From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 00:00:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA21691; Sat, 1 May 1999 00:00:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 00:00:04 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990501173122.0083edc0@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@main.murray.net.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 17:31:22 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: GEOFF EGEL Subject: Re: Need some info on making a potters kiln In-Reply-To: <199904301233.HAA22179@mw2.texas.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"RYRtm3.0.kI5.pPgAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10142 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 07:30 AM 4/30/99 -0500, you wrote: >Geoff, > I think your best bet is to look for a used kiln. Lot's of people get >into ceramics and then quit. Maybe run an ad, or call a few ceramic shops. >Joe Portman >========= > >---------- >> From: GEOFF EGEL >> To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >> Subject: Need some info on making a potters kiln >> Date: Friday, April 30, 1999 4:51 AM >> >> I need some help in finding detials on how to put together a simple >> potters kiln >Yes I had thought of that and may have to do that but thought also there might be an alternative way Thanks geoff> >> Does someone on this list know where on the net I can get some reliable >> info to make a kiln >> preferable from recyclable materials and at litle cost >> >> Geoff >> >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> --- >> Solaris searching for natures energy sources. >> Our main site http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 >> >> Get the complete enecyclopedia of free energy version 1 from us at no >cost >> at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/freebies.html >> >> last updated November 1998 >> >> my postal address as follows >> Geoff Egel >> 18 Sturt Street >> Loxton 5333 >> South Australia >> Australia >> >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> ------- >> Energy 21 website now resides at >> http://www.FortuneCity.com/greenfield/bp/16/index.html >> >> Bright Sparks website. >> >> http://www2.murray.net.au/users/egel/ >> >> our site search facility is located at. >> >> http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/orgone.htm >> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Solaris searching for natures energy sources. Our main site http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 Get the complete enecyclopedia of free energy version 1 from us at no cost at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/freebies.html last updated November 1998 my postal address as follows Geoff Egel 18 Sturt Street Loxton 5333 South Australia Australia ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- Energy 21 website now resides at http://www.FortuneCity.com/greenfield/bp/16/index.html Bright Sparks website. http://www2.murray.net.au/users/egel/ our site search facility is located at. http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/orgone.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 01:48:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA05723; Sat, 1 May 1999 01:46:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 01:46:13 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 09:46:07 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: ARDA v2.0 - Update In-Reply-To: <2ddaf61d.245b68e0@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"UpXYD3.0.KP1.KzhAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10143 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Jean, About your power loses, an engineer I know who has seen your webpage reckons thant your better of not using 2N3055's but a FET switch. The engineer is Roger Burley. I'll check with him first to see if I can give you his email. Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 01:51:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA06427; Sat, 1 May 1999 01:50:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 01:50:48 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 09:50:44 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: ARDA v2.0 - Update In-Reply-To: <2ddaf61d.245b68e0@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"Vsypd3.0.Ha1.e1iAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10144 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dear All, I was asking about the water molecule which has the same 'v' like shape and is polar. Once you are moving, the body has ke, it doesn't remember how it was set in motion. All I'm saying is that water ought to spontaneously heat up because the motion would get disapated in the lattice, liquid or gas phases. This is very intriguing. Why does it work at the macroscopic level but not at the atomic? Remi. P.S. I need sometime to think on my stuff but I'm having good ideas for circuits that get rid of the complication of all those tuned circuits. I will test subsystems this bank holiday (yipee!) weekend. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 02:06:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA20944; Sat, 1 May 1999 02:05:49 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 02:05:49 -0700 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 05:05:04 EDT Subject: Re: ARDA v2.0 - Update To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com CC: R.O.Cornwall@city.ac.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 144 Resent-Message-ID: <"4hWrC.0.975.iFiAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10145 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On01/05/99 10:52:33, R.O.Cornwall@city.ac.uk wrote : > About your power loses, an engineer I know who has seen your webpage > reckons thant your better of not using 2N3055's but a FET switch. The > engineer is Roger Burley. I'll check with him first to see if I can give > you his email. > Remi. Hi Remi, Thanks for your help, I am already in contact with Roger, and his advices about the HV generator design are very helpful. The best MosFet transistor that I have found is the IRFZ 34 ( VDDs=60V, RDS(on)=0.050ohms, Id=30A ) Best Regards, Jean-Louis Naudin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 03:58:03 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA10598; Sat, 1 May 1999 03:57:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 03:57:26 -0700 Message-ID: <372ADE7E.79978994@harti.com> Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 12:59:10 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, JNaudin509@aol.com Subject: Re: ARDA Flying Wing v2.0, Project now started References: <719172a6.245bf5ef@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"5bK-h1.0.Vb2.MujAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10146 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: JNaudin509@aol.com wrote: > > On 01/05/99 01:30:02, MH2_BRIGGS@ODNVMS.A1.Ohio.Gov wrote : > > > Jean-Louis, > > > > Have you checked that your propulsion field will not interfere with your > > remote > > control receiver that is enclosed by or in proximity to the field. . I have two > problems to solve : > 2) The strong EMI generated by the HV generator due to the switching driver... > > The Second problem is more difficult, I need to check it experimentaly... > With some shielding may be this can be solved... > Hi JL, try to put the whole HV generating circuit INCLUSIVE its battery into a plastic cage and wrap this cage with aluminium foil ! Or if you can find a very lightweight iron metal case, that would be ideal too. Only the 30 KV DC voltage should come out of it ! 2. BTW, what about a magnetic effect like this ? Normally you can find simular effects for magnetic devices, if it works with electrostatics, there must be an equivalent effect in the magnetic energy field ??! And magnetic fields have a higher energy density, so that would probably propell it much stronger... Anybody got a clue ? Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 03:58:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA11281; Sat, 1 May 1999 03:58:37 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 03:58:37 -0700 Message-ID: <372ADEC5.7C7D4020@harti.com> Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 13:00:21 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: ZAEV Update References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"0tNv6.0.Am2.SvjAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10147 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, Dieter Bauer has updated the latest findings about the N. ZAEV Effect at: http://www.overunity.com/zaev Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 04:27:35 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id EAA18207; Sat, 1 May 1999 04:27:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 04:27:14 -0700 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <677cb797.245c3ee6@aol.com> Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 07:26:30 EDT Subject: Re: ARDA Flying Wing v2.0, Project now started To: harti@harti.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 144 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id EAA18184 Resent-Message-ID: <"cHnqU1.0.KS4.HKkAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10148 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dans un courrier daté du 01/05/99 12:57:29é), harti@harti.com a écrit : > 2. BTW, what about a magnetic effect like this ? > Normally you can find simular effects for magnetic devices, if it works > with electrostatics, there must be an equivalent effect in the magnetic > energy field ??! > And magnetic fields have a higher energy density, so that would probably > propell it much stronger... > Anybody got a clue ? Hi Stefan, Yes of course, this is the NEXT STEP of my ARDA Project, in the next phase I shall use Magnetic field, The Lorentz Force will help the medium flow and will increase the differential hydrostatic of the medium (Air or Aether)...This is M-EHD propulsion...a kind of enhanced MHD... Today, my primary objective is to build a successful FLYING wing aircraft (The ARDA v2.0) which uses my enhanced EHD propulsion system. This will proove definitely the concept.... Best Regards, Jean-Louis Naudin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 06:00:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA31149; Sat, 1 May 1999 06:00:10 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 06:00:10 -0700 Message-Id: <199905011300.IAA25137@mw2.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: Need some info on making a potters kiln Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 07:57:28 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"7OQLp.0.cc7.QhlAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10149 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Now that's a good idea.... Joe Portman ========== ---------- > From: Dave Dameron > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Need some info on making a potters kiln > Date: Friday, April 30, 1999 11:08 AM > > At 11:41 AM 4/30/99 -1000, you wrote: > >Geoff - > > > >>I need some help in finding detials on how to put together a simple > >>potters kiln > >>so I can reheat some stainless steel to 1100 degres c for my joe cell > >>experiements. > >> > >> > >>Does someone on this list know where on the net I can get some reliable > >>info to make a kiln > >>preferable from recyclable materials and at litle cost > >> > >>Geoff > > >Even cheaper: find someone who does pottery and pay them a few $ to run up > >your steel in their nice temperature controlled kiln. > > 1100 deg. C is about (Orton) cone 03, if you go this route. > > > >- Rick Monteverde > >Honolulu, HI > > > -Dave > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 1 15:08:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA25822; Sat, 1 May 1999 15:05:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 15:05:52 -0700 Sender: gn@wisemansbrand.com Message-ID: <372B7A24.F88082B0@wisemansbrand.com> Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 00:03:16 +0200 From: "Gé Nefkens" Organization: (inventors site) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: ARDA Flying Wing v2.0, Project now started References: <677cb797.245c3ee6@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"6ke8O2.0.NJ6._gtAt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10150 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Jean Louis Great work ! Since the 10 years I'm on line at several groups with so many claims you are the only with practical results Gerard Nefkens Hyères http://layo.com PS If you need any help whatsoever . . . . > Dans un courrier daté du 01/05/99 12:57:29é), harti@harti.com a écrit : > > > 2. BTW, what about a magnetic effect like this ? > > Normally you can find simular effects for magnetic devices, if it works > > with electrostatics, there must be an equivalent effect in the magnetic > > energy field ??! > > And magnetic fields have a higher energy density, so that would probably > > propell it much stronger... > > Anybody got a clue ? > > Hi Stefan, > > Yes of course, this is the NEXT STEP of my ARDA Project, in the next phase I > shall use Magnetic field, The Lorentz Force will help the medium flow and > will increase the differential hydrostatic of the medium (Air or > Aether)...This is M-EHD propulsion...a kind of enhanced MHD... > > Today, my primary objective is to build a successful FLYING wing aircraft > (The ARDA v2.0) which uses my enhanced EHD propulsion system. This will > proove definitely the concept.... > > Best Regards, > > Jean-Louis Naudin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 2 06:10:22 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA05190; Sun, 2 May 1999 06:09:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 06:09:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 14:09:35 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: Freengr List Subject: Re: Reno AntiGravity Conference June 27-28 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"DhVEq.0._G1.Kw4Bt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10151 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Patrick, Any chance of putting some form of conference proceedings on the web? Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 2 07:00:30 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA10958; Sun, 2 May 1999 06:59:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 06:59:56 -0700 Message-ID: <001301be94a3$e5e19960$fbda82d1@felis> From: "Felis Catus" To: Subject: Re: Need some info on making a potters kiln Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 09:58:45 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"dN79B2.0.3h2.Sf5Bt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10152 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: This publisher will sell you plans to make your own kilm. Long sought for and out of print tech books&manuels-do you know how to sharpen a circular saw?Lindsay has a reprint for you of instructions circulated among nineteenth century logging plants in the woods that rough cut-they did it by hand with a file and you can, too! Internet adrs: http://www.lindsaybks.com/HomePage.html For a welding torch, see George Wiseman's site for 'Browns Gas" generation from water using house 110v wire electricity: http://www.eagle-research.com Email = wiseman@eagle-research.com Adrs: 2 KM Mine Camp Road, POB 130 Galloway,BC V0B 1P0. Brown's gas costs less than one third of conventional equiptment to operate, and Wisemans unit is safe to have at home-on fact there is no fire hazard danger from tanks of oxy and acetylene, Brown's Gas is generated onsite by demand of user. Hope this helps. Felis Catus felis@frontiernet.net -----Original Message----- From: Joe Portman To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Saturday, May 01, 1999 9:01 AM Subject: Re: Need some info on making a potters kiln >Now that's a good idea.... >Joe Portman >========== > >---------- >> From: Dave Dameron >> To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >> Subject: Re: Need some info on making a potters kiln >> Date: Friday, April 30, 1999 11:08 AM >> >> At 11:41 AM 4/30/99 -1000, you wrote: >> >Geoff - >> > >> >>I need some help in finding detials on how to put together a simple >> >>potters kiln >> >>so I can reheat some stainless steel to 1100 degres c for my joe >cell >> >>experiements. >> >> >> >> >> >>Does someone on this list know where on the net I can get some >reliable >> >>info to make a kiln >> >>preferable from recyclable materials and at litle cost >> >> >> >>Geoff >> >> >Even cheaper: find someone who does pottery and pay them a few $ to run >up >> >your steel in their nice temperature controlled kiln. >> >> 1100 deg. C is about (Orton) cone 03, if you go this route. >> > >> >- Rick Monteverde >> >Honolulu, HI >> > >> -Dave >> > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 2 16:49:23 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA04020; Sun, 2 May 1999 16:48:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 16:48:29 -0700 Message-ID: <372CE1DF.886809F1@microtec.net> Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 19:38:39 -0400 From: patrick tremblay X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: 13 ? Ha ! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"dfrAr.0.c-.CHEBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10153 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: You said you counted the spaces in E Pluribus Unum. If you count just the letters you will have 13, but if you count the spaces you will have 15. So this clearly shows that the E Pluribus Unum scam was made by humans that deliberately counted the letters in order to have 13. In that time they did not have computers. If you place the E Pluribus Unum in a word processor, it will tell you that you have 15 caracters. So it just means that the 13 scam is now obsolete. I just hated that it's printed LIBERTY on the quarter dollar coins and that they trap the whole country in a superstitious idiotic scam like this. Clearly America was not founded in a Technological era. But you see, the real reason why you see 13 all over the one dollar bill is simple: It is because America was founded by 13 English colonies. No superstition there. Go back to your history class. You should be ashamed, me a Quebecer not good at history to know that and not you ? You see, before USA because such a formidable country, there were 13 initial english colonies. Doesn't 13 has the right to exist. It's a number like another. We like to take appolo 13 as an example of the danger of that number. But I will say this: Millions and millions of computer in the world handle the 13 and the 666 values all the time and that doesn't make the evil or dangerous. In fact they do it without harm and everything goes well. In the store I work, all the doors are marked with a 6 digit number, they start with 666 then 0 then other numbers. I don't freak out for that. I study in electrical science, very oftenly I get values like 666 Ohms, etc. 666,6 Hertz. I don't freak out for that. All that religious bla bla about the 666 number could have made me go nuts with all the apparitions of that number. Frankly I think it was very clumsy to teach such supersitions. As I grow older and older and as I learn more. My faith in Jesus-Crhist remains, however I realise that all the religious bla bla is sickening. I don't want to live in some sort of fear, bigotry, I want to be in power and have first a scientific method in everything I do and stop imaginating that everything is pure destiny and all that bla bla that alienates what I am. YOU see people, first I had a superstitious method to the earlier post about 13. Then I made some research and relised that there were a scientific reason why there is 13 all over the one dollar bill: the 13 colonis that initiated america. Count the lines on the national flag, the red ones and the white ones, you will have 13. Others at the church say it's because it's satanic, they don't even know the history of america. They are ignorant, they nourrish fears and bitterness. And the number 13 is not even mentioned in the bible by itself and nothing in there says it's a bad and evil dangerous number. Let's get scientific for christ's sake. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 2 17:34:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA18968; Sun, 2 May 1999 17:33:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 17:33:44 -0700 Message-Id: <199905030033.TAA18442@mw2.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: 13 ? Ha ! Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 19:31:12 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"o5jYo2.0.De4.exEBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10154 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have a direct daily personal first hand line to God and so I pay little attention to religious and superstitious prattle. Joe Portman ========= ---------- > From: patrick tremblay > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: 13 ? Ha ! > Date: Sunday, May 02, 1999 6:38 PM > > You said you counted the spaces in E Pluribus Unum. If you count just > the letters you will have 13, but if you count the spaces you will have > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 2 22:52:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA22144; Sun, 2 May 1999 22:51:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 22:51:28 -0700 Message-ID: <372D1CEB.99C5D163@telusplanet.net> Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 22:50:03 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13 ? Ha ! References: <372CE1DF.886809F1@microtec.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"dnMq72.0.vP5.VbJBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10155 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: hi pat, some interesting observations you make, however I'd like to point a few things out to you. In my original posting I DID say that one of the odd things about 13 was the fact that there WAS 13 American colonies, did you miss this? Did you actually read my entire post or just skim it? As for the religious based reaction argument you presented, I'm afraid that is simply your own argument, I didnt imply anything related to Satanism et al, I simply said I found something curious going on with the high amount of seeming cooincidence occuring and I offered no direct opinion either way as to what it meant. Since this is how you've chosen to interpret the meaning I would suggest that your argument, obviously, is within yourself and not I. Cheers! Don patrick tremblay wrote: > > You said you counted the spaces in E Pluribus Unum. If you count just > the letters you will have 13, but if you count the spaces you will have > 15. So this clearly shows that the E Pluribus Unum scam was made by > humans that deliberately counted the letters in order to have 13. In > that time they did not have computers. If you place the E Pluribus Unum > in a word processor, it will tell you that you have 15 caracters. So it > just means that the 13 scam is now obsolete. > > I just hated that it's printed LIBERTY on the quarter dollar coins and > that they trap the whole country in a superstitious idiotic scam like > this. Clearly America was not founded in a Technological era. > > But you see, the real reason why you see 13 all over the one dollar bill > is simple: > > It is because America was founded by 13 English colonies. No > superstition there. Go back to your history class. You should be > ashamed, me a Quebecer not good at history to know that and not you ? > > You see, before USA because such a formidable country, there were 13 > initial english colonies. Doesn't 13 has the right to exist. It's a > number like another. > > We like to take appolo 13 as an example of the danger of that number. > But I will say this: > > Millions and millions of computer in the world handle the 13 and the 666 > values all the time and that doesn't make the evil or dangerous. In fact > they do it without harm and everything goes well. > > In the store I work, all the doors are marked with a 6 digit number, > they start with 666 then 0 then other numbers. > > I don't freak out for that. > > I study in electrical science, very oftenly I get values like 666 Ohms, > etc. 666,6 Hertz. I don't freak out for that. All that religious bla bla > about the 666 number could have made me go nuts with all the apparitions > of that number. Frankly I think it was very clumsy to teach such > supersitions. > > As I grow older and older and as I learn more. My faith in Jesus-Crhist > remains, however I realise that all the religious bla bla is sickening. > > I don't want to live in some sort of fear, bigotry, I want to be in > power and have first a scientific method in everything I do and stop > imaginating that everything is pure destiny and all that bla bla that > alienates what I am. > > YOU see people, first I had a superstitious method to the earlier post > about 13. Then I made some research and relised that there were a > scientific reason why there is 13 all over the one dollar bill: the 13 > colonis that initiated america. > > Count the lines on the national flag, the red ones and the white ones, > you will have 13. > > Others at the church say it's because it's satanic, they don't even know > the history of america. They are ignorant, they nourrish fears and > bitterness. > > And the number 13 is not even mentioned in the bible by itself and > nothing in there says it's a bad and evil dangerous number. Let's get > scientific for christ's sake. -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 2 23:15:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA26465; Sun, 2 May 1999 23:11:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 23:11:46 -0700 From: Grod123456@aol.com Message-ID: <519f080c.245e97fa@aol.com> Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 02:11:06 EDT Subject: Re: 13 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"WpAU13.0.PT6.XuJBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10156 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could come up with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! Rod From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 2 23:17:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA26969; Sun, 2 May 1999 23:12:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 23:12:59 -0700 Message-ID: <372D3E47.263181E8@ghiocel.com> Date: Sun, 02 May 1999 23:12:23 -0700 From: Dan Ghiocel Organization: Scott Electronic Services LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13 ? Ha ! References: <372CE1DF.886809F1@microtec.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"tbIZO.0.Ib6.gvJBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10157 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: If you want to be scientific about the number 13, you probably need to look into some natural cycles. The number 13 presence in the United States symbols does not come from the 13 colonies. It is probable the other way around: the existence of 13 colonies made the fight for independence ripe and successfull. It is going much further back than that. As far as number 13 and U.S.A connection is concerned, it is coming pretty much straight from the bible through the old hebrew tribes traditions, and also through the Christian tradition. Regards, Dan G. patrick tremblay wrote: > > > And the number 13 is not even mentioned in the bible by itself and > nothing in there says it's a bad and evil dangerous number. Let's get > scientific for christ's sake. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 01:31:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA14764; Mon, 3 May 1999 01:30:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 01:30:25 -0700 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 04:29:31 EDT Subject: EHD Project Mirror Site... To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 144 Resent-Message-ID: <"6eADJ1.0.Wc3.XwLBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10158 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: EHD Mirror site... Date : 03/05/99 A : aszames@yahoo.com Dear All, If you have some problems to connect to my Advanced Propulsion dedicated web site, you can also use my miror site at: http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Facility/7014/html/advprop.htm Best Regards, Jean-Louis Naudin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 07:07:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA08460; Mon, 3 May 1999 07:06:20 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 07:06:20 -0700 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on Linux X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <519f080c.245e97fa@aol.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 10:03:24 -0400 (EDT) Organization: Society for Real Time Sender: chuck@cougar.ssi.stratus.com From: Charlie Hodgson To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"bqMKT.0.542.RrQBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10159 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On 03-May-99 Grod123456@aol.com wrote: > The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could come up > with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! > Rod I'd have to agree. I always notice the number 352. It started when I was a teenager - My photography class was in room 352, a pint (?) of Seagram's 7 was $3.52 and it came up a few more times in a single week. I doubt it occurs more frequently than any other 3 digit. Only\ I notice it when it appears..... Charlie From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 11:16:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA22660; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:15:49 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 11:15:49 -0700 Message-Id: <199905031815.UAA18747@poindexter.wirehub.nl> From: "Aris" To: Subject: Re: 13 ? Ha ! Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:49:59 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"abFK32.0.rX5.KVUBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10161 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I study in electrical science, very oftenly I get values like 666 Ohms, > etc. 666,6 Hertz. I don't freak out for that. All that religious bla bla > about the 666 number could have made me go nuts with all the apparitions > of that number. Frankly I think it was very clumsy to teach such > supersitions. I got 888 in my phonenumber, does that make me a Jesus-Christ-Reincarnate!!!!!? :-)) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 11:17:22 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA22491; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:15:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 11:15:14 -0700 From: dtmiller@nevia.net (Dean T. Miller) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Wired article on Free Energy conference Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 18:14:45 GMT Organization: Miller and Associates Reply-To: dtmiller@nevia.net Message-ID: <372fe60a.5501801@mail.nevia.net> References: <3.0.1.32.20000428083506.006976dc@pophost.nor.com.au> In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.20000428083506.006976dc@pophost.nor.com.au> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id LAA22471 Resent-Message-ID: <"vnat4.0.KV5.nUUBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10160 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi All, I just ran across an article in Wired news by Declan Cannon on the conference last week/weekend. Here's part of the article: ************************* BETHESDA, Maryland -- David Wallman deftly slides the dark glass shield into place in front of his carbon-arc machine and tells his audience to step away. "Don't look directly at it from the side," Wallman warns. He flips a switch. The light is blinding. The machine begins to bubble and froth as 40 amps of current leap the gap between two carbon rods and electrify the sugar water that fills the tank. Those very special bubbles -- Wallman calls them carbo-hydrogen gas -- will, he hopes, change the world. When burned, the gas produces much less pollution than gasoline, and it may prove cheaper to manufacture. The former Hewlett-Packard electrical engineer rattles off a laundry list of possible uses by consumers and industry. A clean new fuel for cars. Revolutionary power generation. A supplement to solar panels for remote homesteaders. But the most intriguing result of Wallman's demonstration is that it seems to violate the laws of physics by generating more energy than it consumes. As any college chemistry student knows, that should be impossible. Your car's internal combustion engine wastes about three-quarters of the energy in the fuel it burns when you drive down the road. And it guzzles even more when you step on the gas. It never, ever creates more energy. If Wallman's calculations are correct, the only explanation is that some form of a small-scale nuclear reaction is taking place inside that bubbling tank. ************************* The article goes on to talk about Pantone's (GEET) new free energy device and other, more questionable (IMO), stuff. -- Dean -- from (almost) Duh Moines (CDP, KB0ZDF) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 11:18:58 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA24418; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:18:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 11:18:30 -0700 Message-ID: <372DCBFE.B82150C@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 11:17:02 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ZZflH.0.Nz5.rXUBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10162 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I find it interesting that Peter Plichta, one of the most astounding chemists / mathematicians of our time, is convinced that you CAN'T find '> > with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !!' but that certain numbers, especially Primes, have very odd properties Charlie Hodgson wrote: > > On 03-May-99 Grod123456@aol.com wrote: > > The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could come up > > with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! > > Rod > > I'd have to agree. I always notice the number 352. It started when I > was a teenager - My photography class was in room 352, a pint (?) of > Seagram's 7 was $3.52 and it came up a few more times in a single > week. > > I doubt it occurs more frequently than any other 3 digit. Only\ > I notice it when it appears..... > > Charlie -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 11:19:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA25017; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:19:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 11:19:05 -0700 Message-ID: <372DCC1A.D2D1EE1F@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 11:17:30 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha ! References: <372CE1DF.886809F1@microtec.net> <372D3E47.263181E8@ghiocel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"UdcXB.0.P66.MYUBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10163 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dan, Can you elaborate? Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly altho I'm a bit of a Sitchin skeptic myself.. Dan Ghiocel wrote: > > If you want to be scientific about the number 13, > you probably need to look into some natural cycles. > The number 13 presence in the United States symbols > does not come from the 13 colonies. > It is probable the other way around: the existence of > 13 colonies made the fight for independence ripe and successfull. > It is going much further back than that. > As far as number 13 and U.S.A connection is concerned, > it is coming pretty much straight from the bible through > the old hebrew tribes traditions, and also through the > Christian tradition. > > Regards, > Dan G. > > patrick tremblay wrote: > > > > > > > And the number 13 is not even mentioned in the bible by itself and > > nothing in there says it's a bad and evil dangerous number. Let's get > > scientific for christ's sake. -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 11:23:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA28889; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:22:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 11:22:52 -0700 Message-ID: <372DCD04.6051E5A3@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 11:21:24 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13 ? Ha ! References: <199905031815.UAA18747@poindexter.wirehub.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ydBBw1.0.837.xbUBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10164 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: it seems that a herd votes majority on this one, ok thats cool...but I still find it odd regardless of what a pack of the moment says Aris wrote: > > I study in electrical science, very oftenly I get values like 666 Ohms, > > etc. 666,6 Hertz. I don't freak out for that. All that religious bla bla > > about the 666 number could have made me go nuts with all the apparitions > > of that number. Frankly I think it was very clumsy to teach such > > supersitions. > > I got 888 in my phonenumber, does that make me a Jesus-Christ-Reincarnate!!!!!? > > :-)) -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 11:42:17 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA04322; Mon, 3 May 1999 11:41:51 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 11:41:51 -0700 From: mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl Message-Id: <372DEC84.3447BF58@elektro.fontys.nl> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 20:35:49 +0200 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [nl]C-QXW07103 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl, de, en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Negre air-motor Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"dElU_.0.R31.ltUBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10165 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi everybody, I don't know of this is a topic for this list but I have a question about it. Does somebody know something (URL?) about an air-motor invented by a Frenchman, called Guy Negre? I have seen his motor 2 times on a Dutch and German TV channel a few months ago. In the past Guy Negre has designed Renault (?) and fomula 1 engines. The motor is build in a small car, designed by his son. There are plans to use this car as a taxi in Mexico-city. Sincerely, WJ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 12:03:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA11079; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:00:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:00:48 -0700 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on Linux X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <372DCC1A.D2D1EE1F@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 14:57:44 -0400 (EDT) Organization: Society for Real Time Sender: chuck@cougar.ssi.stratus.com From: Charlie Hodgson To: "Don J. S. Adams" Subject: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Resent-Message-ID: <"_ME_N2.0._i2.V9VBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10166 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: > Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid > belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly 11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 12:08:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA14052; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:06:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:06:56 -0700 Message-Id: <199905031906.VAA25171@poindexter.wirehub.nl> From: "Aris" To: Subject: Re: Negre air-motor Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 21:08:17 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"29ruy1.0.SR3.FFVBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10167 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi WJ, I saw the program to on Dutch televison (RVU) and did some investigations... I missed a part of the program and RVU send me some written information and I found the engine-specifications not comparable to standard car engines... Max speed app 70 miles an hour and only about 200 miles driving possible with one tank of air... I believe this engine use aire pressure to drive, but I am not sure, perhaps you can tell us more... I do know there is a lab (or something) in hyeres (French) and Guy is looking for business associates in other countries... (might be interesting...:-) Regards, Aris... > Hi everybody, > > I don't know of this is a topic for this list but I have a question > about it. > Does somebody know something (URL?) about an air-motor invented by a > Frenchman, called Guy Negre? I have seen his motor 2 times on a Dutch > and German TV channel a few months ago. > In the past Guy Negre has designed Renault (?) and fomula 1 engines. The > motor is build in a small car, designed by his son. There are plans to > use this car as a taxi in Mexico-city. > > Sincerely, > WJ > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 12:18:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA17902; Mon, 3 May 1999 12:18:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:18:14 -0700 Message-Id: <199905031918.VAA26898@poindexter.wirehub.nl> From: "Aris" To: Subject: Re: Negre air-motor Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 21:18:58 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"7q8h82.0.XN4.rPVBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10168 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Some links http://www.calstart.org/resources/forum/messages/messages/508.html http://nscp.snap.com/search/directory/results/1,61,nscp-0,00.html?keyword=guy+negre&tag= tt.ns.sb1 Regards, Aris From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 13:24:55 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA05616; Mon, 3 May 1999 13:23:00 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 13:23:00 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <6d67d44d.245f5f2e@aol.com> Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 16:21:02 EDT Subject: Re: 13 (or 7?) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"hu6Pq2.0.fN1.aMWBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10169 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/2/99 11:15:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Grod123456@aol.com writes: << The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could come up with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! Rod >> True -- However a few years ago I ran across an interesting calculation involving the earth, moon and energy/momentum which one could use to assert that the number 7 is unique. Details are at http://members.aol.com/keasy/seven.html for anyone interested. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 13:43:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA12917; Mon, 3 May 1999 13:42:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 13:42:01 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19990503163937.00c4aee4@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: aces79@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 16:39:37 -0400 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Zac Miller Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) In-Reply-To: References: <372DCC1A.D2D1EE1F@telusplanet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Ux8pW3.0.k93.NeWBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10170 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: How'd we get 12?? I thought it was: Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, (asteroids), Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto...and Pluto's not even really a true planet.... >On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: >> Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid >> belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly > >11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. > > Zac Miller - Artemis Society International http://www.asi.org From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 13:48:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA16054; Mon, 3 May 1999 13:48:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 13:48:21 -0700 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on Linux X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19990503163937.00c4aee4@pop.mindspring.com> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 16:45:23 -0400 (EDT) Organization: Society for Real Time Sender: chuck@cougar.ssi.stratus.com From: Charlie Hodgson To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) Resent-Message-ID: <"uzPIa3.0.lw3.KkWBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10171 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On 03-May-99 Zac Miller wrote: > ...and Pluto's not even really a true planet.... Pluto is most definately a planet. It's debatable if at's a major or minor planet. The current feeling at the IAU is that it should retain planethood. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 17:34:30 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA05069; Mon, 3 May 1999 17:33:16 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:33:16 -0700 Message-Id: <199905040033.UAA28904@mail.enter.net> From: "David Rosignoli" Organization: Enter.Net To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:35:39 4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: EHD Project Mirror Site... X-Confirm-Reading-To: "David Rosignoli" Priority: normal In-reply-to: Resent-Message-ID: <"SYs3s1.0.2F1.C1aBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10172 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Nice research. Are you planning on attending the Antigravity Conference being held in Reno, Nevada on June 27-28, 1999. A live demonstration would really be a good indication of the current state of research, and whole lot of fun to look at. > From: JNaudin509@aol.com > Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 04:29:31 EDT > Subject: EHD Project Mirror Site... > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Reply-to: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > EHD Mirror site... > Date : 03/05/99 > A : aszames@yahoo.com > > Dear All, > > If you have some problems to connect to my Advanced Propulsion dedicated web > site, you can also use my miror site at: > > http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Facility/7014/html/advprop.htm > > Best Regards, > > Jean-Louis Naudin > > > > ------------------- David Rosignoli drdaveor@enter.net "Nothing shocks me. I'm a scientist." - Harrison Ford as Indiana Jones From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 18:03:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA14702; Mon, 3 May 1999 18:03:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 18:03:02 -0700 Message-Id: <199905040103.UAA28655@mw3.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: 13 Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:00:30 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BohDt2.0.db3.6TaBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10173 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I hate digital clocks......besides the time, they are always reminding me of my exwives birthdays, April 15, etc. Gimme a break. Joe Portman =========== ---------- > From: Charlie Hodgson > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: 13 > Date: Monday, May 03, 1999 9:03 AM > > > On 03-May-99 Grod123456@aol.com wrote: > > The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could come up > > with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! > > Rod > > I'd have to agree. I always notice the number 352. It started when I > was a teenager - My photography class was in room 352, a pint (?) of > Seagram's 7 was $3.52 and it came up a few more times in a single > week. > > I doubt it occurs more frequently than any other 3 digit. Only\ > I notice it when it appears..... > > Charlie > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 19:13:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA03329; Mon, 3 May 1999 19:12:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 19:12:23 -0700 Message-ID: <372E56EE.8079939D@ihug.co.nz> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 14:09:50 +1200 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Teiit1.0.rp.7UbBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10174 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Well that figure is counting the sun and moon as planets, so 9 (planets) + 2 (sun and moon) + 1 (asteroid belt) = 12 Charlie Hodgson wrote: > On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid > > belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly > > 11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 19:22:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA07130; Mon, 3 May 1999 19:21:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 19:21:48 -0700 Message-ID: <372E586D.B20D2F2E@microtec.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 22:16:19 -0400 From: patrick tremblay X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: doomsday, 20 years Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ogKLk.0.Jl1.ycbBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10175 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: People, I made a dream. In my dream, I saw a number. That number was 137. A big glass like spaceship flew above my city in Laval-Ouest. On the ship was marked 137. That is supposed to be the remaining years before the end of the world. There were other things marked but it was written in a language I can't read. Then, remembering that those kinds of vision are never that simple, I made calculations. If you add the 13 + the 7 in 137, you get 20. Then remembering that 7 is the supposed perfect number, I divided 137 by 7 and got 19.57 So my guess is that somewhere in 2020 or 2019 will be the end of the world. Frightening isn't it ? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 20:23:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA27675; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:22:34 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:22:34 -0700 Message-ID: <372E4B7A.7FE590DD@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 20:20:58 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13 References: <199905040103.UAA28655@mw3.texas.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uoAnF1.0.Cm6.uVcBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10177 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: grin Joe Portman wrote: > > I hate digital clocks......besides the time, they are always reminding me > of my exwives birthdays, April 15, etc. Gimme a break. > Joe Portman > =========== > > ---------- > > From: Charlie Hodgson > > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > > Subject: Re: 13 > > Date: Monday, May 03, 1999 9:03 AM > > > > > > On 03-May-99 Grod123456@aol.com wrote: > > > The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could > come up > > > with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! > > > Rod > > > > I'd have to agree. I always notice the number 352. It started when I > > was a teenager - My photography class was in room 352, a pint (?) of > > Seagram's 7 was $3.52 and it came up a few more times in a single > > week. > > > > I doubt it occurs more frequently than any other 3 digit. Only\ > > I notice it when it appears..... > > > > Charlie > > -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 20:23:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA27753; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:22:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:22:40 -0700 Message-ID: <372E4B8A.9A9A8689@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 20:21:14 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13 (or 7?) References: <6d67d44d.245f5f2e@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"UVVJS1.0.On6._VcBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10178 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Intersting!!! I'll check it out! another curious prime number! thanks for sharing!! Keasy@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 5/2/99 11:15:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > Grod123456@aol.com writes: > > << The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could come > up > with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! > Rod >> > > True -- However a few years ago I ran across an interesting calculation > involving the earth, moon and energy/momentum which one could use to assert > that the number 7 is unique. > Details are at http://members.aol.com/keasy/seven.html for anyone interested. > > Ken Keasy@aol.com -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 20:23:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA27653; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:22:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:22:32 -0700 Message-ID: <372E4B86.4313DFB3@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 20:21:10 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) References: <372DCC1A.D2D1EE1F@telusplanet.net> <3.0.1.32.19990503163937.00c4aee4@pop.mindspring.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"CP_J53.0.wl6.tVcBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10176 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: well the planets angle is a stretch I admit...and it means counting some bodies as planets that really don't qualify as such according to contemporary definitions.... I should have said celestial bodies of significance in the solar system 1 Mercury 2 Venus 3 Earth 4 Mars 5 Jupiter 6 Saturn 7 Uranus 8 Neptune 9 Pluto 10 Asteroid Belt (remains of a former planet?) 11 the moon? I know, I know, not considered a planet but Plichta has an interesting idea of the earth mmon being what is called a binary planet..... 12 the claimed far ranging (non Sitchin) Planet 'X' reported in the media AND........ drum roll please... the SUN!!! so again.... 13 and like many of the other significant 13s it has what appears to be a 'solar' center or primary focus, ie Christ, Arthur, etc.... Zac Miller wrote: > > How'd we get 12?? I thought it was: Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, > (asteroids), Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto...and Pluto's not > even really a true planet.... > > >On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: > >> Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid > >> belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly > > > >11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. > > > > > Zac Miller - Artemis Society International http://www.asi.org -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 20:23:13 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA27941; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:22:49 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:22:49 -0700 Message-ID: <372E4B8F.67B3DBD9@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 20:21:19 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BnOVE3.0.Uq6.8WcBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10179 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: exactly! ;> Charlie Hodgson wrote: > > On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid > > belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly > > 11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 20:27:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA00667; Mon, 3 May 1999 20:27:27 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:27:27 -0700 Message-ID: <372DC27E.95486017@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 08:36:31 -0700 From: Cheryl X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg Subject: Re: 13? Ha! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mq0ly1.0.KA.VacBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10180 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: First post -please don't hurt me too bad. A few years ago the number 444 kept showing up so much in seemingly significant ways that even my practical mind began to wonder if there was something I was supposed to know. I spent many a spare moment looking at everything from Atlases to Zodiacs, whimsically anticipating that "A-ha!" experience. No luck, it doesn't seem to mean anything. Discovering that the chinese word for "four" sounds very much like the word for death had me worried for a while, but its been many years now and no bad, so that has subsided. I've pretty much chalked it up to selective perception. However... While examining the periodic table I did notice that carbon (the element that all? organic life is based on) has 6 electrons, 6 protons and 6 neutrons. Hmmmm..... But thats an old story... From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 21:00:30 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA09717; Mon, 3 May 1999 21:00:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 21:00:05 -0700 Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 22:59:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <372E4B8F.67B3DBD9@telusplanet.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"-rxqa.0.kN2.43dBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10181 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 3 May 1999, Don J. S. Adams wrote: > exactly! ;> > > Charlie Hodgson wrote: > > > > On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid > > > belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly > > > > 11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. > Back in the 19th Century a planet was observed with an orbit closer to the sun than Mercury. It was named "Vulcan". It had an extremely erratic orbit, unpredictale by Kepler's equations. It finally disappeared, leaving some to believe it either fell into the sun or was not in fact just a piece of rock. I have not heard of Charon before. Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 22:17:34 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA24168; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:16:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 22:16:57 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.32.19990503012723.00aa0810@cnct.com> X-Sender: knagel@cnct.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 01:27:25 -0400 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Keith Nagel Subject: Re: 13? Ha! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"0i7TE1.0.Tv5.9BeBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10182 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Well, so much seems to be posted on this, why not??? A while back, a book existed called the principia discordia. It was a religion based on the worship of the greek goddess Eris, goddess of discord and chaos. Anyway, in it was a page on the law of fives. Basically, the idea was that everything and anything was in some manner related to the number 5. Of course, many examples were given. When you got to the bottem of the page, a small postscript was hand written in by the author. He writes, "the strange thing is, the harder I look for it, the more apparent it becomes" This then is the law of fives. If you think it's trivial, reread and think again. By the way, I like the carbon/number of beast relation. That's fun. K. At 08:36 AM 5/3/99 -0700, you wrote: >First post -please don't hurt me too bad. > >A few years ago the number 444 kept showing up so much in >seemingly significant ways that even my practical mind >began to wonder if there was something I was supposed to >know. >I spent many a spare moment looking at everything from >Atlases to Zodiacs, whimsically anticipating that "A-ha!" >experience. No luck, it doesn't seem to mean anything. >Discovering that the chinese word for "four" sounds very >much like the word for death had me worried for a while, >but its been many years now and no bad, so that has >subsided. >I've pretty much chalked it up to selective perception. > >However... > >While examining the periodic table I did notice that >carbon (the element that all? organic life is based on) >has 6 electrons, 6 protons and 6 neutrons. > >Hmmmm..... > >But thats an old story... > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 22:28:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA27180; Mon, 3 May 1999 22:27:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 22:27:04 -0700 From: Grod123456@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 01:26:28 EDT Subject: Re: doomsday, 20 years To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"Q3MfO1.0.be6.dKeBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10183 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Am I in the wrong group here???? I didn't know we were suppose to exchange our gloom and doom stories??? Frightful Rod From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 3 23:16:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA02954; Mon, 3 May 1999 23:14:47 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 23:14:47 -0700 Message-ID: <19990504061415.83957.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.160] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: my 2$ on 13 :)~ Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 23:14:13 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"WSeuF3.0._j.N1fBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10184 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: A few thousand years ago before we had the calendar we have now there was a calendar based on the moon...... The religious of the day held 13 as the holiest of the holy numbers.... To help kill their religious beliefs of the Gnostic it was claimed that 13 was an unlucky number.... thus helping give rise (manufacture) too christianity.... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 01:37:02 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA19107; Tue, 4 May 1999 01:36:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 01:36:39 -0700 Message-ID: <372F13E6.884684C0@datacomm.ch> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 10:36:06 -0500 From: Felix Meyer Reply-To: hb9abx@datacomm.ch Organization: hb9abx X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [de] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8ZppA1.0.Sg4.N6hBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10185 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: SUFFICIENT : I THINK WE SHOULD REMAIN ON OUR THEME : FREE ENERGY WE HAVE READ NOW ENOUGH ABOUT THIS SILLY NUMBER GAME AND SHOULD KEEP ON ON SUBJECT OF THIS LIST THANKS TO ALL OF YOU FELIX Zack Widup schrieb: > > On Mon, 3 May 1999, Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > exactly! ;> > > > > Charlie Hodgson wrote: > > > > > > On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > > Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid > > > > belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly > > > > > > 11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. ... SNIP ... From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 04:38:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id EAA21915; Tue, 4 May 1999 04:36:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 04:36:24 -0700 Message-Id: <199905041136.VAA26204@lebunka.ion.com.au> From: "Pop" To: patrick tremblay , freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:53:07 Subject: Re: 13 ? Ha ! Reply-to: pop79@altavista.net Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.40 Resent-Message-ID: <"TcYmk3.0.KM5.ukjBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10187 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On 2 May 99 at 19:38, freenrg-l@eskimo.com wrote: > You see, before USA because such a formidable country, there were 13 > initial english colonies. Doesn't 13 has the right to exist. It's a > number like another. Yeah. Just like pink has it's rights. :) _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Pop, in an uncontrolled environment Email: pop@ion.com.au (ISP) pop79@altavista.net (forwarded, prefered) pop79@mailexcite.com (backup) WWW: http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/nova/229/index.htm _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 04:38:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id EAA21881; Tue, 4 May 1999 04:36:19 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 04:36:19 -0700 Message-Id: <199905041136.VAA26227@lebunka.ion.com.au> From: "Pop" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:54:16 Subject: Re: 13 [OT] Reply-to: pop79@altavista.net Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.40 Resent-Message-ID: <"t9HQo.0.oL5.okjBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10186 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On 3 May 99 at 2:11, freenrg-l@eskimo.com wrote: > The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could come up > with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! You'd be amazed at how many times you see the number 32 ;) ;) ;) _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Pop, in an uncontrolled environment Email: pop@ion.com.au (ISP) pop79@altavista.net (forwarded, prefered) pop79@mailexcite.com (backup) WWW: http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/nova/229/index.htm _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 06:07:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA04853; Tue, 4 May 1999 06:05:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 06:05:17 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Scalar Wave Speculation Message-Id: <925823085.26168.908@excite.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 06:04:45 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.168 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"_eW1Q3.0.gB1.D2lBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10188 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I posted the following on Keelynet concerning additional consideration of 180 input phasing on production of scalar waves, but since the 13 subject is here I wanted to mention it is my very lucky no. Harvey D Norris = 13 letters 270-50-3302 = I laugh when they say not to give the SS away= 9+5+8=13 My brother Michael was born on friday the 13th All my addresses and phone nos contained 13's Live on 1396 Russell in town at exit 13 on Ohio Turnpike. Also 9 and 7 very good numerology 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F G H I J K L M N O P Q R S T U V W X Y Z H A R V E Y D N O R R I S 8 1 9 4 5 7 4 5 6 9 9 9 1 ! ! ! ! ! ! ! 9 9 9 9 9 9 9 = 7 9's Teslas birthday; 7-9-1856 HDN birthday 99 yrs later 9-7-1955 so I guess its easy to get carried away with numbers! now for the rest of the story... On Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:29:15 -0400, Steve wrote: > from: http://www.keelynet.com/energy/dimshift.htm > > It is also worthy of note that many of the reports of free energy > devices, when in operation and drawing 'negative energy' also > produce phenomena relating to weight loss and temporal alterations. > > Years ago, Tom Bearden told me of an experiment he and an unnamed > researcher had carried out using a scalar generated from > interferometry. Two projectors were aimed to coincide at a fixed > point in space. When power was applied and the frequency/phase was > adjusted, there was no apparent change in the target area. . could anyone explain what exactly this means: > "a scalar generated from interferometry." I've been studying > caduceus coils for a couple years now, but haven't done any > serious research on them yet. Can anyone offer any insight into > cad coils vs. an interferometer for creating "scalars"? > > thanks! > -Steve I would suspect a scalar interferometry refers to establishing two scalar stations or emanators. I did experiments with these on a primitive stage. Nothing seems to be clear in Beardons work but at that time I assumed that scalar waves could be established by simply taking two coils and oscillating them with ac so that the magnetic fields from both would be acting in mutual opposition from the placement of the coils face to face at their poles. In that kind of interaction the plane that exists in the creation of vector magnetic cancellation should logically contain this locked up energy. In my interpretation we should have gone from emitting an EM wave radially outwards in 3 dimensions to enclosing itself to a 2 dimensional scalar planar propagation. In this kind of model only a small portion of scalar conversion would take place, because what is found is that the flux density of the magnetic fields on the end poles increases concurrent to this magnetic compression of the interior poles taking place. Now when one station is creating a N pole compression, at the same time another station could be making a S pole compression. Those two stations themselves in turn could have the planes of magnetic cancellation themselves intersect at right angles. At this intersection point a line exists and that point on the line closest to both stations could represent an area where the phase locked scalar em unlocks and will emit an induction signal on a coil in this test area. In order for this experiment to be realistic the test coil must be well outside the magnetic fields from the stations. In my experiments I inconclusively noted a weak effect. Most remarkble however was that the oscilloscope could show a standing wave induced signal, or two waves 180 out of phase from this target area. This only occured on some of the sweep settings. I think that J Naudin has some info on cad coil scalar effects in which this propagates as a beam,and he warns to take caution. Some of the more recent commentaries on Rick Andersons excellent scalar EM site indicates that you dont necessarily have to have magnetic cancellation to produce a scalar effect and in actuality the cancellation may be superfluous. I think perhaps the hint is made that the cancellation can be internally generated. I might be able to throw some light on this horribly obscurred subject. When a N magnetic pole is made on an air core coil it can be made TWO different ways. It can be made with a clockwise wound coil or a counterclockwise. In each case the current goes in opposite directions to achieve the same effect, or so we suppose. It would seem this distinction might be overlooked when putting two coils together in magnetic compression because it is assumed it makes no difference. I can show that there is a difference. But in order to explain this difference I might have to use the reference point of unobvious potential. First take the case of two identically wound coils. ( I am referring to air core coils of thousands of winds) Assuming these coils are safe to input the 120 v 60 hz wall current it is found that to secure the maximum magnetic field from the coils they must be put in series resonance. This simply involves putting an identical capacitive reactance in series with this inductive reactance. When this is done an unobvious potential expressed as a voltage rise occurs across each of these elements, in opposite directions similar to two forces against each other. Now if two coils can be resonated like this and placed with the poles in opposition it will appear as a clockwise next to a counterclockwise in space. This occurs on these identically wound coils because one of the coils had to be turned around 180 in space to secure the condition of being in magnetic opposition with the other coil. Now it is of course also evident that instead of turning the coil 180 in space the input electrical connections to one of the resonating coils could be reversed to give the same effect, or so we presume... In this 2nd condition the two coils would have the same windings when viewed lengthwise even though repulsive fields were being produced in between. It is worth noting that magnetic fields from air coils might have an inbedded or intrinsic spin that is not contained in the conventional ferromagnetic. The reaction of this spin factor to create magnetically cancelled vectors could have everything to do with whether a scalar wave is created. This may not have been noted in the past. So we have two possibilties; creating a 180 condition by moving a coil in space, or creating the condition by creating a 180 phasing in input. To show that these two conditions are indeed different all that is needed is a volt meter. The resonant rise of voltage is shown by connecting the voltmeter across each element. In the first case both readings on both sides will be identical, but in the second case the identical voltage readings will be opposite polarity. What does this mean? It means that in the first case identical unobvious voltages are created at the midpoints, but in the second case they are opposite. When a voltage measurement is taken BETWEEN the midpoints on both cases the first shows zero but the second shows a voltage between them twice that due to its own rise on each side. This shows that even though the magnetic field action from these factors was thought to be identical, the causitive factors contain important differences. In the second case while one unobvious potential grows negative, its counterpart grows positive. Thus the coils could also be put in magnetic unison with no magnetic cancellation and still produce a scalar effect by virtue of its 180 phasing input function. This is noted by allowing the circuit to become a high frequency oscillation by introducing a break in the series circuit so that an arc gap forms. In the first case a massive EM signature is seen, in the second modification I have named as a binary resonant arc gap (BRAG) the process produces virtually no EM. If this represents a phased locked EM method that is wonderful. But the problem then becomes how to unlock it? It may be better to use cancelled magnetic fields since a concievable method of unlocking it has been concieved already. I would conjecture that both conditions may be necessary to produce the illusive critter known as a scalar wave. HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 06:23:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA09828; Tue, 4 May 1999 06:20:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 06:20:29 -0700 From: Bmd2323@aol.com Message-ID: <468fe7c7.24604dce@aol.com> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:19:10 EDT Subject: Doomsday 20 years To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"wkqs33.0.TP2.SGlBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10189 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I'll tell you what's frightening, what's frightening is that this mailing list, which is supposed to be about free energy has turned into a mass of superstition and speculation about things which have no place being discussed on this list. I had a dream once that I slept with a Playboy Bunny. Does that mean that someday I'm going to sleep with a Playboy Bunny? No! That means I'm a normal male with a healthy libido! If every dream that every person who ever lived came true, this world would be a nightmare. 