) Connect a short length of hookup wire from one of the coil connections to near the other to allow the coil to be shorted. What to do : Test 1 1) Connect battery to coil (no rod) through resistor for 30 seconds. 2) Short coil together and observe size and duration of spark. Test 2 3) Repeat step 1. 4) Drop the rod into the centre of the coil. 5) At the instant the rod hits bottom, short coil and observe size and duration of spark. Test 3 6) Repeat step 1. 7) Short the coil. 8) Repeat step 4. 9) At the instant the rod hits bottom, release coil short and observe size and duration of spark. If you think that the size and duration of the spark is the same in all of the 3 tests, YOU should really do this test. If you have a Hall effect sensor handy, watch what happens to the flux density. Greg From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 15:53:12 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA12543; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:52:58 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 15:52:58 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <01BD37DE.9F2C7440@pm3-123.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: Vortex-l Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 17:49:51 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ttIMV1.0.t33.Njuuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3795 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greetings: How do I get on the Vortex-L list? I tried the majordomo@eskimo.com, but it didn't work. Kyle Randall Mcallister Email: stk@sunherald.infi.net Phone: 228-875-0629 Fax: 228-872-5837 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 16:15:00 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA16306; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:14:52 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:14:52 -0800 Message-ID: <34E39032.6DD9F4A0@microtronics.com.au> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 10:43:38 +1030 From: Greg Watson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: (From Butch) Take a look at this, this could be it! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"tGOkK3.0.e-3.v1vuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3796 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > > Hi all, > Take a look on my web site at my new design. I'm typing operational > description and it should be on site in 2 hours. The drawing is there now. > Look how the coil goes all the way around the stator and any current generated > by the rotor is distributed around the stator in an even fashion. No drag or > repulsion force is local to the rotor. I like to think this is getting pretty > darn close, if not already there! > Comments after discription, please. > Thanks, > Butch Hi Butch, Look interesting. I will do some indepth thinking and get back to you. Greg From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 16:45:22 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA20718; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:44:46 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 16:44:46 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: "Stefan Hartmann" X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Re: Watson4s Research Cc: gwatson@microtronics.com.au Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 01:47:17 +0100 Message-Id: <19980213014717.1187ccb9.in@pop3.vossnet.de> Resent-Message-ID: <"9qeQ9.0.a35.qTvuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3797 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com >> I seem to remember someone important saying something about truth >> being established "at the mouth of two or three (independent) >> witnesses". That is what we badly need for these overunity claims. >> If there was a second witness to Greg's rollaround it would be >> wonderful but I failed to find one (I tried Epitaxy but he never >> responded). One would think that it would have been so simple >> for some independent person who lived near to have dropped by >> to be able to say "no wires, nowhere really to hide a battery, >> and yes it goes around and around!" I can't understand why Greg >> got shirty when it was suggested that someone else took a look. >> But then neither could many of us understand why he was apparently >> so open about it in the first place. Altogether a strange chapter >> in the book of FE. > >While Epitaxy was the only rollaround verification, there are several >rollaway verifications. > Yes, but Epitaxy did disappear ! That is true ! >As to my getting shity, that is not the case. > >To achieve a very large capital injection, I approached 3 local people >who I thought I knew and could work with. A letter of agreement was >created and signed to form the first link in a series of events which >would result on the formation of a Non-Profit Research company (DMEC). > >I believed the process would only take a few weeks. > >To make a now long story short, things haven't gone well. Always told you that...too many individuals involved who will control you... > >My goals and those of the investors are not working out the same. DMEC >still hasn't been formed and I have been told I will get a restraining >order placed on me if I break the terms of the agreement. > >The agreement becomes void in May. > >If DMEC moves ahead, the SMOTs will ship, if not, they will ship in May >and Hal's will be delivered in person. You should have shipped the SMOTs long ago. Each of us on the list would have tinkered with it til a few would have got it to work and you would now be a very well known man by now... Now it is too late. Please refund the money, if it will not ship until 1st March. >Greg > -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 18:00:50 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA16175; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:00:34 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 18:00:34 -0800 Message-ID: <34E3A9CB.94245144@dcache.net> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 21:02:51 -0500 From: "James J. Jiamachello" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Vortex-l X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <01BD37DE.9F2C7440@pm3-123.gpt.infi.net> Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_ntmo.0.Wy3._awuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3798 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Kyle R. Mcallister wrote:
Greetings:

How do I get on the Vortex-L list? I tried the majordomo@eskimo.com, but it didn't work.

Kyle Randall Mcallister
Email: stk@sunherald.infi.net
Phone: 228-875-0629
Fax: 228-872-5837

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   Jim From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 19:23:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA17222; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:23:29 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 19:23:29 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3e4417b9.34e271be@aol.com> References: Conversation <3e4417b9.34e271be@aol.com> with last message <3e4417b9.34e271be@aol.com> Priority: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Scott Fureman" Subject: Re: Two straight wires? Date: Thu, 12 Feb 98 22:22:17 PST Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; X-MAPIextension=".TXT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"j7Edg1.0.yC4.loxuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3799 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > If two straight wires are ran side by side, almost touching, and the current > in the wires is in opposite directions, do you think they would have any self > inductance/back EMF. If so, would it be less than a single wire, same, or > somewhere between? Would they cancel each other out, with respect to back EMF? They will cancel each other. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 20:15:47 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA18724; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:15:23 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:15:23 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980213121434.006b7a8c@cyllene.uwa.edu.au> X-Sender: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:14:34 +0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: John Winterflood Subject: Re: Suggested Research In-Reply-To: <34E37ADD.3E074C31@microtronics.com.au> References: <3.0.1.32.19980212163055.006d8e40@pd.uwa.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"3cG9S2.0.Oa4.PZyuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3800 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greg wrote: >As to my getting shity, that is not the case. I thought I used a gentler word - "shirty", but I guess it is slang and can't be sure what it means for others. >... if not, they will ship in May >and Hal's will be delivered in person. That will be great if that happens - your offer did not go amiss Hal! >> Incidentally if you take a look at the Hyde patent and the circuit >> supposedly for "multiplying current conducted .. while reducing >> potentials" then it seems he didn't have much of a clue about how >> diodes and capacitors work when interconnected. Unless there is >> some accidental stray inductance having some effect of which he >> seems unaware, then I would guess that he could have replaced his >> 12 diodes and 6 capacitors per stator plate pair (~2000 capacitors >> and diodes according to King) with a bridge rectifier per pair and >> a single capacitor for the whole lot. > >Believe that would eliminate the effect King discusses in his paper. > >> This is not something that >> inspires my confidence in Mr Hyde's prowess! > >So what if Hyde is not a electrical engineer ... Well I don't think it takes an engineer to see that 3 capacitors in parallel (100,86,106) can be replaced by 1 larger one. And two diodes in parallel (108,104) can be replaced with a single one. And these two diodes which are sitting across the 3 capacitors are apparently reversed biassed at all times and so can probably be deleted. Similarly although not so certainly if the supply/load situation on these capacitors is reasonable then diode 88 and its diagonal partner could be forward biassed at all times allowing them both (and the other two 90 and diagonal partner) to be deleted. At which point in time you are left with a bridge rectifier (32A,32B, 34A,34B) for each stator pair, and one capacitor (38A/B) shared between all stators. If these changes do eliminate the effect King discusses in his paper, then the means of generating the effect is not properly described in the patent. >...or maybe he found that the >circuit worked better than a bridge for his needs. In which case he should have investigated and described how he coiled the connecting leads (making some stray inductance) or whatever to cause 3 parallel capacitors to behave so differently to a single one of equivalent capacity, etc. >Two way energy conversions systems have what I call a CRT (Critical >Reaction Time). This I define as the time it takes for the system to >reflect a change in the load condition back to the source and for the >source to react and resupply the load with more / less power. This time >is finite and varies with the dynamics of the system. It appears that >when you push a two way conversion system beyond its CRT (in most cases, >you have to design for this to happen) you may open the door to >balancing energy input from the ZP field as cause and effect breakdown. I am inclined to think you might be right. Not that easy to engineer though, particularly when one has no time to fiddle and build as I would love to! Thanks for hearing your voice again Greg! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 20:38:57 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA23349; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:38:52 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:38:52 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980213123813.006f6ab0@cyllene.uwa.edu.au> X-Sender: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:38:13 +0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: John Winterflood Subject: Re: Two straight wires? What I'm trying to do In-Reply-To: <76a30386.34e34a79@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"cWMa53.0.ji5.Rvyuq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3801 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch wrote: >What I'm trying to do is design a configuration of wires that produces a large >magnetic field/fields that allow the configuration to be pulled to a permanent >magnet but in the process of moving to the permanent magnet develope as LITTLE >as possible back EMF. Also, as the current builds up in the wire >configuration, produce as LITTLE back EMF as possible. Unfortunatly it seems to me you are trying to do the equivalent of producing a force with no equal and opposite reaction. It may be possible, but I don't know how. >...I tried using bifilar coils but, the permanent magnet >would not attract the coil when both circuits had current flowing. I'm not surprised - a well cancelling bifilar coil produces almost no magnetic field - hence no force (I don't know anything about "scalar magnetic fields" - to me "scalar" and "magnetic" are contradicting terms). >I am trying >to design an on/off magnetic switch that doesn't use more energy as the switch >on and off duration for a given force, becomes shorter. The faster the switch >on/off duration, (for a given force) the less or same amount of energy, not >greater energy use as switch speed goes up. I can't see a problem in principle here. In principle switches need use no energy and compared to the resistive losses in coils etc are usually rather efficient. There has been some discussion here recently on fast switching using FETs. I believe Greg Watson had a couple of circuits up on his web page which were pretty quick and switched some amps of current. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 20:46:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA00384; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:46:35 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 20:46:35 -0800 (PST) From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <84afdac8.34e3cfbc@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 23:44:42 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Two straight wires? What I'm trying to do Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"GnMvd3.0.s5.f0zuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3802 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-12 14:23:26 EST, you write: << What I'm trying to do is design a configuration of wires that produces a large magnetic field/fields that allow the configuration to be pulled to a permanent magnet but in the process of moving to the permanent magnet develope as LITTLE as possible back EMF >> Butch, While this is an understandable objective, conventional theory says something like the following: put your wires in any configuration you wish, for each tiny length of wire the force on the wire from the magnet is iL x B where this is a vector cross product, i is the current. L the tiny length of wire, and B the B field at the point. Now IF there is motion in the direction of the force the back EMF generated is v x B. So without being real rigorous here the mechanical work done is the power iLBv, (v here the velocity the little length moves in the direction of the force), while the electrical power the source that is providing i must provide is i x back EMF, or i times v times B per unit length or iLBv. If I understand your proposal this unfortunate equality does not make it appear promising. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 12 21:00:21 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA02059; Thu, 12 Feb 1998 21:00:02 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 21:00:02 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 1998 21:56:43 -0700 (MST) From: Steve Ekwall X-Sender: ekwall2@november To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Vortex-l/HTML? In-Reply-To: <34E3A9CB.94245144@dcache.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"Krlzc1.0.2W.FDzuq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3803 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi vorts & butch (yours are 1/2 & 1/2) and all...(lot's of others) -snip-snip-snip- On Thu, 12 Feb 1998, James J. Jiamachello wrote: > Kyle R. Mcallister wrote: >
Vortex-L subscription instructions: >

   Jim > I've seen a lot of people sending MAIL here that appears on my pine mailer as just "cannot display" try view/save. When I try view/save it says cannot display HTML text! So EVRYONE IN THE WORLD HAS A BROWSER?. humm. Is this a NEW thing for browsers? Is it important what your sending?? If it is only recieved as 3 lines stating can't display, I DELETE it and go on. Just note:d (pine-users) if you reply the HTML APPEARS, if your 'include message byte is set'... and looks really like homepage coding. I've seen about fifty of these go by now and thought they were typo's or aborted messages with more to follow.. Anyway to just hand-type 'em in?... or set your ascii to ascii and NOT an HTML OUTPUT??? Everyone in the world doesn't use whatever it is YOUR using!! :):) "This message I'm replying to was on how to join..." I DIDN'T KNOW that until I replied then filtered the HTML coding...looked EMPTY to ME. Oddly, I tend to DELETE empty mail on-the-fly without thinking about what junk may be buried deep within. anyway..whomever.. send 1 e-mail to http://vortex-l-request@eskimo.com with subscribe in subject area... reverse with 'unsubscribe' in header to quit. I plan to still DELETE 'em in the FUTURE when I see a message I can't display.. so don't try to get me to UPDATE to microsick2002 yet. Try keyboard ASCII and *NOT* some super-duper FONT Enhancing Program for a world-wide list. (some people haven't bought this months computer yet:) Off my soap-box BLUE SKIES TO ALL -=se=- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 00:06:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA27160; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 00:06:38 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 00:06:38 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 00:05:08 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802130805.AAA29444@denmark.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Simple Experiment Resent-Message-ID: <"wSMN41.0.Ee6.Cy_uq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3804 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Greg and all, Can you give more details of your setup? If your coil much larger? I do not see sparks with mine: Battery : 12 volts. Resistor, 100 Ohms, thus short circuit current = 120 mA Coil: 2400 turns #24 A.W.G. (about 0.5mm diameter) Inner diameter (bore), 35mm Resistance 35 Ohms At 10:17 AM 2/13/98 +1030, you wrote: >Hi All, > >Here is a real simple experiment. > >You will need : > > 1) Large inductance air core inductor with high resistance (Borrow a >large coil of fine wire). > > 2) Small Battery. > > 3) 100 Ohm resistor. > > 4) Ferrite / Steel Rod. > > 5) Some hookup wire. > > 6) Switch. > > 7) Foam pad. > > >Setup : > > 1) Place foam pad on bench with coil on top and hole upward. > > 2) Connect battery, switch, resistor and coil in series, in this order. > > 3) Connect free battery terminal to free coil terminal. > > 4) Connect a short length of hookup wire from one of the coil >connections to near the other to allow the coil to be shorted. > > >What to do : > >Test 1 > > 1) Connect battery to coil (no rod) through resistor for 30 seconds. > Steady state current ~90mA. Voltage across coil +3 Volts. > 2) Short coil together and observe size and duration of spark. > Voltage across wire switch +3 Volts Initial current in wire (calculated) = I(battery)-I(coil) = 120-90 = 30mA Final current = 120mA Shorting a 3V, 30mA source is hardly conclusive for a spark, especially on a clean "make". I see none. Even with a large, high resistance coil, I see a current not larger than 120 mA at 12 volts. >Test 2 > > 3) Repeat step 1. > > 4) Drop the rod into the centre of the coil. > > 5) At the instant the rod hits bottom, short coil and observe size and >duration of spark. > I assume the inductance increases with the steel rod, which would increase the coil voltage and decrease the current. There is the time for the rod to fall, as well as the inductive time constant, these are interacting. Even if the inductance increases very fast, I think the voltage will be limited to 12 volts (No coil current flow). I see no spark. Using a scope, I see the voltage increase from 3.0 to 3.2 volt in approx. 0.1 sec, faster than my reflexes. If I don't hit the "Peak 3.2 volts", I will see the 3 volts as in test 1. Not much difference. > >Test 3 > > 6) Repeat step 1. > > 7) Short the coil. > Max current through short 120mA. Coil current = 0. > 8) Repeat step 4. > > 9) At the instant the rod hits bottom, release coil short and observe >size and duration of spark. > Upon opening, Coil current = 0. (My steel bar is not magnetized.) Current interrupted = 120mA. For 0 current, voltage across open = 12 volts = V(Battery)- voltage drop across resistor (0). The coil current will build up to 90 mA with its and R time constant. Opening a 12 volt, 120mA supply will not produce a large spark. I see none. Estimate rise time = 0.02 sec, thus coil inductance = 2H. Of course interrupting the coil current produces an arc at 120 mA. Enough voltage for a good shock. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 00:20:39 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA00475; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 00:20:34 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 00:20:34 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <74a1cb53.34e40247@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 03:20:21 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: For the record, my design, (Butch) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_887358021_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"hx9Qg.0.K7.G90vq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3805 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_887358021_boundary Content-ID: <0_887358021@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Hi all, Here is an attached file for those who would like a copy you can down load. LAFONTE NON-CONCENTRIC ROTOR/STATOR, O/U GENERATOR If you have had any trouble downloading my GIF files before, just hit your delete button. Text will be put on web site 2/13/98. 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7uz5M+jQokeTjmn4buTLjRWf5ZxarmWSrllzvMh5duncunfz7u37d9LgqIUfpry0rsTGmY2/ vKw6+OaMeIFTr279OvbsJo8PJwp7rVO1x203XzwZvPT02tezb+/+/WfJC08XFy88qmLuKJfT Rt9w6nTwCTgggQUa2BR/80Wm3HKQMUZQg5kxKGGCiU3oUoIQKvcYg94d+CGIIYo4Ioklmngi iimquCKLLbr4IowxyjgjjTXaeCOOOeq4ESOPPfr4I5BBCjkkkUXuFBAAADs= --part0_887358021_boundary-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 04:38:19 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA30287; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 04:38:14 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 04:38:14 -0800 Message-ID: <34E43E5E.FEA6A929@pavilion.co.uk> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:36:48 +0000 From: Robert Dowse Reply-To: redesign@pavilion.co.uk X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Suggested Research References: <3.0.1.32.19980212163055.006d8e40@pd.uwa.edu.au> <34E37ADD.3E074C31@microtronics.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bU96X1.0.8P7.qw3vq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3806 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greg Watson wrote: > To make a now long story short, things haven't gone well. > > My goals and those of the investors are not working out the same. > Greg Greg, Hal Putoff and Scott Little (if I recall correctly) both offered you contacts with investors upon your production of a working SMOT. This should have been very easy, why did you not do it? Their contacts appeared to be offering what seemed VERY favorable conditions several months ago. The last SMOT claim you made on this list suggested there was a 15:1 asymmetry in roll through direction. I did the test, reported back a maximum of circa 2:1 and you responded that you had forgotten how you obtained the 15:1 ratio. Fizzzzzz.....! You must be a fraud or very stupid. Please show us all that I am wrong! Your credibility is at an all time low. Please wake up. If you genuinely do have something it will die if you persist in your small time ways. The laws of physics do not need restraining orders from pea brained 'shirts' to be fit for others to know! (BTW it was shirty not shitty.) Yours in good faith, (I am NOT trying to insult you, I just cringe when I read your posts these days) Rob Dowse. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 05:16:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA24636; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 05:16:31 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 05:16:31 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: "Stefan Hartmann" X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: redesign@pavilion.co.uk, freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Re: Suggested Research Cc: gwatson@microtronics.com.au Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:14:24 +0100 Message-Id: <19980213141424.1433cd66.in@pop3.vossnet.de> Resent-Message-ID: <"zGQwS.0.r06.iU4vq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3807 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 12:36 13.02.1998 +0000, redesign@pavilion.co.uk wrote: >Greg Watson wrote: > >> To make a now long story short, things haven't gone well. >> >> My goals and those of the investors are not working out the same. >> Greg > > >Greg, > >Hal Putoff and Scott Little (if I recall correctly) both offered you contacts >with investors upon your production of a working SMOT. This should have been >very easy, why did you not do it? Their contacts appeared to be offering what >seemed VERY favorable conditions several months ago. > >The last SMOT claim you made on this list suggested there was a 15:1 asymmetry >in roll through direction. I did the test, reported back a maximum of circa >2:1 and you responded that you had forgotten how you obtained the 15:1 ratio. Fizzzzzz.....! > >You must be a fraud or very stupid. Please show us all that I am wrong! Your >credibility is at an all time low. Please wake up. I must agree. Please Greg wake up and prove us wrong... I also can not belive you have something and never published any photos of it and only used Jean Louis SMOT ANIMATION GIF instead.... If I would have a selfrunning device I would post it all over the Internet ! Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 06:05:01 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA10292; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 06:04:56 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 06:04:56 -0800 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <5b2e97dc.34e452dc@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 09:04:10 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, gwatson@microtronics.com.au Cc: harti@harti.com, mrandall@earthlink.net, WBahmann@compuserve.com, Puthoff@aol.com, ddameron@earthlink.net, Adolf.Schneider@ascom.ch Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re : Re: Suggested Research Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 116 Resent-Message-ID: <"jjqPg1.0.eW2.7C5vq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3808 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On 13/02/1998 15:17:18 , you wrote : << >You must be a fraud or very stupid. Please show us all that I am wrong! Your >credibility is at an all time low. Please wake up. I must agree. Please Greg wake up and prove us wrong... I also can not belive you have something and never published any photos of it and only used Jean Louis SMOT ANIMATION GIF instead.... If I would have a selfrunning device I would post it all over the Internet ! Regards, Stefan. -- >> Hi Greg, Greg, we are very few people and today, we are pionners in this kind of researches, it is time to work TOGETHER and SHARE our knowledge about this fascinating domain of physic. I think that this is the only way today for reaching our COMMON purpose.... We can help you IF you play with us "the game of the truth".... Please SHOWS US OUR DEVICES RUNNING and not only the mine..... Don't fly alone.....You may have another chance, today.... Sincerely, Jean-Louis Naudin (France) 13/02/98 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 06:14:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA02171; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 06:14:01 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 06:14:01 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802131413.MAA26486@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: Huh ? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:16:06 -3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Two straight wires? Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: <3e4417b9.34e271be@aol.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Resent-Message-ID: <"1IySP.0.pX.eK5vq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3809 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > Priority: Normal > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > From: "Scott Fureman" > Subject: Re: Two straight wires? > Date: Thu, 12 Feb 98 22:22:17 PST > Reply-to: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > > If two straight wires are ran side by side, almost touching, and the > current > > in the wires is in opposite directions, do you think they would have any > self > > inductance/back EMF. If so, would it be less than a single wire, same, or > > somewhere between? Would they cancel each other out, with respect to back > EMF? > > They will cancel each other. > Actually, they almost cancel each other. You allways remains with some residual inductance. I would like to see a coil geometry that totally cancel the inductance. My guess is that two parallel wires will totally cancel the inductance ONLY if they share the same physical space... Maybe that flat-cable coil idea ? Marcelo From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 08:23:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA07693; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:23:19 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 08:23:19 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802131623.AA06761@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 98 09:15:39 -0500 To: Subject: Re[2]: Vortex-l/HTML? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LpfQC1.0.5u1.rD7vq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3810 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello All, I'm with Steve on this one -- please folks -- turn off HTML in your mailer. Lots of use don't use a HMTL capable mailer.....so your posts are almost un-readable. Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 13:11:55 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA13991; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:11:37 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:11:37 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:09:38 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: New split coil design for non-concentric rotor/stator (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"kyYnX.0.VQ3._RBvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3811 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com See web site for new split coil design, text being typed, almost finished, theory at this point only! Thanks, Butch LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 13:33:10 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA12501; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:33:00 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 13:33:00 -0800 Message-ID: <34E4BA62.8075CD86@idt.net> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:25:54 -0500 From: Josef Katz X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Biefield-Brown Effect References: <199802120029.QAA02597@mx1.eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Nrq4x1.0.833.9mBvq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3812 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Can someone tell me exactly what the A-field is? is this like scalars? I know what E and B fields are, but I've only heard vauge references to the A-field. thanks -joey katz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 14:07:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA24722; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:07:26 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:07:26 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD3899.338A5F20@pm3-147.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: Jean Louis: Motor Idea Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 16:05:26 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id OAA24638 Resent-Message-ID: <"53q5N2.0.r16.LGCvq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3813 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greetings all: Jean Louis: I have an idea on how to make the 'quantum magnetic motor' work. Try making a ring of magnets around the rotor, with the rotor magnets repelling from the ring interior. Leave a gap in the magnet ring on both ends, but not at the same position on both ends . This will make the fields unbalanced on the device, and either: A. Make it more efficient B. Make it self running Good luck! Kyle Randall Mcallister Email: stk@sunherald.infi.net Phone: 228-875-0629 Fax: 228-872-5837 P.S.: To whoever let me know about the "Black Hole", thank you! I can purchase a 4.3 liter dewar for $37. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 15:21:29 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA07165; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:20:41 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:20:41 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802132319.VAA09080@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: Huh ? To: John Berry Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 21:21:39 -3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Two straight wires? Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br CC: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Priority: normal In-reply-to: <34E457A6.A8F7D6E0@ihug.co.nz> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Resent-Message-ID: <"maQMY2.0.hl1.qKDvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3814 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > What about a coax? > > Marcelo Puhl wrote: > > > My guess is that two parallel wires will totally cancel the inductance ONLY if > > they share the same physical space... > > Well, the two fields generated by the inner and the outer conductor will cancel only in the space between the two conductors. The external field won't be nullified. This way I think we still have inductance. But my theory can be wrong, of course. Marcelo From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 15:21:39 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA07346; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:21:23 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:21:23 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802132319.VAA09087@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: Huh ? To: KeelyNet-L@lists.kz, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 20:08:23 -3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: DeVree ? Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Resent-Message-ID: <"i7ERV2.0.ho1.jLDvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3815 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Any news from Mr. DeVree and his invention ? Marcelo From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 15:58:05 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA13357; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:57:51 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:57:51 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34E5076F.7867@tiac.net> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:54:39 -0800 From: Bob Shannon Organization: Fair at best X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Watson4s Research References: <19980213014717.1187ccb9.in@pop3.vossnet.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jn3mb1.0.ZG3.utDvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3816 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Stefan Hartmann wrote: > >If DMEC moves ahead, the SMOTs will ship, if not, they will ship in May > >and Hal's will be delivered in person. > > You should have shipped the SMOTs long ago. > Each of us on the list would have tinkered with it til a few > would have got it to work and you would now be a very well known > man by now... > > Now it is too late. Please refund the money, if it will not ship until > 1st March. Personally, I'd wait it out. Depending on the laws in your country, you may have a very valid 'prior claim' to Greg's work. You had a valid contract in force prior to the formation of DMEC. This may greatly complicate DMEC's commercial options. The people envolved in DMEC may well be aware of this, and may well wish that everyone will choose to cancel their orders leaving the way clear for their (DMEC's) commercial goals. If you waited this long, wait a bit longer. Don't give up now, its probably just what DMEC wants to see happen to the prior contracts. If you need the cash, you might think about making an offer to sell your sales aggrement to someone who can afford to wait it out. Remember that Greg freely entered into valid sales contracts prior to the formation of DMEC, and those prior claims may have priority over any agreement Greg entered into with DMEC. If his technology is real, this is a possible reason why Greg's attitudes changed, and why no kits have shipped to date. If Greg choose to refund the money and honor his agreement with DMEC, he might be guilty of breech of contract. If you agree to the refund, then you are canceling that prior contract, and Greg is free to honor any agreement with DMEC. Think this through before you insist on a refund. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 19:01:13 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA10832; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:00:38 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:00:38 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 22:00:00 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Still typing operational theory Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"sdnrM1.0.9f2.LZGvq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3817 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I am still typing operational theory for the device on my home page. The weekend is here and with 3 children, well you know. Give me a day or so. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 13 19:47:01 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA22303; Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:46:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 1998 19:46:55 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: "Pete Art" From: "Pete Art" To: "Multiple recipients of list Freenrg-l" Subject: Barkhausen detector results and scalar generator building proposals Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 04:47:26 +0100 Message-ID: <01bd38fb$43c3e3e0$LocalHost@marvin> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BD3903.A5884BE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"njfjw.0.NS5.jEHvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3818 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BD3903.A5884BE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello all, Time........time......... if I had more time............... Like Bob says: day to day life takes most of the time. To be short: yep, I've build the Barkhausen detector using Bob's core material. I have put a picture of the device on my website: www.xs4all.nl/~art/bark2.jpg It's about 260Kb. It shows the setup before winding the coil. I've put some 900-1000 windings on it. Using a simple amplifier it shows reasonable output on the scope. Also on my web-page is an 'audio'-file in .WAV format of about 300 Kb. www.xs4all.nl/~art/bark2.wav The output of the amplifier was connected to my PC-soundcard. It's sampled at 48KHz 32 bit. It clearly shows the distinctive clicks/spikes of the Barkhausen transitions. This sample is made while I moved the magnets near the coil to induce more transitions. In this way it's easy to see what you are looking for. There is still a lot of 'noise' due to the crude-made amplifier. I will make a new amplifier with better low-noise OPAMPS. The actually more important aspect of the setup is: how do I process the signal? I'm thinking of using a DSP-card with a F.I.R. filter to get only the Barkhausen transitions. In this way it would be possible to make a graphical plot, on the PC, showing the power of the transitions in a timedomain. Any suggestions would be very welcome! Anyway, I'm doing a lot of building lately: - finished my waveform generator 0-20MHz using the MAXIM 038 chip. If anyone wants schematics: mail me. (go to www.maxim.com and request the databooks/CD's and up to 8 samples, all for free!!! I love these guys!) - winding a few bifilar coils for the 'active' scalar detector and for the scalar generators using Bob's '180 degrees trick'. I'm going to build a setup as follows: - signal generator producing sine/triangle/sharktooth etc. - two bifilar coils (A and B) driven by fet's or high power OPAMPS - a third coil (C), normal wound in between the two with a permanent magnet inside - a load connected to coil 'C' Attached is my 5 min. drawing My idea is this: On the first half of the cycle: coil A gets a positive signal and coil B gets a negative signal: space/time will bend e.g. on side 'A' space/time will 'grow' and on side 'B' it will 'shrink'. In coil 'C' this will result in that the electrons will move to that side with the 'least' or 'most' space/time density e.g. there will be a currentflow. On the second half of the cycle: coil B gets a positive signal and coil A gets a negative signal, so on side 'A' space/time will 'shrink' and on side 'B' it will 'grow'. In coil 'C' there will be a currentflow the other way. This might give an alternating current. But what if the 'moving forwards and backwards of the electrons' in coil 'C' is extremely small like let's say 1000 electrons? I think that if a permanent magnet is put inside coil 'C' we can create the following: Due to reasons of a-symmetry, caused by the magnet, the electrons will 'feel' less strain in one direction, so more electrons will be 'moved' in an particular direction. This will result in a direct current. At each full cycle there will be moved more electrons forwards than backwards. It has become an electron-pump. All Comments Welcome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 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ske+EgUaDrN1lbsI2SdS0uAQiVdJr7TEdY349TdDgLSZgGKS9kMxgAkYxdjArIqCFyHXVd2gHYGQ LadJCLd0AFO1dJ/DdkQ5ADnhAApoI3cfANoaEArogMgyKWMP9yt2yHInijHDiTiBdoSIG3ZEgN3l PHdHFAF4ANrZRuyFdwn+QWcEqABU5w1QXIiq6ve59fFxx42woyEzW/cgXxNIm8ZKg4AJKNCAOciL qoBTeYChIoBzzo33EVlzxKkKmL452YCYn4AIkFHAMJ+iWMb0EggtAvePf8jUabGGIJrI2Spch4AP 5l3Ou/ncUIBBl7S5VFtST4AGeAAJ2PSJFoztPUil7noFuODdTd5phKuicADukKSO8viYCLv5mxxI Twga0hmTN/ipQEjY4ABApwBj5mfZwWKmz/u4lYuNSJsOWC0BqHTB32cFQoDHaHsNxqhh0eAQga+2 rxyHaIC9VADX0WAcvYtnL4qAAAA7 ------=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BD3903.A5884BE0-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 14 00:27:34 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA26261; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 00:27:16 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 00:27:16 -0800 (PST) From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <8eb0bbc9.34e554f0@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 03:25:17 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re : Jean Louis: Motor Idea Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 116 Resent-Message-ID: <"xJEU_2.0.EQ6.YLLvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3819 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On 14/02/1998 00:13:56 , Kyle wrote : << Jean Louis: I have an idea on how to make the 'quantum magnetic motor' work. Try making a ring of magnets around the rotor, with the rotor magnets repelling from the ring interior. Leave a gap in the magnet ring on both ends, but not at the same position on both ends. This will make the fields unbalanced on the device, and either: A. Make it more efficient B. Make it self running Good luck! >> Thanks for your idea Kyle, Sincerely, Jean-Louis Naudin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 14 11:51:19 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA24909; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 11:51:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 11:51:07 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34E5F50C.F2B24582@pavilion.co.uk> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 19:48:34 +0000 From: Robert Dowse Reply-To: redesign@pavilion.co.uk X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Watson4s Research References: <19980213014717.1187ccb9.in@pop3.vossnet.de> <34E5076F.7867@tiac.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Lv194.0.556.fMVvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3820 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > > You should have shipped the SMOTs long ago. > > Each of us on the list would have tinkered with it til a few > > would have got it to work and you would now be a very well known > > man by now...If his technology is real... > Depending on the laws in your country..etc.. Guys....!!!! If this technology _IS_ real all this legal flim-flam is simply NOT relevant. It seems abundantly clear to me that the people on this list and many many others way beyond will benefit in almost any way they choose, IF his technology is real... Watson or DNMEC or whatever cannot 'own' a new principal or an anomaly in physics. People instead attempt to 'own' the rights to products based on those phonenoma. I don't own water disassociation but I could own the apparatus and the know how to produce cheap hydrogen fuel! If Meyer has a genuine process my guess is that he has kept some vital part of it a secret because he knows he cannot 'own' it after it's out because everyone will copy it straight away! What he has failed to grasp is that he could be the spear head of a world wide mega multi billion $ industry, just like that. So I conclude he is either a fraud or stupid. What happens is that lots of different people make lots of different products at prices to suit lots of different customers and every body wins. It really makes me sick to read about selfish small minded people over and over again who think they can 'own' things by writing words on pieces of paper! The most valuable thing to 'have' resides between your ears and nobody else can own that unless you're brain washed, tortured or seduced in some way. Think about who you'd invte to your dinner party, Gates or Ghandi, $ rich merchant bankers who can only think about money, power and control or mind rich people who think and have things to say on many of topics? History tends to remember people who had ideas and spread them around. So Greg, I say to you that by far the most profitable way foreward ($$$'s and intelectually) for YOU personally is to get your new principal or an anomaly out here, share it, watch it grow, you can then learn a hundred times faster and ten times more details to be able to manufacture better products! Competion, as I wrote to you before, will strengthen your position unless you build bad products which you can easily do no matter how good the physics behind your products is! Unfortunatly I don't see Greg doing this because I think he has deluded himself, probably unintentionally, about the effects upon which some new technology and product could be based. I hope I am wrong. Greg PLEASE WAKE UP. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 14 19:52:48 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA22663; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 19:52:28 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 19:52:28 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <01BD3992.686686C0@pm3-153.