20 years to live! Ha! Several well known psychotics, err, I mean psychics, claimed that we all were going to die last year! Unless I slept through it, and this is one screwed up afterlife, we didn't die. If I want weird numerology theories, I'll real Robert Anton Wilson! At least his stuff is tempered with an understanding that it all might just be a side effect of the acid. Let's cut the crap, guys, and get back to what this list is supposed to be about. I don't care if aliens landed in your back yard and told you that the spider hidden on US currency is the Mark of the Beast, this is not the forum for such discussions. If somebody wants to talk about it, I suggest you call Art Bell. Brian Drake (Bmd2323@aol.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 06:47:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA16772; Tue, 4 May 1999 06:46:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 06:46:01 -0700 Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 08:45:54 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <925823085.26168.908@excite.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"T3hZM2.0.z54.PelBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10190 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 4 May 1999, Harvey Norris wrote: > I posted the following on Keelynet > concerning additional consideration of > 180 input phasing on production of scalar > waves, but since the 13 subject is here > I wanted to mention it is my very lucky no. I've given some thought to scalar wave production over the years, but haven't tried anything yet. In one of Bearden's papers he gave the idea that scalar waves have been produced with two antennas the proper distance apart and fed so that they produce phase cancellation in the far field (a net EM field of zero). This has brought up a couple questions: 1) What about the near field? 2) What havoc does this wreak on the SWR of the antenna system? My amateur radio transmitter cuts back its power output as the SWR of the load increases. It may not want to drive such an antenna setup. Well, I guess I will have to give this more thought when I get time, and even try some experiments. Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 07:26:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA28559; Tue, 4 May 1999 07:24:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 07:24:21 -0700 Message-ID: <372F0369.F3AEFAC4@harti.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 16:25:45 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , "JNaudin509@aol.com" Subject: Magnetic levitation ? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"T48oW2.0.8-6.LCmBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10191 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, does everybody agree, that the magnetic equal effect to JL Naudin´s electrostatic levitation effect might be this ? http://www.tricountyi.net/~randerse/ortho1.htm Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 07:55:34 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA10163; Tue, 4 May 1999 07:53:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 07:53:07 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Beardon Site Message-Id: <925829555.28736.902@excite.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 07:52:35 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.168 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"KL6Kc3.0.eU2.IdmBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10192 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: For those willing to fathom it; http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/i/n/infonet/Beardon.htm Somehow a medical application of scalar effects may be explored but it is hard to continue reading this without somekind of reprieve. Been there before? Other notes of interest exist on the host site. I dont know why mathematics and quantum theory has to be so obtuse. That means you think you have an inkling of whats going on by reading it over and over. I think I need to go back to school... HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 08:44:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA24932; Tue, 4 May 1999 08:42:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 08:42:29 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: harti@harti.com Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Magnetic levitation ? Message-Id: <925832512.16097.214@excite.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 08:41:52 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.168 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"nPtn3.0.T56.aLnBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10193 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 04 May 1999 16:25:45 +0200, Stefan Hartmann wrote: > > Hi, > does everybody agree, > that the magnetic equal effect to JL Naudin=B4s > electrostatic levitation effect might be this ? > > http://www.tricountyi.net/~randerse/ortho1.htm > > Regards, Stefan. > >Great site about toroidal fields concerning B and A fields. Your question is difficult for me. Can I say a barber pole theory? This is a picture of how spin causes illusion of motion. In the old days in America a barber shop had a cylinder that spun along its axis. Like the candy canes at Christmas time it has a red spiral. When the cylinder rotates the eyes follow the illusion of the red band moving upward. This illusion correlates with the way a magnetic field line moves from north to south, when in reality this movement is only a relative perception of spin. In this model if both the spin and the spiral are backwards the same relative effect is made. This tells us the analogy applies in two ways and not just one. Of course no one has ever discovered a magnetic particle that moves through space because it is not a particle that causes this observance but rather more like a gear that interacts with another gear at right angles that causes actual movement of charged masses at right angles to both gears. The analogy provides a kind of instance were both intrinsic spins going in opposite directions still deliver the same effect. This accounts for clockwise and counterclockwise windings producing the same magnetic fields when currents are going in opposite directions on the coils. Kind of silly but worth mentioning. HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 09:32:56 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA12915; Tue, 4 May 1999 09:30:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:30:28 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: 180 phasing on TC/ Bill Wysock model 12 Message-Id: <925835402.14009.695@excite.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 09:30:02 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.168 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"ATCYk3.0.e93.a2oBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10194 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On topic? Bill Wysock posted this letter to me and looking at his site is most impressive; http://www.ttr.com/model/12_ITS_article.htm Your post to the Tesla List was interesting. However, I submit to you, that what you proposed, has already been done. Go to my web site : www.ttr.com. Look up Model 12. Study the photos and read the accompanying white paper (schematic included.) I did this work in 1992, and gave a week long exhibition before thousands of people, at Colorado Springs for the 5th bi-annual International Tesla Society. Best regards, Bill Wysock >From site; The most significant feature of this system is the primary resonant tank circuit in a series fed configuration. The system consists of two identical 1/4-Lambda Tesla resonators which are electrically phased to produce opposite sign oscillations between the respective high voltage terminals In looking at the schematic a single capacitor C-1 is used in coordination with bifilar primaries. This is the spirit of things and in this magnificent demonstration no one would bmore impressed with this truly spectacular display of arcing. Howevever this is not what I am conveying concerning a binary resonant arc gap. In that case two capacities each themselves are 180 degrees out of phase and must be shown schematically different. Additionally in the model 12 circuit a different idea is presented where the primaries are mutually opposing whearas in practice with the idea employed with larger inductances mutual inductance in agreement will be better to increase the Q of both. Wysock indicates the reasoning in this regard, it is better to decrease the inductance by interaction so that more capacitance can be used to charge the system. So be it. One can scarcely argue with some one that is a leader in these endeavors. But nevertheless he has been mistaken in his interpretation of what I am speaking about; and it is not the same thing he has demonstrated with great fanfare. It may be that the method I am speaking of might deliver meager results compared to that already done, but nevertheless it deserves experimental recognition. Trying new things is always freely recognized; and never censored. The additional concept of an actual bifilar SECONDARY is most probably possible. Once again I will explain that if one takes the picture of a full wave rectifier and replaces the forward conducting diodes with identical capacitors; and then taking the same configuration and replacing the reverse conducting diodes with identical inductors; that this presents a new configuration that I have used in conjunction with high inductances to resonate at 60 hz. Whether this same kind of application can be made in dual tesla primaries remains in my opinion an undiscovered territory. I have described this schematic in the same way at circuit desciption http://www.insidetheweb.com/mbs.cgi/mb124201 HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 09:43:03 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA17154; Tue, 4 May 1999 09:42:42 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:42:42 -0700 Message-ID: <372F2348.6AF2136E@ix.netcom.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 09:41:45 -0700 From: "Mark N. Iverson" Organization: Research Management Associates X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Doomsday 20 years References: <468fe7c7.24604dce@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8rETN.0.wB4.2EoBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10195 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Bmd2323@aol.com wrote: > I'll tell you what's frightening, what's frightening is that this mailing > list, which is supposed to be about free energy has turned into a mass of > superstition and speculation about things which have no place being discussed > on this list. DITTO! Couldn't have said it better myself... For all those who feel the need to share things NOT related to the topic of the list.... LEARN HOW TO CREATE A NEW EMAIL MSG ADDRESSED ONLY TO THOSE WHO WANT TO HEAR IT...OR CREATE A LIST FOR THE TOPIC! > Let's cut the crap, guys, and get back to what this list is supposed to be > about. I don't care if aliens landed in your back yard and told you that the > spider hidden on US currency is the Mark of the Beast, this is not the forum > for such discussions. Again, DITTO! > Brian Drake Mark Iverson From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 10:17:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA27817; Tue, 4 May 1999 10:17:12 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 10:17:12 -0700 Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 10:17:03 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199905041717.KAA04623@schilling.ucdavis.edu> X-Sender: danq@blue.ucdavis.edu (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dan Quickert Subject: planets,UFOs,13,doomsday Cc: aaa@texas.net, dave.tingley@juno.com, MKSBoysal@aol.com, donadams@telusplanet.net, atech@ix.netcom.com, avd@wirehub.nl, energeon@microtec.net Resent-Message-ID: <"MGB3P.0.Xo6.NkoBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10196 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: the statement below is what Bill Beaty (list owner) publishes at http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/flist.html note the 7th and 9th words in the first paragraph 7th + 9th =16; plus 3 (for the 3rd significant word)=19; note the word in the first paragraph that corresponds to that number ;-) --------------- FREENRGL is for the discussion of experiments and devices which exhibit anomalous energy production (or consumption!), or which violate currently-accepted physics theory. This includes: * "Overunity" * Electrogravity & inertia violation * Scalar Electromagnetism * Psi phenomena and Paranormal * Relativity violation ...and any similar topics which the regular users consider interesting (ask us!) The discussion is limited to experimentalism. Or theory-led experiments. Or theoretical implications of experiments. This is not a forum for all those controversial physics theories being ignored by mainstream science. Try NEOTECH for those. But if your theory leads directly to interesting, testable, real-world phenomena, then by all means discuss the experimental possibilites. If your experiments reveal anomalies not predicted by ANY theory, definitely jump right in and discuss your findings. Also it's very acceptable to publish theoretical work on a web page and announce its presence here. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 11:01:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA09906; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:13 -0700 Message-ID: <372F196E.EA58451@telusplanet.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 10:59:42 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: my 2$ on 13 :)~ References: <19990504061415.83957.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"AYzi73.0.WQ2.eNpBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10198 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Flytch... interesting comments, I heard however that the Gnostics staged their own persecution and that it was actually they who wanted to remove the conscious knowledge of 13 from the public arena and have the 'Christians' conveniently blamed for it.... wonder what really happened... flytch er wrote: > > A few thousand years ago before we had the calendar we have now there was a > calendar based on the moon...... > > The religious of the day held 13 as the holiest of the holy numbers.... > > To help kill their religious beliefs of the Gnostic it was claimed that 13 > was an unlucky number.... thus helping give rise (manufacture) too > christianity.... > > _______________________________________________________________ > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 11:01:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA09848; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:10 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:10 -0700 Message-ID: <372F1974.AE03CDDC@telusplanet.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 10:59:48 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"KsT8g1.0.eP2.cNpBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10197 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I knew Charon was a moon...but hadnt heard of Vulcan before... I thought it was a joke but your saying it was actually something viewed back in the 19th century, how interesting! Zack Widup wrote: > > On Mon, 3 May 1999, Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > exactly! ;> > > > > Charlie Hodgson wrote: > > > > > > On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > > Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid > > > > belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly > > > > > > 11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. > > > > Back in the 19th Century a planet was observed with an orbit closer to > the sun than Mercury. It was named "Vulcan". It had an extremely > erratic orbit, unpredictale by Kepler's equations. It finally disappeared, > leaving some to believe it either fell into the sun or was not in fact > just a piece of rock. > > I have not heard of Charon before. > > Zack > -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 11:01:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA10057; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:22 -0700 Message-ID: <372F197A.2E608A77@telusplanet.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 10:59:54 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"huEe03.0.oS2.mNpBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10199 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: isnt Charon some small asteroid or moon of Mars or something? Zack Widup wrote: > > On Mon, 3 May 1999, Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > exactly! ;> > > > > Charlie Hodgson wrote: > > > > > > On 03-May-99 Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > > Also, we have 11 planets... and an asteroid > > > > belt (12th planet remains?) and then theres the planet X supposedly > > > > > > 11 Planets? Including Vulcan and Charon, I suppose. > > > > Back in the 19th Century a planet was observed with an orbit closer to > the sun than Mercury. It was named "Vulcan". It had an extremely > erratic orbit, unpredictale by Kepler's equations. It finally disappeared, > leaving some to believe it either fell into the sun or was not in fact > just a piece of rock. > > I have not heard of Charon before. > > Zack > -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 11:02:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA10106; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:29 -0700 Message-ID: <372F1986.7FCCD186@telusplanet.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 11:00:06 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13? Ha! References: <372DC27E.95486017@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"WnRFO1.0.pT2.uNpBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10200 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Cheryl, fascinating post! Again, this sounds like its right out of Plichta's strange book .... Cheryl wrote: > > First post -please don't hurt me too bad. > > A few years ago the number 444 kept showing up so much in > seemingly significant ways that even my practical mind > began to wonder if there was something I was supposed to > know. > I spent many a spare moment looking at everything from > Atlases to Zodiacs, whimsically anticipating that "A-ha!" > experience. No luck, it doesn't seem to mean anything. > Discovering that the chinese word for "four" sounds very > much like the word for death had me worried for a while, > but its been many years now and no bad, so that has > subsided. > I've pretty much chalked it up to selective perception. > > However... > > While examining the periodic table I did notice that > carbon (the element that all? organic life is based on) > has 6 electrons, 6 protons and 6 neutrons. > > Hmmmm..... > > But thats an old story... -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 11:02:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA10621; Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:01:56 -0700 Message-ID: <372F198C.ECA491E0@telusplanet.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 11:00:12 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 13? Ha! References: <3.0.32.19990503012723.00aa0810@cnct.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OrQZk3.0.Yb2.FOpBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10201 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: wow... freaky .... I've heard of the principia discordia by name only, never really knew what it was about, the items you list below again sound like much of the same ilk found in Plichta's amazing book.... Keith Nagel wrote: > > Well, so much seems to be posted on this, why not??? > > A while back, a book existed called the principia discordia. > It was a religion based on the worship of the greek goddess > Eris, goddess of discord and chaos. Anyway, in it was > a page on the law of fives. Basically, the idea was that > everything and anything was in some manner related to the > number 5. Of course, many examples were given. When you got > to the bottem of the page, a small postscript was hand > written in by the author. He writes, "the strange thing is, the > harder I look for it, the more apparent it becomes" > > This then is the law of fives. > > If you think it's trivial, reread and think again. > > By the way, I like the carbon/number of beast relation. > That's fun. > > K. > > At 08:36 AM 5/3/99 -0700, you wrote: > >First post -please don't hurt me too bad. > > > >A few years ago the number 444 kept showing up so much in > >seemingly significant ways that even my practical mind > >began to wonder if there was something I was supposed to > >know. > >I spent many a spare moment looking at everything from > >Atlases to Zodiacs, whimsically anticipating that "A-ha!" > >experience. No luck, it doesn't seem to mean anything. > >Discovering that the chinese word for "four" sounds very > >much like the word for death had me worried for a while, > >but its been many years now and no bad, so that has > >subsided. > >I've pretty much chalked it up to selective perception. > > > >However... > > > >While examining the periodic table I did notice that > >carbon (the element that all? organic life is based on) > >has 6 electrons, 6 protons and 6 neutrons. > > > >Hmmmm..... > > > >But thats an old story... > > > > > > -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 12:05:38 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA02086; Tue, 4 May 1999 12:04:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 12:04:25 -0700 From: mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl Message-Id: <372F43F0.9B454623@elektro.fontys.nl> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 21:01:05 +0200 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [nl]C-QXW07103 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl, de, en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor References: <199905031906.VAA25171@poindexter.wirehub.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Smcs51.0.RW.vIqBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10202 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi (Hoi) Aris and others, > Hi WJ, > I saw the program too on Dutch televison (RVU) and did some investigations... I saw the engine also in the program Stern TV (?) at RTL Television but I missed a part also. > I missed a part of the program and RVU send me some written information > and I found the engine-specifications not comparable to standard car engines... > > Max speed app 70 miles an hour and only about 200 miles driving possible > with one tank of air... I believe this engine use aire pressure to drive, but I am > not sure, perhaps you can tell us more... I have no technical specifications or drawings. I am not sure but I thought that the internal of the engine had a triangular piston. > I do know there is a lab (or something) in hyeres (French) and Guy is looking > for business associates in other countries... (might be interesting...:-) > Regards, > Aris... Sincerly, WJ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 12:44:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA14588; Tue, 4 May 1999 12:43:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 12:43:54 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Negre air-motor Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:47:33 -0400 Message-ID: <19990504194733937.AAA159@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"h4yaN1.0.rZ3.vtqBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10203 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Aris wrote: >I have no technical specifications or drawings. >I am not sure but I thought that the internal of the engine had a triangular piston. > Ola! Was it a triangular piston, or a triangular rotor, like a Wankel engine? Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 13:02:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA21533; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:01:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:01:32 -0700 From: mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl Message-Id: <372F525E.1773384@elektro.fontys.nl> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 22:02:38 +0200 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [nl]C-QXW07103 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl, de, en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor References: <199905031918.VAA26898@poindexter.wirehub.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"cr6WV2.0.JG5.S8rBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10204 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Aris and others, Thanks for your links. Look at this site : http://www.necnp.org/aircar.htm Some quotes : "...his air driven engine mounted in a Citroen AX chassis ran for 10 hours with a top speed of about 100 kmh. That is a better performance than any electric car in production." "Sixteen patents have been taken out to cover an integrated system in which 300 litres of compressed air can be pumped into the tank under high pressure in three minutes." "While the air is free, the electricity used to refuel the tank at home would cost less than $2. " Speciaal voor jou Aris : "The car is being studied by other countries, including the NETHERLANDS, because it can also clean up air that has been polluted by petrol vehicles. " Sincerly, WJ Aris schreef: > Some links > > http://www.calstart.org/resources/forum/messages/messages/508.html > http://nscp.snap.com/search/directory/results/1,61,nscp-0,00.html?keyword=guy+negre&tag= > tt.ns.sb1 > > Regards, > Aris From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 13:16:40 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA25272; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:12:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:12:24 -0700 Message-ID: <19990504201218.34046.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.227] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: air-motor Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 13:12:18 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"gqjnm1.0.nA6.dIrBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10206 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > > and I found the engine-specifications not comparable to standard car >engines... > > > > Max speed app 70 miles an hour and only about 200 miles driving possible > > with one tank of air... I believe this engine use aire pressure to >drive, but I am Can anyone speculate on what pressure, and how much volume, could do this???? it seams to me that an motor of this type could be very simple. The question would still be how much $/miles (efficiency) as you would still have to compress the air .... I am very interested:) and have in mind an engine that tesla invented as an earth quake machine..... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 13:17:35 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA27929; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:15:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:15:52 -0700 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <8f6d48a2.2460ae75@aol.com> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:11:33 EDT Subject: ARDA v2.0 Mk1 - Ready to fly... To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 144 Resent-Message-ID: <"B7XBQ3.0.Hq6.uLrBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10207 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dear All, The ARDA v2.0 Mk1 is the 1/4 scale of the ARDA v2.0 (the real EHD flying version). This model has been built to test the aerodynamical model of the wing in free flight. This scaled model of the ARDA v2.0 will allow me to conduct some tests : - Validation of the aerodynamical model in free flight, - Adjustements of the center of gravity, - Wing loading tests, - EHD setup and installation. ARDA v2.0 Mk1 specifications (1/4 scale of the v2.0) : Wing span : 360mm Lenght : 315mm Aifoil profile : Eppler 338 Wing load: 8.75 g/dm2 Weight: 38g You will find all pictures of this model at : http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine/delany/256/html/ardav21.htm Best Regards, Jean-Louis Naudin Email: Jnaudin509@aol.com Overunity Web site: http://members.aol.com/jnaudin509/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 13:18:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA25093; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:12:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:12:01 -0700 Message-ID: <000f01be966a$73813560$485ffea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: "Free Energy" Subject: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:12:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01BE9640.862FB760" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"W-kzG3.0.-76.HIrBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10205 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BE9640.862FB760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit -----Original Message----- From: atg0317 To: harti@harti.com Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 2:58 PM Subject: Re: Magnetic levitation ? >From: Stefan Hartmann >To: Free Energy ; JNaudin509@aol.com > >Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 9:35 AM >Subject: Magnetic levitation ? > > >> >>Hi, >>does everybody agree, >>that the magnetic equal effect to JL Naudin´s >>electrostatic levitation effect might be this ? >> >>http://www.tricountyi.net/~randerse/ortho1.htm >> >>Regards, Stefan. >> >>-- >>Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann >>Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany >>Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 >>email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com >>http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! >> > >Stefan! > >Went and looked at the above site and thought that by an off chance we could >try to see if the idea could be tested. > >I wound two small toroids and fastened them together with a small plastic >wire tie. A 16,000uf cap was charged to 40vdc at which point it was >discharged through the coils (connected in parallel). The coils wire >suspended by their wires about 0.5mm above a wood block. The suspending >wires allowed for a spring action. In other words they would with a slight >movement bounce up and down and then settle above the wood block. > >There is a very decided movement when the cap is discharged through the >coils. Depending on the polarity it is initially up or down. Because of the >wire spring action this can be seen without trouble. > >I insured that no vibration took place during the discharge and the >experiment is repeatable over and over again. There is a very real force >present in this configuration. > >The two toroids were wound with #26 AWG magnet wire. These coils are small, >the biggest is only 12mm Dia. > >Very interesting, although the input power is very extreme for this first >try configuration. > >A (.jpg) picture of the coils is included. > ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BE9640.862FB760 Content-Type: image/jpeg; name="Mvc-002s.jpg" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Mvc-002s.jpg" /9j/4AAQSkZJRgABAQEBLAEsAAD/2wBDAAUDBAQEAwUEBAQFBQUGBwwIBwcHBw8LCwkMEQ8SEhEP ERETFhwXExQaFRERGCEYGh0dHx8fExciJCIeJBweHx7/2wBDAQUFBQcGBw4ICA4eFBEUHh4eHh4e Hh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh4eHh7/wAARCACUAMIDASIA AhEBAxEB/8QAHwAAAQUBAQEBAQEAAAAAAAAAAAECAwQFBgcICQoL/8QAtRAAAgEDAwIEAwUFBAQA AAF9AQIDAAQRBRIhMUEGE1FhByJxFDKBkaEII0KxwRVS0fAkM2JyggkKFhcYGRolJicoKSo0NTY3 ODk6Q0RFRkdISUpTVFVWV1hZWmNkZWZnaGlqc3R1dnd4eXqDhIWGh4iJipKTlJWWl5iZmqKjpKWm p6ipqrKztLW2t7i5usLDxMXGx8jJytLT1NXW19jZ2uHi4+Tl5ufo6erx8vP09fb3+Pn6/8QAHwEA AwEBAQEBAQEBAQAAAAAAAAECAwQFBgcICQoL/8QAtREAAgECBAQDBAcFBAQAAQJ3AAECAxEEBSEx 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Message-ID: <372F7460.6E041BF@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 15:27:44 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? References: <000f01be966a$73813560$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"cELV_.0.At.harBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10208 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >There is a very decided movement when the cap is discharged through the >coils. Depending on the polarity it is initially up or down. Because of the >wire spring action this can be seen without trouble. This sounds similar to the thrusting effect I and Rick Monteverde saw in toroid coils connected to high current sources. In the end, I couldn't rule out thermal flexing of the wires or magnetic effects. I will set the experiment up and see what comes of it. Stay tuned for results... Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 13:41:59 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA07004; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:39:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:39:03 -0700 Message-ID: <372F5B3F.2A697A5B@harti.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 22:40:31 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, stk@sunherald.infi.net Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? References: <000f01be966a$73813560$485ffea9@y9g6r3> <372F7460.6E041BF@sunherald.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"hg13_3.0.Lj1.dhrBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10209 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: "Kyle R. Mcallister" wrote: > > >There is a very decided movement when the cap is discharged through the > >coils. Depending on the polarity it is initially up or down. Because of the > >wire spring action this can be seen without trouble. > > This sounds similar to the thrusting effect I and Rick Monteverde saw in > toroid coils connected to high current sources. In the end, I couldn't > rule out thermal flexing of the wires or magnetic effects. I will set > the experiment up and see what comes of it. Stay tuned for results... > > Kyle R. Mcallister Great, yes please try it and report back ! :) Please try to use a scope to see if the current oscillates inside the coils...(LC tanks..parasitric capacitance effects) Thanks a lot in advance. Good luck ! Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 13:57:23 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA13258; Tue, 4 May 1999 13:56:43 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:56:43 -0700 Message-ID: <372F5F6B.D4B5B695@harti.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 22:58:19 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: If you want to understand Scalar Waves this is the software to get ! X-Priority: 2 (High) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"6FPXz.0.3F3.ByrBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10210 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: http://www.tricountyi.net/~randerse/qbmenu.htm If you want to understand Scalar Waves this is the software to get ! Really good ! Big thanks to Rick Anderson to make it visually explainable ! Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 14:06:35 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA24846; Tue, 4 May 1999 14:05:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 14:05:25 -0700 Message-ID: <372F6178.9AFEF12C@harti.com> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 23:07:04 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"muG4S1.0.346.L4sBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10211 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: http://www.necnp.org/aircar.htm A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this ! Why has nobody invented this earlier ? I want it now ! :) Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 14:20:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA14705; Tue, 4 May 1999 14:18:35 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 14:18:35 -0700 Message-ID: <372F47B4.85BBCED2@telusplanet.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 14:17:08 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation References: <925823085.26168.908@excite.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"899x6.0.bb3.hGsBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10212 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: fascinating harvey! Harvey Norris wrote: > > I posted the following on Keelynet > concerning additional consideration of > 180 input phasing on production of scalar > waves, but since the 13 subject is here > I wanted to mention it is my very lucky no. > Harvey D Norris = 13 letters > 270-50-3302 = I laugh when they say not > to give the SS away= 9+5+8=13 > My brother Michael was born on friday the 13th > All my addresses and phone nos contained 13's > Live on 1396 Russell in town at exit 13 > on Ohio Turnpike. > Also 9 and 7 very good numerology > 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 > A B C D E F G H I > J K L M N O P Q R > S T U V W X Y Z > > H A R V E Y D N O R R I S > 8 1 9 4 5 7 4 5 6 9 9 9 1 > ! ! ! ! ! ! ! > 9 9 9 9 9 9 9 = 7 9's > Teslas birthday; 7-9-1856 > HDN birthday 99 yrs later 9-7-1955 > so I guess its easy to get carried away with numbers! > now for the rest of the story... > > On Tue, 20 Apr 1999 17:29:15 -0400, Steve wrote: > > > from: http://www.keelynet.com/energy/dimshift.htm > > > > It is also worthy of note that many of the reports of > free energy > > devices, when in operation and drawing 'negative > energy' also > > produce phenomena relating to weight loss and > temporal alterations. > > > > Years ago, Tom Bearden told me of an experiment he > and an unnamed > > researcher had carried out using a scalar generated > from > > interferometry. Two projectors were aimed to coincide > at a fixed > > point in space. When power was applied and the > frequency/phase was > > adjusted, there was no apparent change in the target > area. > . could anyone explain what exactly this means: > > "a scalar generated from interferometry." I've been > studying > > caduceus coils for a couple years now, but haven't > done any > > serious research on them yet. Can anyone offer any > insight into > > cad coils vs. an interferometer for creating > "scalars"? > > > > thanks! > > -Steve > > I would suspect a scalar interferometry refers to > establishing > two scalar stations or emanators. I did experiments > with > these on a primitive stage. Nothing seems to be clear > in > Beardons work but at that time I assumed that scalar > waves > could be established by simply taking two coils and > oscillating > them with ac so that the magnetic fields from both > would be > acting in mutual opposition from the placement of the > coils > face to face at their poles. In that kind of > interaction the plane > that exists in the creation of vector magnetic > cancellation > should logically contain this locked up energy. In my > interpretation we should have gone from emitting an EM > wave radially outwards in 3 dimensions to enclosing > itself > to a 2 dimensional scalar planar propagation. In this > kind > of model only a small portion of scalar conversion > would > take place, because what is found is that the flux > density > of the magnetic fields on the end poles increases > concurrent to > this magnetic compression of the interior poles taking > place. > Now when one station is creating a N pole compression, > at the same time another station could be making a S > pole compression. Those two stations themselves in turn > could have the planes of magnetic cancellation > themselves > intersect at right angles. At this intersection point a > line > exists and that point on the line closest to both > stations > could represent an area where the phase locked scalar > em unlocks and will emit an induction signal on a coil > in > this test area. In order for this experiment to be > realistic > the test coil must be well outside the magnetic fields > from > the stations. In my experiments I inconclusively noted > a > weak effect. Most remarkble however was that the > oscilloscope could show a standing wave induced > signal, or two waves 180 out of phase from this target > area. This only occured on some of the sweep > settings. > I think that J Naudin has some info on cad > coil scalar effects in which this propagates as a > beam,and he warns to take caution. Some of the > more recent commentaries on Rick Andersons > excellent scalar EM site indicates that you dont > necessarily have to have magnetic cancellation > to produce a scalar effect and in actuality the > cancellation may be superfluous. I think perhaps > the hint is made that the cancellation can be > internally generated. I might be able to throw > some light on this horribly obscurred subject. > When a N magnetic pole is made on an > air core coil it can be made TWO different ways. > It can be made with a clockwise wound coil or > a counterclockwise. In each case the current > goes in opposite directions to achieve the same > effect, or so we suppose. It would seem this > distinction might be overlooked when putting > two coils together in magnetic compression > because it is assumed it makes no difference. > I can show that there is a difference. But in order > to explain this difference I might have to use the > reference point of unobvious potential. > First take the case of two identically wound > coils. ( I am referring to air core coils of thousands > of winds) Assuming these coils are safe to input > the 120 v 60 hz wall current it is found that to > secure the maximum magnetic field from the coils > they must be put in series resonance. This simply > involves putting an identical capacitive reactance > in series with this inductive reactance. When this is > done an unobvious potential expressed as a voltage > rise occurs across each of these elements, in opposite > directions similar to two forces against each other. > Now if two coils can be resonated like this and placed > with the poles in opposition it will appear as a > clockwise > next to a counterclockwise in space. This occurs on > these identically wound coils because one of the > coils had to be turned around 180 in space to secure > the condition of being in magnetic opposition with the > other coil. > Now it is of course also evident that instead of > turning the coil 180 in space the input electrical > connections to one of the resonating coils could > be reversed to give the same effect, or so we > presume... > In this 2nd condition the two coils would have > the same windings when viewed lengthwise even > though repulsive fields were being produced in between. > It is worth noting that magnetic fields from > air coils might have an inbedded or intrinsic spin > that is not contained in the conventional > ferromagnetic. > The reaction of this spin factor to create > magnetically cancelled vectors could have everything > to do with whether a scalar wave is created. This may > not have been noted in the past. > So we have two possibilties; creating a 180 > condition > by moving a coil in space, or creating the condition by > creating a 180 phasing in input. To show that these > two conditions are indeed different all that is needed > is a volt meter. The resonant rise of voltage is shown > by connecting the voltmeter across each element. > In the first case both readings on both sides will > be identical, but in the second case the identical > voltage readings will be opposite polarity. > What does this mean? It means that in the first > case identical unobvious voltages are created at > the midpoints, but in the second case they are > opposite. When a voltage measurement is taken > BETWEEN the midpoints on both cases the first > shows zero but the second shows a voltage > between them twice that due to its own rise on > each side. This shows that even though the > magnetic field action from these factors was > thought to be identical, the causitive factors > contain important differences. In the second case > while one unobvious potential grows negative, its > counterpart grows positive. > Thus the coils could also be put in magnetic > unison with no magnetic cancellation and still > produce a scalar effect by virtue of its 180 > phasing input function. This is noted by allowing > the circuit to become a high frequency oscillation > by introducing a break in the series circuit so that > an arc gap forms. In the first case a massive EM > signature is seen, in the second modification I > have named as a binary resonant arc gap (BRAG) > the process produces virtually no EM. > If this represents a phased locked EM method > that is wonderful. But the problem then becomes > how to unlock it? It may be better to use cancelled > magnetic fields since a concievable method of > unlocking it has been concieved already. > I would conjecture that both conditions > may be necessary to produce the illusive critter > known as a scalar wave. HDN > > _______________________________________________________ > Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 14:45:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA27764; Tue, 4 May 1999 14:45:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 14:45:02 -0700 Message-ID: <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:45:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"F9Fzy3.0.fn6.TfsBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10213 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 3:34 PM Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? >>There is a very decided movement when the cap is discharged through the >>coils. Depending on the polarity it is initially up or down. Because of the >>wire spring action this can be seen without trouble. > >This sounds similar to the thrusting effect I and Rick Monteverde saw in >toroid coils connected to high current sources. In the end, I couldn't >rule out thermal flexing of the wires or magnetic effects. I will set >the experiment up and see what comes of it. Stay tuned for results... > >Kyle R. Mcallister > I won't say thermal is not a possibility, although I an unaware of the fact that a copper wire will flex with gravity when current flows in one direction and then flexes in the opposite direction when current flows in the reverse direction. If you know something about this fact of a straight length of copper wire I would like to have additional information. Thermal aside I don't think this is what I observed. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:09:13 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA24239; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:08:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:08:01 -0700 Message-ID: <372F8AF7.74215456@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 17:04:08 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Toroid tests... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"6xwPe.0.Yw5.1_sBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10214 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: All: I have performed a test of the effect observed by ATG0317, and have negative results. This it not to say he didn't see an effect, this may just be that I did it wrong. I am going to set up a new configuration more similar to his shortly. My test used two toroid coils, ferrite core, connected in parallel and in a way that the B field rotation directions were the same. I used a 12VDC power supply, and a 100,000uF capacitor. No thrusting effect was observed. The big toroid was about 1.25 inches in diameter, the small one the size of ATG0317's big one. Both used >50 turns of #22AWG wire. I will continue to test. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:10:22 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA24557; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:09:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:09:32 -0700 Message-ID: <372F8B52.49AE8C1B@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 17:05:38 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? References: <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"b1rPp2.0.X_5.R0tBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10215 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > I won't say thermal is not a possibility, although I an unaware of the fact > that a copper wire will flex with gravity when current flows in one > direction and then flexes in the opposite direction when current flows in > the reverse direction. If you know something about this fact of a straight > length of copper wire I would like to have additional information. Thermal > aside I don't think this is what I observed. No, after realizing the fallacy of what I wrote, I don't think thermal flexing would account for a thrust that reversed direction with polarity. Thermally, it shouldn't matter what direction the thrust is in. Magnetics is now what I am trying to rule out. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:12:46 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA26336; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:12:00 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:12:00 -0700 Message-ID: <372F6F5F.DE67A9C5@microtec.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 18:06:29 -0400 From: patrick tremblay X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: ZAEV and DIODES References: <372E586D.B20D2F2E@microtec.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"hRzbA.0.IR6.j2tBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10216 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Why don't they make an LC circuit with the Zaev varicond. My guess is it could run a transformer and recapture back EMF and amplify it. The experiment I am proposing is to put a Zaev in parallel with a coil and make an LC tank circuit with it. Probably the oscillations will extract heat energy. It is a very interesting capacitor. But a semiconductor capacitor behaves strangely with heat too, a Diode can be configured as a capacitor when in inverse voltage. The second experiment I am proposing is simple, take several diodes and connect them in parallel, then charge them in inverse voltage DC. Then heat them up and discharge. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:25:19 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA32138; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:24:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:24:40 -0700 Message-ID: <000a01be967c$fcb3b760$485ffea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Toroid tests... Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 17:25:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"VFzhc3.0.2s7.eEtBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10217 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 5:11 PM Subject: Toroid tests... >All: > >I have performed a test of the effect observed by ATG0317, and have >negative results. This it not to say he didn't see an effect, this may >just be that I did it wrong. I am going to set up a new configuration >more similar to his shortly. My test used two toroid coils, ferrite >core, connected in parallel and in a way that the B field rotation >directions were the same. I used a 12VDC power supply, and a 100,000uF >capacitor. No thrusting effect was observed. The big toroid was about >1.25 inches in diameter, the small one the size of ATG0317's big one. >Both used >50 turns of #22AWG wire. I will continue to test. > >Kyle R. Mcallister > Kyle! My largest coils is 12mm diameter and the smaller is 8mm dia. How are you observing thrust ? The RC values differ greatly here along with the coil sizes, I have just posted a mail with the resistance of my two coils and connecting wire in parallel. Looking at the discharge with a scope shows only what is expected. (1) considerable activity at initial contact of the discharge contactor, typical noise until the contacts weld. (2) No! LC oscillation observed. Again this is a very brief period and observation at present depends only on sight during the very short sweep period. I'm not so sure that arranging the coils as I have with a slight spring in the wires do not aid in the observation. I added a second wire tie to secure the coils. The added weight of the tie reduced the movement to the extent that I added another 4.7Kuf to restore activity to the prior single tie condition. Will sully exact coil measurements, number of turns etc., if some one wants to duplicate the exact experiment. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:35:04 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA03461; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:34:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:34:33 -0700 Message-ID: <372F74B2.62FFD55B@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 01:29:06 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? References: <000f01be966a$73813560$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mvPV91.0.vr.vNtBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10218 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > >I wound two small toroids and fastened them together with a small plastic > >wire tie. A 16,000uf cap was charged to 40vdc at which point it was > >discharged through the coils (connected in parallel). The coils wire > >suspended by their wires about 0.5mm above a wood block. The suspending > >wires allowed for a spring action. In other words they would with a slight > >movement bounce up and down and then settle above the wood block. > > Hi, You may check the effect is reflecting the hypothesis by only powering one coil, leaving the other unconnected. It would also worth to check if any voltage get induced on this unpowered coil. hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:39:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA05607; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:39:00 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:39:00 -0700 Message-ID: <372F7768.1AB86F56@harti.com> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 00:40:40 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, "Kyle R. Mcallister" Subject: Re: Toroid tests... References: <372F8AF7.74215456@sunherald.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jJmwC.0.WN1.3StBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10219 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: "Kyle R. Mcallister" wrote: > > All: > > I have performed a test of the effect observed by ATG0317, and have > negative results. This it not to say he didn't see an effect, this may > just be that I did it wrong. I am going to set up a new configuration > more similar to his shortly. My test used two toroid coils, ferrite > core, connected in parallel and in a way that the B field rotation > directions were the same. I used a 12VDC power supply, and a 100,000uF > capacitor. No thrusting effect was observed. The big toroid was about > 1.25 inches in diameter, the small one the size of ATG0317's big one. > Both used >50 turns of #22AWG wire. I will continue to test. > > Kyle R. Mcallister Maybe there is a critical threshold current pulse density, before it will take place ? Maybe you should raise your supply voltage also to 40 Volts DC ? Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:42:46 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA07354; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:42:20 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:42:20 -0700 Message-ID: <372F92FF.B7967D18@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 17:38:23 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid tests... References: <000a01be967c$fcb3b760$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"u3I4D.0.po1.BVtBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10220 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > My largest coils is 12mm diameter and the smaller is 8mm dia. Yes, that is my setup now. Large coil is ferrite core, small is the only core I could find: a steel nut. > How are you observing thrust ? By the springiness of the wires supporting the coil assembly. > I'm not so sure that arranging the coils as I have with a slight spring in > the wires do not aid in the observation. > > I added a second wire tie to secure the coils. The added weight of the tie > reduced the movement to the extent that I added another 4.7Kuf to restore > activity to the prior single tie condition. Maybe I am not putting enough power through the coils? I am only using 12V...but 100Kuf is much bigger than 20.7Kuf. > Will sully exact coil measurements, number of turns etc., if some one wants > to duplicate the exact experiment. Yes, please send details! Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:44:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA07746; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:43:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:43:29 -0700 Message-ID: <372F9347.45052CC0@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 17:39:35 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid tests... References: <372F8AF7.74215456@sunherald.infi.net> <372F7768.1AB86F56@harti.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mSPG61.0.xu1.HWtBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10221 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Stefan Hartmann wrote: > Maybe there is a critical threshold current pulse density, > before it will take place ? > Maybe you should raise your supply voltage also to 40 Volts DC ? Yes, I am going to raise power to about 40 VDC. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:46:07 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA09286; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:45:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:45:07 -0700 Message-ID: <372F93A4.476901FB@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 17:41:08 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid tests... References: <000a01be967c$fcb3b760$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wDiI-3.0.xG2.oXtBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10222 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > Will sully exact coil measurements, number of turns etc., if some one wants > to duplicate the exact experiment. Also, what is your power supply? What is the available current? Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 15:54:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA12710; Tue, 4 May 1999 15:52:08 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 15:52:08 -0700 Message-ID: <001c01be9680$d37086e0$1a1bfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 17:52:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"RHG5O2.0.V63.NetBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10223 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: hamdi ucar To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 5:38 PM Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? >atg0317 wrote: > >> >I wound two small toroids and fastened them together with a small plastic >> >wire tie. A 16,000uf cap was charged to 40vdc at which point it was >> >discharged through the coils (connected in parallel). The coils wire >> >suspended by their wires about 0.5mm above a wood block. The suspending >> >wires allowed for a spring action. In other words they would with a slight >> >movement bounce up and down and then settle above the wood block. >> > > >Hi, > >You may check the effect is reflecting the hypothesis by only powering one coil, leaving the other unconnected. It would also worth to check if any voltage get induced on this unpowered coil. > >hamdi ucar > Hamdi, at present this is a very loose experiment at best. It was set up fast and equipment to measure force is not available at this time. The actual observed effect is an oscillation up and down of the two coils on the spring action supplied by the supporting (supply) wires. Although the first force direction is discernable (up against gravity or down with gravity) depending on polarity of current. Now many questions arise, if I could measure the actual force I could observe if they were equal of course factoring in gravity, also the spring in the wire would be less resistant to the with gravity movement as the wire is already stressed in this direction. I will try what you suggest with one coil at a time, although I'm not totally sure what this could prove at this time. If this is a result of some other factor it could only manifest when both coils are excited. Okay I'll try it and see if I can obtain some answers. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 16:15:51 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA19103; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:14:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:14:39 -0700 Message-ID: <000a01be9683$f8b2c460$1a1bfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:15:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"uhK7h3.0.Kg4.UztBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10224 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >From: hamdi ucar >To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 5:38 PM >Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? > > >>atg0317 wrote: >> >>> >I wound two small toroids and fastened them together with a small >plastic >>> >wire tie. A 16,000uf cap was charged to 40vdc at which point it was >>> >discharged through the coils (connected in parallel). The coils wire >>> >suspended by their wires about 0.5mm above a wood block. The suspending >>> >wires allowed for a spring action. In other words they would with a >slight >>> >movement bounce up and down and then settle above the wood block. >>> > >> >>Hi, >> >>You may check the effect is reflecting the hypothesis by only powering one >coil, leaving the other unconnected. It would also worth to check if any >voltage get induced on this unpowered coil. >> >>hamdi ucar >> >Hamdi, at present this is a very loose experiment at best. It was set up >fast and equipment to measure force is not available at this time. The >actual observed effect is an oscillation up and down of the two coils on the >spring action supplied by the supporting (supply) wires. Although the first >force direction is discernable (up against gravity or down with gravity) >depending on polarity of current. > >Now many questions arise, if I could measure the actual force I could >observe if they were equal of course factoring in gravity, also the spring >in the wire would be less resistant to the with gravity movement as the wire >is already stressed in this direction. > >I will try what you suggest with one coil at a time, although I'm not >totally sure what this could prove at this time. If this is a result of some >other factor it could only manifest when both coils are excited. Okay I'll >try it and see if I can obtain some answers. > Hamdi! With one coil (smaller of the two) connected direct to scope with 10Mohm probe on the 20mv range I observe a 40mv Peak to Peak HF burst when the larger coil discharges the cap. This HF burst matches the HF activity at the contactor contacts, although greatly reduced. In fact I almost want to say its the probe itself that is picking up the signal from the proximity to the supply wires and not an induced signal between the coils. No! No movement when one coil is fired only. This makes no difference which coil is fired. The coils do not move at all when only one is excited. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 16:33:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA26869; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:31:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:31:25 -0700 Message-ID: <000601be9686$4fc5cde0$1a1bfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Toroid tests... Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:31:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"l1aGp3.0.kZ6.DDuBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10225 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 5:55 PM Subject: Re: Toroid tests... >atg0317 wrote: > >> Will sully exact coil measurements, number of turns etc., if some one wants >> to duplicate the exact experiment. > >Also, what is your power supply? What is the available current? > >Kyle R. Mcallister > Coil #1 Color (Violet) 10mm Outer Dia. 8mm Inner Dia, 3mm Thick 24T #24 AWG Coil #2 Color (Ferrite Gray) 12mm Outer Dia. 10mm Inner Dia. 4mm Thick 36T #24 AWG Supply is Lab Standard crow barred at 500ma max I. Cap is charged through a 10 ohm 25W resistor until voltage across cap equals supply, at which point the cap is connected to the coils (with the supply still connected). The supply will shut down when the output current reaches 500ma. I have done it both with and without the supply left connected and it has no effect on result. I think you will have to use all toroids on this, the object as I understand it is to contain the (B) in the coil and only exhibit the (A) external to the coils. This effect is shown when I observe no coupling from one coil to the other. I don't think you can observe when using a steel core. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 16:33:28 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA29449; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:33:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:33:11 -0700 Message-ID: <00a801be9686$7f6593a0$8a5dadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 19:31:49 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"ezkeh.0.2C7.sEuBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10229 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >I knew Charon was a moon...but hadnt heard of Vulcan before... >I thought it was a joke but your saying it was actually something >viewed back in the 19th century, how interesting! There were a LOT of intraMercurial planets (or something!) viewed in the 19th century. Consult "The Book of the Damned" for more details than you can possibly imagine. It's online at http://www.aracnet.net/~fortean/damnei.htm , but I don't know if it's complete yet. It is also desperately in need of a search engine. Hold on, I'll try to find the location in my paper copy... OK, go to chapter 14, http://www.aracnet.net/~fortean/damn14.htm , and be prepared to have your mind blown. -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 16:33:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA29348; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:33:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:33:04 -0700 Message-ID: <00a601be9686$7e2fd2c0$8a5dadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: doomsday, 20 years Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 19:17:37 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"Afd7y.0.JA7.lEuBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10227 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >If you add the 13 + the 7 in 137, you get 20. Why the 13 and the 7? Why not the 1 and the 37, or the 1 and the 3 and the 7? More to the point, 137 is the inverse of a number called the fine-structure constant, which is dimensionless and ties together a number of fundamental physical constants. -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 16:33:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA29394; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:33:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:33:07 -0700 Message-ID: <00a701be9686$7ebdbae0$8a5dadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 19:19:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"Fz4Np2.0.fA7.lEuBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10228 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >isnt Charon some small asteroid or moon of Mars or something? Charon is the moon of Pluto. Chiron is an asteroid (it actually appears to be a gigantic dead comet) that orbits between, I think, Uranus and Neptune. -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 16:34:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA26951; Tue, 4 May 1999 16:31:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:31:32 -0700 Message-ID: <372F83BA.846D4BB1@harti.com> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 01:33:14 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, atg0317 Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? References: <000a01be9683$f8b2c460$1a1bfea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BgAqt3.0.0b6.KDuBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10226 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > > > No! No movement when one coil is fired only. This makes no difference which > coil is fired. The coils do not move at all when only one is excited. This is good news ! Keep on experimenting ! Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 17:04:30 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA12685; Tue, 4 May 1999 17:03:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 17:03:52 -0700 Message-Id: <199905050003.TAA14122@mw3.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 19:01:14 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"dfaXw1.0.263.dhuBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10230 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I recall maybe 30 years ago, someone built a lab pump....a large copper coil in a rigid container with 2 check valves. Upon momentarily charging the coil, it would expand and force liquid out, and on discharge, it would draw liquid in. Never saw any commercialization of this pump. It at least demonstrated that copper expands under charge. Joe Portman =========== ---------- > From: Kyle R. Mcallister > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? > Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 7:05 PM > > atg0317 wrote: > > > I won't say thermal is not a possibility, although I an unaware of the fact > > that a copper wire will flex with gravity when current flows in one > > direction and then flexes in the opposite direction when current flows in > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 17:59:17 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA31845; Tue, 4 May 1999 17:57:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 17:57:52 -0700 Message-ID: <372FB2C5.D6BDE8D6@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 19:53:57 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Toroid tests, part two... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"7_i2x3.0.Un7.GUvBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10231 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: I have retested the experiment, with some interesting but inconclusive results. I used two capacitors, each 100,000uF, in series for 50,000uf. This was connected to a 50VDC power supply, providing a maximum of 1.7 amperes. The capacitors were allowed to charge. They were then discharged through two coils, one ferrite core one steel core, of the same size used by ATG0317, resulting in a violent thrust, and then a steadily decreasing oscillation. I retested this many times, all with the same result. Then, I wound a noninductive coil from the same wire, and connected it to the cap bank. It too thrusted, and showed the same decreasing oscillations. So right now, I cannot confirm that there is any anomalous thrusting effect present. However, I need to get a tiny ferrite core toroid to correctly duplicate the experiment. ATG0317, thoughts on this? Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 19:21:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA30798; Tue, 4 May 1999 19:20:38 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 19:20:38 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990504180023.238703c2@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 04 May 1999 18:00:23 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"vYHuF3.0.3X7.shwBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10232 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi atg0317, Kyle, Stefan and all, At 04:45 PM 5/4/99 -0500, atg0317 wrote: >I won't say thermal is not a possibility, although I an unaware of the fact >that a copper wire will flex with gravity when current flows in one >direction and then flexes in the opposite direction when current flows in >the reverse direction. If you know something about this fact of a straight >length of copper wire I would like to have additional information. Thermal >aside I don't think this is what I observed. > What was the orientation of the wire with respect to the earth's magnetic field? Interesting article by Rich Anderson and toroid experiments! Some comments: You could hang the toroids by the lead wires like a pendulum. The movement would be horizontal, not against gravity, but small forces and deflections could be measured. The effect of the earth's magnetic field could be tested. I wonder if pulsed currents are required? Of course 40 Volts DC would burn out the small windings you have described. If it works with ferromagnetic cores, but not air cores, the core is producing tha vast majority of the A and B fields. This would seem to imply that this effect could also be seen with toroid permanent magnets poled like with a normal toroidal winding. If the gradient is important (2 toroid cores of different diameters), then a single toroid might work with a cross section with different diameters. The ferrite yoke for a CRT or TV comes to mind. There is a werb site I cannot remember which describes such a winding, the core looking somewhat like a bell with a hole at the top. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 4 21:01:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA01888; Tue, 4 May 1999 21:00:42 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 21:00:42 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <39e6a1d5.24611b2a@aol.com> Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 23:55:22 EDT Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"1WGVO2.0.PT.g9yBt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10233 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/4/99 5:59:30 PM Pacific Daylight Time, stk@sunherald.infi.net writes: << Hi all: I have retested the experiment, with some interesting but inconclusive results. I used two capacitors, each 100,000uF, in series for 50,000uf. This was connected to a 50VDC power supply, providing a maximum of 1.7 amperes. The capacitors were allowed to charge. They were then discharged through two coils, one ferrite core one steel core, of the same size used by ATG0317, resulting in a violent thrust, and then a steadily decreasing oscillation. I retested this many times, all with the same result. Then, I wound a noninductive coil from the same wire, and connected it to the cap bank. It too thrusted, and showed the same decreasing oscillations. So right now, I cannot confirm that there is any anomalous thrusting effect present. However, I need to get a tiny ferrite core toroid to correctly duplicate the experiment. ATG0317, thoughts on this? Kyle R. Mcallister >> I don't know the details of how these coils are connected, but a couple points may be of interest: If the toroids are a single winding -not two layers- they each also look like a single loop and could interact with the earth's field or nearby metal objects. How the leads to the toroids are handled is critical. Strong transient forces are developed between lead wires and, if one is not careful, could account for the movement seen. (In general the polarity of the discharge should not change the movement, however, if the polarity is all that changes) Wire expansion, heating, forces between the toroids, etc., should not of course result in any movement in the center of mass of the toroids. I look forward to further results ---- Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 00:12:02 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA05832; Wed, 5 May 1999 00:11:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 00:11:28 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990505030320.00810a90@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 03:03:20 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990504180023.238703c2@earthlink.net> References: <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"2D3ym.0.zQ1.Wy-Bt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10234 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: To David, Stefan, Rick, Kyle, and atg0317, and All: At 06:00 PM 05/04/99, Dave Dameron wrote: > >Interesting article by Rick Anderson and toroid experiments! Some comments: >You could hang the toroids by the lead wires like a pendulum. The movement >would be horizontal, not against gravity, but small forces and deflections >could be measured. The effect of the earth's magnetic field could be tested. > >I wonder if pulsed currents are required? Of course 40 Volts DC would burn >out the small windings you have described. > >If it works with ferromagnetic cores, but not air cores, the core is >producing tha vast majority of the A and B fields. This would seem to imply >that this effect could also be seen with toroid permanent magnets poled >like with a normal toroidal winding. > David will be pleased [I am sure], to discover that Thomas Phipps Jr. Phd, author of 'Heretical Verities', recently and successfully performed this very experiment [last year] using two pair of identical horseshoe magnets, and his results were published in several alt-sci journals, including a write-up in issue #25 of the Journal of Electric Spacecraft. The force was identified by Phipps as an Amperian force. His Hall probe measurement of a significantly small leakage of magnetic field (only at the joints) was noted, and it removed all doubt that these force measurements arose from any magnetic effects. The magnetic leakage forces were too small by at least 5X to account for his force results. Angular force measurements were also recorded while one of the toroids was rotated through 360 degrees. These also supported Ampere's formulae. This effect was not due to leakage magnetism, nor was it from any magnetic interaction with the earth's field or with any ferromagnetic material in his lab. The experiment was strong and unequivocal, very simple to replicate, and it tends to slap "mainstream" scientists in the face for being asleep at the switch for the last 175 years. Since Amperian current elements within a permanent magnet are considered "virtual", he has labelled this the Virtual Amperian Current Element {VACE}. He claims that this experiment was predictable from Amperian theory (but not Lorentz ) and that it unequivocally shows the superiority of the Amperian force law over the Lorentz force law, and that Physics therefore must now be rewritten. I am amazed as he that this experiment has been ignored, but he reported that mainstream journals all totally rejected publishing it. (I guess experiment no longer has any place or meaning within mainstream science..) The capacitor discharge - toroid experiments [described here] create an A field [or VACE] that accelerates with time-- a second order, so to speak, and I naturally would be interested in what additional effects might arise from using this "alternating current" version of Phipps' experiment, so I do hope they will continue.. I also like David's idea of using a single cone shaped toroid to test Rick's Anderson's theory. Btw, the VACE [or 'A' field] might be directed through a circle [or super-toroid] by neck-lacing a series of those toroids to a larger toroid shape-- but I wonder what kind of field we would find arising in the center of that (?) Thank heavens we still have experimenters. (-- greatly appreciated. ) Colin Quinney :) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 03:23:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA17936; Wed, 5 May 1999 03:23:16 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 03:23:16 -0700 Message-Id: <199905051023.UAA12072@lebunka.ion.com.au> From: "Pop" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 22:10:08 Subject: Re: Negre air-motor Reply-to: pop79@altavista.net Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.40 Resent-Message-ID: <"EIdoJ1.0.6O4.Jm1Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10236 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I've seen that in the news...AFAIK it is already being used in Mexico city. On 3 May 99 at 20:35, freenrg-l@eskimo.com wrote: > Hi everybody, > > I don't know of this is a topic for this list but I have a question > about it. > Does somebody know something (URL?) about an air-motor invented by a > Frenchman, called Guy Negre? I have seen his motor 2 times on a Dutch > and German TV channel a few months ago. > In the past Guy Negre has designed Renault (?) and fomula 1 engines. The > motor is build in a small car, designed by his son. There are plans to > use this car as a taxi in Mexico-city. > > Sincerely, > WJ > > > > > _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Pop, in an uncontrolled environment Email: pop@ion.com.au (ISP) pop79@altavista.net (forwarded, prefered) pop79@mailexcite.com (backup) WWW: http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/nova/229/index.htm _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 03:23:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA17910; Wed, 5 May 1999 03:23:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 03:23:14 -0700 Message-Id: <199905051023.UAA11856@lebunka.ion.com.au> From: "Pop" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 22:07:59 Subject: Re: 13 (or 7?) Reply-to: pop79@altavista.net Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.40 Resent-Message-ID: <"KtiGd.0.lN4.Im1Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10235 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: SEVEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!! Quote from Sienfeld. On 3 May 99 at 16:21, freenrg-l@eskimo.com wrote: > In a message dated 5/2/99 11:15:18 PM Pacific Daylight Time, > Grod123456@aol.com writes: > > << The only comment I have about this subject is that I'm sure we could come > up > with 20 different things relating to ANY NUMBER !! > Rod >> > > True -- However a few years ago I ran across an interesting calculation > involving the earth, moon and energy/momentum which one could use to assert > that the number 7 is unique. > Details are at http://members.aol.com/keasy/seven.html for anyone interested. _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Pop, in an uncontrolled environment Email: pop@ion.com.au (ISP) pop79@altavista.net (forwarded, prefered) pop79@mailexcite.com (backup) WWW: http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/nova/229/index.htm _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 05:22:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA04891; Wed, 5 May 1999 05:22:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 05:22:01 -0700 Message-Id: <199905051221.WAA01112@lebunka.ion.com.au> From: "Pop" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 20:51:28 Subject: Water car Reply-to: pop79@altavista.net Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.40 Resent-Message-ID: <"mP115.0.KC1.fV3Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10237 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Anyone got anything to say about running a car off water... I still need to research this...cant seem to get my greasy hands on some stainless steel, and I have slight doubts about standard tap water electrical conductivity. Anyone got anything? Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeease? On 4 May 99 at 23:07, freenrg-l@eskimo.com wrote: > http://www.necnp.org/aircar.htm > > A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this ! > > Why has nobody invented this earlier ? > > I want it now ! :) > > Regards, Stefan. _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Pop, in an uncontrolled environment Email: pop@ion.com.au (ISP) pop79@altavista.net (forwarded, prefered) pop79@mailexcite.com (backup) WWW: http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/nova/229/index.htm _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 05:52:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA13159; Wed, 5 May 1999 05:51:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 05:51:52 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:50:54 EDT Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"yBgQU3.0.MD3.ex3Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10238 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/5/99 12:13:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time, quinney@inforamp.net writes: << David will be pleased [I am sure], to discover that Thomas Phipps Jr. Phd, author of 'Heretical Verities', recently and successfully performed this very experiment [last year] using two pair of identical horseshoe magnets, and his results were published in several alt-sci journals, including a write-up in issue #25 of the Journal of Electric Spacecraft. The force was identified by Phipps as an Amperian force. His Hall probe measurement of a significantly small leakage of magnetic field (only at the joints) was noted, and it removed all doubt that these force measurements arose from any magnetic effects. The magnetic leakage forces were too small by at least 5X to account for his force results. Angular force measurements were also recorded while one of the toroids was rotated through 360 degrees. These also supported Ampere's formulae. This effect was not due to leakage magnetism, nor was it from any magnetic interaction with the earth's field or with any ferromagnetic material in his lab. The experiment was strong and unequivocal, very simple to replicate, and it tends to slap "mainstream" scientists in the face for being asleep at the switch for the last 175 years. Since Amperian current elements within a permanent magnet are considered "virtual", he has labelled this the Virtual Amperian Current Element {VACE}. He claims that this experiment was predictable from Amperian theory (but not Lorentz ) and that it unequivocally shows the superiority of the Amperian force law over the Lorentz force law, and that Physics therefore must now be rewritten. I am amazed as he that this experiment has been ignored, but he reported that mainstream journals all totally rejected publishing it. (I guess experiment no longer has any place or meaning within mainstream science..) >> Does anyone know if the details of this experiment are available anywhere on the web? Ken From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 06:43:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA27868; Wed, 5 May 1999 06:41:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 06:41:32 -0700 Message-ID: <373049EB.66C4D6B2@ihug.co.nz> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 01:38:51 +1200 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? References: <000f01be966a$73813560$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"D54s01.0.Jp6.Ag4Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10239 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: How much current do you expect is going through that coil, Have you tried it on a horizontal axis, and have you tried flat DC or pulsed DC? The experiment is very promising indeed! atg0317 wrote: > -----Original Message----- > From: atg0317 > To: harti@harti.com > Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 2:58 PM > Subject: Re: Magnetic levitation ? > > >From: Stefan Hartmann > >To: Free Energy ; JNaudin509@aol.com > > > >Date: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 9:35 AM > >Subject: Magnetic levitation ? > > > > > >> > >>Hi, > >>does everybody agree, > >>that the magnetic equal effect to JL Naudin´s > >>electrostatic levitation effect might be this ? > >> > >>http://www.tricountyi.net/~randerse/ortho1.htm > >> > >>Regards, Stefan. > >> > >>-- > >>Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann > >>Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany > >>Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 > >>email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com > >>http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! > >> > > > >Stefan! > > > >Went and looked at the above site and thought that by an off chance we > could > >try to see if the idea could be tested. > > > >I wound two small toroids and fastened them together with a small plastic > >wire tie. A 16,000uf cap was charged to 40vdc at which point it was > >discharged through the coils (connected in parallel). The coils wire > >suspended by their wires about 0.5mm above a wood block. The suspending > >wires allowed for a spring action. In other words they would with a slight > >movement bounce up and down and then settle above the wood block. > > > >There is a very decided movement when the cap is discharged through the > >coils. Depending on the polarity it is initially up or down. Because of the > >wire spring action this can be seen without trouble. > > > >I insured that no vibration took place during the discharge and the > >experiment is repeatable over and over again. There is a very real force > >present in this configuration. > > > >The two toroids were wound with #26 AWG magnet wire. These coils are small, > >the biggest is only 12mm Dia. > > > >Very interesting, although the input power is very extreme for this first > >try configuration. > > > >A (.jpg) picture of the coils is included. > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Name: Mvc-002s.jpg > Mvc-002s.jpg Type: JPEG Image (image/jpeg) > Encoding: base64 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 07:06:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA05682; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:05:19 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 07:05:19 -0700 Message-ID: <37303AD0.1C1FB8C8@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 15:34:24 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? References: <000a01be9683$f8b2c460$1a1bfea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OZEaZ.0.hO1.U05Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10240 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > > No! No movement when one coil is fired only. This makes no difference which > coil is fired. The coils do not move at all when only one is excited. Great! This show importance of the differential experimenting methodology which is missing on J.Naudin experiments. An other encouraging experiment is to check is there any non electrical, non magnetic anomaly act to non conductive, low-dilectric and having low susceptibility in the vortex of the setup. Maybe paraffin with k=2.1 dielectric constant, or polystyrene (k=2.55) could be a good nominee. It would also useful to duplicate the experiment in nullified or increased magnetic field. Some strong permanent magnets at distance could be used to neutralize the earth magnetic field. It would be important because the strong magnetic flux flowing trou gh the toroidal core is actually saturating the core and the ferromagnetic material may react in a different manner to earth magnetic field. I am going to build a setup to test the phenomenon. Regards, hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 07:07:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA06571; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:06:55 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 07:06:55 -0700 Message-ID: <00c501be9700$9c929980$cb2afea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 09:06:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"FKLWZ.0.ac1._15Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10241 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Quinney To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 2:13 AM Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? >To David, Stefan, Rick, Kyle, and atg0317, and All: > > >David will be pleased [I am sure], to discover that Thomas Phipps Jr. Phd, >author of 'Heretical Verities', recently and successfully performed this So what is Thomas Phillips doing now, or do you know ? Wonder if he is moving forward on this or considers it a done deal ? > >replicate, and it tends to slap "mainstream" scientists in the face for >being asleep at the switch for the last 175 years. > I don't really think so. Maybe open science, but something this easy to get results from and the overall implications are to staggering that this has not been in a dirty old book until Phillips last year. If I'm wrong then I will really need to adjust my view. >publishing it. (I guess experiment no longer has any place or meaning >within mainstream science..) > To a large extent. This can bee seen by watching various lists. A couple of years back in frustration I called everyone 'Arm Chair Scientists', just sitting around and thinking waiting for someone to post a great discovery. Then those that DO NOT! want discovery in the mainstream as it upsets to many soft positions from which retirement is the goal. Boy am I in trouble again, why did I open my big mouth again. >The capacitor discharge - toroid experiments [described here] create an A >field [or VACE] that accelerates with time-- a second order, so to speak, >and I naturally would be interested in what additional effects might arise >from using this "alternating current" version of Phipps' experiment, so I >do hope they will continue.. > The bottom line as I look at this is what is the goal ? I (we) are not in pure research and have nowhere near the funds to follow this line. In fact we can't see a goal that hasn't the very real possibility of already having been met. > >Thank heavens we still have experimenters. (-- greatly appreciated. ) > I did decide that some additional work will be done, although it may not be over a shedule that will profit the list. Because of the lab setup and our ultimate goal we may not even be able to contribute much of true scientific value. >Colin Quinney :) > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 07:11:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA11764; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:11:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 07:11:26 -0700 Message-ID: <373050F5.8148DD83@ihug.co.nz> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 02:08:53 +1200 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... References: <372FB2C5.D6BDE8D6@sunherald.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"tVAXO.0.ft2.E65Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10242 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I'm not sure I understand this, a noninductive coil works but it depends of the electrical polarity? And in what way could this be anything but anomalous? "Kyle R. Mcallister" wrote: > Then, I wound a noninductive coil from the same wire, > and connected it to the cap bank. It too thrusted, and showed the same > decreasing oscillations. So right now, I cannot confirm that there is > any anomalous thrusting effect present. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 07:20:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA19623; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:20:10 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 07:20:10 -0700 Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:19:47 -0600 (MDT) From: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" X-Sender: jdo@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca To: mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor In-Reply-To: <372F525E.1773384@elektro.fontys.nl> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"0vcjD2.0.Wo4.QE5Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10243 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Is anyone doing serious investigation of the above? Jorg Ostrowski _____________________________________________________________________ On Tue, 4 May 1999 mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl wrote: > Thanks for your links. > > Look at this site : http://www.necnp.org/aircar.htm > Some quotes : > > "...his air driven engine mounted in a Citroen AX chassis ran for 10 hours with a top speed > of about 100 kmh. That is a better performance than any electric car in production." > > "Sixteen patents have been taken out to cover an integrated system in which 300 litres of > compressed air can be pumped into the tank under high pressure in three minutes." > > "While the air is free, the electricity used to refuel the tank at home would cost less than > $2. " > > Speciaal voor jou Aris : > "The car is being studied by other countries, including the NETHERLANDS, because it can also > clean up air that has been polluted by petrol vehicles. " > > Sincerly, > WJ > > Aris schreef: > > > Some links > > > > http://www.calstart.org/resources/forum/messages/messages/508.html > > http://nscp.snap.com/search/directory/results/1,61,nscp-0,00.html?keyword=guy+negre&tag= > > tt.ns.sb1 > > > > Regards, > > Aris > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 07:58:38 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA02556; Wed, 5 May 1999 07:57:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 07:57:40 -0700 Message-ID: <37307799.32639BF4@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 09:53:45 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... References: <372FB2C5.D6BDE8D6@sunherald.infi.net> <373050F5.8148DD83@ihug.co.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Y3lGE2.0.nd.an5Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10244 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: John Berry wrote: > > I'm not sure I understand this, a noninductive coil works but it depends of > the electrical polarity? And in what way could this be anything but > anomalous? No, you misunderstand. I never saw any direction reversal in the thrusting. Just a bouncing effect. I replaced the toroid assembly with the noninductive coil, and tested. The same thrusting was seen. I think this would indicate it is a reaction between the wires of the device. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 08:19:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA12995; Wed, 5 May 1999 08:17:09 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:17:09 -0700 Message-ID: <37305FF0.1D618AA0@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 18:12:48 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: vortex , freenrg , Torsion List Subject: The Correlation Between Gravitation and Electromagnetism, Inertia and Unification (physics/9905003) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ki8pK3.0.jA3.q36Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10245 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: http://xxx.lanl.gov/abs/physics/9905003 Hi, This is second paper of Fran De Aquino which appeared on LANL archive the first one was The Gravitational Spacecraft (http://xxx.lanl.gov/abs/physics/9904018) that I announced earlier. Apologize for cross list posting. hamdi ucar Physics, abstract physics/9905003 From: "Maranhao State University" Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 22:43:03 GMT (220kb,H) The Correlation Between Gravitation and Electromagnetism, Inertia and Unification Author: Fran De Aquino (Maranhao State University, Brazil) Comments: 9 pages, E-mail : deaquino@elo.com.br Subj-class: General Physics We show that gravitational mass and inertial mass are correlated by an adimentional factor, which in specific electromagnetic conditions, can be reduced, nullified, negated, and increased. Some theoretical consequences of the mentioned correlation are: the generalization of Newton=92s second law for the motion (New law for Inertia); the deduction of the differential equation for entropy (second law of Thermodynamics); unification of gravitational and electromagnetic interactions . Paper: Source (220kb), HTML From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 08:57:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA29759; Wed, 5 May 1999 08:56:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:56:05 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990505114757.00b1d750@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 11:47:57 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <00c501be9700$9c929980$cb2afea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"bS1ac1.0.uG7.Le6Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10246 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 09:06 AM 05/05/99 -0500, atg0317 wrote: > >So what is Thomas Phillips doing now, or do you know ? > >Wonder if he is moving forward on this or considers it a done deal ? > I spoke with Thomas Phipps briefly, several weeks ago when ordering his book. He is in his later years-- retired with a lab at his home.. He mentioned that the VACE experiment had not been originally suggested by himself and that it had also been replicated by an experimenter in Argentina who had used an unbroken magnet toroid-- perhaps using a small alnico speaker magnet, directionally re-magnetized. Dr Phipps has also successfully replicated a Marinov motor, but he does not believe the operational mechanisms are the same. I didn't inquire if he was continuing the VACE experiment (directly) but I got the impression that he was waiting for a source of unbroken magnet toroid of optimal shape. I contacted a magnet manufacturer myself, but the magnetic engineer whom I spoke with told me that I would pretty-well have to manufacture one for myself-- and then wished me, "have a nice day"... :-( (This was a similar response to that which Thomas Phipps has been receiving from many.) >> >>replicate, and it tends to slap "mainstream" scientists in the face for >>being asleep at the switch for the last 175 years. >> >I don't really think so. Maybe open science, but something this easy to get >results from and the overall implications are to staggering that this has >not been in a dirty old book until Phillips last year. > >If I'm wrong then I will really need to adjust my view. Yes-- In the sense that much of science is based on Lorentz-- General Relativity, Electrodynamics, etc. The longitudinal force is not predicted by the Lorentz force, but it is with Ampere. Perhaps we all need to adjust our view, but it is not easy. And don't shoot me. I'm just the messenger. I hope I have put everything down correctly. > >>The capacitor discharge - toroid experiments [described here] create an A >>field [or VACE] that accelerates with time-- a second order, so to speak, >>and I naturally would be interested in what additional effects might arise >>from using this "alternating current" version of Phipps' experiment, so I >>do hope they will continue.. >> >The bottom line as I look at this is what is the goal ? I (we) are not in >pure research and have nowhere near the funds to follow this line. In fact >we can't see a goal that hasn't the very real possibility of already having >been met. > The goal? Surely you jest.. How can you predict that the study and manipulation of this force will not [sooner or later] yield incredible results? The science has not even reached it's infancy, and magnets are cheap. Are not the excitement and adventure [and romance] of scientific discovery their own rewards? (Or did I read that wrong?) >I did decide that some additional work will be done, although it may not be >over a shedule that will profit the list. Because of the lab setup and our >ultimate goal we may not even be able to contribute much of true scientific >value. > I am grateful for whatever any of you submit regarding your experiments. (What is your ultimate goal?) The beautiful thing about using the permanent magnet toroids though, [with B field totally enclosed], is that the results can be measured unequivocally. You do not have to concern yourself about 2nd order transient effects from cap. discharge / electromagnet toroids, or from the lead in wires, or if there is an interaction with the earth's magnetic field. The confidence level goes up with unbroken magnet toroids, and further experiments can then proceed. A psychological factor of confidence is definitely involved. Are there any PM engineers on the list? Colin Quinney :) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 10:00:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA16865; Wed, 5 May 1999 09:58:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 09:58:22 -0700 Message-ID: <001e01be9718$9399ebe0$cb2afea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 11:59:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"DLkpg3.0.M74.kY7Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10248 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Quinney To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 11:02 AM Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? >At 09:06 AM 05/05/99 -0500, atg0317 wrote: >> >>So what is Thomas Phillips doing now, or do you know ? >> >>Wonder if he is moving forward on this or considers it a done deal ? >> > >I spoke with Thomas Phipps briefly, several weeks ago when ordering his >book. He is in his later years-- Well I really don't know about you, but I'm in the same boat 'later years', not that many left unless somegreat life extender is found, but them we need a way of bringing back all the knowledge we have lost over the years. >retired with a lab at his home.. Well I have both and am therefore semi-retired. > >I didn't inquire if he was continuing the VACE experiment (directly) but I >got the impression that he was waiting for a source of unbroken magnet >toroid of optimal shape. I contacted a magnet manufacturer myself, but the >magnetic engineer whom I spoke with told me that I would pretty-well have >to manufacture one for myself-- and then wished me, "have a nice day"... >:-( >(This was a similar response to that which Thomas Phipps has been receiving >from many.) > I have done work with a great company in AZ which will attempt to build just what you want 'If You Pay'. They even said they would try to biuld a hollow toroid if we wished. (Now isn't that a thought?) >The goal? >Surely you jest.. How can you predict that the study and manipulation of >(Or did I read that wrong?) > Yes! You read it wrong or my way of putting was evasive. We have a goal now, which has nothing to do with this type of effect, earth shattering or not. It's not felt that ramping up both lab equipment and knowledge base could be offer much at this point i n this area. > >I am grateful for whatever any of you submit regarding your experiments. >(What is your ultimate goal?) Without opening a can of worms and starting heavy list traffic, let s say that if someone carries the toroid work on and creates a device which requires power, we would hope to have a device to supply that power. > >Colin Quinney :) > I will place the information on the atgroup web site within the next 24hrs. The content will be what was done, observed, equipment used and whatever measurements are available now and if we do more I will see that it is added. Understand this information many be heavy into error content and basement science. http://www.atgroup.org/electron.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 10:09:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA20548; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:06:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 10:06:33 -0700 Message-ID: <37307AEC.130225DE@harti.com> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 19:07:56 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Newman-L Mailing List , Free Energy Subject: Re:Delivery of =?iso-8859-1?Q?Newman=B4s?= machine... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"DL92H3.0.z05.Pg7Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10249 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Tufmony@aol.com wrote: > > A word to the wise: > > Gee, I hope Mr. Newman realizes selling books about an idea, theory, or > otherwise is one thing, but making promises, and taking folk's money and not > delivering is yet another. > > And, on top of all that, he is making claims (violation of established laws > of physics) of an extraordinary nature. If he doesn't deliver, agreement or > not, the authorities will have a free-for-all under a fraud claim and he > could spend a few years in jail. > > I'd like to believe, but, no physically creditable proof (prototype with > generator attached) has been demonstrated to substantiate the feasibility of > the proposed unit. To give one's money under these circumstances is just > simply foolish. > > Evan, I know you are Joe's friend, and I have commended you for being a loyal > advocate on his behalf...but, I would certainly be careful if I were you. > You have consistently demonstrated your association with him and helped to > promote this whole process via the Internet and otherwise. Wire fraud is no > small charge. > > Finally, although Joe has promised refunds to those whom a motor is not > delivered, it is hard to refund something you don't have...If he is spending > the money on himself or using it to further research in order to refine a > prototype, and such prototype is never developed, (IN A REASONABLE AMOUNT OF > TIME), or does not perform as anticipated, those good trusting thinking folks > could turn into good trusting thinking plaintiffs, with you, Joe, and his > wife in tow. > > Ben Hi Ben and all, I couldn´t have said this better. I will never again trust somebody and send him money in advance, cause I was already "burned" by Greg Watson, who also did NOT refund and disappeared with the money from about 25 people who trusted him ! And he was even willing to show more than Joe Newman seems to be willing to release in this moment... So my advice, be very cautious, also if it looks pretty good and never pay in advance. The same goes with RQM from Switzerland who are now almost bankrupt... How many believers did they "burn" ?? Regards, Stefan. > > Evan Wrote: > > Dear Stefan, > > > > I have no idea regarding the status of the Motor/Generator. Joe > > has stated > > to me that progress is ongoing, but I do not know the details. I do know > > that -- in part as a result of the documented injustices done to him > > throughout his patent struggles [& as featured on the A&E Network] -- Joe > > is reluctant to disclose details to me over the telephone since > > he does not > > have total confidence in the security and privacy of the telephone system. > > And, as far as that goes, the only people that have a "need" to know > > specifics are those individuals who have specifically contracted with Joe > > for motor/generator production. As such, those individuals are welcome to > > contact Joe themselves, and they and Joe can communicate how and when they > > deem appropriate. > > > > Joe has stated (as has previously been posted) that if he does not secure > > sufficient deposits to fund production, that he will give those who have > > sent deposits the option of a refund of deposit or a continuation of the > > deposit pending production of the technology. In that case, it will be up > > to Joe and each individual depositor to arrange a mutually satisfactory > > renegotiation of the production contract. > > > > Regards, > > > > Evan Soule' > > > > > > > > -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 10:19:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA25673; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:16:20 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 10:16:20 -0700 Message-ID: <37307D4A.22ECD2A6@harti.com> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 19:18:02 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... X-Priority: 2 (High) References: <372FB2C5.D6BDE8D6@sunherald.infi.net> <373050F5.8148DD83@ihug.co.nz> <37307799.32639BF4@sunherald.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"R7HkF2.0.2H6.ap7Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10250 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: "Kyle R. Mcallister" wrote: > > John Berry wrote: > > > > I'm not sure I understand this, a noninductive coil works but it depends of > > the electrical polarity? And in what way could this be anything but > > anomalous? > > No, you misunderstand. I never saw any direction reversal in the > thrusting. Just a bouncing effect. I replaced the toroid assembly with > the noninductive coil, and tested. The same thrusting was seen. I think > this would indicate it is a reaction between the wires of the device. > Or it is a scalar wave action ! Get the scalar field demo software from Rick Anderson and have a look ! Get it here: http://www.tricountyi.net/~randerse/qbmenu.htm Regards, Stefan. > Kyle R. Mcallister -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 10:25:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA30590; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:24:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 10:24:26 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990505131616.00a3a460@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 13:16:16 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <001e01be9718$9399ebe0$cb2afea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Zcdzd3.0.tT7.Ax7Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10251 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 11:59 AM 05/05/99 -0500, atg0317 wrote: > >I will place the information on the atgroup web site within the next 24hrs. >The content will be what was done, observed, equipment used and whatever >measurements are available now and if we do more I will see that it is >added. Understand this information many be heavy into error content and >basement science. > >http://www.atgroup.org/electron.htm > We're looking forward to it. Thanks. Colin Quinney From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 10:26:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA10120; Wed, 5 May 1999 09:56:09 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 09:56:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990505124613.0085f870@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 12:46:13 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Water car In-Reply-To: <199905051221.WAA01112@lebunka.ion.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"-eiap1.0.zT2.dW7Ct"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10247 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 08:51 PM 05/05/99, pop79 wrote: >Anyone got anything to say about running a car off water... > Eagle Research (Eric Wiseman) has a page regarding water as an fuel additive for increased gas mileage, etc: and on his "News" Page, there is mention of an upcoming Release (in May) about Brown's/Rhode's Gas that sounds rather interesting... E.W: "BROWN'S GAS: There's been a breakthrough in Brown's Gas technology! A full report will be on the website in What is Brown's Gas?, hopefully during May 1999. This redefines the gas, which will help the development of the technology." Colin Quinney From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 10:29:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA00888; Wed, 5 May 1999 10:29:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 10:29:22 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990505132110.00a37b50@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 13:21:10 -0700 To: From: Quinney Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <001e01be9718$9399ebe0$cb2afea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"VdYQ53.0.gD.n_7Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10252 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 11:59 AM 05/05/99 -0500, you wrote: > >Well I have both and am therefore semi-retired. I am also retired, but no lab. (yet) > >I have done work with a great company in AZ which will attempt to build just what you want 'If You Pay'. They even said they would try to biuld a hollow toroid if we wished. (Now isn't that a thought?) > Please give me the contact, and I'll check their prices for PM toroids. Thanks. Best Regards, Colin Quinney From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 11:07:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA14246; Wed, 5 May 1999 11:07:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 11:07:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199905051807.UAA09943@poindexter.wirehub.nl> From: "Aris" To: Subject: Re: Negre air-motor Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:54:20 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OxRxk.0.UU3.LZ8Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10253 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > Is anyone doing serious investigation of the above? Jorg Ostrowski > > > > Look at this site : http://www.necnp.org/aircar.htm > > Some quotes : > > > > > > Speciaal voor jou Aris : > > "The car is being studied by other countries, including the NETHERLANDS, because it can also > > clean up air that has been polluted by petrol vehicles. " > > > > Sincerly, > > WJ It looks like they are investigating it in the NETHERLANDS but I don't have any idea who and where? I am surfing and sending some mails and will keep you informed.... Regards, Aris From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 12:29:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA07577; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:28:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:28:54 -0700 Message-ID: <001901be972d$512a4600$d739b5cc@s.boster> From: "S. Boster" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:27:26 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"6H15h2.0.Es1.sl9Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10254 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >>At 09:06 AM 05/05/99 -0500, atg0317 wrote: > >I have done work with a great company in AZ which will attempt to build just what you want 'If You Pay'. They even said they would try to biuld a hollow toroid if we wished. (Now isn't that a thought?) > Could this company be in Tempe, AZ? I have a client who is right across the street from such a company. What is the name? scott@spectrapure.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 12:45:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA13807; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:44:43 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:44:43 -0700 Message-ID: <001101be972f$d16ea8e0$cb2afea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 14:45:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"anrjS3.0.eN3.g-9Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10255 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: -----Original Message----- From: Quinney To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 12:33 PM Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? >At 11:59 AM 05/05/99 -0500, you wrote: >> >>Well I have both and am therefore semi-retired. > >I am also retired, but no lab. (yet) > >> >>I have done work with a great company in AZ which will attempt to build >just what you want 'If You Pay'. They even said they would try to biuld a >hollow toroid if we wished. (Now isn't that a thought?) >> > >Please give me the contact, and I'll check their prices for PM toroids. > >Thanks. > > > >Best Regards, >Colin Quinney > Sorry they are not in AZ, that is their name, following is their web address. http://www.futuremag.net/Hm_azi.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 12:46:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA13967; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:45:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:45:32 -0700 Message-ID: <001601be972f$ed6c2fe0$cb2afea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 14:46:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"qjn-61.0.8Q3.S_9Ct"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10256 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: -----Original Message----- From: S. Boster To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 2:35 PM Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? > >>>At 09:06 AM 05/05/99 -0500, atg0317 wrote: >> >>I have done work with a great company in AZ which will attempt to build >just what you want 'If You Pay'. They even said they would try to biuld >a hollow toroid if we wished. (Now isn't that a thought?) >> > >Could this company be in Tempe, AZ? I have a client >who is right across the street from such a company. >What is the name? > >scott@spectrapure.com > > > I screwed up they are called AZ, here is their web address. http://www.futuremag.net/Hm_azi.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 12:55:28 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA18278; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:53:38 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:53:38 -0700 Posted-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 22:50:58 +0400 (MEDT) Message-ID: <37309F5D.F727DB44@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 22:43:25 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? References: <000f01be966a$73813560$485ffea9@y9g6r3> <372F74B2.62FFD55B@verisoft.com.tr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"EM_7c.0.VT4.17ACt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10257 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi atg0317 and all, I have an other (silly) idea! Every motor is generator. Of course not! But it may worth to try if the 2 toroidal setup react to inertial effect. Kick it and see any voltage be induced on. On this setup, the coils (still on parallel) would be driven by an constant current source (0.5-2 Amps.) Mmay a single xistor circuit is enough. It would be funny if it works. It would be the most misused application for such a space propulsion technology: an accelerometer! hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 12:55:51 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA19018; Wed, 5 May 1999 12:55:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:55:04 -0700 Message-ID: <3730BD4A.BBAF35BD@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 14:51:06 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Phase changing of 120V Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"e0L9e1.0.ue4.N8ACt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10258 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: All: If anyone here knows of a simple way to change a 120VAC 60Hz current to a 180 degrees phase shifted signal, or maybe just invert it, please describe it to me. I need to set it up so that when one signal is at peak +, the other is at peak -. I believe there is a term for this, but I can't recall it at this time...I will need the current to be at least 2A. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 13:13:15 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA25700; Wed, 5 May 1999 13:10:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 13:10:54 -0700 Message-Id: <199905052011.RAA04263@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 17:11:20 -2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Phase changing of 120V Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3730BD4A.BBAF35BD@sunherald.infi.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Resent-Message-ID: <"2ZP462.0.TH6.DNACt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10259 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > All: > > If anyone here knows of a simple way to change a 120VAC 60Hz current to > a 180 degrees phase shifted signal, or maybe just invert it, please > describe it to me. I need to set it up so that when one signal is at > peak +, the other is at peak -. I believe there is a term for this, but > I can't recall it at this time...I will need the current to be at least > 2A. > > Kyle R. Mcallister > Huuumm..... How about a 1:1 transformer ? --- Marcelo Puhl mark@plug-in.com.br From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 14:26:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA17667; Wed, 5 May 1999 14:24:47 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 14:24:47 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.01 (295) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 11:22:34 -1000 Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... From: "Rick Monteverde" To: freenrg Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <199905051741.SM00205@[206.127.240.158]> Resent-Message-ID: <"F-plb3.0.yJ4.USBCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10260 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Stephan - >Or it is a scalar wave action ! > >Get the scalar field demo software from Rick Anderson >and have a look ! > >Get it here: > >http://www.tricountyi.net/~randerse/qbmenu.htm > > >Regards, Stefan. It could be anything, but it's almost certainly magnetic and inductive and/or heat. I saw both effects when I did the experiments a while back. Saw the initial surge which I took to be magnetic, but there was also a slower effect over a few seconds that was apparentlyu heat on the aluminum conductors I was using. Pure aluminum has a fairly high CTE and the 2'+ #6 wires were simply bending with the heat. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 15:12:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA16530; Wed, 5 May 1999 15:12:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 15:12:01 -0700 Message-ID: <000601be9744$643f6880$cb2afea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 17:12:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"X5xzo1.0.A24.n8CCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10261 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: -----Original Message----- From: Rick Monteverde To: freenrg Date: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 4:32 PM Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... >Stephan - > >>Or it is a scalar wave action ! >> >>Get the scalar field demo software from Rick Anderson >>and have a look ! >> >>Get it here: >> >>http://www.tricountyi.net/~randerse/qbmenu.htm >> >> >>Regards, Stefan. > > >It could be anything, but it's almost certainly magnetic and inductive >and/or heat. I saw both effects when I did the experiments a while back. Saw >the initial surge which I took to be magnetic, but there was also a slower >effect over a few seconds that was apparentlyu heat on the aluminum >conductors I was using. Pure aluminum has a fairly high CTE and the 2'+ #6 >wires were simply bending with the heat. > >- Rick Monteverde >Honolulu, HI > I'm unaware of your test, although a simple question ? Did you observe this deflection to be vertical ? And did the initial deflection change with polarity (direction of current through the coils ? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 15:17:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA16863; Wed, 5 May 1999 15:13:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 15:13:07 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990505135058.23878fc8@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 13:50:58 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990505030320.00810a90@inforamp.net> References: <3.0.6.16.19990504180023.238703c2@earthlink.net> <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"BEPbT2.0.K74.o9CCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10262 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all, At 03:03 AM 5/5/99 -0700, Colin wrote: >David will be pleased [I am sure], to discover that Thomas Phipps Jr. Phd, >author of 'Heretical Verities', recently and successfully performed this >very experiment [last year] using two pair of identical horseshoe magnets, >and his results were published in several alt-sci journals, including a >write-up in issue #25 of the Journal of Electric Spacecraft. The force was >identified by Phipps as an Amperian force. His Hall probe measurement of a >significantly small leakage of magnetic field (only at the joints) was >noted, and it removed all doubt that these force measurements arose from >any magnetic effects. The magnetic leakage forces were too small by at >least 5X to account for his force results. Angular force measurements were >also recorded while one of the toroids was rotated through 360 degrees. >These also supported Ampere's formulae. > I have the paper "Simulation of Amperian Current elements by Magnetic Toroids" by Thomas Phipps and Jorge Valverde, thanks to Robert Gray. It was published in Summer, 1998 21'st Century and discusses "vace" elements. I would be interested in what the other articles say. I could not find any such articles on-line. One thing I didn't understand is the (virtual) current through the hole of the magnetized toroid is balanced by the return on the outside. The current density in the center is greater, of course, but the force effects, if I understand correctly, just depend on the total current. He also was measuring the force on one toroid on the other, not a net force from the pair. The only thing keeping me from trying it is that an analytical balance is required, the peak forces (delta weights) were about 10mg. His had a resolution of 0.1 mg. >This effect was not due to leakage magnetism, nor was it from any magnetic >interaction with the earth's field or with any ferromagnetic material in >his lab. The experiment was strong and unequivocal, very simple to >replicate, and it tends to slap "mainstream" scientists in the face for >being asleep at the switch for the last 175 years. Apparently the Ampere-Newman forces were used in most of the 19'th century. I have read in a "closed" circuit that one cannot see the differences between Ampere and Lorentz forces. Also that the Ampere forces fid not fit the behavior of an electron beam, so the Lorentz force was "adopted". To eliminate magnetic leakages he did get some special one-piece Alnico toroids. They were 6cm outer diameter, 2cm inner diameter, and 6 cm tall and circularly magnetized. They also followed (better) the Ampere force relations. >Since Amperian current elements within a permanent magnet are considered >"virtual", he has labelled this the Virtual Amperian Current Element >{VACE}. He claims that this experiment was predictable from Amperian theory >(but not Lorentz ) and that it unequivocally shows the superiority of the >Amperian force law over the Lorentz force law, and that Physics therefore >must now be rewritten. I am amazed as he that this experiment has been >ignored, but he reported that mainstream journals all totally rejected >publishing it. (I guess experiment no longer has any place or meaning >within mainstream science..) I wonder if any gave a reason? > >I also like David's idea of using a single cone shaped toroid to test >Rick's Anderson's theory. I have gotten some TV ferrite yoke cores to try soon. > >Btw, the VACE [or 'A' field] might be directed through a circle [or >super-toroid] by neck-lacing a series of those toroids to a larger toroid >shape-- but I wonder what kind of field we would find arising in the center >of that (?) A "reamplified" B field?? My shielded transformer tests last summer seemed to show the A field effects also, as opposed to the B field. > >Thank heavens we still have experimenters. (-- greatly appreciated. ) > >Colin Quinney :) > > -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 16:24:30 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA10896; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:23:53 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 16:23:53 -0700 Message-ID: <01BE9714.2C2F4CB0@iras-4-48.ucdavis.edu> From: Dan Quickert To: "'freenrg-l@eskimo.com'" Subject: Re: Phase changing of 120V Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 16:27:27 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"6FlET.0.9g2.9CDCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10263 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Kyle, how about using a center-tapped secondary? the two 'outside' ends will be 180 apart wrt the center tap Dan Quickert > All: > > If anyone here knows of a simple way to change a 120VAC 60Hz current to > a 180 degrees phase shifted signal, or maybe just invert it, please > describe it to me. I need to set it up so that when one signal is at > peak +, the other is at peak -. I believe there is a term for this, but > I can't recall it at this time...I will need the current to be at least > 2A. > > Kyle R. Mcallister > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 16:47:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA20386; Wed, 5 May 1999 16:46:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 16:46:58 -0700 Message-ID: <3730D71B.836DC297@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 02:41:15 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... References: <199905051741.SM00205@[206.127.240.158]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"-a8lT3.0.M-4.nXDCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10264 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Rick Monteverde wrote: > > > It could be anything, but it's almost certainly magnetic and inductive > and/or heat. I saw both effects when I did the experiments a while back. Saw > the initial surge which I took to be magnetic, but there was also a slower > effect over a few seconds that was apparentlyu heat on the aluminum > conductors I was using. Pure aluminum has a fairly high CTE and the 2'+ #6 > wires were simply bending with the heat. > > - Rick Monteverde > Honolulu, HI There is way to ruling out the heat/deformation possibility: Use repeating millisecond pulses and listen in a appropriate way the mechanical vibration. If vibration occurs, good news. If does not occurs, needed more bright ideas :) Rick, also take account that the effect does not appeared to occurs when only one coil is excited. Of course one possibility (for the positive result) is the final windings around the core had moved (attracted by the core or expelled by the neighbour turns) when the current was applied and this caused the movement. To avoid this windings should be well fixed to the core. Regards, hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 17:09:02 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA26457; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:07:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 17:07:48 -0700 Message-ID: <3730DC7D.7B203FD1@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 03:04:13 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg Subject: A good page about cores and inductors Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"nY7nU1.0.IT6.KrDCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10265 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: http://www.hills2.u-net.com/electron/induct.htm see the home page also. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 18:08:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA10514; Wed, 5 May 1999 18:08:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 18:08:05 -0700 Message-Id: <199905060108.UAA10094@mw2.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: A good page about cores and inductors Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 20:05:26 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"022cA3.0.Ba2.rjECt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10266 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hamdi, this is good, thanks....Joe Portman ================================ ---------- > From: hamdi ucar > To: freenrg > Subject: A good page about cores and inductors > Date: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 7:04 PM > > http://www.hills2.u-net.com/electron/induct.htm > > see the home page also. > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 21:40:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA12126; Wed, 5 May 1999 21:39:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 21:39:33 -0700 From: MKSBoysal@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 00:38:58 EDT Subject: Promised but couldn't delivered free energy Machines: To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id VAA12107 Resent-Message-ID: <"9CSPC1.0.Nz2.5qHCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10267 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: << Hi Folks, After reading the email bellow, I thought you might like to know about the Dennis Lee too, that with false promisees he sold free energy machine dealership to at least 8 retired people that I know of. Amount of $$$ he took ranges from $8.000 to $28.000 and this was more then 8 years a go. With false fabricated hopes in the name of Freedom, Liberty, and Free energy accomplished con-artist knows only so well the weakness of the common people, as fisher man with bait and hooks knows how to pull the fish out of the water. Shame on them, how can they sleep at night with peace??? MKSB.>> << Tufmony@aol.com wrote: > > A word to the wise: > > Gee, I hope Mr. Newman realizes selling books about an idea, theory, or > otherwise is one thing, but making promises, and taking folk's money and not > delivering is yet another. > > And, on top of all that, he is making claims (violation of established laws > of physics) of an extraordinary nature. If he doesn't deliver, agreement or > not, the authorities will have a free-for-all under a fraud claim and he > could spend a few years in jail. > > I'd like to believe, but, no physically creditable proof (prototype with > generator attached) has been demonstrated to substantiate the feasibility of > the proposed unit. To give one's money under these circumstances is just > simply foolish. > > Evan, I know you are Joe's friend, and I have commended you for being a loyal > advocate on his behalf...but, I would certainly be careful if I were you. > You have consistently demonstrated your association with him and helped to > promote this whole process via the Internet and otherwise. Wire fraud is no > small charge. > > Finally, although Joe has promised refunds to those whom a motor is not > delivered, it is hard to refund something you don't have...If he is spending > the money on himself or using it to further research in order to refine a > prototype, and such prototype is never developed, (IN A REASONABLE AMOUNT OF > TIME), or does not perform as anticipated, those good trusting thinking folks > could turn into good trusting thinking plaintiffs, with you, Joe, and his > wife in tow. > > Ben Hi Ben and all, I couldn´t have said this better. I will never again trust somebody and send him money in advance, cause I was already "burned" by Greg Watson, who also did NOT refund and disappeared with the money from about 25 people who trusted him ! And he was even willing to show more than Joe Newman seems to be willing to release in this moment... So my advice, be very cautious, also if it looks pretty good and never pay in advance. The same goes with RQM from Switzerland who are now almost bankrupt... How many believers did they "burn" ?? Regards, Stefan. > > Evan Wrote: > > Dear Stefan, > > > > I have no idea regarding the status of the Motor/Generator. Joe > > has stated > > to me that progress is ongoing, but I do not know the details. I do know > > that -- in part as a result of the documented injustices done to him > > throughout his patent struggles [& as featured on the A&E Network] -- Joe > > is reluctant to disclose details to me over the telephone since > > he does not > > have total confidence in the security and privacy of the telephone system. > > And, as far as that goes, the only people that have a "need" to know > > specifics are those individuals who have specifically contracted with Joe > > for motor/generator production. As such, those individuals are welcome to > > contact Joe themselves, and they and Joe can communicate how and when they > > deem appropriate. > > > > Joe has stated (as has previously been posted) that if he does not secure > > sufficient deposits to fund production, that he will give those who have > > sent deposits the option of a refund of deposit or a continuation of the > > deposit pending production of the technology. In that case, it will be up > > to Joe and each individual depositor to arrange a mutually satisfactory > > renegotiation of the production contract. > > > > Regards, > > > > Evan Soule' > > > > >> From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 5 23:47:59 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA05679; Wed, 5 May 1999 23:47:37 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 23:47:37 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: Free Energy Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 06:47:22 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <37353926.32527647@mail-hub> References: <372F6178.9AFEF12C@harti.com> In-Reply-To: <372F6178.9AFEF12C@harti.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id XAA05651 Resent-Message-ID: <"YuaYn.0.YO1.8iJCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10268 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 04 May 1999 23:07:04 +0200, Stefan Hartmann wrote: >http://www.necnp.org/aircar.htm > >A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this ! > >Why has nobody invented this earlier ? > >I want it now ! :) > >Regards, Stefan. 300 liters at 800 atm is only 9 hp*hr. I.e. 9 hp for one hour. I smell a rat. (Though if my calcs are correct, using liquid nitrogen would triple that). Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 01:30:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA19506; Thu, 6 May 1999 01:30:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 01:30:17 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express for Macintosh - 4.01 (295) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 22:27:36 -1000 Subject: Re: Toroid tests, part two... From: "Rick Monteverde" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <199905060446.SM00205@[206.127.240.158]> Resent-Message-ID: <"HrcCT3.0.hm4.PCLCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10269 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > Did you observe this deflection to be vertical ? It was along the major axis of the toroid. > And did the initial deflection > change with polarity (direction of current through the coils ? Not that I recall. - Rick Monteverde Honolulu, HI From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 01:49:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA22669; Thu, 6 May 1999 01:48:55 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 01:48:55 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 04:52:37 -0400 Message-ID: <19990506085237296.AAA270@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"Om3WW.0.6Y5.sTLCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10270 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Pneumatic motors have been around for a long time. This report is also 11 years old, and there is no such thing as 2 US$ in terms of electrical costs. Costs can vary from region to region as much as 10 cents per kilowatt hour, and can be seasonally priced as well. Even if you triple the output, you are still only getting 27 hp for one hour. All the electrical vehicles that I have seen have 90 horse motors. I was surprised that cars could be driven by that little horsepower, as compared to the 200+ horsepower gas engines. It's a nice picture and everything, but I just don't believe it. Knuke >On Tue, 04 May 1999 23:07:04 +0200, Stefan Hartmann wrote: > >>http://www.necnp.org/aircar.htm >> >>A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this ! >> >>Why has nobody invented this earlier ? >> >>I want it now ! :) >> >>Regards, Stefan. >300 liters at 800 atm is only 9 hp*hr. I.e. 9 hp for one hour. I smell a >rat. >(Though if my calcs are correct, using liquid nitrogen would triple >that). > >Regards, > >Robin van Spaandonk > > Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 04:52:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id EAA31945; Thu, 6 May 1999 04:52:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 04:52:02 -0700 Message-Id: <199905061151.NAA36238@hermes.fontys.nl> From: "w" To: Subject: Re: Negre air-motor Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 13:41:36 +0200 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"TIuYH.0.1p7.Y9OCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10271 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, I found a user forum about electric, natural gas ,etc. cars : http://www.calstart.com/forum/index.html See the "zero-pollution car" messages. They are also searching for more information about the engine. Regards, WJ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 06:18:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA18446; Thu, 6 May 1999 06:17:09 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 06:17:09 -0700 Message-Id: <199905061317.IAA29601@mw2.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 08:14:33 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BBwv93.0.3W4.LPPCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10272 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hey, Knuke, Americans are power hungry...no patience. I have a 23 Maxwell 4 dr convertible that eventually will get up to 50 mph. It has a 12 hp engine. Thought you'd like this trivia. Joe Portman ============ ---------- > From: Michael T Huffman > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! > Date: Thursday, May 06, 1999 3:52 AM > > Pneumatic motors have been around for a long time. This report is also 11 > years old, and there is no such thing as 2 US$ in terms of electrical costs. > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 06:21:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA20496; Thu, 6 May 1999 06:21:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 06:21:13 -0700 Message-Id: <199905061321.IAA18045@mw1.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: Promised but couldn't delivered free energy Machines: Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 08:18:31 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"JuwqB3.0.505.8TPCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10274 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: There's a sucker born every minute.......and hope springs eternal from the human breast. Some of us are just sitting ducks because we trust people. Joe Portman ========== ---------- > From: MKSBoysal@aol.com > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Promised but couldn't delivered free energy Machines: > Date: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 11:38 PM > > << Hi Folks, > After reading the email bellow, I thought you might like to know about the > Dennis Lee too, that with false promisees he sold free energy machine > dealership to at least 8 retired people that I know of. Amount of $$$ he took > ranges from $8.000 to $28.000 and this was more then 8 years a go. With false > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 06:21:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA20445; Thu, 6 May 1999 06:21:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 06:21:03 -0700 Message-ID: <373195D3.3EBA2D13@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 16:14:59 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg Subject: Do not trust toroid coils on RF Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"AB35y3.0.M_4._SPCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10273 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, I wound a toroidal coil with ferrite core, I dont know the type of the core, but it appear a soft material. Final dimensions are 22.4 mm outer 12.4 inner diameter, 11.4 height including the thickness of the 0.50 mm (~24AWG) wire. I first attempted to excite the coil with RF on 30-50 MHz. What I observed show the toroidal coil does not work the same way at LF. I exited the coil with less than 100mW I guess and see the coil emit strong field radially inducting 1 Vpp on a one turn loop. The loop axis is pointing radially to the center of the torus hole. When I coupled a single turn conventionally to the coil (in a regular xformer config) I also obtained 1 Vpp induction. This signal is not constant along the torus but changing phase and amplitude making nodes, which sign that standing waves occurring on t he coil. Back again to radial field, the phase of this radial field also change in phase and amplitude. As conclusion I would say that toroidal coil does not hold the flux inside on RF and on transient, that suggest the experiments about the hypothesis on aether disturbance should be driven by DC or on LF (i.e. 60 Hz) and transients should be avoided. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 06:48:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA32598; Thu, 6 May 1999 06:48:12 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 06:48:12 -0700 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on Linux X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <468fe7c7.24604dce@aol.com> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 09:44:58 -0400 (EDT) Organization: Society for Real Time Sender: chuck@cougar.ssi.stratus.com From: Charlie Hodgson To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: Doomsday 20 years Resent-Message-ID: <"gWAMb2.0.Fz7.SsPCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10275 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On 04-May-99 Bmd2323@aol.com wrote: > I'll tell you what's frightening, what's frightening is that this mailing > list, which is supposed to be about free energy has turned into a mass of > superstition and speculation about things which have no place being discussed > on this list. I had a dream once that I slept with a Playboy Bunny. Does > that mean that someday I'm going to sleep with a Playboy Bunny? No! With that attitude you wont. Many, many important discoveries have been attributed to dreams by their discoverers. If you are so close-minded that you cannot accept the possibility of dreams 'revealing' info, no matter what the actual means, then you ARE in the wrong place. To succeed, you need an open mind. Whether it be dreams, the bible or something read on a cereal box, many things have relevance. When I am working on a project, it's not uncommon for me to walk the aisles of hardware and electronic stores, just looking. It's amazing how a seemingly unrelated item can bring focus and direction and spark additional ideas. Charlie From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 06:52:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA02201; Thu, 6 May 1999 06:51:43 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 06:51:43 -0700 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on Linux X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <00a701be9686$7ebdbae0$8a5dadd1@default> Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 09:48:30 -0400 (EDT) Organization: Society for Real Time Sender: chuck@cougar.ssi.stratus.com From: Charlie Hodgson To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 11 Planets? (was: RE: Dan - Re: 13 ? Ha !) Resent-Message-ID: <"F_01b2.0.IY.lvPCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10276 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On 04-May-99 Jim Shaffer, Jr. wrote: >>isnt Charon some small asteroid or moon of Mars or something? > Charon is the moon of Pluto. Some atronomers feel that Charon should share planetary status with Pluto, since the two appear to orbit each other. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 07:51:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA24780; Thu, 6 May 1999 07:47:42 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 07:47:42 -0700 Message-Id: <199905061447.QAA47594@hermes.fontys.nl> From: "w" To: Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:38:06 +0200 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"zNWEX3.0.536.DkQCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10277 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, The official website : www.zeropollution.com Regards, WJ ---------- > Van: w > Aan: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Onderwerp: Re: Negre air-motor > Datum: donderdag 6 mei 1999 13:41 > > > Hi, > > I found a user forum about electric, natural gas ,etc. cars : > http://www.calstart.com/forum/index.html > See the "zero-pollution car" messages. > They are also searching for more information about the engine. > > Regards, > WJ > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 07:55:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA27273; Thu, 6 May 1999 07:53:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 07:53:48 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 10:46:39 EDT Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"LXVfL2.0.zf6.xpQCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10278 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/5/99 9:59:57 AM Pacific Daylight Time, atg0317@wt.net writes: << I will place the information on the atgroup web site within the next 24hrs. The content will be what was done, observed, equipment used and whatever measurements are available now and if we do more I will see that it is added. Understand this information many be heavy into error content and basement science. http://www.atgroup.org/electron.htm >> The aspect of these experiments that is hardest to understand, I think, is the reversal of the initial movement with the reversal of polarity. A possible explanation would be magnetized material nearby or an interaction with the earth's field (also magnetized material "nearby"?). But Kyle and Rick reported related experiments where the change in initial movement direction with change in polarity was not seen, and it would be useful to understand the differences. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 08:37:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA08269; Thu, 6 May 1999 08:34:34 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 08:34:34 -0700 Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 10:34:27 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: Do not trust toroid coils on RF To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <373195D3.3EBA2D13@verisoft.com.tr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"3Diyy1.0.612.9QRCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10279 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 6 May 1999, hamdi ucar wrote: > Hi, > > I wound a toroidal coil with ferrite core, I dont know the type of the core, but it appear a soft material. Final dimensions are 22.4 mm outer 12.4 inner diameter, 11.4 height including the thickness of the 0.50 mm (~24AWG) wire. > > I first attempted to excite the coil with RF on 30-50 MHz. What I observed show the toroidal coil does not work the same way at LF. > I exited the coil with less than 100mW I guess and see the coil > emit strong field radially inducting 1 Vpp on a one turn loop. The loop axis is pointing radially to the center of the torus hole. > Toroids are commonly of two types - powdered-iron and ferrites. Powdered iron cores are usually color-coded and have more rounded edges. Ferrites are usually not color coded and have sharper edges. Both these materials have limited frequency ranges. The powdered-iron cores have smaller frequency ranges than the ferrites. Powdered-iron cores are used for tuned-circuit designs in oscillators, amplifiers, etc. where a narrow bandwidth and more stability is needed. Ferrites are usually used in broadband amplifier circuits, switching power supplies, RF chokes, etc. Manufacturers supply a range of toroids to cover most frequencies from DC to VHF. But you have to know what material the core is made of. I wouldn't expect a toroid that works at 2 MHz to work well at 60 MHz, and vice versa. If your core appears to be soft, my guess is that it's a powdered-iron core. Ferrites are harder and brittle. I've played the "guessing game" with unknown toroids but never had much luck in accurately calculating what kind of core material they have. You CAN measure the permeability (related to inductance per number of turns and core dimensions) and get an idea of the frequency range they may cover from other manufacturers' specs. Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 08:44:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA11672; Thu, 6 May 1999 08:41:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 08:41:46 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 11:45:30 -0400 Message-ID: <19990506154530953.AAA174@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"X1M2N2.0.Hs2.wWRCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10280 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Hey, Knuke, > Americans are power hungry...no patience. I have a 23 Maxwell 4 dr >convertible that eventually will get up to 50 mph. It has a 12 hp engine. >Thought you'd like this trivia. >Joe Portman >============ Hey, that's all the thrills and spills I can handle, myself, these days. 8^) 23 Skidoo!!! Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 09:41:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA02486; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:40:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:40:48 -0700 Message-ID: <00a701be97df$2c870560$661a0fcb@default> From: "Glenville T. Sawyer" To: Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 02:10:36 +0930 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"Eiknb3.0.lc.GOSCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10281 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Quoth... >Hey, that's all the thrills and spills I can handle, myself, these days. 8^) >23 Skidoo!!! You've had a "Ski-doo" since 1923 !!!! Yeah, and I bet it was Steam powered - Right ?? ( Sorry Keptin - I Could'na resist it )!! Glenville in South Australia, skulking back to my Hydroxy experiments, and thinking about using some of those Toroids that are cluttering up the workshop around here. An occasional break for a giggle helps to restore my "sanity" - if that is what it really is ! Regards. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 09:49:23 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA06655; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:48:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:48:30 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 12:52:14 -0400 Message-ID: <19990506165214015.AAA258@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"1esh93.0.qd1.TVSCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10282 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Ahoy there! Thanks for the links. This is obviously not just another pneumatic motor. It's very encouraging news, actually. Please keep us posted. -Knuke >The official website : www.zeropollution.com >> I found a user forum about electric, natural gas ,etc. cars : >> http://www.calstart.com/forum/index.html Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 09:58:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA11584; Thu, 6 May 1999 09:57:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:57:58 -0700 From: dtmiller@nevia.net (Dean T. Miller) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 16:57:38 GMT Organization: Miller and Associates Reply-To: dtmiller@nevia.net Message-ID: <3732c759.89365626@mail.nevia.net> References: <19990506085237296.AAA270@mail.lcia.com@lizard> In-Reply-To: <19990506085237296.AAA270@mail.lcia.com@lizard> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id JAA11560 Resent-Message-ID: <"jQhsL1.0.tq2.LeSCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10283 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Knuke, Some cars in the 60's had 45 hp or less engines (VW, Renault, Fiat and others come to mind). You sure don't need 200+ hp for a car. Even the 3500 lb Mercedes 190D sedan had a diesel engine that produced only 65 hp. That's still a far cry from 9 (or 27) hp for an hour. On Thu, 6 May 1999 04:52:37 -0400, knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) wrote: >All the electrical vehicles that >I have seen have 90 horse motors. I was surprised that cars could be driven >by that little horsepower, as compared to the 200+ horsepower gas engines. >It's a nice picture and everything, but I just don't believe it. -- Dean -- from (almost) Duh Moines (CDP, KB0ZDF) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 13:49:03 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA30071; Thu, 6 May 1999 13:47:16 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 13:47:16 -0700 From: "Bruce Hegerberg" To: Subject: Re: Doomsday 20 years Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:38:13 -0400 Message-ID: <01be9800$7bfdb8c0$56f843ce@voo.america.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"m08I42.0.iL7.J_VCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10284 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: -----Original Message----- From: Charlie Hodgson To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Thursday, May 06, 1999 9:48 AM Subject: RE: Doomsday 20 years > >On 04-May-99 Bmd2323@aol.com wrote: >> I'll tell you what's frightening, what's frightening is that this mailing >> list, which is supposed to be about free energy has turned into a mass of >> superstition and speculation about things which have no place being discussed >> on this list. I had a dream once that I slept with a Playboy Bunny. Does >> that mean that someday I'm going to sleep with a Playboy Bunny? No! > >With that attitude you wont. Many, many important discoveries have been >attributed to dreams by their discoverers. If you are so close-minded >that you cannot accept the possibility of dreams 'revealing' info, no >matter what the actual means, then you ARE in the wrong place. To succeed, >you need an open mind. Whether it be dreams, the bible or something read >on a cereal box, many things have relevance. > >When I am working on a project, it's not uncommon for me to walk the >aisles of hardware and electronic stores, just looking. It's amazing >how a seemingly unrelated item can bring focus and direction and spark >additional ideas. > >Charlie Hi Charlie Want to see a hardware creation check out my web site. I told Jerry Decker this is how a redneck builds a telescope. http://america.net/~boo/html/sun_gun.html Regards Bruce From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 14:20:51 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA04768; Thu, 6 May 1999 14:20:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 14:20:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199905062120.QAA16901@mw1.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:17:36 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"L-z-x.0.MA1.HUWCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10285 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hey, Knuke, My Maxwell has lost art. For example, it has no water pump and no dipstick to get the ladies dirty..just look through the hood vent at a needle that points to full or empty. Just more trivia... Joe Portman ============ ---------- > From: Michael T Huffman > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! > Date: Thursday, May 06, 1999 10:45 AM > > >Hey, Knuke, > > Americans are power hungry...no patience. I have a 23 Maxwell 4 dr > >convertible that eventually will get up to 50 mph. It has a 12 hp engine. > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 17:24:04 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA18023; Thu, 6 May 1999 17:21:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 17:21:39 -0700 X-Sender: bailey@shell14.ba.best.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 17:20:30 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com (Freengr List) From: pgb@padrak.com (Patrick Bailey) Subject: Cold Fusion: Fire From Water - A New Videotape!!! Copyright 1999. Resent-Message-ID: <"uyey01.0.WP4.I8ZCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10286 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Cold Fusion: Fire From Water A New Videotape!!! Copyright 1999. A Documentary about one of the most controversial scientific discoveries of all time. "I've become convinced, from my original skepticism, to 99% certainty that [cold fusion] is for real. The evidence now is really overwhelming." - Sir Arthur C. Clarke A 70 Minute Videotape, NOW AVAILABLE! See: http://www.infinite-energy.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >From the back of the videotape box: THE BIRTH OF THE WATER FUEL AGE? In this fascinating documentary narrated by James Doohan, "Scotty" of Star Trek fame, find out what happened to the Cold Fusion discovery in the years since the announcement at the University of Utah. On March 23, 1989, respected chemists Drs. Martin Fleischmann and Stanley Pons claimed that a table-top, glass cell filled with heavy water, fitted with a palladium electrode, produced so much heat beyond the power put in that the mysterious energy source had to be nuclear. They said it was probably related to nuclear fusion, which powers the stars. The new "fire" from water could not be coming from ordinary chemical reactions; it was far too much energy. Nuclear reactions in a jar of water, producing heat but no deadly radiation? If the shocking claim was real, the world might have a source of infinite, clean energy from the abundant fusion fuel in all water. Thus began the Cold Fusion controversy, one of the greatest revolutions in the history of science. The facts of Cold Fusion's birth are far more dramatic than any fiction! LEARN THAT... * Cold Fusion is the ultimate renewable energy source. It promises the beginning of a Water Fuel Age early in the 21st Century. * Vested interests in Academia launched a "Cold Fusion War" against the new science that continues to this day. * What Fleischmann and Pons discovered in the mid-1980s was probably merely the tip of an iceberg of a much larger discovery that might be called "Modern Alchemy." * Dozens of scientific theories have been put forth by top scientists to explain Cold Fusion. * Cold Fusion is very much alive. It has been confirmed in hundreds of experiments done in many countries. Commercial activity is underway to develop this revolutionary clean energy source and the other discoveries it inspired...such as the potential to neutralize radioactive waste! * This real discovery will drastically change the world early in the 21st Century. By exploring the history of the discovery and witnessing people working in the field today in laboratories and companies, decide for yourself whether Cold Fusion is one of the greatest discoveries of all time - really a "miracle" in water. "It could be the end of the fossil fuel age: the end of oil and coal. And the end, incidentally, of many of our worries about global pollution and global warming." - Futurist and author, Sir Author C. Clarke. Infinite Energy Magazine P.O. Box 2816 Concord, NH 03302-2816 http://www.infinite-energy.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------ SPECIAL PROMOTION! ------------------ Available postpaid in the U.S. for $34.95 (USD) and Shipped to foreign destination for $44.95 (USD). The Video Tape Promotion Website at http://www.mv.com/ipusers/zeropoint/IEHTML/promos.html includes: * An internet order form (Visa, M/C, AmExp) * A picture of the videotape box * and more information!!! ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 17:32:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA22034; Thu, 6 May 1999 17:31:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 17:31:29 -0700 From: Bmd2323@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 20:22:52 EDT Subject: Re: Doomsday 20 years To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"_eofR1.0.AO5.WHZCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10287 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Charlie, You miss my point entirely. I am not saying uncatagorically that valuable information cannot come from dreams. There are, indeed, a whole host of things which have been discovered thanks to dreams, and the list is probably longer than anyone would suspect because many people would be unwilling to admit that the idea came to them in a dream. My point is this, if someone has a dream which enables them to discover a free energy device, then by all means share it with us. If, however, your dream relates to something totally off topic as a vision of the end of the world, then share it somewhere else. If I were to relate my dream about the Playboy Bunny to the group, I would rightly be blasted by numerous members for wasting valuable time and space. It is common politeness to keep things within the parameters of this list's subject matter. And, yes, one can find an amazing amount of discoveries some times by slapping two or more unrelated items together and looking at the result. However, if I were to post to this list everything I slapped together or I thought that someone might be able to become inspired by to create a free energy device, I would be spending all my time writing postings, until I got banned from the list as being a spammer (probably after my third posting). Finally, if I didn't have an open mind, I wouldn't be a subscriber to this list. I will be the first one to admit that ANYTHING is possible, but at the same time, the odds of a Playboy Bunny ringing my doorbell at 7 AM tomorrow and saying, "My Ferrari's just broken down and I've GOT to have sex with someone or I'll die!" are so near to nothing as to make no odds. Brian Drake (Bmd2323@aol.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 18:35:26 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA06346; Thu, 6 May 1999 18:33:37 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 18:33:37 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990507120453.00842da0@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@main.murray.net.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 12:04:53 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: GEOFF EGEL Subject: Addition to my energy 21 websites Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"d2DgX2.0._Y1.nBaCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10288 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have added two more pages to my website at energy 21 Fortunecity (1) The first being some simple experiments with static electricity and a simple motor device using a spirit lamp and a horseshoe magnet to make a simple motor that works. http://www.Fortunecity.com/greenfield/bp/16/elektor.htm (2) Some further information on the Power wheel that is related to the swiss ml at my solaris website. an amended version of a presentation given at exotic research conference in mesa Arizona July 1998 http://www.Fortunecity.com/greenfield/bp/powerw.htm Geoff ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Solaris searching for natures energy sources. Our main site http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 Get the complete enecyclopedia of free energy version 1 from us at no cost at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/freebies.html last updated November 1998 my postal address as follows Geoff Egel 18 Sturt Street Loxton 5333 South Australia Australia ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- Energy 21 website now resides at http://www.FortuneCity.com/greenfield/bp/16/index.html Bright Sparks website. http://www2.murray.net.au/users/egel/ our site search facility is located at. http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/orgone.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 19:51:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA31819; Thu, 6 May 1999 19:50:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 19:50:58 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990507132220.00866600@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@main.murray.net.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 13:22:20 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: GEOFF EGEL Subject: Addition to my energy 21 websites Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"YY_FD2.0.4n7.HKbCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10289 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have added two more pages to my website at energy 21 Fortunecity (1) The first being some simple experiments with static electricity and a simple motor device using a spirit lamp and a horseshoe magnet to make a simple motor that works. http://www.Fortunecity.com/greenfield/bp/16/elektor.htm (2) Some further information on the Power wheel that is related to the swiss ml at my solaris website. an amended version of a presentation given at exotic research conference in mesa Arizona July 1998 whoops tis is the right address http://www.Fortunecity.com/greenfield/bp/16/powerw.htm Geoff ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Solaris searching for natures energy sources. Our main site http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 Get the complete enecyclopedia of free energy version 1 from us at no cost at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/freebies.html last updated November 1998 my postal address as follows Geoff Egel 18 Sturt Street Loxton 5333 South Australia Australia ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- Energy 21 website now resides at http://www.FortuneCity.com/greenfield/bp/16/index.html Bright Sparks website. http://www2.murray.net.au/users/egel/ our site search facility is located at. http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/orgone.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 20:20:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA07888; Thu, 6 May 1999 20:20:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 20:20:03 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Doomsday 20 years Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 23:23:46 -0400 Message-ID: <19990507032346421.AAA68@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"CeaWR2.0.8x1.YlbCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10290 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: You wrote: >Finally, if I didn't have an open mind, I wouldn't be a subscriber to this >list. I will be the first one to admit that ANYTHING is possible, but at the >same time, the odds of a Playboy Bunny ringing my doorbell at 7 AM tomorrow >and saying, "My Ferrari's just broken down and I've GOT to have sex with >someone or I'll die!" are so near to nothing as to make no odds. >Brian Drake >(Bmd2323@aol.com) I've had that happen a couple of times, and boy, it can really be annoying. I'm just not a "morning person" at all. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 20:41:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA14960; Thu, 6 May 1999 20:41:16 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 20:41:16 -0700 From: pop79@altavista.net Message-Id: <199905070341.NAA22859@lebunka.ion.com.au> To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 13:35:22 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199905062120.QAA16901@mw1.texas.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.01b) Resent-Message-ID: <"HmEC32.0.ff3.S3cCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10291 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > Hey, Knuke, > My Maxwell has lost art. For example, it has no water pump and no > dipstick to get the ladies dirty..just look through the hood vent at a > needle that points to full or empty. Just more trivia... > Joe Portman > ============ > > ---------- > > From: Michael T Huffman > > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > > Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want > this now! > > Date: Thursday, May 06, 1999 10:45 AM > > > > >Hey, Knuke, > > > Americans are power hungry...no patience. I have a 23 Maxwell 4 dr > > >convertible that eventually will get up to 50 mph. It has a 12 hp > engine. What the?!!! How big is the motor? I've heard of a 100cc V4 go kart motor that makes 12hp. From, Paul (Quantum Business Systems) www.quantumsystems.com.au From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 6 22:26:19 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA14325; Thu, 6 May 1999 22:25:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 22:25:54 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 01:29:37 -0400 Message-ID: <19990507052937953.AAA286@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"JiLLG2.0.gV3.XbdCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10292 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dean wrote: >Some cars in the 60's had 45 hp or less engines (VW, Renault, Fiat and >others come to mind). You sure don't need 200+ hp for a car. > >Even the 3500 lb Mercedes 190D sedan had a diesel engine that produced >only 65 hp. Hi Dean, Yeah, I know that now, but I've only just recently (well, the last 20 years or so) learned some of the specifics of what is necessary to transport ones' self physically from one place to another. I grew up with the idea that a car was something that had to weigh a couple of tons, and that if you wanted or needed to drive to Hell and back, the car should have at least 400 horses under the hood. I've owned several that fit that description in my younger days. One of them, a '69 Olds 442 was such a guzzler that you could literally feel the four barrel carb gulping the gas. I don't know how many gallons per mile that thing took, but it was an obscene amount, I'm sure. That personal idea of what a car had to be was a result of a combination of cultural, hormonal, and marketing influences that were, at best, misdirected. That '23 Maxwell of Joe's sounds like a pretty cool car. I've never heard of it before, and will have to do a websearch to see what it looks like. I'm still hoping to have either a converted electric auto or some kind of pollution free form of transport soon. Who knows, it may be an air motor car. I took a look at the website, and that company is doing some pretty ambitious stuff. They aren't just manufacturing a motor, they are doing the entire car. Well, they are doing pick-ups and vans. They've gotten the weight down to 1,600 lbs by using carbon fiber material for the body. This is less than half of the weight of my 87 Toyota minivan with a four cylinder engine. Actually, it's about a ton less. No small accomplishment there. Still, there are a few things that I would like to see on their website that would make me think that is actually for real. First, it would be nice if they put their address and phone number somewhere on the site instead of having you request it. It is also quite normal for companies to post their management structure, and the names of the company's officers, etc.. A more detailed explanation of how the motor works would be nice, too. Some kind of price listing would be a good idea... They've definitely got my interest, though. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 01:08:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA09583; Fri, 7 May 1999 01:08:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 01:08:02 -0700 Message-ID: <19990507080730.64942.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.132] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: wow.... Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 01:07:29 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"u2mkm2.0.eL2.YzfCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10293 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hay Charlie, It's good to see I'm not the only one :) > >When I am working on a project, it's not uncommon for me to walk the >aisles of hardware and electronic stores, just looking. It's amazing >how a seemingly unrelated item can bring focus and direction and spark >additional ideas. > > > _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 01:50:26 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA16177; Fri, 7 May 1999 01:50:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 01:50:07 -0700 Message-ID: <19990507084936.23827.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.132] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 01:49:35 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"ES_GG1.0.cy3.-agCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10294 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >300 liters at 800 atm is only 9 hp*hr. I.e. 9 hp for one hour. I smell a >rat. >(Though if my calcs are correct, using liquid nitrogen would triple >that). > >Robin van Spaandonk > Robin, how did you arrive at these numbers??? I'm not questing them, just would like to know the math.... Please :) _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 02:18:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA11102; Fri, 7 May 1999 02:17:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 02:17:57 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 05:21:40 -0400 Message-ID: <19990507092140953.AAA258@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"cXKU22.0.Nj2.4_gCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10295 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hey there, I was talking to a new friend of mine the other day about what I did, etc., and he told me an interesting story. As it happens, this guy is the nephew of Siah Armanjani, an Iranian immigrant, who, in the judgement of most of the artistic community, is the most important sculptor living in America today. Siah has numerous examples of his work on permanent display in major cities across the US, and they can be viewed on the internet by doing a name search. Anyhow, this guy told me that when he was a kid, his uncle displayed a "scupture" that consisted of two laser beams aimed so that the beams came together at a point in space. At that point he put a large gold brick, which would stay suspended in midair. He also said that while he was looking at it, a woman tried to photograph it with a flash, and when the flash went off, the brick fell down. The display attendant picked the brick back up, positioned it in its proper place, and it remained suspended for the rest of the demonstration. I thought about it, and scalar waves came to mind, but the brick was gold, and I thought that if this was a magnetic phenomenon, only a material that was influenced by magnetism would behave in such a way. Gold is not one of those materials, and I told him so. He smiled and said that the brick was only gold plated. He wouldn't say any more, but I will ask him the next time I see him. Have you tried doing scalar experiments with lasers? Siah, BTW, is schooled in philosophy, and has no scientific or artistic training at all. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 05:38:59 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA27356; Fri, 7 May 1999 05:37:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 05:37:59 -0700 Message-Id: <199905071237.WAA23896@lebunka.ion.com.au> From: "Pop" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:58:03 Subject: Re: wow.... Reply-to: pop79@altavista.net Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.40 Resent-Message-ID: <"MjUNc1.0.Lh6.cwjCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10296 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Me too. How about we start a 'Wander aimlessly in hardware stores' mailing list ;-) On 7 May 99 at 1:07, freenrg-l@eskimo.com wrote: > Hay Charlie, > It's good to see I'm not the only one :) > > > > >When I am working on a project, it's not uncommon for me to walk the > >aisles of hardware and electronic stores, just looking. It's amazing > >how a seemingly unrelated item can bring focus and direction and spark > >additional ideas. _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Pop, in an uncontrolled environment Email: pop@ion.com.au (ISP) pop79@altavista.net (forwarded, prefered) pop79@mailexcite.com (backup) WWW: http://www.fortunecity.com/skyscraper/nova/229/index.htm _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 06:42:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA09460; Fri, 7 May 1999 06:40:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 06:40:46 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990508001209.0086ae80@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@main.murray.net.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 00:12:09 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: GEOFF EGEL Subject: Addition to my energy 21 websites Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"yHDBV3.0.jJ2.UrkCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10297 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have added two more pages to my website at energy 21 Fortunecity (1) The first being some simple experiments with static electricity and a simple motor device using a spirit lamp and a horseshoe magnet to make a simple motor that works. http://www.Fortunecity.com/greenfield/bp/16/elektor.htm (2) Some further information on the Power wheel that is related to the swiss ml at my solaris website. an amended version of a presentation given at exotic research conference in mesa Arizona July 1998 whoops tis is the right address http://www.Fortunecity.com/greenfield/bp/16/powerw.htm you may care to look at this new one as well http://www.Fortunecity.com/greenfield/bp/16/radiant.htm Geoff ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Solaris searching for natures energy sources. Our main site http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 Get the complete enecyclopedia of free energy version 1 from us at no cost at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/freebies.html last updated November 1998 my postal address as follows Geoff Egel 18 Sturt Street Loxton 5333 South Australia Australia ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- Energy 21 website now resides at http://www.FortuneCity.com/greenfield/bp/16/index.html Bright Sparks website. http://www2.murray.net.au/users/egel/ our site search facility is located at. http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/orgone.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 06:48:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA12567; Fri, 7 May 1999 06:47:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 06:47:30 -0700 MR-Received: by mta EUROPA; Relayed; Fri, 07 May 1999 09:46:07 -0400 (EDT) MR-Received: by mta GOSIP; Relayed; Fri, 07 May 1999 09:47:09 -0400 (EDT) Alternate-recipient: prohibited Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 09:34:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Briggs 614-752-0199 Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I wa In-reply-to: <37353926.32527647@mail-hub> To: freenrg-l Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Posting-date: Fri, 07 May 1999 09:46:00 -0400 (EDT) Importance: normal Priority: normal UA-content-id: E2037ZXXIDYQ81 X400-MTS-identifier: [;70649070509991/3717919@ODNVMS] A1-type: MAIL Hop-count: 2 Resent-Message-ID: <"RsUP43.0.C43.oxkCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10298 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Robin, What is the density ratio for liquid nitrogen -vs- gaseous 1 atm nitrogen. How about dry ice? Both would boost the energy capacity for the same volume of storage. (I know, tree huggers hate CO2, which is odd because trees absolutely love it! ;^) Bill webriggs@concentric.net >>A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this ! >> >>Why has nobody invented this earlier ? >> >>I want it now ! :) >> >>Regards, Stefan. >300 liters at 800 atm is only 9 hp*hr. I.e. 9 hp for one hour. I smell a rat. >(Though if my calcs are correct, using liquid nitrogen would triple that). > >Regards, > >Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 07:07:55 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA21302; Fri, 7 May 1999 07:06:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 07:06:57 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <2daf277.24644cbd@aol.com> Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 10:03:41 EDT Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"EpQrG1.0.lC5.1ElCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10299 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/7/99 2:28:27 AM Pacific Daylight Time, knuke@LCIA.COM writes: << Anyhow, this guy told me that when he was a kid, his uncle displayed a "scupture" that consisted of two laser beams aimed so that the beams came together at a point in space. At that point he put a large gold brick, which would stay suspended in midair. He also said that while he was looking at it, a woman tried to photograph it with a flash, and when the flash went off, the brick fell down. The display attendant picked the brick back up, positioned it in its proper place, and it remained suspended for the rest of the demonstration. I thought about it, and scalar waves came to mind, but the brick was gold, and I thought that if this was a magnetic phenomenon, only a material that was influenced by magnetism would behave in such a way. Gold is not one of those materials, and I told him so. He smiled and said that the brick was only gold plated. He wouldn't say any more, but I will ask him the next time I see him. >> This is strictly speculation, but from the description what could have been observed was a small hologram (which might be hardly visible at all) which produced a suspended gold brick from the laser beams. That could be made to look very real --just a thought. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 07:49:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA00340; Fri, 7 May 1999 07:46:19 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 07:46:19 -0700 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on Linux X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 10:42:58 -0400 (EDT) Organization: Society for Real Time Sender: chuck@cougar.ssi.stratus.com From: Charlie Hodgson To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Doomsday 20 years Resent-Message-ID: <"49u_l3.0.D5.xolCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10300 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On 07-May-99 Bmd2323@aol.com wrote: > Charlie, > > My point is this, if someone has a dream which enables them to discover a > free energy device, then by all means share it with us. If, however, your > dream relates to something totally off topic as a vision of the end of the > world, then share it somewhere else. I agree with the above, though your statement: > I had a dream once that I slept with a Playboy Bunny. Does > that mean that someday I'm going to sleep with a Playboy Bunny? No! denies the fact that it is possible. I know quite a few people that have. If I wasn't such an awkward, shy nerd at the age of 16 I could include myself in that grouping. Yes, the list does waver. I typically read the beginnings of each new thread, skipping most later on. Sometimes pointless banter leads to comradare between list members, which leads to collaboration, much the same as discussions around the water cooler about the brown patches on your lawn fosters a healthier work enviornment and a leads to a more productive organization. I don't think the list should be a free for all. The thread that this is part of started off dealing with numbers and their place/function in nature's order. I found it interesting. We have quite the mix of eclectic talents here. I'm interested in free energy, but more so I'm interested in learning about alternatives. Alternatives to EVERYTHING, whether it be gravity, magnetism, religion, medicine, etc. The problem, as I see it, is that the mainstream sciences are stuck in a certain way of thinking, mostly due to the education system. There is currently so much knowledge available that it is impossible for any one individual to have a complete grasp, or even modest familiarity with all there is to know. Hence, schools teach what they believe is needed. The result is the education system produces closed-minded people, barely qualified to conduct research. You would think that after 40 years of failures the AMA, NIH, etc would realize that maybe they should look elsewhere for a cure for cancer, but instead they continue down the same track, only the names of the chemicals used change. In a public forum as this, with a diverse group of intelligent, open-minded people, we are exposed to many, many other points of view, theories and ideas. These are the things needed to kindle an idea. On a totally off topic thread a year or so back, the Ark of the Covenant came up. Later, I explore Orgonamy. Interesting, the Ark sounds like an orgon accumulator. Connection made. Granted, it still has no current value, but let a few more synapses connect and who knows what will be the result. To sum it up, dreams about sleeping with bunnies have no place here, but ones that involve being chased through a hollow toroid by the number 19 (wearing rabbit ears) would be quite interesting. :) Charlie > the odds of a Playboy Bunny ringing my doorbell at 7 AM tomorrow > and saying, "My Ferrari's just broken down and I've GOT to have sex with > someone or I'll die!" are so near to nothing as to make no odds. I think you are confusing Playmates with Bunnies. They are NOT the same, though some woman have been both. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 08:44:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA27855; Fri, 7 May 1999 08:42:36 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 08:42:36 -0700 Message-Id: <199905071542.KAA22059@mw1.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 10:39:53 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jmFPU1.0.6p6.hdmCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10301 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: My 23 Maxwell has a 4 cyl engine...Joe Portman ==================================== ---------- > From: pop79@altavista.net > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! > Date: Thursday, May 06, 1999 10:35 PM > > > Hey, Knuke, > > My Maxwell has lost art. For example, it has no water pump and no > > dipstick to get the ladies dirty..just look through the hood vent at a > > needle that points to full or empty. Just more trivia... > > Joe Portman > > ============ > > > > ---------- > > > From: Michael T Huffman > > > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 09:38:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA22141; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:36:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:36:46 -0700 Message-ID: <373316FC.BEF3416E@harti.com> Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 18:38:20 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List , "JNaudin509@aol.com" Subject: Who wants to join a LIVE broadcast RealVideo chat about free energy ? X-Priority: 2 (High) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Q49XA3.0.oP5.UQnCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10302 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, I have setup a RealVideo Server at a friends ISP machine and have already tried to broadcast Live RealVideo from my machine this way. I just don´t have much to show in this moment, but this could be used together with a Javachat I also did install to chat to each other. If you are interested to participate, we can try it in the next few evenings. The RealServer 5.0 can handle about 60 streams at the same time, so 60 people can connect and watch the 20 kbits/sec livestream. You just have to have RealVideo player G2 or 5.0 player installed on your machine and at least have a 28.8 K Modem Internet access. Please send me a private email, if you want to participate. I will send you the dates I will be broadcasting live. This will be a test for a real event, when we have somebody, who has a running free energy machine. If Jean Louis or anybody else would like to broadcast live from his lab and show us any realtime experiment in front of a live audience, please download the RealEncoder 5.1 from here: http://proforma.real.com/mario/tools/encoder50.html?wp=798tools and let me know. I will set you up, so you can show your experiment live on the net for free with Live Audio and Video ! -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 09:50:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA26778; Fri, 7 May 1999 09:49:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:49:54 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990507124159.0112a100@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 12:41:59 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990505135058.23878fc8@earthlink.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19990505030320.00810a90@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990504180023.238703c2@earthlink.net> <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"SFIB02.0.JY6.ncnCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10303 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 01:50 PM 05/05/99, Dave wrote: > >I have the paper "Simulation of Amperian Current elements by Magnetic >Toroids" by Thomas Phipps and Jorge Valverde, thanks to Robert Gray. Yes. And Robert Gray was originally responsible for suggesting the VACE experiments [in 1995] Thomas Phipps also give credit to J Valverde for the actual magnetic toroid interaction measurement. It was >published in Summer, 1998 21'st Century and discusses "vace" elements. I >would be interested in what the other articles say. I could not find any >such articles on-line. I have that article. And along with the Electric Spacecraft Journal article I also have the 'Report on VACE Experiments' published in Galilean Electrodynamics, in January/February 1999. They are all rather similar with respect to the VACE portions, but there was just a bit more information. I believe it was also published in two other journals, but not in any of the mainstream journals. > >One thing I didn't understand is the (virtual) current through the hole of >the magnetized toroid is balanced by the return on the outside. The current >density in the center is greater, of course, but the force effects, if I >understand correctly, just depend on the total current. Yes-- the Amperian current element which is related to the gauss measure. (Total enclosed flux.) The longitudinal Amperian force between the toroids is dependent on exactly that. The current density inside the hole also goes up if the hole's diameter shrinks, but I don't know if that in itself, also increases the interactive forces. (?) > >He also was measuring the force on one toroid on the other, not a net force >from the pair. The only thing keeping me from trying it is that an >analytical balance is required, the peak forces (delta weights) were about >10mg. His had a resolution of 0.1 mg. > Oh-- No. The first paper didn't make that very clear, did it? Please do the experiment, Dave. A resolution of 0.1 mg, but that was for a distance of over 4 cm to measure ~60 mg. Phipps had to keep the distances far enough apart to actually rotate the VACE toroids because the experiment was to prove the angular dependance of force measurement to those predicted by Ampere, not to measure the maximum dynes. Actually, Phipps mentions in the Galilean Electrodynamics 1999 paper that high accuracy and expensive scales is totally unnecessary for *direct* force measurement at closer distances. Also-- consider that with the B field here in the toroid configuration, [as opposed to an infinitely long solenoid] the "force" action between the two toroids falls off with separation with roughly the inverse *sixth* power of separation distance, and not the desired second power" Consider then, placing them side-by-side. These VACE PM toroids offer an easy and unambiguous opportunity to research primary A field forces without worrying about AC interactions, short measurement times [from short pulse durations], bouncing effects, heating effects, etc.. One test comes to mind-- I wonder if a [DC current] toroid electromagnet induces the same longitudinal force effects as the Permanent Magnet toroids. I think it probably does-- and the other experiments too-- using capacitor discharges into electromagnetic toroids are IMO probably also birthing the same resultant. But those are transient longitudinal force effects and the fact that it is not a steady (virtual) current, but a real current that is accelerating in time, complicates matters because we don't know for sure if the force effects are longitudinal, from the lead-in wires, or from an induced [but as yet undiscovered] secondary field, etc., without doing further tests. I would recommend to those of us who are doing the capacitor/toroid experiments, to maybe order half a dozen horseshoe magnets and experience the steady state VACE concept also. I'm still looking for a source of small alnico horseshoe fridge magnets myself. If anyone has a source, could you please let me know, because I'm skeptical enough to want to prove this simple experiment for myself. Colin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 15:21:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA28164; Fri, 7 May 1999 15:19:10 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 15:19:10 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:22:53 -0400 Message-ID: <19990507222253484.AAA215@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"4UOGJ.0.wt6.TRsCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10304 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Ken wrote: >This is strictly speculation, but from the description what could have been >observed was a small hologram (which might be hardly visible at all) which >produced a suspended gold brick from the laser beams. That could be made to >look very real --just a thought. That's an idea that I should have thought of also. It'll be on the list of things to ask. Thanks, Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 18:04:13 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA09537; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:03:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:03:03 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I wa Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 23:15:57 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <373371c9.85650443@mail-hub> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id SAA09492 Resent-Message-ID: <"fIsTk3.0.wK2.6ruCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10305 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 07 May 1999 09:34:21 -0400 (EDT), Bill Briggs 614-752-0199 wrote: >Robin, > >What is the density ratio for liquid nitrogen -vs- gaseous 1 atm nitrogen. I don't know. However I did manage to find the critical point of Nitrogen (-146 deg. C, 485 psi), so working from that I get a pressure of 1144 psi at 27 deg C. for roughly the same volume as the liquid. This means my previous calcs were wrong, and using liquid nitrogen only gives an improvement of ~50% over the 9 hp hrs that I posted earlier. > >How about dry ice? The critical point for CO2 is 31.1 deg. C, at 1072 psi. This means that at 27 deg. C, the pressure would be less than 1072 psi, and hence also less than the 1144 psi of nitrogen. [snip] Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 18:20:14 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA17579; Fri, 7 May 1999 18:19:47 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:19:47 -0700 Message-ID: <37339196.FAB8913D@harti.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 03:21:27 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Chat test !Now ! X-Priority: 2 (High) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BNJb-3.0.TI4.o4vCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10306 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, I am now online via the new chat page at: http://www.overunity.com/ouchat/ Chat with me now ! Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 19:20:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA05397; Fri, 7 May 1999 19:18:50 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 19:18:50 -0700 From: dtmiller@nevia.net (Dean T. Miller) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 02:18:51 GMT Organization: Miller and Associates Reply-To: dtmiller@nevia.net Message-ID: <37334075.60508930@mail.nevia.net> References: <19990507052937953.AAA286@mail.lcia.com@lizard> In-Reply-To: <19990507052937953.AAA286@mail.lcia.com@lizard> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id TAA05339 Resent-Message-ID: <"I_d9K2.0.DK1.9yvCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10307 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Michael, On Fri, 7 May 1999 01:29:37 -0400, knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) wrote: > I took a look at the website, and that company is doing some pretty >ambitious stuff. They aren't just manufacturing a motor, they are doing the >entire car. Well, they are doing pick-ups and vans. They've gotten the >weight down to 1,600 lbs by using carbon fiber material for the body. This >is less than half of the weight of my 87 Toyota minivan with a four cylinder >engine. Actually, it's about a ton less. No small accomplishment there. If you'll notice, they're not actually producing production cars, from what I can tell. (Maybe they are, but the WWW site seems to imply they're looking for investors or people to build a production plant.) Also, the engine they show normally runs on gasoline or LP. It's a 3-chamber design where: one cylinder compresses the air which feeds a spherical combustion chamber which feeds a power cylinder. The engine can run only on compressed air, but fuel can be added for longer distance travel (I assume, but the site didn't say from what I read, that the engine could also run an air compressor when operating in the fuel-using mode). -- Dean -- from (almost) Duh Moines (CDP, KB0ZDF) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 19:23:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA06932; Fri, 7 May 1999 19:22:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 19:22:44 -0700 Message-ID: <3733A058.7DEF6925@harti.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 04:24:24 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Broadcasting Joe =?iso-8859-1?Q?Newman=B4s?= new tape ? X-Priority: 2 (High) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"6w1lK3.0.9i1.p_vCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10308 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: daveem m wrote: > > Sorry for the some what vague unsure description of Joes video, I was > doing two things at the same time I was watching it. I believe Joe said > the two finger test was 63 volts at roughly 10 MA or less, his analog > meter made it hard to pin the current right on the money, > > As an experiment I tried the same test with my best permanent magnet DC > motor which is over 90 percent efficient. and at .6 of a watt it was no > problem stopping it with a couple fingers. I realize this is hardly any > kind of scientific experiment since the strength of each person will > vary, but never the less it was thought provoking! > The test with the pony brake I think was at 63 volts also at 1 amp. The > motor turned at 60 to 70 RPM while he tightened his brake system down, I > couldn't follow that part to well since I don't understand how a pony > brake works exactly. but it looked like his brake system consisted of a > rope which went around a pulley and created resistance, and I believe he > calculated the tension to be 40 pounds of resistance. He said the test > showed that he was able to produce .63 HP with about 200 watts. > Dave > > PS I don't know if three fingers would have stoped it? > > Dave's Alternative Energy. > http://www.homezen.com/powersys.html Hi All, is it possible for somebody on these lists to get this tape and do you have yourself or any friend of you a fast PC or MAC with a capture card, so you could LIVE broadcast it via the RealEncoder at the new overunity videochat page ? http://www.overunity.com/ouchat/ I just tested a chat session with a guy from Mississipi and it worked fine. I really would like to see the tape but don´t want to wait so long untill it might get shipped to me. Others would also be interested... Thanks in advance. Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 20:22:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA21684; Fri, 7 May 1999 20:21:53 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 20:21:53 -0700 Message-ID: <3733AE35.1FABEF0@harti.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 05:23:33 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Re: OUchat... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"flPeV.0.jI5.HtwCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10309 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: -------- Original Message -------- Subject: problem #2 Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 22:49:10 -0300 From: jdelac To: harti@harti.com >Hi Stefan! >I can hear you now....are you trasmiting video too? >If so, how should setup my R.A. for see you? >I've installed the G2 version. > >Thanks in advance Stefan and good luck with your idea! Hi, I just tested it tonight only via broadcasting Audio, so maybe also some others have been listening into it ? I have successfully been heard in Argentinia and Mississipi and Michigan ! :) Now let us try some video the coming nights ! :) Anyone want to send a live stream or has a nice new video which he wants to broadcast ? How about the new Newman video and the new cold fusion videotape just released from infinite energy magazine ? Regards, Stefan. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 21:25:59 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA30745; Fri, 7 May 1999 21:25:31 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 21:25:31 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Cc: SQUIB2@prodigy.net Subject: More Tornadoes? Message-Id: <926137497.22745.458@excite.com> Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 21:24:57 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"fcFWj3.0.IW7.xoxCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10310 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: 5/5/99 12:58:32 PM Pacific Daylight Time:  It seems that the Kosovo crisis is taking an unexpected turn. There are indications that a meteorological weaponry that Russians call  MTVR-1 is currently in use to create atmospherics disturbances over the U.S. It seems that the Pentagon is panicking, and Clinton is even talking about halting the air strike against Yugoslavia!? There was a web site about  this weapon, I can't speak Russian but [what] I understood is that it does not  need to be applied over the region one wants to attack and that [it] is not controllable . HDN reporting from ORBIT site. _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 21:50:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA04942; Fri, 7 May 1999 21:50:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 21:50:30 -0700 Message-ID: <19990508044954.21591.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.18] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: psi to hp ???? Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 21:49:53 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"X5-Aq2.0.2D1.MAyCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10311 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > >I don't know. However I did manage to find the critical point of >Nitrogen (-146 deg. C, 485 psi), so working from that I get a pressure >of 1144 psi at 27 deg C. for roughly the same volume as the liquid. >This means my previous calcs were wrong, and using liquid nitrogen only >gives an improvement of ~50% over the 9 hp hrs that I posted earlier. > > > > >How about dry ice? > >The critical point for CO2 is 31.1 deg. C, at 1072 psi. This means that >at 27 deg. C, the pressure would be less than 1072 psi, and hence also >less than the 1144 psi of nitrogen. >[snip] > >Regards, > >Robin van Spaandonk And I ask again HOW DO YOU GET HP FROM FROM PSI?????? _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 22:50:35 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA18059; Fri, 7 May 1999 22:49:12 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 22:49:12 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990507212349.2377a172@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 21:23:49 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990507124159.0112a100@inforamp.net> References: <3.0.6.16.19990505135058.23878fc8@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990505030320.00810a90@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990504180023.238703c2@earthlink.net> <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Z5Uwi2.0._P4.N1zCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10312 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Colin and all, At 12:41 PM 5/7/99 -0700, you wrote: >>One thing I didn't understand is the (virtual) current through the hole of >>the magnetized toroid is balanced by the return on the outside. The current >>density in the center is greater, of course, but the force effects, if I >>understand correctly, just depend on the total current. > >Yes-- the Amperian current element which is related to the gauss measure. >(Total enclosed flux.) The longitudinal Amperian force between the toroids >is dependent on exactly that. >The current density inside the hole also goes up if the hole's diameter >shrinks, but I don't know if that in itself, also increases the interactive >forces. (?) Do the other papers explain the dependence on density, vs. just the total current? I understand the current->circular field and the surface toroidal currents, but don't understand that. Interesting that in a toroid coil winding, the total outer current is the same as that going through the wires in the center hole (same number of wires). This may not be true for a permanent magnet toroid, as the currents are "electronic" and the total currents increase with the radius in the toroid. > >> >>He also was measuring the force on one toroid on the other, not a net force >>from the pair. The only thing keeping me from trying it is that an >>analytical balance is required, the peak forces (delta weights) were about >>10mg. His had a resolution of 0.1 mg. >> > >Oh-- No. The first paper didn't make that very clear, did it? One vace was mounted on the scale and the other on a fixed support. His magnet toroids were about 22mm diameter, and spaced about 4cm, as you say. >Please do the >experiment, Dave. A resolution of 0.1 mg, but that was for a distance of >over 4 cm to measure ~60 mg. Phipps had to keep the distances far enough >apart to actually rotate the VACE toroids because the experiment was to >prove the angular dependance of force measurement to those predicted by >Ampere, not to measure the maximum dynes. Actually, Phipps mentions in the >Galilean Electrodynamics 1999 paper that high accuracy and expensive scales >is totally unnecessary for *direct* force measurement at closer distances. >Also-- consider that with the B field here in the toroid configuration, [as >opposed to an infinitely long solenoid] the "force" action between the two >toroids falls off with separation with roughly the inverse *sixth* power of >separation distance, and not the desired second power" Consider then, >placing them side-by-side. These VACE PM toroids offer an easy and >unambiguous opportunity to research primary A field forces without worrying >about AC interactions, short measurement times [from short pulse >durations], bouncing effects, heating effects, etc.. I actually tried a horizontal setup with one toroid (welded steel ring) on a pendulum, the other fixed but rotatable. I could get no good data, maybe the rings were poor (circularly poled) magnets. By the way, a pendulum seems sensitive, I found that a brass ball I had was very slightly magnetic. I then began to wonder about the current densities and later, Ampere forces between 2 closed circuits, which these appear to be. > >One test comes to mind-- I wonder if a [DC current] toroid electromagnet >induces the same longitudinal force effects as the Permanent Magnet >toroids. I think it probably does-- and the other experiments too-- using >capacitor discharges into electromagnetic toroids are IMO probably also >birthing the same resultant. But those are transient longitudinal force >effects and the fact that it is not a steady (virtual) current, but a real >current that is accelerating in time, complicates matters because we don't >know for sure if the force effects are longitudinal, from the lead-in >wires, or from an induced [but as yet undiscovered] secondary field, etc., >without doing further tests. Probably DC, at least long enough for measurements would be optimum. One appreciates permanent magnets when one realizes that, for each cm path in air, a field of 1 Tesla requires 8000 Amp-turns, less of course for a ferromagnetic core. Of course the advantage is that it can be switched on and off. > >I would recommend to those of us who are doing the capacitor/toroid >experiments, to maybe order half a dozen horseshoe magnets and experience >the steady state VACE concept also. I'm still looking for a source of small >alnico horseshoe fridge magnets myself. If anyone has a source, could you >please let me know, because I'm skeptical enough to want to prove this >simple experiment for myself. I also thought of steel wedges, say 22.5 degrees with 16 Neodym magnets to make a ring with the fields all the same direction, but there are many interfaces and I never had the wedges machined. > >Colin > -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 23:17:38 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA23246; Fri, 7 May 1999 23:17:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 23:17:21 -0700 From: Bmd2323@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 02:16:34 EDT Subject: Re: Doomsday 20 years To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"aPBAV.0.7h5.nRzCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10313 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Charlie, Apparently my years as an English major did more damage to my ability to communicate than I once thought, as you have totally missed my point. Certainly, there are going to be postings which deviate from the letter of rules of this list. As long as those deviations don't violate the SPIRIT of this list, they are okay. After all, a device which pokes a hole in an established scientific theory, but isn't a free energy device is an important piece of evidence in the battle to prove that mainstream science doesn't have all the answers. I fail to see, however, how an apocalyptic dream which relies on numerology for its conclusion can have anything to do with this lists subject matter. Speculation on UFO propulsion, certainly. Especially if its on the level of Hill's "Unconventional Flying Objects" as too much of what is appearing on this list is sorely lacking in hard data to back it up. The fact that one person may find something interesting is not enough reason to post it to the list. If we fail to practice self-censorship and do limit ourselves to the topics which this list is supposed to address, it will lose any value which it might have, simply because the very people who are accessing the list for important information needed to complete their latest project will be unable to get what they need. And yes, off-topic subjects can inspire people to collaborate, but what will they be collaborating on? If their collaboration is on a free energy matter, wonderful, but odds are, if their spending all their time discussing off-topic items, they won't be spending their time doing on-topic projects. If you want to discuss something off-topic, start a separate list to discuss such a subject, but don't take up space on this list with something that doesn't belong. The amount of e-mails I've had to delete because they have no bearing on this list is rapidly increasing and I am seriously considering unsubscribing because of it. This is a wonderful forum and a wonderful opportunity for all of us IF we use it properly. Failing to do so, will simply turn this into little more than a conversation at a cocktail party. That is NOT why I subscribed to this list. If I want to be bombarded by light, fluffy chatter, I'll turn on a talk radio program. If I want information on free energy and related subjects I'll check this list, but if it turns out that I'm not getting anything other than light and fluffy, I'll look elsewhere. I, too, am interested in alternatives to current theories, but at the same time, I'm not going to bombard the list with those things that don't seem to have a relevance to this list. Certainly, it is entirely possible that two things which don't seem to have a relevance at first, or a connection could appear between two items later on. If they have a relation to free energy, fine, the post them, if not, be polite and don't take up space here. If you really must discuss them, a simple request for other people interested in the topic to e-mail you privately is the proper thing to do. Brian Drake (Bmd2323@aol.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 7 23:17:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA23289; Fri, 7 May 1999 23:17:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 23:17:24 -0700 From: Bmd2323@aol.com Message-ID: <35b086af.246530c6@aol.com> Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 02:16:38 EDT Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"KHP_8.0.jh5.qRzCt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10314 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Yeah, but we could counter attack by firing up HAARP, couldn't we? Supposedly, we could also wipe electronics using an EMP generated by it, but I'm uncertain of the range, etc. so I don't know how practical it could be for us to target Yugoslavia with an EMP. Brian Drake (Bmd2323@aol.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 03:55:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA00175; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:54:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 03:54:58 -0700 From: RoConroy@aol.com Message-ID: <22721456.246571dd@aol.com> Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 06:54:21 EDT Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"3apFv.0.e2.2W1Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10315 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/8/99 1:20:24 AM Central Daylight Time, Bmd2323@aol.com writes: << Yeah, but we could counter attack by firing up HAARP, couldn't we? Supposedly, we could also wipe electronics using an EMP generated by it, but I'm uncertain of the range, etc. so I don't know how practical it could be for us to target Yugoslavia with an EMP. >> Being as the underlying HAARP technology was developed by Tesla, and he thought he had caused a nuclear type event in Siberia, while testing his equipment, I would think that the range would be fairly impressive. Bob From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 03:57:46 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA00673; Sat, 8 May 1999 03:57:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 03:57:07 -0700 Message-ID: <373418E4.228F043D@harti.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 12:58:44 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Newman-L Mailing List , Free Energy Subject: [Fwd: Newman's MinnKotta motor tests] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"yIfIt3.0.LA.2Y1Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10316 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Just received this message. -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Newman's MinnKotta motor tests Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 00:56:07 -0500 From: Ted Gondert To: harti@harti.com I see on Joseph Newman's webpage Jan 1 1999 message describes Joe's test of a MinnKOtta 41 lb thrust electric trolling motor. He claims that with 12 volts at 45 amps input power = 540 watts that the motor produces 760 watts on the output shaft, measured with a pony brake and also calculates loss in motor resistance of 1202 watts. (or similar) I did a few calculations from the figures he gives. 5 inch diameter pulley, 11 lbs force on rope, 1200 RPM. (pi 3.14159) * 5/12 * 1200 * 11 /30,000 = .542 HP or 390 watts, which is less than 540 watts input power. Also Joe said he measured the motor resistance as 0.5 ohms with ohmmeter. So he calculated heat loss as 45 amps squared * 0.5 ohms = 1012 watts. But if motor had 0.5 ohms resistance, at 12 volts it would only use 24 amps. To measure motor resistance, usually use a Kelvin bridge that inputs current with one set of leads and measure voltage drop with another set of test leads. So Joe Newman is a poor researcher and lab technician. I'm no expert, just looked up standard formales for power, etc. and calculated results. Anyone can make simple mistake, but when your calcultions go against all accepted scientific theory, the reasonable conclusion would be to double check your figures. :-) Joe is asking for $3500 deposits for "Energy Machines" to be delivered by July 1999, but does he have working model? Ignoring scientific argument, how does Joe expect production in only a couple months without prototypes tested, parts ordered, workers trained, etc. ? Overunity research is interesting but hasn't had a repeatable breakthrough yet as far as I know. People like Joe Newman don't help in legitimate research for overunity or clean power. Ted Gondert PS. Evan Soule' wont allow my message to be posted on www.josephnewman.com website "workshop guestbook" Guess he is afraid of the truth. :-) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 05:31:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA18153; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:26:36 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:26:36 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:30:19 -0400 Message-ID: <19990508123019140.AAA122@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"l_wID.0.XR4.yr2Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10317 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Dean, >If you'll notice, they're not actually producing production cars, from >what I can tell. (Maybe they are, but the WWW site seems to imply >they're looking for investors or people to build a production plant.) Yeah, I know, but the photos looked pretty real, so they must have some kind of facility. I think they showed four different models, and they weren't conversions of existing cars, unless they put new bodies on old chassis. >Also, the engine they show normally runs on gasoline or LP. It's a >3-chamber design where: one cylinder compresses the air which feeds a >spherical combustion chamber which feeds a power cylinder. The engine >can run only on compressed air, but fuel can be added for longer >distance travel (I assume, but the site didn't say from what I read, >that the engine could also run an air compressor when operating in the >fuel-using mode). Like I said, there is a lot missing from the website that I would like to see. Understandably, they are looking for investors, but so are GM, Ford, and Chrysler. We'll keep an eye on them, and see what develops. It is novel and interesting, and maybe even for real:) Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 05:34:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA20720; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:33:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:33:25 -0700 Message-Id: <199905081233.HAA01249@mw1.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: psi to hp ???? Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 07:21:53 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"t-pw12.0.b35.Ly2Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10318 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: When I was a boy in the 40's, I'd get dry ice from the ice cream man who pushed a cart in my area. I learned that if you put a piece in a Vicks or Mason jar with the lid on tight, you would get a terrific explosion as gas pressure built up. Naturally, I always hid after assembly. Joe Portman trivia ============== ---------- > From: flytch er > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: psi to hp ???? > Date: Friday, May 07, 1999 11:49 PM > > > > > >How about dry ice? > > > >The critical point for CO2 is 31.1 deg. C, at 1072 psi. This means that > >at 27 deg. C, the pressure would be less than 1072 psi, and hence also > >less than the 1144 psi of nitrogen. > >[snip] > > > >Regards, > > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 05:35:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA21942; Sat, 8 May 1999 05:34:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:34:32 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:38:12 -0400 Message-ID: <19990508123812671.AAA277@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"iA3RA3.0.iM5.Jz2Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10319 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Joe wrote: >My 23 Maxwell has a 4 cyl engine...Joe Portman >==================================== Hi Joe, Is the word "Singer" written on the side of it? Only kidding. I'll look for info on it today, it does sound like a pretty cool car. I just looked at today's paper, and the entire automotive section was covered with the auto industry's latest offerings in the way of SUV's. Gawd, what BEASTS they are! They're HUGE! Knuke, still shaking his head... Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 07:55:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA18613; Sat, 8 May 1999 07:55:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 07:55:02 -0700 From: bpaddock@csonline.net (Bob Paddock) Newsgroups: list.freenrg1 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Rex Research: Done before? Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 10:53:05 -0400 Organization: is mostly via piles Reply-To: bpaddock@csonline.net Message-ID: Lines: 25 X-Newsreader: VSoup v1.2.9.27Beta [95/NT] Resent-Message-ID: <"4-c6A2.0.kY4.615Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10320 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Have you ever come with a idea and wondered if some one had already thought of it before in these areas of Weird Science? The 'old timers' among us probably remember the Rex Research Archives that more often than not held the answer to that question. With Rex's blessing I've put a copy of his 1999 catalog on my web site if any one wants to take a look at it. I'm not trying to sell any thing, I don't need those kinds of complications, just want to point out that the catalog it self is a good resource to have in ones bag of tricks. http://www.biogate.com/rexresearch/ -- For information on any of the following check out my WEB site at: http://www.biogate.com/bpaddock/ Chemical Free Air Conditioning/No CFC's, Chronic Pain Relief, Echofone, Electromedicine, Electronics, Explore!, Free Energy, Full Disclosure, KeelyNet, Matric Limited, Neurophone, Oil City PA, Philadelphia Experiment. http://www.uCOS-II.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 08:41:03 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA27944; Sat, 8 May 1999 08:39:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:39:58 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990508113129.009028f0@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 11:31:29 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Fw: Magnetic levitation ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990507212349.2377a172@earthlink.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19990507124159.0112a100@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990505135058.23878fc8@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990505030320.00810a90@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990504180023.238703c2@earthlink.net> <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"gsh0V2.0.Xq6.Eh5Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10321 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: To Dave and All; At 09:23 PM 05/07/99, Dave wrote: CQ: >>The current density inside the hole also goes up if the hole's diameter >>shrinks, but I don't know if that in itself, also increases the interactive >>forces. (?) > DD: >Do the other papers explain the dependence on density, vs. just the total >current? I understand the current->circular field and the surface toroidal >currents, but don't understand that. Interesting that in a toroid coil >winding, the total outer current is the same as that going through the >wires in the center hole (same number of wires). This may not be true for a >permanent magnet toroid, as the currents are "electronic" and the total >currents increase with the radius in the toroid. CQ: No. I don't recall the other papers explaining any additional information on that, [although it may be somehow evident within the formulas] but in my conversation with him, I received the impression that it makes a difference, since he commented on the diameter of the hole as being critical to efficiency, everything else being equal. I neglected to ask which direction though-- since I automatically presumed a smaller diameter opening would increase the effect. Let's see-- If the greater B flux concentration moved to the outer side of the toroid, would that really make any difference though? The 'A' field must move in a circular path around the toroid up through the center no matter where the B flux is radially concentrated inside the toroid, and if the properties of the A field are anything similar to the properties of the B field, I might hazard a guess that the efficiency would improve when the hole diameter is made smaller. Modern manufacturing techniques of PMs may make my ruminations about the B flux concentration [relocation] redundant anyway ;-) Best, Colin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 10:14:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA22402; Sat, 8 May 1999 10:12:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 10:12:28 -0700 Message-ID: <001e01be9975$cb5dd460$395895d1@premio> Reply-To: "Gene Marlin" From: "Gene Marlin" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 12:11:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"TQFtZ1.0.tT5.y17Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10322 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >5/5/99 12:58:32 PM Pacific Daylight Time: It seems that the Kosovo crisis >is taking an unexpected turn. There are indications that a meteorological >weaponry that Russians call MTVR-1 is currently in use to create >atmospherics disturbances over the U.S. What indications? Its severe weather season in the US. When those tornadoes struck Oklahoma and Kansas, all the conditions there were favorable for them. Wind shear, high dew points, and a cold front to act as a focus. Then you had the Jet Stream directly overhead to carry off the storms' exhaust and provide rotation to the mesocyclones. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 11:06:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA12089; Sat, 8 May 1999 11:05:06 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 11:05:06 -0700 Message-ID: <37347D19.E8E58260@harti.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 20:06:17 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ted Gondert , Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Re: Newman's MinnKotta motor tests References: <3733D1F7.A128CC4D@teleweb.net> <37341A03.728E4B3A@harti.com> <37347547.9C8EA2C3@teleweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"O2Slv3.0.oy2.Ip7Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10323 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Ted Gondert wrote: > > > > > But wasn´t it a 24 or 48 Volt type motor ? > > > > Why do you state it was an 12 Volt motor ? > > > > It was 12 volt trolling motor, read his Jan 1 1999 post about it. I'll > include the longer version as attachment to this email. The point I want > to make is that Joe Newman will make up any story to sell his "Energy > Machines". Common sense says to double check your measurement and > calculations when results break "The Laws of Physics". > > BTW I've called Joe Newman a few times to find out more about his > "production motor" but now he doesn't even specify the battery voltage > it runs on, says he is keeping it a secret until the Energy Machines > are in production. Supposedly will produce 10KW 240/120 VAC 60HZ. But > he doesn't specify how he regulates the RPM to get 3600 RPM of the > alternator to produce 60HZ. > > Ted Gondert > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > These are my corrections to Joseph Newman's > calculations in message posted Jan 1 1999 > > "Press Release from Joseph Newman for 1/1/1999" > > "See the MinnKota Motor (representing stolen technology > from myself)" > > "If you can purchase a 41-Thrust Motor that has not > been tampered with, then attach to its shaft a 5-inch > diameter pulley with a rope looped over it and connected > at both ends to a spring tension of approximately 11 lbs.; > also connect it to a charged deep cycle 12-volt battery > with a Simpson 50 amp meter in the circuit (as well as > utilize a Grainger tachometer, to obtain approximately > 1200 rpms." > > "The resulting efficiency equation is 2 x #(3.14) x > lbs.(ft.) x rpm and divided by 33,000 equals the horsepower. > I performed this simple scientific test and obtained 768 > watts out (on the shaft of the Motor) and 45 amps draw at > 12 volts which equals only 540 watts input power, thus > providing 142% (production) efficiency. " > > "During the test conducted, the Motor drew 45 amps. > The heat loss of a Motor is computed as the current squared > times resistance. Using a highly accurate Ohm meter, I > tested the MinnKota Motor's resistance and it proved to be > 0.5 ohms of resistance. 45 amps squared equals 2025 x 0.5 > ohms which equals 1012 watts of heat loss in the Motor > plus 768 watts out on the shaft equals 1,780.5 watts > produced by the MinnKota Motor (which represents technology > stolen from myself) with only 540 watts input power." > ************************************************************** > > Ohms and Watts laws are as follow: VA=P, V^2/R=P, A^2*R=P, > P/V=A, P/A=V, AR=V, (RP)^0.5=V, V/R=A, (P/R)^0.5 = A, V/A=R, > P/A^2= R, V^2/P=R > > Where V is voltage in Volts, A is amperes, P is power in Watts, > R is resistance in Ohms. ^2 is exponential or square, > ^0.5 is square root > > Perhaps Joe oversimplified the formula for horsepower from lbs. > force and RPM and forgot a few factors. 1HP = 33,000 foot pounds > per minute. 1 foot=12 inches. 1 HP = 746 watts. Diameter * > (pi3.14159) = circumference. > > Using 5 inch diameter pulley at 1200 RPM and 11 pounds force > yields:(pi)(5/12)* 1200rpm * 11 pounds/33,000 = 0.524HP or > .524hp X 746w = 391 watts. > > Since input power is 12 Volts * 45 Amps = 540 watts, efficiency > of output shaft power is 391/540 = 72.4%, the rest of the power > is used in the control circuit and/or is dissipated as heat in > the motor. So 540-391=149 watts heat dissipated by the motor and > controller. 149Watt/45Amps^2 = .073 ohms motor and controller > resistance. 45 amps squared is 2025 X .073 ohms = 149 watts > > As for the alleged 0.5 ohm resistance of motor; it's hard to > measure a low resistance with ohmmeter accurately, especially a > motor. Usually use a Kelvin bridge where a current is passed > through with one set of test leads and voltage is measured with > another set. > > If motor had 0.5 ohm dc resistance, than 12 volts would only pass > 24 amps or 288 watts total. But the motor consumes 45 amps at 12 > volts = 540 Watts. So your resistance measurement must be wrong. > Motor resistance is less than 12volts/45amps = .266 ohms maximum. Correct, I agree ! Newman must be wrong with his calculations ! At 12 Volts only a maximum of 24 Amperes can flow in 0.5 Ohms resistance ! > > (All calculations are rounded off) > > If the MinnKota motor truly output more shaft HP or watts than > input watts, it should be possibly to get two MinnKotta motors > connected together as motor/generator to run continuously and > produce power. That is not accepted by most scientists today > because of the Thermodynamic laws of Physics, of which you > are well aware. > > Hope this information helps you. > > Ted Thanks for this insight in calculation errors ! What do you say to this posted info: ===== Sorry for the some what vague unsure description of Joes video, I was doing two things at the same time I was watching it. I believe Joe said the two finger test was 63 volts at roughly 10 MA or less, his analog meter made it hard to pin the current right on the money, As an experiment I tried the same test with my best permanent magnet DC motor which is over 90 percent efficient. and at .6 of a watt it was no problem stopping it with a couple fingers. I realize this is hardly any kind of scientific experiment since the strength of each person will vary, but never the less it was thought provoking! The test with the pony brake I think was at 63 volts also at 1 amp. The motor turned at 60 to 70 RPM while he tightened his brake system down, I couldn't follow that part to well since I don't understand how a pony brake works exactly. but it looked like his brake system consisted of a rope which went around a pulley and created resistance, and I believe he calculated the tension to be 40 pounds of resistance. He said the test showed that he was able to produce .63 HP with about 200 watts. Dave PS I don't know if three fingers would have stoped it? ========== Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 11:37:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA18340; Sat, 8 May 1999 11:25:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 11:25:41 -0700 Message-ID: <373481FF.B7793D9E@harti.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 20:27:11 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: daveem m , Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List , Ted Gondert Subject: Re: I saw Joes latest video. References: <11594-37334277-7331@mailtod-162.iap.bryant.webtv.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"gUYC72.0.PU4.a68Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10324 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: daveem m wrote: > > Sorry for the some what vague unsure description of Joes video, I was > doing two things at the same time I was watching it. I believe Joe said > the two finger test was 63 volts at roughly 10 MA or less, his analog > meter made it hard to pin the current right on the money, > I see, so the amp meter was moving fast up and down during the test ? Was the 0.6. Watts input at 40 RPM ? If the rotor has a lot of inertia due to its weight it is for sure hard to stop it with 2 fingers ! During increasing the RPM from 0 RPM to 40 RPM you put the energy into the rotating rotor ! Afterwards you only keep up versus the friction losses ! Don´t forget this ! > As an experiment I tried the same test with my best permanent magnet DC > motor which is over 90 percent efficient. and at .6 of a watt it was no > problem stopping it with a couple fingers. I realize this is hardly any > kind of scientific experiment since the strength of each person will > vary, but never the less it was thought provoking! Well, yor toy motor probably has not such a big rotor weight, so not so much inertia ! So not so much stored energy ! > The test with the pony brake I think was at 63 volts also at 1 amp. The > motor turned at 60 to 70 RPM while he tightened his brake system down, I > couldn't follow that part to well since I don't understand how a pony > brake works exactly. but it looked like his brake system consisted of a > rope which went around a pulley and created resistance, and I believe he > calculated the tension to be 40 pounds of resistance. He said the test > showed that he was able to produce .63 HP with about 200 watts. So that means he claims: 470 Watts out to 200 Watts in. That is about 235 % efficiency. If you say it was at 1 Ampere at 63 Volts, this is only 63 Watts input ! Did the current raise to 200 Watts / 63 Volts= 3.17 Amperes, when the tightened the prony brake ?? How did he show the 40 pounds resistance ? Was this showed on a scale somehow ? > Dave regards, Stefan. > > PS I don't know if three fingers would have stoped it? > > Dave's Alternative Energy. > http://www.homezen.com/powersys.html -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 11:54:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA26094; Sat, 8 May 1999 11:53:55 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 11:53:55 -0700 From: "Sergei M.Godin" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 22:23:45 +0400 Message-ID: <01be997f$e8760ea0$LocalHost@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"_rkss3.0.UN6.1X8Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10326 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: To Brian, for info: HAARP is only scientific tool for reception of money from government and military ministry. It is absolutely unsuitable for military application. SMG. >Yeah, but we could counter attack by firing up HAARP, couldn't we? >Supposedly, we could also wipe electronics using an EMP generated by it, but >I'm uncertain of the range, etc. so I don't know how practical it could be >for us to target Yugoslavia with an EMP. > >Brian Drake >(Bmd2323@aol.com) > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 11:54:23 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA26074; Sat, 8 May 1999 11:53:53 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 11:53:53 -0700 From: "Sergei M.Godin" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 22:16:42 +0400 Message-ID: <01be997e$ecac5ac0$LocalHost@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"FLvub1.0.DN6.0X8Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10325 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Harley, you wrote: > 5/5/99 12:58:32 PM Pacific Daylight Time:  It seems that the Kosovo crisis >is taking an unexpected turn. There are indications that a meteorological >weaponry that Russians call  MTVR-1 is currently in use to create >atmospherics disturbances over the U.S. > I never heard anything serious concerning this type of the weapon. I think that it is a myth, but if you will give me the references, I shall try to find out more in detail about it. Sergei Godin, Russia From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 13:00:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA12119; Sat, 8 May 1999 13:00:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 13:00:30 -0700 Message-ID: <19990508195959.56562.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [195.92.197.55] From: "Chris Moon" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 12:59:59 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"WrHFy3.0.Gz2.UV9Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10327 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I thought the US had HAARP to play with or doesn't it work?? i.e. why would Clinton worry if you Americans had equally intriguing weapon to throw back on Moscow.. at least its clean! or is there evidence to the contrary? Cheers Chris M. > 5/5/99 12:58:32 PM Pacific Daylight Time:  It seems that the Kosovo >crisis >is taking an unexpected turn. There are indications that a meteorological >weaponry that Russians call  MTVR-1 is currently in use to create >atmospherics disturbances over the U.S. It seems that the Pentagon is >panicking, and Clinton is even talking about halting the air strike against >Yugoslavia!? There was a web site about  this weapon, I can't speak Russian >but [what] I understood is that it does not  need to be applied over the >region one wants to attack and that [it] is not controllable . HDN >reporting from ORBIT site. > > > > >_______________________________________________________ >Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 13:06:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA14450; Sat, 8 May 1999 13:06:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 13:06:01 -0700 Message-ID: <3734992F.2EF38FD2@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 13:06:08 -0700 From: eks1 Reply-To: eks1@earthlink.net Organization: Systems Research Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <199905061447.QAA47594@hermes.fontys.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"1P3ck3.0.cX3.ea9Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10328 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: w wrote: > Hi, > > The official website : www.zeropollution.com > > Regards, > WJ > And for those of our readers that havent been exposed to this concept before, here's what's really happening: 1.) This engine is in fact NOT an Otto-cycle ICE. It is actually a Brayton-cycle ICE, similar to a gas turbine but with pistons to do the work normally performed by the inlet compressor, and the drive turbine. Also note that the combustion IS internal in the sense of being inside the head/block. In a very real sense, this device is LESS EFFICIENT than a gas turbine because of the intermittent or pulsed nature of it's combustion. With Brayton-cycle engines that employ contin. combustion there is LESS pollution and if sized right, the efficiency can approach 50% 2.) SOME of the work of compression is done when the high pressure air tank is filled - please keep this in mind. The device isn't new, it can be matured a bit from the existing design to incorporate regeneration of the high pressure air supply. And if that's not enough to enlighten and demystify, then perhaps the reader should be reading Sadie Carnot instead of New Age prattle! (you know who I'm referring to, don't you?) I for one vite we drop the entire subject of heat engines - they are a totally dead issue, and the laws of thermodynamics DO APPLY! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 13:28:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA20178; Sat, 8 May 1999 13:27:45 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 13:27:45 -0700 Message-ID: <3734A26A.26C5@keelynet.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 15:45:30 -0500 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Reply-To: jdecker@keelynet.com Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: eks1@earthlink.net CC: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <199905061447.QAA47594@hermes.fontys.nl> <3734992F.2EF38FD2@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SqcU02.0.Bx4.1v9Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10329 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Folks! Someone named eks1 wrote; > I for one vite (vote) we drop the entire subject of heat engines - > they are a totally dead issue, and the laws of thermodynamics DO > APPLY! Regarding the dead heat engines, I suggest you read; http://keelynet.com/interact/archive/00000053.htm Yes, do drop the subject, there is no hope, we are doomed, the world ends in 2000, give up. How's this for new age from the Ramayana and the Mahabharata...Not only do we have a centennial end, but a millenial end, plus the 6000 year Kali Yuga cycle (1/4th of the 22,000 year Yuga Cycles) as well as the end of the Great Yuga cycle (48,000 years), all culminating in 2000 AD. So whats the use of doing anything but having fun and blasting the great many things we don't fully understand? The baby will just have to learn to swim on its own in all that dirty bathwater......with some of us HELPING instead of hindering. -- Jerry Wayne Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 13:35:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA25886; Sat, 8 May 1999 13:34:31 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 13:34:31 -0700 From: mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl Message-Id: <37349FC1.1508DCE5@elektro.fontys.nl> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 22:34:10 +0200 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [nl]C-QXW07103 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl, de, en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! References: <19990507052937953.AAA286@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"h0pQa.0.NK6.M_9Dt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10330 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Michael and others, I did some searching on the web about the Negre air engine and I found some info and also the CQFD Air Solution address : At http://www.calstart.org/forum/messages/508 I found this : "Guy Negre has tried to sell his idea to french car makers like Renault and Peugeot. Apparently without any success. Cars will be made in mexico by local car makers under french licence. Eventually 87 000 taxis should be replaced. According to the report the engine weight 34Kg runs at up to 7000 rpm develops 60 to 80 CV (horsepower) and consumes 15 liters of compressed air (200 bars) per hour. Maximal speed 100 Kmh per hour. CQFD Air Solutions is based in France in Brignoles. Source : In the french magazine Science & vie (issue #969 of June 1998, page 130-134) a report by Catherine Cousin." At http://www.calstart.org/forum/messages/804 I found this : "the may 1999 issue of wired has a piece on p. 76: CQFD Air Solution Sarl,in Brignoles, France, led by Guy Negre, has built an airpowered car that makes electric cars seem like noxious nightmares. Negre has designed lightweight engines for lightweight aircraft and Formula One racecars. The clean-burning 2-cylinder motor uses a combination of heated outside air and supercompressed air from tanks stored under the car. The Mexican Government is planning to buy a fleet of 40,000 compressed-air powered taxis. At gas-station air pumps where others inflate tires, Negre can fill up in less than 3 minutes and a tankful lasts about 120 miles. Carbon filters scrub the expired air before it is released. It produces negative pollution, Negre says. He and his team of 20 engineers have developed 3 prototypes: a taxi, a van, and a pickup. They are expected to be released in 2000 at an average cost of $13,000." At http://www.calstart.org/forum/messages/888 I found this : CQFD Air Solution Forum Aurelia Route du Val 83170 Brignoles telephone +33498-051000. E-mail: cqfd.be@infonie.fr I have not checked this address but the email address is correct. The email adress belongs to Guy Negre (or his son?) himself. At this page I found also a newspaper report from the Manchester Guardian: >Air today, Mexico City tomorrow>>Paul Webster in Brignoles> >WITH nothing more than a slight wheeze as the compressed air tap was turned on by the driver, followed by a polite phut-phut from its eco-friendly motor, the bright green car that might change the way we drive in the next century set off for a run outside the workshop in this southern French city. >Its designer, Guy Nègre, who abandoned the Formula One race circuit to build a zero-pollution car, had reason to smile as the vehicle accelerated as smoothly as a petrol-engined version. The demonstration was his first answer to the scores of sceptics who reacted critically when the Guardian Weekly first published the news in February of a compressed-air prototype that could be filled up for a less than $2 and run for 10 hours in urban conditions. >From the pile of correspondence to the editor here is a quote from Graham F Andrews, in Gresham, Oregon, USA, summing up the sceptics' viewpoint. "In his writings on two cultures, C P Snow drew a parallel between liberal arts types who did not know the Second Law of Thermodynamics and technical types who had never read Shakespeare," he wrote. "By this standard your Paul Webster should either go back to school or be demoted to theatre critic." >Apart from the fact that being appointed "theatre" critic should not be considered demotion, I had to check out his theory that it would need several thousand atmospheres to move the vehicle and that pressure would be so high that sitting on the air tank would be like sitting on a bomb. This big bang view is rather important as Mexico plans to mass-produce the vehicle under licence to replace the capital's 87,000 taxis. >Preconceptions about noisy and greasy car factories take a knock on meeting Mr Nègre, whose workshop in this town near the Mediterranean beaches, is as clean as a clinic. White-coated engineers build every component and chassis part for brightly-coloured toy-like taxis that would appeal to Noddy. >Mr Nègre is a down-to-earth, self-taught engine designer. At 58 he is recovering from losing a fortune developing a Formula One motor that ran into opposition from big manufacturers. For this reason he has no plans to take on GM or Ford with a private-car version of the air-driven vehicle. >"There is no point in clashing with the big firms when there are so many specialist slots to be filled," he said, before giving technical details of a motor known as the MDI EV3 C that uses nothing except the air around us. "The air tanks are a special design made in carbon and are 100 percent safe. They contain 300 litres of air at 300 bars and can be refilled in three minutes under high pressure. The car's maximum speed is 100 km/h, and urban autonomy, with full tanks, is 10 hours." >Without taking the compressed air engine apart or sitting in the car for 10 hours while it runs around Mexico City, there is no reason to doubt Mr Nègre's claims, backed up by detailed diagrams that have persuaded 160 backers in Britain and the rest of Europe to take up shares in Motor Development International in Luxembourg, which oversees investment.> >For sceptics who want to take the argument further, Mr Nègre hopes to hear from them at CQFD Air Solution, Forum Aurelia, Route du Val, 83170, Brignoles, telephone +33498-051000. E-mail: cqfd.be@infonie.fr I have also found some patents : http://www.patents.ibm.com/details?patent_number=5592904 I hope you have more info now. Regards, WJ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 14:00:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA01495; Sat, 8 May 1999 13:59:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 13:59:56 -0700 Message-ID: <3734A9F9.7275@keelynet.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 16:17:45 -0500 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Reply-To: jdecker@keelynet.com Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! References: <19990507052937953.AAA286@mail.lcia.com@lizard> <37349FC1.1508DCE5@elektro.fontys.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"630g-.0.GN.CNADt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10331 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi WJ! That was an excellent piece of tracking, thanks for providing all that additional information. There is a short article on use of air motors to drive cars and trolleys in the 1800s when people were more afraid of electricity than air, it is near the bottom of the archive email at; http://keelynet.com/interact/archive/00000050.htm -- Jerry Wayne Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 14:11:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA19660; Sat, 8 May 1999 14:10:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 14:10:26 -0700 Message-ID: <3734A897.CF2BBBCF@harti.com> Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 23:11:51 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: daveem m , Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Analysis of Joe =?iso-8859-1?Q?Newman=B4s?= latest video... References: <27029-37349C43-3105@mailtod-161.iap.bryant.webtv.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"rAkRh.0.jo4.1XADt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10332 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: daveem m wrote: > > >I see, so the amp meter was moving fast >up and down during the test ? > > Yes, but it moved with in a small range that was not beyond 10 MA > > > Was the 0.6. Watts input at 40 RPM ? > > Yes, > > >If the rotor has a lot of inertia due to its >weight it is for sure > hard to stop it with 2 f>fingers ! > > No, I don't believe the inertia would have been any kind of factor > because of the slow RPMs, and the motor it self had a great deal of > internal resistance, Milton could not turn the motor shaft when there > was no power going to the motor. Well yes, of course, cause it has these strong Neodym magnets inside the stator and the rotor gets stuck as in a step motor, cause the rotor has iron in it ! You need a lot of torque to spin the rotor without any electric input verus the forces in the air gaps ! It is as hard e.g. as to pull apart two big Neodym magnets in your hand attracting themself ! > >During increasing the RPM from 0 RPM >to 40 RPM you put the energy into > the >rotating rotor ! >Afterwards you only keep up versus the >friction > losses ! Don´t forget this ! > > As an experiment I tried the same test with my best permanent magnet DC > motor which is over 90 percent efficient. and at .6 of a watt it was no > problem stopping it with a couple fingers. I realize this is hardly any > kind of scientific experiment since the strength of each person will > vary, but never the less it was thought provoking! > >Well, your toy motor probably has not >such a big rotor weight, so not > so much >inertia ! So not so much stored energy ! > > Good point, but again I don't believe inertia was a factor here. Well indeed the intertia is a BIG factor here ! If the rotor weights around 70 or 80 Kgs as I remember correctly ?? you have lots of inertia even at 40 rpm ! Attach a flywheel with 80 Kgs to your 90 % efficient toy motor shaft and spin it up to 40 RPM and keep it spinning with 0.6 Watts and try to stop the shaft with 2 fingers ! It will be the same as hard as to stop the new Newman motor ! > > The test with the pony brake I think was at 63 volts also at 1 amp. The > motor turned at 60 to 70 RPM while he tightened his brake system down, I > couldn't follow that part to well since I don't understand how a pony > brake works exactly. but it looked like his brake system consisted of a > rope which went around a pulley and created resistance, and I believe he > calculated the tension to be 40 pounds of resistance. He said the test > showed that he was able to produce .63 HP with about 200 watts. > > >So that means he claims: > >470 Watts out to 200 Watts in. That is >about 235 % efficiency. > >If you say it was at 1 Ampere at 63 Volts, >this is only 63 Watts input > ! > > Your right, 1 amp times 63 volts is 63 watts. What am I saying? I'm > loosing it, some one call a doctor! I guess I lost track some what. > > >Did the current raise to 200 Watts / 63 >Volts= 3.17 Amperes, when the > tightened >the prony brake ?? > > Sorry again, I cant remember exactly. > I am starting to feel like Bill Clinton here. Well, of course the current is raising, if you put friction via the prony brake onto the shaft ! The amperage input probably went up from 1 Ampere to 3.17 Ampere, so that it gave about 200 Watts input at 63 volts ! I just wonder, if it took such a big rise from 10 mA at 40 RPM to 1 Ampere at 60 to 70 RPM ? Was the motor already loaded by a load at this 60 to 70 RPM ? With no load it should have only increased by a few milliamps, maybe going up until 100 mA, but not to 1 Ampere ! Did you see what the voltage source was ? Were it batteries connected in series ? Or was it a power supply connected to the grid ? > > >How did he show the 40 pounds >resistance ? Was this showed on a scale > somehow ? > > Yes, I think he used a scale much like what you would use to weigh a > fish. I see, yes, that is common for such a friction wheel pulley prony brake. > > If I was Joes witness in court we would both be in trouble. > Dave Well, not if you had a closer look ! :) You have to watch these tapes over and over to see the real evidence in them... Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 16:18:14 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA07733; Sat, 8 May 1999 16:17:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 16:17:30 -0700 Message-ID: <3734C666.77976A3C@harti.com> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 01:19:02 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: eric@voicenet.com, Newman-L Mailing List , Free Energy Subject: Re: why two power measurements References: <3734ABB7.A00D78DA@voicenet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"CFqF83.0.ku1.9OCDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10333 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Eric Krieg wrote: > > Stefan, > > I don't get why Newman would go through the trouble of even getting a prony brake. If he has 200% >overunity, it would be far cheaper and easier to just buy and hook up to a generator and supply his >input power that way. Yes, that is right. Also because when he was lately asked in a public demo, "what this motor would do by hooking it up to a house generator" he said: "It would blow up your house" :) That was a pretty good joke ! :) >Then no one could accuse him of bad input and output power readings. You wouldn't need any >instrumentation expertise to confirm that an isolated motor/generator pair was putting out continuous >power. I guess, he is still not setup for it yet. probably he has not yet found any generator , that would fit to his shaft and produce enough power to couple it this way. Otherwise he would have shown this.. This assumes, that the claim of over 200 % efficiency is right, which also could be wrong ! >I could do electrical power measurement, but I don't even know anyone who could independently >confirm >shaft power measurement - it seems a silly exercise. Likewise, trying to stop a polished >shaft with >great rotational inertia means nothing. Well, yes, mechanical measurements are pretty difficult ! I agree totally. > In this case, one must assume that Newman may be >trying to >cover underunity. The long history of >false OU clams justify great skepticism and caution in >this >case. Well, yes, I also believe it would be better to optimize a Newman machine into the direction of electrical output via the Correa and Chernetski effects and I guess mechanically it still can be underunity. Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 16:39:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA11768; Sat, 8 May 1999 16:38:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 16:38:54 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: psi to hp ???? Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 23:38:19 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <3734c02b.81764097@mail-hub> References: <19990508044954.21591.qmail@hotmail.com> In-Reply-To: <19990508044954.21591.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id QAA11700 Resent-Message-ID: <"4f_j11.0.ht2.DiCDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10334 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 07 May 1999 21:49:53 PDT, flytch er wrote: [snip] > >And I ask again HOW DO YOU GET HP FROM FROM PSI?????? > [snip] Oops egg on face time again. Looks like I mixed up psi and atm between posts. Please bear in mind that thermo is not my strong suit, so I'm kind of learning as I go here, and this may well be wrong too. If anyone can do better please jump in. In all of the following the assumption is made that we are dealing with an ideal gas. The amount of work that can be done actually depends on the way in which the gas is expanded. If it is done rapidly, with no heat exchange with the environment (adiabatically), then we get a lower limit. If it is done infinitely slowly, with perfect heat exchange with the environment (isothermally - constant temperature), then we get an upper limit. Reality will lie somewhere between these two limits. Adiabatic expansion: The internal energy in a gas (i.e. the total kinetic energy of all the molecules) is p x V, for any pressure and volume. Let the initial pressure be p0, and the initial volume be V0. The total energy is then p0 x V0. Let the initial temperature be T0. If we let this gas expand, doing work in the process, then the temperature will drop. After expansion, let the final pressure be p1, and the final volume be V1. Let the final temperature be T1. Since no heat is exchanged with the environment, we can say that the work done will be the difference in internal energy of the gas between initial and final states. I.e. p0 x V0 = W + p1 x V1 equ. I Because for an ideal gas, p0 x V0/T0 = p1 x V1/T1 we can rewrite equ. I as: p0 x V0 = W + (T1/T0) x p0 x V0 shuffling this around a bit gives W = p0 x V0 x (1 - T1/T0) Now in the ideal case that T1 drops as far as absolute zero, we see that W = p0 x V0. IOW all the initial internal energy of the gas is extracted as work. So given the 300 liter volume from one of the URLs as V0, and my own guesstimate of 800 atm as p0, the total internal energy is 24.3 million joules or 9.06 hp x hr. (Note this is power times time; any combination of hp and time is valid, as long as the product remains the same. E.g. 4.5 hp for 2 hours would also be OK). This is basically the idealisation that I originally used in my earlier posts. Isothermal expansion: If we assume that the gasses in question behave as ideal gasses, then the ideal gas law can be used. This states that pV/T = nR. Given that the amount of gas doesn't change during expansion, nR is a constant. So now we can say that p x V / T = p0 x V0 / T0. (A '0' suffix implies the initial condition). IOW given any two of the three, the third can be calculated based on initial conditions. If we now assume isothermal expansion of the gas (constant temperature), where heat from the environment is absorbed during the expansion, we have T = T0 (by definition). So the above simplifies to: p x V = p0 x V0 or rewritten p = p0 x V0 / V. (p and V both change continuously during expansion). I'm now going to assume that the amount of work done during an infinitesimal expansion of the gas (dW) is: dW = p dV. >From this we get W = integral(p dV) = integral(p0 x V0 /V) dV which is W = p0 x V0 x ln(V1/V0), where V1 is the volume of the gas after expansion, which can be found from V1 = p0 x V0 / P1 (constant temps.) So V1/V0 = P0/P1, and the formula becomes W = p0 x V0 x ln(p0/p1). Since we let the gas escape into the atmosphere, p1 = 1 atm. If P0 = 800 atm, then ln(p0/p1) = ln(800) = ~6.7. => W = p0 x V0 x 6.7 = 800 atm x 300 liter x 6.7 = ~ 61 hp x hr. Conclusion: Given that the gas expands in a motor very rapidly, I suspect that reality will be nearer to adiabatic rather than isothermal expansion. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 18:24:46 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA30203; Sat, 8 May 1999 18:24:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 18:24:24 -0700 Message-ID: <19990509012426.85540.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.239] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Doomsday 20 years Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 18:24:25 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"t7qXh1.0.qN7.7FEDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10335 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Apparently my years as an English major did more damage to my ability to >communicate than I once thought, as you have totally missed my point. >Certainly, there are going to be postings which deviate from the letter of >rules of this list. As long as those deviations don't violate the SPIRIT >of >this list, they are okay. After all, a device which pokes a hole in an >established scientific theory, but isn't a free energy device is an >important >piece of evidence in the battle to prove that mainstream science doesn't >have >all the answers. > >I fail to see, however, how an apocalyptic dream which relies on numerology >for its conclusion can have anything to do with this lists subject matter. >Speculation on UFO propulsion, certainly. Especially if its on the level >of >Hill's "Unconventional Flying Objects" as too much of what is appearing on >this list is sorely lacking in hard data to back it up. The fact that one >person may find something interesting is not enough reason to post it to >the >list. If we fail to practice self-censorship and do limit ourselves to the >topics which this list is supposed to address, it will lose any value which >it might have, simply because the very people who are accessing the list >for >important information needed to complete their latest project will be >unable >to get what they need. > >And yes, off-topic subjects can inspire people to collaborate, but what >will >they be collaborating on? If their collaboration is on a free energy >matter, >wonderful, but odds are, if their spending all their time discussing >off-topic items, they won't be spending their time doing on-topic projects. > >If you want to discuss something off-topic, start a separate list to >discuss >such a subject, but don't take up space on this list with something that >doesn't belong. The amount of e-mails I've had to delete because they have >no bearing on this list is rapidly increasing and I am seriously >considering >unsubscribing because of it. > >This is a wonderful forum and a wonderful opportunity for all of us IF we >use >it properly. Failing to do so, will simply turn this into little more than >a >conversation at a cocktail party. That is NOT why I subscribed to this >list. > If I want to be bombarded by light, fluffy chatter, I'll turn on a talk >radio program. If I want information on free energy and related subjects >I'll check this list, but if it turns out that I'm not getting anything >other >than light and fluffy, I'll look elsewhere. > >I, too, am interested in alternatives to current theories, but at the same >time, I'm not going to bombard the list with those things that don't seem >to >have a relevance to this list. Certainly, it is entirely possible that two >things which don't seem to have a relevance at first, or a connection could >appear between two items later on. If they have a relation to free energy, >fine, the post them, if not, be polite and don't take up space here. If >you >really must discuss them, a simple request for other people interested in >the >topic to e-mail you privately is the proper thing to do. > >Brian Drake >(Bmd2323@aol.com) WOW! did you stop to breathe???................................. _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 18:57:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA04657; Sat, 8 May 1999 18:57:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 18:57:14 -0700 Message-Id: <199905090157.UAA27258@mw1.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: psi to hp ???? Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 20:54:36 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lzKM6.0.g81.wjEDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10336 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Try this route; At hiway speeds, the typical engine developes a combustion pressure of about 1200 psi (100 octane) so if you know the cubic inches and the horsepower rating for a particular engine, you can extrapolate horsepower/psi for a typical wasteful today's engine. Joe Portman....trivia to work with ======================= ---------- > From: Robin van Spaandonk > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: psi to hp ???? > Date: Saturday, May 08, 1999 6:38 PM > > On Fri, 07 May 1999 21:49:53 PDT, flytch er wrote: > [snip] > > > >And I ask again HOW DO YOU GET HP FROM FROM PSI?????? > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 19:13:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA08893; Sat, 8 May 1999 19:13:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 19:13:33 -0700 Message-Id: <199905090213.VAA10364@mw3.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 21:10:55 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"MKe7Y2.0.sA2.DzEDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10337 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Those SUVs are ugly too, ain't they. I like old cars because they are a mixture of beauty and tech, whereas new cars are all tech and pure ugly. Beauty may be only skin deep, but ugly goes all the way to the bone. Joe Portman trivia ============== ---------- > From: Michael T Huffman > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: A car tank fill up for 2 US$ and a 120 miles range ! I want this now! > Date: Saturday, May 08, 1999 7:38 AM > > Joe wrote: > >My 23 Maxwell has a 4 cyl engine...Joe Portman > >==================================== > > Hi Joe, > > the auto industry's latest offerings in the way of SUV's. Gawd, what BEASTS > they are! They're HUGE! > > Knuke, still shaking his head... > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 19:15:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA10092; Sat, 8 May 1999 19:15:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 19:15:26 -0700 Message-ID: <013001be99c1$d42e6220$065dadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 22:06:49 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"ZAw2K2.0.TT2.z-EDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10341 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > Being as the underlying HAARP technology was developed by Tesla, and he >thought he had caused a nuclear type event in Siberia, while testing his >equipment, I would think that the range would be fairly impressive. The speculation that the Tunguska event was caused by Tesla was put forth by Oliver Nicholsen as far as I know, not Tesla himself. If someone knows otherwise, I'd love to see the reference. -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 19:15:45 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA10125; Sat, 8 May 1999 19:15:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 19:15:29 -0700 Message-ID: <013101be99c1$d4c57200$065dadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 22:11:51 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"I5nmC.0.hS2.u-EDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10340 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > I thought about it, and scalar waves came to mind, but the brick was >gold, and I thought that if this was a magnetic phenomenon, only a material >that was influenced by magnetism would behave in such a way. Gold is not >one of those materials, and I told him so. He smiled and said that the >brick was only gold plated. He wouldn't say any more, but I will ask him >the next time I see him. It doesn't sound too unconventional to me. Somewhere I've seen a "levitation" demonstration consisting of a small iron ball held in space by an electromagnet. A light and a photocell are used to switch the magnet on and off rapidly to hold the ball in mid-air rather than letting it be pulled all the way up to the magnet. Someone please help me out here by identifying the gadget I'm thinking of. > Have you tried doing scalar experiments with lasers? Charles Berlitz and William Moore write, in "The Philadelphia Experiment", that they've seen a secret government paper on using lasers to generate gravity waves for communications purposes. -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 19:17:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA09971; Sat, 8 May 1999 19:15:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 19:15:17 -0700 Message-ID: <012f01be99c1$d3868960$065dadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 22:04:47 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"Eo9fw1.0.dR2.r-EDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10338 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > reporting from ORBIT site. You've got to be careful about that site! Most of it is speculation, and some of it is inaccurate. I remember not long ago, during the EQ Pegasi signal hoax, they were trying to start the old spacecraft-disguised-as-comet garbage again. But the comet which was supposedly moving out of Pegasus was in fact headed TOWARD Pegasus! And I just noticed yesterday they've got a report on the newly-discovered Comet Lee which is expected to peak at magnitude 7 this August, coupled with a quote from Nostradamus about an August when "the beast will be visible in daylight" or something like that. Magnitude 7 won't even be visible with the naked eye at night, let alone daylight! -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 19:17:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA10034; Sat, 8 May 1999 19:15:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 19:15:22 -0700 Message-ID: <013201be99c1$d56bc420$065dadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 22:15:24 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"J9AHv2.0.gS2.u-EDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10339 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >I thought the US had HAARP to play with or doesn't it work?? i.e. why would >Clinton worry if you Americans had equally intriguing weapon to throw back >on Moscow.. at least its clean! or is there evidence to the contrary? While Eastlund's patents hint at weather-control uses for such technology, and some people invent grandiose conspiracy theories, the existing HAARP facility is a PROTOTYPE and is used for research into the ionosphere. -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 19:35:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA19356; Sat, 8 May 1999 19:35:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 19:35:01 -0700 Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 21:34:57 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <001e01be9975$cb5dd460$395895d1@premio> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"oGdV9.0.Hk4.LHFDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10342 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 8 May 1999, Gene Marlin wrote: > > > > >5/5/99 12:58:32 PM Pacific Daylight Time: It seems that the Kosovo crisis > >is taking an unexpected turn. There are indications that a meteorological > >weaponry that Russians call MTVR-1 is currently in use to create > >atmospherics disturbances over the U.S. > > What indications? Its severe weather season in the US. When those tornadoes > struck Oklahoma and Kansas, all the conditions there were favorable for > them. > > Wind shear, high dew points, and a cold front to act as a focus. Then you > had the Jet Stream directly overhead to carry off the storms' exhaust and > provide rotation to the mesocyclones. > Tom Bearden wrote about Russian weather control of U.S. weather in one of his papers. He described telltale cloud patterns that indicated such a device was in use. According to Mr. Bearden, it was in use back in the 70's and 80's. Right now, their economy (including the government) is in poor shape and I don't know that they can afford to fire up the system. The cloud patterns described were a sort of a ring with cloud streamers radiating out from the ring; these patterns appeared on a 20-mile square grid pattern. Anyone up for cloudbusting? Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 19:43:28 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA21759; Sat, 8 May 1999 19:43:10 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 19:43:10 -0700 Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 21:43:06 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <19990508195959.56562.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"-_RZw.0.sJ5.-OFDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10343 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sat, 8 May 1999, Chris Moon wrote: > I thought the US had HAARP to play with or doesn't it work?? i.e. why would > Clinton worry if you Americans had equally intriguing weapon to throw back > on Moscow.. at least its clean! or is there evidence to the contrary? > > Cheers > > Chris M. > > No one (at least among us common citizens) really knows what HAARP really is all about. All I have seen is speculation with no definite proof. Artificial aurora projects (its reported purpose) have been done since the 70's when an experiment was performed in Colorado. I know they were attempting to generate artificial FAI (field-aligned irregularities) as several radio amateurs active on VHF were asked to participate in that experiment. Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 8 22:03:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA09818; Sat, 8 May 1999 22:02:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 22:02:39 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990508203854.22772be2@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 20:38:54 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: VACE elements? In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990508113129.009028f0@inforamp.net> References: <3.0.6.16.19990507212349.2377a172@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990507124159.0112a100@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990505135058.23878fc8@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990505030320.00810a90@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990504180023.238703c2@earthlink.net> <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"GnKCV.0.FP2.lRHDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10344 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Colin and all, At 11:31 AM 5/8/99 -0700, you wrote: ... >Let's see-- If the greater B flux concentration moved to the outer side of >the toroid, would that really make any difference though? The 'A' field >must move in a circular path around the toroid up through the center no >matter where the B flux is radially concentrated inside the toroid, and if >the properties of the A field are anything similar to the properties of the >B field, I might hazard a guess that the efficiency would improve when the >hole diameter is made smaller. Modern manufacturing techniques of PMs may >make my ruminations about the B flux concentration [relocation] redundant >anyway ;-) > Yes, it might not matter. In the paper it mentioned that Reginald Gray tried using real currents, bur shielded in most parts in iron pipe. It isn't clear that the A field can be shielded in the same way as the B field, or its possible path through/ inside the toroid. I am still trying to get some ideas clear in my mind. For the VACE's both Ampere and Lorentz force angular factors are given. One is something like 3A-2B while the other is B-A, where A and B are trig. factors. The angle where the Ampere force is zero is the same that solenoid coils can be mounted for min. coupling. Other larger issues for me. The Lorentz force can be written using a current element and the B field from the other. For a perfect toroid, there is no external B field, so the interactive force should be zero, not just present with different coefficients. Then there is the Ampere longnitudinal force which seems a second order effect, that is 1000's of Amps are required to demonstrate it, as opposed to a length of wire, a "D" cell, and a compass. I know it is connected to the VACE experiments by the "real" current element force interactions, but haven't looked at the two closely enough. It sure seems like the force between 2 elements defines a force field, and if this isn't the normal magnetic B field, then this is new. Another demonstration of the A field for me is trying to figure out the energy coupling mechanisms for a transformer, like the thread last August with shielding the secondary windings. On a related matter, does anyone know what ceramic material ceramic magnets are made of, like speaker magnets. I know Barium ferrite, BaFe(12)O(19) is one example. I will find a copy of "Ferromagnetism" by Bozorth and look there. In particular, can they be heated to their Curie temperature (which is?) without changing their mechanical grain structure, so they are magnetically blank and can be repoled? -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 00:41:55 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA10283; Sun, 9 May 1999 00:41:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 00:41:17 -0700 From: Bmd2323@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 03:40:26 EDT Subject: Blaclight power To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"cUtMl1.0.aW2.TmJDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10345 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Has anyone taken a good look at the Blacklight Power website (www.blacklightpower.com)? They claim that by dropping the electron of hydrogen atoms they can get a massive amount of power from the reaction, somewhere between the levels of chemical and nuclear. They've gotten a patent in Australia and claim to have others pending. According to the Buckminster Fuller Institute's website (www.bfi.org) one could build a car engine using their technology which weighs a mere 22 pounds and has a performance level equal to conventional internal combustion engines. It sounds a bit far fetched to me, but they claim to have raised $10 million so far, and are publishing test results, etc. on their site. Its worth a look. Brian Drake (Bmd2323@aol.