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: Power Supplies Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:49:20 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"E9B2F3.0.0Y5.tPcvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3821 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greetings: Any idea what I could do to get 150 amps of DC voltage? (or more amps if possible) Thanks, Kyle Randall Mcallister Email: stk@sunherald.infi.net Phone: 228-875-0629 Fax: 228-872-5837 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 14 20:22:02 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA27005; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 20:21:57 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 20:21:57 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: "Pete Art" From: "Pete Art" To: Subject: Re: Power Supplies Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 05:22:35 +0100 Message-ID: <01bd39c9$57947a00$LocalHost@marvin> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"BCqQE3.0.mb6.Xrcvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3822 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Kyle, At what voltage would you like it? Rgrds, Pete -----Original Message----- From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: 'freenrg-l@eskimo.com' Date: 15 February 1998 05:04 Subject: Power Supplies >Greetings: > >Any idea what I could do to get 150 amps of DC voltage? (or more amps if possible) > >Thanks, >Kyle Randall Mcallister >Email: stk@sunherald.infi.net >Phone: 228-875-0629 >Fax: 228-872-5837 > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 14 21:11:42 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA29968; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:11:17 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:11:17 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <1c1e4715.34e678e2@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 00:10:56 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Power Supplies Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"-6vsd1.0.7K7.nZdvq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3823 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-14 22:58:45 EST, you write: << Any idea what I could do to get 150 amps of DC voltage? (or more amps if possible) >> Kyle, What do dc welders put out amp wise? Maybe 2 or 3 wired together? That is, if they make dc welders? Butch As a last resort, a Sears Diehard? Or rather 2 or more. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 14 21:31:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA04423; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:31:48 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:31:48 -0800 (PST) From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <95e42c1.34e67d4f@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 00:29:49 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Power Supplies Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"IBb-I.0.x41.2tdvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3824 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-14 22:58:45 EST, you write: << Any idea what I could do to get 150 amps of DC voltage? (or more amps if possible) >> For low voltages, car batteries come to mind. You can place several in series and/or parallel depending upon how long and at what voltage you need the current. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 14 21:41:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA01332; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:41:45 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 21:41:45 -0800 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <448af221.34e6800c@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 00:41:30 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Interesting article on Gravity Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"mX_7J2.0.cK.O0evq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3825 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com For those of you intererested in gravity as a possible route to free energy there is an interesting article "Breaking the Law of Gravity" in the March (1998) issue of WIRED. The author travelled around the world interviewing people (Eugene Podkletnov, Schnurer, NASA, etc.) involved in some of the recently publicized work. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 14 23:14:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA12215; Sat, 14 Feb 1998 23:14:18 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 1998 23:14:18 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 02:12:08 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: (Butch)Theory of operation on web site now Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"eamxn.0.j-2.0Nfvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3826 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com My ideas of how to approach the research on my non-concentric rotor/stator gererator were just up loaded to my web site. LaFonte Generator Home Page Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 15 13:06:32 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA12959; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:06:17 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 13:06:17 -0800 Message-ID: <34E58747.31BD@xtra.co.nz> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 01:00:07 +1300 From: Robbie Rowntree Reply-To: rown@xtra.co.nz X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alon Cohen CC: USA-TESLA@list.iex.net, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Anti gravity drive References: <199802140743.JAA32053@alpha.netvision.net.il> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"eceMm3.0.LA3.7Zrvq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3827 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Alon Cohen wrote: > > Can you give more info on "Anti gravity drive" > > What is it exactly? > > Thanks > Alon Hi Alon, I have not tested my ideas on anti gravity yet, but gravity must be a componint of atomic spin, like a right hand spin that lines up with all other atoms its been showen that a left hand spin can lose mass weight in some cases, also both Tesla ,AC high voltage and TT Brown ,DC high voltage have made clams about anti grav and i hope to test some of there ideas later on. I think the key is first to have a light weight self powered generater with adjustable freq and then a single wire in a ring.............. around the rosey. -- **RRAMM** Good Waves Robbie Rowntree experimental research Self powered*Magnetic Motor*Electric Gen*Anti gravity drive http://www.primenet.com/~rags/tesla/rr.html mailto:rown@xtra.co.nz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 15 16:29:40 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA20514; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:29:31 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 16:29:31 -0800 From: RoConroy@aol.com Message-ID: <8b80a9ee.34e7883d@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 19:28:43 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Watson4s Research Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"xcimw1.0.__4.fXuvq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3828 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-13 18:58:37 EST, Bob,you write: << The people envolved in DMEC may well be aware of this, and may well wish that everyone will choose to cancel their orders leaving the way clear for their (DMEC's) commercial goals. >> >From my what I remember from the U.S. contract law course I took 25 years ago, DMEC's contract would be invalid because it tries to illegally to void a prior legal contract with a third party. If I remember correctly, a contract to do anything illegal is not enforceable. Bob From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 15 17:33:34 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA28681; Sun, 15 Feb 1998 17:33:14 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 1998 17:33:14 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34E79482.6FC0@xtra.co.nz> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:21:06 +1300 From: Robbie Rowntree Reply-To: rown@xtra.co.nz X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-XTRA (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com CC: USA-TESLA@list.iex.net Subject: what? happens Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------3D562B9F4A56" Resent-Message-ID: <"hHAK32.0.__6.NTvvq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3829 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------3D562B9F4A56 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit in the attached gif does the collapsing reversed fields , 1, add to new path flow . 2, decrease magnetic flow . 3, osculates at the speed of light? or domain alignment. 4, become totally confused and give up all. 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(PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 00:12:08 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802160811.AAA11836@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: New Permanent Magnet Motor Idea Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 00:17:07 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01BD3A70.370BA4A0" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"adYzq2.0.o-4.MJ_vq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3830 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BD3A70.370BA4A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reading Bill Beaty's article on an all mechanical magnetic levitation device ( http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/maglev/magroll.html ) got me to thinking about how to use repulsive magnetic fields created by eddy currents in nearby conductors as the basis for a permanent magnet motor. This repulsion could be used to push a magnetic piston away, or to push a magnetic rotor around. The only problem is that the same eddy currents would repel the magnetic piston or rotor AS IT APPROACHED the conductor, using up any kinetic energy it may have gained from being repelled on the previous stroke or rotation. However, if the creation of eddy currents could be prevented while the permanent magnet approached the conductive plate, and then allowed to form as the magnet moved on, the rotor would continue to produce more energy on the repulsion side of the cycle than it consumed on the approach. The creation of eddy currents requires a path for those current to flow along. If the conductor were in the form of a flat wound coil, with each turn insulated from the others, and with each turn interupted by a break in the wire then such a "coil" would not have any circular current paths, and should not produce eddy currents. (Much like the way transformer cores are formed by lamenating insulated layers of iron to prevent eddy currents.) As the magnet reached its closest approach to the flat coil a cam operated switch would close and complete the circuit allowing the formation of eddy currents. The magnet moving past this surface would induce those eddy currents and an opposing magnetic field would be set up in the coil (which would now be electrically equivalent to a flat conductive plate) repelling the magnet attached to the rotor. (See attached GIF file, and Bill Beaty's article http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/maglev/magroll.html ) I am currently constructing a test model and will report on the results. Thanks. -Gary Shannon Free Lance Mad Scientist ------=_NextPart_000_01BD3A70.370BA4A0 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="EddyRotor.gif" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Description: EddyRotor.gif (GIF Image) Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="EddyRotor.gif" R0lGODlh3wFtAYAAAAAAAP///ywAAAAA3wFtAQAC/oyPqcvtD6OctNqLs968+w+G4kiW5omm6sq2 7gvH8kzX9o3n+s73/g8MCofEovGITCqXzKbzCY1Kp1SA1UrNardc4hXbDYvH5NW1jE6r15Mv+w2P jwEGuvyOzy/t+r7/38MHOEhYaCaocGa4KPbl+AjJWIGY6CZ5WYVBqQfZ+fjg6Yk5WrQZYYqHqhHZ oEr6euPaSih7wcpQC6sLk5tIS+IIujuc05tgrIZMoeigTJxBFx0KFuDMZm1Nlv2x/dw8DX4LiP07 0+19XP2JLB38Rz54ziH/3H5GX/eZBz9Og6+77kQnOfze+UNn694Lfdc0lZPx7xJDc8zSFPQT0RbC /lPuYllCc7FPRgsj41UMdLJLSE4HN+KiBmQil5X7WrpE8NELzJkO49m8mfNIykwafZq7qW6nkqFR aKb6iY5pko5TnN4pucyl1D1KoVglCJVY16ZjPYYTN8koRIRbnwQF0fabLxNYnZwd+PJu2VFvs8RN +BdXNZx1B0edhfRbYR6BOcpsUyfy4sUgESde0FhK5lZ4SR4AQ5myNsuXCYtGuQFcUXWRU5wOg+r1 1b2NaOedVtRONDOsYcUubZqg7WN3PQsa7qGvpN/AlSfrpXfzTuTznC9iXnqzyrbRrWM+bti1dpaC 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rXrpyZrbqsGIrcA9i0tmt3STuBlZGVWt3IP4nanVqCXtFy0OjKkN469WF38DXBP5n2qd1gxpjSh7 vAdi4lX2ajHRv8Ij5C1EyQJb43vI1Ow2nUOL4zwrH0dXpE0VjextqoeGd1tut0Kx5C6L5cRcsyJN 5EwueENWoR7+OOW9hIvJdugo5T+e5Eh+yxVI53Vu5ymJ5wc73i5tXhH3kx895XBXyRmsd0YIdtiX /tmaluj55tE9Anp9WEMnIeZtnkkWaN+Dc2Y2on4CuDUOzuCT5+lAvnuSjnJZkoKdSp6bbpcLZnIa d+FzbrbUlUZ/4+oSyH9yPumWBzJ8eHwqWNBvvtqSiJYU5etpDlKGziUZJ3JzieuQGexeIh1r7oUl U4QLct9oXetezpLmlXqBzqY9SujcroXp7uywF3ful19V+Om6fnlw6IPPHsB/yOx8Xur8m4H7jnnV nsLmjnpKWHj+IuuB9+78LvDbfe2XMerSpycJH+YAr4MDiOa8F/EwOPF0/XrdfoULL/F/oXlr6Oct aPEgz+4Uf4jIvuopv+5n8+1l6PL6Dnrhx+cTQWeDeEjzFo/pv567LM/zlCfyMwn0QU/wQw9Cjf6B OwifSg/1nSr0UX+DJ0/1UY/uV8/zNa/1Xe/1Xw/2YX8TBQAAADs= ------=_NextPart_000_01BD3A70.370BA4A0-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 10:28:36 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA20665; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:28:22 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 10:28:22 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <3e506495.34e884e0@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:26:37 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Going private (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"3n2MD3.0.k25.0L8wq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3831 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Good-bye all, Due to lack of interest and response I will be closing down my web site and going private with my research. I will monitor the list to keep up with any interesting progress. I will be working on my "Big A" & "Big Y" Designs, also the non-concentric rotor/stator, with most focus on the "Big A" design. Good luck with your projects. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 11:32:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA00445; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:32:27 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:32:27 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802161931.LAA16035@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: New Permanent Magnet Motor Idea Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 11:36:32 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mpGxB.0.W6.uG9wq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3832 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Regarding the OU idea I posted earlier, more details can be found at http://rio.com/~reboot/oumotor.html Thanks -Gary Shannon Freelance Mad Scientist From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 12:42:42 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA15581; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:42:23 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 12:42:23 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 13:37:28 -0500 Subject: Re: Watson4s Research Message-ID: <19980216.153207.6398.0.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <19980213014717.1187ccb9.in@pop3.vossnet.de> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-5,7-11,13-18,22-23,25-26,32-33,35-41,43 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"mHFuu2.0.Hp3.iIAwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3833 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Fri, 13 Feb 1998 18:54:39 -0800 Bob Shannon writes: >Personally, I'd wait it out. > >Depending on the laws in your country, you may have a very valid >'prior claim' to Greg's work. You had a valid contract in force prior to the >formation of DMEC. This may greatly complicate DMEC's commercial >options. > >The people envolved in DMEC may well be aware of this, and may well >wish that everyone will choose to cancel their orders leaving the way clear >for their (DMEC's) commercial goals. > >If you waited this long, wait a bit longer. Don't give up now, its >probably just what DMEC wants to see happen to the prior contracts. > I concurr with Bob. I have trouble understanding why DMEC is taking such an irrational course....after all, the "T" in smot stands for toy, and DMEC is/was suppose to market the RMOG and develope the PMOD, if I am correct, that is. Also, the plans for the smot were freely posted, and many built it and claim rollaways. So a US Patent is out of the question for the most part. But the biggest problem is why DMEC does not want free positive exposure. J.L. Naudin was suppose to have demonstrated a smot publicly in Europe, surely a few beta-verson smots out in the hands of some experimenters would give the feedback Greg could use to improve the existing design. (Even microsoft sold a beta-version of Win 95 before its official release to get feedback). If nothing else, DMEC would already have willing distributers for their products all over Europe, North and South America. Just my two-cents worth... Steve Heckman ...if I only had a brain.... (part of a song that is frequently on my mind when dealing with the public). _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 14:25:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA05990; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:25:29 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 14:25:29 -0800 From: Jiyani@aol.com Message-ID: <5ce6746b.34e8bcc3@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 17:25:05 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Going private (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"5x5tB2.0.KT1.MpBwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3834 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sorry to see you go. You were one of the few who seemed to be worth listening to. There is always so much crap and repeated crap that it makes it difficult to continuously be required to dump chaff just to get a few grains of good information. I do expect that we all will hear from you, or about you, again if you keep pursuing O/U. Jiyani From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 15:51:16 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA01003; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:51:06 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 15:51:06 -0800 Message-ID: <34E8FA9E.D75@tiac.net> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 18:49:02 -0800 From: Bob Shannon Organization: Fair at best X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Watson4s Research References: <8b80a9ee.34e7883d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"669sl2.0.KF.c3Dwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3835 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com RoConroy@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 98-02-13 18:58:37 EST, Bob,you write: > > << The people envolved in DMEC may well be aware of this, and may well wish > that everyone will choose to cancel their orders leaving the way clear > for their (DMEC's) commercial goals. >> > > >From my what I remember from the U.S. contract law course I took 25 years ago, > DMEC's contract would be invalid because it tries to illegally to void a prior > legal contract with a third party. If I remember correctly, a contract to do > anything illegal is not enforceable. > Bob I rather thought so, thats for the clarification. I think this explains a lot of Greg's recent behaviors. I should add that it is my opinion, based on both physics and private exchanges with Greg, that the whole SMOT thing is a huge scam. If and when this all ever sees the light of day, there will be some very interesting clues found in the freenrg-l archives. Methinks Greg does talk out of both sides of his mouth, and I cannot truse what comes out of either side. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 20:40:58 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA12138; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 20:40:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 20:40:19 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <01BD3B2B.5E780B80@pm3-161.gpt.infi.net> From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: Joe Misiolek Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 22:36:47 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx2.eskimo.com id UAA12012 Resent-Message-ID: <"LaqYs1.0.Uz2.dIHwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3836 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greetings: Does anyone here know much about who Joseph Misiolek is, what he is known for, and is anyone here in contact with him or know how to get in contact with him? Thanks, Kyle Randall Mcallister Email: stk@sunherald.infi.net Phone: 228-875-0629 Fax: 228-872-5837 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 21:42:32 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA25384; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 21:42:10 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 21:42:10 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <3e524204.34e922b6@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 00:40:04 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: This many people answered poll? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"v9CQO.0.UC6.XCIwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3837 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I have been asked tonight(and last week) how many people answered my poll asking how many read my post. 123 people from Free Energy 38 people from Newman List My web site had over 400 hits between 2/1/98 and 2/15/98 But no response from these people looking at the web page? Note: I would like to thank the people who answered the poll and for their nice comments. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 22:41:12 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA24126; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 22:41:07 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 22:41:07 -0800 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 21:56:23 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802170556.VAA00732@italy.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: New Permanent Magnet Motor Idea Resent-Message-ID: <"nVN1s3.0.nu5.14Jwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3838 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Gary and all, At 12:17 AM 2/16/98 -0800, you wrote: > >Reading Bill Beaty's article on an all mechanical magnetic levitation >device ( http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/maglev/magroll.html ) got me to >thinking about how to use repulsive magnetic fields created by eddy >currents in nearby conductors as the basis for a permanent magnet motor. >This repulsion could be used to push a magnetic piston away, or to push a >magnetic rotor around. The only problem is that the same eddy currents >would repel the magnetic piston or rotor AS IT APPROACHED the conductor, >using up any kinetic energy it may have gained from being repelled on the >previous stroke or rotation. However, if the creation of eddy currents >could be prevented while the permanent magnet approached the conductive >plate, and then allowed to form as the magnet moved on, the rotor would >continue to produce more energy on the repulsion side of the cycle than it >consumed on the approach. .. >I am currently constructing a test model and will report on the results. > >Thanks. >-Gary Shannon This idea is interesting and look foward to your tests. However I think it may not work, from ideas on your web page. The energy for the eddy current loop comes from the rotating magnet, and thus will brake it more than accelerate it. In the levitating train, the eddy currents produce a drag which the engine has to overcome. A simpler experiment is to drop a strong magnet (Neodym.) down a copper pipe and watch what happens. Or think, when the switch is closed, no current is flowing in the loop. The energy needed to built up the eddy currents comes from the rotation, and unless the repulsion is >100% energywise, a "viscous damping" will result. Another interesting experiment. Make 2 copper rings and put them on a ferromagnetic core AC electromagnet or other arrangement to produce eddy currents. Only one ring will be repelled. Two, however, will each have eddy currents in the same direction and be attracted to each other. If one ring is built in to the electromagnet, it will now attract non-ferrous materials such as the second ring. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 23:42:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA10003; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 23:42:47 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 23:42:47 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 00:41:52 -0700 (MST) From: Steve Ekwall X-Sender: ekwall2@november To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com cc: newman-l@emachine.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Subject: Re: This many people answered poll? In-Reply-To: <3e524204.34e922b6@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"Pichc.0.CS2.rzJwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3839 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Tue, 17 Feb 1998 HLafonte@aol.com wrote: > I have been asked tonight(and last week) how many people answered my poll > asking how many read my post. > 123 people from Free Energy > 38 people from Newman List > My web site had over 400 hits between 2/1/98 and 2/15/98 > But no response from these people looking at the web page? > Note: I would like to thank the people who answered the poll and for their > nice comments. > Thanks, > Butch > > Butch, We/They are looking at webpages Everywhere, including each individuals pursuits. Intertrest vary to the extreme on this 'cutting-edge' relm of users worldwide.. You/We/I shouldn't feel too left in the dark. IF we 'holler' is/does anyone care.. and the response is a bit filter'd. --------- Common goal, common plan = common energy. --------- BUT, when You/I/They HAVE something, this is the first place I would think about to announce it. ---------- nut-crackers/birds (errr) THOUGHTS of a FEATHER - you've got to love it (errr.. Thoughts of Together???) HOPE you keep 'lurking the list' :) I have MORE "Butch###.gif" than any other in my graphics section here. Best to you & yours -=se=- Thought for today: " As long as men are free to ask what they must, free to say what they will, freedom can never be lost, AND science can never regress." -- J. Robert Oppenheimer, American physicist (1904-1967) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 16 23:58:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA15759; Mon, 16 Feb 1998 23:58:01 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 23:58:01 -0800 Message-Id: <199802170758.XAA29177@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: New Permanent Magnet Motor Idea Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 00:04:20 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"H3se2.0.8s3.8CKwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3840 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ---------- > From: dave dameron > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: New Permanent Magnet Motor Idea > Date: Monday, February 16, 1998 9:56 PM > This idea is interesting and look foward to your tests. However I think it > may not work, from ideas on your web page. The energy for the eddy current > loop comes from the rotating magnet, and thus will brake it more than > accelerate it. > In the levitating train, the eddy currents produce a drag which the engine > has to overcome. A simpler experiment is to drop a strong magnet (Neodym.) > down a copper pipe and watch what happens. I'd sort of come to that conclusion myself. But even as the rotor loses some kinetic energy to the build-up of the eddy currents, those same currents cause the rotor to be repelled. So one force slows it down, and the other speeds it up. I don't suppose it would be that easy to pull a fast one on mother nature though. But you never know. There *could* be a simple loophole nobody's noticed before. I'll keep on looking. --Gary Shannon http://www.rio.com/~reboot From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 05:32:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA19615; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 05:31:30 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 05:31:30 -0800 (PST) From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <83866c82.34e990bb@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 08:29:29 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: QMM Mk8 - New 3D views Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 116 Resent-Message-ID: <"kc6NO3.0.Lo4.k4Pwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3841 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi All, I have updated my web site with two very nice 3D isometric views (made by Tony Colgan) of the QMM Mk8.... You will find it in the QMM mk8 topic in my web site at: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/qmmv8.htm Sincerely Jean-Louis Naudin 02/17/98 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 08:49:52 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA01021; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 08:49:27 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 08:49:27 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802171649.AA07376@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 98 09:43:35 -0500 To: , Subject: Re: Going private (Butch) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bDwns.0.kF.L-Rwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3842 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch, A few suggestions for you....hopefully before you leave. A - you contribute valid ideas...sometimes others are not quite on the same wavelength yet. Be patient. B - pursuing your ideas alone will help no-one. Please continue to bounce things off the list. We can all benefit. C - I have been thinking about some of the ideas you have had. Will send an email later today with some additional ideas that I had this weekend. Point is -- we all feed off each other. D - Please try to explain your concepts a bit better. I don't know what type of timeframe you expected for feedback, but I never got to actually read your explanation of the latest idea.....and the URL is now gone [and it wasn't up yet on Friday]! I read my mail on weekdays for the list -- remember the patience part? You seem to be offended by the lack of support -- I have tried a couple of your ideas, and just haven't had the time to finish reading all my email. I guess I could understand if you were getting hate mail for your ideas, but I think you are just getting discouraged from lack of participation in your free-association exercises. Remember -- a group can always accomplish more than an individual. Please keep in touch. Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 09:26:58 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA10545; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 09:26:51 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 09:26:51 -0800 From: PROTIEUS@aol.com Message-ID: <1d0d7bdd.34e9c830@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:26:06 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Watson4s Research Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"2DhD31.0.ea2.PXSwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3843 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com hello, not to be ignorant or anything ..but what is this SMOT supposed to do..and how may i get my hands on it..what is the cost and knowledge on building this also. thank you Scotty From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 10:04:53 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA21140; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:04:46 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:04:46 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802171804.AA22790@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 98 10:49:40 -0500 To: Subject: Frequency vs Permeability in ferrites Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"EdckJ3.0.1A5.w4Twq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3844 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello All, New idea over the weekend. Magnetic permeability of ferrites is affected by several external factors. Temp [Currie] and electrical frequency come to mind. Thought experiment -- if we inject a high frequency current into a ferrite core, will it interfere with it's ability to conduct/interact with an external magnetic flux [ie some permanent magnets]? Will this require less energy than using the current to actually induce a magnetic field in the ferrite? Imagine the following: -permanent magnet stator -- perhaps a SMOT-like arrangement around outer edge of rotors path. small gap [regauge area] between start [weak] and finish [strong] areas. -iron nail core coil rotor -iron nail is drawn into array from start point, and as nail comes to regauging area [end of array] a shot of high freq current is applied to rotor coil. Does this shut-down the rotor's attraction/interaction with the array's flux enough "break free" of the strong field at the end....and pass along to the start point again? Questions: - how many cycles at a particular freq would be needed for a nail? would 4 or 5 cycles at 100KHz do? - how much current would that probably use? - could it use a Telsa-Type single wire method with higher freqs [potential only?]? - could this approach be O/U? Any comments? Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 10:08:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA01411; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:08:26 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 10:08:26 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <52fd38b4.34e9d1c1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:06:55 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Going private (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"WeE-W1.0.xL.O8Twq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3845 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-17 11:52:13 EST, you write: << Please keep in touch >> Anton, I keep list informed of progress. Thanks for input. Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 11:33:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA14513; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:33:39 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:33:39 -0800 (PST) From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802171932.AA09307@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 98 12:25:50 -0500 To: Subject: Rick's Rocks and Ionic Movement Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"EJiI12.0.dY3.EOUwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3846 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello All/Rick, Been thinking about Rick's capacitor observations over the long weekend [Petrovoltaic effect and external temperature], and had an idea of what could be causing voltage to rise with external temperature changes [assuming localized temp is stable]. Could this be due to ionic transfers/movement from temperature differentials?....airflow might seem to be nil, but if there is a temperature differential, you will probably have some ionic movement -- which could relate to voltage changes in a capacitor/rock. Not sure it would explain T.T.Brown's observations in pressure chambers though...... Second thought -- wouldn't a temperature/pressure differential induce a "strain" on the object in the chamber? I'm relating this to diving, but pressure differentials will definitely produce stress on the walls of an air tank......wouldn't that be noticeable to the contents of the tank? [ie air density/volume?] Just a thought. Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 11:46:43 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA11976; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:46:36 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:46:36 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802171946.AA11858@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 98 12:39:39 -0500 To: Subject: Magnetic Vortex? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"0cODz.0.1x2.QaUwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3847 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello again folks, One more idea from this weekend...... Take a second look at the animated GIF on G. Watson's site for a Quickfield simulation of Butch's Y design. see http://www.microtronics.com.au/%7Egwatson/lafonte.html At each side of the bottom [attracting] magnet there seems to be additional "blue hole" regions. If you look at the flux lines during the animation, there are several frames with flux lines moving in opposite directions, without nearby lines to cancel them out. Could this be an area to explore for "magnetic vortexes" [or is that vorti...]? I still can't get that blue-hole vortex dream out of my head......... The central hole is surrounded by flux lines that are moving in different directions, but that cancel each other out around the hole. The edge holes are quite different. Take a look -- Any feedback? Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 11:48:06 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA17245; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:47:57 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 11:47:57 -0800 (PST) From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802171946.AA11878@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 98 12:41:30 -0500 To: Subject: Re: QMM Mk8 - New 3D views Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"S9Aes2.0.GD4.fbUwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3848 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com >Hi All, >I have updated my web site with two very nice 3D isometric views >(made by Tony Colgan) of the QMM Mk8.... What software did Tony Colgan use......Great pictures! Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 12:26:49 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA20114; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:26:43 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:26:43 -0800 Message-ID: <34EA0D25.6BC@cmet.net> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 17:20:21 -0500 From: Felix Meyer Reply-To: ce3cwf@cmet.net Organization: CE3CWF X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-KIT-bw (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Going private (Butch) References: <199802171649.AA07376@interlock.mgh.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mXI2L2.0.5w4.1AVwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3849 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com arager@mcgraw-hill.com wrote: > > Butch, > > A few suggestions for you....hopefully before you leave. > > A - you contribute valid ideas...sometimes others are not quite on the > same wavelength yet. Be patient. > ... ... > D - Please try to explain your concepts a bit better. ... ... ... > lack of participation in your free-association exercises. Remember -- > a group can always accomplish more than an individual. > > Please keep in touch. > > Anton Rager > arager@McGraw-Hill.com Hi Butch, I am also a frequent reader of your ideas without giving sufficient feedback... Please stay on and continue here, what really is needed is a brainstorm of ideas - finally - the expected result will arrive ... !!! Regards Felix From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 15:41:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA04446; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 15:41:37 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 15:41:37 -0800 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:47:11 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802172347.SAA02731@mail.wincom.net> X-Sender: wood@mail.wincom.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dick Wood Subject: Re: Watson4s Research Resent-Message-ID: <"c3rQe1.0.L51.l0Ywq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3850 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 12:26 PM 2/17/98 EST, you wrote: >hello, > not to be ignorant or anything ..but what is this SMOT supposed to do..and >how may i get my hands on it..what is the cost and knowledge on building this >also. > > >thank you >Scotty > The smot is a simple toy. It is a simple arrangement of magnets in 2 rows that pull a ball up a slight incline. At the end of the incline the ball drops off the end and supposedly if a track is built properly and the ball climbed high enough the ball will roll around to the starting point and go up the incline again--perpetually.I have built one of these without trying for a roll around with less than 5 bucks worth of magnets.It is an interesting effect and there should be a way to make it more efficient. Perhaps putting the steel ball on an arm and pivot and letting it travel through an arc of magnets as described for the smot.If 2 balls are used to balance one another then this may make a motor. The smot is a lot easier to build and less demanding of acuracy than the instructions will lead you believe. Woody From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 20:33:17 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA03256; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 20:33:09 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 20:33:09 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Cc: HLafonte@aol.com Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 18:51:06 -0800 Subject: Re: Going private (Butch) Message-ID: <19980217.202916.12038.2.tv@juno.com> References: <3e506495.34e884e0@aol.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,5-15 From: tv@juno.com (Tim D Vaughan) Resent-Message-ID: <"Hu_kx3.0.ho.3Icwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3851 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch, I hate to see someone with so many thoughtful ideas leave the list because it seems nobody is interested. I for one have been interested but after all the excitment Greg Watson created, I have sort of exhausted my magnet motor ideas for a while. I was just beginning to get interested in yours :- ( . . Tim ( tv@juno.com ) _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 21:18:25 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA12950; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:18:14 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:18:14 -0800 To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: freenrg-L@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:13:27 -0800 Subject: Re: ZPE Message-ID: <19980217.211330.12038.5.tv@juno.com> References: <01BD3BED.6A723740@pm3-145.gpt.infi.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-5,7-9,11-15 From: tv@juno.com (Tim D Vaughan) Resent-Message-ID: <"XOb-G1.0.4A3.Kycwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3852 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com >Kyle R. Mcallister said: >Maybe we can't tap ZPE to run things, = but maybe we can warp it (or spacetime) to >allow antigravity or 'space = drives'. And then again, maybe we can do both ! How about a ZPE powered spacecraft with a ZPE reaction field (or space warp) drive ? I wouldn't be surprised if they already exist. I will christen my first one the U.S.S. Hal Puthoff. : ) Tim ( tv@juno.com ) _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 21:25:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA19364; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:24:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:24:55 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802171932.AA09307@interlock.mgh.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 17:33:54 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Rick's Rocks and Ionic Movement Resent-Message-ID: <"P4TSG3.0.Kk4.V2dwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3853 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Anton wrote: > Could this be due to ionic > transfers/movement from temperature > differentials?....airflow might seem to be > nil, but if there is a temperature > differential, you will probably have some > ionic movement -- which could relate to > voltage changes in a capacitor/rock. Temperature differentials, and certainly not ion flows, are not a factor when the caps are sealed up in a foil covered package of foam as they were in the recent experiment I did. > Not sure it would explain T.T.Brown's > observations in pressure chambers though... ...Further confirmation of the above. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 21:25:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA19395; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:25:04 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:25:04 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802172347.SAA02731@mail.wincom.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 17:39:49 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Watson's Research Resent-Message-ID: <"Uq0ba3.0.Pk4.V2dwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3854 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Woody - > The smot is a lot easier to build and less > demanding of acuracy than the instructions > will lead you believe. Were you able to achieve a rollaway of the ball at a level equal to or higher than the starting point? I found that even if I followed the instructions very carefully and built a very smooth and accurate level track, the ball would not quite roll away free from the fields from a standing start. It would be *remarkable* if you were able to do this on a guaranteed level, and would be worthy of taking some effort to duplicate and record this if you were indeed able to do it. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 21:37:24 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA17524; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:37:18 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 21:37:18 -0800 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 17:33:39 +1100 Message-Id: <199802180633.RAA08899@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@mail.sa.ozland.net.au (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Geoff Egel Subject: Re: Vacuum Thrust Aircraft Resent-Message-ID: <"rCI9p3.0.jH4.CEdwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3855 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 03:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: >Check out the new article on my website By G.D Mutch on an Interesting Flying saucer design >>>>>Geoff Egel >>>> From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 22:11:47 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA25886; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 22:11:36 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 22:11:36 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802180610.WAA18972@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: Watson's Research Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 22:15:12 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Lw5Sq3.0.LK6.Lkdwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3856 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com If your track was indeed level, then that was your problem. As I understand it the ball escapes from the magnets at the top of its travel by being pulled down by gravity at it goes off the end of the upward-sloping ramp. --Gary. > Were you able to achieve a rollaway of the ball at a level equal to or > higher than the starting point? I found that even if I followed the > instructions very carefully and built a very smooth and accurate level track, >the ball would not quite roll away free from the fields from a > standing start. It would be *remarkable* if you were able to do this on a > guaranteed level, and would be worthy of taking some effort to duplicate > and record this if you were indeed able to do it. > > - Rick Monteverde > Honolulu, HI > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 17 22:33:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA29531; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 22:33:39 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 22:33:39 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <5d2a59eb.34ea806b@aol.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 01:31:45 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: A new approach to the list (BUTCH) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"aWvu91.0.KD7.13ewq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3857 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com My mail box has been full of posts from people upset that the web site is no longer up. Also that I was not posting my crazy ideas on the list anymore. So I have come up with a new approach. I will post my web address once every week or two, so as to not take up any list space with constant posts. Then anyone who wants to share ideas or ask questions can email me direct and I will respond to them direct so as to not take up list space. I will make a list of these people and cc them on all posts. From time to time (Once every couple of months) update the list with a short post. This will save a lot of people on the list from getting posts they don't want. I have money to start serious prototype building now. Will start on the "Big A" first. It is on the web site now and a theory of operation is being put together now. I also will be uploading a dynamic coil theory I have always wanted to get some input on. Here Is the web address. Thanks, Butch LaFonte Generator Home Page1 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 02:50:50 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA22289; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 02:50:47 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 02:50:47 -0800 X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199802180610.WAA18972@rio.