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 02:19:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA20079; Sun, 9 May 1999 02:16:42 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 02:16:42 -0700 Message-ID: <37355275.FB877F44@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 02:16:37 -0700 From: eks1 Reply-To: eks1@earthlink.net Organization: Systems Research Ltd. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "freenrg-L@eskimo.com" Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <199905061447.QAA47594@hermes.fontys.nl> <3734992F.2EF38FD2@earthlink.net> <3734A26A.26C5@keelynet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lfc5P2.0.ev4.v9LDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10346 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: "Jerry W. Decker" wrote: > Hi Folks! > > Someone named eks1 wrote; Yes, that's my user name at earthlink.net. If you had bothered to look me up, you'd find that I have been a fairly quiet, background player in the energy arena - with many interdisciplinary skills. > > > I for one vite (vote) we drop the entire subject of heat engines - > > they are a totally dead issue, and the laws of thermodynamics DO > > APPLY! > > Regarding the dead heat engines, I suggest you read; > > http://keelynet.com/interact/archive/00000053.htm > Good references Jerry, thanks for posting them! The threads about Maxwell's Demon (usually referred to as Carnot's Demon by thermodynamics-types) is of particular significance, in a very real sense stretching the temperature and working pressures of the operating range of any heat engine comes close to modelling this concept. > Yes, do drop the subject, there is no hope, we are doomed, the world > ends in 2000, give up. > Your use of sarcasm as humor is duly noted. > How's this for new age from the Ramayana and the Mahabharata...Not only > do we have a centennial end, but a millenial end, plus the 6000 year > Kali Yuga cycle (1/4th of the 22,000 year Yuga Cycles) as well as the > end of the Great Yuga cycle (48,000 years), all culminating in 2000 AD. Oh please..I know you don't buy all that BS! (And BTW, I wasn't referring to YOU personally when I made that crack. Suffice it to say that the comment was intended towards a broader field of this list's more "noisy" posters...one's who seem to forget that Bill created this list for discussion of the topics of ALTERNATE ENERGY!) They keep posting numerology and philosophical meanderings, or 3 word replies while quoting entire postings in their damn fool follow-ups! ..I would hardly term the Negre engine as anything but a heat engine..a clever one perhaps, but nothing that isn't predicted exactly by thermodynamics. > > > So whats the use of doing anything but having fun and blasting the great > many things we don't fully understand? You might ask that same question of virtually the entire population at large..oh, wait..it seems they've already decided on that as a course of action! Sorry..I thought we WERE having fun! ;) > > > The baby will just have to learn to swim on its own in all that dirty > bathwater......with some of us HELPING instead of hindering. Very amusing. Jerry, the Negre Air-Motor isn't new. Those of us that were involved in the JPL car study (back in 1975-76) investigated several dozen systems that used compressed air schemes. Many of them had regeneration built into their designs. > > -- > Jerry Wayne Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com > http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" > Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 > KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 Yes...everyone who's been semi-awake for the last 20 years knows who you are, and honors your continued commitment to the cause. That includes me! Sincerely, Erik Karl Sorgatz (KB6LUY) <---that's ham radio talk for I passed the tests!) (all-around-computer-nerd-and-Boy Scientist at large.. ..look me up in the Who'sWho, or the NIC if you just have to know more.) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 02:40:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA23031; Sun, 9 May 1999 02:40:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 02:40:15 -0700 From: RoConroy@aol.com Message-ID: <15526d76.2466b1db@aol.com> Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 05:39:39 EDT Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"yqVES1.0.md5.-VLDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10347 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/8/99 9:16:29 PM Central Daylight Time, jshaffer@csrlink.net writes: << The speculation that the Tunguska event was caused by Tesla was put forth by Oliver Nicholsen as far as I know, not Tesla himself. If someone knows otherwise, I'd love to see the reference. >> What does anyone know of Tesla. 99.5% of the U.S. high school students haven't even heard of him, yet he was responsible for the alternating current electrical system lighting their school halls, high voltage sources in their auto ignitions and computer screens, and according to a ruling by our own Supreme Court, the initial inventor of the radio. Yet some non educated paper boy protege of Henry Ford, Edison, not only cheated Tesla of money owed for improving the D.C. system, but tried to unfairly discredit Tesla's A.C. system. What is a reasonable answer to why, what had to be a scientific wonder, the metal geodesic topped tower Tesla built on Long Island, and which possibly provided the source location for the Tunguska event, was torn town almost immediately? Why is Tesla a non identity in the school system, apart from the fact that "what is good for General Electric (Edison based company) is good for the U.S."? Is the 99% sweat espoused by Edison, his own or that of the people he hired? What was Morgan's role in the financial ruin of Tesla and for what purpose, and what was Morgan's role in the government? Were Morgan's investments in energy a reason for undermining Tesla and any of his "free energy" notions then, and have Morgan's present counter parts continued in Morgan's footsteps? Did the government take Tesla's files upon his death, and if so, how have they been used? Bob From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 02:56:34 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA25432; Sun, 9 May 1999 02:56:00 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 02:56:00 -0700 Message-ID: <005d01be9a02$1fd64220$571a0fcb@default> From: "Glenville T. Sawyer" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 19:16:14 +0930 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"UJMvR2.0.DD6.mkLDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10348 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hmm.. A ring of cloud with streamers out of them ...... Sounds a LOT like the "contrails" mystery to me ! IIRC http://www.contrails.com/ is the location for a bit of "conspiracy theory" in relation to contrails. Just my devaulued $0.02 Glenville vk5zcf From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 04:03:58 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id EAA31323; Sun, 9 May 1999 04:02:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 04:02:58 -0700 Message-ID: <37356AF7.73021DF3@harti.com> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 13:01:11 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ted Gondert , Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Re: Newman's MinnKotta motor tests under investigation References: <3733D1F7.A128CC4D@teleweb.net> <37341A03.728E4B3A@harti.com> <37347547.9C8EA2C3@teleweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lN_EV1.0.Kf7.XjMDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10349 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Ted Gondert wrote: Hi Ted, > Using 5 inch diameter pulley at 1200 RPM and 11 pounds force > yields:(pi)(5/12)* 1200rpm * 11 pounds/33,000 = 0.524HP or > .524hp X 746w = 391 watts. This is okay. > > Since input power is 12 Volts * 45 Amps = 540 watts, efficiency > of output shaft power is 391/540 = 72.4%, the rest of the power > is used in the control circuit and/or is dissipated as heat in > the motor. So 540-391=149 watts heat dissipated by the motor and > controller. 149Watt/45Amps^2 = .073 ohms motor and controller > resistance. 45 amps squared is 2025 X .073 ohms = 149 watts This you have just CALCULATED from the energy conservation formulas ? Right ? I don´t trust these formulas anymore ! So how do you come to the conclusion, that the ohmic resistance is just only as small as 0.073 Ohms, when Mr. Newman claims 0.5 Ohm ? That is only 14.6 % of the resistance he had measured... Are you sure his meters would do such a big error ?? > As for the alleged 0.5 ohm resistance of motor; it's hard to > measure a low resistance with ohmmeter accurately, especially a > motor. Usually use a Kelvin bridge where a current is passed > through with one set of test leads and voltage is measured with > another set. Hmm, but I guess you will not get a 85.4 % wrong reading wiuth his meter ?! > > If motor had 0.5 ohm dc resistance, than 12 volts would only pass > 24 amps or 288 watts total. But the motor consumes 45 amps at 12 > volts = 540 Watts. So your resistance measurement must be wrong. > Motor resistance is less than 12volts/45amps = .266 ohms maximum. Let us assume the motor had 0.2 Ohms resistance: 45Amps x 45Amps x 0.2 Ohm= 405 Watts ohmic heating. Together with your corrected mechanical output of 391 watts this would give: 796 Watts. 796 Watts out / 540 Watts in = 147 % efficiency. Now it really depends how much ohmic DC resistance that motor really had. Maybe we should ask Minn Kotta about it ?? Anybody know any Techsupport guy at this company ? But this test also clearly shows, that the Minn Kotta motor is NOT MECHANICALLY OVERUNITY, which is a "slab" into Newman´s face ! If his new motor will ever go mechanically overunity, I still doubt that with these calculations in mind ... Newman bases all his hopes that his new motor also goes mechanically overunity, otherwise it does not make sense to produce and sell this motor to couple it with an AC generator to produce power. It always will produce less AC output power than DC power put in into his motor. That is also why he never was able to show a closed loop system running on its own energy. > Hope this information helps you. > > Ted Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 07:00:34 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA16488; Sun, 9 May 1999 06:59:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 06:59:59 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Blaclight power Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:03:46 -0400 Message-ID: <19990509140346421.AAA283@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"BCnlr2.0.X14.UJPDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10350 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Brian wrote: >Has anyone taken a good look at the Blacklight Power website >(www.blacklightpower.com)? Hi Brian, The Vortex Group has been studying this since it first came out. Some inconclusive experimentation by members of the group was done, but the protocols were not followed exactly, and the inventor was not involved with the experimentation. Blacklight Power does have major funding, and the theoretical basis for the claims is pretty sound, in my opinion. As always, there is a lot of engineering work to be done before any commercial product can be offered, but Blacklight Power has been busy hiring some very good people to do that work. If you want to read more, you can go through the Vortex-l archives. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 07:18:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA20213; Sun, 9 May 1999 07:17:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 07:17:39 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:21:27 -0400 Message-ID: <19990509142127171.AAA160@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"kdAEc3.0.kx4.3aPDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10351 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Thanks for the comeback, Jeff. If there was a photocell involved in the setup, then it might explain how the unexpected camera flash might disturb the timing, and cause the object to fall. I've still haven't read the Philadelphia Experiment, but the last I heard, gravity waves were not considered to be conventional physics. I have read some papers from people that were considered "fringy" on the concept, though, and it is interesting. Interacting, or manipulating gravity is still a mystery to me, and I think, to most people. I'll pass this by my friend the next time I see him. Thanks again, Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 07:50:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA27216; Sun, 9 May 1999 07:50:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 07:50:22 -0700 Message-ID: <3735A447.6FB9B714@servtech.com> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 11:05:43 -0400 From: Robert Gray X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Blaclight power References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ozVDx2.0.5f6.j2QDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10352 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have been follow Blacklight Power for a few years now. I think they have something of real importance. They have a lot of "independent" labs confirm their results. Unfortunately, I hear that they are not pursuing the energy aspects. They seem to want to pursue the materials aspects. That is, with the electrons in lower than ground state states, new molecules are possible with new properties. I think they are looking for investors to come in and license the energy aspects of their process. That is, they want someone else to implement the conversion of power plants. They seem to have the details worked out, but they want to focus on other applications. That's what I hear anyway. Bob Gray Bmd2323@aol.com wrote: > Has anyone taken a good look at the Blacklight Power website > (www.blacklightpower.com)? They claim that by dropping the electron of > hydrogen atoms they can get a massive amount of power from the reaction, > somewhere between the levels of chemical and nuclear. They've gotten a > patent in Australia and claim to have others pending. According to the > Buckminster Fuller Institute's website (www.bfi.org) one could build a car > engine using their technology which weighs a mere 22 pounds and has a > performance level equal to conventional internal combustion engines. It > sounds a bit far fetched to me, but they claim to have raised $10 million so > far, and are publishing test results, etc. on their site. Its worth a look. > > Brian Drake > (Bmd2323@aol.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 08:13:51 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA32220; Sun, 9 May 1999 08:13:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 08:13:01 -0700 Message-ID: <001001be9a2e$442c9c60$465895d1@premio> Reply-To: "Gene Marlin" From: "Gene Marlin" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:11:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"Lu2oV3.0.Lt7.zNQDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10353 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: ><< The speculation that the Tunguska event was caused by Tesla was put forth >by > Oliver Nicholsen as far as I know, not Tesla himself How certain are we that the Tunguska incident was Tesla-induced? Are there plans for Tesla devices that can wreak that sort of havoc on demand? I have always been in the impact-camp for Tunguska, but I have read up on Nikola Tesla before and would like somebody to enlighten me on his link to Tunguska. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 08:15:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA00583; Sun, 9 May 1999 08:15:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 08:15:02 -0700 Message-ID: <001d01be9a2e$8ec06860$465895d1@premio> Reply-To: "Gene Marlin" From: "Gene Marlin" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:13:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"MipOS.0.y8.rPQDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10354 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > A ring of cloud with streamers out of them ...... How about a ring-shaped hole in a cloud with a cirrus streamer inside of it? I have an example of one in one of Corliss' books! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 08:44:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA06790; Sun, 9 May 1999 08:41:45 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 08:41:45 -0700 Message-ID: <000d01be9a32$8998fe20$24f8fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: "Free Energy" Subject: 'A' Field and Thrust Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:42:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"9R-gY3.0._f1.voQDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10355 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Some additional information on the possible thrust from the Magnetic Vector Potential and two shaping toroid coils has been added to our study on the effect. Take a look, it is very interesting test which rules out the first question of thermal effect of the connecting wires. It further tends to indicate that the hypothesis of Rick Andersen as far as the field presence and action therefrom may be accurate. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 08:48:40 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA08915; Sun, 9 May 1999 08:48:08 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 08:48:08 -0700 Message-ID: <001701be9a33$6ef656c0$24f8fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: "Free Energy" Subject: Fw: 'A' Field and Thrust Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:48:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"Ds9r62.0.CB2.uuQDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10356 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: atg0317 To: Free Energy Date: Sunday, May 09, 1999 10:43 AM Subject: 'A' Field and Thrust >Some additional information on the possible thrust from the Magnetic Vector >Potential and two shaping toroid coils has been added to our study on the >effect. Take a look, it is very interesting test which rules out the first >question of thermal effect of the connecting wires. > >It further tends to indicate that the hypothesis of Rick Andersen as far as >the field presence and action therefrom may be accurate. > Sorry I dis not include the site address in case you have not looked at the first tests. Here is the new test location. http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 09:59:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA20777; Sun, 9 May 1999 09:59:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 09:59:01 -0700 Message-ID: <3735DA06.7C7891E8@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 11:55:02 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: 'A' Field and Thrust References: <000d01be9a32$8998fe20$24f8fea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"0x4Mg.0.Y45.LxRDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10357 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > > Some additional information on the possible thrust from the Magnetic Vector > Potential and two shaping toroid coils has been added to our study on the > effect. Take a look, it is very interesting test which rules out the first > question of thermal effect of the connecting wires. Very interesting results. I may have seen the paper flexing action just now, but I am still not using the proper toroids as you are. I plan to order them tomorrow, shipped quickly, and conduct some more tests on this. If the paper flexing is caused not by a buoyancy effect from thermal heating, that would also tend to rule out EM effects, AFAIK. As far as magnetic effects occuring on the toroids themselves, do note that the earth's magnetic field has a vertical component... This is very interesting though. I wonder what higher u(r) cores would do? Increase the effect? Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 10:33:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA27962; Sun, 9 May 1999 10:32:55 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:32:55 -0700 Message-ID: <3735C737.670EDC72@bellsouth.net> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 12:34:47 -0500 From: Hamilton Smith X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en]C-bls40 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Light Saber Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"r5NlE2.0.lq6.7RSDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10358 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: A light saber can be modelled as a single ended, specially shaped and tuned scalar interferometer. A particular 'tesla globe'.(Bearden, Gravitobiology) Just a little pre 'Phantom Menace' excitement. See you in the theatres. hchester. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 10:34:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA29352; Sun, 9 May 1999 10:34:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 10:34:39 -0700 Message-ID: <000601be9a42$4f9d9900$24f8fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: 'A' Field and Thrust Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 12:35:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"JVJQB3.0.OA7.kSSDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10359 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sunday, May 09, 1999 12:01 PM Subject: Re: 'A' Field and Thrust >atg0317 wrote: >> >> Some additional information on the possible thrust from the Magnetic Vector >> Potential and two shaping toroid coils has been added to our study on the >> effect. Take a look, it is very interesting test which rules out the first >> question of thermal effect of the connecting wires. > >Very interesting results. I may have seen the paper flexing action just >now, but I am still not using the proper toroids as you are. I plan to >order them tomorrow, shipped quickly, and conduct some more tests on >this. If the paper flexing is caused not by a buoyancy effect from >thermal heating, that would also tend to rule out EM effects, AFAIK. As >far as magnetic effects occuring on the toroids themselves, do note that >the earth's magnetic field has a vertical component... > >This is very interesting though. I wonder what higher u(r) cores would >do? Increase the effect? > >Kyle R. Mcallister > Here are some thing that are not yet on the site which may help in duplicating the tests. (1) The toriods should have a ration of 1.5:1. This is preliminary, although so far it has worked with bigger designs which are now being tested. (2) The wire layer must be 'Single' layer. The wrap style must be as uniform as possible, uneven spacing will distort the fields effect and make it directional. (3) A force is present between the two coils if not mounted as close as possible. Although Rick Andersen does not say it, he indicates via a picture that the coils have some gap between. As yet we have not explored this except to the extent that some thrust is lost when this is done. (4) Potential (i.e., Voltage of excitation appears to have a greater effect than current (at this point at least). Low voltage high current with equal power does not equal same force as high voltage and lower current. Still looking at this. (5) With the discharge method any number of external factors may cause an interaction, also remember the toriod changes it saturation curve once pulsed. Let things cool between tests or the results will not be the same. We have tried constant direct current and not pulsed. The results will appear later. Think about this, the last project you worked on we sent a mail to you direct, think of a similar configuration to increase field potential, there is more to this than straight magnetic vector potential. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 11:20:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA06477; Sun, 9 May 1999 11:17:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 11:17:13 -0700 Message-ID: <3735D09C.20D7@keelynet.com> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 13:14:52 -0500 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Reply-To: jdecker@keelynet.com Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: eks1@earthlink.net CC: "freenrg-L@eskimo.com" Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <199905061447.QAA47594@hermes.fontys.nl> <3734992F.2EF38FD2@earthlink.net> <3734A26A.26C5@keelynet.com> <37355275.FB877F44@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"7A13D2.0.6b1.f4TDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10360 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Erik et al! I didn't take it as anything personal and was aware of where it was pointing as I had the same problem at one time. Just a bit puzzled that anyone on a freenrg list would rule out the possibility that the 2nd law could be in error and that someone might have developed something that wasn't well known....ergo, the Schlictig device. I saw it work so have great confidence in Earl...at the time, we talked for about 2 hours about it and his views on patents and research, I was impressed with the man and his machine which charged up AS HE MADE HIS CASE on stage. This Maxwell Demon machine of Schlictigs was a purely mechanical device, no electronics, with one finger size probe that was above the machine and another that hung off the edge of the table....it was August, we were in a cooled hotel conference room, probably about 73 or so degrees. The device had a pressure gauge that could clearly be seen by the audience and the machine sat on a simple table, in the open and fully available for detailed inspection. At the beginning of the talk, the pressure gauge was at zero...as Earl talked you could not see the gauge move but after about 35 minutes, the gauge had slowly risen to roughly 35psi, tapping into the ambient temperature differential between the two probes... Earl pointed this out, that the device was now charged, though not fully as the gauge was I think about 50psi max...he only had an hour for his presenation....he turned a valve to release the pressure, the machine made a 'chuffa-chuffa' sound and a flywheel spun around to dissipate the pressure...it only ran for a few seconds because the accumulator wasn't that big, but it was impressive. Earl said the thing worked on as little as 3 degrees Fahrenheit and that it would continually charge and discharge if the temperature differential was high enough to sustain the load. At the time he was looking for funding and was disappointed that no one at the conference (Global Sciences) had approached him for funding. So, with the demon at work, fed by black heated refrigerant solar panels as the hot side and probes in the ground as the cold side, you could easily get temperature differentials of at least 100 degrees or more to keep the machine running continuously and produce power or mechanical energy depending on configuration. As to the 'new age' mess, I don't honestly think anything of import is going to happen due to any spook cycle, its just odd with so many of them dovetailing and in some case from very ancient and disparate sources. Y2K and all that...we shall see. Anyway, my purpose was simply to offer new information which a friend in Switzerland had so kindly shared and which directly applied to your 2nd law inviolate statement. I am particularly intrigued by Schlictig's camera lucida observations of elongated particles having a preferred direction in Brownian motion and that a particle ionized on one end will have the same proclivity of motion...most intriguing....thanks for the reply....just doing my job....seeya! -- Jerry Wayne Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 13:56:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA15306; Sun, 9 May 1999 13:55:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 13:55:54 -0700 Message-ID: <3735D982.452B75D4@telusplanet.net> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 13:52:50 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Light Saber References: <3735C737.670EDC72@bellsouth.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"zbyIp2.0.vk3.QPVDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10362 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: yeah but how? and what would power it practically? Hamilton Smith wrote: > > A light saber can be modelled as a single ended, specially shaped and > tuned scalar interferometer. A particular 'tesla globe'.(Bearden, > Gravitobiology) > > Just a little pre 'Phantom Menace' excitement. > > See you in the theatres. > hchester. -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 13:57:03 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA15342; Sun, 9 May 1999 13:55:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 13:55:57 -0700 Message-ID: <3735D990.67FDA54F@telusplanet.net> Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 13:53:04 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? References: <012f01be99c1$d3868960$065dadd1@default> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"5Cw0T2.0.Il3.SPVDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10363 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Jim I heard that the supposed hoax may not havebeen a hoax entirely... seems like when this first came out a few people came out and discreditited it right away, among whom were those who had been involved with propagting it at the outset, however some digger deeping seems to show that the hoax label may have been a smoke screen... Jim Shaffer, Jr. wrote: > > > reporting from ORBIT site. > > You've got to be careful about that site! Most of it is speculation, and some > of it is inaccurate. I remember not long ago, during the EQ Pegasi signal hoax, > they were trying to start the old spacecraft-disguised-as-comet garbage again. > But the comet which was supposedly moving out of Pegasus was in fact headed > TOWARD Pegasus! And I just noticed yesterday they've got a report on the > newly-discovered Comet Lee which is expected to peak at magnitude 7 this August, > coupled with a quote from Nostradamus about an August when "the beast will be > visible in daylight" or something like that. Magnitude 7 won't even be visible > with the naked eye at night, let alone daylight! > > -- > home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer -- Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, don't wait for it, just... let it happen. -- Special Agent Dale Cooper --------------------------------------------------------------------- Don J. S. Adams Managing Consultant RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 14:00:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA14044; Sun, 9 May 1999 13:53:19 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 13:53:19 -0700 Message-ID: <003901be9a5d$777bf140$62684fc6@default> From: "mrand@access" To: Subject: Re: 'A' Field and Thrust Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 13:49:15 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"xaBMs3.0.FR3.-MVDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10361 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317, Kyle and all, Interesting experiments and good web site layout! Rick Andersen's theory looked logical and your experiments indicates possible verification. Thanks for sharing your experiments with freenrg-l. Looking forward to hearing more of your work! Thanks - Michael Randall From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 17:04:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA31026; Sun, 9 May 1999 17:04:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 17:04:01 -0700 Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 02:09:47 +0200 Message-Id: <199905100009.CAA25827@ns.b.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@pop3.vossnet.de X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" To: Ted Gondert From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Re: Newman's MinnKotta motor tests under investigation Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, newman-l@emachine.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id RAA31004 Resent-Message-ID: <"0qCO51.0.da7.n9YDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10364 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 16:58 09.05.99 -0500, Ted Gondert wrote: > > >> > Since input power is 12 Volts * 45 Amps = 540 watts, efficiency >> > of output shaft power is 391/540 = 72.4%, the rest of the power >> > is used in the control circuit and/or is dissipated as heat in >> > the motor. So 540-391=149 watts heat dissipated by the motor and >> > controller. 149Watt/45Amps^2 = .073 ohms motor and controller >> > resistance. 45 amps squared is 2025 X .073 ohms = 149 watts >> >> This you have just CALCULATED from the energy conservation formulas ? >> Right ? >> I don´t trust these formulas anymore ! > >Sure those are standard formulas I used. Maybe the accepted laws of >physics are all wrong, BUT I WOULDN'T BET ON IT!!! :-) > Sure, but they only apply for linearly approached designs. Nonlinearity is not handled by these formulas or at least not quite convincing or only via mathematic tricks which do not apply to reality ! >Anyone with common sense would check their measurements and calculations >before declaring that "Thermodynamic Laws of Physics" are wrong. That is right. > >If motor has 0.2 ohms resistance, than at least the current could flow, >with no rotor rotation, but when the motor turns it generates a "back >EMF" that bucks the input voltage. AFIK. Read any book on electrical >motors for more iformation. :-) If you stall a DC motor the current draw >usually goes up because then there is no back EMF/voltage to buck >against the input voltage. Just check your own small DC motor and see >what the results are, try your ohmmeter than input a current of 1 amp or >so, just use external resistor and also measure the voltage drop. Divide >Voltage by Current to get Resistance, as Ohms law says. I agree, but we have a totally different case here with the Minn Kota motor under test load conditions ! It is running at 12 Volts and draws 45 Amps ! So at (assume) 0.2 Ohms internal resistance it generates itself an Internal counter EMF of 3 volts, so we have a difference voltage of 9 Volts / 0.2 Ohms = 45 Amps ! Remember there is the heavy prony brake friction load on the motor so the internal generated EMF is much smaller than in the idle mode ! When holding still the rotor it would draw then 60 Amps at 0.2 Ohm internal resistance. Well it just makes no sense to argue, if we don´t know the internal DC resistance of the motor coils... The most important thing is: Your corrected math did really show, that the MECHANICAL output of the Minn Kotta motor was STILL UNDERUNITY, which leads me to the conclusion , that Joe´s new motor also will not be much better in its mechanical output. Regards, Stefan. > >I have some small RC car motors but they pull several amps. Will try to >connect them to old computer 5 volt power supply and do some testing on >them just to get some numbers, such as resistance, etc. > >As for MinnKotta motors, they are sold at department stores, and boat, >fishing stores. Maybe they have a webpage, But of course Joe Newman >claims that the "overunity" models were removed from stock when Joe >found out. :-0 Notice how he has covered his tracks, even if you get a >MinnKotta motor, he will claim that it wasn't one of the special "high >efficiency" or overunity models, like he tested. Surprising that Joe >Newman was so STUPID!!!!NOT TO BUY UP THOSE MOTORS!!!!! AFTER ALL THEY >WERE PRODUCTION MODELS THAT PROOVED HIS THEORY!!!!! He could than have >the motors independantly tested scientifically and release the >information to the world. ;-) > >Like the old story about the "Liars Club", "The first Liar doesn't stand >a chance!" :-) > >I'm convinced Joe Newman is a conman, if he truly had working models why >has he never allowed independant verification? What takes 20 years since >he started publishing his book, etc. to build a prototype that works? > >And why can't the motor just run itself from a generator? > >Like NIKE says, "Just DO IT!" :-) > >It will be interesting to read Joes excuses in July when his production >motors are NOT made. :-) > >If I'm wrong, well I'll admit a mistake. :-) > >Ted Gondert > -- Hartmann Multimedia Service Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann WEB-Site: www.harti.com www.ccard.net email: harti@harti.com info@ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 17:14:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA01284; Sun, 9 May 1999 17:14:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 17:14:26 -0700 Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 02:20:15 +0200 Message-Id: <199905100020.CAA26240@ns.b.vossnet.de> X-Sender: leoguitar@pop3.vossnet.de (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, "Free Energy" From: harti@harti.com (Stefan Hartmann) Subject: Re: Fw: 'A' Field and Thrust Cc: atgroup@atgroup.org, atg0317@wt.net Resent-Message-ID: <"xV1Nq3.0.zJ.YJYDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10365 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 10:48 09.05.99 -0500, freenrg-l@eskimo.com wrote: >From: atg0317 >To: Free Energy >Date: Sunday, May 09, 1999 10:43 AM >Subject: 'A' Field and Thrust > > >>Some additional information on the possible thrust from the Magnetic Vector >>Potential and two shaping toroid coils has been added to our study on the >>effect. Take a look, it is very interesting test which rules out the first >>question of thermal effect of the connecting wires. >> >>It further tends to indicate that the hypothesis of Rick Andersen as far as >>the field presence and action therefrom may be accurate. >> >Sorry I dis not include the site address in case you have not looked at the >first tests. Here is the new test location. > >http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm > > Great reults, especially with this pice of paper. I guess this field opens up the real antigravity research ! BTW, whart happened to your special TEP device, which you claimed a while back last year to be "self sustaining" ? Was this any measurement error ? Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann WEB-Site: www.harti.com www.ccard.net email: harti@harti.com info@ccard.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 20:43:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA15583; Sun, 9 May 1999 20:43:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 20:43:05 -0700 Message-ID: <00fd01be9a97$4119c660$135cadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 12:50:35 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"SCvfj3.0.Op3.8NbDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10366 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Does anyone know what would happen if you fired a vortex cannon at a tornado while it was forming? Would it disrupt it completely, or would it only cause it to break into smaller vortices? -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 20:43:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA15655; Sun, 9 May 1999 20:43:10 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 20:43:10 -0700 Message-ID: <00fe01be9a97$41a7ae80$135cadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 12:59:25 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"koWWR2.0.Sq3.ENbDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10368 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Oliver Nichelson 333 N 760 E Am. Fork, Utah 84003 Nikola Tesla's Long Range Weapon Oliver Nichelson Copyright 1989 The French ship Iena blew up in 1907. Electrical experts were sought by the press for an explanation. Many thought the explosion was caused by an electrical spark and the discussion was about the origin of the ignition. Lee De Forest, inventor of the Audion vacuum tube adopted by many radio broadcasters, pointed out that Nikola Tesla had experimented with a "dirigible torpedo" capable of delivering such destructive power to a ship through remote control. He noted, though, Tesla also claimed that the same technology used for remotely controlling vehicles also could project an electrical wave of "sufficient intensity to cause a spark in a ship's magazine and explode it." It was Spring of 1924, however, that the time seemed best for "death rays," for that year many newspapers carried a several stories about their invention in different parts of the world. Harry Grindell-Matthews of London lead the contenders in this early Star Wars race. The New York Times of May 21st had this report: Paris, May 20 - If confidence of Grindell Mathew (sic), inventor of the so-called 'diabolical ray,' in his discovery is justified it may become possible to put the whole of an enemy army out of action, destroy any force of airplanes attacking a city or paralyze any fleet venturing within a certain distance of the coast by invisible rays. Grindell-Matthews stated that his destructive rays would operate over a distance of four miles and that the maximum distance for this type of weapon would be seven or eight miles. "Tests have been reported where the ray has been used to stop the operation of automobiles by arresting the action of the magnetos, and an quantity of gunpowder is said to have been exploded by playing the beams on it from a distance of thirty-six feet." Grindell-Matthews was able, also, to electrocute mice, shrivel plants, and light the wick of an oil lamp from the same distance away. Sensing something of importance the New York Times copyrighted its story on May 28th on a ray weapon developed by the Soviets. The story opened: News has leaked out from the Communist circles in Moscow that behind Trotsky's recent war-like utterance lies an electromagnetic invention, by a Russian engineer named Grammachikoff for destroying airplanes. Tests of the destructive ray, the Times continued, had began the previous August with the aid of German technical experts. A large scale demonstration at Podosinsky Aerodome near Moscow was so successful that the revolutionary Military Council and the Political Bureau decided to fund enough electronic anti-aircraft stations to protect sensitive areas of Russia. Similar, but more powerful, stations were to be constructed to disable the electrical mechanisms of warships. The Commander of the Soviet Air Services, Rosenholtz, was so overwhelmed by the ray weapon demonstration that he proposed "to curtail the activity of the air fleet, because the invention rendered a large air fleet unnecessary for the purpose of defense." Picking up the death ray stories on the wire services on the other side of the world, the Colorado Springs Gazette, ran a local interest item on May 30th. With the headline: "Tesla Discovered 'Death Ray' in Experiments He Made Here," the story recounted, with a feeling of local pride, the inventor's 1899 researches financed by John Jacob Astor. Tesla's Colorado Springs tests were well remembered by local residents. With a 200 foot pole topped by a large copper sphere rising above his laboratory he generated potentials that discharged lightning bolts up to 135 feet long. Thunder from the released energy could be heard 15 miles away in Cripple Creek. People walking along the streets were amazed to see sparks jumping between their feet and the ground, and flames of electricity would spring from a tap when anyone turned them on for a drink of water. Light bulbs within 100 feet of the experimental tower glowed when they were turned off. Horses at the livery stable received shocks through their metal shoes and bolted from the stalls. Even insects were affected: Butterflies became electrified and "helplessly swirled in circles - their wings spouting blue halos of 'St. Elmo's Fire.'" The most pronounced effect, and the one that captured the attention of death ray inventors, occurred at the Colorado Springs Electric Company generating station. One day while Tesla was conducting a high power test, the crackling from inside the laboratory suddenly stopped. Bursting into the lab Tesla demanded to know why his assistant had disconnected the coil. The assistant protested that had not anything. The power from the city's generator, the assistant said, must have quit. When the angry Tesla telephoned the power company he received an equally angry reply that the electric company had not cut the power, but that Tesla's experiment had destroyed the generator! The inventor explained to The Electrical Experimenter, in August of 1917 what had happened. While running his transmitter at a power level of "several hundred kilowatts" high frequency currents were set up in the electric company's generators. These powerful currents "caused heavy sparks to jump thru the winds and destroy the insulation." When the insulation failed, the generator shorted out and was destroyed. Some years later, 1935, he elaborated on the destructive potential of his transmitter in the February issue of Liberty magazine: My invention requires a large plant, but once it is established it will be possible to destroy anything, men or machines, approaching within a radius of 200 miles. He went on to make a distinction between his invention and those brought forward by others. He claimed that his device did not use any so-called "death rays" because such radiation cannot be produced in large amounts and rapidly becomes weaker over distance. Here, he likely had in mind a Grindell-Matthews type of device which, according to contemporary reports, used a powerful ultra- violet beam to make the air conducting so that high energy current could be directed to the target. The range of an ultra-violet searchlight would be much less than what Tesla was claiming. As he put it: "all the energy of New York City (approximately two million horsepower [1.5 billion watts]) transformed into rays and projected twenty miles, would not kill a human being." On the contrary, he said: My apparatus projects particles which may be relatively large or of microscopic di- mensions, enabling us to convey to a small area at a great distance trillions of times more energy than is possible with rays of any kind. Many thousands of horsepower can be thus transmitted by a stream thinner than a hair, so that nothing can resist. Apparently what Tesla had in mind with this defensive system was a large scale version of his Colorado Springs lightning bolt machine. As airplanes or ships entered the electric field of his charged tower, they would set up a conducting path for a stream of high energy particles that would destroy the intruder's electrical system. A drawback to having giant Tesla transmitters poised to shoot bolts of lightning at an enemy approaching the coasts is that they would have to be located in an uninhabited area equal to its circle of protection. Anyone stepping into the defensive zone of the coils would be sensed as an intruder and struck down. Today, with the development of oil drilling platforms, this disadvantage might be overcome by locating the lightning defensive system at sea. As ominous as death ray and beam weapon technology will be for the future, there is another, more destructive, weapon system alluded to in Tesla's writings. When Tesla realized, as he pointed out in the 1900 Century article, "The Problem of Increasing Human Energy," that economic forces would not allow the development of a new type of electrical generator able to supply power without burning fuel he "was led to recognize [that] the transmission of electrical energy to any distance through the media as by far the best solution of the great problem of harnessing the sun's energy for the use of man." His idea was that a relatively few generating plants located near waterfalls would supply his very high energy transmitters which, in turn, would send power through the earth to be picked up wherever it was needed. The plan would require several of his transmitters to rhythmically pump huge amounts of electricity into the earth at pressures on the order of 100 million volts. The earth would become like a huge ball inflated to a great electrical potential, but pulsing to Tesla's imposed beat. Receiving energy from this high pressure reservoir only would require a person to put a rod into the ground and connect it to a receiver operating in unison with the earth's electrical motion. As Tesla described it, "the entire apparatus for lighting the average country dwelling will contain no moving parts whatever, and could be readily carried about in a small valise." However, the difference between a current that can be used to run, say, a sewing machine and a current used as a method of destruction, however, is a matter of timing. If the amount of electricity used to run a sewing machine for an hour is released in a millionth of a second, it would have a very different, and negative, effect on the sewing machine. Tesla said his transmitter could produce 100 million volts of pressure with currents up to 1000 amperes which is a power level of 100 billion watts. If it was resonating at a radio frequency of 2 MHz, then the energy released during one period of its oscillation would be 100,000,000,000,000,000 Joules of energy, or roughly the amount of energy released by the explosion of 10 megatons of TNT. Such a transmitter, would be capable of projecting the energy of a nuclear warhead by radio. Any location in the world could be vaporized at the speed of light. Not unexpectedly, many scientists doubted the technical feasibility of Tesla's wireless power transmission scheme whether for commercial or military purposes. The secret of how through- the-earth broadcast power was found not in the theories of electrical engineering, but in the realm of high energy physics. Dr. Andrija Puharich, in 1976, was the first to point out that Tesla's power transmission system could not be explained by the laws of classical electrodynamics, but, rather, in terms of relativistic transformations in high energy fields. He noted that according to Dirac's theory of the electron, when one of those particles encountered its oppositely charged member, a positron, the two particles would annihilate each other. Because energy can neither be destroyed nor created the energy of the two former particles are transformed into an electromagnetic wave. The opposite, of course, holds true. If there is a strong enough electric field, two opposite charges of electricity are formed where there was originally no charge at all. This type of trans- formation usually takes place near the intense field near an atomic nucleus, but it can also manifest without the aid of a nuclear catalyst if an electric field has enough energy. Puharich's involved mathematical treatment demonstrated that power levels in a Tesla transmitter were strong enough to cause such pair production. The mechanism of pair production offers a very attractive explanation for the ground transmission of power. Ordinary electrical currents do not travel far through the earth. Dirt has a high resistance to electricity and quickly turns currents into heat energy that is wasted. With the pair production method electricity can be moved from one point to another without really having to push the physical particle through the earth - the transmitting source would create a strong field, and a particle would be created at the receiver. If the sending of currents through the earth is possible from the viewpoint of modern physics, the question remains of whether Tesla actually demonstrated the weapons application of his power transmitter or whether it remained an unrealized plan on the part of the inventor. Circumstantial evidence points to there having been a test of this weapon. The clues are found in the chronology of Tesla's work and financial fortunes between 1900 and 1915. 1900: Tesla returned from Colorado Springs after a series of important tests of wireless power transmission. It was during these tests that his magnifying transmitter sent out waves of energy causing the destruction of the power company's generator. He received financial backing from J. Pierpont Morgan of $150,000 to build a radio transmitter for signaling Europe. With the first portion of the money he obtained 200 acres of land at Shoreham, Long Island and built an enormous tower 187 feet tall topped with a 55 ton, 68 foot metal dome. He called the research site "Wardenclyffe." As Tesla was just getting started, investors were rushing to buy stock offered by the Marconi company. Supporters of the Marconi Company include his old adversary Edison. On December 12th, Marconi sent the first transatlantic signal, the letter "S," from Cornwall, England to Newfoundland. He did this with, as the financiers noted, equipment much less costly than that envisioned by Tesla. 1902: Marconi is being hailed as a hero around the world while Tesla is seen as a shirker by the public for ignoring a call to jury duty in a murder case (he was excused from duty because of his opposition to the death penalty). 1903: When Morgan sent the balance of the $150,000, it would not cover the outstanding balance Tesla owed on the Wardenclyffe construction. To encourage a larger investment in the face of Marconi's success, Tesla revealed to Morgan his real purpose was not to just send radio signals but the wireless transmission of power to any point on the planet. Morgan was uninterested and declined further funding. A financial panic that Fall put an end to Tesla's hopes for financing by Morgan or other wealthy industrialists. This left Tesla without money even to buy the coal to fire the transmitter's electrical generators. 1904: Tesla writes for the Electrical World, "The Transmission of Electrical Energy Without Wires," noting that the globe, even with its great size, responds to electrical currents like a small metal ball. Tesla declares to the press the completion of Wardenclyffe. 1904: The Colorado Springs power company sues for electricity used at that experimental station. Tesla's Colorado laboratory is torn down and is sold for lumber to pay the $180 judgement; his electrical equipment is put in storage. 1905: Electrotherapeutic coils are manufactured at Wardenclyffe for hospitals and researchers to help pay bills. Tesla is sued by his lawyer for non-payment of a loan. In an article, Tesla comments on Peary's expedition to the North Pole and tells of his, Tesla's, plans for energy transmission to any central point on the ground. Tesla is sued by C.J. Duffner, a caretaker at the experi- mental station in Colorado Springs, for wages . 1906: "Left Property Here; Skips; Sheriff's Sale," was the headline in the Colorado Springs Gazette for March 6th. Tesla's electrical equipment is sold to pay judgement of $928.57. George Westinghouse, who bought Tesla's patents for alter- nating current motors and generators in the 1880's, turns down the inventor's power transmission proposal. Workers gradually stop coming to the Wardenclyffe labor- atory when there are no funds to pay them. 1907: When commenting on the destruction of the French ship Iena, Tesla noted in a letter to the New York Times that he has built and tested remotely controlled torpedoes, but that electrical waves would be more destructive. "As to projecting wave energy to any particular region of the globe ... this can be done by my devices," he wrote. Further, he claimed that "the spot at which the desired effect is to be produced can be calculated very closely, assuming the accepted terrestrial measurements to be correct." 1908: Tesla repeated the idea of destruction by electrical waves to the newspaper on April 21st. His letter to the editor stated, "When I spoke of future warfare I meant that it should be conducted by direct application of electrical waves without the use of aerial engines or other implements of destruction." He added: "This is not a dream. Even now wireless power plants could be constructed by which any region of the globe might be rendered uninhabitable without subjecting the population of other parts to serious danger or inconvenience." 1915: Again, in another letter to the editor, Tesla stated: "It is perfectly practical to transmit electrical energy without wires and produce destructive effects at a distance. I have already constructed a wireless transmitter which makes this possible... When unavoidable, the [transmitter] may be used to destroy property and life." Important to this chronology is the state of Tesla's mental health. One researcher, Marc J. Seifer, a psychologist, believes Tesla suffered a nervous breakdown catalyzed by the death of one the partners in the Tesla Electric Company and the shooting of Stanford White, the noted architect, who had designed Wardenclyffe. Seifer places this in 1906 and cites as evidence a letter from George Scherff, Tesla's secretary: Wardenclyffe, 4/10/1906 Dear Mr. Tesla: I have received your letter and am very glad to know you are vanquishing your illness. I have scarcely ever seen you so out of sorts as last Sunday; and I was frightened. In the period from 1900 to 1910 Tesla's creative thrust was to establish his plan for wireless transmission of energy. Undercut by Marconi's accomplishment, beset by financial problems, and spurned by the scientific establishment, Tesla was in a desperate situation by mid-decade. The strain became too great by 1906 and he suffered an emotional collapse. In order to make a final effort to have his grand scheme recognized, he may have tried one high power test of his transmitter to show off its destructive potential. This would have been in 1908. The Tunguska event took place on the morning of June 30th, 1908. An explosion estimated to be equivalent to 10-15 megatons of TNT flattened 500,000 acres of pine forest near the Stony Tunguska River in central Siberia. Whole herds of reindeer were destroyed. The explosion was heard over a radius of 620 miles. When an expedition was made to the area in 1927 to find evidence of the meteorite presumed to have caused the blast, no impact crater was found. When the ground was drilled for pieces of nickel, iron, or stone, the main constituents of meteorites, none were found down to a depth of 118 feet. Many explanations have been given for the Tunguska event. The officially accepted version is that a 100,000 ton fragment of Encke's Comet, composed mainly of dust and ice, entered the atmosphere at 62,000 mph, heated up, and exploded over the earth's surface creating a fireball and shock wave but no crater. Alternative versions of the disaster see a renegade mini-black hole or an alien space ship crashing into the earth with the resulting release of energy. Associating Tesla with the Tunguska event comes close to putting the inventor's power transmission idea in the same speculative category as ancient astronauts. However, by looking at the above chronology, it can be seen that real historical facts point to the possibility that this event was caused by a test firing of Tesla's energy weapon. In 1907 and 1908, Tesla wrote about the destructive effects of his energy transmitter. His Wardenclyffe transmitter was much larger than the Colorado Springs device that destroyed the power station's generator. His new transmitter would be capable of effects many orders of magnitude greater than the Colorado device. In 1915, he said he had already built a transmitter that "when unavoidable ... may be used to destroy property and life." Finally, a 1934 letter from Tesla to J.P. Morgan, uncovered by Tesla biographer Margaret Cheney, seems to conclusively point to an energy weapon test. In an effort to raise money for his defensive system he wrote: The flying machine has completely demoralized the world, so much so that in some cities, as London and Paris, people are in mortal fear from aerial bombing. The new means I have perfected affords absolute protection against this and other forms of attack... These new discoveries I have carried out experimentally on a limited scale, created a profound impression (emphasis added). Again, the evidence is circumstantial but, to use the language of criminal investigation, Tesla had motive and means to be the cause of the Tunguska event. He also seems to confess to such a test having taken place before 1915. His transmitter could generate energy levels and frequencies that would release the destructive force of 10 megatons, or more, of TNT. And the overlooked genius was desperate. The nature of the Tunguska event, also, is not inconsistent with what would happen during the sudden release of wireless power. No fiery object was reported in the skies at that time by professional or amateur astronomers as would be expected when a 200,000,000 pound object enters the atmosphere. The sky glow in the region, mentioned by some witnesses, just before the explosion may have come from the ground, as geological researchers discovered in the 1970's. Just before an earthquake the stressed rock beneath the ground creates an electrical effect causing the air to illuminate. If the explosion was caused by wireless energy transmission, either the geological stressing or the current itself would cause an air glow. Finally, there is the absence of an impact crater. Because there is no material object to impact, an explosion caused by broadcast power would not leave a crater. Given Tesla's general pacifistic nature it is hard to understand why he would carry out a test harmful to both animals and the people who herded the animals even when he was in the grip of financial desperation. The answer is that he probably intended no harm, but was aiming for a publicity coup and, literally, missed his target. At the end of 1908, the whole world was following the daring attempt of Peary to reach the North Pole. Peary claimed the Pole in the Spring of 1909, but the winter before he had returned to the base at Ellesmere Island, about 700 miles from the Pole. If Tesla wanted the attention of the international press, few things would have been more impressive than the Peary expedition sending out word of a cataclysmic explosion on the ice in the direction of the North Pole. Tesla, then, if he could not be hailed as the master creator that he was, could be seen as the master of a mysterious new force of destruction. The test, it seems, was not a complete success. It must have been difficult controlling the vast amount of power in transmitter and guiding it to the exact spot Tesla wanted. Alert, Canada on Ellesmere Island and the Tunguska region are all on the same great circle line from Shoreham, Long Island. Both are on a compass bearing of a little more than 2 degrees along a polar path. The destructive electrical wave overshot its target. Whoever was privy to Tesla's energy weapon demonstration must have been dismayed either because it missed the intended target and would be a threat to inhabited regions of the planet, or because it worked too well in devastating such a large area at the mere throwing of a switch thousands of miles away. Whichever was the case, Tesla never received the notoriety he sought for his power transmitter. In 1915, the Wardenclyffe laboratory was deeded over to Waldorf- Astoria, Inc. in lieu of payment for Tesla's hotel bills. In 1917, Wardenclyffe was dynamited on orders of the new owners to recover some money from the scrap. The evidence is only circumstantial. Perhaps Tesla never did achieve wireless power transmission through the earth. Maybe he made a mistake in interpreting the results of his radio tests in Colorado Springs and did not produce an effect engineers, then and now, know is a scientific impossibility. Perhaps the mental stress he suffered caused him to retreat completely to a fantasy world from which he would send out preposterous claims to reporters who gathered for his yearly, copy-making pronouncements on his birthday. Maybe the atomic bomb size explosion in Siberia near the turn of the century was the result of a meteorite no one saw fall. Or, perhaps, Nikola Tesla did shake the world in a way that has been kept secret for over 80 years. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 20:43:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA15613; Sun, 9 May 1999 20:43:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 20:43:07 -0700 Message-ID: <00fc01be9a97$40272900$135cadd1@default> From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 12:48:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Resent-Message-ID: <"Zrp2w1.0.rp3.BNbDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10367 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > What is a reasonable answer to why, what had to be a scientific wonder, >the metal geodesic topped tower Tesla built on Long Island, and which >possibly provided the source location for the Tunguska event, was torn town >almost immediately? He owed a lot of money? -- home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 21:02:04 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA24664; Sun, 9 May 1999 21:01:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 21:01:41 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990509235325.00a3c3c0@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sun, 09 May 1999 23:53:25 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: VACE elements? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990508203854.22772be2@earthlink.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19990508113129.009028f0@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990507212349.2377a172@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990507124159.0112a100@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990505135058.23878fc8@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990505030320.00810a90@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990504180023.238703c2@earthlink.net> <000f01be9677$747bd620$485ffea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"VbAAd.0.H16.bebDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10369 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: To Dave and all, At 08:38 PM 05/08/99, Dave wrote: >In the paper it mentioned that Reginald Gray tried using real currents, bur >shielded in most parts in iron pipe. It isn't clear that the A field can be >shielded in the same way as the B field, or its possible path through/ >inside the toroid. Perhaps a very small PM toroid can be used as a search tool to map the steady-state 'A' field, much as ATG is using a small piece of paper to "map" the time-varying 'A' field. > >Then there is the Ampere longnitudinal force which seems a second order >effect, that is 1000's of Amps are required to demonstrate it, as opposed >to a length of wire, a "D" cell, and a compass. I know it is connected to >the VACE experiments by the "real" current element force interactions, but >haven't looked at the two closely enough. It sure seems like the force >between 2 elements defines a force field, and if this isn't the normal >magnetic B field, then this is new. >Another demonstration of the A field for me is trying to figure out the >energy coupling mechanisms for a transformer, like the thread last August >with shielding the secondary windings. I'm unqualified to do other than guess at the answers, but Kyle and ATG are using Rick Anderson's theories and getting some amazing results with a time-varying "Magnetic Vector Potential or 'A' Field" (isn't this the same the same as a time-varying VACE? ). I must commend them and Rick for their excellence with experimentation and collaboration. I think the issue of whether a DC (or PM) double-toroid experiment giving identical results as a time-varying 'A' field is critical, and I would "guess" that it perhaps does *not* have identical properties, but-- that can only be decided by empirical testing. That's as far as I will or can go. According to ATG, we may not have long to wait. I must say-- this is all very exciting. Colin. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 23:00:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA13844; Sun, 9 May 1999 23:00:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 23:00:15 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 05:59:41 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <3737748a.193507073@mail-hub> References: <199905061447.QAA47594@hermes.fontys.nl> <3734992F.2EF38FD2@earthlink.net> <3734A26A.26C5@keelynet.com> <37355275.FB877F44@earthlink.net> <3735D09C.20D7@keelynet.com> In-Reply-To: <3735D09C.20D7@keelynet.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id XAA13822 Resent-Message-ID: <"YkxMo3.0.DO3.lNdDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10370 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 09 May 1999 13:14:52 -0500, Jerry W. Decker wrote: [snip] >Earl said the thing worked on as little as 3 degrees Fahrenheit and that >it would continually charge and discharge if the temperature >differential was high enough to sustain the load. > >At the time he was looking for funding and was disappointed that no one >at the conference (Global Sciences) had approached him for funding. > >So, with the demon at work, fed by black heated refrigerant solar panels With a temperature differential, you don't need a demon. The purpose of Maxwell's demon was to create a temperature differential, where one doesn't exist, by taking advantage of the fact that some molecules are more energetic than others. >as the hot side and probes in the ground as the cold side, you could Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 23:19:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA17296; Sun, 9 May 1999 23:18:34 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 23:18:34 -0700 Message-ID: <373679A2.3651@keelynet.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 01:16:02 -0500 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Reply-To: jdecker@keelynet.com Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <199905061447.QAA47594@hermes.fontys.nl> <3734992F.2EF38FD2@earthlink.net> <3734A26A.26C5@keelynet.com> <37355275.FB877F44@earthlink.net> <3735D09C.20D7@keelynet.com> <3737748a.193507073@mail-hub> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"qjDe_2.0.9E4.wedDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10371 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Robin et al! Robin van Spaandonk wrote; > With a temperature differential, you don't need a demon. The purpose > of Maxwell's demon was to create a temperature differential, where > one doesn't exist, by taking advantage of the fact that some > molecules are more energetic than others. Sorry Robin, you must be very tired or sleepy as that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. A temperature differential ALWAYS exists on many levels, the demon simply purifies or separates it. If its energetic, it has more heat so your 'fact that some molecules are more energetic than others' should be 'fact that some molecules have more heat than others', i.e., differential....more than.... What makes the molecules more energetic? Could it be heat perhaps? A differential would then already be present, 'energetically' as heat on the micro level. We always have difference of temperature anywhere we go in my opinion, cold, cool, warm and hot all intermix seeking thermal equilibrium. The point is unnecessarily belabored....the demon only works on heat differential, regardless of the degree of that heat/cold separation or the micro or macro levels. -- Jerry Wayne Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 23:58:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA07282; Sun, 9 May 1999 23:57:06 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 23:57:06 -0700 (PDT) X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 06:53:48 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <37387b7a.195283822@mail-hub> References: <00fe01be9a97$41a7ae80$135cadd1@default> In-Reply-To: <00fe01be9a97$41a7ae80$135cadd1@default> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx2.eskimo.com id XAA07256 Resent-Message-ID: <"t-dXR1.0.en1.0DeDt"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10372 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 9 May 1999 12:59:25 -0400, Jim Shaffer, Jr. wrote: [snip] > Tesla said his transmitter could produce 100 million volts of >pressure with currents up to 1000 amperes which is a power level of >100 billion watts. If it was resonating at a radio frequency of 2 >MHz, then the energy released during one period of its oscillation >would be 100,000,000,000,000,000 Joules of energy, or roughly the >amount of energy released by the explosion of 10 megatons of TNT. I think someone multiplied here, when they should have divided. 10^11 watts times 1/2000000 sec. = 50000 joules / cycle, (not 100,000,000,000,000,000). Nevertheless, even 100 Gigawatts is impressive, though likely the power during pulsed operation, rather than continuous. So I doubt the 2 MHz. More like single pulses with ample recharge time between pulses. (E.g. such as are currently used with high power lasers). > Such a transmitter, would be capable of projecting the energy of >a nuclear warhead by radio. Any location in the world could be >vaporized at the speed of light. Thus obviously not. [snip] Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 00:02:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA25000; Mon, 10 May 1999 00:02:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 00:02:01 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 07:01:28 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <373a843d.197527085@mail-hub> References: <199905061447.QAA47594@hermes.fontys.nl> <3734992F.2EF38FD2@earthlink.net> <3734A26A.26C5@keelynet.com> <37355275.FB877F44@earthlink.net> <3735D09C.20D7@keelynet.com> <3737748a.193507073@mail-hub> <373679A2.3651@keelynet.com> In-Reply-To: <373679A2.3651@keelynet.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id AAA24983 Resent-Message-ID: <"Uoe1r3.0.X66.fHeDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10373 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 10 May 1999 01:16:02 -0500, Jerry W. Decker wrote: >Hi Robin et al! > >Robin van Spaandonk wrote; >> With a temperature differential, you don't need a demon. The purpose >> of Maxwell's demon was to create a temperature differential, where >> one doesn't exist, by taking advantage of the fact that some >> molecules are more energetic than others. > >Sorry Robin, you must be very tired or sleepy as that makes absolutely >no sense whatsoever. A temperature differential ALWAYS exists on many >levels, the demon simply purifies or separates it. No, *energy* differentials exist on many levels. Temperature (by definition) is a macroscopic phenomenon. It is a measure of the average energy of the molecules. One doesn't speak of the temperature of an individual molecule. Maxwell demons (if they exist) take advantage of energy differences at the molecular level to create a temperature difference (i.e. to create two separate bodies of matter with different average molecular energies). [snip] Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 02:58:28 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA12167; Mon, 10 May 1999 02:57:27 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 02:57:27 -0700 Message-Id: <199905100957.LAA17510@hermes.fontys.nl> From: "w" To: , Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:48:01 +0200 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"UoxJo.0.yz2.7sgDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10374 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, How many Watts or horsepower is needed to power a compressor that fills the airtank of the Negre engine? Regards, WJ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 03:02:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA12526; Mon, 10 May 1999 02:59:06 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 02:59:06 -0700 Message-ID: <3736A8C3.C59023F9@harti.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:37:07 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Newman-L Mailing List , Free Energy , Evan Soule Subject: Re: Newman's MinnKotta motor tests under investigation References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"2O2UZ2.0.d33.gtgDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10375 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Evan Soule wrote: > > Joseph Newman has produced a video which demonstrates > and has documented the nature of the MinnKota motor which produced "greater > external energy output than external energy input." Evan, just simply admit , that Nemwan might have done wrong measurement tests with it and came to the wrong conclusions ?! That can happen to everyone including Newman ! Mechanically it was obviously not greater than the input ! So the whole concept of building a mechanical overunity motor with this design seems not to be fruitful ! Newman should have concentrated on scaling up his back current spikes, which I see to be the real new concept ! His motor is just too much a normal DC motor with all its losses... Please give me the names and maybe the phone numbers of the people at the Lawrence Tech university, who have run the mechanical tests which should have been 700 % with Newman´s earlier modell. I will ask them, what they will say. There must be at least somebody out here who has run some real mechanical tests on mechanical efficiency. The tests from Dr. Hastings which Joe has in his book are not very much convincing, cause there could have been unknown friction factors with the rotor at different speeds, so these tests seem not to be very practical in getting the "real world" numbers... Also in his book is a test, where it is shown, that the mechanical output is less than the electrical input ! (although in this test the back current power output is bigger than the electrical input) With my own made tests with my modells I have not seen any mechanical overunity mode yet, so I assume, the principle behind the motor concept is not a viable path to an overunity motor. And I have tried a lot to build this back and forth... Maybe I am wrong, but the data I have seen so far are not truly convincing and also with Jean Louis Naudin´s mechanical tests there are still open questions. > > Evan Soule' Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 03:34:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA20241; Mon, 10 May 1999 03:34:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 03:34:15 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:34:04 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: flux linkage and energy Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"LGq3o3.0.6y4.cOhDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10376 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dear All, I have a question regarding flux linkage and energy. I kind of know the answer for one scenario where it makes physical sense, but the other seems absurd to me. Imagine I have some independent flux linking many short circuited low resistance coils, don't worry about how the flux go there at this stage. We have a flux and we can calculate the field energy. Now the flux collapses by some mechanism. Each coil (and there are many!) sees the same flux collapse, so generates the same amount of electrical energy. If we have J joules of field energy linking N coils, we get NJ joules electrical power. The above I can believe if the flux exists temporarily - say from a cooled ferromagnet rising above its Curie point. To me, any flux change would induce a current in the coils to prevent that flux change; the dipoles would have a harder job randomising back to zero net magnetisation. In effect, the heat capacity of the sample has been increased. I can believe that this would be overunity. Now what I find difficult is if the mechansim of the flux collapse is not by heat, say some metastable state as the system momentarily sat in a higher energy level. Where does the energy come from, what is the mechanism? Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 05:31:59 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA10764; Mon, 10 May 1999 05:31:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 05:31:26 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 13:31:03 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"yKdCr2.0.5e2.U6jDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10377 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: All, I am very confused here because I ought to be able to make one big equivalent coil and that would see the J joules of field energy. The inductance would stay the same if we put them in parallel on the same former but the resistance would lower. All of this is odd because on step 2-3 of the cycle I posted a few weeks ago, the excitor coil sees zero net flux change and does zero electrical work. The power coils are switched in at the right moment in the cycle when no current exists in the excitor coil (or primary) and the flux falls due to the sample rising in temperature. The excitor sees the J joules or energy come back, the power coil sees the same flux change too and should get J joules. The other argument says gang them into one parallel coil - there is only one coil and it sees the flux change and generates j joules of energy dissapated in the effective impedance (the impedance of the two coil circuits alone put in parallel). If the p.d. of the induced current is partitioned between the two resistances in proportion to their (G1/(G1 + G2), G2/(G1 + G2) ) how can the primary, excitor ever experience the full flux change and hence 'return to xero'. Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 05:42:19 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA15192; Mon, 10 May 1999 05:41:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 05:41:30 -0700 Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 06:41:04 -0600 (MDT) From: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" X-Sender: jdo@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca To: "Jerry W. Decker" Cc: eks1@earthlink.net, "freenrg-L@eskimo.com" Subject: Schlictig Device In-Reply-To: <3735D09C.20D7@keelynet.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"_UVNV.0.Dj3.wFjDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10378 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Jerry: Further to your summary of the above device, what year did you see that demonstration and has Earl (or anyone else) worked on it since? Was it a stirling engine? Perhaps instead of using a solar collector, why not use the temperature difference between inside and outside since this would be available for a much longer time each day in both hot and cold climates. Jorg Ostrowski (with fresh snow on the ground) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 06:32:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA31468; Mon, 10 May 1999 06:32:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 06:32:21 -0700 Message-ID: <19990510131939.18628.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [192.250.113.22] From: "Chris Moon" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 06:19:38 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"JEP_D2.0.bh7.b_jDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10379 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: What is a Vortex Cannon? or what is it meant to do??.. so long as the plans wern't taken from the Star wars/trek schematics its sound fun! (better than HAARP?) (((I caught the light Sabre section, and considered even if I had to use niagra falls as a hydroelectric plant to run the thing it would be worth it!! ))) Cheers Chris M. >From: "Jim Shaffer, Jr." >Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >To: >Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? >Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 12:50:35 -0400 >MIME-Version: 1.0 >From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 9 20:58:50 1999 >Received: (from smartlst@localhost)by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id >UAA15582;Sun, 9 May 1999 20:43:05 -0700 >Resent-Date: Sun, 9 May 1999 20:43:05 -0700 >Message-ID: <00fd01be9a97$4119c660$135cadd1@default> >X-Priority: 3 >X-MSMail-Priority: Normal >X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 >X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 >Resent-Message-ID: <"SCvfj3.0.Op3.8NbDt"@mx1> >Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10366 >X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Precedence: list >Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > >Does anyone know what would happen if you fired a vortex cannon at a >tornado >while it was forming? Would it disrupt it completely, or would it only >cause it >to break into smaller vortices? > >-- >home page: http://woodstock.csrlink.net/~jshaffer > > > > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 07:11:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA09486; Mon, 10 May 1999 07:10:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 07:10:48 -0700 Posted-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 17:08:03 +0400 (MEDT) Message-ID: <3736E7F7.D1EFAEA9@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 17:06:47 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg Subject: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"CCzJ71.0.6K2.eZkDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10380 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi atg0317 and All, I figured that a laser beam traversing the vortex of toroidal coils would be a very nice test to determine whether the space-time is being deformed by this vortex. Two different test come to my mind: 1) Passing merely the laser beam (of a small key holder LD torch) trough the vortex and observe the spot on a distance paper plane. May the deflection of the beam is a remote possibility but may the micro interference patterns could be changed by the vor tex. It would useful to pass the beam either axially (trough the hole) and horizontally above and below the coils. 2) A more delicate setup can be used to create interference pattern by splitting the beam and passing the half trough the vortex. Regards, hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 07:33:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA14623; Mon, 10 May 1999 07:31:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 07:31:41 -0700 Message-ID: <000801be9af1$ebefa6e0$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 09:32:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"ljivl.0.Oa3.DtkDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10381 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: hamdi ucar To: freenrg Date: Monday, May 10, 1999 9:15 AM Subject: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam >Hi atg0317 and All, > > >I figured that a laser beam traversing the vortex of toroidal coils would be a very nice test to determine whether the space-time is being deformed by this vortex. Two different test come to my mind: > 1) Passing merely the laser beam (of a small key holder LD torch) trough the vortex and observe the spot on a distance paper plane. May the deflection of the beam is a remote possibility but may the micro interference patterns could be changed by the vortex. It would useful to pass the beam either axially (trough the hole) and horizontally above and below the coils. > >2) A more delicate setup can be used to create interference pattern by splitting the beam and passing the half trough the vortex. > >Regards, > >hamdi ucar > Hamdi! Yes this seems to be worth a try, although the problem at this point is that the discharge method we used initially does not lend itself to easy detection and measurement of resulting phenomena. We by surprise do happen to have laser equipment to perform such a test, yet we still do not have a constant current set of test coils. In fact (may be premature to say this) it could be that this must be a time varying excitation to cause the manifestation.In short with constant current test arrangements we "are not" seeing any type of result. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 08:06:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA23718; Mon, 10 May 1999 08:04:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 08:04:57 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:08:44 -0400 Message-ID: <19990510150844156.AAA275@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"61LtK3.0.Qo5.PMlDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10382 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Hi, > >How many Watts or horsepower is needed to power a compressor that fills the >airtank of the Negre engine? > >Regards, >WJ Hi, I've seen air compressors that were fairlu decent sized that were powered by 5hp single phase 120V motors, but I think what you are asking is how many watthours. That I don't know. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 08:30:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA01555; Mon, 10 May 1999 08:29:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 08:29:33 -0700 Posted-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 18:26:51 +0400 (MEDT) Message-ID: <3736FA6C.29569EFB@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 18:25:32 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam References: <000801be9af1$ebefa6e0$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"icg9y.0.CO.SjlDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10383 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > > > >Hi atg0317 and All, > > > > > >I figured that a laser beam traversing the vortex of toroidal coils would > be a very nice test to determine whether the space-time is being deformed by > this vortex. Two different test come to my mind: [snip] > > > Hamdi! > > Yes this seems to be worth a try, although the problem at this point is that > the discharge method we used initially does not lend itself to easy > detection and measurement of resulting phenomena. We by surprise do happen > to have laser equipment to perform such a test, yet we still do not have a > constant current set of test coils. > > In fact (may be premature to say this) it could be that this must be a time > varying excitation to cause the manifestation.In short with constant current > test arrangements we "are not" seeing any type of result. Yes, this (transients) also explain why high voltage instead of high current is improving the effect. In the transient, coil show high impedance and only the applied voltage make sense. I already observed that in high frequencies, magnetic fields are radi ating from the coil and magnetic nodes are formed (as well as voltage nodes). So probably what is happening here is more complex than described on the original paper. Once I thought it will be possible to observe laser spot change on the transient which will be shorter than 100uS (>5uS my guess), but it may be impossible to observe this without instrumentation. Regards, hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 08:33:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA04890; Mon, 10 May 1999 08:33:19 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 08:33:19 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 16:33:05 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"hUqkc2.0.EC1.-mlDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10384 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: All, There is a problem here, I'll recant the cycle (also I've renumbered from the stuff I posted weeks ago to make it more logical) 1: At ambient just above curie point. 2: Switch on excitor coil field, sample rise in temp. 3: Let sample cool back to ambient with field still on. 4: Switch off current in excitor coil, sample cools and has magnetic moment. 5: Switch in power tap coil so flux from sample links two coils: excitor and power coil. Sample heats up, field collapses 6: back at start. The excitor coil can be electrically configured so that the back emf is recaptured - its like a 'tank' LC oscillator circuit. The net flux change is zero so it does zero electrical work (forget losses which are small, this is meant to be ou :) The power coil sees a net flux change and so generates power. There is no current in the excitor coil when the power coil is switched in, there is no transformer action. The flux is independent. How can X joules of field energy couple to two coils and generate 2X joules of electrical power? The circuit is linear, so I can make one equivalent coil with equivalent load. This coil sees X joules of energy BUT partioned between the excitor circuit load and the power coil load. The excitor doesn't come back round to zero (with forward emf canceling back emf) even though it should by the argument with two coils not one effective coil. May be there is some delayed transformer effect. Say I build a core with a soft material that takes months to demagnetise... Now I think someone posted something like this, it May have been Mike Carrell which was why I was asking for the list archive. If I can find the *reason* I can engineer around it, if possible. I'm in two minds: the second coil sees a flux change and the primary current is off, No, its a slow transformer. Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 09:17:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA22226; Mon, 10 May 1999 09:13:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 09:13:04 -0700 Message-ID: <000801be9b00$11007320$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:13:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"smlU42.0.5R5.FMmDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10385 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: hamdi ucar To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, May 10, 1999 10:41 AM Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam >Yes, this (transients) also explain why high voltage instead of high current is improving the effect. In the transient, coil show high impedance and only the applied voltage make sense. I already observed that in high frequencies, magnetic fields are radiating from the coil and magnetic nodes are formed (as well as voltage nodes). So probably what is happening here is more complex than described on the original paper. > >Once I thought it will be possible to observe laser spot change on the transient which will be shorter than 100uS (>5uS my guess), but it may be impossible to observe this without instrumentation. > > >Regards, > >hamdi ucar > The idea of how to detect a transient is monitor the laser spot on a backdrop with a photocell and look for any AC signal that might be detected. This should detect a movement on the beam. We first thought of placing the detector behind the backdrop and doing the same, but that idea fell apart when because the spot is fairly uniform and for detection we would have to monitor the spot at the edge. By looking at the entire spot we may be able to obtain a better response. Currently we are setting up SCR switching for the contactor (discharge switch). So far our contactors destroy themselves after a few tests. Pitting etc., think the SCR will be a better way. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 10:54:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA26894; Mon, 10 May 1999 10:53:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 10:53:13 -0700 Message-ID: <37373833.8BF349E3@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 12:49:07 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam References: <000801be9af1$ebefa6e0$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"gPHSP2.0.2a6.8qnDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10386 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atg0317 wrote: > In fact (may be premature to say this) it could be that this must be a time > varying excitation to cause the manifestation.In short with constant current > test arrangements we "are not" seeing any type of result. Assuming the effect is really anomalous, and it might be (I hope!) the effect could be caused by the acceleration of electricity in the coils themselves. There is a difference in accelerating current and constant speed current. Analogy: I can stand in a car going 50MPH constant, but if the accelerator is slammed down, I will not be able to remain standing. Perhaps some kind of inertial effect is taking place? Also: I have ordered toroids the same specifications as ATG0317's. They will be here tomorrow. I have also ordered some which are the same size, but the mu(r) is much higher. If anyone wants to order these type toroid cores, let me know, and I will post the manufacturer's numbers. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 11:45:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA15916; Mon, 10 May 1999 11:43:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:43:07 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990510143351.00b373f0@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 14:33:51 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"9STfs1.0.au3.xYoDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10387 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: To atg0317, Kyle and all, At 09:32 AM 05/10/99 -0500, atg0317 wrote: > >In fact (may be premature to say this) it could be that this must be a time >varying excitation to cause the manifestation.In short with constant current >test arrangements we "are not" seeing any type of result. > atg0317-- Based on the Thomas Phipps [et al] experiments with the VACEs-- you may need hundreds of watts to get the flux up to the *same* level as was developed from the transient capacitor discharges, and if that is unreasonable due to heating effects, you may want to utilize two [hopefully-- shielded] (horseshoe-pair) magnet toroids of aprox. 5 to 6000 gauss. (I'm going to sneak those VACE's in here somehow! ;-)) If the effects are different, then the time-varying 'A' field must get a different designation to differentiate it from the static. It would be very handy indeed-- if the 'A' field could be fluctuated without too much loss of energy. Did I not read from E. Podkletnov's or was it J. Schnurer's work, that a SC transition point could be 'modified' with an external B field? I know it's "counting chickens", but it's certainly exciting to extrapolate to the future utilization of superconducting wire. Kyle's point regarding the conduction electron's acceleration is very interesting. Kyle-- Could you please post the Toroid manufacturer's Web Site and/or #. Thanks very much. Colin Quinney From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 11:47:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA17972; Mon, 10 May 1999 11:46:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:46:58 -0700 Message-ID: <19990510184904.16063.rocketmail@web118.yahoomail.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:49:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerry Wayne Decker Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"l5XDj3.0.fO4.YcoDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10388 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Robin et al! Nope, doesn't wash..... --- Robin van Spaandonk wrote: > On Mon, 10 May 1999 01:16:02 -0500, Jerry W. Decker > wrote: > > >Hi Robin et al! > > > >Robin van Spaandonk > wrote; > No, *energy* differentials exist on many levels. > Temperature (by > definition) is a macroscopic phenomenon. It is a > measure of the average > energy of the molecules. One doesn't speak of the > temperature of an > individual molecule. > Maxwell demons (if they exist) take advantage of > energy differences at > the molecular level to create a temperature > difference (i.e. to create > two separate bodies of matter with different average > molecular > energies). > [snip] > > Regards, > > Robin van Spaandonk > === ================================= Please respond to jdecker@keelynet.com as I am writing from my work email of jwdatwork@yahoo.com.........thanks! ================================= _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 12:02:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA23923; Mon, 10 May 1999 12:01:53 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 12:01:53 -0700 Message-ID: <19990510190037.54834.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.188] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 12:00:37 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"GnS7W2.0.ir5.WqoDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10389 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Hi, > >How many Watts or horsepower is needed to power a compressor that fills the >airtank of the Negre engine? > >Regards, >WJ > Good question! somewhere someone must have a chart for compressors?? could you share ??? anyone.... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 12:18:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA31862; Mon, 10 May 1999 12:17:20 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 12:17:20 -0700 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <21afaf36.246889b8@aol.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 15:12:56 EDT Subject: Dynamic Profile Matching for overunity/site To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"KuYoR3.0.kn7.03pDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10390 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: See my site for drawings and text. If you have any problems pulling up site, please let me know. Thanks, Butch LaFonte LaFonte Research Site 1 or http://members.aol.com/hlafonte/page/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 12:18:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA31947; Mon, 10 May 1999 12:17:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 12:17:41 -0700 Message-ID: <19990510191941.58070.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.188] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 12:19:40 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"kUG6g2.0.3p7.K3pDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10391 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > >What is a Vortex Cannon? >the plans wern't taken from the Star w fun! didn't the germans develop a vortex cannon to knock down panes in ww2?? > >(((I caught the light Sabre section, and considered even if I had to use >niagra falls as a hydroelectric plant to run the thing it would be worth >it!! ))) ttfn, Timothy... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 12:28:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA04750; Mon, 10 May 1999 12:27:34 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 12:27:34 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: xs4.xs4all.nl: art owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 21:26:30 +0200 (CEST) From: Pete Art To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation In-Reply-To: <013101be99c1$d4c57200$065dadd1@default> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"scDvc2.0.3A1.cCpDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10392 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > It doesn't sound too unconventional to me. Somewhere I've seen a "levitation" > demonstration consisting of a small iron ball held in space by an electromagnet. > A light and a photocell are used to switch the magnet on and off rapidly to hold > the ball in mid-air rather than letting it be pulled all the way up to the > magnet. Someone please help me out here by identifying the gadget I'm thinking > of. hi, CONRAD sells them for $40 or so, look at http://www.conrad.de cheers, Pete From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 12:42:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA09688; Mon, 10 May 1999 12:42:19 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 12:42:19 -0700 Message-ID: <373736EE.38EFA389@harti.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 21:43:42 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, atg0317 Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam References: <000801be9b00$11007320$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Nb4iT.0.zM2.PQpDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10393 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > The idea of how to detect a transient is monitor the laser spot on a > backdrop with a photocell and look for any AC signal that might be detected. > This should detect a movement on the beam. We first thought of placing the > detector behind the backdrop and doing the same, but that idea fell apart > when because the spot is fairly uniform and for detection we would have to > monitor the spot at the edge. By looking at the entire spot we may be able > to obtain a better response. Try to bend the light of the laser ! Just let the laser light go through the hole in the middle of the 2 toroids and see, if you can deflect it a few degrees ! Let the laser light go not through directly in the middle but at various angles... Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 13:31:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA29324; Mon, 10 May 1999 13:30:06 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 13:30:06 -0700 Message-ID: <002901be9b23$f5d83320$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 15:30:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"Y1KSE.0.1A7.E7qDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10394 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, May 10, 1999 1:13 PM Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam >Assuming the effect is really anomalous, and it might be (I hope!) the >effect could be caused by the acceleration of electricity in the coils >themselves. There is a difference in accelerating current and constant >speed current. Analogy: I can stand in a car going 50MPH constant, but >if the accelerator is slammed down, I will not be able to remain >standing. Perhaps some kind of inertial effect is taking place? > >Kyle R. Mcallister > I guess you will have to enlighten me here. I am familiar with angular momentum and the time before current flow resulting from skin effect along with the the effects of accelerating a current carrying conductor or 'inertia of conduction electrons' similar to E(e) = mr w(squared)/e. Also the fact that individual electrons themselves do not move from one end of a conductor to the other to constitute a current. So what are you referring to ? Always willing to learn here. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 14:04:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA02402; Mon, 10 May 1999 13:40:18 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 13:40:18 -0700 Message-ID: <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 15:40:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"yGxu1.0.Rb.oGqDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10395 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Quinney To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, May 10, 1999 1:47 PM Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam >To atg0317, Kyle and all, > >atg0317-- Based on the Thomas Phipps [et al] experiments with the VACEs-- >you may need hundreds of watts to get the flux up to the *same* level as >was developed from the transient capacitor discharges, and if that is >unreasonable due to heating effects, you may want to utilize two >[hopefully-- shielded] (horseshoe-pair) magnet toroids of aprox. 5 to 6000 >gauss. (I'm going to sneak those VACE's in here somehow! ;-)) > > >Colin Quinney > This must be a stupid question, but where am I able to obtain the article published by Thomas Phipps on his experiments with the horeshoe toriods ? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 14:07:07 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA04027; Mon, 10 May 1999 13:43:27 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 13:43:27 -0700 Message-ID: <19990510204533.9621.rocketmail@web118.yahoomail.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 13:45:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerry Wayne Decker Subject: Re: Schlictig Device To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Cc: eks1@earthlink.net, "freenrg-L@eskimo.com" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"ykNnt.0.q-.jJqDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10396 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Jorg! I met Earl Schlictig in the late 1980s, about 1988 or 1989 at one of Dean Stoniers Global Sciences Congresses in Denver, held every August. I think he was in his 60's at the time, but I know he was upset because no one seemed to pick up on it at the time...cept me.....but I don't have any money...so much for that Texas oil myth.... Never heard anything else about him, but I filed away the information and refer to it every now and then....the observation of the elongated particles having a preferred direction intrigues me no end...lots of correlations... Yes, the inside vs outside temps should also produce a differential but the greater the difference, the more power will be extracted overall. Just his little finger size probes in one room was sufficient to charge the unit up. --- "Jorg D. Ostrowski" wrote: > > Jerry: Further to your summary of the above device, > what year did you > see that demonstration and has Earl (or anyone else) > worked on it since? > Was it a stirling engine? Perhaps instead of using a > solar collector, why > not use the temperature difference between inside > and outside since this > would be available for a much longer time each day > in both hot and cold > climates. Jorg Ostrowski (with fresh snow on the > ground) > > === ================================= Please respond to jdecker@keelynet.com as I am writing from my work email of jwdatwork@yahoo.com.........thanks! ================================= _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 14:08:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA23244; Mon, 10 May 1999 14:07:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 14:07:25 -0700 From: mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl Message-Id: <373745EA.33C41B0E@elektro.fontys.nl> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:47:38 +0200 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [nl]C-QXW07103 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl, de, en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <19990510150844156.AAA275@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"6r0D13.0._g5.CgqDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10397 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, At the http://www.zeropollution.com/zeropollution/index.html they say that a compressor in the car, the airtanks fills in 4,5 hours. How many watthours is the compressor using? Regards, WJ Michael T Huffman schreef: > >Hi, > > > >How many Watts or horsepower is needed to power a compressor that fills the > >airtank of the Negre engine? > > > >Regards, > >WJ > > Hi, > > I've seen air compressors that were fairlu decent sized that were > powered by 5hp single phase 120V motors, but I think what you are asking is > how many watthours. That I don't know. > > Knuke > Michael T. Huffman > Huffman Technology Company > 1121 Dustin Drive > Lady Lake, Florida 32159 > (352)259-1276 > knuke@LCIA.COM > http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 14:43:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA07824; Mon, 10 May 1999 14:42:38 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 14:42:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199905102136.QAA15209@mw2.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 16:33:36 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"mCFYU2.0.7w1.CBrDt"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10398 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I built one in the 50's. Imagine a musical drum with a 3 or 4" hole in one side. When you strike the other side you get a straight beam of compressed air plus a moving donut or toroid of air. If you put smoke in the drum you can see this. I put gasoline in mine (metal drum) and set a candle about 10 feet away. When the donut came by, it was ignited...looked pretty for a couple of seconds. made a timer and hooked it up to a drum pedal and produced rapid fire fire rings. Learned a little, then quit. Joe Portman trivia. ================ ---------- > From: flytch er > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? > Date: Monday, May 10, 1999 2:19 PM > > > > >What is a Vortex Cannon? >the plans wern't taken from the Star w fun! > didn't the germans develop a vortex cannon to knock down panes in ww2?? > > > >(((I caught the light Sabre section, and considered even if I had to use > >niagra falls as a hydroelectric plant to run the thing it would be worth > >it!! ))) > > > > ttfn, > Timothy... > > > _______________________________________________________________ > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 14:43:14 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA16913; Mon, 10 May 1999 14:42:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 14:42:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199905102142.QAA25271@mw1.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 16:39:27 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"xVXbt.0.s74.tArDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10399 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Don't know about the gadget you speak of, but, in induction welding ,(radio frequency) molten iron is refined in mid air without a crucible. A crucible is placed below to receive it as the power is reduced. I have worked with this method of welding, but have only watched this operation of refinement. Joe Portman trivia ============== ---------- > From: Pete Art > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Scalar Wave Speculation > Date: Monday, May 10, 1999 2:26 PM > > > It doesn't sound too unconventional to me. Somewhere I've seen a "levitation" > > demonstration consisting of a small iron ball held in space by an electromagnet. > > A light and a photocell are used to switch the magnet on and off rapidly to hold > > the ball in mid-air rather than letting it be pulled all the way up to the > > magnet. Someone please help me out here by identifying the gadget I'm thinking > > of. > > hi, > CONRAD sells them for $40 or so, look at http://www.conrad.de > > cheers, > Pete > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 15:40:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA24613; Mon, 10 May 1999 15:38:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 15:38:39 -0700 Message-ID: <19990510224205.8945.rocketmail@web114.yahoomail.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 15:42:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerry Wayne Decker Subject: Re: Fw: 'A' Field and Thrust To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"3YC2F.0.U06.k_rDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10400 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi! Got an email from Michael so checked out the site....interesting effect, but I note the paper disc was subject to vibration from being placed on the coils. "A small paper circle was placed over the center of the small (top - focusing) coil." Analogies; 1) an air pallet that floats weights on a cushion of air 2) electronic vibrating table football or hockey where the players vibrate across the surface in a kids game 3) a buzzer that has a metal plate suspended over a coil on a pin, it vibrates due to hysteresis (I think..) I have an intriguing file from the old BBS which I'll send to the atgroup where the guy claims thrust from superposed EM fields....might copy it here as its not too large... ----------------- --- atg0317 wrote: > From: atg0317 > To: Free Energy > Date: Sunday, May 09, 1999 10:43 AM > Subject: 'A' Field and Thrust > > > >Some additional information on the possible thrust > from the Magnetic Vector > >Potential and two shaping toroid coils has been > added to our study on the > >effect. Take a look, it is very interesting test > which rules out the first > >question of thermal effect of the connecting wires. > > > >It further tends to indicate that the hypothesis of > Rick Andersen as far as > >the field presence and action therefrom may be > accurate. > > > Sorry I dis not include the site address in case you > have not looked at the > first tests. Here is the new test location. > > http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm > > === ================================= Please respond to jdecker@keelynet.com as I am writing from my work email of jwdatwork@yahoo.com.........thanks! ================================= _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 15:43:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA25977; Mon, 10 May 1999 15:41:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 15:41:30 -0700 Message-ID: <19990510224054.79121.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [195.92.197.56] From: "Chris Moon" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 15:40:53 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"6doZu.0.mL6.Q2sDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10401 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: That sounds like a very good sunday afternoon experiment Cheers Chris M. >I built one in the 50's. Imagine a musical drum with a 3 or 4" hole in one >side. When you strike the other side you get a straight beam of compressed >air plus a moving donut or toroid of air. If you put smoke in the drum you >can see this. I put gasoline in mine (metal drum) and set a candle about 10 >feet away. When the donut came by, it was ignited...looked pretty for a >couple of seconds. made a timer and hooked it up to a drum pedal and >produced rapid fire fire rings. Learned a little, then quit. >Joe Portman trivia. >================ > >---------- > > From: flytch er > > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > > Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? > > Date: Monday, May 10, 1999 2:19 PM > > > > > > > >What is a Vortex Cannon? >the plans wern't taken from the Star w fun! > > didn't the germans develop a vortex cannon to knock down panes in ww2?? > > > > > >(((I caught the light Sabre section, and considered even if I had to >use > > > >niagra falls as a hydroelectric plant to run the thing it would be >worth > > > >it!! ))) > > > > > > > > ttfn, > > Timothy... > > > > > > _______________________________________________________________ > > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 16:29:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA09030; Mon, 10 May 1999 16:28:18 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 16:28:18 -0700 Message-ID: <37376A35.69CC2FF9@microtec.net> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 19:22:35 -0400 From: patrick tremblay X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Doomsday ? Ha! References: <19990509012426.85540.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"o_K_F.0.xC2.IksDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10402 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: People, forget what I said. I haven't said a thing. You're right, it's nothing more than stupid numerology of shit. If you want very good advice: keep scientific and avoid occult bla bla and aliens. The only way to find out when the end of the world will come is to assist it. When it will arrive, we will have hard data and proof of it. Until then I am laughing all my hearth. Take care and enjoy life with science, goods, money and best of all: Hard Data. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 16:44:35 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA17543; Mon, 10 May 1999 16:43:53 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 16:43:53 -0700 Message-ID: <37376DDE.6DBF0EA9@microtec.net> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 19:38:12 -0400 From: patrick tremblay X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: CURE References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"AGuL62.0.0I4.vysDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10403 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I am not closed minded. Tell you this, watch TLC and learn. We now use chemicals to treat cancer. In a near future-2003: when the wearable PC will be released, cancers will be cured by : 1) Extremely early detection of cancer clusters 2) New treatments like: nano machines ( microscopic robots to maintain and repair the body), The victory is close friends. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 18:26:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA19766; Mon, 10 May 1999 18:25:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 18:25:44 -0700 Message-ID: <19990511012628.29877.rocketmail@web107.yahoomail.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 18:26:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerry Wayne Decker Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website To: Robin van Spaandonk Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"ztwsY3.0.fq4.NSuDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10404 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Robin! So you say you don't want to further embarrass me on the list......thanks but I'll pass as that is again 'stretching' the importance of the dialogue. You also say that 'everyone' uses your definition? Except me of course. Well, sorry, but I'm not remotely embarrassed....so have no problems posting this back to the list without your comments since you made yours private. You provided no references backing up your contentions (nor did I), and your word simply isn't good enough...nor is mine....therefore in the interest of clarity; To recap; My post was with regard to 'Taming Maxwell's demon' as posted at; http://keelynet.com/interact/archive/00000053.htm and refers specifically to the Schlictig THERMODYNAMIC engine and the interesting comments he made about elongated large end or ionized particles that apparently carry the heat. Thermo means HEAT as from; http://www.dictionary.com thermo- \Ther"mo-\ A combining form from Gr. qe`rmh heat, qermo`s hot, warm; as in thermochemistry, thermodynamic. >Robin van Spaandonk wrote; >> With a temperature differential, you don't need a demon. >> The purpose of Maxwell's demon was to create a temperature >> differential, where one doesn't exist, by taking advantage >> of the fact that some molecules are more energetic >> than others. I responded; >Sorry Robin, you must be very tired or sleepy as that makes absolutely >no sense whatsoever. A temperature differential ALWAYS exists on many >levels, the demon simply purifies or separates it. You responded; > No, *energy* differentials exist on many levels. Temperature (by > definition) is a macroscopic phenomenon. It is a measure of the average > energy of the molecules. One doesn't speak of the temperature of an > individual molecule. Maxwell demons (if they exist) take advantage of > energy differences at the molecular level to create a temperature difference > (i.e. to create two separate bodies of matter with different average molecular > energies). ------------------------ 'One also doesn't' confuse the definition of thermodynamics and maxwells demon; ------------------------- Explanation of Maxwells' Demon; http://www.maxwellian.demon.co.uk/name.html "A wall separates two compartments filled with gas. A little "demon" sits by a tiny trapdoor in the wall. It looks at oncoming gas molecules, and depending on their speeds it opens or closes the trapdoor. The object of the game is to eventually collect all the molecules faster than average on one side, and the slower ones on the other side. (and why are they faster or slower? because they are hotter, more energetic) We end up with a hot, high pressure gas on one side, and a cold, low pressure gas on the other. Conservation of energy is not violated, but hey presto, we've redistributed the random kinetic energy of the molecules (heat) in such a way that energy can now be extracted from the system (it can drive a gas turbine, say)." ------------------------- How can you so easily use the term temperature difference then turn right around and say 'that is, 2 bodies with different molecular energies?????' Those 'energies' for thermodynamics, which is what the Schlictig device is, are HEAT. (random kinetic energy of the molecule) = HEAT as in 'thermodynamic'. -------------------------- http://www.sasked.gov.sk.ca/docs/physics/u4a2phy.html Thermal energy is the average of the potential and kinetic energies possessed by atoms and molecules experiencing random motion. Heat is transferred by convection, conduction, or radiation. Heat is the thermal energy transferred from one object to another due to differences in temperature. (Some texts do not make a distinction between heat and thermal energy. The distinction between heat and thermal energy need not be emphasized to the same extent as that between heat and temperature.) Heat energy is measured in joules. There is no direct method used to measure heat. Indirect methods must be used. Temperature is a measure of the average kinetic energy of the molecules of a substance. Temperature can be measured with a thermometer. One way a thermometer can be calibrated is by the amount of thermal expansion and contraction that occurs within a given type of substance. ------------------------- http://pc65.frontier.osrhe.edu/hs/science/penergy.htm Five main forms of energy: Mechanical - Associated with motion. Heat - Internal motion of particles. Chemical - Bonds atoms and ions together. Electromagnetic - Moving electric charges. Nuclear - In the atomic nucleus Heat engines: (like the Schlictig engine) Change heat energy into mechanical energy. Are classified by where the fuel is burned: External-combustion engine Internal-combustion engine ------------------------ http://www.energy.ca.gov/education/story/story-html/chapter01.html 1.Energy is the ability to do work. 2.There are two different types of energy. Kinetic energy is energy in motion. Potential energy is energy that is stored. 3.Energy is measured in units, two of which are Btu (British thermal unit) or joule. Energy is measured in a couple of different ways. One of the basic measuring blocks is called a Btu. This stands for British thermal unit. Btu is defined as the amount of heat energy it takes to raise the temperature of one pound of water by one degree Fahrenheit, at sea level. One Btu equals about: One blue-tip kitchen match One-thousand (1,000) Btu roughly equals: One average candy bar 4/5 of a peanut butter and jelly sandwich It takes, for example, about 2,000 Btus to make a pot of coffee. Energy can also be measured in joules. Joules sounds the same way as the word jewels, like diamonds and emeralds. It takes 1,000 joules to equal a British thermal unit. So: 1,000 joules = 1 Btu So, it would take 2 million joules to make a pot of coffee. 4.Energy cannot be created, nor can it be destroyed. It can only be changed in form. 5.Heat energy comes in three forms: conduction, convection and radiation. ------------------------ http://teacher.nsrl.rochester.edu/Phy_labs/Heat/Heat.html ------------------------ I have no idea how this craziness started since I was simply talking about THERMOdynamics which refers to heat. Anything beyond heat is irrelevant to the post and therefore out of field. Your honor, judge and jury, I rest my case with the 'rest of the world'. Regarde'vous Jerry W. Decker === ================================= Please respond to jdecker@keelynet.com as I am writing from my work email of jwdatwork@yahoo.com.........thanks! ================================= _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 18:35:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA26242; Mon, 10 May 1999 18:35:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 18:35:30 -0700 Message-ID: <3737A48C.61355B78@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 20:31:24 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Part No.'s and an experiment Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4vHIa.0.xP6.XbuDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10405 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: Aside from the toroid experiment work I am doing alongside ATG0317, I am also testing a suggestion posted by, I believe, Colin Quinney: string several toroid coils into a toroid, and see what happens. This will be ready for testing tomorrow, using both constant current or cap discharge. Now, about the toroids I ordered, they were purchased from Tech-America, part numbers T-37-15 and T-50-6. These will be her tomorrow, so I can test the experiment again. Both are carbonyl iron powder cores. I have ordered several of each. The cores I plan to use for the "super toroid" are FT-50A-77, also purchased from Tech-America. Results from both experiments will be posted here as soon as I get them. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 19:32:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA11269; Mon, 10 May 1999 19:31:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 19:31:52 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 02:31:16 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <373f8d26.265363449@mail-hub> References: <19990511012628.29877.rocketmail@web107.yahoomail.com> In-Reply-To: <19990511012628.29877.rocketmail@web107.yahoomail.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id TAA11240 Resent-Message-ID: <"MRUMT2.0.zl2.OQvDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10406 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 10 May 1999 18:26:28 -0700 (PDT), Jerry Wayne Decker wrote: [snip] >To recap; > >My post was with regard to 'Taming Maxwell's demon' as >posted at; > >http://keelynet.com/interact/archive/00000053.htm > >and refers specifically to the Schlictig THERMODYNAMIC >engine and the interesting comments he made about >elongated large end or ionized particles that >apparently carry the heat. > >Thermo means HEAT as from; http://www.dictionary.com > >thermo- \Ther"mo-\ A combining form from Gr. qe`rmh >heat, qermo`s >hot, warm; as in thermochemistry, thermodynamic. I responded; >Sorry Robin, you must be very tired or sleepy as that makes absolutely >no sense whatsoever. A temperature differential ALWAYS exists on many >levels, the demon simply purifies or separates it. When you used "temperature" in the above, and said "on many levels", I thought you also meant at the level of individual molecules. This impression is strengthened by the following statement referring to the operation of a Maxwell's demon. It was the apparent use of temperature in regard to individual molecules that I was objecting to. I still don't understand what a "purified temperature differential" is. A larger or smaller differential I would understand. > >>Robin van Spaandonk >wrote; [snip] >> (i.e. to create two separate bodies of matter with >different average molecular >> energies). [snip] Jerry: >How can you so easily use the term temperature >difference then turn right around and say 'that is, 2 >bodies with different molecular energies?????' I said two bodies of matter (e.g. two compartments filled with gas), not "two bodies" (i.e. two particles - which you seem to imply). Furthermore I said "different average molecular energies", not "different molecular energies" - the "average" is important (and in fact critical) as it implies multiple particles (i.e. a "body of matter"), so that there are multiple things over which to average. [snip] Jerry: >Indirect methods must be used. Temperature is a >measure of the average kinetic energy of the molecules >of a substance. Which is what I said before. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 19:39:17 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA14265; Mon, 10 May 1999 19:38:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 19:38:58 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Hydrogen car Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 02:38:24 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <374097d2.268095735@mail-hub> References: <199903080943.TAA26554@lebunka.ion.com.au> <36E30D5E.D0A5EEB6@ccc.bu.aust.com> In-Reply-To: <36E30D5E.D0A5EEB6@ccc.bu.aust.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id TAA14245 Resent-Message-ID: <"aGycW2.0.oU3.1XvDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10407 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 08 Mar 1999 09:35:58 +1000, Cameron Maxwell wrote: > > >Pop wrote: > >> Hmmm, so it's nitrous-oxide? What is that made of? NO? I dont know >> >> Does pressurised hydrogen and oxygen form water before combustion? >> >> Does the combustion of pure hydrogen and oxygen IMPLODE or EXPLODE? > >Nitrous Oxide is usually NO2e.g. 2N2 + 02 =2NO2 I think you mean N2O, as your equation as given doesn't balance. [snip] Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 19:57:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA21645; Mon, 10 May 1999 19:56:50 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 19:56:50 -0700 Message-ID: <000701be9b59$ff937100$b591fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: "Free Energy" Subject: New Toroid Tests Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 21:57:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"pGAkY3.0.2I5.nnvDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10408 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: We have started to test the possible bending of a laser beam by the 'A' field focusing toroid pairs.The site will be updated as we move forward. The new page for the laser testing is found at; http://www.atgroup.org/laser.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 20:07:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA25032; Mon, 10 May 1999 20:06:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 20:06:54 -0700 Message-Id: <199905110308.AAA09884@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 00:08:11 -2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3736FA6C.29569EFB@verisoft.com.tr> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Resent-Message-ID: <"CC5zS2.0.176.DxvDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10409 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > > Yes, this (transients) also explain why high voltage instead of high current > is improving the effect. In the transient, coil show high impedance and only > the applied voltage make sense. I already observed that in high frequencies, > magnetic fields are radiating from the coil and magnetic nodes are formed (as > well as voltage nodes). So probably what is happening here is more complex > than described on the original paper. > > Once I thought it will be possible to observe laser spot change on the > transient which will be shorter than 100uS (>5uS my guess), but it may be > impossible to observe this without instrumentation. > This reminds me the Greg Watson's "Ferrite Critical Response Time". Maybe we should test the effect using toroidal plastic cores. --- Marcelo Puhl mark@plug-in.com.br From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 20:26:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA01417; Mon, 10 May 1999 20:26:00 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 20:26:00 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990510231749.009c0a90@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 23:17:49 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam In-Reply-To: <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"M0P7w1.0.2M.8DwDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10410 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi atg0317, Kyle, Rick, Dave, and all At 03:40 PM 05/10/99 -0500, you wrote: > >This must be a stupid question, but where am I able to obtain the article >published by Thomas Phipps on his experiments with the horeshoe toroids ? (One thing's for sure. We won't locate these experiments in any main-line journal, no matter who performs them. ) The three published sources of which I am aware: The Journal of Electric Spacecraft, 1998, issue #25, '21st CENTURY', Summer 1998*, GALILEAN ELECTRODYNAMICS, J-F, 1999* (*received from Thomas E. Phipps, Jr. 908 South Busey Avenue Urbana, Illinois, 61801) All of the articles are similar. They use paired horseshoe magnet toroids, except for one experiment that used an unbroken PM toroid [with identical results]. "... with Alnico or better permanent magnets, the confined fluxes amount routinely to thousands of gauss, so we are talking about surface currents equivalent to thousands of amperes per transverse cm. Hence the forces of interaction of two small VACEs separated by a few times their maximum physical dimensions, may amount to many milligrams (dynes), even hundreds of milligrams-- very easily and accurately measurable by the crudest of analytic balances. So, anybody can check it out without special equipment." (Thomas Phipps) He did not publish any results of his voluminous force measurements per se (centre to centre), however, he did report the measure of the toroid force actions with distance, and it reportedly fell off as ~ inverse 6th power, and not as the inverse 2nd power. He reported that this was probably only due to the high concentrations of the 'A' field by the Toroid configuration itself. (Remains to be proven, I think.) Something he said on p.64 of the '21st CENTURY', summer, 98 article-- that may be of interest. I'm not exactly sure of it's meaning: "... Observations (which we do not discuss here) aimed at detecting pondermotive force action between polarization current and real current, have apparently failed to show any such cross-action." The term "pondermotive" (?) It harkens back to turn of the century. Is that the same as the longitudinal force ? And the difference between polarization current and real current. I know what "real" current is, so I must assume that "polarization" current is the Amperian current (?) of the permanent magnet Toroids (?) If that's read correctly (3 "ifs") then there will be no 'A' field force effect between a DC electromagnet toroid and a permanent magnet toroid. I must contact the author for clarification. Colin Quinney. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 20:51:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA07333; Mon, 10 May 1999 20:51:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 20:51:26 -0700 Message-ID: <3737A8AE.4D3E@keelynet.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:49:02 -0500 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Reply-To: jdecker@keelynet.com Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <19990511012628.29877.rocketmail@web107.yahoomail.com> <373f8d26.265363449@mail-hub> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ZfrB4.0.To1.zawDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10411 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Robin quoted; > Temperature is a measure of the average kinetic energy of the > molecules of a substance. and responded; >> Which is what I said before. And the 'average kinetic energy is measured HOW...as HEAT in a thermodynamic context....heat engine...case closed. -- Jerry Wayne Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 21:25:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA16330; Mon, 10 May 1999 21:24:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 21:24:54 -0700 Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 23:24:47 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: Part No.'s and an experiment To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <3737A48C.61355B78@sunherald.infi.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"B1UUF3.0._-3.M4xDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10412 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 10 May 1999, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote: > Hi all: > > Aside from the toroid experiment work I am doing alongside ATG0317, I am > also testing a suggestion posted by, I believe, Colin Quinney: string > several toroid coils into a toroid, and see what happens. This will be > ready for testing tomorrow, using both constant current or cap > discharge. Now, about the toroids I ordered, they were purchased from > Tech-America, part numbers T-37-15 and T-50-6. These will be her > tomorrow, so I can test the experiment again. Both are carbonyl iron > powder cores. I have ordered several of each. The cores I plan to use > for the "super toroid" are FT-50A-77, also purchased from Tech-America. > Results from both experiments will be posted here as soon as I get them. > > Kyle R. Mcallister > >From my data sheets: T-37-15: Powdered-iron core, 0.375 inches O.D., 0.205 inches I.D., color code red-white, u=25, useful frequency range 0.1 to 2.0 MHz. T-50-6: Powdered-iron core, 0.500 inches O.D., 0.300 inches I.D., color code yellow, u=8, useful frequency range 3 to 50 MHz. (I have a lot of experience with this one in particular and have quite a few around here). FT-50A-77: Ferrite core, 0.500 inches O.D., 0.312 inches I.D., u=2000, "High saturation flux density at high temperatures. Low core loss in the 1 kHz to 1 MHz range. Suited for power conversion and wideband transformers. Widely used for noise attenuation in the 0.5 MHz to 50 MHz. frequency range." Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 21:29:34 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA18235; Mon, 10 May 1999 21:29:18 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 21:29:18 -0700 Message-ID: <3737CD4B.D8774406@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 23:25:15 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Part No.'s and an experiment References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BhFqf2.0.qS4.U8xDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10413 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Zack Widup wrote: > T-50-6: Powdered-iron core, 0.500 inches O.D., 0.300 inches I.D., color > code yellow, u=8, useful frequency range 3 to 50 MHz. (I have a lot of > experience with this one in particular and have quite a few around here). Ach! I mistyped this. Should be T-50-3, not T-50-6. Sorry ;) Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 22:15:26 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA29415; Mon, 10 May 1999 22:14:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:14:56 -0700 Message-ID: <3737BBE5.7F32261E@ihug.co.nz> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:11:01 +1200 From: John Berry X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Schlictig Device References: <19990510204533.9621.rocketmail@web118.yahoomail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bGfOY3.0.SB7.GpxDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10414 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Someone's going to have to fill me in, What's this about elongated particles? It sounds right up my ally right now. John Berry Jerry Wayne Decker wrote: > Hi Jorg! > > I met Earl Schlictig in the late 1980s, about 1988 or > 1989 at one of Dean Stoniers Global Sciences > Congresses in Denver, held every August. I think he > was in his 60's at the time, but I know he was upset > because no one seemed to pick up on it at the > time...cept me.....but I don't have any money...so > much for that Texas oil myth.... > > Never heard anything else about him, but I filed away > the information and refer to it every now and > then....the observation of the elongated particles > having a preferred direction intrigues me no > end...lots of correlations... > > Yes, the inside vs outside temps should also produce a > differential but the greater the difference, the more > power will be extracted overall. > > Just his little finger size probes in one room was > sufficient to charge the unit up. > > --- "Jorg D. Ostrowski" wrote: > > > > Jerry: Further to your summary of the above device, > > what year did you > > see that demonstration and has Earl (or anyone else) > > worked on it since? > > Was it a stirling engine? Perhaps instead of using a > > solar collector, why > > not use the temperature difference between inside > > and outside since this > > would be available for a much longer time each day > > in both hot and cold > > climates. Jorg Ostrowski (with fresh snow on the > > ground) > > > > > > === > > ================================= > Please respond to jdecker@keelynet.com > as I am writing from my work email of > jwdatwork@yahoo.com.........thanks! > ================================= > _________________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 22:20:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA30529; Mon, 10 May 1999 22:20:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:20:01 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Spatial L and C Interactions Message-Id: <926399967.6396.887@excite.