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 00:50:48 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Watson's Research Resent-Message-ID: <"IoT3A3.0.5S5.6qhwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3858 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Gary - > If your track was indeed level, then that was > your problem. As I understand it the ball > escapes from the magnets at the top of its > travel by being pulled down by gravity at it > goes off the end of the upward-sloping ramp. Thanks, Gary. The profile of the ramp I used was right off Greg's design. Basic principles are well understood; it had a ramp. I'm referring to the height of the entry and rollaway tracks before and after the ramp. They must be level and also at the same level for a rollaway to be valid. The exit can't be lower or tilt down, for instance. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 06:09:18 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA21255; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 06:09:12 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 06:09:12 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 16 Feb 1998 20:54:11 -0500 Subject: Re: New Permanent Magnet Motor Idea Message-ID: <19980218.090010.12390.1.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <199802160811.AAA11836@rio.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-16,18-22 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"-pqN81.0.yB5.6kkwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3859 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Mon, 16 Feb 1998 00:17:07 -0800 "Gary Shannon" writes: >This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > >------=_NextPart_000_01BD3A70.370BA4A0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >I am currently constructing a test model and will report on the >results. > >Thanks. >-Gary Shannon >Free Lance Mad Scientist > Interesting idea. Reminded me of the regauging section of Bearden's magnetic wankel (www.virtualtimes.com/writers/bearden/mageng/fig8.htm). Would like to hear how it turns out. Steve Heckman _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 06:58:21 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA12786; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 06:58:13 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 06:58:13 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: wharton@128.183.200.226 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <5d2a59eb.34ea806b@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:56:42 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Larry Wharton Subject: Re: A new approach to the list (BUTCH) Resent-Message-ID: <"vwqk53.0.g73.3Slwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3860 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com >My mail box has been full of posts from people upset that the web site is no >longer up. Also that I was not posting my crazy ideas on the list anymore. So >I have come up with a new approach. I will post my web address once every week >or two, so as to not take up any list space with constant posts. Then anyone >who wants to share ideas or ask questions can email me direct and I will Your new approach is a big improvement over your previous plan. I would suggest that along with posting your web address you give a one or two sentance indication of any new experimental results. As you now know there are many of us who are interested in your work but did not have any comments. The important thing is the actual experimental results. I will be looking for your results with great interest. Lawrence E. Wharton NASA/GSFC code 913 Greenbelt MD 20771 (301) 286-3486 Email - wharton@climate.gsfc.nasa.gov From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 09:02:58 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA02872; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:02:33 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:02:33 -0800 (PST) From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802181701.AA01898@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 98 09:50:11 -0500 To: Subject: Permeability vs Frequency - Part Deux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="simple boundary" Resent-Message-ID: <"tNm9h.0.mi.cGnwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3861 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com --simple boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello All, Attached is a graph from www.ferronics.com showing how frequency effects permeability in a T type ferrite [MnZn]. Looks like at 0-100KHz it has about 10,000ui and starts to drop off past 100KHz. At about 1MHz the permeability is about 2500ui....that's a %75 reduction in permeability! This should be usable if this decease also corresponds to how the ferrite will "conduct" external magnetic fluxes from permanent magnets..... see http://www.ferronics.com/tuvsf.htm if unable to decode attachment. Any ideas about whether this reaction to frequency is independent of amount of current? ie -- does tiny current @ high frequency have same effect on permeability as large current @ high frequency? Does anyone have similar permeability vs frequency values for less exotic materials......like bolts and nails? [ahhhh the wonders of a basement lab on a budget!] I can't find any other good refs on the net, and don't have access to the specific materials listed at Ferronics. What's the verdict? Look like a direction to explore? 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M-DE@#5Q_JVB;\\F1RC>@Y>O!YYNA]HMS(YR_WS?!,QR(_SES'^R+2RQ^30S# M3XS`WKDL/,R;W;?""GK%\9C%[$B?217%"CS%^Y;$+)R^]UO`[2O!7$R44IS" MO2G&`@S'3/S"9TS$>L>9[T),RGQLS:?,D``]SZM\O?8<:12MS^EYT67LS]&]#U*].(O,S_O'H./S!8K:RB" MF[B+NU,>N-9LW=9N_=9P'==R/=<:-<2+',@/U\ULO!+1.B]%@[B^>]5=CJSW5K!TMTT+41AS4*]K<2IXUW!T;&T[8M6:MZPIJ]!W3 MAOW3)HW40\XRS\W?.+W2TYV48CX^+OZ.^K7)[&SB'-WEL)?<2$F./([DX3SA MIIWF6RY:H8'BBOG:\!&'U+W>@&[E]BW+V@WE:O[=]?\QC#@NW@%[CDO^Z"#X MW`OQY"4N:P0;YR?MXW85XX5>XG=^.1_5WA[-Z`7[YZ`]UK`\Z`K=Z3/>R6#M M)8O-`)3.D(L&K"^-R4,9Q(@,TZ[^V,?]%RW(CCZ[K%5^EP7NO16-R@O^Y0U. MV*A5@YBNY8(NXH2NWD).XXC^T"M^ZL^>%>4-XF9^AQAEY]C.AAI>C`GY[3T> M[KS(U(!ZZN2Y[&$]ZJVLP@?^QL>>EN3>ZQSMW]N>V^D>[:3>SG1NX,F^Q;[. MX/\^W9?N&+P^YU?N[D!]TJXH[VTNYU&N[ABOZ?#$U:Q>TY^N5?Y.[Z@NT?-] M[X6MZAYO[0".T@G/[`N?H'[_KO&9SN[\Z>X/[_+]KNTDS^(O8>LLN^\0K_*' M_?%97>X9#M[U3.KN>D2FWO*>/NTP#N3O'NC\GNV0#>8R'^#!-33BA>?Z`R#O)2_^,C;O3G'MPKQ^`38![#._7 M/?5SS_(.WLQW?_%I/^;>KAR6[;=`QAR0'ODYK/>%U^U/7_B&7M_4ONJ$G_E( MC^>NC>[D/2R27_H83/EUO\[%/O2;O_)!#O7>;>Y*S^UQ_&*$_P$4_A$R_M5^_]/`_^)2_^!T^9P8_FPP_]AR_]U8V+ M[Y_Z^2[_X]_]2?_]`,$@`0."!0T>1)@0(0*%#1T^A!A1XD&&$RT^K'B1HL:, M#CLN;/B1H$@&(DEJY(@2I,63&STJ/&D2X4"5$5O6Q)DSX4V=(77RW&GS)K2(,VD4*M>78I`ZU:N7;U^!1M6[%BR919M6[5JV M;=V^/7L`J]2Y=5/:?5J3:52,>>D6)"D3K\^?%Y'RC$GTK\#!>P?C=5PUNWT)RQX^NC;GW[!S6UV>>+%/#GHX\B5UQ9L7?MV MX^5#?U_,N_%UX>-M!Y^(^SQZ^MO=%_=<&2+B^=A%]\;J/O:XHVV\U@ATSC_8 MPFNOI]L0=$ZZ_]8;$#4!]L;LD@+:5QQQ.=PW$Y'R7A,$2XI MIZ2R2BNOQ#)++;VBSBX9H4SP1.)$)#%(#W=CS[T'E;21R"+5JPY,+]/\DQ32$//3(].1/L+DD-`X9RS4-\\8!$Y-,OL$U#Y3XT3UR3TSG='. M#XWL5%%<>?6U55+/H]2T7'?<=55-[VPI6%N;=594/R5%]M9*ET6R0=9";37: M5W\]5:4U0?TSVX,$[397K0![=Z1XC=VV6FL5%1 MDAAZ=UYRAS47W']=U7?A>NU%=]1:WY286$OC31AACT/:,F211R:Y9).U+'?C MBCH^N&5N7X8Y9IDK_'1FFV_&.>>9:]:Y9Y]_!OK0H(I=Z/:JBWEM7H@EM6&&N:JV:99;'%(_OCLC_^-FF.V3Z; MQ[?!ACON6%=6.V^7-0YZ[K#MS@YONO<&W$+!UQZ\[<(79[QQFAV'/'+)!YZ\ M(*0-]YWX)._WG@#%&#` M@.R7][YWZZ>'W?OQ"3*_]M^_?_[A]J'??GCN>1\^?>G/)S]__:.7O7[VJPO/CWO;T)ST&D@]X\PM@!JDW05X"%E"!"?R@ M<(87.PS*3WWRP^`)1R@\$SX0A0\4GN]>&$,-EA""-G3A"@_X/M2%T'$KS`D0 L?=A#'Q8QA$0T8A+;AT0E-E%U3'1B%$,'12E647-4M&(6)X=%+7:Q<0$!`#L` end --simple boundary-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 09:14:26 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA04548; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:14:21 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:14:21 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <7d4cc75c.34eb1679@aol.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:12:22 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: "Big A" & LaFonte Dynamic Coil on web page Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"VjLGj3.0.y61.hRnwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3862 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com "Big A" & LaFonte Dynamic Coil on web page, operation text coming. LaFonte Generator Home Page Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 11:03:49 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA23472; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:03:43 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:03:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19980218190144.9308.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [206.129.11.197] From: "CJT Enterprises one" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Re[2]: Need better descriptions on generator and HELP! Content-Type: text/plain Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:01:40 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"Yyicr2.0.fk5.C2pwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3863 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch, Thanks It did help..immensely Chris ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 11:14:01 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA14192; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:13:46 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:13:46 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802181913.AA26356@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 98 12:06:19 -0500 To: Subject: Magnetic Materials Graphing Software Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YhQcE1.0.aT3.eBpwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3864 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greg Watson/All, I need to know what software package was used to produce the supporting material properties graphs for the PMOD documentation on Greg's page. Anyone know? http://www.microtronics.com.au/~gwatson/pmod.html Also -- anyone know where Greg got the values that he plugged into the software? esp the Freq vs Permeability values for his graphs? Is there a good reference for this, is it part of his software package, or did he measure experimentally? Thanks, Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 11:43:59 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA00883; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:43:41 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:43:41 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 20:43:27 +0100 Message-Id: <199802181943.UAA16365@cache.hb.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@pop3.vossnet.de (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: HLafonte@aol.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: BIG Y can propell bar magnet rotor ? Cc: arager@McGraw-Hill.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Resent-Message-ID: <"sYixR.0.hD.gdpwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3865 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Butch, the idea of someone on the list to try, if the opening and closing blue hole in the middle of your Big Y magnet configuration has some possibility of a magnetic whirlwind inside the hole would be an interesting test setup to try ! Maybe you can propell a rotating bar permanent magnet rotating inside the "blue hole" via it ? Just an idea ! Let me know , what you think. Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 11:55:29 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA22574; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:55:20 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 11:55:20 -0800 Message-ID: <007701bd3ca3$28dab6c0$96d2989e@david-callaghan> From: David Callaghan To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at post.mail.demon.net Subject: Re: Watson's Research Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:26:45 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"iDQe83.0.dW5.dopwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3866 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi, Could someone please give me some more information on Watsons 'SMOT' that everone is going on about. Many thanks David Callaghan From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 12:56:11 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA00426; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:55:59 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 12:55:59 -0800 Message-ID: <34EB4AF3.ACEE9EBE@ihug.co.nz> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:56:19 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, HLafonte@aol.com Subject: Re: Permeability vs Frequency - Part Deux References: <199802181701.AA01898@interlock.mgh.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"qN14L2.0.Z6.Uhqwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3867 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Good idea, you could have a very high frequency magnetic field turning on and off at a much lower frequency or changing frequency that would effect the conduction of flux from a permanant magnet to a coil that would be in tune with the low frequency alternation of the permeability not the high frequincy that is changing the permeability hence no back EMF! John Berry arager@mcgraw-hill.com wrote: > Hello All, > > Attached is a graph from www.ferronics.com showing how frequency > effects permeability in a T type ferrite [MnZn]. Looks like at > 0-100KHz it has about 10,000ui and starts to drop off past 100KHz. At > about 1MHz the permeability is about 2500ui....that's a %75 reduction > in permeability! This should be usable if this decease also > corresponds to how the ferrite will "conduct" external magnetic fluxes > from permanent magnets..... > > see http://www.ferronics.com/tuvsf.htm if unable to decode attachment. > > > Any ideas about whether this reaction to frequency is independent of > amount of current? ie -- does tiny current @ high frequency have same > effect on permeability as large current @ high frequency? > > > > Does anyone have similar permeability vs frequency values for less > exotic materials......like bolts and nails? [ahhhh the wonders of a > basement lab on a budget!] I can't find any other good refs on the > net, and don't have access to the specific materials listed at > Ferronics. > > > What's the verdict? Look like a direction to explore? > > Anton Rager > arager@McGraw-Hill.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 13:09:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA15348; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:09:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:09:19 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34EB3377.F8FDD819@pavilion.co.uk> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:16:08 +0000 From: Robert Dowse Reply-To: redesign@pavilion.co.uk X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: A new approach to the list (BUTCH) References: <5d2a59eb.34ea806b@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jcqOL3.0.cl3.ytqwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3868 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Butch, Please include me in your postings a I am VERY interested in your work as many others are even though I'm not able to make any sensible comments. Keep up the good work. I wish you all the best...good luck! Thanks Rob Dowse From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 15:42:25 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA11137; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 15:41:56 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 15:41:56 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802182341.PAA11084@mx2.eskimo.com> Date: 18 Feb 1998 14:45 EST Sender: "Gene Batten" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: "Gene Batten" Subject: Re: Vacuum Thrust Aircraft Resent-Message-ID: <"rqOA51.0.uj2.y6twq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3869 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I would like to check out your website. So, what is the address? Gene Batten mdleb@nortel.ca In message "Vacuum Thrust Aircraft", you write: > At 03:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: > >Check out the new article on my website By G.D Mutch on an Interesting > Flying saucer design > >>>>>Geoff Egel > >>>> > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 16:02:18 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA14577; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:02:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:02:07 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34EB763E.398DCD39@ihug.co.nz> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:01:03 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: webpage Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LDM611.0.eZ3.yPtwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3870 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Can everyone who has a webpage generally on-topic for this mailing list please post their url now rather than tell us to go to their webpage but not give the url or like some just inform us that the webpage was there just when it is coming down. John Berry From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 16:42:38 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA22075; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:42:25 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:42:25 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: monteverde@postoffice.worldnet.att.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <007701bd3ca3$28dab6c0$96d2989e@david-callaghan> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 14:30:34 -1000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rick Monteverde Subject: Re: Watson's Research Resent-Message-ID: <"UoDPs1.0.qO5.k_twq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3871 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com David - Greg's web site at: http://www.microtronics.com.au/~gwatson ...has details on the SMOT. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 18:38:41 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA12205; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 18:38:31 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 18:38:31 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 21:42:31 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199802190242.VAA20278@mail.wincom.net> X-Sender: wood@mail.wincom.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dick Wood Subject: Re: Watson's Research Resent-Message-ID: <"vacXN2.0.Q-2.Pivwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3872 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 05:39 PM 2/17/98 -1000, you wrote: >Woody - > > > The smot is a lot easier to build and less > > demanding of acuracy than the instructions > > will lead you believe. > >Were you able to achieve a rollaway of the ball at a level equal to or >higher than the starting point? I found that even if I followed the >instructions very carefully and built a very smooth and accurate level >Honolulu, HI > When I built this simple smot I made no attempt at a roll around I just wanted to examine the principle involved.Ya gotta admit it is interesting. Woody From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 19:03:26 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA05589; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:03:19 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:03:19 -0800 Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:03:09 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802190303.TAA16746@iceland.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Permeability vs Frequency - Part Deux Resent-Message-ID: <"y-tU-3.0.8N1.r3wwq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3873 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:50 AM 2/18/98 -0500, you wrote: > Hello All, > > Attached is a graph from www.ferronics.com showing how frequency > effects permeability in a T type ferrite [MnZn]. Looks like at > 0-100KHz it has about 10,000ui and starts to drop off past 100KHz. At > about 1MHz the permeability is about 2500ui....that's a %75 reduction > in permeability! This should be usable if this decease also > corresponds to how the ferrite will "conduct" external magnetic fluxes > from permanent magnets..... > > Any ideas about whether this reaction to frequency is independent of > amount of current? ie -- does tiny current @ high frequency have same > effect on permeability as large current @ high frequency? Hi Anton and all, I think I've missed something in your last few posts. Could you please explain (again) the connection you see between frequency (the material following the field in time) and amount of current (saturation)? Did you mean "...as large current @ low frequency? -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 18 23:29:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA27821; Wed, 18 Feb 1998 23:29:10 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 23:29:10 -0800 (PST) From: Jiyani@aol.com Message-ID: <1ed5d0ba.34ebdef0@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 02:27:42 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Vacuum Thrust Aircraft Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"_6yqN1.0.Zo6.3zzwq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3874 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-18 00:43:14 EST, you write: << At 03:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: >Check out the new article on my website By G.D Mutch on an Interesting Flying saucer design >>>>>Geoff Egel >>>> >> What is the address of the website? When I tried to reach it the thing shifted pages or something. I must have a bad copy of the address (URL). Please help, Jiyani From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 19 08:36:28 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA17092; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:31:46 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 08:31:46 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802191631.AA05625@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Thu, 19 Feb 98 09:25:19 -0500 To: Subject: Re[2]: Permeability vs Frequency - Part Deux Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OFV6T2.0.eA4.hv5xq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3875 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello Dave, I wrote: >>Any ideas about whether this reaction to frequency is independent of >>amount of current? ie -- does tiny current @ high frequency have >>same effect on permeability as large current @ high frequency? You wrote: >I think I've missed something in your last few posts. >Could you please explain (again) the connection you see between frequency >(the material following the field in time) and amount of current >(saturation)? Did you mean "...as large current @ low frequency? What I'm wondering is this.......if a ferrite reacts with a decrease in permeability to a high frequency current.....what is the threshold current that will produce the effect? - And, would a small current have the same effect as a large one, or would a large current [at same freq] have a more pronounced effect? Mainly what I'm wondering is this -- Which would be more efficient [perhaps O/U]: 1 - apply high frequency energy to a ferrite core coil to reduce permeability [and hopefully it's reluctance to magnetic flux of permanent magnets] of the ferrite. 2 -applying energy to create an electromagnet that counteracts permanent magnets. Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 19 13:26:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA09893; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:02:30 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 13:02:30 -0800 (PST) From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <3c668838.34ec9d62@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 16:00:16 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Regarding request to post URLs Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"btdvB2.0.UQ2.at9xq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3876 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com It was suggested URL's of web sites by people on the list be posted. I have a somewhat technical but misc. items page at http://members.aol.com/Keasy Some people on the list may find some of the items of interest. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 19 23:04:40 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA27707; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 22:57:45 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 22:57:45 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:54:13 +1100 Message-Id: <199802200754.SAA00647@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@mail.sa.ozland.net.au (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Geoff Egel Subject: Re: Hyper Science Magnetic Chaos program Resent-Message-ID: <"kY8kf1.0.pm6.dbIxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3877 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Last Thursday the 19 Febraury on ABC TV I saw a program called Magnetic Chaos in the their science series Hyper Science If you are in Australia the program will be repeated on ABC Australian National TV at 12.30 pm Monday the 23 February and you too may also find it interesting. If I am able I will make a copy on video tape at this time. The program showed a Levitron in Action and more interesting a levitating grass hopper under a magnetic field. The program also dealt in some detail the effects of a magnetic reversal to Planet. and some time also spent on bio magnetics. The program is well worth seeing in my view. Geoff Egel http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 19 23:12:39 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA29303; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 23:10:05 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 23:10:05 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 19:06:33 +1100 Message-Id: <199802200806.TAA00721@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@mail.sa.ozland.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Geoff Egel Subject: Re: Vacuum Thrust Aircraft Resent-Message-ID: <"7htvA2.0.g97.9nIxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3878 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 02:45 PM 2/18/98 EST, you wrote: >I would like to check out your website. So, what is the address? > >Gene Batten >mdleb@nortel.ca > >In message "Vacuum Thrust Aircraft", you write: > >> At 03:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: >> >Check out the new article on my website By G.D Mutch on an Interesting >> Flying saucer design >> >>>>>Geoff Egel >> >>>> >> >> >sorry about that the address http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 enjoy Geoff > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 19 23:17:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA00379; Thu, 19 Feb 1998 23:15:35 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 23:15:35 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 19:11:56 +1100 Message-Id: <199802200811.TAA00767@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@mail.sa.ozland.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Geoff Egel Subject: Re: Vacuum Thrust Aircraft Resent-Message-ID: <"HXJQr.0.r5.KsIxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3879 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 02:27 AM 2/19/98 EST, you wrote: >In a message dated 98-02-18 00:43:14 EST, you write: > ><< At 03:22 PM 2/2/98 -0600, you wrote: > >Check out the new article on my website By G.D Mutch on an Interesting > Flying saucer design > >>>>>Geoff Egel > >>>> >> >What is the address of the website? When I tried to reach it the thing shifted >pages or something. I must have a bad copy of the address (URL). >Please help, >Jiyani > >you should be able to get it from my geocities site. I need to make some changes shortly to make it work properly geoff http://geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 >Geoff From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 04:13:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA22842; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 04:04:34 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 04:04:34 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 12:48:37 +0100 Message-Id: <199802201148.MAA17097@cache.hb.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@pop3.vossnet.de (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: JNaudin509@aol.com, ddameron@earthlink.net, mrandall@earthlink.net From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Re:MEP experiment Cc: vramos@ctv.es, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Resent-Message-ID: <"u5Qyv1.0.qa5.G5Nxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3880 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 01:55 20.02.1998 EST, JNaudin509@aol.com wrote: >On 20/02/1998 04:17:08 , ddameron@earthlink.net wrote : > ><< I think it was known before. I found it in a 1906 book reprinted by Lindsay > Pub's. "Experimental Science, Vol. 1" By Hopkins (from "Scientific > American". They called it "concurrent poles". > Of course, they knew no use for it then, so I'm glad you found it, did > tests, and pointed it out to us for thought, J-L! It is sort of like Greg. > W's 2 magnet RMOG test. Do you have a scanner, Michael, if so I can snail > mail the 2 pages to you. > -Dave > >> > >Hi All, > >Yes I am very interested to read this document....Concerning the MEP >experiment, I think that this effect is used in the Kawai motor for >example....and others kinds of motors... >The energy is located in the AIR GAP, don't forget that the NRG is greater in >the air gap than in the core !! because we have d= B^2 / (2 uo * ur ) (d in >J/cm^3) >Lower is the permeability of the medium (the vacuum/air is the best), greater >is the energy that could be tapped !! >This is the reason why the attractive force F of the steel ball by the metal >shield is strong : > > F= ( B^2 * S ) / (2 uo ) with B in Teslas, S in m^2, F in Newtons > >with u0=4 * pi * 10^7 we have : > > F = 400 000 * ( B^2 * S ) ( in the air gap ) > >Today, we need only to find a mean for tapping this energy IN THE AIR GAP.... >This will be done with a mechanical mean ( a quantum magnetic motor ) or by a >flat core placed in this small air gap ( a static device )... > Hi JL and all, maybe you can just wrap a big OUTPUT coil around the piece of steel, which holds the steel ball ! Then replace one magnet via a driver electromagnet and pulse it. Then the output coil will get huge dB/dt which will induce AC current. Now it is only the question, if this will be more power out than in... Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 06:23:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA10282; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 06:19:09 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 06:19:09 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980220211837.006d6b38@world.std.com> X-Sender: mica@world.std.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:18:37 +0000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Mitchell Swartz Subject: Re: Regarding request to post URLs In-Reply-To: <3c668838.34ec9d62@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"yyu8W2.0.aW2.R3Pxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3881 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Cold fusion is real. The world literature discussing the nuclear, metallurgical, and material science and engineering continues at a significant rate, although much of the literature is difficult to obtain in that the journals are not generally available in all libraries. Cold fusion is also consistent with conventional physics. More information is available at the following URL http://world.std.com/~mica/cft.html Dr. Mitchell Swartz (mica@world.std.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 08:09:30 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA27527; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:06:28 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:06:28 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:50:54 -0500 Subject: Re: Re[2]: Permeability vs Frequency - Part Deux Message-ID: <19980220.105357.6366.0.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <199802191631.AA05625@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-11,14-15,17-19 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"_HWLk.0.vj6.2eQxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3882 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Thu, 19 Feb 98 09:25:19 -0500 arager@mcgraw-hill.com writes: > > Mainly what I'm wondering is this -- Which would be more >efficient > 2 -applying energy to create an electromagnet that counteracts > permanent magnets. > > Anton Rager > arager@McGraw-Hill.com > I am looking into this effect in a smot based motor That I am trying to build. Want to try one setup that has an electromagnet "counteract" the last set of magnets in a smot array so it can "escape". Looking at Bearden's regauging concept as well. Gives me about three configuartions to try. Steve Heckman _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 08:13:21 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA27942; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:08:35 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:08:35 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: eskimo.com: billb owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 08:08:27 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Bill Wysock on Laura Lee Radio Show - February 21 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"ZVRsQ.0.Wq6.2gQxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3883 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com The renowned Tesla Coiler Bill Wysock is scheduled to be on the Laura Lee alternative science talk-radio show tomorrow evening. This show has national US distribution, so check out the Laura Lee website for a stations list, it might be available in your area. http://www.lauralee.com ((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))) William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb@eskimo.com www.eskimo.com/~billb EE/programmer/sci-exhibits science projects, tesla, weird science Seattle, WA 206-781-3320 freenrg-L taoshum-L vortex-L webhead-L ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 20:25:53 -0800 From: webmaster@lauralee.com To: billb@eskimo.com Subject: Laura Lee Show - February 21, 1998 Greetings from the Laura Lee Show. This weekly update of scheduled guests of The Laura Lee Show is by subscription only. If you receive this unsolicited someone else has entered you for subscription. If you wish not to receive these updates in the future you can "unsubscribe" at our website under "upcoming" or simply return this message with "unsubscribe" as the subject. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- GUEST/TOPIC LINE UP - SCHEDULED TO AIR THIS WEEK: Saturday, February 21, 1998 Bill Wysock William C. Wysock has been building Tesla Coils since 1962. In 1975, he developed a line of commercial grade Tesla Coils designed for sale to museums of science and industry, historical institutions, government and private research institutions. Ten standard models known as "Model One" through "Model Ten", were all built from the highest quality materials and components available. Each of these units featured a form of high voltage discharge electrode known as a "toroid." The use of this type of electrode greatly improved the working efficiency of each of these models, and was the result of many years of experimentation from 1962 up to 1975. In 1987, Mr. Wysock began a company known as Tesla Technology Research, specializing in high voltage engineering and development, providing equipment for sale and for lease/rental. One additional area of the company's involvement has been providing special effects for the motion picture/television/magazine/advertising media industries, both in still graphics and video promos. Our focus for the evening: looking back on the claim that Tesla was 100 years ahead of his time; Tesla as the real father of radio; the story behind Tesla's wireless power and the particle beam weapon; and wherever the callers take us. We'll have additional guests, to be announced. MORE TO COME ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you for your support of the Laura Lee Show. If you enjoy the show, please tell your friends to join us! And you can always join us via our live webcast, and the audio archives of each show which are posted each week by Sunday Noon. Live Webcast and Audio Archives are accessed via our AUDIO button. Show hours: Saturday 7 PM to Sunday 2 AM Pacific Saturday 8 PM to Sunday 3 AM Mountain Saturday 9 PM to Sunday 4 AM Central Saturday 10 PM to Sunday 5 AM Eastern For a complete list of stations carrying the Laura Lee Show, visit our website at http://www.lauralee.com/ and click on the TIMES & STATIONS button ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The list above of posted guests/topics represent what is scheduled when this is sent. Last minute and often unavoidable changes can occur. When a scheduled guest is unable to join us, well include a rescheduled time/date in the next email message to you. We apologize for any inconvenience. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 12:04:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA07421; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:51:51 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:51:51 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <48ddeb26.34eddeae@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:51:07 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: New animation on site (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"qpGMc3.0.lp1.KxTxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3884 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com There isnew animation on web page to help visualize my generator layout. Thanks, Butch LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 12:11:09 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA05801; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:55:57 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:55:57 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19980220194626.13734.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [206.129.11.97] From: "Chris Thomas" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Greg Watson Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 11:46:26 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"-ry7F3.0.ZQ1.A_Txq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3885 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Two questions:What is DMEC? How do I order a SMOT? Chris cjt642@hotmail.com Chris Thomas http://www.fortunecity.com/roswell/crystal/100/index.html Alternate Energy Research Project ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 14:48:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA01889; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:43:21 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:43:21 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19980220223851.14423.rocketmail@send1d.yahoomail.com> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 14:38:51 -0800 (PST) From: Anton Rager Subject: Ignore - Testing Mailer To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"2IcnC1.0.QT.6SWxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3886 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Test message to freenrg-l - new account == Anton Rager a_rager@yahoo.com _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 16:40:40 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA17374; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:28:34 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:28:34 -0800 Message-ID: <19980221002736.13883.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [152.163.206.88] From: "david lackey" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Hi Butch Content-Type: text/plain Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 16:27:35 PST Resent-Message-ID: <"iBYUS.0.MF4.m-Xxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3887 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Butch, could you do me a favor and forward a copy of subscribe/unsubscribe info for the free-energy list. Hotmail(now a microsoft product) deleted a bunch of my files without warning. If you could, could you send it to me at davelook@gsinet.net Thanks, Dave L ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 18:39:25 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA13059; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:33:49 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:33:49 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:25:17 -0500 Subject: Re: BIG Y can propell bar magnet rotor ? Message-ID: <19980220.212532.6374.2.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <199802181943.UAA16365@cache.hb.vossnet.de> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-7,9-13 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"n6sOZ3.0.bB3.BqZxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3888 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Wed, 18 Feb 1998 20:43:27 +0100 harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) writes: > >Maybe you can propell a rotating bar permanent magnet rotating inside >the "blue hole" via it ? > What is the blue hole? Is it a zone of decreased magnetic intensity on the quickfield simulations? Just curious. Steve Heckman _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 20 18:48:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA13372; Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:34:38 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 18:34:38 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 21:22:06 -0500 Subject: Re: Permeability vs Frequency - Part Deux Message-ID: <19980220.212532.6374.1.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> References: <199802181701.AA01898@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-4,6,8-17,19-28,30-31,36-37,39-45 From: steve-nyeoka@juno.com (Stephen L Heckman) Resent-Message-ID: <"Y9OEP2.0.dG3.vqZxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3889 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Wed, 18 Feb 98 09:50:11 -0500 arager@mcgraw-hill.com writes: > > Attached is a graph from www.ferronics.com showing how frequency > effects permeability in a T type ferrite [MnZn]. Looks like at > 0-100KHz it has about 10,000ui and starts to drop off past 100KHz. At > about 1MHz the permeability is about 2500ui....that's a %75 reduction > in permeability! This should be usable if this decease also > corresponds to how the ferrite will "conduct" external magnetic > fluxes from permanent magnets..... > > see http://www.ferronics.com/tuvsf.htm if unable to decode > attachment. > > > Any ideas about whether this reaction to frequency is independent > of amount of current? ie -- does tiny current @ high frequency have > same effect on permeability as large current @ high frequency? > > > What's the verdict? Look like a direction to explore? > > Anton Rager > arager@McGraw-Hill.com > > If a small ac field can affect the permeability to a steady magnetic field, then I think that this would be very useful. A simple test could perhaps use a ferrite rod between two magnets that are in repulsion. Perhaps one could be on an arm so it can "swing". Set it up so that magnet is "swung" up a bit. With a coil wound on that ferrite rod, apply a high freq. AC current, and see if the effect takes place (the magnet will swing closer to the rod). Also considered a transformer test setup, but would require external hi- and low-pass filters, etc. Is this along the line of what you are thinking? Steve Heckman _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 21 09:03:12 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA14325; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:00:53 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:00:53 -0800 Message-ID: <34EF080C.14567046@pavilion.co.uk> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 16:59:55 +0000 From: Robert Dowse Reply-To: redesign@pavilion.co.uk X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Greg Watson References: <19980220194626.13734.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Ybc5W3.0.iV3.3Xmxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3890 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Chris, Unless I am mistaken, there is a strong probability that DNEC and SMOT are hoaxes. RD Chris Thomas wrote: > > Two questions:What is DMEC? > How do I order a SMOT? > > Chris > > cjt642@hotmail.com Chris Thomas > http://www.fortunecity.com/roswell/crystal/100/index.html Alternate > Energy Research Project > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 21 12:49:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA15428; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:40:02 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 12:40:02 -0800 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 15:39:23 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Reed's Motor update.... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 116 Resent-Message-ID: <"3iLoZ.0.-m3.Xkpxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3891 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi All, Today, I have received from Nelson Camus some important informations and hints for the construction and the tuning about the Reed's motor (the QMM mk8). You will find these informations at : http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/qmmv8.htm I think that this will interest you.... Sincerely, Jean-Louis Naudin 02-21-98 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 21 17:19:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA28413; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:15:20 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:15:20 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: eskimo.com: billb owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:15:10 -0800 (PST) From: William Beaty To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <19980220194626.13734.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"Q5OEj2.0.nx6.dmtxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3892 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I just talked with Todd Knudtson, trknute@earthlink.net, a long time in the "Brown's Gas" arena. He's now temporarily subscribed to FREENRG-L. Todd has worked with Yull Brown since 1983, and is tired of all lack of progress and the greed/secrecy which builds such barriers in the Hydroxy gas technology field. He has an article on Eric Kreig's Skeptics page, and recently I posted a cleaned-up copy at: http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/freenrg/hydroxy.html Is anyone here interested in investigating the reports of physics anomalies involving "Hydroxy" gas? If so, Todd is interested in getting this information out into the hands of experimenters. This way the secrets might not be lost like so many other "unusual science" discoveries have been in the past. For direct contact, his phone # is 909-949-7354. His mother lives with him and has a heart condition, so please respect this and don't call him out of the blue, arrange calls by email first. ((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))) William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb@eskimo.com www.eskimo.com/~billb EE/programmer/sci-exhibits science projects, tesla, weird science Seattle, WA 206-781-3320 freenrg-L taoshum-L vortex-L webhead-L From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 21 17:59:20 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA15691; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:56:47 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 17:56:47 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980217123526.007a9690@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 12:35:26 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: References: <19980220194626.13734.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"b_3zv1.0.5r3.TNuxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3893 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 05:15 PM 2/21/98 -0800, you wrote: >I just talked with Todd Knudtson, trknute@earthlink.net, a long time >in the "Brown's Gas" arena. > >He's now temporarily subscribed to FREENRG-L. Todd has worked with Yull >Brown since 1983, and is tired of all lack of progress and the >greed/secrecy which builds such barriers in the Hydroxy gas technology >field. He has an article on Eric Kreig's Skeptics page, and recently I >posted a cleaned-up copy at: > > http://www.eskimo.com/~billb/freenrg/hydroxy.html > >Is anyone here interested in investigating the reports of physics >anomalies involving "Hydroxy" gas? If so, Todd is interested in getting >this information out into the hands of experimenters. This way the >secrets might not be lost like so many other "unusual science" discoveries >have been in the past. > >For direct contact, his phone # is 909-949-7354. His mother lives with >him and has a heart condition, so please respect this and don't call him >out of the blue, arrange calls by email first. > > >((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))) >William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website >billb@eskimo.com www.eskimo.com/~billb >EE/programmer/sci-exhibits science projects, tesla, weird science >Seattle, WA 206-781-3320 freenrg-L taoshum-L vortex-L webhead-L > > > This should work very well. Thanks. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 21 18:46:38 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA12780; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 18:38:33 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 18:38:33 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980221222209.00530a58@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 22:22:12 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"wt94V.0.X73.e-uxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3894 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 05:15 PM 2/21/98 -0800, you wrote: >I just talked with Todd Knudtson, trknute@earthlink.net, a long time >in the "Brown's Gas" arena. >William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website Hi: I remember receiving a video from an old acquaintance, Chris Bird, regarding Browns Gas. In it Brown is shown doing the various experiments referred to in the posted message. In the last years of his life Chris was a big proponent of Yull, although to be championed by Chris was I'd imagine a somewhat harrowing experience :^) Todd refers to a free energy aspect of Browns work in his post. By my calculations, a litre of browns gas has ~6650 joules of chemical energy stored within (at STP). At a kilo per litre of water, 67.8 kilograms of water suspended 10 meter above the earth will give an equivalent gravitational potential energy as one litre of Browns gas. I seem to remember in the video Brown using a pump based on the vacuum left after exploding the gas. As you (Todd) probably participated in such experiments with Yull, was the pump able to move this amount of water to this height? Last I heard Yull was claiming that fusing radioactive waste with the gas reduced it's radioactivity. Perhaps Todd would comment on this as well. KPN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 21 21:32:02 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA30835; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 21:24:26 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 21:24:26 -0800 Message-ID: <19980222052445.7520.rocketmail@send1c.yahoomail.com> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 21:24:45 -0800 (PST) From: Anton Rager Subject: Re: Greg Watson To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"h5z7G2.0.hX7.8Qxxq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3895 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > Chris Thomas wrote: > > > > Two questions:What is DMEC? > > How do I order a SMOT? > > > > Chris Hello Chris, Here's what I know. DMEC is the name of a company that Greg Watson created to research several magnetic OU motors/generators. SMOT [simple magnetic OU toy] is a magnetic toy. It is bascially a ramp with a steel ball, and magnets arranged to pull the ball up the ramp. The ball falls off the end of the ramp [due to gravity]....That part seems to work just fine, and is reproducable. Where the controversy arises is with later versions of the toy. Greg claimed things that others have not been able to reproduce. The verdict is still out on the OU part. PMOD and RMOG are other devices that Greg published info on, and JNL Labs tried to reproduce. Again, interesting devices -- but no verdict on the OU part yet. I've included some links at the end of this Email that you may want to check out. Here's the biggie -- Greg took orders for the SMOT thing [in it's supposed OU configuration], and has never shipped them....and stalled for a long time -- This has angered many on the list, and tarnished Greg's credibility. I wouldn't recommend ordering a SMOT kit -- even though Greg is still advertising them on his WWW page. My personal opinion is that Greg has published some valid research/info that should not be completely discarded. I also feel that Greg has mis-handled the SMOT kit thing.......and gotten poop on his sneakers. JNL Labs SMOT info: http://members.aol.com/overunity3/html/smotidx.htm JNL Labs RMOG info: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/rmog1.htm JNL Labs PMOD info: http://members.aol.com/overunity2/html/pmod.htm Greg Watson's Page: Http://www.microtronics.com.au/~gwatson/ Hope this helps -- Others will correct/clarify things more, but that's a real general picture. == Anton Rager a_rager@yahoo.com _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 21 22:58:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA08873; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 22:56:59 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 22:56:59 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980217173539.007a6870@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 17:35:39 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980221222209.00530a58@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"xu4Ed.0.ZA2.vmyxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3896 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 10:22 PM 2/21/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 05:15 PM 2/21/98 -0800, you wrote: > >>I just talked with Todd Knudtson, trknute@earthlink.net, a long time >>in the "Brown's Gas" arena. >>William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website > >Hi: > >I remember receiving a video from an old acquaintance, Chris Bird, >regarding Browns Gas. In it Brown is shown doing the various >experiments referred to in the posted message. In the last years >of his life Chris was a big proponent of Yull, although to be >championed by Chris was I'd imagine a somewhat harrowing experience :^) > >Todd refers to a free energy aspect of Browns work in his post. >By my calculations, a litre of browns gas has ~6650 joules of chemical >energy stored within (at STP). At a kilo per litre of water, 67.8 kilograms >of water suspended 10 meter above the earth will give an equivalent >gravitational potential energy as one litre of Browns gas. I seem >to remember in the video Brown using a pump based on the vacuum left >after exploding the gas. As you (Todd) probably participated in >such experiments with Yull, was the pump able to move this amount >of water to this height? > >Last I heard Yull was claiming that fusing radioactive waste with >the gas reduced it's radioactivity. Perhaps Todd would comment on >this as well. > >KPN > Dear Bill, I had spoken to Chris Bird on many occasions by phone, but there was only one occasion where Brown, Chris and I met together in 1990, in Ontario California. We spoke long hours, over a two day period, concerning the future of Browns gas, and strategies for advancing these technologies. Prior to his death, Chris was preparing a book, that I hear is yet unpublished, but is complete and in the possession of his widow. I have been told that she plans to publish this final work soon, but I have not heard if this has been done. In many articles, Chris was very supportive, and clearly documented many of the key anomalies of the Hydroxy reactions specific to Browns gas. If I remember right, the titles of some of Chris's books were, "The secret life of Soils and The Secret Life of plants". In this next book Chris was to devote several chapters to Browns work, and the stories of greed and repression that surround this and other efforts specific to Hydrogen technologies. One of the key issues that Chris was seeking to get out to the public, is the electrical energy storage potential of Brown's Gas. Hydrogen and Oxygen suspended in a common gas. Unlike conventional Hydrogen, that is suspended away from the Oxygen, as separated by Photosynthesis of the Chloroplasts, in the bonding of Hydrogen to Carbon. These mechanics of Nature, in forming living structures of energy suspension, were the focus of Chris's interest. These critical structures in Nature, form the linking in saccharides, or sugars and carbohydrates. Secondary to these structures is the additional use of the Hydroxyl bond to construct Glycogen and simple Starches. Polysaccharide structures and once again the hydroxyl reaction forms the foundation of understanding the construction of not only Tubril and Fibril structures that form stalk, branch, and trunk, supporting structure of plants, and the side linking of Hydrogen bonds in the formation of sheet structures in leaves. The control and manipulation of these critical structures of Nature, Chris saw as a key hope to improve crop yields and the general health of plant growth. At this lowest level of the food chain lies the energy suspension that eventually works its way to human energy, through the food chain. By learning of our work in this area Chris was able to see direct correlation to "micro"-biology and what we were learning to understand in the "macro", by examining the macro mechanical dynamics of the Hydroxyl reaction, (bench top). Correlation's between the work we were doing in the energy transfer, internal to the electrolytic suspension of Hydrogen and Oxygen, Chris paralleled with the work of others in the "micro"-biological studies of plant growth and yields. He saw that the physical characteristics and properties of our Hydroxyl reactions, were in direct accordance with the suspected relationships hinted to by Biological Researchers and key to understanding the charges and prohibeters of these micro level reactions. The greatest contribution of Chris was that he presented a clear and multi disciplined insight into a more cosmological approach to biology and scientific research. He pointed out that 'it is one thing to gaze into a micro scope and surmise that this reaction existed, still yet another (as we were doing) to reproduce it, evaluate it, and manipulate it in the real time real world on a bench top'. Nuclear Reduction. I do like the use of the term "fussing away" the harmful effects left by mans destruction of Natures structure of the atom. I would say God's structure but that might raise some unnecessary comments or attitudes. Fussing, in this reference implies to bring together. It my sound a bit mystical or hokey, but the example of the reduction of the half life seems more like the damage to the atomic structure is being healed or repaired. This is not as far fetched as it may sound. The Hydroxy reaction most often exhibits a constructive contractive nature in its manifest in physical effects. To see that the contracted, closed or healed reduction of fission, opened or damaged effects of what has split the original atomic structure would be very consistent with other observable characteristics of Hydroxyl reactions. True reductions were tested many times and replicated. This is one of the main areas where, I personally, want to see this general study of Hydroxy to advance. The foundations slowly confirmed about this unique energy system, will point the way to further understanding how this "observed" nuclear reduction effect is happening. I hope that the open and careful study of Hydroxy will begin to clear away the skepticism that seems to exist when these things are even spoken of, let alone said to have been demonstrated. I do not feel as some, that what is taking place is a simple incineration of the supporting material, thus releasing the harmful radiation. I would however suggest that much more qualified persons than I conduct the tests. My only hope is that they would put a concerted effort into evaluating this effect, rather than just a cursory dismissal after a few experiments. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 00:03:50 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA13464; Sat, 21 Feb 1998 23:59:13 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 23:59:13 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980222034137.00533268@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 03:41:41 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"rbju_1.0.II3.Fhzxq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3897 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 05:35 PM 2/17/98 -0800, you wrote: >Nuclear Reduction. > >I do like the use of the term "fussing away" the harmful effects left by >mans destruction of Natures structure of the atom. I would say God's >structure but that might raise some unnecessary comments or attitudes. >Fussing, in this reference implies to bring together. It my sound a bit >mystical or hokey, but the example of the reduction of the half life seems >more like the damage to the atomic structure is being healed or repaired. >This is not as far fetched as it may sound. The Hydroxy reaction most >often exhibits a constructive contractive nature in its manifest in >physical effects. To see that the contracted, closed or healed reduction >of fission, opened or damaged effects of what has split the original atomic >structure would be very consistent with other observable characteristics of >Hydroxyl reactions. By "fusing" I was referring to the fusion of the radioactive material with the carrier or substrate. The resulting glass makes an ideal waste container. I am also aware that the rate of decay itself for certain materials can be altered by physical and chemical means. Whether reaction in a plasma torch does this remains to be seen; I was hoping you would describe these experiments in a bit more detail. If the latter is the theorized means; first order of experiment might be to integrate the output of a geiger counter as the reaction occurs to measure total radiant output. If this can be correlated to the decay rate after reaction...you get the idea I'm sure. > >True reductions were tested many times and replicated. This is one of the >main areas where, I personally, want to see this general study of Hydroxy >to advance. The foundations slowly confirmed about this unique energy >system, will point the way to further understanding how this "observed" >nuclear reduction effect is happening. I hope that the open and careful >study of Hydroxy will begin to clear away the skepticism that seems to >exist when these things are even spoken of, let alone said to have been >demonstrated. > >I do not feel as some, that what is taking place is a simple incineration >of the supporting material, thus releasing the harmful radiation. I would >however suggest that much more qualified persons than I conduct the tests. >My only hope is that they would put a concerted effort into evaluating this >effect, rather than just a cursory dismissal after a few experiments. > >Love > >TR Knudtson > Well, that would be my first concern too. After all, with temperatures reaching such extremes as you describe it stands to reason that some fraction of the material would be vaporized. Then it remains for the reaction chamber walls to provide a barrier. Of course, vaporizing the sample and redepositing on the walls will produce a lesser geiger counter reading just based on the volumetric expansion of the material. You know, I'm thinking about it now and I don't think I'd want to do it in the garage, eh? If the chamber wall ruptures you'd have a baby Chernobyl in your backyard :^( KPN PS: fellow Vort Robert Eachus posted an excellent series of monologues on atomic hydrogen torches, check the archive. These devices use an arc to disassociate normal H2 gas. The resulting plasma is pretty hellacious. Of course, this is somewhat different than burning the gas resulting from electrolysis of water. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 09:27:18 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA23805; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 09:23:59 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 09:23:59 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218040243.007a48e0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 04:02:43 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980222034137.00533268@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"GfbEx1.0.tp5.jy5yq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3898 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 03:41 AM 2/22/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 05:35 PM 2/17/98 -0800, you wrote: >>Nuclear Reduction. >> >>I do like the use of the term "fussing away" the harmful effects left by >>mans destruction of Natures structure of the atom. I would say God's >>structure but that might raise some unnecessary comments or attitudes. >>Fussing, in this reference implies to bring together. It my sound a bit >>mystical or hokey, but the example of the reduction of the half life seems >>more like the damage to the atomic structure is being healed or repaired. >>This is not as far fetched as it may sound. The Hydroxy reaction most >>often exhibits a constructive contractive nature in its manifest in >>physical effects. To see that the contracted, closed or healed reduction >>of fission, opened or damaged effects of what has split the original atomic >>structure would be very consistent with other observable characteristics of >>Hydroxyl reactions. > >By "fusing" I was referring to the fusion of the radioactive material >with the carrier or substrate. The resulting glass makes an ideal >waste container. I am also aware that the rate of decay itself >for certain materials can be altered by physical and chemical means. >Whether reaction in a plasma torch does this remains to be seen; >I was hoping you would describe these experiments in a bit more detail. > >If the latter is the theorized means; first order of experiment >might be to integrate the output of a geiger counter as the >reaction occurs to measure total radiant output. If this can >be correlated to the decay rate after reaction...you get the idea >I'm sure. > >> >>True reductions were tested many times and replicated. This is one of the >>main areas where, I personally, want to see this general study of Hydroxy >>to advance. The foundations slowly confirmed about this unique energy >>system, will point the way to further understanding how this "observed" >>nuclear reduction effect is happening. I hope that the open and careful >>study of Hydroxy will begin to clear away the skepticism that seems to >>exist when these things are even spoken of, let alone said to have been >>demonstrated. >> >>I do not feel as some, that what is taking place is a simple incineration >>of the supporting material, thus releasing the harmful radiation. I would >>however suggest that much more qualified persons than I conduct the tests. >>My only hope is that they would put a concerted effort into evaluating this >>effect, rather than just a cursory dismissal after a few experiments. >> >>Love >> >>TR Knudtson >> > >Well, that would be my first concern too. After all, with temperatures >reaching such extremes as you describe it stands to reason that some >fraction of the material would be vaporized. Then it remains for the >reaction chamber walls to provide a barrier. Of course, vaporizing >the sample and redepositing on the walls will produce a lesser >geiger counter reading just based on the volumetric expansion of >the material. You know, I'm thinking about it now and I don't >think I'd want to do it in the garage, eh? If the chamber wall >ruptures you'd have a baby Chernobyl in your backyard :^( > >KPN > >PS: fellow Vort Robert Eachus posted an excellent series of monologues >on atomic hydrogen torches, check the archive. These devices use >an arc to disassociate normal H2 gas. The resulting plasma is >pretty hellacious. Of course, this is somewhat different than >burning the gas resulting from electrolysis of water. > > I will review these files. :) When discussing the phenomenon of Hydroxyl reactions the direct correlation to plasma states is most evident. In later years I have begun to call this reaction (Electro Chemical Plasma). I often avoid using this name because others are more familiar with the names "Hydroxy" defining this reaction in chemical terms or "Brown's Gas", referencing this system with deference to one of the discovers, and popularization of this reaction. I do prefer the term (Electro Chemical Plasma), as the more accurate, when describing this new science. It is far more descriptive and definitive of the scientific observed Phenomenon. Lets look at some of the valuable characteristics that make this reaction of value, specific to processes involving direct incineration of various materials, including nuclear waste. First, this flame is continuously contractive, as it burns it is consumed by its self. It is always returning to water, the source of it's formation. When viewed in reference to incineration in a contained space, the result is a small relative degradation of the volume of the contained space. This differs much with reference to conventional combustion in that the gasses necessary to form heat sources of half the potential these "Hydroxyl" heat releases. The spent gasses of conventional combustion require the addition of scrubbers, condensers, and paths for effluent discharge i.e. Smoke stacks or venting. These parameters of consideration, are not at issue when employing Hydroxy sourced flames. To differentiate this new type of combustion I have coined the term "Im-bustion", form the combination of terms, (Implosive - Combustion). With regard these later issues are of great concern when looking at the possible incineration of Nuclear waste. The shear volume of spent gasses that can become charged with liberated radiation only compounds the problem when considering the use of conventional methods of combustion in the destruction of Nuclear Waste. With "Electro Chemical Plasma" this is all but eliminated. This opens up totally new vistas for incineration of all types. With specific reference to Nuclear Waste these particular design parameters of ECP offer direct incineration in a vacuum. One, this flame can uniquely produce all it's heat characteristics as it contains all of the necessary elements to maintain "Im-bustion" or this new type of combustion. Atomic level plasma states do not require the exothermic heat, to obtain plasma reaction levels. It is, pure plasma. There is no need to break carbon bonds associated with normal hydrocarbon combustion as there are no carbon bonds to break. The necessity to liberate hydrogen from carbon suspension in normal combustion, retards the reaction of conventional combustion, by requiring the absorption of some of the energy "heat" to simply sustain the reaction. This is not present or an issue in this plasma state or "energy system". To then postulate that this is a "New Type of Fire" is not such a large stretch, when some of these parameters are more clearly understood. Admittedly this was however a bold statement to make as a 15 year old child, to have "Reinvented Fire" or at least redefined a new type of combustion. I do not mean to get all "ZEN" on you, but I do believe that Science needs to be experienced and "KNOWN" to be advanced properly. It is my hope that I may describe new experiences with regard to this "New Fire" so that others can begin to conceptualize or to construct mental models or visualizations of these processes. I invite and relish the questions of others, as their independent nature, forces me to find new ways to describe what I have seen. I also hope that these discussions further stimulate additional hypotheses as to the elemental physics that surround these new conditions of energy and mater. You will find that I most often resist the compulsion to state definitively, "this is this way, or this means that". As I do not want to limit speculative thought by myself becoming a hard fast authority. I most often will describe rather than define. I do take some latitude in naming some things, as to set conceptual references only. Often this is the providence of those who have gone their first, but in no way do I wish to cloud this process of exploration with my singular understanding. I see true scientific progress, as a collective pursuit, most usually negatively influenced by what I call "Intellectual Inertia". I hope rather, that I try to keep these discussions open, with supporting information and few unsubstantiated speculative assumptions. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 10:38:38 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA02482; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 10:36:03 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 10:36:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980222141831.00534d40@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 14:18:35 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"_gDM13.0.dc.G07yq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3899 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 04:02 AM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >First, this flame is continuously contractive, as it burns it is consumed >by its self. It is always returning to water, the source of it's >formation. When viewed in reference to incineration in a contained space, >the result is a small relative degradation of the volume of the contained >space. This differs much with reference to conventional combustion in that >the gasses necessary to form heat sources of half the potential these >"Hydroxyl" heat releases. The spent gasses of conventional combustion >require the addition of scrubbers, condensers, and paths for effluent >discharge i.e. Smoke stacks or venting. These parameters of consideration, >are not at issue when employing Hydroxy sourced flames. To differentiate >this new type of combustion I have coined the term "Im-bustion", form the >combination of terms, (Implosive - Combustion). Uhh, why not do away with the middleman and treat the waste directly in an electric arc? Clearly more efficient as you've cut out the step of creating the gas. Also the reaction chamber is spared the constant influx of water... I remember seeing several researchers heading in this direction a few years ago. I've not kept abreast of this; waste remediation is not the sort of thing one dabbles in for the reasons previously mentioned. >I hope rather, that I try to keep these discussions open, with supporting >information and few unsubstantiated speculative assumptions. > >Love > >TR Knudtson > Couldn't agree with you more. Please go ahead and describe the actual experiments done involving waste remediation. Believe it or not, there are people lurking on this thing with all the hardware needed to do these things safely. What draws them in to the loop is discussion of experiment. If you have signed NDA's with Brown say so and we'll shift the focus of discussion. KPN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 11:41:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA09618; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:39:25 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:39:25 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 11:37:52 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802221937.LAA24163@sweden.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: mrandall@mail.earthlink.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Michael Randall Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Resent-Message-ID: <"4XKbl1.0.CM2.gx7yq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3900 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 05:15 PM 2/21/98 -0800, billb@eskimo.com wrote: >I just talked with Todd Knudtson, trknute@earthlink.net, a long time >in the "Brown's Gas" arena. >>> Hi Todd, Welcome to freenrg-l! There are a handful of researchers on this list that are familiar with this topic. There also have been some interest in the DOE to looking at alternative solutions to the radiation waste disposal problems at nuclear power plants. Hal Fox, the editor of New Energy News, tel: (801)583-6232, mentioned this last month when I talked to him over the telephone. If you can give Hal a call, you might be able to get some interest in developing the Hydroxy gas method of waste disposal. Sincerely, Michael Randall From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 14:39:14 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA22650; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 14:32:59 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 14:32:59 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218091258.007a5770@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 09:12:58 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980222141831.00534d40@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"xUFlA3.0.kX5.OUAyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3901 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 02:18 PM 2/22/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 04:02 AM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >>First, this flame is continuously contractive, as it burns it is consumed >>by its self. It is always returning to water, the source of it's >>formation. When viewed in reference to incineration in a contained space, >>the result is a small relative degradation of the volume of the contained >>space. This differs much with reference to conventional combustion in that >>the gasses necessary to form heat sources of half the potential these >>"Hydroxyl" heat releases. The spent gasses of conventional combustion >>require the addition of scrubbers, condensers, and paths for effluent >>discharge i.e. Smoke stacks or venting. These parameters of consideration, >>are not at issue when employing Hydroxy sourced flames. To differentiate >>this new type of combustion I have coined the term "Im-bustion", form the >>combination of terms, (Implosive - Combustion). > >Uhh, why not do away with the middleman and treat the waste directly >in an electric arc? Clearly more efficient as you've cut out the >step of creating the gas. Also the reaction chamber is spared the >constant influx of water... I remember seeing several researchers >heading in this direction a few years ago. I've not kept abreast >of this; waste remediation is not the sort of thing one dabbles >in for the reasons previously mentioned. > >>I hope rather, that I try to keep these discussions open, with supporting >>information and few unsubstantiated speculative assumptions. >> >>Love >> >>TR Knudtson >> > >Couldn't agree with you more. Please go ahead and describe the >actual experiments done involving waste remediation. Believe it >or not, there are people lurking on this thing with all the >hardware needed to do these things safely. What draws them in >to the loop is discussion of experiment. If you have signed >NDA's with Brown say so and we'll shift the focus of discussion. > >KPN > > > The insights and experiments that I share here are mine and not those of Brown. Brown early on saw that I had a clear understanding of this gas and it's implications. I had after all been working with hydrogen for over 17 years, when Brown and I became friends. I will now and always be supportive of his efforts, to see that this new technology would be circulated to all the world. I have helped Brown to this end, buy being instrumental in helping him find people in the United States, that have offered and assisted him in his efforts, as well as being a strong advocate for the application of this gas in industry. I claim and feel strongly responsible for his agreeing to go to China, as this decision came only after much sole searching and a lot of encouragement on my part. I may point out that I have always shared all of my work openly with Brown, but for more than 15 years, there has been little published or suggested in these areas. I am very respectful of Yull, as the person who took this technology forward, with the development of the welders in the early 80s. My criticism if any lies, in the fact that to date not much more information exists about this gas other than to say, that it gets very hot. Brown has previously stated that "No one understands this gas as Todd does". Make no mistake, this is not to say that I have the total formal understanding of how this energy system works. I will say that each and every thing that I will talk about I have done, tested, and tried. If not you will clearly hear me say things like "I think, or it should be so, or does it not fallow that". To answer directly, these are my tests, my discoveries, my work, and I have my full permission to discuss them. Brown's patents have run out, and still he has offered only demonstrations of these principles and attributes. He asked me for 20 years of silence, so that he could pursue his patents, 3 years more than he had obtained from the 17 year allocation by law. My 20 years to work and not publish ended last March, I think I have been fair and have restrained myself in a most ethical manner. I am not angry with Brown or upset with his lack of progress, but we do differ in many ways. I do not think that a discoverer of a "new" principle of science, should seek to limit the access of others to such information. It is as if to say, that Ben Franklin should control the development of the Microwave, simply because it also employs electricity. Further would it stand, that the Personal computer, is a derivative of the work on the "light bulb" of Thomas Edison, and the eventual development of the Vacuum Tube, which led directly to the development of computers. Brown has wrongfully stated, that anything that uses Brown's gas owes royalty to him. My personal agreement with him withstanding, I do see this as wrong. I have chosen rather to share my work with others freely. My designs deal in many areas of Hydrogen technology not only Browns gas. I also work in Magnetism, Biochemistry, Volcanism, Anthropology, Inertial Drive Systems, Magnetic Suspension Systems, Dynamic Breaking and Energy Conservation systems, High Atmospheric Studies, Bio-mechanics, Neurology, Electro Physics, Explosives and Explosive Technologies. Brown's gas, is more a hobby of mine than a full time pursuit. Please do not infer that I seek in any way to minimize the importance of this discovery. I hope eventually to see that Brown takes his place in history as the "Crowning Achievement" in Science of a century of great advances for man. He deserves this even if it is proven that his work stems mainly from the earlier efforts of William Rhodes. Rhodes, must also be faced with the hard question, of what he had been able to do to advance "This New Science" and understanding, if the Hydroxyl reaction is as claimed, developed by him in 1966. Brown's machines or copies of them are to be found on every continent on earth. Can Rhodes claim this to be said of his work? Do Brown and I not see "Eye to Eye"? Some of our arguments would rage on for weeks. Does this mean that I disrespect him? Not in the least, his work will one day, be well documented and understood. Did he force me to 20 years of silence? No, I saw it as only fair and gave freely all the help that I could, to him and his work, but that time has passed. Now I near the end of my career, I have the freedom to speak with whom I want, and share with anyone who is respectful, any and all information I have. I like Science, I like doing Science, but I find the effort of no consequence if it is not shared with others. The corporatization of knowledge, in the later part of this Century, I view as a scourge on the development of man. It may be claimed as "good business", but I feel that science should somehow be a help to business not controlled by it. The dream of Inventors, is that they will someday control a technology, is an ill-fated fantasy at best. On a whole, the best of inventions yield only heartache and disappointment, to those who foolishly seek to self-market in today's "Mega Corporation" controlled economic times. The democratization of information, is what I would hope for Science and Education. I do however fear that this too, is becoming an obsolete and "old fashioned" idea. In defense of Big Business, I would point out that very few individuals could support the effort to bring forward a technology in today's world. The staffing and resources that major corporations can bring to bear on a given project is unparalleled. I had a discussion recently surrounding Bill Gates, and the Computer Software Industry. My point was well taken when I stated my belief that, "Bill Gates today, with all his wealth, could not compete with his own company Micro Soft, even if he were to try". I just wish heads of cooperation's had more vision and foresight to see that research should be often funded for no other reason then to help others or man in general, the "spin-offs" could be easily cross marketed. Sorry for the soap boxing. (Smile) Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 15:15:42 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA31084; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:13:20 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:13:20 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 00:12:49 +0100 Message-Id: <199802222312.AAA12360@cache.hb.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@pop3.vossnet.de (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" To: JNaudin509@aol.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Status of our RMOD device... Cc: dave dameron , mrandall@earthlink.net, vramos@ctv.es Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id PAA31018 Resent-Message-ID: <"23ZWl2.0.Tb7.D4Byq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3902 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi JL and all, today I met with Dieter Bauer and we vsisited a friend of ours, who is building our RMOD for us. Cause he is very experienced in doing mechanical work and also has a mechanical lab we let him build the device and we only do proposals for modification and setup. So far he has build a rotor with 5 arms carrying iron-steel pieces at the outer rim and one SMOT ramp as a stator. You can imagine it, if you put Jean Louis´s design of his RMOD at a 90 degree turn. This way it is not yet running, but the magnetic forces are at work and sometimes it seems not to stop, but after a while it is stoping to turn. We hope, that by placing a total of 4 SMOT ramps equally spaced around the circle, the 5 arm rotor will not stop to rotate. Thus there will be forces which attract all the time the iron steel pieces into the ramps. We found out that there is a nice magnet material called BETAFLEX, which could ideally be used for the SMOT ramps. It is some kind of barium ferrite permanent magnet material glued together with some binder material and you can buy it at local permanent magnet stores in dimensions like 500 mm length x 24 mm width x 8 mm thickness and it has the right polarisation. If you put this flexible "ribbon-tape" magnet (belt magnet) onto an iron bar-backplate, it is like a SMOT MK1 design. So the magnetic field inside a ramp is very homogenous ! You have to make the ramp like a "V" form to get an increased flux density inside the ramp ! Our friend is using special steelbar angles to distribute and diverse the magnetic flux at the "blue hole" location to get there an "easy exit" of the rotorarm ironsteel piece ! Unfortunately my digital camera is broken in this moment, so I could not tape it. The next thing we will try is to get more BETAFLEX material to build the missing 3 SMOT ramps around the rotor and fiddle as long as to get it to run perpetually. Also we will try to use different shaped rotor ironsteel material ! In this moment it is still a piece of a ironsteel cylinder about 1.5 cm in diameter and 3 cms long which goes into the ramp, but we will also try triangular shaped rotor-steel pieces which could have an easier "exit-ramp" condition ! So far for now it looks pretty promising, but you never know... I hope to report soon some more news on it. Comments are welcome. Best regardsm, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 15:15:44 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA31124; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:13:28 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:13:28 -0800 Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 00:12:37 +0100 Message-Id: <199802222312.AAA12352@cache.hb.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@pop3.vossnet.de (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" To: JNaudin509@aol.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Re: MEP conditions.... ! Cc: dave dameron , mrandall@earthlink.net, vramos@ctv.es Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id PAA31060 Resent-Message-ID: <"4LGN52.0.8c7.L4Byq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3903 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi JL and all, today I met with Dieter Bauer and we also spoke abour your MEP experiments at: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/jlnaudin/html/mep1.htm We tried to solve it via magnetic schematics diagrams and came to the conclusion: 1. You have to try it with an electromagnet to be able to say anything about it. 2. If using an electromagnet instead of the second magnet you MUST BE ABLE to produce at least a factor of > 2 (bigger 2) of flux density (B) change at your hall probe down at at the ironsteel-bar from the relationship: flux density with powered driver coil / flux density without powered driver coil > 2 If you get for instance 0.4 Tesla without power to the driver coil you need to get at least > 0.8 Tesla flux density with powering the coil ! Also this will NOT YET TELL you, if you would get this circuit to OU operation. Cause you are using big air gaps in your simple experiment a lot of flux is lost, which will not apply in a machine with an iron rotor and smaller airgaps. There the conditions could be tottaly different, also if the rotor is turning and changing the airgaps dynamically ! So, if you can´t fullfill the 2 upper conditions, it is hopeless to build anything based on your experiment. Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 15:55:01 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA05125; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:52:32 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:52:32 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218103234.007a3a80@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 10:32:34 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980222141831.00534d40@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"yCdf1.0.uF1.-eByq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3904 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 02:18 PM 2/22/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 04:02 AM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >>First, this flame is continuously contractive, as it burns it is consumed >>by its self. It is always returning to water, the source of it's >>formation. When viewed in reference to incineration in a contained space, >>the result is a small relative degradation of the volume of the contained >>space. This differs much with reference to conventional combustion in that >>the gasses necessary to form heat sources of half the potential these >>"Hydroxyl" heat releases. The spent gasses of conventional combustion >>require the addition of scrubbers, condensers, and paths for effluent >>discharge i.e. Smoke stacks or venting. These parameters of consideration, >>are not at issue when employing Hydroxy sourced flames. To differentiate >>this new type of combustion I have coined the term "Im-bustion", form the >>combination of terms, (Implosive - Combustion). > >Uhh, why not do away with the middleman and treat the waste directly >in an electric arc? Clearly more efficient as you've cut out the >step of creating the gas. Also the reaction chamber is spared the >constant influx of water... I remember seeing several researchers >heading in this direction a few years ago. I've not kept abreast >of this; waste remediation is not the sort of thing one dabbles >in for the reasons previously mentioned. > >>I hope rather, that I try to keep these discussions open, with supporting >>information and few unsubstantiated speculative assumptions. >> >>Love >> >>TR Knudtson >> > >Couldn't agree with you more. Please go ahead and describe the >actual experiments done involving waste remediation. Believe it >or not, there are people lurking on this thing with all the >hardware needed to do these things safely. What draws them in >to the loop is discussion of experiment. If you have signed >NDA's with Brown say so and we'll shift the focus of discussion. > >KPN > > Cutting out the "energy" middle man. Inherent in the designs of the welders was the need to force the production of quantities of gas to meet the demand of cutting and braising applications. Typically these units function at voltages of from 24 to 30 Volts DC. The actual voltages that are required to produce the disassociation of water are between 1.45 and 1.6 Volts DC. Considering that most threshold voltages of Photo Voltaic cells is 2.4 Volts DC, more than enough power exists to develop atomic gasification of water. Viewed with solar powered energy, factored in as the prime energy source, the gas becomes virtually free. The currents necessary to sustain these Arcs used for incineration, is greatly higher than is practically available in Solar, Photo Voltaic Systems. Yes the obvious cost of amortizing out the original cost of establishing a Solar field, is a consideration. I do see however that these two technologies are married with regard to future applications of both. Wind certainly can augment this source also. The optimum placement of such a facility would be a windy hill, where the sun shines often, and surrounding communities produce a lot of garbage. I might also point out that this application does not require the fire-up or warm up times, usually associated with many oven based technologies, just start up the conveyors and fire the burners. Simple experiment, hook a small Solar Cell to two mild steel plates immersed in an electrolyte solution, I prefer a 20% by weight, solution of Potassium Hydroxide and demineralized water. At about 7:45 am on a clear day your unit is ready to go. Hold the plates in electrolyte about 1/4" to 3/8" away and you will see the bubbles of these gasses being released. Storage systems of non conductive fiberglass containers, also affords the reservoir for gas storage when the plant is not operating. Additionally when the aggregate material has been treated, the ash can then be subjected to more intense segregation, by the discriminating effects of this gas. High heat yielding materials such as silicates, can be used to form compound heat internal to processing vessels. A simple rotary retort, can be used to separate materials by their friction, or cohesive effects. Rare minerals tend to collect by an induced affinity to themselves. Low melting point minerals such as Zinc or Led, can be simply blown a through chain mesh conveyors early in the extraction process. Oxides, of heavy metals can be contained in scrubbing systems to be later reprocessed. Scrubbing systems, such as water vapor and lime can easily capture 99% of all effluent materials. The resultant paste can then be subjected to further extraction by smelting out of the materials in small, contained volumes. The purified lime, can then be ground up to be reused in the process. I may point out that the "non reactive" nature of this gas to Aluminum and Concrete, makes these two substances a very good choice for the lining of and rotary retort or processing drums. The value of rotary systems used when processing these materials, is found in the ability to present material in process, over and over to the flame rack. The adjustment of incline of these retorts can determine the processing times for any and all continuant aggregate materials. The addition of steam generation in the initial phases of incineration insures a cash byproduct of this process, Electrical energy, as a great majority of all materials in land fills are combustible. The supper high temperatures insures a clean and efficient burn of all materials. Secondary High temperature, re-burn of resultant ash, up stream of effluent gasses and insure total sublimation of any materials, at 1.2 times the temperature of the sun. All sustained at a source voltage of 2.4 Volts DC. Electro static separation of vaporous Oxides also insures a source of segregated materials to be sold back to private industry. Yes even the dust, and ash can be sold, as extremely high grade purified silica, and carbon to the electronic industry. Please point to the "middle man". Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 17:05:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA18150; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 17:02:04 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 17:02:04 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980222204545.00539680@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:45:48 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"cNCvy1.0.UR4.AgCyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3905 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com >Cutting out the "energy" middle man. Reeeeeeeally big snip > >Please point to the "middle man". > >Love > >TR Knudtson > > The gas itself. Running the cells at 2.4 volts means 50% efficiency, at many 1000's of amps to fire a reasonably sized furnace. Where does the rest of the power go? As heat dissipated in the electrolyzer. Whereas with direct application of the arc all the power goes direcly into the reactor vessel. Inverter technology has reached a point where >95% efficiency is common. With special catalysts the electrolytic cells can be made more efficient at high power levels, but now the cell cost shoots up. I did a lot of work on cathode cell catalysts in the '80s, trying to deal with just that problem. Yull's use of stainless steel was a good practical choice, as conversion efficiency was not a big factor in the welding industry. It becomes more of an issue when you're talking about big disposal plants. My choice of power source for radioactive materials processing would have to be, uh, atomic batteries. You'll be floating in the stuff after all, states will be standing in line to give it to you. O^) Of course, that begs the question as to why you'd want to dispose of the rad waste at all... ask the japanese, purchasing hugh stockpiles of plutonium from us. Hell, wouldn't you? All the mess is generated in making the stuff. Altogether though I am glad it's moving to the other side of the world. Paul Brown, are you out there? KPN By the way, thanks for the process description. Its remarkable what can be done with the water gas welding system. The real value for me in this technology was the convienence of gas generation (no tanks to rent) and the ease of small scale processing of materials. One of these days I'll have to build another one and play with the stuff again. Talking about it with you is giving me that old itch again. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 18:40:49 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA08543; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 18:38:31 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 18:38:31 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218131338.007a5100@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:13:38 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Adaptive Technologies Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"3Zrv2.0.F52.a4Eyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3906 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hydrogen Burners: Here is a project that that I hope many will enjoy. It has long been a hobby of mine to come with adaptive technologies for the implementation of Hydrogen in conventional appliances, ovens and stoves and water heaters. I see these things as important to those who dream of the energy independent home. Hydrogen can be extracted from water easily using low voltage DC current, and fortunately separates into totally pure gasses, of Oxygen and hydrogen. Storage of these separated gasses markedly more safe than Hydroxy systems. And even leaks internal to the home environment are of increased safety over natural gas, as Hydrogen is non toxic. Even if leeks were to develop the gas is so light that it dissipates out and away even through the tinniest of cracks. To insure against the build up of any hydrogen in a home the simple addition of a escape vent at a high position in the structure or home is a simple but effective to any accumulation of hydrogen gas. I have seen many designs that employ Stainless Steel Mesh, and finely orificed machinings and other methods. Most are very expensive, and require regular and costly replacement. I had very little money when I started working with Hydrogen, so I had to find other ways of forming burners. One type that I am very proud of, is one that I developed while in school. I had an evening job cleaning a Laundromat to pay my way through school, and also was taking Ceramics class during this semester. I had also learned of the lost wax process of creating voids in ceramic molds. I had an idea, I took some of the dryer lint that accumulated in abundant supply, and simply entrained it into wet clay in varying quantities, in each test piece. You might think of this as looking like fuzzy, thick Tortilla. I worked the material thoroughly so that the fibers were well mixed into the clay, and fired the pieces. Clamping these disks into the top of a shallow pan, using a gasket of, tape asbestos, I fed the pure hydrogen into a small tube, attached to a fitting in the side of the pan. I used fine silica sand. to disperse the gas internal to the pan, and the unit worked well. Pure Hydrogen is inert until in the presence of Oxygen. For a few pennies, I had developed a useful and workable solution to adaptive burners. I could heat steel on this burner, cook food, and warm my shop. However the flame tended to stack up, centering the heating effects. On later attempts, I glazed an outer ring, to form a better seal, and blanked out the center to form a circular strip of porous clay, that looked like a skinny doughnut, towards the outside of the disk. This did the trick. I would later developed tube designs with spiral orifice surfaces. Some with roughed up surfaces that would glow when heated. Long ones, oval ones, domed ones, almost any shape could be designed once you knew how you wanted the flame face to look. The designs became easy. They even could be washed. I invite any and all to try your hand at furthering Hydrogen technology, and take this simple idea, and run with it. I "TR Knudtson", do hereby donate, this principle of Ceramic Adaptive Technologies, for the benefit of man and to whomever might have the energy and strength of will to get industry to buy it. (Smile). I do seriously hope that one of you might take this ball and give it all you got, to see that it would come to fruition. They are easy to make, cheep, and have no moving parts to break. Also, the have all the heat handling properties needed for this use. You might also be generous and give some credit to me for the idea. (smile) I do hope for the success of this and many other adaptive technologies, and those who would carry them forward. The transition period, that will surly come, as people and industry seeks energy alternatives to energy dependency on polluting hydrocarbon fuels, will need these kinds of simple yet practical answers. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 19:10:26 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA15647; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:08:18 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:08:18 -0800 Message-Id: <199802230308.RAA12906@ranger.t-link.net> From: "Alastair Couper" Organization: Aquarian Electronics To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 17:04:09 +10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Permeability vs Frequency - Part Deux Reply-to: aquarius@t-link.net Priority: normal In-reply-to: <19980220.212532.6374.1.steve-nyeoka@juno.com> Resent-Message-ID: <"m8dBo2.0.Lq3.WWEyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3907 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greetings Free-nrgs, I have tried the experiment you are thinking of, a few weeks ago, using ferrite rods. I placed a variety of coil/ winding combinations near a magnet and switched high frequency excitation on and off to see if there was a reduction in attraction. I couldn't see anything with the material and frequencies I was using, but am not convinced that it can't work with different choices of same. Since oscillating the flux of a coil approaching a magnet using a capacitor switched in at the proper moment should not require work (ie pure reactive circuit), there may be a way to make a reversal or neutralization of attraction. The reverse situation, whereby a DC current is used to change the high frequency permeability of a core, is used to "tune" the inductance in high power switching supplies and such circuits. One patent I have shows a toroid with a hollow core which holds a poloidal coil inside, excited by DC. Then a normal toroidal winding is placed on the outside. Thus the DC magnetization is crossed to the AC magnetization, which is curious. I also have a DC current clamp probe (they are usually AC only) which uses the same principle, where an oscillator is FM'ed by the amount of current passing through the core, and the frequency delta is used to compute the current. Regards, Alastair Couper aquarius@t-link.net Aquarian Electronics Maui,Hawaii http://www.t-link.net/~aquarius/aquarian.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 19:11:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA15985; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:09:03 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:09:03 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218134908.007a6730@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 13:49:08 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980222204545.00539680@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Pi0vk1.0.Lv3.CXEyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3909 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 08:45 PM 2/22/98 -0500, you wrote: >>Cutting out the "energy" middle man. > >Reeeeeeeally big snip > >> >>Please point to the "middle man". >> >>Love >> >>TR Knudtson >> >> > >The gas itself. Running the cells at 2.4 volts means 50% efficiency, >at many 1000's of amps to fire a reasonably sized furnace. Where >does the rest of the power go? As heat dissipated in the electrolyzer. >Whereas with direct application of the arc all the power >goes direcly into the reactor vessel. > >Inverter technology has reached a point where >95% >efficiency is common. With special catalysts the electrolytic cells can be >made more efficient at high power levels, but now the >cell cost shoots up. I did a lot of work on cathode cell >catalysts in the '80s, trying to deal with just that problem. >Yull's use of stainless steel was a good practical choice, as >conversion efficiency was not a big factor in the welding industry. >It becomes more of an issue when you're talking about big >disposal plants. > >My choice of power source for radioactive materials processing >would have to be, uh, atomic batteries. You'll be floating in the >stuff after all, states will be standing in line to give it >to you. O^) > >Of course, that begs the question as to why you'd want to >dispose of the rad waste at all... ask the japanese, purchasing >hugh stockpiles of plutonium from us. Hell, wouldn't you? >All the mess is generated in making the stuff. Altogether >though I am glad it's moving to the other side of the world. > >Paul Brown, are you out there? > >KPN > >By the way, thanks for the process description. Its remarkable >what can be done with the water gas welding system. The >real value for me in this technology was the convienence >of gas generation (no tanks to rent) and the ease of >small scale processing of materials. One of these days I'll >have to build another one and play with the stuff again. >Talking about it with you is giving me that old itch again. > > > > > Dear Keith, Remember, we are talking about the use of Solar and wind power, augmented by storage of unused quantities of gas to offset bad solar days, it even does rain in Arizona. The last time I checked the sun was free. The amperage of even a small 8" solar cell is about .5 amp at 2.4 volts. This would mean only about 10,000 single cells to develop a 5,000 amp at 2.4 Volts power source. This would not be much larger an area then the roof of a large home. The average life of photo voltaic cells is about 10 to 15 years. The co-generation of the thermal yield from the augmented combustion of trash, would generate enough steam heat to be transformed into heat, and eventually electricity, to be sold. This income alone could pay for a new solar field in about a weeks time. The critical factor is that this type of highly developed trash handling plant, is also a source for all the raw materials that can be completely extracted from this aggregate, using the unique discriminating capabilities of the Hydroxy reaction. Think of all the gold, silver, tin, aluminum, iron, silica, carbon, copper, chromium, that is just thrown away each day at any dump. All of these materials can be separated with these processes. If we consider that the generation of electricity would make the efficient burning of trash a financially viable alternative to land fills. The recycling of purified and smelted raw materials to be sole back to industry, makes this an even more ecological imperative. I do hope that there are captains of industry lurking on this discussion. PLEASE, take these and other technologies and make lost of money cleaning up our world. You not only have my support, but also, you have my full blessing! Please, please, STEAL THIS TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!! Love TR Knudtson By the way the "welder" was only a way to get this technology into every country on earth. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 19:17:33 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA15665; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:08:21 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:08:21 -0800 Message-Id: <199802230308.RAA12903@ranger.t-link.net> From: "Alastair Couper" Organization: Aquarian Electronics To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 17:04:09 +10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Reply-to: aquarius@t-link.net Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199802221937.LAA24163@sweden.it.earthlink.net> Resent-Message-ID: <"jxcAn3.0.bq3.YWEyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3908 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Greetings all, I am in the midst of building a Brown's Gas generator, based on what I feel to be the very excellent work by George Wiseman. I'd like to point others to his web pages which are at: http://www.eagle-research.com/ and contain two books which are very helpful in understending the BG situation. He has taken some of the mystery out of Brown's work, and apparently improved on what looks to be a pretty inferior design which is being made in China. Brown probably has some things he has not let out, but as far as what is reproducible, George has gotten a good theoretical and practical slant on it. Basically, the BG phenomena relies on water dissociation in a design which allows for a fair percentage of monoatomic H and monoatomic O to be produced, as opposed to conventional electrolzers which create mainly diatomic H2 and O2. One result of this, given that the conversion of H to H2 is an exothermic reaction, normal electrolzers get hot, whereas a unit putting out significant BG remains cool. The conversion of H2O to monoatomic H and O is endothermic, so no heat is given off. Also, the volume of gas produced in a BG unit is more than what would be expected, based on the Faraday rate, than from a normal unit. The reason is simply due to the increased number of molecules left over as a result of not recombining into diatomic forms. This allows one to rate a given electrolyzer. A normal unit would be somewhat under 100%, based on the Faraday rate, whereas George has measured Brown's commercial units at around 130%, which means that a fair proportion, but not all, of the gas is monoatomic. George's larger unit has given up to 160% volume, with his main improvement being a greatly increased electrical efficiency and rreduced cost/ weight over Brown's Chinese units. Perfect BG production would give 200%. This also corresponds to what happens when BG or normal H2-O2 are ignited. Perfect BG would implode to a near vacuum, with the resultant sound in a closed container being a "ping". Normal H2 explodes of course, with a loud "bang" and a release of heat. The mixed gases made by Brown's and Wiseman's commercial units both explode and implode, sounding like a "poof". BG explodes when mixed with air. The reaction of the flame IS a mystery, getting very hot when played on high melting point material, but not getting hot enough to cause much heat when played against (water containing) skin. Having just gotten an oxy-acet burn, I am very impressed by this information. I will post some results when I get the thing going. I am also building a second form of electrolzer based on the Archie Blue patent. George has given reports of some BG experimenters, including himself, experiencing transient periods of very high gas production, with the electrolyzer getting cool as well. This has not been reproduceable on demand, and seems to require a pulsing waveform instead of DC. It is this which I am looking into. Regards, Alastair Couper aquarius@t-link.net Aquarian Electronics Maui,Hawaii http://www.t-link.net/~aquarius/aquarian.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 20:04:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA16957; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:01:30 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:01:30 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34F0F50E.7FB9@gorge.net> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:03:26 -0800 From: tom@gorge.net (Tom Miller) Reply-To: tom@gorge.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: ECP References: <199802222239.OAA24073@mx1.eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4f2FL.0.t84.OIFyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3910 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Todd: 1. It is said that "brown's gas"is composed of, or has a high proportion of, mono atomic hydrogen and oxygen. What can you tell us about that idea? 2. 2H2 + O2 = 2H2O Plus UV light energy. Does the Hydroxy reaction/ECP also emit UV? What UV danger have you found re open ECP flame? 3. It has been reported that Yull Brown has operated an automobile using self generated ECP. Can you: a. Confirm? b. Give details of the method used? c. What problems were found--corrosion, hydrogen embrittlement, etc? Tom Miller From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 20:11:42 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA00403; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:09:44 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:09:44 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980222235326.0052e838@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:53:29 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"HiIKi.0.B6.6QFyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3911 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 01:49 PM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >Remember, we are talking about the use of Solar and wind power, augmented >by storage of unused quantities of gas to offset bad solar days, it even >does rain in Arizona. The last time I checked the sun was free. The >amperage of even a small 8" solar cell is about .5 amp at 2.4 volts. This >would mean only about 10,000 single cells to develop a 5,000 amp at 2.4 >Volts power source. This would not be much larger an area then the roof of >a large home. The average life of photo voltaic cells is about 10 to 15 >years. The co-generation of the thermal yield from the augmented >combustion of trash, would generate enough steam heat to be transformed >into heat, and eventually electricity, to be sold. This income alone could >pay for a new solar field in about a weeks time. Last time I checked solar cells weren't. In fact; if they were cheap people would have them powering everything. It's difficult to justify unless the site is so remote that running power to it exceeds the cost of the system. Besides, it's not just cells, its batteries also and control electronics. It became grossly apparent to me in my own researches in alternative energy technology that the old demon fossil fuel is a hard mother to beat...I pay premium price for my electricity from the local power co, 14 cents per kilowatt hour. I'm looking at an old catalog for solar stuff, you need 12kwh. Lets see...largest unit was 2.7kwh per day, $12,000. You'd need six, so thats $72,000. Thats about $20 per day over 10 years. Compare to $1.68 from ConHugeCo... Probably more like 30 or 40 cents if you set up shop next to a dam like Niagra; most electrochemical industry companies are found where electricity is cheapest. I don't even want to look at the numbers for landfill cost; it would ruin my evening. I believe as you do that the world is in desperate need of these types of technologies; the problem is bringing the cost down so as to be competitive with whats already there. No one will move an inch on it untill that's addressed. Greed rows the boat here, I'm afraid. KPN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 21:10:24 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA25840; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:07:56 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:07:56 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218154647.007aae80@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 15:46:47 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980222235326.0052e838@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"n7MzD3.0.YJ6.eGGyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3912 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 11:53 PM 2/22/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 01:49 PM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >>Remember, we are talking about the use of Solar and wind power, augmented >>by storage of unused quantities of gas to offset bad solar days, it even >>does rain in Arizona. The last time I checked the sun was free. The >>amperage of even a small 8" solar cell is about .5 amp at 2.4 volts. This >>would mean only about 10,000 single cells to develop a 5,000 amp at 2.4 >>Volts power source. This would not be much larger an area then the roof of >>a large home. The average life of photo voltaic cells is about 10 to 15 >>years. The co-generation of the thermal yield from the augmented >>combustion of trash, would generate enough steam heat to be transformed >>into heat, and eventually electricity, to be sold. This income alone could >>pay for a new solar field in about a weeks time. > >Last time I checked solar cells weren't. In fact; if they were >cheap people would have them powering everything. ** This is considering retail prices. A 2.4 volt direct wholesale Photo Voltaic aray to produce 5,000 amps continuas duty. would cost about $20,000. I might also point out that these systems are artificialy over priced because of the newness of the technology. This a point of discussion that could be a entire topic in its self. It's difficult >to justify unless the site is so remote that running power to >it exceeds the cost of the system. Besides, it's not just cells, >its batteries also and control electronics. Lets talk bateries, this gas contains only Hydrogen Oxygen and Energy. What do you thisn you get when you bring plates into close proximity to each other in the presence of the gas and apply a load? YES, that is it, at placements of about 1/8" clearence the gas begins to discharge its electrical potential. Humm a gasious battery. Much lighter then lead. What if you construct the frame of a car to house this gas and locate coiled plates in the verticle portions of the frame, so that the water drains back down to production units. Hummmm? A closed loop gas electrical suspension system. Now add in wheel electric disk DC motors and dynamic regenerative breaking. Hummm? **Back to the effeciancies. $20,000 to run a toxic waste and refuse plant of conciderable size for 12.5 years, energy free, producing millions in recovered materials, and minerals, excess elecrtricity from the thermal yield of the trash itself. Hummmmm? I wonder what the cost of one Cancer victum's hospitilization is from the toxic leakage, into the ground water near any land fill is. $100,000? $250,000. I wonder what New York City spends each day to ship its garbage by train each day to Ohio? $3,000,000?????? ** Nope, you are right, lets keep stuffing it in the ground for our kids to have to deal with. > >It became grossly apparent to me in my own researches in alternative >energy technology that the old demon fossil fuel is a hard mother to >beat...I pay premium price for my electricity from the local >power co, 14 cents per kilowatt hour. I'm looking at an old >catalog for solar stuff, you need 12kwh. Lets see...largest >unit was 2.7kwh per day, $12,000. You'd need six, so thats >$72,000. Thats about $20 per day over 10 years. Compare to >$1.68 from ConHugeCo... Probably more like 30 or 40 cents >if you set up shop next to a dam like Niagra; most electrochemical >industry companies are found where electricity is cheapest. >I don't even want to look at the numbers for landfill cost; >it would ruin my evening. > >I believe as you do that the world is in desperate need of >these types of technologies; the problem is bringing the >cost down so as to be competitive with whats already there. >No one will move an inch on it untill that's addressed. >Greed rows the boat here, I'm afraid. > >KPN > > ************ Greed,,,,,,, or lack of will? Love TR Knudtson > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 21:47:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA23120; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:46:14 -0800 Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:46:14 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218162622.007a82d0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 16:26:22 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980222235326.0052e838@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"RwgDG1.0.Af5.bqGyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3913 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 11:53 PM 2/22/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 01:49 PM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >> > >I believe as you do that the world is in desperate need of >these types of technologies; the problem is bringing the >cost down so as to be competitive with whats already there. >No one will move an inch on it untill that's addressed. >Greed rows the boat here, I'm afraid. > >KPN > > Sorry for the last letter Kieth, maybe we should just stick to the issues surrounding what Hydroxy acts like. I do like your discussions though. (Smile) Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 22:48:00 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA10096; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:46:09 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:46:09 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:44:01 -0700 (MST) From: Steve Ekwall X-Sender: ekwall2@november To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980218040243.007a48e0@earthlink.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"3h8r_.0.dT2.liHyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3914 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Wed, 18 Feb 1998 trknute@earthlink.net wrote: -snip--snip- > are not at issue when employing Hydroxy sourced flames. To differentiate > this new type of combustion I have coined the term "Im-bustion", form the > combination of terms, (Implosive - Combustion). > Is cigarette smoke DRAWN into the flame? (I know, no one here smokes;) but, are you saying surrounding "AIR" (including+ H,O,N) is Imploding on this ball shape fire ball... would be interested if smoke (test material) was consumed from AROUND the fire-ball. Else, the implosion you state is ONLY the INSIDE, and only consuming (electrically returning to water) anything in its path. (clean flame dissperssures assumed). Seems hard to go BOTH Ways: 1, If the BG (charged) is the Source then you shouldn't need a back-valve (or anti-flame saftey x3 as they use in EXplosive welding). and 2, If (amazing (hope it is) true), IT is IMploding as per your demonstrations, then the "area to look at resides IN the ball itself" and cannot back up the in-coming air lines. hence, everything wouldbe going into the new fire. (understood, that the flame is cool to the approaching hand, and only contact will burn.) (also understood that you have lost a lab or 2 (and garage) [sorry about that:] proving this. So this points to #1 (cigarette smoke) or AIR being drawn in -- correct?? -snip- > "New Type of Fire" is not such a large stretch, when some of these > parameters are more clearly understood. Admittedly this was however a bold > statement to make as a 15 year old child, to have "Reinvented Fire" or at > least redefined a new type of combustion. > Love > TR Knudtson Were you 15 or was Brown 15 when this was discovered?? ------------------- Lastly, (and this does sound exciting "BG", or "Water for THAT Matter" :) cross-references of skeptics of this: (www.eskimo.com/~billb/freenrg/hydroxy.html) link to explosion, implosion, explosion, implosion (looping as it were with excessive) heat could be turned around or collected I would think off the sides of the outer chamber walls. (ref: your vaccuum chamber in mutliple fires). If this hot loop doesn't occur, than I would refer to question 1 with external smoke being drawn in and consumed. If this hot loop does occur, you've got one really GOOD HEATER! (re-ref: YOUR homepage of common house-hold bricks going to a hardness level of 9... has carbon (or coal) or graphite shown signs of going to 10?? Best to you & yours -=se=- ekwall2@diac.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 23:26:21 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA13272; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:24:21 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:24:21 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218180315.007a8730@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 18:03:15 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.5.32.19980218040243.007a48e0@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"pauEE2.0.FF3.ZGIyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3915 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 11:44 PM 2/22/98 -0700, you wrote: >On Wed, 18 Feb 1998 trknute@earthlink.net wrote: >-snip--snip- >> are not at issue when employing Hydroxy sourced flames. To differentiate >> this new type of combustion I have coined the term "Im-bustion", form the >> combination of terms, (Implosive - Combustion). >> >Is cigarette smoke DRAWN into the flame? (I know, no one here smokes;) >but, are you saying surrounding "AIR" (including+ H,O,N) is Imploding on >this ball shape fire ball... would be interested if smoke (test material) >was consumed from AROUND the fire-ball. Else, the implosion you >state is ONLY the INSIDE, and only consuming (electrically returning to >water) anything in its path. (clean flame dissperssures assumed). > Seems hard to go BOTH Ways: 1, If the BG (charged) is the Source then >you shouldn't need a back-valve (or anti-flame saftey x3 as they use in >EXplosive welding). and 2, If (amazing (hope it is) true), IT is IMploding >as per your demonstrations, then the "area to look at resides IN the ball >itself" and cannot back up the in-coming air lines. hence, everything >wouldbe going into the new fire. (understood, that the flame is cool to the >approaching hand, and only contact will burn.) (also understood that you >have lost a lab or 2 (and garage) [sorry about that:] proving this. So >this points to #1 (cigarette smoke) or AIR being drawn in -- correct?? >-snip- > >> "New Type of Fire" is not such a large stretch, when some of these >> parameters are more clearly understood. Admittedly this was however a bold >> statement to make as a 15 year old child, to have "Reinvented Fire" or at >> least redefined a new type of combustion. >> Love >> TR Knudtson > >Were you 15 or was Brown 15 when this was discovered?? > >------------------- > >Lastly, (and this does sound exciting "BG", or "Water for THAT Matter" :) >cross-references of skeptics of this: >(www.eskimo.com/~billb/freenrg/hydroxy.html) link to explosion, implosion, >explosion, implosion (looping as it were with excessive) heat could be >turned around or collected I would think off the sides of the outer >chamber walls. (ref: your vaccuum chamber in mutliple fires). > If this hot loop doesn't occur, than I would refer to question 1 with >external smoke being drawn in and consumed. > If this hot loop does occur, you've got one really GOOD HEATER! >(re-ref: YOUR homepage of common house-hold bricks going to a hardness >level of 9... has carbon (or coal) or graphite shown signs of going to >10?? > >Best to you & yours > >-=se=- >ekwall2@diac.com > > > I was 15 when I first began to work steels using this technology as a heat source. I made collapsed Pepsi and Coke bottles, for sale at local Flea Markets, as ashtrays. One garage bit the dust when I made a containment of a plastic drum. I sealed the lid, with a truck inner tube taped through the lid to later be inflated and expanded in the drum container. This way I was able to pressurize captured volumes of pure Hydrogen, by inflating the rubber inner tube. With this crude and later to be seen, stupid compression system I developed long flames of hydrogen. It was not until one of the patches let free air into the container, resulting in a total flash back and explosion that I learned about the error in my calculations. Pragmatically I did learn not to fear Hydrogen explosions, as there are over very fast. The doors and windows were all blown off their hinges. I came out with the front of my hair still smoking, Jubilantly dancing around the back yard shouting, "I survived, I survived, you can survive Hydrogen explosions". I had to fix all the windows, and clean up the mess, and needless to say at my Fathers request I had to take my continued work underground. The issue of this gas burning in the shape of a ball, that is at low pressures in a vacuum chamber, not in open air. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun Feb 22 23:28:33 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA13694; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:27:11 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 23:27:11 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <6ec50299.34f12446@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 02:24:51 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: I might have got it! See web site (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"RnJqU2.0.tL3.BJIyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3916 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com It's 1 AM and I just sent this to the web site. I will type operation discription tomorrow morning. Anyone who has working knowledge of basic electricity, basic magnetic behavior in metals, and can follow the path and sequence of forces in a simple machine might be able to figure it out before I get my type to the web site. Have fun! This could be it! Thanks, Butch LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 06:18:08 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA17121; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 06:08:46 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 06:08:46 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <19980223140644.29350.rocketmail@send1a.yahoomail.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 06:06:44 -0800 (PST) From: Anton Rager Subject: Re: Permeability vs Frequency - Part Deux To: aquarius@t-link.net, freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"2bjEk2.0.QB4.hBOyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3917 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ---Alastair Couper wrote: > > Greetings Free-nrgs, > > I have tried the experiment you are thinking of, a few weeks ago, using > ferrite rods. I placed a variety of coil/ winding combinations near a > magnet and switched high frequency excitation on and off to see if there > was a reduction in attraction. I couldn't see anything with the material > and frequencies I was using, but am not convinced that it can't work > with different choices of same. Glad someone had a chance to try it out -- What type of core did you have in your coil? How high of a frequency did you test with? How much current/voltage? Could you send me a copy of your oscillator circuit? I'm still trying to decide what the best design might be, and would love other ideas. Almost went and bought some compents yesterday, but the weather was nice here -- so road the MTB instead :) [sanity preservation] As a side note -- does anyone know what the frequency response [where permeability peaks/drops] for Iron and Seel should be? Any good refs that might have it? Since oscillating the flux of a coil > approaching a magnet using a capacitor switched in at the proper moment > should not require work (ie pure reactive circuit), there may be a way to > make a reversal or neutralization of attraction. > > The reverse situation, whereby a DC current is used to change the high > frequency permeability of a core, is used to "tune" the inductance in > One patent I have shows > a toroid with a hollow core which holds a poloidal coil inside, excited > by DC. Then a normal toroidal winding is placed on the outside. What's the patent # -- sounds interesting. == Anton Rager a_rager@yahoo.com _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 09:47:50 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA03417; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:42:12 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 09:42:12 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <7aabcdbd.34f1b4af@aol.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:41:01 EST To: edk@ic.net, freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Offer from Ed for animation help on new design (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"IUv9r3.0.Cr.nJRyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3918 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com You said> Hi Butch, I think I can figure it out and create another 3d animation for the new stuff if you want. let me know. Ed Snip> Ed, I was typing a message to you when I got your email. I finished this latest Idea at 1 AM this morning and I am just now up to speed. The best way I can describe the new design is this. The ferrite rotor is now the same all the way around and the air gap is what changes now. This should make it more easy to understand. The rotor, when turned with the circuit open ( no current ) is a simple machine that except for minor loses, friction, ect., is a break even deal. You get out only the work you put in. The magnetic force transfer rotor, changes all this when you close the circuit. The rotor at zero degrees, thru 180 degrees, rotating clockwise, will cause a collapse of the magnetic field around the coil due to the increasing air gap. The increase in magnetic force due to current flow is now transfered to the opposite end of the rotor to keep positive and negative work equal for a full revolution. The coil only covers 180 degrees of stator so that the opposite end of the rotor does not have to interact with the coil's magnetic field and the negative effects it would have. I am typing more detailed description for site now. If you can do animation with just this information that would be great as it would help everyone going to the site to better understand how it works. Ed, I think we might be very, very, close. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 11:51:09 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA00514; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:30:30 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:30:30 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980218230854.007a8590@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 1998 23:08:54 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Story Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"NQwcD2.0.u7.KvSyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3919 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Electro Chemical Plasma. The unique characteristics of this state of mater and energy, has pointed the way to a vast new Science. Lets look at some of what we have learned by our manipulation of conventional heat sources to draw a caparison to why I dare to make such a bold statement. I know that I have great dificulty explaining these new insights and observations. I hope this story will help you see my problem. When first discovered, Fire was undoubtedly viewed with fear and skepticism by even the most learned of our ancestors. What is this new thing? Fire if allowed, will quickly spread to others things, setting them to blaze, leaving only a dust remaining where there once was solid material. Surely it must be evil as it destroys all living things. Other than the sun, it is the only thing that gives off heat and light. To touch this new stuff results in pain and suffering, and if trapped in it's path results in a horrible death of agony and torment. Surly it is wise to run whenever it is seen that this thing is coming. Soon stories would be heard that this new monster has no effect on rivers or lakes, the power of water seems to combat this new force in their universe. Early reports have been heard that splashing or throwing water on fire, at the rivers edge, results in the foiling of this new feared force. Water is more powerful than fire. A story of Fire: One of the great warriors, from our family, was seen to pick up a partially wetted, but still burning stick, and hold fire in the hand of man for the first time. The power that he so bravely held mystified and frightened all that had seen this act. Emboldened with confidence at his "new found" ability to hold on to this power, he waved it over the heads of his fearful brothers. Great, surly must be his spirit, if he can defy the power of the Gods, and seek to control this most dangerous of forces. These stories caused others to try to capture this new force, many were injured, some were killed but eventually new ways were learned to capture and keep this most feared demon. Men of great wisdom became the keepers of this new power that could be used to scare of even the wild beasts that would threaten the people of our houses. Enemies of the our people were soon to stop threatening, as they feared this new held power. What had first mystified and tormented man, now could be used for good. Newly killed meat, let to hang in the smoke of a fire would last for two moons, and had a new rich flavor when eaten. Even carcasses of rotted animals could be put into the fire and cleansed of the evil that would have killed any who tried to eat this meat, prior to it's being purified by the fire. Fire must have the power to stop sickness, and vanquish evil. In the cold of winter, all could come close to the fire and be saved from the discomfort of the night. Dangerous as it may be, this new force began to be used by many. Even women were allowed to use this new force, as food prepared in the cleansing of the fire was pleasing of taste and soft to eat. Old people could now eat foods, that they could previously not chew, as the loss of teeth often hastened death. There came a story of a woman tending a fire, built on rocks flowing a rain. She had turned over a stone some days later, to find that a coating of mud had hardened around the stone. She could hold and carry water in this hollow thing, after she had pulled it off the stone. Fine river mud's, were found to make better holders of water. Also, if this mud were made by hand in this shape, and put onto a very hot fire for many days, the shapes became very strong. Finely ground sands, could be mixed with animal fat and berry juice, to seal and line the inside of the shapes, thus stopping them from leaking. Trenches dug into the side of a hill that faced the wind, could be stacked with many of these mud things and covered to have the fire to climb over them all, and be tended from below. Many hallow mud things could be made at once and used to trade for stone tools and food with neighboring peoples. One day, while sifting through the dust of a long kept fire, built near the blue green mountain, a woman found small round drops of a shiny smooth material. Collecting these droplets, she wove then into a necklace. She came to be known as a special finder, of the shiny rock that could be marked by teeth. Large pieces, of this new material were soon found, and some developed the ability to pound them into long hard shapes. Rubbing the edges on stones left them sharp, and able to cut even the toughest of animal hides. Unlike stone tools, the sharpened edge could be renewed as it became worn. Lashing them to the end of throwing-sticks made "great" the power of these new weapons for the hunt, as they could penetrate the hide of even the largest of animals. A large heavy piece, lashed turned to the side, into the yoke of a long, forked branch, could be used to cut down even the largest trees. In the areas that were cleared of trees, the plants that grew roots and seeds, became very tall and more were to be found. Each area that was cleared of trees was planted and the food for the family increased. One day, the woman placed many of these droplets, into one of the hallow water carriers, and placed it on a hot fire to see if it would cook like the roots and nuts, perhaps becoming soft. She had learned that even the bad waters, in still ponds of the dry times, could be cleaned of it's evil that made the family sick, by placing it in the fire. In a few hours of blowing through a reed, to make the fire grow bright under the water carrier, she saw that the droplets ran together and formed a "soup". As she carefully used sticks to remove the carrier from the fire, but tipped and the soup ran out and into the groves in the sand. It was still very hot and she could not touch it, so she got some water from the stream and poured it onto the hot, red soup. A white cloud rose from the shape as it cooled, she now could pick it up and hold it. As she looked, she saw that it had hardened into the shape of the groves in the sand. She thought for a time, and started to make new shapes in the wet sand. She called all of her sisters and gave them each reeds. Putting the shape back into the water carrier, she placed it carefully back on the fire. With the help of her sisters, they began to take turns blowing fast through the reeds, tending the fire and making it grow very bright. Soon the soup was ready. With more carefully selected forked sticks, two of sisters removed the carrier from the fire. Pouring the soup into the shapes in the sand and cooling it with water, she found that she could make larger and unique designs that would have taken days for the men to make by hammering. Soon all the women were gathering droplets from the dust, around the blue green rocks of their cooking fires. Some had begun to make special shapes in the fine mud, found near the bend in the river. Making shapes of the moon, and stars they began to make there soups and pour them into the shapes. One had made a shape of the face of her friend, and poured her soup into it. When it had cooled she removed it, and laughed, because it had the big nose just like her sister. She was so happy, that she took it to show the wise man of the family. He became angry and called all of the men to the great circle. He shouted holding the face of her sister high for all to see. He said that she had surly stolen part of her sisters spirit, as everyone could see that the face made from the smooth brown stone, looked like her sister with the big nose. Only the Gods can form the faces of living things, she would have to be beaten for trying to be like a God. Tools are good because they make mans existence easier, but this, surly evil woman, has taken this gift and angered the Gods by it's misuse. Soon, a great storm came upon the houses of the family. This was unusual, because the rains were not to come for another turn of the moon. Surly the Gods must be angry. Fire sticks, were seen to come from the sky in more numbers that even the old ones could remember. The wise man knew why the Gods were angry, one among them had tried to make the face of a sister like the Gods make man. He gathered the people together in the midst of the storm and called forward the sister who had mocked the Gods. "Tie her to the highest branches of the tallest tree, the one in the open land", he shouted. The people, in fear followed his every command. As all watched from a distance, the storm grew worse. Fire sticks from the sky, began to come more. In a blinding flash, the top of the tree including the fallen sister had disappeared. The next morning the sky cleared, all the family went about quietly, finding their things that had been thrown about by the anger of the Gods. No one spoke, as all were afraid to mention the name of the evil sister that the Gods had punished. From that day on, only the Wiseman were allowed to make the soup of the droplets, from the dust of the fire around the blue green rocks. Fire was taken from the hands of the women. They were forced to come to the Wiseman, and ask for an ember to start a fire. To pay for the foolishness to the fallen woman, each ember allowed a woman, was to be used for only one day's cooking. Every one saw that this was good, for now it would be told to all the children how woman, in her vanity and mischief, had brought the wrath of the Gods on man. Love TR Knudtson Knowledge hidden, is knowledge wasted, and power controlled is power deprived. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 17:10:59 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA28272; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:57:32 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:57:32 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: bailey@shell14.ba.best.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 16:55:49 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com (Freengr List) From: pgb@padrak.com (Patrick Bailey) Subject: The INE Website Has Been Updated Resent-Message-ID: <"kjgGA3.0.Yv6.rhXyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3920 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com The Institute for New Energy Web Site has been updated at: http://www.padrak.com/ine/ Most New Data Files are at: http://www.padrak.com/ine/index.shtml#INE_RECENT All new revisions are in the file: http://www.padrak.com/ine/REVISIONS.html ------------- ------------------------------------------------------------ Date Included Additions, Expansions, or Revisions ------------- ------------------------------------------------------------ Feb. 23, 1998 Added: NEN TOC Vol. 5, No. 10, Febuary 1998 The Economics Of Goodness Low-Energy Nuclear Transformation: Where Did The Thorium Go? ENECO US Patents 5,632,870 and 5,653,800 Fusion Report: Summary: "Cold Fusion: An Outcast of Science" Email Policy For NEN, And Note To Contributors and Readers The 1998 DOE Budget Request Letter From Anthony Sutton Regarding Recent Innacurate Press Reporting Letter From Donald Walton Regarding Uses of Resonant Energy and Egypt Easy Money ($1K) Challenge, By Bert Schreiber Updated: Fabulous Facts Subjects and Authors Websites People and Organizations Fixed: Return links in all the NEN_5_8_* files. Site counter = 206,376. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 17:48:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA06046; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:42:13 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:42:13 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980223212445.00530268@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:24:49 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"PmsEK2.0.CU1.nLYyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3921 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 03:46 PM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >** This is considering retail prices. A 2.4 volt direct wholesale Photo >Voltaic aray to produce 5,000 amps continuas duty. would cost about >$20,000. I might also point out that these systems are artificialy over >priced because of the newness of the technology. This a point of >discussion that could be a entire topic in its self. > Well, I was trying to be fair based on the retail price of my electricity from ConHugeCo. I'm sure if i used these quantities at off hours I could drive the price down by a factor of 3 to match. >Lets talk bateries, this gas contains only Hydrogen Oxygen and Energy. What >do you thisn you get when you bring plates into close proximity to each >other in the presence of the gas and apply a load? YES, that is it, at >placements of about 1/8" clearence the gas begins to discharge its >electrical potential. Humm a gasious battery. Much lighter then lead. What >if you construct the frame of a car to house this gas and locate coiled >plates in the verticle portions of the frame, so that the water drains back >down to production units. Hummmm? A closed loop gas electrical suspension >system. Now add in wheel electric disk DC motors and dynamic regenerative >breaking. Hummm? Yup, thats a fuel cell. But you need to seperate the gas or you poison the cathode. I've made a few of these too in my short lifetime. But the point is taken that you could split the water and store the gas, although that presents the cost and safety concerns of the storage system. Best technology there was active carbon systems. > >**Back to the effeciancies. $20,000 to run a toxic waste and refuse plant >of conciderable size for 12.5 years, energy free, producing millions in >recovered materials, and minerals, excess elecrtricity from the thermal >yield of the trash itself. >Hummmmm? > Well, why don't you set up a pilot plant and start processing trash? I think the numbers might be a bit higher there... >I wonder what the cost of one Cancer victum's hospitilization is from the >toxic leakage, into the ground water near any land fill is. $100,000? >$250,000. well, it makes the hospital $100,000. A great deal of money is made on keeping people sick. Such is the world we now live in. I prefer the tibetian system, you pay the doctor when you are well and he treats you for free when you are sick. Now it's in the doctors interest to keep you well. > >I wonder what New York City spends each day to ship its garbage by train >each day to Ohio? $3,000,000?????? Actually, we send it all to New Jersey. And they make a lot of money from it. Granted, everyone gets sick from the pollution and such, but thats ok because more money can be made from that. See what I mean... > >** Nope, you are right, lets keep stuffing it in the ground for our kids to >have to deal with. > >> >************ Greed,,,,,,, or lack of will? > >Love > >TR Knudtson >> Oh greed, definitely. If you ever have doubts or wonder why things are so messed up, just follow the money. All questions answered, guaranteed. I hate coming off so bitter and misanthropic, but so few people I meet can see beyond the next quarters earnings or beyond their skin. I've been meaning to mount the old soapbox for some time on the current state of alternative energy technologies, and why things have gotten to the state we are in now. This has been something of a preamble. Please forgive me. But a lot of your first posts touched on these issues. KPN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 18:05:08 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA13047; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:57:28 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 17:57:28 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980223214115.0053dff0@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:41:19 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"WnQRG2.0.eB3.6aYyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3922 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 04:26 PM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >Sorry for the last letter Kieth, maybe we should just stick to the issues >surrounding what Hydroxy acts like. I do like your discussions though. > >(Smile) > >Love > >TR Knudtson > Don't apologize TR, stick to your guns and keep swinging! You're fighting the good fight. Ignore me if I sound too burned out or down on things. It's an unfortunate side effect of studying this field too closely. I agree that we should shift focus back to a discussion of the gas and it's properties. Political and economic issues are interesting to debate but really I come to this list for discussion of technology. So, you clearly have a pretty deep well of experience to draw from concerning this stuff, you lead... KPN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 22:02:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA19075; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:58:15 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 21:58:15 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980219093652.007a97b0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 1998 09:36:52 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980223212445.00530268@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"UxPRv3.0.zf4.s5cyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3923 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:24 PM 2/23/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 03:46 PM 2/18/98 -0800, you wrote: >>** This is considering retail prices. A 2.4 volt direct wholesale Photo >>Voltaic aray to produce 5,000 amps continuas duty. would cost about >>$20,000. I might also point out that these systems are artificialy over >>priced because of the newness of the technology. This a point of >>discussion that could be a entire topic in its self. >> > >Well, I was trying to be fair based on the retail price of my >electricity from ConHugeCo. I'm sure if i used these quantities >at off hours I could drive the price down by a factor of 3 to >match. > >Oh greed, definitely. If you ever have doubts or wonder why things >are so messed up, just follow the money. All questions answered, >guaranteed. > >I hate coming off so bitter and misanthropic, but so few people >I meet can see beyond the next quarters earnings or beyond their >skin. I've been meaning to mount the old soapbox for some time >on the current state of alternative energy technologies, and >why things have gotten to the state we are in now. This has >been something of a preamble. Please forgive me. But a lot of >your first posts touched on these issues. > >KPN > >Dear Keith, We have covered a lot of ground in a few letters. I like your spirit and interest and hope that we can continue the discussions. I too am a bit miffed about the wild claims surrounding "New energy" and the required editing of foolish speculation, rather than solid reviews of scientific research that can be documented and replicated. I feel that you were a bit unfair in leading me right into rash speculations of energy efficiencies on our first date. (Smile) I will concede openly to you that if it is more efficient to run this type of reclamation plant off the grid then go for it. The key issue that I see that we were diverted form discussing are the unique properties of ECP systems to deal with very poisonous and toxic materials in aggregate. The "material governed" thermal effects of this reaction have been tested and show clear abilities to deal with the separations of all types of materials from aggregate. Any reclamation project suffers because of the difficulty of segregating incoming garbage to remove toxins metals, styrene, Polyvinyls, and other materials. The high heat potential of this flame source guaranties, the highest quality of incineration. Additionally the gasses can be captured electrostaticly and the Oxides recovered. Although lime scrubber systems have been widely used for many decades to capture even nuclear byproducts, the resultant sump material, becomes a toxin concentrate in it's own right. This system and the high temperatures associated with reactions of minerals, can effectively deal with this material, in third stage recovery systems. One application I think that holds the greatest promise for quick returns on investment is the destruction of asbestos. Actually it is quite simple, you simply melt it into a glass like residue. The key value of Hydroxy is that this is done in a smokeless, rotating vacuum chamber, with a fixed, central rack of small hydroxyl flames that is fed by a pipe penetrating the end of the container at the axis point. The drum is filled and rotated as the flame reduces the asbestos to harmless glass like pebbles. The disposal of dangerous asbestos is a Multi Billion Dollar business. As you say, if it is cheaper, hook it to a power pole and pay for the bill. The Value is in the simple fact, that the flame has no residue, and develops white hot temperatures, with no spent gasses. Additionally, this can be accomplished in a trailer mounted system, on site, thus eliminating the expense and hazard of transportation. These and many others are what I call real time "Nuts and Bolts" applications. As always, this is free to all to use, I do hope that it will make you a lot of money. I like to see people making money by cleaning up our world. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 23:25:29 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA04556; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:23:27 -0800 Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:23:27 -0800 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <79669b80.34f2754d@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 01:46:50 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: AOL is down here Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"1E5KB2.0._61.kLdyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3924 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi All, AOL has been down all afternoon and night here in Birmingham, AL. I can just now send mail out but still can't receive any (it's 1 AM here) Will try again in the morning to answer any posts I may have. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon Feb 23 23:30:53 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA15228; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:25:26 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 23:25:26 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <2732901.34f27561@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 01:55:11 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Minor changes made to drawings on web (Butch) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"k0Dpf2.0.mj3.WNdyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3925 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Minor changes made to drawings on web (Butch) LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 24 05:50:27 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA14857; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 05:46:39 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 05:46:39 -0800 (PST) From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:44:21 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: New animation of generator by Ed Kauffmann on web Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"MfQUQ.0.2e3.yyiyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3926 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On web site now. Thanks, Butch LaFonte Generator Home Page From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 24 08:57:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA14381; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:44:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 08:44:55 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 17:45:09 +0100 Message-Id: <199802241645.RAA15407@cache.hb.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@mail.vossnet.de X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Re: AOL is down here Resent-Message-ID: <"4asXk.0.cW3._Zlyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3927 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 08:41 24.02.1998 -0800, freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com wrote: >Sorry, you cannot post to this list if you are not a member. >If you wish to subscribe, send mail to this list's "-request" >alias. For example, if the list name is "this-list@eskimo.com", >send mail to "this-list-request@eskimo.com" with the word >"subscribe" in the subject: line of your message. > Yes, AOL "sucks" !, a customer of mine also has huge problems with it in the last 2 weeks ! -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 24 09:15:25 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA18717; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:08:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:08:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 18:02:26 +0100 Message-Id: <199802241702.SAA15851@cache.hb.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@pop3.vossnet.de X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: JNaudin509@aol.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: My Email problems. please resend ! Cc: dave dameron , mrandall@earthlink.net, vramos@ctv.es Resent-Message-ID: <"Dxv363.0.Ia4.vvlyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3928 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi all, If somebody tried to sent me email during the last 2 days, it might be lost, cause my ISP had some mail problems. Please resend directly to my other account: leoguitar@vossnet.de Thanks ! Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 24 09:34:46 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA23453; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:30:51 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 09:30:51 -0800 (PST) From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802241729.AA23053@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 10:00:54 -0500 To: Subject: Re: AOL is down here Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jynV92.0.Kk5.0Fmyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3929 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ANS...AOL's network provider, had some downtime due to power outages last nite. Didn't know it affected AOL....but ANS has me really steamed at the moment! Venting ----------------------------- Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: AOL is down here Author: at ccnode Date: 2/23/98 11:23 PM Hi All, AOL has been down all afternoon and night here in Birmingham, AL. I can just now send mail out but still can't receive any (it's 1 AM here) Will try again in the morning to answer any posts I may have. Thanks, Butch From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 24 10:55:05 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA31163; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:50:57 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 10:50:57 -0800 Message-ID: <34F31408.68B3@microtec.net> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 13:40:08 -0500 From: patrick tremblay Reply-To: energeon@microtec.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Permanent Magnet Motor Kit References: <3.0.5.32.19980219093652.007a97b0@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"WflLE3.0.rc7.FQnyq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3930 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi everybody, I am looking for a Permanent Magnet Motor Kit that runs without electricity. Have any clue where I may find one ? Or where may I find useful info about how to build one ? patrick tremblay energeon@microtec.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 24 14:54:11 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA13163; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 14:48:33 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 14:48:33 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 23:48:35 +0100 Message-Id: <199802242248.XAA27754@cache.hb.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@pop3.vossnet.de (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Did this went through ? Status of our RMOD device... Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx2.eskimo.com id OAA13094 Resent-Message-ID: <"hRfMA3.0.XD3.wuqyq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3931 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi all, I had email problems the last 2 days, so I don´t know, if this went through... Any coments ? ====================================================== Today I met with Dieter Bauer and we vsisited a friend of ours, who is building our RMOD for us. Cause he is very experienced in doing mechanical work and also has a mechanical lab we let him build the device and we only do proposals for modification and setup. So far he has build a rotor with 5 arms carrying iron-steel pieces at the outer rim and one SMOT ramp as a stator. You can imagine it, if you put Jean Louis´s design of his RMOD at a 90 degree turn. This way it is not yet running, but the magnetic forces are at work and sometimes it seems not to stop, but after a while it is stoping to turn. We hope, that by placing a total of 4 SMOT ramps equally spaced around the circle, the 5 arm rotor will not stop to rotate. Thus there will be forces which attract all the time the iron steel pieces into the ramps. We found out that there is a nice magnet material called BETAFLEX, which could ideally be used for the SMOT ramps. It is some kind of barium ferrite permanent magnet material glued together with some binder material and you can buy it at local permanent magnet stores in dimensions like 500 mm length x 24 mm width x 8 mm thickness and it has the right polarisation. If you put this flexible "ribbon-tape" magnet (belt magnet) onto an iron bar-backplate, it is like a SMOT MK1 design. So the magnetic field inside a ramp is very homogenous ! You have to make the ramp like a "V" form to get an increased flux density inside the ramp ! Our friend is using special steelbar angles to distribute and diverse the magnetic flux at the "blue hole" location to get there an "easy exit" of the rotorarm ironsteel piece ! Unfortunately my digital camera is broken in this moment, so I could not tape it. The next thing we will try is to get more BETAFLEX material to build the missing 3 SMOT ramps around the rotor and fiddle as long as to get it to run perpetually. Also we will try to use different shaped rotor ironsteel material ! In this moment it is still a piece of a ironsteel cylinder about 1.5 cm in diameter and 3 cms long which goes into the ramp, but we will also try triangular shaped rotor-steel pieces which could have an easier "exit-ramp" condition ! So far for now it looks pretty promising, but you never know... I hope to report soon some more news on it. Comments are welcome. Best regardsm, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com Use our automatic creditcard billing at: http://ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue Feb 24 15:20:28 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA00284; Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:16:41 -0800 Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 1998 15:16:41 -0800 From: arager@mcgraw-hill.com Message-Id: <199802242316.AA23691@interlock.mgh.com> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 98 16:08:33 -0500 To: Subject: Re: Did this went through ? Status of our RMOD device... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"UbeNL3.0.H4.NJryq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3932 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Yup -- Made it thru the 1st time. Thanks for the resend. Hope you get your mail situation all ironed out. Anton Rager arager@McGraw-Hill.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 05:39:18 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA29303; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 05:37:12 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 05:37:12 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980225091950.005395d0@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:19:55 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"osoD03.0.n97.6w1zq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3933 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:36 AM 2/19/98 -0800, you wrote: >We have covered a lot of ground in a few letters. I like your spirit and >interest and hope that we can continue the discussions. I too am a bit >miffed about the wild claims surrounding "New energy" and the required >editing of foolish speculation, rather than solid reviews of scientific >research that can be documented and replicated. Actually, the soapbox speech I had in mind was regarding the true claims, not the bogus ones. We all know the story about the bogus ones. What is poorly understood among alternative energy researchers is the fact that technological solutions to problems are rarely lacking. No great conspiracy suppresses these technologies. The ugly truth is that no one can figure out how to make money on them. Let that sink in for a minute. I'm going to pick this up later on a seperate thread... Back to the technology. >One application I think that holds the greatest promise for quick returns >on investment is the destruction of asbestos. Actually it is quite simple, >you simply melt it into a glass like residue. The key value of Hydroxy is >that this is done in a smokeless, rotating vacuum chamber, with a fixed, >central rack of small hydroxyl flames that is fed by a pipe penetrating the >end of the container at the axis point. The drum is filled and rotated as >the flame reduces the asbestos to harmless glass like pebbles. The >disposal of dangerous asbestos is a Multi Billion Dollar business. As you >say, if it is cheaper, hook it to a power pole and pay for the bill. The >Value is in the simple fact, that the flame has no residue, and develops >white hot temperatures, with no spent gasses. Additionally, this can be >accomplished in a trailer mounted system, on site, thus eliminating the >expense and hazard of transportation. > When you talk about doing these things in a sealed container, what happens to the steam generated by the flame? Have you actually ran a combustion chamber as described above? If so, what happened? Please don't misunderstand me, these are sincere questions and not skeptical baiting. I did spend some time looking into this area; I might be encouraged to revisit it. KPN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 09:38:44 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA13698; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:30:24 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 09:30:24 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220001847.007a99b0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 00:18:47 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980225091950.005395d0@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"iwCPX1.0.qL3.dK5zq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3934 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:19 AM 2/25/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 09:36 AM 2/19/98 -0800, you wrote: >>We have covered a lot of ground in a few letters. I like your spirit and >>interest and hope that we can continue the discussions. I too am a bit >>miffed about the wild claims surrounding "New energy" and the required >>editing of foolish speculation, rather than solid reviews of scientific >>research that can be documented and replicated. > >Actually, the soapbox speech I had in mind was regarding the >true claims, not the bogus ones. We all know the story about >the bogus ones. What is poorly understood among alternative >energy researchers is the fact that technological solutions >to problems are rarely lacking. No great conspiracy suppresses >these technologies. The ugly truth is that no one can figure >out how to make money on them. > >Let that sink in for a minute. > >I'm going to pick this up later on a seperate thread... Back >to the technology. > >>One application I think that holds the greatest promise for quick returns >>on investment is the destruction of asbestos. Actually it is quite simple, >>you simply melt it into a glass like residue. The key value of Hydroxy is >>that this is done in a smokeless, rotating vacuum chamber, with a fixed, >>central rack of small hydroxyl flames that is fed by a pipe penetrating the >>end of the container at the axis point. The drum is filled and rotated as >>the flame reduces the asbestos to harmless glass like pebbles. The >>disposal of dangerous asbestos is a Multi Billion Dollar business. As you >>say, if it is cheaper, hook it to a power pole and pay for the bill. The >>Value is in the simple fact, that the flame has no residue, and develops >>white hot temperatures, with no spent gasses. Additionally, this can be >>accomplished in a trailer mounted system, on site, thus eliminating the >>expense and hazard of transportation. >> > >When you talk about doing these things in a sealed container, >what happens to the steam generated by the flame? Have you actually >ran a combustion chamber as described above? If so, what happened? > >Please don't misunderstand me, these are sincere questions and >not skeptical baiting. I did spend some time looking into this >area; I might be encouraged to revisit it. > >KPN > Good Keith, Now we are on the right track. Good point the steam; The ONLY residue to this process is steam and a considerably small amount. No other poisonous gas are the result of this reaction. Yes I have constructed small aluminum drums with groves inside to move the material up a slight incline. The slight resultant presser is sent out through a series of fine filters to trap any possible material that might escape the process. The used filter medium is good for about thirty cycles and is just then added to the next batch and reprocessed and new filters installed. The unit sufficient to process a 55 gallon drum of asbestos uses about 50 amps, at 240 volt. The small rotary drum processor, could deal with the 55 in about six fillings. So there are your figures; 50 amps at 240 volts, times six times about 20 minutes processing time per fill. And yes this simple system was demonstrated, and tested. Depending on transportation and disposal fees asbestos disposal costs about, $385.00 per 55 gallon drum. Also add the cost of the containers at 1aout $125.00 each. The resultant pebble like beads of glass are inert and can be disposed of or used as roofing rock, or garden fill. The final key point is that this system is just that a final solution. This hazardous material is completely destroyed our kids will never be faced with what to do with it. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 12:59:11 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA06124; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 12:55:42 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 12:55:42 -0800 Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:53:49 -0500 From: "Glenn F. Hinton" <103510.1772@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Little help.... Sender: "Glenn F. Hinton" <103510.1772@CompuServe.COM> To: "INTERNET:freenrg-l@eskimo.com" Message-ID: <199802251553_MC2-34AF-368E@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id MAA06059 Resent-Message-ID: <"3wWHH1.0.SV1.9L8zq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3935 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hey Guys & or Gals, Am a long time subscriber to the list and I have got to say I love this guy Knudtson! This is the kind of interaction we need! Anyway, I was on the web the other day and was reading about some type of electrostatic device (I think) that was patented and at the bottom of the page it gave thrust comparisons for airplanes, autos and this device. The only other things that I can remember is that there was a picture of a man with the device and I think the device was made of balsa wood. My wife came up and started in on how I should be working etc., yada, yada, yada... and I closed the page and now I can't find the article any where! Has anyone seen this article?? I sure would love to finish it! Let me know, Thanks, Glenn Hinton From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 16:05:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA23897; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:59:51 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:59:51 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34F4B22E.7D7F@ix.netcom.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:07:10 -0500 From: "Dana K. Loan" Reply-To: loan@ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Little help.... References: <199802251553_MC2-34AF-368E@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ITMb71.0.Jr5.r1Bzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3936 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Glenn F. Hinton wrote: > > Hey Guys & or Gals, > Am a long time subscriber to the list and I have got to say I love this guy > Knudtson! > This is the kind of interaction we need! > > Anyway, I was on the web the other day and was reading about some type of > electrostatic device (I think) that was patented and at the bottom of the > page > it gave thrust comparisons for airplanes, autos and this device. > The only other things that I can remember is that there was a picture of a > man with the > device and I think the device was made of balsa wood. > My wife came up and started in on how I should be working etc., yada, yada, > yada... > and I closed the page and now I can't find the article any where! > Has anyone seen this article?? I sure would love to finish it! > > Let me know, > > Thanks, > Glenn Hinton Glenn Could you be talking about Thomas Townsend Brown? He was a scientist in the fifties that demonstrated electrostatic thrust. I would have thought he would be fairly well known in these circles. You can get extnsive info on him and his work from Bill B's home pages or just do a search on T. T. Brown. Sorry to jump in here like this..his work is my main interest. Dana Loan loan@ix.netcom.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 17:46:55 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA04663; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:57:57 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 16:57:57 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34F4B6D0.82B0C067@ihug.co.nz> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 13:26:56 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Little help.... References: <199802251553_MC2-34AF-368E@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OtDT51.0.h81.HuBzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3937 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com What browser do you use?, some browsers you can go through the cache, I run Netscape 4 and just need to go communicator > History. I sure am interested, can you remember how you got there? pages that could have led you there? anything? John Berry Glenn F. Hinton wrote: > Hey Guys & or Gals, > Am a long time subscriber to the list and I have got to say I love this guy > Knudtson! > This is the kind of interaction we need! > > Anyway, I was on the web the other day and was reading about some type of > electrostatic device (I think) that was patented and at the bottom of the > page > it gave thrust comparisons for airplanes, autos and this device. > The only other things that I can remember is that there was a picture of a > man with the > device and I think the device was made of balsa wood. > My wife came up and started in on how I should be working etc., yada, yada, > yada... > and I closed the page and now I can't find the article any where! > Has anyone seen this article?? I sure would love to finish it! > > Let me know, > > Thanks, > Glenn Hinton From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 18:06:21 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA00258; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:00:51 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:00:51 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980225213909.0053bdc8@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 21:39:13 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"LIk6f2.0.r3.IpCzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3938 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 12:18 AM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: >Yes I have constructed small aluminum drums with groves inside to move the >material up a slight incline. The slight resultant presser is sent out >through a series of fine filters to trap any possible material that might >escape the process. The used filter medium is good for about thirty cycles >and is just then added to the next batch and reprocessed and new filters >installed. OK. I'm a little hazy as to the details here. The aluminum drum is the reaction chamber? How well does it withstand the molten asbestos? I take it that once you get a nice puddle of the stuff, the temperature won't go higher. Oddly enough, my Merc index does not list the melting temp of asbestos. Or am I mistaken here and a chemical reaction is occurring, breaking down the asbestos into something else? Does it melt or simply decompose? > >The unit sufficient to process a 55 gallon drum of asbestos uses about 50 >amps, at 240 volt. The small rotary drum processor, could deal with the 55 >in about six fillings. > >So there are your figures; 50 amps at 240 volts, times six times about 20 >minutes processing time per fill. > >And yes this simple system was demonstrated, and tested. > >Depending on transportation and disposal fees asbestos disposal costs >about, $385.00 per 55 gallon drum. Also add the cost of the containers at >1aout $125.00 each. Not to beat a dead cow, but is this the cost to guy who wants to get rid of the stuff or the processing cost to the disposal center? > >The resultant pebble like beads of glass are inert and can be disposed of >or used as roofing rock, or garden fill. > Back to the first question; the resulting material is still asbestos, or something else after processing? By the way; I found that video of Yull Brown etc. Alot of it was shot of one Dave Ennis(sp?) giving demonstrations of the welder. This was quite interesting. The "energy from the atmosphere" suffered from a lack of understanding of what gravitational energy was. Of course, this was Dave explaining this; not Yull. I don't know what Yulls explanation was. Dave seemed to think that he was getting more energy if he lifted the water faster. Not so. The energy stored is simply a function of the difference in height in the gradient. What is your take on this? Also, for people wanting to fool around with this technology, Alfa chemical company used to sell a small water gas welder. It was quite cheap in comparison to Yull's welder, of course it's only the size of a briefcase. Nonetheless, if you don't want to reinvent the wheel to experiment with this technology check it out. Their website does not show labware; so you'd have to order the catalog or talk to them. Last time I looked was about 2 years ago, perhaps someone wants to check on this. The site is http://www.alfa.com KPN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 19:05:57 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA25056; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:56:39 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 18:56:39 -0800 (PST) From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Little help.... Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 02:54:55 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <34f4d681.11882441@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <199802251553_MC2-34AF-368E@compuserve.com> In-Reply-To: <199802251553_MC2-34AF-368E@compuserve.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OQr1Y2.0.P76.XdDzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3939 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:53:49 -0500, Glenn F. Hinton wrote: [snip] >Anyway, I was on the web the other day and was reading about some type of >electrostatic device (I think) that was patented and at the bottom of the >page >it gave thrust comparisons for airplanes, autos and this device. [snip] You might want to do a search on "inertial drives", "reactionless drives", and "Laithwaite, Eric R.". Regards, Robin van Spaandonk -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on temperature. "....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." PS - no SPAM thanks! -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 19:18:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA27861; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:14:10 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 19:14:10 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220022650.007aae30@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 02:26:50 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980225213909.0053bdc8@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"W-V_93.0.9p6.ztDzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3940 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:39 PM 2/25/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 12:18 AM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: >>Yes I have constructed small aluminum drums with groves inside to move the >>material up a slight incline. The slight resultant presser is sent out >>through a series of fine filters to trap any possible material that might >>escape the process. The used filter medium is good for about thirty cycles >>and is just then added to the next batch and reprocessed and new filters >>installed. > >OK. I'm a little hazy as to the details here. The aluminum drum is >the reaction chamber? How well does it withstand the molten asbestos? >I take it that once you get a nice puddle of the stuff, the temperature >won't go higher. Oddly enough, my Merc index does not list the >melting temp of asbestos. Or am I mistaken here and a chemical >reaction is occurring, breaking down the asbestos into something >else? Does it melt or simply decompose? > >> >>The unit sufficient to process a 55 gallon drum of asbestos uses about 50 >>amps, at 240 volt. The small rotary drum processor, could deal with the 55 >>in about six fillings. >> >>So there are your figures; 50 amps at 240 volts, times six times about 20 >>minutes processing time per fill. >> >>And yes this simple system was demonstrated, and tested. >> >>Depending on transportation and disposal fees asbestos disposal costs >>about, $385.00 per 55 gallon drum. Also add the cost of the containers at >>1aout $125.00 each. > >Not to beat a dead cow, but is this the cost to guy who wants >to get rid of the stuff or the processing cost to the disposal >center? > >> >>The resultant pebble like beads of glass are inert and can be disposed of >>or used as roofing rock, or garden fill. >> > >Back to the first question; the resulting material is still >asbestos, or something else after processing? > >By the way; I found that video of Yull Brown etc. Alot of it >was shot of one Dave Ennis(sp?) giving demonstrations of the >welder. This was quite interesting. The "energy from the atmosphere" >suffered from a lack of understanding of what gravitational >energy was. Of course, this was Dave explaining this; not Yull. >I don't know what Yulls explanation was. Dave seemed to think >that he was getting more energy if he lifted the water faster. >Not so. The energy stored is simply a function of the difference >in height in the gradient. What is your take on this? > >Also, for people wanting to fool around with this technology, >Alfa chemical company used to sell a small water gas welder. >It was quite cheap in comparison to Yull's welder, of course >it's only the size of a briefcase. Nonetheless, if you don't >want to reinvent the wheel to experiment with this technology >check it out. Their website does not show labware; so you'd >have to order the catalog or talk to them. Last time I looked >was about 2 years ago, perhaps someone wants to check on this. >The site is > >http://www.alfa.com > >KPN > > Keith, dear boy! These are some of the things that are covered in the basic statements about the "NEW" effects of this gas on differing materials. This gas has very different reactions with varying materials, thus "NEW" design parameters. You will not find this stuff in a book, hence the accurate use of the term, "NEW". The drum is cooled by a water jacket, but this only insures longer life in this "NEW" system. The "NEW" type of heating occurs in a "NEW" way, directly in the material presented to the "NEW" kind of flame. This "NEW" principle of thermal release is what is also the foundation for a "NEW" Practical Applied Science, "NEW" Oven-less Technology 1) Hydroxy reacts to Aluminum in a mild way, hence the use of Aluminum in the construction of the drums. The slight incline to the drum facilitates longitudinal "roll-over" of material. The groves spiraling up incline as the drum rotates also facilitate this action. The simple rotation is the primary consideration to presenting new material to the flame rack. 2) The flame rack is fed through the end axis point, on the down-incline end. The venting of accumulated resultant steam exits through a small port in the up-incline end. A "Variable Speed Drive", and bike chain, provide the rotation of the drum. 3) The cost of conventional disposal is what is referenced in the transportation and container costing. 4) The "NEW" System, is the cost of processing and remember this is done on site. That means, in the parking lot of the building, factory, or school, where the asbestos has been removed. Then you hook up the "NEW" trailer mounted equipment using this "NEW" system, and haul it to you "NEW" home that you bought with your "NEW" found wealth made from processing "OLD" asbestos. (Smile) Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed Feb 25 22:13:19 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA23226; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 22:09:37 -0800 Resent-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 22:09:37 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220052843.007aad50@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 05:28:43 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Energy Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"0Ee7A1.0.qg5.VSGzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3941 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fabrica de Matricies: The loose translation gives clues to the ancient conceptualization of a web of force that effects all mass. i.e. Fabric of the Matrix. There has been a longstanding misconception in science to segregate observed phenomenon. This habit runs into trouble when we seek to describe reality by examining effects, rather than looking for the source of these effects. The quest for the "Grand Unified Theory" is just such a manifest of this difficulty. Aethereal research is much like this in its seeking, an energy, rather than to seek what is it that creates the effects that we know as energy. This is most easily understood by drawing an analogy. The quest for scientific understanding by only examining effects likened trying to understand the ocean, by watching a cork, with out having a concept of buoyancy or water. An observer may see that a cork, caused by the ripples and waves, seems to most times to move up and down. He then says boldly, "The ocean is a vertical oriented thing, it moves only up and down". Another observer watches the cork for a longer time and sees that it has a prime resonance of movement to greater or lesser ranges, in addition to the minor vertical fluctuations. This movement has a period of every twelve hours, a correlation to the action of the tides. Confidently he declares, "The Ocean is a Mystical Clock". Another observer watches the cork even longer, and sees that the period of primary ranging of the movements of the cork, does not happen at regular intervals but seems to regress with the passage of time. He shouts his prediction, "The Mystical Clock is running down". Along comes a great storm and the cork is thrown to the beach and comes to rest. All three observers look at each other in terrible fear. The are convinced that the world has come to an end, the quietly go to their homes to prepare for the end. A forth observer, swims to the beach for a rest, and finds the cork high on a sand dune, puts it into his teeth and swims back out into the ocean where he knows of a strong current, and sets the cork free to drift to other lands. He swims of to enjoy the ocean he knows well. Nicola Tesla: "Man will have no need for concerns of energy when he learns to connect his machinery to the gear-works of the universe". 1938 Fabrica de Matricies, is that gear-work. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 00:21:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA05757; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 00:19:47 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 00:19:47 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802260710.XAA02949@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: Little help.... Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 23:15:40 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"HrKXM2.0.nP1.XMIzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3942 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com If you're using Internet Explorer click on "Go" and then on "Open History Folder". That will show you every site you've visited for the last gazillion years! ---------- > From: John Berry > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Little help.... > Date: Wednesday, February 25, 1998 4:26 PM > > What browser do you use?, some browsers you can go through the cache, I run > Netscape 4 and just need to go communicator > History. > > I sure am interested, can you remember how you got there? pages that could have > led you there? > anything? > > John Berry > > Glenn F. Hinton wrote: > > > Hey Guys & or Gals, > > Am a long time subscriber to the list and I have got to say I love this guy > > Knudtson! > > This is the kind of interaction we need! > > > > Anyway, I was on the web the other day and was reading about some type of > > electrostatic device (I think) that was patented and at the bottom of the > > page > > it gave thrust comparisons for airplanes, autos and this device. > > The only other things that I can remember is that there was a picture of a > > man with the > > device and I think the device was made of balsa wood. > > My wife came up and started in on how I should be working etc., yada, yada, > > yada... > > and I closed the page and now I can't find the article any where! > > Has anyone seen this article?? I sure would love to finish it! > > > > Let me know, > > > > Thanks, > > Glenn Hinton > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 10:42:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA05124; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:34:12 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 10:34:12 -0800 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 13:32:35 -0500 From: "Glenn F. Hinton" <103510.1772@CompuServe.COM> Subject: Little help ....Worked!!! Sender: "Glenn F. Hinton" <103510.1772@CompuServe.COM> To: "INTERNET:freenrg-l@eskimo.com" Message-ID: <199802261333_MC2-34C7-EA2F@compuserve.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id KAA05087 Resent-Message-ID: <"nvJSH2.0.wF1.ZMRzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3943 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thanks for all the response to my "Little help.." e-mail! One of the responses (I'm sorry, but I lost the name) suggested that I look at the "History" in Internet Explorer and sure enough there it was!!! I was so excited that when I saw the above referenced e-mail, I went directly to the Internet Explorer and had to close my current browser. This caused the particular e-mail to be deleted. Nonetheless (sp?), I am very grateful to this person in particular, and to everyone else who responded! The article with .gif is at www.Keelynet.com/expcirc.htm. It is a zipped file so you will need an "unzipper" (decompression utility). There are two "Things" (I know, I know...what is the correct word?) to click on, "Majorde FTP" and "Majorde.www" Oh yeah, if possible, PLEASE SEND KEELYNET, ( OUR BUDDY JERRY DECKER!) WHAT YOU CAN TO KEEP KEELYNET ONLINE. The website is coming up for re-newal (sp?) and it ain't cheap!! Plus he's between jobs now and I think we can all relate to that! Yours in Free Energy(Off the Grid!!!!), Glenn Hinton From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 11:53:04 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA05979; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:42:17 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 11:42:17 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220101114.007af9c0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 10:11:14 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Hydroxy Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"dUpg_.0.GT1.HMSzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3944 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hydroxy VS. Hydrocarbons The battle for an understanding of efficiencies. When we seek to make an evaluation of which energy to use, is the issue of economics what we should focus on? I would say not. The expedient may be a folly that is ripe with hidden cost. When comparing energy systems it would be good to look at ALL the costs when making decisions to which is best for man. First lets look at the conservation structure of Hydrocarbons. As we all know hydrocarbons or COAL and OIL, are nothing more than a energy reservoir, created by the energy from the sun splitting the water molecule and bonding the Hydrogen atom to Carbon. This results in carbohydrate structures, starch, sugars, and cellulose. This process we call photosynthesis, and it happens in the structure of the Chloroplasts of living plants. So, the sun is the source of all energies in living things. After a Billion years or so, enough energy has been stored up in a swamp or bog to produce many Trillion kilo calories of energy when released. But we are not done with the Hydrocarbons yet. First we need to bury them. In the earth carbohydrates are subjected to anaerobic decay, heat and pressure. After about another Billion years, we dig a hole and find that the structure of this ooze has changed a bit to form what we call a hydrocarbon. What we fail to see is that one other purpose of plants is to collect the poisons in the previously much polluted, volcanic spoiled air, thus becoming a repository of all the garbage that is harmful to life. By this time we had become accustom to warmth in our homes and power to run things, and the use of primary Carbohydrate structures to get this power, burning plants, wood if you will. We had learned about steam, and found that coal burned very hot and could make good steels from Iron. We did not see that this consumption also meant that all of the Billions of years of accumulated pollution was also being re-released into the air. We sent workers into the earth to dig this filthy stuff up, and then began to pump tons of garbage into the air for no other reason other that it was expedient. Early in this century we discovered new ways to drill deep for trapped oils, and began to pull this garbage out too. The extensive use of these polluting forms of heat energy began to so damage our earth so much, that entire forests we being poisoned. But, we still kept on digging it up. We pay men to dig these wells, men to pump this garbage out of the ground. We load it into great ships and transport it a world away, then we process it to make it work just a little better for specific needs. Then we transport it to distribution locations, and pay men to sell it. Then we finally after Billions of years, and thousands of processes, and handling, we drive to the store, in a contraption that at best is only about 17% efficient mechanically, our cars. Now lets look at Hydroxy. You use the sun to through solar voltaic low voltage DC current, to suspend energy directly in the elemental structure of water Hydrogen and Oxygen. Then you use it. What is left over is water and heat. Guess what? You are warm. Nothing from the air, and puts nothing into the air. I kind of like that. This simple understanding is why I get so upset when others ask, "Well, how much does it cost"? It costs the earth NOTHING, is that not of value? AND, we get to keep all our toys. (Smile) Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 15:32:34 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA15861; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 15:25:45 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 15:25:45 -0800 Message-ID: <34F61472.BF1@keelynet.com> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 17:18:42 -0800 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Magnetic Diode Generator Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"DOeNI3.0.Vt3.rdVzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3945 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Folks! I found this on one of Jim Leatherman's pages; http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/1287/sindex1.htm A brief quote; > I have invented a new electrical generator which reduces the counter > torque of today's generator designs by a factor of 100. This new > generator design is analogous to the diode in that Magnetic flux has > high permeability in one direction and low in the other.... Note it is a CLAIM, and that's all there is at present, but so far no reason to doubt him. Tapping back EMF is an approach that many free energy researchers have experimented with. Check it out! -- Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 18:13:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA32562; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 18:09:03 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 18:09:03 -0800 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 18:06:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802270206.SAA29530@denmark.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Hydroxy Resent-Message-ID: <"FDtoP3.0.dy7.x0Yzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3946 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello Todd and all, At 10:11 AM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: ... >Now lets look at Hydroxy. > >You use the sun to through solar voltaic low voltage DC current, to suspend >energy directly in the elemental structure of water Hydrogen and Oxygen. >Then you use it. What is left over is water and heat. Guess what? You >are warm. Nothing from the air, and puts nothing into the air. I kind of >like that. > Are you worried that large scale use of solar cell arrays will cause global warming through increased solar radiation absorption? (I'm not sure if I believe all the global warming claims I hear.) Some people say that it takes more energy to produce solar cells than the electrical energy they produce. Is this true? If so, is the energy balance about to be switched by newer more efficient or "less energy to produce" solar cells? -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 19:32:54 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA22843; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 19:27:05 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 19:27:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34F6322D.B82321F7@ihug.co.nz> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 16:25:35 +1300 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Little help ....Worked!!! References: <199802261333_MC2-34C7-EA2F@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"NMhzi3.0.ra5.7AZzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3947 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com The url you gave: www.Keelynet.com/expcirc.htm is wrong, other that the fact that it is a small "k" for keelynet not upper case the url is still wrong, please copy and past the url into the email if you can to get the right url. John Berry Glenn F. Hinton wrote: > Thanks for all the response to my "Little help.." e-mail! > One of the responses (I'm sorry, but I lost the name) suggested that I look > at the "History" in Internet Explorer and sure enough there it was!!! > I was so excited that when I saw the above referenced e-mail, I went > directly to the Internet Explorer and had to close my current browser. This > caused the particular > e-mail to be deleted. Nonetheless (sp?), I am very grateful to this person > in particular, and to everyone else who responded! > > The article with .gif is at www.Keelynet.com/expcirc.htm. It is a zipped > file so you will need an "unzipper" (decompression utility). > There are two "Things" (I know, I know...what is the correct word?) to > click on, > "Majorde FTP" and "Majorde.www" > > Oh yeah, if possible, PLEASE SEND KEELYNET, ( OUR BUDDY JERRY DECKER!) > WHAT YOU CAN TO KEEP KEELYNET ONLINE. The website is coming up for re-newal > (sp?) and it ain't cheap!! Plus he's between jobs now and I think we can > all relate to that! > > Yours in Free Energy(Off the Grid!!!!), > > Glenn Hinton From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 20:10:48 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA25606; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:05:49 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:05:49 -0800 Message-ID: <34F62071.4CC9@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 18:09:53 -0800 From: Wm Perry Reply-To: wperry3092@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: HV Rectification? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"LrFKI.0.xF6.RkZzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3948 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hello All, I am not an engineer, so therefore do not hold an engineer's knowledge. I know it is possible to use a spark gap arrangement to convert High Voltage DC Power into HVAC. What I want to know is, how is it possible to rectify HV, say 20-30MV, into DC, I thought of trying a rather large pin diode type of setup, but not quite sure if it could handle that much Voltage. Any technical help would be appreciated. WILLIAM PERRY From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 20:16:23 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA28307; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:13:00 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:13:00 -0800 Message-ID: <34F657D0.7129@keelynet.com> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 22:06:08 -0800 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Little help ....Worked!!! References: <199802261333_MC2-34C7-EA2F@compuserve.com> <34F6322D.B82321F7@ihug.co.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"DeKo71.0.Dw6.ArZzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3949 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi John! Try; http://keelynet.com/expcirc/expcirc.htm Because of differences in browsers, the experimental files are posted as downloadable using ftp: or www....if what you want doesn't work one way, try the other....good luck... -- Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 20:23:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA30146; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:18:17 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:18:17 -0800 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19980227000225.0053e258@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 00:02:29 -0500 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"7J5SI1.0.uM7.6wZzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3950 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 02:26 AM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: > >1) Hydroxy reacts to Aluminum in a mild way, hence the use of Aluminum in >the construction of the drums. The slight incline to the drum facilitates >longitudinal "roll-over" of material. The groves spiraling up incline as >the drum rotates also facilitate this action. The simple rotation is the >primary consideration to presenting new material to the flame rack. > >2) The flame rack is fed through the end axis point, on the down-incline >end. The venting of accumulated resultant steam exits through a small port >in the up-incline end. A "Variable Speed Drive", and bike chain, provide >the rotation of the drum. > >3) The cost of conventional disposal is what is referenced in the >transportation and container costing. > >4) The "NEW" System, is the cost of processing and remember this is done on >site. That means, in the parking lot of the building, factory, or school, >where the asbestos has been removed. Then you hook up the "NEW" trailer >mounted equipment using this "NEW" system, and haul it to you "NEW" home >that you bought with your "NEW" found wealth made from processing "OLD" >asbestos. > >(Smile) > >Love > >TR Knudtson > Several forms of asbestos exist, the most common being serpentine or Mg3Si2O5(OH)4 ( all numbers being subscripts ). I expect either the product after combustion to be some simpler combination of these elements, or the same substance en masse. This is a pretty critical point TR. You can bet the EPA is going to ask that question when you roll into town in your processing truck. They're certainly gonna ask it when you start dumping the product into someones backyard. I'm not sure I understand the answer in point 3. Please elaborate on this ( late nite working... ). After watch Yull melt and weld aluminum of various sorts, I wonder about the "mild" effect it has. Perhaps it might be more accurate to say that thermal insulators, like asbestos, will achieve much higher temperatures that thermal conductors, like aluminum, because the energy is contained in a much smaller volume. Hence a large heat sink like a big aluminum can will be much less readily affected than the insulator. This effect was demonstrated in a very clear way on the video by showing a piece of ceramic being heated underwater, although the explanation above was not provided. Please tell me why this simple "OLD" explanation is wrong. KPN From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 20:31:31 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA01521; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:22:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:22:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802270421.UAA16496@rio.com> From: "Gary Shannon" To: Subject: Re: HV Rectification? Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:28:25 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"7nYLD1.0.YN.N-Zzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3951 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com ---------- > From: Wm Perry > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: HV Rectification? > Date: Thursday, February 26, 1998 6:09 PM > > Hello All, > I am not an engineer, so therefore do not hold an engineer's knowledge. > I know it is possible to use a spark gap arrangement to convert High > Voltage DC Power into HVAC. What I want to know is, how is it possible > to rectify HV, say 20-30MV, into DC, I thought of trying a rather large > pin diode type of setup, but not quite sure if it could handle that much > Voltage. Any technical help would be appreciated. > > WILLIAM PERRY > I once saw an article in the Amateur Scientist Department of Scientific American (back in the 60's I think) that used a synchronous motor attached to a home-made distributor-type gadget. The motor ran at the frequency of the AC (which was 60 Hz = 60 rev/sec in the example) and switched the output AC to whichever output terminal matched it's current polarity. I don't imagine that would work at higher frequencies, but at 60Hz it worked fine. The input AC was wired to two rotors seperate on the motor shaft and each rotor touched either the positive or negative ouput terminal for 1/2 of each revolution. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 20:53:05 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA05553; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:45:02 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:45:02 -0800 From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 04:44:47 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <34f64381.27148251@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <3.0.32.19980227000225.0053e258@cnct.com> In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980227000225.0053e258@cnct.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"pLGzK.0.aM1.CJazq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3952 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Fri, 27 Feb 1998 00:02:29 -0500, Keith Nagel wrote: [snip] >Several forms of asbestos exist, the most common being serpentine >or Mg3Si2O5(OH)4 ( all numbers being subscripts ). I expect either >the product after combustion to be some simpler combination of >these elements, or the same substance en masse. This is a pretty >critical point TR. You can bet the EPA is going to ask that question >when you roll into town in your processing truck. They're certainly >gonna ask it when you start dumping the product into someones backyard. [snip] I was under the impression that asbestos was carcinogenic because it came in the form of long sharp fibers which have a tendency to lodge in lung tissue. I suspect that the resulting long term inflammatory effects would contribute. I could therefore easily be convinced that the same substance, in the form of spheroids rather than fibers was perfectly harmless. Comments from anyone who actually knows what they are talking about? Regards, Robin van Spaandonk -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on temperature. "....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." PS - no SPAM thanks! -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 21:43:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA14265; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:39:37 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:39:37 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34F634F2.109A@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 19:37:23 -0800 From: "H. Turt" Reply-To: wperry3092@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: HV Rectification? References: <199802270421.UAA16496@rio.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"76sFU3.0.oU3.N6bzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3953 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com thanks gary. That actually seems like such a novel approach. I feel a little clumsy not even thinking of anything along those lines (my standard is to think of something cool only to find out it has been in practice for 50 yrs). WILLIAM From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 21:47:22 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA15155; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:43:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:43:19 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 20:12:17 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <199802270206.SAA29530@denmark.it.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"QEXK82.0.bi3.n9bzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3954 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 06:06 PM 2/26/98 -0800, you wrote: >Hello Todd and all, >At 10:11 AM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: >... >>Now lets look at Hydroxy. >> >>You use the sun to through solar voltaic low voltage DC current, to suspend >>energy directly in the elemental structure of water Hydrogen and Oxygen. >>Then you use it. What is left over is water and heat. Guess what? You >>are warm. Nothing from the air, and puts nothing into the air. I kind of >>like that. >> >Are you worried that large scale use of solar cell arrays will cause global >warming through increased solar radiation absorption? (I'm not sure if I >believe all the global warming claims I hear.) >Some people say that it takes more energy to produce solar cells than the >electrical energy they produce. Is this true? If so, is the energy balance >about to be switched by newer more efficient or "less energy to produce" >solar cells? >-Dave > > >Dear Dave, It is good to hear form someone else other than just Keith. I like his questions, don't get me wrong, but I was beginning to think that we were the only ones communicating at this site. Lets look at the global warming issue. The agreed critical issue in the global warming controversy has long been shown to be the quantity of Carbon-dioxide gas in the atmosphere. Science does completely agree that this gas acts like a blanket and holds in the solar heat that impacts the earth. The disagreement is over whether this is a bad thing or a good thing. As far as solar cells absorbing more of the suns heat? No, the heat would be absorbed anyway, it makes no difference whether it is hitting a solar collector of the asphalt of a parking lot. Heat is still striking the earth. Actually the point you raise is a good one. As the sun light is converted to electricity, by the Photo Voltaic Process , at efficiencies of about, nominally 30%. This means that 30% less heat would be actually felt. The missing 30% is now electricity. This is not a gain though, because it eventually is released back into the "macro system" (The Big System), at some point when it is used. But, the insulating blanket of carbon-dioxide gas that is causing this warming, is growing ever thicker, every time we use "hydrocarbon" based fuels. This holding of what energy does hit the earth, as solar generated heat, IN. Now plants love Carbon-dioxide, it is to them what Oxygen is to us, they need it to live. Plants in some parts of the world are doing very well. But, where they might be able to bring the CO2 back into balance, they can't because we are killing off more that can re-grow. So on it goes more CO2 from fuel gasses, less plants, a thicker insulating blanket of CO2 gas, finally more contained heat. "GLOBAL WARMING" As for the energy to produce Photo-voltaic Cells, this is why I strongly advocate the use of "Hydroxy" energy systems, and in particular (Oven-less) technologies as a whole. You need to see this energy system as a closed loop. From sun to electricity,,,, from electricity to a gas made from water,,,,, from an electrified water gas, (Hydroxy), to heat,,,,,,, who's byproduct is water. You end up with what you started, "Closed Loop". Now why do we not use this "Oven-less" technology to make Solar cells? Because I haven't shown anyone how to yet. In fact most people find it incredulous that I can make water burn let alone making solar cells with it. This would make the manufacture of Solar cells and energy free process. You would still have to pay people to make, distribute and sell these cells though. But the manufacture of solar cells is very easy using this system, but I do not have the $30 to $40 million that it would take to perfect and automate such a process. So what I can do is teach others how who have that kind of money. That is what I do. As far as the conventional processing of solar cells, costing more to make than they produce in their life? Lets look. An 8" solar cell produces about 2 amp of current at about 2.6 Volts. Or, about 5.2 Watts. If you put it in the sun for an hour, that gives you 5.2 watt hours. Now if you look at the sun in a good area for solar, you can expect about 10 hours per day peek yield. The rest is inefficiencies because of angle of light hitting the cell in the morning and evening and the seasonal reductions due to the suns annual shift. So, we get about 52 watts form a small cell per day and in 100 days that will be about 5.2 Kilo Watt Hours. At my personal billing rate, (Southern California) is about 10.5 Cents, per kWh. Now, newer cells boast a 15 year life and old cells used to last about 10 years, so lets say 12.5 years for the life of a cell on average. Over that 12.5 years, a 8" cell would make about 234 kWh. At 10 cents per kWh, that would equal about $23.50 worth of power, retail. Or about, $12.00 actual, power production costs, wholesale. Now that cell would cost you near $15.00 to buy. So, yes it is not worth it, because even if you factor the energy costs at actual cost of producing the power, like the cost of making the electricity,, it would cost you more money to buy the cell, than even the wholesale costs of what you could get back out in electricity. I might add, that as long as others control the relative price of things and products it will always be that way. You actually loose about $2.00 on the deal. What you might like to know however is that That 8" inch solar cell only cost about 30 cents to make. So if you look at it that way you get $23.50 0f electricity for about 30 cents manufacturing costs. This later extreme, of actual manufacturing costs, to retail value of the electricity, it really is a good deal. You save $23.20 over the life of the cell. You will never see this because this would be bad for business, and cost jobs, or that is what they tell us. Thank you for writing me. I am sure Keith likes the break. I don't mean to be a smarty pants but these are the facts, please keep asking questions. Love TR Knudtson Math 5.2 Watts per hour per cell. 10 hours yield per day =52 Watt Hours per day. 5.2 kWh per 100 days 12.5 years average life of a cell 365 days per year X 12.5 years = 4,562.5 days life. 4,562 days / 100 days per 5.2 kWh. = 45 X 5.2 = 234 kWh @ 10 cents per kWh. 234 kWh life time production of a cell X 10 cents = $23,50, I rounded up. (Smile) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 21:53:51 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA17199; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:52:15 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:52:15 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980227125113.006e5038@world.std.com> X-Sender: mica@world.std.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 12:51:13 +0000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Mitchell Swartz Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> References: <199802270206.SAA29530@denmark.it.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"KmBkc1.0.dC4.CIbzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3955 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 08:12 PM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: > >An 8" solar cell produces about 2 amp of current at about 2.6 Volts. Or, >about 5.2 Watts. If you put it in the sun for an hour, that gives you 5.2 >watt hours. Now if you look at the sun in a good area for solar, you can >expect about 10 hours per day peek yield. The rest is inefficiencies >because of angle of light hitting the cell in the morning and evening and >the seasonal reductions due to the suns annual shift. So, we get about 52 >watts form a small cell per day and in 100 days that will be about 5.2 Kilo >Watt Hours. At my personal billing rate, (Southern California) is about >10.5 Cents, per kWh. Now, newer cells boast a 15 year life and old cells >used to last about 10 years, so lets say 12.5 years for the life of a cell >on average. Over that 12.5 years, a 8" cell would make about 234 kWh. At >10 cents per kWh, that would equal about $23.50 worth of power, retail. Or >about, $12.00 actual, power production costs, wholesale. Now that cell >would cost you near $15.00 to buy. So, yes it is not worth it, because >even if you factor the energy costs at actual cost of producing the power, >like the cost of making the electricity,, it would cost you more money to >buy the cell, than even the wholesale costs of what you could get back out >in electricity. I might add, that as long as others control the relative >price of things and products it will always be that way. You actually >loose about $2.00 on the deal. > >What you might like to know however is that That 8" inch solar cell only >cost about 30 cents to make. So if you look at it that way you get $23.50 >0f electricity for about 30 cents manufacturing costs. This later extreme, >of actual manufacturing costs, to retail value of the electricity, it >really is a good deal. You save $23.20 over the life of the cell. > >You will never see this because this would be bad for business, and cost >jobs, or that is what they tell us. > >Thank you for writing me. I am sure Keith likes the break. > >I don't mean to be a smarty pants but these are the facts, please keep >asking questions. > >Love > >TR Knudtson This model assumes a lifetime of 12.5 years. Many solar cells have lasted decades. Furthermore, for some reason, some of their efficiencies have increased over time. With the correct numbers observed for actual solar cell use, they have paid for themselves. Why does the above calculation choose 12.5 years? Mitchell Swartz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 21:56:35 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA17855; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:54:43 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:54:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34F6393B.5731@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 19:55:40 -0800 From: "H. Turt" Reply-To: wperry3092@worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: another 2 wire question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"j69P-1.0.uM4.XKbzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3957 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com The other day I noticed someone had posted a bunch of questions about long wires and inductance. I was wondering if anyone else agrees with me that if one applied a voltage difference between two wires stretched parallel and taut. that the wires could be used in an oscillator circuit as the capacitor in the tank circuit. and the resonance (Fo) of the circuit would be the acoustical resonance of the wires? WILLIAM From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 21:55:19 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA21906; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:53:22 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:53:22 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220202351.007aeb60@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 20:23:51 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980227000225.0053e258@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"O4vAJ.0.9M5.GJbzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3956 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 12:02 AM 2/27/98 -0500, you wrote: >At 02:26 AM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: > >> >>1) Hydroxy reacts to Aluminum in a mild way, hence the use of Aluminum in >>the construction of the drums. The slight incline to the drum facilitates >>longitudinal "roll-over" of material. The groves spiraling up incline as >>the drum rotates also facilitate this action. The simple rotation is the >>primary consideration to presenting new material to the flame rack. >> >>2) The flame rack is fed through the end axis point, on the down-incline >>end. The venting of accumulated resultant steam exits through a small port >>in the up-incline end. A "Variable Speed Drive", and bike chain, provide >>the rotation of the drum. >> >>3) The cost of conventional disposal is what is referenced in the >>transportation and container costing. >> >>4) The "NEW" System, is the cost of processing and remember this is done on >>site. That means, in the parking lot of the building, factory, or school, >>where the asbestos has been removed. Then you hook up the "NEW" trailer >>mounted equipment using this "NEW" system, and haul it to you "NEW" home >>that you bought with your "NEW" found wealth made from processing "OLD" >>asbestos. >> >>(Smile) >> >>Love >> >>TR Knudtson >> > >Several forms of asbestos exist, the most common being serpentine >or Mg3Si2O5(OH)4 ( all numbers being subscripts ). I expect either >the product after combustion to be some simpler combination of >these elements, or the same substance en masse. This is a pretty >critical point TR. You can bet the EPA is going to ask that question >when you roll into town in your processing truck. They're certainly >gonna ask it when you start dumping the product into someones backyard. > >I'm not sure I understand the answer in point 3. Please elaborate >on this ( late nite working... ). Kieth, Back to the previous letter for this one. Those are the conventional disposal costs. $385 + $125 to buy the can. Total between $415 and $500 per 55 gal drum. > >After watch Yull melt and weld aluminum of various sorts, I wonder >about the "mild" effect it has. Perhaps it might be more accurate >to say that thermal insulators, like asbestos, will achieve much higher >temperatures that thermal conductors, like aluminum, because the >energy is contained in a much smaller volume. Hence a large heat >sink like a big aluminum can will be much less readily affected >than the insulator. ********* YES! YES! YES! Good boy you got it. thick aluminum gives off the heat very fast, the mineral of asbestose absorbs it. I also use aluminum for the lining of my ore seperator. Good JOB! A+ and two weeks off with pay. ********* This effect was demonstrated in a very clear >way on the video by showing a piece of ceramic being heated >underwater, although the explanation above was not provided. >Please tell me why this simple "OLD" explanation is wrong. > >KPN > > > > It is not, you are wright on. But, with conventional gasses it would be oppiset. WAY to GO Keith! Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 22:00:15 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA23435; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:58:34 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 21:58:34 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220202902.007b2bc0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 20:29:02 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... In-Reply-To: <34f64381.27148251@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <3.0.32.19980227000225.0053e258@cnct.com> <3.0.32.19980227000225.0053e258@cnct.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"HHWMT.0.0k5.8Obzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3958 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 04:44 AM 2/27/98 GMT, you wrote: >On Fri, 27 Feb 1998 00:02:29 -0500, Keith Nagel wrote: >[snip] >>Several forms of asbestos exist, the most common being serpentine >>or Mg3Si2O5(OH)4 ( all numbers being subscripts ). I expect either >>the product after combustion to be some simpler combination of >>these elements, or the same substance en masse. This is a pretty >>critical point TR. You can bet the EPA is going to ask that question >>when you roll into town in your processing truck. They're certainly >>gonna ask it when you start dumping the product into someones backyard. >[snip] >I was under the impression that asbestos was carcinogenic because it >came in the form of long sharp fibers which have a tendency to lodge >in lung tissue. ************** Yes! Robin exactly. The contractive nature of materials subjected to Hydroxy is such that they tend to melt and form smaller harder chrystals. The beading up of asbestos particles makes them become a harmless glass like substance. The sharp fibers are no longer sharp. Love TR Knudtson I suspect that the resulting long term inflammatory >effects would contribute. >I could therefore easily be convinced that the same substance, in the >form of spheroids rather than fibers was perfectly harmless. > >Comments from anyone who actually knows what they are talking about? > >Regards, > >Robin van Spaandonk >-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* >Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on >temperature. >"....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." >PS - no SPAM thanks! >-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 22:04:45 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA24416; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 22:03:06 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 22:03:06 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980220203336.007abcf0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 1998 20:33:36 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19980227125113.006e5038@world.std.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <199802270206.SAA29530@denmark.it.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"GCOXn1.0.Qz5.PSbzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3959 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 12:51 PM 2/27/98 +0000, you wrote: >At 08:12 PM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: >> >>An 8" solar cell produces about 2 amp of current at about 2.6 Volts. Or, >>about 5.2 Watts. If you put it in the sun for an hour, that gives you 5.2 >>watt hours. Now if you look at the sun in a good area for solar, you can >>expect about 10 hours per day peek yield. The rest is inefficiencies >>because of angle of light hitting the cell in the morning and evening and >>the seasonal reductions due to the suns annual shift. So, we get about 52 >>watts form a small cell per day and in 100 days that will be about 5.2 Kilo >>Watt Hours. At my personal billing rate, (Southern California) is about >>10.5 Cents, per kWh. Now, newer cells boast a 15 year life and old cells >>used to last about 10 years, so lets say 12.5 years for the life of a cell >>on average. Over that 12.5 years, a 8" cell would make about 234 kWh. At >>10 cents per kWh, that would equal about $23.50 worth of power, retail. Or >>about, $12.00 actual, power production costs, wholesale. Now that cell >>would cost you near $15.00 to buy. So, yes it is not worth it, because >>even if you factor the energy costs at actual cost of producing the power, >>like the cost of making the electricity,, it would cost you more money to >>buy the cell, than even the wholesale costs of what you could get back out >>in electricity. I might add, that as long as others control the relative >>price of things and products it will always be that way. You actually >>loose about $2.00 on the deal. >> >>What you might like to know however is that That 8" inch solar cell only >>cost about 30 cents to make. So if you look at it that way you get $23.50 >>0f electricity for about 30 cents manufacturing costs. This later extreme, >>of actual manufacturing costs, to retail value of the electricity, it >>really is a good deal. You save $23.20 over the life of the cell. >> >>You will never see this because this would be bad for business, and cost >>jobs, or that is what they tell us. >> >>Thank you for writing me. I am sure Keith likes the break. >> >>I don't mean to be a smarty pants but these are the facts, please keep >>asking questions. >> >>Love >> >>TR Knudtson > > > This model assumes a lifetime of 12.5 years. Many solar cells >have lasted decades. > > Furthermore, for some reason, some of their efficiencies have >increased over time. > > With the correct numbers observed for actual solar cell use, >they have paid for themselves. Why does the above calculation >choose 12.5 years? > > Mitchell Swartz Yes Mitchell, there are cells here in Daget Californis that are about 27 years old at the So Calif Edison plant, and they are still doing well. I was just playing it safe. (Smile) Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 22:15:14 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA21105; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 22:12:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 22:12:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980227131133.006e8a00@world.std.com> X-Sender: mica@world.std.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 13:11:33 +0000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Mitchell Swartz Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980220203336.007abcf0@earthlink.net> References: <3.0.1.32.19980227125113.006e5038@world.std.com> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <199802270206.SAA29530@denmark.it.earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"7NfV7.0.W95.Wbbzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3960 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 08:33 PM 2/20/98 -0800, you wrote: > >> >> This model assumes a lifetime of 12.5 years. Many solar cells >>have lasted decades. >> >> Furthermore, for some reason, some of their efficiencies have >>increased over time. >> >> With the correct numbers observed for actual solar cell use, >>they have paid for themselves. Why does the above calculation >>choose 12.5 years? >> >> Mitchell Swartz > > >Yes Mitchell, there are cells here in Daget Californis that are about 27 >years old at the So Calif Edison plant, and they are still doing well. I >was just playing it safe. (Smile) > Did the efficiency increase for those as well? What fraction were lost at 27 years? How do these real numbers impact on your calculation? Mitchell Swartz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu Feb 26 23:02:08 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA06685; Thu, 26 Feb 1998 22:59:28 -0800 Resent-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 22:59:28 -0800 Message-Id: <199802270659.UAA25421@ranger.t-link.net> From: "Alastair Couper" Organization: Aquarian Electronics To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 20:59:59 +10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: another 2 wire question Reply-to: aquarius@t-link.net Priority: normal Resent-Message-ID: <"wqTDJ3.0.Ne1.EHczq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3961 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Those 2 parallel wires would form a transmission line of characteristic impedance determined by the spacing and diameters. Depending on the wavelength (or frequency) at the end terminals, the impedance seen looking in to the line would be resistive, inductive, or capacitive. So one could use such a means as a resonator in an oscillator circuit, using either the parallel (loop) resonant point or the series (node) resonant point. This is done all the time in microwave circuitry. There would not be anything going on in the acoustic modes, unless you had some major arcing and sparking going on. Alastair Couper aquarius@t-link.net Aquarian Electronics Maui,Hawaii http://www.t-link.net/~aquarius/aquarian.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 00:09:10 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA17247; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 00:04:35 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 00:04:35 -0800 Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 00:04:25 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802270804.AAA12636@italy.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: dave dameron Subject: Re: Hydroxy Resent-Message-ID: <"rv-ZQ1.0.KD4.IEdzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3962 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Todd and all, >>>Now lets look at Hydroxy. >>> >>>You use the sun to through solar voltaic low voltage DC current, to suspend >>>energy directly in the elemental structure of water Hydrogen and Oxygen. >>>Then you use it. What is left over is water and heat. Guess what? You >>>are warm. Nothing from the air, and puts nothing into the air. I kind of >>>like that. >>> >>Are you worried that large scale use of solar cell arrays will cause global >>warming through increased solar radiation absorption? (I'm not sure if I >>believe all the global warming claims I hear.) >>Some people say that it takes more energy to produce solar cells than the >>electrical energy they produce. Is this true? If so, is the energy balance >>about to be switched by newer more efficient or "less energy to produce" >>solar cells? >>-Dave >> >> >>Dear Dave, > >It is good to hear form someone else other than just Keith. I like his >questions, don't get me wrong, but I was beginning to think that we were >the only ones communicating at this site. > >Lets look at the global warming issue. > >The agreed critical issue in the global warming controversy has long been >shown to be the quantity of Carbon-dioxide gas in the atmosphere. Science >does completely agree that this gas acts like a blanket and holds in the >solar heat that impacts the earth. The disagreement is over whether this >is a bad thing or a good thing. > I've read that the vast majority of plants converting carbon dioxide are simple plants in the ocean. Not that land plants aren't important! I have heard that other gasses also act as greenhouse gasses, such as water vapor. There is a good article about this in Bill B.'s science article section. Yes the carbon dioxide has increased, and carbon dioxide is a "greenhouse" gas, but since satellites have been used to measure the earth's temp., the global temperature hasn't increased. So there must be other factors at least as important. The "global warming" people 20 or so years ago were the global cooling (Read ice age) advocates. The incident solar energy about 1Kw/m^2 is mostly visible. Thus absorption is also a major factor, it is the source of the heat. If solar cells were put in a desert, they would greatly decrease the energy reflected. You are probably right if they replaced asphalt. >As far as solar cells absorbing more of the suns heat? No, the heat would >be absorbed anyway, it makes no difference whether it is hitting a solar >collector of the asphalt of a parking lot. ... > >As far as the conventional processing of solar cells, costing more to make >than they produce in their life? Lets look. > >An 8" solar cell produces about 2 amp of current at about 2.6 Volts. Or, >about 5.2 Watts. What kind of solar cell? I thought silicon types produced only about 0.4 volts/ cell. But even with this number, 0.8 watts, one can still use your calculations and see your results. >What you might like to know however is that That 8" inch solar cell only >cost about 30 cents to make. Even if you could buy them for 60 cents/cell, I think they would be all over the place! A while back I looked at used panels 30-50 watts and was told they were removed from PV stations after 5 years or so because of decreased efficiency. Maybe it was something else, like some tax benefit? Even their price was a lot for "off the grid" use. I quess this isn't central to your hydroxyl uses, though. "Nothing from the air..." >Love > >TR Knudtson > -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 01:08:42 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA22848; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 01:04:58 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 01:04:58 -0800 From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 09:04:43 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <34fa7f5e.42478474@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"atvZZ2.0.wa5.v6ezq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3963 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Fri, 20 Feb 1998 20:12:17 -0800, trknute@earthlink.net wrote: [snip] >>Some people say that it takes more energy to produce solar cells than the >>electrical energy they produce. Is this true? If so, is the energy balance >>about to be switched by newer more efficient or "less energy to produce" >>solar cells? >>-Dave [snip] >As far as the conventional processing of solar cells, costing more to make >than they produce in their life? Lets look. [snip] You followed this with a calculation of monetary cost. However I believe the original question asked after *energy* cost. Now unless someone operated at a loss, then obviously, if financial balance is positive, then so is the energy balance (energy only forms part of the overall financial costs). However I thought it might be even more instructive, if you could throw some light on the actual energy balance. A good starting point might be the total electricity consumption of the solar cell factory, compared to the energy the cells produce. (Most of the power will be used in refining the silicon presumably). Such a balance is important to show that solar cells aren't a losing proposition energy wise (finances aside). In short could a solar cell factory operate on the power generated from the cells it makes, and still produce excess cells? Regards, Robin van Spaandonk -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on temperature. "....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." PS - no SPAM thanks! -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 03:46:04 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA24167; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 03:44:26 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 03:44:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <002601bd4375$26db9000$937e02d0@jsburch.CSW> From: "Scott Burch" To: Subject: Re: HV Rectification? Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 05:45:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"IR22G2.0.Vv5.OSgzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3964 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com I am a bit rusty on these subjects, but in labs I had in college we used an lab grade rectifier that converted AC into DC. Then we ran that through a Tesla Coil. The bigger the coil the higher the voltage, but the current of course drops off. A lot of fun to experiment with too. Watch out for arcs and the ozone build up though. You can reach Mega volt levels this way pretty easily. --J.S.Burch -----Original Message----- From: Gary Shannon To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Thursday, February 26, 1998 10:17 PM Subject: Re: HV Rectification? > > >---------- >> From: Wm Perry >> To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >> Subject: HV Rectification? >> Date: Thursday, February 26, 1998 6:09 PM >> >> Hello All, >> I am not an engineer, so therefore do not hold an engineer's knowledge. >> I know it is possible to use a spark gap arrangement to convert High >> Voltage DC Power into HVAC. What I want to know is, how is it possible >> to rectify HV, say 20-30MV, into DC, I thought of trying a rather large >> pin diode type of setup, but not quite sure if it could handle that much >> Voltage. Any technical help would be appreciated. >> >> WILLIAM PERRY >> >I once saw an article in the Amateur Scientist Department of Scientific >American (back in the 60's I think) that used a synchronous motor attached >to a home-made distributor-type gadget. The motor ran at the frequency of >the AC (which was 60 Hz = 60 rev/sec in the example) and switched the >output AC to whichever output terminal matched it's current polarity. I >don't imagine that would work at higher frequencies, but at 60Hz it worked >fine. > >The input AC was wired to two rotors seperate on the motor shaft and each >rotor touched either the positive or negative ouput terminal for 1/2 of >each revolution. > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 08:18:21 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA15102; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 08:15:52 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 08:15:52 -0800 Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 08:15:38 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199802271615.IAA08376@sweden.it.earthlink.net> X-Sender: mrandall@mail.earthlink.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: trknute@earthlink.net From: Michael Randall Subject: Re: Todd Knudtson, of "Brown's" Gas fame... Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Resent-Message-ID: <"7vqCY.0.uh3.tQkzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3965 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Todd, On 2/22/98 I posted the below message to freenrg-l. Did you receive it? Can Hydroxy help in remediation of the nuclear waste disposal problem? If so, can you or anybody do a demonstration for the DOE? Regards, Michael --------------------------------------------------------------- At 05:15 PM 2/21/98 -0800, billb@eskimo.com wrote: >I just talked with Todd Knudtson, trknute@earthlink.net, a long time >in the "Brown's Gas" arena. >>> Hi Todd, Welcome to freenrg-l! There are a handful of researchers on this list that are familiar with this topic. There also have been some interest in the DOE to looking at alternative solutions to the radiation waste disposal problems at nuclear power plants. Hal Fox, the editor of New Energy News, tel: (801)583-6232, mentioned this last month when I talked to him over the telephone. If you can give Hal a call, you might be able to get some interest in developing the Hydroxy gas method of waste disposal. Sincerely, Michael Randall From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 09:24:32 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA25562; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 09:19:10 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 09:19:10 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980221074945.007aeae0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 07:49:45 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <34fa7f5e.42478474@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"a96kT1.0.JF6.CMlzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3966 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:04 AM 2/27/98 GMT, you wrote: >On Fri, 20 Feb 1998 20:12:17 -0800, trknute@earthlink.net wrote: >[snip] >>>Some people say that it takes more energy to produce solar cells than the >>>electrical energy they produce. Is this true? If so, is the energy balance >>>about to be switched by newer more efficient or "less energy to produce" >>>solar cells? >>>-Dave >[snip] >>As far as the conventional processing of solar cells, costing more to make >>than they produce in their life? Lets look. >[snip] >You followed this with a calculation of monetary cost. However I >believe the original question asked after *energy* cost. Now unless >someone operated at a loss, then obviously, if financial balance is >positive, then so is the energy balance (energy only forms part of the >overall financial costs). However I thought it might be even more >instructive, if you could throw some light on the actual energy >balance. A good starting point might be the total electricity >consumption of the solar cell factory, compared to the energy the >cells produce. (Most of the power will be used in refining the silicon >presumably). >Such a balance is important to show that solar cells aren't a losing >proposition energy wise (finances aside). >In short could a solar cell factory operate on the power generated >from the cells it makes, and still produce excess cells? > > >Regards, > >Robin van Spaandonk > > >Snip****** It takes about 500 Watts to make a conventional solar cell using the vacuum process developed in Europe. In India, where the lowest cost of production and some of the highest quality cells are now procused, the figure is about 350 Watts, this includes the vacuum generation also. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 10:13:34 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA15475; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:02:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:02:07 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980228005717.014fef48@world.std.com> X-Sender: mica@world.std.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 00:57:17 +0000 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Mitchell Swartz Subject: Re: Hydroxy Cc: trknute@earthlink.net In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980221074945.007aeae0@earthlink.net> References: <34fa7f5e.42478474@mail.eisa.net.au> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"eOmjX1.0.jn3.T-lzq"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3967 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 09:04 AM 2/27/98 GMT, trknute@earthlink.net wrote: 'It takes about 500 Watts to make a conventional solar cell using the vacuum process developed in Europe. In India, where the lowest cost of production and some of the highest quality cells are now procused, the figure is about 350 Watts, this includes the vacuum generation also.' Where do you come up with these numbers? 12.5 years? Now 500 watts? That is a unit of power. Dont you mean some energy, or cost equivalent? Or do you mean the equipment runs on 500 watts? ????? Mitchell Swartz From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 10:51:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA10598; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:46:37 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:46:37 -0800 Message-ID: <34F70AD0.2869@gorge.net> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 10:49:52 -0800 From: tom@gorge.net (Tom Miller) Reply-To: tom@gorge.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re:Hydroxy References: <199802270615.WAA21613@mx2.eskimo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"hjo4V2.0.Rb2.Bemzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3968 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com TR wrote: (snipped unmercifully) > Now why do we not use this "Oven-less" technology to make Solar > cells? Because I haven't shown anyone how to yet. In fact most people > find it incredulous that I can make water burn let alone making solar cells > with it. This would make the manufacture of Solar cells and energy free > process. You would still have to pay people to make, distribute and sell > these cells though. But the manufacture of solar cells is very easy using > this system, but I do not have the $30 to $40 million that it would take to > perfect and automate such a process. So what I can do is teach others how > who have that kind of money. That is what I do. > I might add, that as long as others control the relative > price of things and products it will always be that way. > > What you might like to know however is that That 8" inch solar cell only > cost about 30 cents to make. > > You will never see this because this would be bad for business, and cost > jobs, or that is what they tell us. Do you mean 30 cents using current technology, or using Hydroxy technology? If current technology, it would mean that there has been collusion between manufacturers of solar cells, to keep prices artificially high. I can see the possibility of such collusion, in that solar cells are the only electronic devices with a vast, built-in market, which have not gone UP in efficiency, and DOWN in price, over the last ten years, or so. If you mean Hydroxy technology, please get a patent, and then PUBLICIZE!! I am convinced that there are large numbers of people who actually care about their environment, (both within and outside of the "environmental movement") who will rise up en mass to DEMAND such technology, and surely, the SUPPLY will follow. But they can only *demand* something that they know about. Spread the word!! Tom Miller From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 11:44:47 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA19198; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 11:34:10 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 11:34:10 -0800 From: Ro Conroy Message-ID: <947b12ce.34f714fa@aol.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 14:33:12 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Hydroxy Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"JpdJB3.0.ph4.nKnzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3969 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-26 14:48:40 EST, TR,you write: << You use the sun to through solar voltaic low voltage DC current, to suspend energy directly in the elemental structure of water Hydrogen and Oxygen. Then you use it. >> Can you give some links to simple plans for converting this hydroxy into usefull energy, such as electricity or conversion to use as cooking gas. Without some kind of conversion system, I see my cooking pans winding up as a lump of molten metal. I would also be interested in plans for a simple safe storage system. I have designed a simple low cost high strength housing system which I plan to heat with an insulated solar gain thermal mass, but I would also like to incorporate a electrical system which makes minimal use of batteries along with somehow using hydrogen as a backup system for high peak usage. If the hydroxy is safe to store, then maybe it can be simply separated into hydrogen & oxygen, with the oxygen being released for human consumption and then the hydrogen simply being burned in the lower percentage oxygenated air. All this separation being done in small quantities just prior to use. If you have any references for the practical use of hydroxy in such or similiar manner, please let me know. Also if you could clarify the production of H versus H2 and how that would be incorporated into any usable system. Bob http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/robert_conroy/24diamet.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 19:39:50 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA30553; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:35:24 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:35:24 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980221094149.007ad730@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:41:49 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <947b12ce.34f714fa@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"aLQBS2.0.JT7.wNuzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3970 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 02:33 PM 2/27/98 EST, you wrote: >In a message dated 98-02-26 14:48:40 EST, TR,you write: > ><< You use the sun to through solar voltaic low voltage DC current, to suspend > energy directly in the elemental structure of water Hydrogen and Oxygen. > Then you use it. >> > >Can you give some links to simple plans for converting this hydroxy into >usefull energy, such as electricity or conversion to use as cooking gas. >Without some kind of conversion system, I see my cooking pans winding up as a >lump of molten metal. I would also be interested in plans for a simple safe >storage system. > I have designed a simple low cost high strength housing system which I >plan to heat with an insulated solar gain thermal mass, but I would also like >to incorporate a electrical system which makes minimal use of batteries along >with somehow using hydrogen as a backup system for high peak usage. If the >hydroxy is safe to store, then maybe it can be simply separated into hydrogen >& oxygen, with the oxygen being released for human consumption and then the >hydrogen simply being burned in the lower percentage oxygenated air. All this >separation being done in small quantities just prior to use. If you have any >references for the practical use of hydroxy in such or similiar manner, please >let me know. Also if you could clarify the production of H versus H2 and how >that would be incorporated into any usable system. >Bob >http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/robert_conroy/24diamet.htm > > Dear Bob and others, Here is mu read on the seperate uses. Hydroxy, VS Hydrogen All of my research in Hydroxy points to is being a point of use industrial processing system. In this description are two primary limitations. 1) There is a rather rapid degradation of some of it's primary effects shortly after production. I.e. implosive effects. Some of the internal electrical suspensions begin to break down changing some primary effects in explosiveness, and some specific heating effects with some materials. 2) Any material that contains both the fuel, Hydrogen and the oxidizer, Oxygen, can be very explosive. In the case of Hydroxy, the detonation rate is about Mach 7.5. This makes Hydroxy the fastest burning gas on earth, and one hell of an explosive when contained. So the safe storage of Hydroxy seems to be the critical issue. A final issue is a social one, are we ready for such a volatile gas to be widely available. To all who read this site, I would like your input on this one. Is man ,or are you personally prepared to have this type of infinitely producible material widely available. I think we should develop it. I have produced an explosive system using this gas that is very stable, produces no poisonous gasses that kill thousands of miners each year, and can produce regulated blasting effects. You can focus the effect for point penetration like in drilling. You can provide a type of effect that shatters, lightly pushes, or heaves with tonnage, unprecedented in other explosive materials. I make a liner shearing effect, that slices through rock like butter, by focusing the high frequency released by this gas. All this destruction can be created for just a few pennies of electricity, and a few cups full of water. Can man be trusted with such a technology? Saving miners lives aside, my hope is that this mining technology would be used in the development and ore processing on the moon or other planets, as this system works very well in a vacuum. Pleas don't hammer on me about the my questioning the social impact of such a technology. Nobel, who invented TNT felt very responsible for the use of his technology in warfare, my concerns are no different. The fact still remains that man often takes things of great power and uses them for evil. It is a responsible researcher that evaluates all sides of their work prior to releasing developments with dangerous side effects. As for the use of this Hydroxy for energy storage, there is no system that can store more potential energy that can be easily converted to electricity in a more confined space than Hydroxy. Energy densities are at a factor of 60 times led acid storage batteries. This accomplished at relatively low pressures. Unlike compressed Hydrogen and Oxygen, that require rather sophisticated production fuel cell technologies, all that is needed in Hydroxy, is for two plate assemblies to be placed in close proximity, and you get a continuous flow of DC current. All of these critical points make me offer that this technology should be used for only the electrical needs of domestic applications, and located outside the home. Or for point of use, production on demand, for specific targeted industrial applications. Now for Conventional Hydrogen; It has none of these limitations. It can be stored at any pressure, even to the point of liquefaction. It never degrades. Is totally inert until in the presence of Oxygen. If released into a confined space it rises and dissipated through the smallest crack, even passing through walls. If a leak happens it is non poisonous unlike Natural Gas, or Propane. Even in rich mixtures, a short distance from a leak, combustion is nearly impossible, even with life flame present. So I vote for Hydroxy for industrial processing applications, and domestic electrical storage, (In a specially designed containment area away from the house). I vote for regular, conventional Hydrogen, (Also produced from electrolyses of water), for Heating, Cooking, and Water heating. Let me hear back. Love TR Knudtson P.S. As far as the infinite explosive effects, I can claim childish ignorance. I was only 16 when I discovered the principles that led to this system. I have spent the last 30 years looking for all the good applications of hydrogen, trying to make up for this Fact. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 19:49:56 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA00124; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:47:57 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 19:47:57 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980221095425.007b48b0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:54:25 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19980228005717.014fef48@world.std.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980221074945.007aeae0@earthlink.net> <34fa7f5e.42478474@mail.eisa.net.au> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"AWbkJ1.0.c1.hZuzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3971 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 12:57 AM 2/28/98 +0000, you wrote: > >At 09:04 AM 2/27/98 GMT, trknute@earthlink.net wrote: > >'It takes about 500 Watts to make a conventional solar cell using the vacuum >process developed in Europe. In India, where the lowest cost of production >and some of the highest quality cells are now procused, the figure is about >350 Watts, this includes the vacuum generation also.' > > Where do you come up with these numbers? 12.5 years? > Now 500 watts? That is a unit of power. Dont you mean some >energy, or cost equivalent? > Or do you mean the equipment runs on 500 watts? ????? Mike, (Smile) You jumped in on the middle of a conversation through a progression of letters. Send me your personal e-mail and I will do my best to bribg you up to speed. Love TR Knudtson > > > Mitchell Swartz > > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri Feb 27 22:48:23 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA29588; Fri, 27 Feb 1998 22:45:38 -0800 Resent-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 1998 22:45:38 -0800 From: HLafonte Message-ID: <88d98817.34f7b262@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 01:44:48 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, KeelyNet-L@lists.kz, newman-l@emachine.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Take me the hell off your list, you jerk! Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part0_888648288_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Resent-Message-ID: <"gg-Pb3.0.0E7.EAxzq"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3972 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_888648288_boundary Content-ID: <0_888648288@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII In a message dated 98-02-25 01:52:37 EST, jdecker@keelynet.com writes: << Hi Butch! I am puzzled. I can't quite figure out what is going on with you. Don't take this wrong, I'm just trying to get a handle of what is driving you. Specifically; 1) Why do you post every little change or modification to your website? 2) Why do you seem so concerned when few if any respond to your posts? You seem to be preoccupied with advertising your name or website on as many lists as you can, yet you have built nothing to prove even your simplest contentions, just drawings of how you envision it COULD be. You also seem to think that the entire world should be absolutely caught up with your posts, and you make even more posts asking who has responded or why no one is responding. It is very odd and I can see no logical reason for it. I intended for the KeelyNet-L list to have the majority of information posted to it to be useful information, offering interesting ideas, URLs or discussions about the basic subjects of free energy, gravity control and electronic health. People can participate or not, it is their choice as I don't expect the world to beat a path to any single post or group of them. Anyway, I just don't understand what is going on with you and you alone of all the 85 subscribers here. I was always puzzled why Bill Beaty did not say something to you about posting your images directly into the freenrg/vortex lists, in fact, that is WHY I don't allow it here. If you have a good idea, you should think it through as fully as possible, then post a link and ask for advice if applicable, rather than posting every little change....most sites I know will have NUMEROUS changes to their site before emailing to any newsgroup or list that changes have been made, not just one or two every few days. Anyway, could you please post something useful that will evoke a discussion or start a thread or at least wait til you've made several changes to your site before posting. The list is not here solely to advertise other sites. In all the posts I've seen from you, it simply has a URL stating something new or different has been added, no discussion, no questions, no new ideas for the list to discuss. Thanks. -- Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" >> Take me the hell off your list then, you jerk! Thanks, Butch LaFonte --part0_888648288_boundary Content-ID: <0_888648288@inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from relay10.mail.aol.com (relay10.mail.aol.com [172.31.109.10]) by air11.mail.aol.com (v39.9) with SMTP; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 01:52:37 1900 Received: from endeavor.flash.net (endeavor.flash.net [209.30.0.40]) by relay10.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id BAA11460 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 01:52:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from flash.net (dasc7-67.flash.net [208.194.209.67]) by endeavor.flash.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA20536 for ; Wed, 25 Feb 1998 00:52:32 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <34F3DA48.362D@keelynet.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 00:46:00 -0800 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win16; I) To: HLafonte@aol.com Subject: Re: New animation of generator by Ed Kauffmann on web References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Hi Butch! I am puzzled. I can't quite figure out what is going on with you. Don't take this wrong, I'm just trying to get a handle of what is driving you. Specifically; 1) Why do you post every little change or modification to your website? 2) Why do you seem so concerned when few if any respond to your posts? You seem to be preoccupied with advertising your name or website on as many lists as you can, yet you have built nothing to prove even your simplest contentions, just drawings of how you envision it COULD be. You also seem to think that the entire world should be absolutely caught up with your posts, and you make even more posts asking who has responded or why no one is responding. It is very odd and I can see no logical reason for it. I intended for the KeelyNet-L list to have the majority of information posted to it to be useful information, offering interesting ideas, URLs or discussions about the basic subjects of free energy, gravity control and electronic health. People can participate or not, it is their choice as I don't expect the world to beat a path to any single post or group of them. Anyway, I just don't understand what is going on with you and you alone of all the 85 subscribers here. I was always puzzled why Bill Beaty did not say something to you about posting your images directly into the freenrg/vortex lists, in fact, that is WHY I don't allow it here. If you have a good idea, you should think it through as fully as possible, then post a link and ask for advice if applicable, rather than posting every little change....most sites I know will have NUMEROUS changes to their site before emailing to any newsgroup or list that changes have been made, not just one or two every few days. Anyway, could you please post something useful that will evoke a discussion or start a thread or at least wait til you've made several changes to your site before posting. The list is not here solely to advertise other sites. In all the posts I've seen from you, it simply has a URL stating something new or different has been added, no discussion, no questions, no new ideas for the list to discuss. Thanks. -- Jerry W. Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 --part0_888648288_boundary-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 08:42:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA20711; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 08:38:15 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 08:38:15 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <34F83DE7.F30AFC75@psu.edu> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 11:40:07 -0500 From: Scott Peterson Reply-To: sdp127@psu.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: freenrg-l archive Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Oli9X1.0.W35.qr3-q"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3973 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Anyone out there in message land maintain, or know of, an accessible archive of freenrg-l? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 14:49:08 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA24985; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 14:43:45 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 14:43:45 -0800 Message-ID: <34F8AEBC.50B8@cmet.net> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:41:32 -0500 From: Felix Meyer Reply-To: ce3cwf@cmet.net Organization: CE3CWF X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-KIT-bw (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy References: <3.0.5.32.19980221074945.007aeae0@earthlink.net> <34fa7f5e.42478474@mail.eisa.net.au> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980221095425.007b48b0@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"0n5rV2.0.E66.WC9-q"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3974 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Hi Todd, with much interest I am following the Hydroxy conversation ! Now I think that Mike was right with his question about the 500 W. What we have to consider is Kw*h (energy) and not Power, which for itself is meaningless. So you probably meant 0.5 Kw*h instead of 500 Watts. Is it right ? Regards Felix Reference: trknute@earthlink.net wrote: > > At 12:57 AM 2/28/98 +0000, you wrote: > > > >At 09:04 AM 2/27/98 GMT, trknute@earthlink.net wrote: > > > >'It takes about 500 Watts to make a conventional solar cell using the vacuum > >process developed in Europe. In India, where the lowest cost of production > >and some of the highest quality cells are now procused, the figure is about > >350 Watts, this includes the vacuum generation also.' > > > > Where do you come up with these numbers? 12.5 years? > > Now 500 watts? That is a unit of power. Dont you mean some > >energy, or cost equivalent? > > Or do you mean the equipment runs on 500 watts? ????? > > Mike, (Smile) You jumped in on the middle of a conversation through a > progression of letters. > > Send me your personal e-mail and I will do my best to bribg you up to speed. > > Love > > TR Knudts From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 16:51:49 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA15884; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 16:45:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 16:45:06 -0800 (PST) From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy Date: Sun, 01 Mar 1998 00:43:25 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <34fcae86.67489047@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <3.0.5.32.19980221074945.007aeae0@earthlink.net> <34fa7f5e.42478474@mail.eisa.net.au> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980221095425.007b48b0@earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980221095425.007b48b0@earthlink.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YqV_q2.0.5u3.G-A-q"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3975 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com On Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:54:25 -0800, trknute@earthlink.net wrote: [snip] >>'It takes about 500 Watts to make a conventional solar cell using the vacuum >>process developed in Europe. In India, where the lowest cost of production >>and some of the highest quality cells are now procused, the figure is about >>350 Watts, this includes the vacuum generation also.' >> >> Where do you come up with these numbers? 12.5 years? >> Now 500 watts? That is a unit of power. Dont you mean some >>energy, or cost equivalent? >> Or do you mean the equipment runs on 500 watts? ????? > >Mike, (Smile) You jumped in on the middle of a conversation through a >progression of letters. [snip] Well I found Mitchell's question spot on, which is why I didn't post a query myself. Now I feel somewhat disappointed by your answer. I was hoping for a proper energy balance between factory and product. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on temperature. "....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." PS - no SPAM thanks! -*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 19:10:46 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA12372; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:05:39 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:05:39 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980228190105.007adb90@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:01:05 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <34fcae86.67489047@mail.eisa.net.au> References: <3.0.5.32.19980221095425.007b48b0@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980221074945.007aeae0@earthlink.net> <34fa7f5e.42478474@mail.eisa.net.au> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980220201217.007abb60@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19980221095425.007b48b0@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"EX2eT2.0.813.02D-q"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3976 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 12:43 AM 3/1/98 GMT, you wrote: >On Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:54:25 -0800, trknute@earthlink.net wrote: >[snip] >>>'It takes about 500 Watts to make a conventional solar cell using the vacuum >>>process developed in Europe. In India, where the lowest cost of production >>>and some of the highest quality cells are now procused, the figure is about >>>350 Watts, this includes the vacuum generation also.' >>> >>> Where do you come up with these numbers? 12.5 years? >>> Now 500 watts? That is a unit of power. Dont you mean some >>>energy, or cost equivalent? >>> Or do you mean the equipment runs on 500 watts? ????? >> >>Mike, (Smile) You jumped in on the middle of a conversation through a >>progression of letters. >[snip] >Well I found Mitchell's question spot on, which is why I didn't post a >query myself. Now I feel somewhat disappointed by your answer. I was >hoping for a proper energy balance between factory and product. > > >Regards, > >Robin van Spaandonk >-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* >Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on >temperature. >"....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." >PS - no SPAM thanks! >-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* > >Snip ********** snip *********** SNIPPPPPPPPPPPP*********** >Robin, Yes, .5 kWh to make a 2.4 Volt, 2.1 Amp unit Cell. ENERGY ONLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Scientific American. Spring 97. The Actual cost was quoted at 30 cents per cell. Many cells are needed to make an array. But lets look only at one unit cell at a time. Now!!!!!! Why does one unit cell cost us so much. Lets look. Manufacturing sales structure on average. These are general terms they go up and down depending on the company. Actual costs of manufacture as reported about $1.25 each unit cell. INCLUDING the .5 kWh. Manufactures, usually seek four to five times actual cost, lets say 4 X A.C. Just a fair guess. MATH $1.25 X 4 = $5.00 Dollars,,,,,, Grenache Mean Time. Now primary vendors, the lead distributor, pays for handling, transportation and warehousing of product and may take on a role in some advertising and wholesaler development. They like about 40 to 60 % on there money or better. Products reps are factored in her also. They like 20% just to rep to wholesalers. We will take 40% as a conservative guess. MATH $5.00 X 40% = $7.00 ,,,,,, after these guys all get there cut. Now Wholesalers, like about 30 to 40% They usually have a store like operation where installers buy the product in bulk. Lets take the low. 30% MATH $7.00 X 30% =$9.10 ,,,,,,, We are not done yet! The installer might mark the product up as much as 100%. Depending on whether you have a Mercedes in the driveway, or a 1978 Buick, Vista Cruser, Station wagon, with primer fenders. Lets say that you own the Buick, and he needs the work to pay off the ex-wives. He also likes you. So he only hits you for 50% on the parts. MATH $9.10 X 50% = $13.65 Your final cost for the product. Direct from the contractor or installer. NOW, if you go into a retail store to buy this item, they always want to double their money so you are looking at a 100% mark up. MATH $9.10 X 2 = $18.20,,,,,,, at your local Radio Shack. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 19:13:07 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA13012; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:08:25 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:08:25 -0800 Message-ID: <34F8CE91.7839@microtec.net> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 21:57:21 -0500 From: patrick tremblay Reply-To: energeon@microtec.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: BUTCH, I WANT TO KNOW EVERYTHING Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"rg7IA3.0.7B3.d4D-q"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3978 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com BUTCH, Please Do Tell Me always when you make changes to your site, whatsoever small change it could be: I am about to build a working PM motor and I owe it all to a simple animated gif file I saw, it gave me the inspiration I needed. So please, Do Email me whenever you make changes to your site and in return, I will refer your site in my what's new page everytime you update yours. Is it a deal ? And that goes DOUBLE for anyone in this list who has a web page and want their updates posted. As a webmaster, I am always looking for something new. sinecerly, patrick tremblay energeon@microtec.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 19:13:19 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA12467; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:06:04 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:06:04 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980228190124.007b3b10@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 19:01:24 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"i8E-c1.0.d23.Q2D-q"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3977 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com >Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 16:45:06 -0800 (PST) >From: rvanspaa@eisa.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) >To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Subject: Re: Hydroxy >Date: Sun, 01 Mar 1998 00:43:25 GMT >Organization: Improving >X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.0/32.390 >Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3975 >X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > >On Sat, 21 Feb 1998 09:54:25 -0800, trknute@earthlink.net wrote: >[snip] >>>'It takes about 500 Watts to make a conventional solar cell using the vacuum >>>process developed in Europe. In India, where the lowest cost of production >>>and some of the highest quality cells are now procused, the figure is about >>>350 Watts, this includes the vacuum generation also.' >>> >>> Where do you come up with these numbers? 12.5 years? >>> Now 500 watts? That is a unit of power. Dont you mean some >>>energy, or cost equivalent? >>> Or do you mean the equipment runs on 500 watts? ????? >> >>Mike, (Smile) You jumped in on the middle of a conversation through a >>progression of letters. >[snip] >Well I found Mitchell's question spot on, which is why I didn't post a >query myself. Now I feel somewhat disappointed by your answer. I was >hoping for a proper energy balance between factory and product. > > >Regards, > >Robin van Spaandonk >-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* >Check out: http://www.eisa.net.au/~rvanspaa for how CF depends on >temperature. >"....,then he should stop, and he will catch up..." >PS - no SPAM thanks! >-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 20:33:14 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA28148; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 20:29:24 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 20:29:24 -0800 From: Ro Conroy Message-ID: <502812cf.34f8e3a9@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 23:27:19 EST To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Hydroxy Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 38 Resent-Message-ID: <"KTC431.0.jt6.ZGE-q"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3979 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com In a message dated 98-02-27 22:38:23 EST, TR, you write: << So I vote for Hydroxy for industrial processing applications, and domestic electrical storage, (In a specially designed containment area away from the house). I vote for regular, conventional Hydrogen, (Also produced from electrolyses of water), for Heating, Cooking, and Water heating. >> Are there any simple plans available giving materials and dimensions for building safe simple "specially designed" containment systems for home use? For the hydroxy system, does the containment system have the two plate assembly within the storage container? Bob From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 22:23:44 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA14160; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 22:21:36 -0800 Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 22:21:36 -0800 From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980228221706.007ae100@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 22:17:06 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydroxy In-Reply-To: <502812cf.34f8e3a9@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"ujAvM2.0.9T3.lvF-q"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3980 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com At 11:27 PM 2/28/98 EST, you wrote: >In a message dated 98-02-27 22:38:23 EST, TR, you write: > ><< So I vote for Hydroxy for industrial processing applications, and domestic > electrical storage, (In a specially designed containment area away from > the house). > I vote for regular, conventional Hydrogen, (Also produced from >electrolyses > of water), for Heating, Cooking, and Water heating. >> > > Are there any simple plans available giving materials and dimensions for >building safe simple "specially designed" containment systems for home use? >For the hydroxy system, does the containment system have the two plate >assembly within the storage container? >Bob > > >Dear Bob, Yes, George Wiseman of Eagle research has produced two books outlining design parameters of a successful cell, "The Series Cell". This simple cell produces many of the effects seen in true Hydroxy. Admittedly, his book is based on coping the BN 200 From Norinco, and referenced drawings included in Yull Brown's Patents, March, 1977. The series cell produces a gas that surpasses the Faraday standard of 931 liters of gas, from 1 liter of water. George has managed to obtain 1.36 X Faraday, or about 1,270 liters from 1 liter of water. True Hydroxy is twice or 2 X Faraday or 1862 to 1 volumes. I have reviewed George's work and am very proud of what he has accomplished. I do not fault him for this work, as he is getting this information out to many, and soon I know that improvements will fallow. Brown on the other hand, has threatened to sue George, if he does not stop with this publication. In the fray, is Dr William Rhodes, patents 1966 and 1967. His "Hydrogen Oxygen Generator" produced the same X2 Faraday Volumes, It is said that this is the source of Browns original work. I can not say for sure if this is true. I did work with Brown in the 80s and on into the early 90s, but he did not mention any inspiration for his work other than the study of Michael Faraday, 1833, who is accredited with the definitive work on the Process of evolving or disassociation of water into it's constituent eliminates, Hydrogen and Oxygen. I began my work in this area of Electro chemistry in 1966, in an effort to produce a hotter burning flame for the smelting and refining of Iron ore to make better and purer steels. I have had many mishaps, so today I work with many who are building these units to offer advice on safety features, design short cuts, and electrical insulation of components. My efforts here are more esoteric. I hope to share more about what I have learned, as to what the gas can do, and what new things this reaction can show us about the interplay between energy and mater. I help many individuals who are getting started with this work and seeking to make differing cells. I have designed and built 210 differing cells. Of those 210, there are about 9 that I am happy with. The most promising is the "Parallel Cell". By the use of an electrical energy shaping, "Control Cell" this system produces the 2X Faraday, or 1862 to 1. Some call this "Hyper Gas", some call it "H2O2", some "200% Gas". I call it by its Chemical Name Hydroxy. More often than not I have worked with the applications rather than building units. I seek to demonstrate the unique characteristics of this gas and how they can change the way we think of industrial heating processes in general. Additionally, I hope to point the way to others to experiment with this gas and duplicate this work. I see this gas as a new tool to comparing materials and their reactions in this new, but little studied heat source. I hold strongly that what can be learned about mater and energy by examining this reaction will open the door to a Vast New Science. I call it the "Feminine" side of fire, the antitheses of expansive, exothermal reactions. In terms of Chemical level reactions there is none that compare with Hydroxy. You Might want to see this for yourself. Go to Alta Vista Search, Enter Hydroxy, you will see 5000 entry's involving the interplay of "The Hydroxy" reaction with the bonding and forming of matter and life itself. Hydroxy reactions and the energy states that are found internal to this reaction are in every type of structure, form mineral to acid, form Protein, to enzymes, from simple molecules to large and complex compounds. This reaction and the understanding of the energies that is harbors are key to all we know as ordered mater. The electrical charges, imparted to matter by this reaction, makes YOU what YOU are. It is how you think and how you digest your food. Even how your food is formed and energized. As a study, this is very new. There are few, who have even seen these reactions first hand, so at this point these are no experts. I will do my best to answer any questions you have on the reaction and how it works, but please lets leave these non productive questionings as to efficiencies out of our effort. Most such considerations are fleeting and based on market issues any way. These systems would be very efficient and cost effective if oil cost $1,000.00 per barrel. I would rather focus on the investigative work that is needed. Love TR Knudtson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Feb 28 22:25:37 1998 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA25344; Sat, 28 Feb 1998 22:23:04 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 22:23:04 -0800 (PST) From: trknute@earthlink.net Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980228221430.007ab6b0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: trknute@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 22:14:30 -0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Answer to Bob Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"-LDCE1.0.rB6.4xF-q"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/3981 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Dear Bob, Yes, George Wiseman of Eagle research has produced two books outlining design parameters of a successful cell, "The Series Cell". This simple cell produces many of the effects seen in true Hydroxy. Admittedly, his book is based on coping the BN 200 From Norinco, and referenced drawings included in Yull Brown's Patents, March, 1977. The series cell produces a gas that surpasses the Faraday standard of 931 liters of gas, from 1 liter of water. George has managed to obtain 1.36 X Faraday, or about 1,270 liters from 1 liter of water. True Hydroxy is twice or 2 X Faraday or 1862 to 1 volumes. I have reviewed George's work and am very proud of what he has accomplished. I do not fault him for this work, as he is getting this information out to many, and soon I know that improvements will fallow. Brown on the other hand, has threatened to sue George, if he does not stop with this publication. In the fray, is Dr William Rhodes, patents 1966 and 1967. His "Hydrogen Oxygen Generator" produced the same X2 Faraday Volumes, It is said that this is the source of Browns original work. I can not say for sure if this is true. I did work with Brown in the 80s and on into the early 90s, but he did not mention any inspiration for his work other than the study of Michael Faraday, 1833, who is accredited with the definitive work on the Process of evolving or disassociation of water into it's constituent eliminates, Hydrogen and Oxygen. I began my work in this area of Electro chemistry in 1966, in an effort to produce a hotter burning flame for the smelting and refining of Iron ore to make better and purer steels. I have had many mishaps, so today I work with many who are building these units to offer advice on safety features, design short cuts, and electrical insulation of components. My efforts here are more esoteric. I hope to share more about what I have learned, as to what the gas can do, and what new things this reaction can show us about the interplay between energy and mater. I help many individuals who are getting started with this work and seeking to make differing cells. I have designed and built 210 differing cells. Of those 210, there are about 9 that I am happy with. The most promising is the "Parallel Cell". By the use of an electrical energy shaping, "Control Cell" this system produces the 2X Faraday, or 1862 to 1. Some call this "Hyper Gas", some call it "H2O2", some "200% Gas". I call it by its Chemical Name Hydroxy. More often than not I have worked with the applications rather than building units. I seek to demonstrate the unique characteristics of this gas and how they can change the way we think of industrial heating processes in general. Additionally, I hope to point the way to others to experiment with this gas and duplicate this work. I see this gas as a new tool to comparing materials and their reactions in this new, but little studied heat source. I hold strongly that what can be learned about mater and energy by examining this reaction will open the door to a Vast New Science. I call it the "Feminine" side of fire, the antitheses of expansive, exothermal reactions. In terms of Chemical level reactions there is none that compare with Hydroxy. You Might want to see this for yourself. Go to Alta Vista Search, Enter Hydroxy, you will see 5000 entry's involving the interplay of "The Hydroxy" reaction with the bonding and forming of matter and life itself. Hydroxy reactions and the energy states that are found internal to this reaction are in every type of structure, form mineral to acid, form Protein, to enzymes, from simple molecules to large and complex compounds. This reaction and the understanding of the energies that is harbors are key to all we know as ordered mater. The electrical charges, imparted to matter by this reaction, makes YOU what YOU are. It is how you think and how you digest your food. Even how your food is formed and energized. As a study, this is very new. There are few, who have even seen these reactions first hand, so at this point these are no experts. I will do my best to answer any questions you have on the reaction and how it works, but please lets leave these non productive questionings as to efficiencies out of our effort. Most such considerations are fleeting and based on market issues any way. These systems would be very efficient and cost effective if oil cost $1,000.00 per barrel. I would rather focus on the investigative work that is needed. Love TR Knudtson