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:19:27 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.12 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"_1PA91.0.wS7.1uxDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10415 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: The spatial harnessing of resonance goes beyond a simple schematic that conveys a two dimensional idea. The idea of tapping energy from resonance must be accomplished by extracting energy from the potential without diminishing the potential. This is not as impossible as it sounds. If an electric field exists at right angles to a magnetic field a Lorentz force interaction can take place which will exert a force on a moving charged particle that is at right angles to both the causitive forces. That movement does not deplete the potential in the electric field because it moves parallel to the potential. It appears that I have been misunderstood in the above statement on my message board at http//:www.insidetheweb.com/mbs.cgi/mb124201 As such a clarification is in order. What I am speaking of first of all is an idea and not a prototype. If anyone understood this idea they would recognize immediately that it is practically impossible to achieve at 60 hz. That is because the VOLUME needed for a corresponding electric field resonating with a huge inductor is too large to fit in the core of the magnetic field that it shares resonance with. When I speak of the SPATIAL harnessing of resonance, that is exactly what I mean; by having two resonating processes that normally schematically indicated as respective values of L and C; The schematic can not convey a special condition whereby L and C are actually using portions of the same SPACE at right angles because that is not the job of a schematic. It only tells the values and connection routes, not the special interelationship acquired when L and C can exist at right angles by sharing the same space at right angles to produce a Lorentz reaction force. In determining how this could be manipulated practically no effect has ever been noted for the simple reason that both fields use different materials to propagate in their commercial application. Secondarily that to secure this interaction an oscillation of twice the frequency would be predicted by spatially interacting L and C, since they are inherently acting in separate times by their respective 90 degree time relationship in resonance. The idea of spatially reacting an electric field with a magnetic field from an oscillation in resonance sounds very much like the the Zen saying: what is the sound of one hand clapping? Of course this is because by trying to secure an interaction between these two quantities in space when one has emerged fully in space, the other has vanished and vice versa. That is the nature of the beast. It is the beast of a SINGLE phase of resonance; and it can NEVER obtain more energy out of that interaction than is contained in its fields. Therefore that will never exhibit over unity. I dont know why the simple things have to be said over and over, but just because the previous scenario isnt OU doesnt mean the SPATIAL harnessing of resonance has to be thrown out the window. If I want to clap BOTH my hands together it can be done. I can make an ELECTRIC field from resonance at the same TIME as I can make a MAGNETIC field from resonance, but now I have TWO power inputs and not ONE. It takes a special 90 degree generator to do that, but it can be done. It can also be made that each of these phases can then can be SPATIALLY interacted as a JUXTAPOSITION. This only means that the electric field from phase 1 will be placed in the interior space of the magnetic field from phase 2 and vice versa, and not just inside itself as the former spatial harnessing suggested. In the former condition the reaction produced an oscillation that is barely detectable dependent on the shared material of E and B fields: but in the juxtaposition possibility the reaction is NOT an oscillation but rather a unidirectional pulse characteristic of DC. In fact that condition resembles the exact same analogy of gyroscopic precession. What this leads to is the idea of constructing two radial fin electrolysisors to be inserted inside 2 large inductors in 90 degree phase relationship from their generator. That is the practicality of the theory in that the energies fluctuating in resonance can then AID half of the cells by lorentz interaction; and then recharge or oppose the other half by lorentz interaction. In ANY case this lorentz reaction is now much greater than a single phase of resonance could deliver by spatial interaction with itself which was formerly conveyed by the zen analogy of a single hand clapping. What the observant might observe is that in the new condition TWO power inputs and not ONE are used for the fields in resonance to be manipulated to produce a DC interaction in space. However the TIMING of each phase guarantees that when one is sending amperage and power to produce a full MAGNETIC field the counterpart is then consuming ZERO energy and still producing a POTENTIAL energy which manifests as an ELECTRIC field in resonance. This brings into question the conservation of energy which states that the sum of POTENTIAL and KINETIC (magnetic expression of amperage conduction) energies is a CONSTANT. While this is entirely true for a SINGLE phase of resonance: that precludes that when the kinetic energy is increasing, the potential energy is decreasing so that these values add to a constant. However the manipulation just described shows that TWO inputs can produce a condition wherby KINETIC AND POTENTIAL CAN RISE TO A MAXIMUM SIMULTANEOUSLY; CONCURENT WITH ANOTHER SET REACHING ZERO IN THIS NEW KIND OF JUXTAPOSITION. The realization of two inputs also must imply two outputs which is why this is noted. Seems like a time to end, but want to conclude that new EM signatures by these methods seem entirely feasible with matched matches of actual radio wave 90 degree methods. Here to fore every basis and thinking has been predicated on the 180 appraisal which is spelled wrong. An obstacle appears as a mirage that limits our perception by our own belief in it. HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 22:26:58 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA00230; Mon, 10 May 1999 22:25:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:25:52 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Spatial L and C Interactions Message-Id: <926400341.18420.909@excite.com> Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:25:41 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.41 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"eL5ak2.0.U3.VzxDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10416 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: The spatial harnessing of resonance goes beyond a simple schematic that conveys a two dimensional idea. The idea of tapping energy from resonance must be accomplished by extracting energy from the potential without diminishing the potential. This is not as impossible as it sounds. If an electric field exists at right angles to a magnetic field a Lorentz force interaction can take place which will exert a force on a moving charged particle that is at right angles to both the causitive forces. That movement does not deplete the potential in the electric field because it moves parallel to the potential. It appears that I have been misunderstood in the above statement on my message board at http//:www.insidetheweb.com/mbs.cgi/mb124201 As such a clarification is in order. What I am speaking of first of all is an idea and not a prototype. If anyone understood this idea they would recognize immediately that it is practically impossible to achieve at 60 hz. That is because the VOLUME needed for a corresponding electric field resonating with a huge inductor is too large to fit in the core of the magnetic field that it shares resonance with. When I speak of the SPATIAL harnessing of resonance, that is exactly what I mean; by having two resonating processes that normally schematically indicated as respective values of L and C; The schematic can not convey a special condition whereby L and C are actually using portions of the same SPACE at right angles because that is not the job of a schematic. It only tells the values and connection routes, not the special interelationship acquired when L and C can exist at right angles by sharing the same space at right angles to produce a Lorentz reaction force. In determining how this could be manipulated practically no effect has ever been noted for the simple reason that both fields use different materials to propagate in their commercial application. Secondarily that to secure this interaction an oscillation of twice the frequency would be predicted by spatially interacting L and C, since they are inherently acting in separate times by their respective 90 degree time relationship in resonance. The idea of spatially reacting an electric field with a magnetic field from an oscillation in resonance sounds very much like the the Zen saying: what is the sound of one hand clapping? Of course this is because by trying to secure an interaction between these two quantities in space when one has emerged fully in space, the other has vanished and vice versa. That is the nature of the beast. It is the beast of a SINGLE phase of resonance; and it can NEVER obtain more energy out of that interaction than is contained in its fields. Therefore that will never exhibit over unity. I dont know why the simple things have to be said over and over, but just because the previous scenario isnt OU doesnt mean the SPATIAL harnessing of resonance has to be thrown out the window. If I want to clap BOTH my hands together it can be done. I can make an ELECTRIC field from resonance at the same TIME as I can make a MAGNETIC field from resonance, but now I have TWO power inputs and not ONE. It takes a special 90 degree generator to do that, but it can be done. It can also be made that each of these phases can then can be SPATIALLY interacted as a JUXTAPOSITION. This only means that the electric field from phase 1 will be placed in the interior space of the magnetic field from phase 2 and vice versa, and not just inside itself as the former spatial harnessing suggested. In the former condition the reaction produced an oscillation that is barely detectable dependent on the shared material of E and B fields: but in the juxtaposition possibility the reaction is NOT an oscillation but rather a unidirectional pulse characteristic of DC. In fact that condition resembles the exact same analogy of gyroscopic precession. What this leads to is the idea of constructing two radial fin electrolysisors to be inserted inside 2 large inductors in 90 degree phase relationship from their generator. That is the practicality of the theory in that the energies fluctuating in resonance can then AID half of the cells by lorentz interaction; and then recharge or oppose the other half by lorentz interaction. In ANY case this lorentz reaction is now much greater than a single phase of resonance could deliver by spatial interaction with itself which was formerly conveyed by the zen analogy of a single hand clapping. What the observant might observe is that in the new condition TWO power inputs and not ONE are used for the fields in resonance to be manipulated to produce a DC interaction in space. However the TIMING of each phase guarantees that when one is sending amperage and power to produce a full MAGNETIC field the counterpart is then consuming ZERO energy and still producing a POTENTIAL energy which manifests as an ELECTRIC field in resonance. This brings into question the conservation of energy which states that the sum of POTENTIAL and KINETIC (magnetic expression of amperage conduction) energies is a CONSTANT. While this is entirely true for a SINGLE phase of resonance: that precludes that when the kinetic energy is increasing, the potential energy is decreasing so that these values add to a constant. However the manipulation just described shows that TWO inputs can produce a condition wherby KINETIC AND POTENTIAL CAN RISE TO A MAXIMUM SIMULTANEOUSLY; CONCURENT WITH ANOTHER SET REACHING ZERO IN THIS NEW KIND OF JUXTAPOSITION. The realization of two inputs also must imply two outputs which is why this is noted. Seems like a time to end, but want to conclude that new EM signatures by these methods seem entirely feasible with matched matches of actual radio wave 90 degree methods. Here to fore every basis and thinking has been predicated on the 180 appraisal which is spelled wrong. An obstacle appears as a mirage that limits our perception by our own belief in it. HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 22:34:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA02946; Mon, 10 May 1999 22:34:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:34:24 -0700 Message-ID: <011901be9b6f$702e24e0$41684fc6@default> From: "mrand@access" To: Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 22:30:51 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"joNvE3.0.xj.W5yDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10417 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Stefan and all, Maybe the beam would bend if projected over the top or the bottom of the coil from the side. The beam would bend up or down depending on the direction of the A field flow thru the center of the toroids. Similar to the way light bends around the sun or galaxies. Regards, Michael >Try to bend the light of the laser ! >Just let the laser light go through the hole >in the middle of the 2 toroids >> From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 10 23:20:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA11502; Mon, 10 May 1999 23:20:18 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 23:20:18 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990510215611.21e70018@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 21:56:11 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"dPYA73.0.Zp2.XmyDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10418 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Remi and all, At 01:31 PM 5/10/99 +0100, you wrote: > >I am very confused here because I ought to be able to make one big >equivalent coil and that would see the J joules of field energy. The >inductance would stay the same if we put them in parallel on the same >former but the resistance would lower. > >All of this is odd because on step 2-3 of the cycle I posted a few weeks >ago, the excitor coil sees zero net flux change and does zero electrical >work. The power coils are switched in at the right moment in the cycle >when no current exists in the excitor coil (or primary) and the flux falls >due to the sample rising in temperature. ... >Now what I find difficult is if the mechansim of the flux collapse is not >by heat, say some metastable state as the system momentarily sat in a >higher energy level. Where does the energy come from, what is the >mechanism? > > Is there a site where your device is shown and explained? Thanks, Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 00:41:34 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA24752; Tue, 11 May 1999 00:33:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 00:33:17 -0700 Message-ID: <19990511073243.6607.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.185] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Vortex Cannon Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 00:32:42 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"8PPnk3.0.f26.yqzDt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10419 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have an article on one that is many generations better... the indoor free flight guys ( that fly in a plane catching buildings) use them to knock down a plane stuck in the rafters.... the design is simple ... use a five gallon bucket and a pringles can cut a hole in the bottom of the pail to fit the chip can cut a circle of heavy tarp plastic roughly 6 in lager than the top of the bucket tape the plastic to the top of the bucket so that it sags into the bucket 3-4 in (tape well as it gets abuse) fit the chip can to the bottom of the pail so it dose not protrude into the pail and glue with a thick filet of liquid nails or caulk hold by the can in a upright position and hit the top (now the bottom) smartly..... I've seen a candle be blown out at fifty feet indoors!!! Yes 50 feet!!!! quite impressive :) >I built one in the 50's. Imagine a musical drum with a 3 or 4" hole in one >side. When you strike the other side you get a straight beam of compressed >air plus a moving donut or toroid of air. If you put smoke in the drum you >can see this. I put gasoline in mine (metal drum) and set a candle about 10 >feet away. When the donut came by, it was ignited...looked pretty for a >couple of seconds. made a timer and hooked it up to a drum pedal and >produced rapid fire fire rings. Learned a little, then quit. >Joe Portman trivia. >================ > > > > > >What is a Vortex Cannon? >the plans wern't taken from the Star w fun! > > didn't the germans develop a vortex cannon to knock down panes in ww2?? > > > > > >(((I caught the light Sabre section, and considered even if I had to >use > > > >niagra falls as a hydroelectric plant to run the thing it would be >worth > > > >it!! ))) > > > > > > > > ttfn, > > Timothy... > > > > > > _______________________________________________________________ > > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > > > _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 05:49:22 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA21773; Tue, 11 May 1999 05:48:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 05:48:24 -0700 Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 06:43:28 -0600 (MDT) From: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" X-Sender: jdo@acs6.acs.ucalgary.ca To: Jerry Wayne Decker Cc: "freenrg-L@eskimo.com" , eks1@earthlink.net Subject: Re: Schlictig Device In-Reply-To: <19990510204533.9621.rocketmail@web118.yahoomail.com> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"oFWHc3.0.6K5.NS2Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10420 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Jerry: Thank you for your update. Are there any articles on this device and has it appeared anywhere on the internet. If you told us where he lived, perhaps someone from the list lives close enough to go there and see what if anything he is doing at the present time? For your consideration. Jorg Ostrowski From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 06:25:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA30413; Tue, 11 May 1999 06:24:19 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 06:24:19 -0700 Message-Id: <199905111324.IAA28794@mw2.texas.net> From: "Joe Portman" To: Subject: Re: Hydrogen car Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 08:21:39 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"DdEOU2.0.6R7.3-2Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10421 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hydrogen and oxygen chemically combine to make water. Much heat is released. When done in a combustion chamber, the initial heat causes the chemical action to speed up. The resultant heat causes molecular activity the same as an internal combustion engine running on gasoline. These molecule move about rotationally, vibrationally, and transitionally, causing pressure on all surfaces. Since the piston is the only thing free to move, it does so. Joe Portman trivia........ ps; an explosion is where the rapidity of the burn exceeds the speed of sound. ================== ---------- > From: Robin van Spaandonk > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Re: Hydrogen car > Date: Monday, May 10, 1999 9:38 PM > > On Mon, 08 Mar 1999 09:35:58 +1000, Cameron Maxwell wrote: > > > > > > >Pop wrote: > > > >> Hmmm, so it's nitrous-oxide? What is that made of? NO? I dont know > >> > >> Does pressurised hydrogen and oxygen form water before combustion? > >> > >> Does the combustion of pure hydrogen and oxygen IMPLODE or EXPLODE? > > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 06:41:51 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA02327; Tue, 11 May 1999 06:41:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 06:41:33 -0700 Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 08:41:30 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: Part No.'s and an experiment To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <3737CD4B.D8774406@sunherald.infi.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"HHY3N3.0.Ca.CE3Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10422 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 10 May 1999, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote: > Zack Widup wrote: > > > T-50-6: Powdered-iron core, 0.500 inches O.D., 0.300 inches I.D., color > > code yellow, u=8, useful frequency range 3 to 50 MHz. (I have a lot of > > experience with this one in particular and have quite a few around here). > > Ach! I mistyped this. Should be T-50-3, not T-50-6. Sorry ;) > > Kyle R. Mcallister > Well then! The T-50-3 has a color code of gray and a useful frequency range of 50 kHz to 500 kHz. Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 08:44:08 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA11540; Tue, 11 May 1999 08:43:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 08:43:26 -0700 Message-ID: <37384C0A.2154C896@harti.com> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:26:02 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: atg0317 , "mrand@iols.net" , Free Energy Subject: Re:Laser light bending ! References: <001b01be9b26$fa552860$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"K4EIB2.0.Dq2.U05Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10423 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Stefan and all, Maybe the beam would bend if projected over the top or the bottom of the coil from the side. The beam would bend up or down depending on the direction of the A field flow thru the center of the toroids. Similar to the way light bends around the sun or galaxies. Regards, Michael Hi Michael, yes, that is right, mybe at 90 degrees it works better ! If you put the laser through the hole directly you could probably just FM modulate the light, so it gets different "colors" with pulsing the A-field , but not bending it ! Regards, Stefan. >Try to bend the light of the laser ! >Just let the laser light go through the hole >in the middle of the 2 toroids >> -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 12:24:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA19107; Tue, 11 May 1999 12:23:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 12:23:56 -0700 Message-ID: <37389EF2.C8859450@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 14:19:46 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Toroid experiment status Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Cb0503.0.Og4.BF8Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10424 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: I have finished winding the toroids for the A-field experiment, and also the toroids for the "toroid necklace" experiment. I will be assembling these experiments shortly. Stay tuned for results... Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 12:37:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA23074; Tue, 11 May 1999 12:34:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 12:34:33 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 20:34:25 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990510215611.21e70018@earthlink.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"a4lx32.0.Re5.8P8Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10425 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dave, At the moment we have strong theory, though not strong enough to present to an academic, maybe. I'm having conceptual problems with this idea of an independant flux linking several coils:- Forget the source of the flux for a mo, if it has a field energy, N coils will generate N times this energy on flux collapse. I think the solution is not talk about the field divorced from its source (counter to what I said about forgetting the source). We ACCEPT that N times the electrical energy is generated and figure how the source does that; I know how it would work for heat mediated collapse of the field - its harder to randomise the dipoles - its like an extra heat capacity. Now if the collapse isn't heat mediated. Where does the energy come from? I've got some ideas: an electron say promoted to an energy level where it can take part in ferromagnetic processes by the exchange interaction; that electron is perturbed in its orbit a la Lamb shift type effects (zpe). Now I'm no quantum mechanist to be able to deal with QED but the answer lies there because one is trying to cohere a random effect. An orbital taking part in exchange processes is a very directional thing. ************************************************************************* So to finally answer you question: no experiment just yet, though this is near, cheap and simple to do; I'd like to put up a webpage but I don't want to publish until I feel the gaps have been filled; I have circulated a private document which I'll keep private for reasons of modesty and that some of it is a patent spec. I'll put the science in the open but the nitty-gritty I'll keep quite for a bit. ************************************************************************* Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 13:34:45 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA15017; Tue, 11 May 1999 13:32:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 13:32:22 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 21:32:17 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: Free Energy Subject: Re:Laser light bending ! In-Reply-To: <37384C0A.2154C896@harti.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"7X_-E2.0.Yg3.MF9Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10426 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: All, Increase the path length of the laser by passing it back and forth between mirrors as it goes trhough or near the toroid. You should be able to get a path length of many miles. Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 13:58:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA22388; Tue, 11 May 1999 13:56:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 13:56:04 -0700 Message-ID: <3738B48F.41EC34FF@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 15:51:59 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"eI7kE3.0.jT5.Zb9Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10427 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: Results from the first test using 22AWG wire are negative. No motion of a paper disc, no thrusting effect. Next test will use 26AWG wire. With the 22, I was only able to get about 60% the turns that ATG0317 got. With the 26, I get all of them. Note that I am using 40VDC and a 50,000uF capacitor. Stay tuned... Quinney's toroid necklace is still being made. I will get to it either after while, or tomorrow. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 15:18:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA02720; Tue, 11 May 1999 15:17:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 15:17:17 -0700 Message-ID: <3738C799.DA83127C@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:13:13 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lCY-T3.0.Lg.jnAEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10428 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: The test with 26AWG was much more successful. I can confirm that there is some kind of force being produced, whether it is vertical magnetic interactions or something else, I don't know. I cannot change the direction of the motion of the toroids by reversing polarity. The device always thrusts down. But, the toroids were mistakenly wound opposite. The coils themselves are wound in different directions. I am now winding a new toroid so they will both be identical, just different sizes. Thermal heating is ruled out. I can strike a pulse, get it moving, and watch carefully its amplitude of swing. When it reaches lowest position, I can strike another arc, increasing amplitude. When it reaches highest position, I can strike an arc and nearly stop the device from moving. ATG0317: what kind of paper did you use for the paper test? Normal notebook paper was unaffected. The piece used was smaller than the smallest toroid. Stay tuned... Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 16:07:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA20977; Tue, 11 May 1999 16:07:06 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:07:06 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 23:06:30 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <3739b722.341669260@mail-hub> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id QAA20945 Resent-Message-ID: <"AjC5i1.0.g75.QWBEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10429 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 11 May 1999 20:34:25 +0100 (BST), Cornwall RO wrote: [snip] Hi Remi, What you describe is the secondary half of a transformer, i.e. flux supplied be some source interacting with a coil(s). If you think of the primary of the transformer as the source of the flux, then you can see where the energy comes from by analysing the way a transformer works (and you already know how a trafo. works). Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 16:33:22 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA30305; Tue, 11 May 1999 16:32:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:32:25 -0700 Message-ID: <007901be9c06$086dc120$78684fc6@default> From: "mrand@access" To: Subject: Re: Toroids, results Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:26:32 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"Ez4Dt2.0.QP7.8uBEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10430 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Kyle, [snip] >Note that I am using 40VDC and a >50,000uF capacitor. Stay tuned... Can the coils and capacitors take a higher voltage? Has it been confirmed that the A field works better with low voltage and high current? It would be interesting to compare the output results from low voltage input to high voltage input (maybe +120Vdc). EV Gray, Tesla and others found uses for HV in their applications :-) Regards, Michael Randall From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 16:37:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA00198; Tue, 11 May 1999 16:36:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:36:52 -0700 Message-ID: <3738DA41.FD189725@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 18:32:49 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results References: <007901be9c06$086dc120$78684fc6@default> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ZODCj.0.-2.JyBEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10431 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: mrand@access wrote: > > Can the coils and capacitors take a higher voltage? Has it been confirmed > that the A field works better with low voltage and high current? The coils could take a higher voltage, but the caps can only take 50VDC. I can get more, but that will take several days... As far as the A field, I don't think anyone can claim to know really what the A field is. Physicists will tell you some theoretical explanation, but nothing more. I can try with different voltages though. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 16:52:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA06174; Tue, 11 May 1999 16:51:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:51:59 -0700 Posted-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 02:49:08 +0400 (MEDT) Message-ID: <3738C1C8.7D2044F8@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 02:48:24 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results References: <007901be9c06$086dc120$78684fc6@default> <3738DA41.FD189725@sunherald.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"oJS-K2.0.MW1.UACEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10433 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Kyle R. Mcallister wrote: > > The coils could take a higher voltage, but the caps can only take 50VDC. Why dont you try rectified main voltage (with current limiting resistor, a low wattage lamp) and a 1uF cap. Maybe you can obtain + result too. Regards, hamdi From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 16:58:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA07562; Tue, 11 May 1999 16:45:56 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:45:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3738DACA.5B59AC97@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 18:35:06 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"rVJyP3.0._r1.o4CEt"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10432 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: I have retested with the correct coil configuration. Thrusting? yes. Reversal of thrust with reversal of polarity? no. Effects on a sliver of paper? no. But, at least I am making progress. A roll of 24AWG wire will be here tomorrow. I am going to test with a magnet next, to see if this might be a magnetic interaction with the earth's field. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 17:04:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA10638; Tue, 11 May 1999 17:01:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:01:23 -0700 Message-ID: <37389AF0.2891@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:02:40 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results References: <007901be9c06$086dc120$78684fc6@default> <3738DA41.FD189725@sunherald.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"H-aTZ2.0.3c2.JJCEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10434 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Kyle R. Mcallister wrote: > > mrand@access wrote: > > > > Can the coils and capacitors take a higher voltage? Has it been confirmed > > that the A field works better with low voltage and high current? > This is my first posting to your list, so hello everyone. One idea on the subject of voltage used. The force-field effect may have more to do with the rate of change of current across the coils. The inductance of the coils will tend to oppose di/dt. In this sense it may be an idea to actually take a look at current in the coils with a current probe or a 'home made' pulse current transformer and a digital scope. While admittedly messy, if 'jumping coils' were placed in a small transparent container with transformer oil (or any transparent dielectric fluid) that oil/fluid should respond to any forces through the middle of toroid. Different dielectric constant from air could also result in something interesting if the effect is influenced by such parameters. Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 17:07:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA12931; Tue, 11 May 1999 17:06:49 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:06:49 -0700 Message-ID: <19990512000617.80907.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [195.92.197.53] From: "Chris Moon" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Pulsed Vortex Cannon Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:06:16 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"nfSV31.0.y93.OOCEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10435 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: you could try an industrial version.... say air/propane mixture pumped into the cavity and ingnited by a sparkplug set inside a very much stronger version of the 5gall bucket/pringles can arrangement. If you get the mix/timing right you should be able to get a pulsed vortex cannon with a much greater range or powerful 'smoke ring' 'line up those bottles-- chaps!!' Cheers Chris M. >From: "flytch er" >Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Subject: Vortex Cannon >Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 00:32:42 PDT >MIME-Version: 1.0 >From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 00:55:47 1999 >Received: from [204.122.16.48] by hotmail.com (1.5) with SMTP id >MHotMailB9012D6500B5D1017095CC7A103071403; Tue May 11 00:55:47 1999 >Received: (from smartlst@localhost)by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id >AAA24751;Tue, 11 May 1999 00:33:17 -0700 >Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 00:33:17 -0700 >Message-ID: <19990511073243.6607.qmail@hotmail.com> >X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.185] >Resent-Message-ID: <"8PPnk3.0.f26.yqzDt"@mx1> >Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10419 >X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com >Precedence: list >Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com > >I have an article on one that is many generations better... the indoor free >flight guys ( that fly in a plane catching buildings) use them to knock >down a plane stuck in the rafters.... the design is simple ... > >use a five gallon bucket and a pringles can >cut a hole in the bottom of the pail to fit the chip can >cut a circle of heavy tarp plastic roughly 6 in lager than the top of the >bucket >tape the plastic to the top of the bucket so that it sags into the bucket >3-4 in (tape well as it gets abuse) >fit the chip can to the bottom of the pail so it dose not protrude into the >pail and glue with a thick filet of liquid nails or caulk > >hold by the can in a upright position and hit the top (now the bottom) >smartly..... I've seen a candle be blown out at fifty feet indoors!!! >Yes 50 feet!!!! quite impressive :) > >>I built one in the 50's. Imagine a musical drum with a 3 or 4" hole in one >>side. When you strike the other side you get a straight beam of compressed >>air plus a moving donut or toroid of air. If you put smoke in the drum you >>can see this. I put gasoline in mine (metal drum) and set a candle about >>10 >>feet away. When the donut came by, it was ignited...looked pretty for a >>couple of seconds. made a timer and hooked it up to a drum pedal and >>produced rapid fire fire rings. Learned a little, then quit. >>Joe Portman trivia. >>================ >> > > >> > >What is a Vortex Cannon? >the plans wern't taken from the Star w fun! >> > didn't the germans develop a vortex cannon to knock down panes in ww2?? >> > > >> > >(((I caught the light Sabre section, and considered even if I had to >>use >> >> > >niagra falls as a hydroelectric plant to run the thing it would be >>worth >> >> > >it!! ))) >> > >> > >> > >> > ttfn, >> > Timothy... >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________________________ >> > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com >> > >> > > >_______________________________________________________________ >Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 17:17:55 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA16910; Tue, 11 May 1999 17:17:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 17:17:25 -0700 Message-ID: <3738E3C3.71316E16@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 19:13:23 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, IMPORTANT!!! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"av61Y2.0.684.KYCEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10436 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: I have taken a large magnetron magnet, and moved it within the vicinity of a compass to determine how far its magnetic field reached to turn the compass at the same rate the earth's magnetic field does. About 8 inches from the compass is when this happens. I suspended this magnet above the toroid apparatus, about 6 inches above it. I then pulsed the toroids. No change in toroid thrusting on either polarity. The magnet should in one mode attract the toroids, the other mode should repel it. It would seem that this may not be a magnetic interaction after all...thoughts? I will also try with the magnet horizontal to the apparatus, and then closer vertical. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 19:45:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA31647; Tue, 11 May 1999 19:45:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 19:45:17 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990511181706.226f7b08@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 18:17:06 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Toroid experiment status In-Reply-To: <37389EF2.C8859450@sunherald.infi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"qT_i01.0.Kk7.ziEEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10438 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Kyle and all, At 02:19 PM 5/11/99 -0700, you wrote: >Hi all: > >I have finished winding the toroids for the A-field experiment, and also >the toroids for the "toroid necklace" experiment. I will be assembling >these experiments shortly. Stay tuned for results... Is your "toroid necklace" going to be strung on a ferromagnetic ring too? > >Kyle R. Mcallister > -Dave. ps. my data shows that #3 material also has a relative mu of 35. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 19:45:34 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA31476; Tue, 11 May 1999 19:45:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 19:45:04 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990511182351.226f007e@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 18:23:51 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990510231749.009c0a90@inforamp.net> References: <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"bO5MD.0.jh7.miEEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10437 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Colin, At 11:17 PM 5/10/99 -0700, you wrote: >He did not publish any results of his voluminous force measurements per se >(centre to centre), however, he did report the measure of the toroid force >actions with distance, and it reportedly fell off as ~ inverse 6th power, >and not as the inverse 2nd power. He reported that this was probably only >due to the high concentrations of the 'A' field by the Toroid configuration >itself. (Remains to be proven, I think.) > >Something he said on p.64 of the '21st CENTURY', summer, 98 article-- that >may be of interest. I'm not exactly sure of it's meaning: >"... Observations (which we do not discuss here) aimed at detecting >pondermotive force action between polarization current and real current, >have apparently failed to show any such cross-action." >The term "pondermotive" (?) It harkens back to turn of the century. Is that >the same as the longitudinal force ? >And the difference between polarization current and real current. I know >what "real" current is, so I must assume that "polarization" current is the >Amperian current (?) of the permanent magnet Toroids (?) If that's read >correctly (3 "ifs") then there will be no 'A' field force effect between a >DC electromagnet toroid and a permanent magnet toroid. Yes, in context the "pondermotive" force seems to be the force between 2 current elements. I have only seen it used in some of Peter Graneau's papers, but couldn't find its definition in any electrodynamics or mechanics book. Maxwell's books "A Treatise on electricity and magnetism" seem to use the term "electromotive". And I agree that the "polarization" is the ferromagnetic current, like in the PM VACE's. It would be surprising if there were no force between a PM vace and a ferromagnetic core toroid magnet, as the polarization current are about the same, using a high relative mu core. They are just not permanently aligned. Using a air core toroid may suggest more experiments, and possible problems. On page 56 of the same article, it says: "Since current flows generally in closed circuits, this means that there is no obvious experimental way of determining Nature's preference among these candidate laws." (Ampere or Lorentz.) Ampere I assume had only closed circuits for his experiments, so wonder how he found his laws? Some I know were intra-circuit. Does the VACE results imply that the "polarization" currents do NOT travel in closed circuits in each VACE, as there is a measurement difference?? If you contact Phipps, please ask him this. > >I must contact the author for clarification. > >Colin Quinney. > -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 19:45:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA31704; Tue, 11 May 1999 19:45:20 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 19:45:20 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990511182136.226f0018@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 18:21:36 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.6.16.19990510215611.21e70018@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"7U_c82.0.Al7.0jEEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10439 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Remi and all, At 08:34 PM 5/11/99 +0100, you wrote: >Dave, > >At the moment we have strong theory, though not strong enough to present >to an academic, maybe. I'm having conceptual problems with this idea of >an independant flux linking several coils:- > >Forget the source of the flux for a mo, if it has a field energy, N coils >will generate N times this energy on flux collapse. > Well not in a transformer where more turns just change the V and I pulse characteristics. Of course in a (steel core) transformer, all the turns are tightly linked. This is why I asked more about your device configuration. Thanks, -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 21:16:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA31742; Tue, 11 May 1999 21:15:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 21:15:48 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990511195224.239fa3c6@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 19:52:24 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Toroids, IMPORTANT!!! In-Reply-To: <3738E3C3.71316E16@sunherald.infi.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"1JPd_2.0.ml7.o1GEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10440 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: HI Kyle and all, At 07:13 PM 5/11/99 -0700, you wrote: >Hi all: > >I have taken a large magnetron magnet, and moved it within the vicinity >of a compass to determine how far its magnetic field reached to turn the >compass at the same rate the earth's magnetic field does. About 8 inches >from the compass is when this happens. I suspended this magnet above the >toroid apparatus, about 6 inches above it. I then pulsed the toroids. No >change in toroid thrusting on either polarity. That sounds like a good test and an useful technique to me. You might also try testing with a small Neodym magnet as a probe. Will your pulsed toroids move it? One can "feel" currents in wires, AC, DC, pulsed, or switched, from their fields. Examples are the distribution and direction of fields inside a solenoidal coil, the "leakage" fields from a toroidal coil, where flux leaks from a transformer, or even single wires. You can even "feel" the earth's magnetic field, using it as a compass, your fingers being the mechanical support. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 21:20:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA00097; Tue, 11 May 1999 21:19:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 21:19:59 -0700 Message-ID: <37388BC0.7028@panacom.com> Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 14:57:52 -0500 From: Dean Nallick Reply-To: dean@panacom.com Organization: OZ X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <19990510190037.54834.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"O11DL1.0.Q1.k5GEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10441 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Any mechanical engineering handbook will have a section that gives complete details on HP requirements for compressors. > >How many Watts or horsepower is needed to power a compressor that > >Regards, > >WJ > > > Good question! somewhere someone must have a chart for compressors?? could > you share ??? anyone.... From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 21:38:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA05143; Tue, 11 May 1999 21:38:31 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 21:38:31 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990512003025.01086100@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 00:30:25 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990511182351.226f007e@earthlink.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19990510231749.009c0a90@inforamp.net> <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Txsmz1.0.CG1.7NGEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10442 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Dave, and all, At 06:23 PM 05/11/99, Dave wrote: > >Yes, in context the "pondermotive" force seems to be the force between 2 >current elements. I have only seen it used in some of Peter Graneau's >papers, but couldn't find its definition in any electrodynamics or >mechanics book. Maxwell's books "A Treatise on electricity and magnetism" >seem to use the term "electromotive". The term was used throughout the 1830s to at least the 1850s. >And I agree that the "polarization" is the ferromagnetic current, like in >the PM VACE's. It would be surprising if there were no force between a PM >vace and a ferromagnetic core toroid magnet, as the polarization current >are about the same, using a high relative mu core. They are just not >permanently aligned. If the two kinds of currents [Virtual Amperian Currents, and Electric Currents] do not interact with any longitudinal [pondermotive] force, that implies that the VACE force is interactive to only another VACE force. (But that sounds preposterous.) My best guess-- something like this is what Thomas Phipps Jr. is probably now investigating. > >On page 56 of the same article, it says: >"Since current flows generally in closed circuits, this means that there is >no obvious experimental way of determining Nature's preference among these >candidate laws." (Ampere or Lorentz.) Ampere I assume had only closed >circuits for his experiments, so wonder how he found his laws? An excellent question, but ... Well-- I certainly don't think Ampere did any experiments with antennas ;-) A leap of faith-- if you will, but based on previous kinetics experiments-- Ampere, [as opposed to Lorentz,] utilized Newtons Force Laws {Nature's Preference}and incorporated them into his electrodynamics experiments to result in his formulas. Since Lorentz did not do that, the Lorentz Force Law [read "theory"] often violates the 3rd law-- and THAT, along with Bill Beaty, is probably what gave birth to this list. :-)) It certainly seems to have screwed up the science that we have inherited. ( i.e: GR, etc.) Anyway-- that's just *my* dilettante paraphrasing from Phipps' book, 'Heretical Verities'. He appears to have thoroughly investigated the history of science with integrity. It's probably best though, to contact him directly-- rather that quoting my filtered version. I am only a lowly messenger. Some I know >were intra-circuit. Does the VACE results imply that the "polarization" >currents do NOT travel in closed circuits in each VACE, as there is a >measurement difference?? > To which measurement do you refer? Colin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 22:22:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA14426; Tue, 11 May 1999 22:21:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 22:21:29 -0700 From: MATTIARO@aol.com Message-ID: <4fc20241.246a698c@aol.com> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 01:20:12 EDT Subject: Re: Toroids, IMPORTANT!!! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"Xli7Y2.0.JX3.P_GEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10443 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi. Do you know the orientation of the magnetic field in the magnetron's magnet? Just an idea that orientation just might be wrong. Matti From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 22:56:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA26820; Tue, 11 May 1999 22:56:09 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 22:56:09 -0700 From: MATTIARO@aol.com Message-ID: <8f8cfa39.246a71d2@aol.com> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 01:55:30 EDT Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"VaFOU2.0.vY6.uVHEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10444 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi one and all! The only thing a magnetic field will do to light is to polarize it. I have not seen any experiments on it, but read it as a footnote in one physics book. Matti From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 23:18:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA32216; Tue, 11 May 1999 23:18:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 23:18:40 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 07:18:33 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 2 In-Reply-To: <3738C799.DA83127C@sunherald.infi.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"plUTw.0.Gt7.0rHEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10445 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Kyle, Don't forget the Faraday effect. Though you are using toroids, could there be a stray field? Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 23:22:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA01207; Tue, 11 May 1999 23:22:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 23:22:11 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 07:22:05 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy In-Reply-To: <3739b722.341669260@mail-hub> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"rbJey2.0.mI.JuHEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10446 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: No Robin, This is the point, we don't think it is a transformer action because the flux is independent. The flux exists by atmoic dipole moments not a 'manmade' current loop. Keep an eye out for George Holtz on vortex-l because he is very knowledgable and I could forward his non-private messages to this list. Remi. On Tue, 11 May 1999, Robin van Spaandonk wrote: > On Tue, 11 May 1999 20:34:25 +0100 (BST), Cornwall RO wrote: > [snip] > Hi Remi, > > What you describe is the secondary half of a transformer, i.e. flux > supplied be some source interacting with a coil(s). If you think of the > primary of the transformer as the source of the flux, then you can see > where the energy comes from by analysing the way a transformer works > (and you already know how a trafo. works). > > > Regards, > > Robin van Spaandonk > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 11 23:29:30 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA03883; Tue, 11 May 1999 23:28:35 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 23:28:35 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 07:28:29 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990511182136.226f0018@earthlink.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"iDQZm3.0.ay.J-HEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10447 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 11 May 1999, Dave Dameron wrote: > > > Well not in a transformer where more turns just change the V and I pulse > characteristics. Of course in a (steel core) transformer, all the turns are > tightly linked. This is why I asked more about your device configuration. > Thanks, > -Dave Dave, this is not transformer action. The question still remains as to how aflux collapse from a material with a magnetic moment interacts with several coils - a certain amount of energy is expended by one coil in setting up the moment, then the field collapses by heat or some other mechanism, the flux linking N coils... I'm confused, but I think we accept the result that there is N times the electrical power generated. Mechanism: heat collapse of field, I can supply mechanism; some other collapse - I don't really know. Remi. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 03:19:13 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA27357; Wed, 12 May 1999 03:18:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 03:18:41 -0700 Message-ID: <19990512101856.9563.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.249] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Pulsed Vortex Cannon Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 03:18:53 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"BrEPk.0.Ih6.1MLEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10448 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hay chris, Can you say shrapnel??? Or don't try this at home kids :) just kiddin' that sound about what I've read about and seen photos of ..... some were even mounted on trucks .... and appeared about 10 to 15 feet in diameter..... maybe that's one of the reasons that high altitude flying/bombing became so popular???? >you could try an industrial version.... > >say air/propane mixture pumped into the cavity and ingnited by a sparkplug >set inside a very much stronger version of the 5gall bucket/pringles can >arrangement. If you get the mix/timing right you should be able to get a >pulsed vortex cannon with a much greater range or powerful 'smoke ring' >'line up those bottles-- chaps!!' > >Cheers > >Chris M. ttfn, Timothy... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 05:49:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA26864; Wed, 12 May 1999 05:48:12 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 05:48:12 -0700 Message-ID: <19990512124739.61299.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [192.250.113.22] From: "Chris Moon" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Pulsed Vortex Cannon Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 05:47:39 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"Mg5SJ1.0.fZ6.BYNEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10449 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: shanp shhhcll nah give up!! These things were real and worked?????!!.. I missed out on some fun when I was young! I was going to solve the worlds energy crisis but this looks far more promising... Cheers Chris M. >Hay chris, > >Can you say shrapnel??? > >Or don't try this at home kids :) > >just kiddin' > >that sound about what I've read about and seen photos of ..... >some were even mounted on trucks .... and appeared about 10 to 15 feet in >diameter..... >maybe that's one of the reasons that high altitude flying/bombing became so >popular???? > >>you could try an industrial version.... >> >>say air/propane mixture pumped into the cavity and ingnited by a sparkplug >>set inside a very much stronger version of the 5gall bucket/pringles can >>arrangement. If you get the mix/timing right you should be able to get a >>pulsed vortex cannon with a much greater range or powerful 'smoke ring' >>'line up those bottles-- chaps!!' >> >>Cheers >> >>Chris M. > > > > ttfn, > Timothy... > > >_______________________________________________________________ >Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 06:54:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA16974; Wed, 12 May 1999 06:52:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 06:52:41 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <43c15d66.246ae12d@aol.com> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 09:50:37 EDT Subject: Re: Toroids, IMPORTANT!!! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"GQHFA1.0.794.fUOEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10450 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/11/99 5:21:01 PM Pacific Daylight Time, stk@sunherald.infi.net writes: << I have taken a large magnetron magnet, and moved it within the vicinity of a compass to determine how far its magnetic field reached to turn the compass at the same rate the earth's magnetic field does. About 8 inches from the compass is when this happens. I suspended this magnet above the toroid apparatus, about 6 inches above it. I then pulsed the toroids. No change in toroid thrusting on either polarity. The magnet should in one mode attract the toroids, the other mode should repel it. It would seem that this may not be a magnetic interaction after all...thoughts? I will also try with the magnet horizontal to the apparatus, and then closer vertical. Kyle R. Mcallister >> Kyle, If various orientations of the magnet does not change the thrusting then it would seem the earth's magnetic field is not involved in the interaction. To me it still does not rule out magnetic interactions between the input leads, also possibly involving the toroids suspension. I don't know the electrical/mechanical details of your set up, but the only other thing I can think of is a rapid -but small- expansion of the leads due to heating as a conventional explanation for the thrusting. Ken From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 06:59:38 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA18951; Wed, 12 May 1999 06:56:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 06:56:26 -0700 Message-Id: <199905121355.PAA10318@hermes.fontys.nl> From: "w" To: Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 15:46:55 +0200 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"-fRy.0.0e4.9YOEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10451 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, At the site of de Negre engine ( http://www.zeropollution.com/zeropollution/no_fuel.html ) : " However,  MDI vehicle is design to run exclusively on air compressed. A jet of cold air is delivered at hight pressure into de combustion chamber which is already charged up with HOT COMPRESSED AIR. This provides enough force to run the engine." Which temperature is the HOT COMPRESSED AIR? Is this really a high temperature or is it just warm? If the temperature is high : Is the exhaust air also hot? Regards, WJ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 07:25:22 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA29604; Wed, 12 May 1999 07:24:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 07:24:29 -0700 Message-ID: <3739AA4E.7200E758@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 09:20:30 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, IMPORTANT!!! References: <43c15d66.246ae12d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"cfUNp2.0.OE7.SyOEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10452 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Keasy@aol.com wrote: > Kyle, > If various orientations of the magnet does not change the thrusting then > it would seem the earth's magnetic field is not involved in the interaction. Yes, that is what I meant. > To me it still does not rule out magnetic interactions between the input > leads, also possibly involving the toroids suspension. Correct. It could very well be a wire interaction. Would you know any way to test for this besides changing the orientation of the wires? > I don't know the > electrical/mechanical details of your set up, but the only other thing I can > think of is a rapid -but small- expansion of the leads due to heating as a > conventional explanation for the thrusting. I don't know about thermal flexing. It would seem to be a very strange form of thermal flexing if I can cancel it in some modes of amplitude. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 07:26:08 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA29862; Wed, 12 May 1999 07:25:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 07:25:39 -0700 Message-ID: <3739AA92.293B585D@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 09:21:38 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 2 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"y_ifl.0.UI7.YzOEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10453 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Cornwall RO wrote: > > Kyle, > Don't forget the Faraday effect. Though you are using toroids, could there > be a stray field? Between the leads, yes. With the earth's magnetic field, likely no. See: "Toroid tests IMPORTANT!!!" K. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 07:29:45 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA31337; Wed, 12 May 1999 07:27:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 07:27:05 -0700 Message-ID: <3739AAE5.77BA6875@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 09:23:01 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, IMPORTANT!!! References: <4fc20241.246a698c@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"THzJS2.0.Uf7.v-OEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10454 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: MATTIARO@aol.com wrote: > > Hi. > Do you know the orientation of the magnetic field in the magnetron's magnet? > > Just an idea that orientation just might be wrong. No, I know the orientation of the fields, and I have already tested this. What I wonder about now is force between the power leads. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 09:32:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA15931; Wed, 12 May 1999 09:30:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 09:30:58 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 08:37:18 -0700 Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam Message-ID: <19990512.093308.-66361.7.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-17,19-20,23-30,33-34,36-43 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SKUTQ.0.qu3.1pQEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10455 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 12 May 1999 01:55:30 EDT MATTIARO@aol.com writes: >Hi one and all! > > The only thing a magnetic field will do to light is to polarize it. > I >have not seen any experiments on it, but read it as a footnote in one >physics >book. > > Matti > Hi Folks, Have you considered the Zeeman effect? As I recall, the Zeeman effect is relative to the rotation of light by a magnetic field. I used to make the devices that held the polarizing materials to demonstrate the effect. The polarizer that polarized the laser light before it entered the magnetic field was stationary and the polarizer that the light went through after the magnetic field was rotatable and marked in degrees. The idea is that with the magnetic field off, the second polarizer was rotated for maximum light transmission and set to zero degrees. The magnetic field is turned on and the second polarizer is rotated for maximum tranzmission, then the number of degrees of rotation can be read for a given magnetic field. Just to give you an shakey idea of the ballpark, as I recall (that's the shakey part), our strongest magnet was 14 kilogauss and the second polarizer indicated a maximum of 30 degrees. Many (many,many) moons ago I found polarizing material (glass even) on the racks in major drug store chains in the form of polarizing sun glasses. For a $5 item, they worked well. You might check it out. David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 10:20:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA30224; Wed, 12 May 1999 10:17:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 10:17:21 -0700 MR-Received: by mta EUROPA; Relayed; Wed, 12 May 1999 13:16:02 -0400 (EDT) MR-Received: by mta GOSIP; Relayed; Wed, 12 May 1999 13:17:12 -0400 (EDT) Alternate-recipient: prohibited Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 12:30:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Briggs 614-752-0199 Subject: Re: Toroids, IMPORTANT!!! In-reply-to: <3739AA4E.7200E758@sunherald.infi.net> To: freenrg-l Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Posting-date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:16:00 -0400 (EDT) Importance: normal Priority: normal UA-content-id: E2047ZXXNIZ2Q5 X400-MTS-identifier: [;20613121509991/3728334@ODNVMS] A1-type: MAIL Hop-count: 2 Resent-Message-ID: <"543QW1.0.9O7.WUREt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10456 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Kyle, Isolate possible wire torsion induced deflection by placing/fixing all components on a single platform. Then put wheels on the platform aligned with the direction of force. Or just mount it on a light board with some kind of round tubing or pipe underneath for it to roll on. If the cap/wires/toroids are fixed to the platform, the wires can wriggle & flex around all they want. But if the toroid is moving because of some kind of field effect it will take the platform with it. There is still the possibility of a stick-slip situation, this could be eliminated by hanging the whole assembly by strings and measuring the deflection. Bill webriggs@concentric.net >> To me it still does not rule out magnetic interactions between the input >> leads, also possibly involving the toroids suspension. >Correct. It could very well be a wire interaction. Would you know any >way to test for this besides changing the orientation of the wires? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 10:44:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA08274; Wed, 12 May 1999 10:44:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 10:44:07 -0700 MR-Received: by mta EUROPA; Relayed; Wed, 12 May 1999 13:42:24 -0400 (EDT) MR-Received: by mta GOSIP; Relayed; Wed, 12 May 1999 13:43:31 -0400 (EDT) Alternate-recipient: prohibited Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:39:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Bill Briggs 614-752-0199 Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? In-reply-to: <19990512.103755.-170993.1.broompilot@juno.com> To: freenrg-l Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Posting-date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:42:00 -0400 (EDT) Importance: normal Priority: normal UA-content-id: E2045ZXXNJLDKR X400-MTS-identifier: [;42243121509991/3728416@ODNVMS] A1-type: MAIL Hop-count: 2 Resent-Message-ID: <"8r6gu1.0.612.btREt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10458 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: David, When you only have a hammer, everything looks like nails. >There was no mention of Tesla, but then when they only invite asteroid >experts and meteorite experts to investigate, they only get >results relative to asteroids and meteorites. Bill webriggs@concentric.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 10:39:03 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA04574; Wed, 12 May 1999 10:36:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 10:36:02 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 10:36:26 -0700 Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Message-ID: <19990512.103755.-170993.1.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-2,4-5,7-9,11-18 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"iPiHY.0.M71.1mREt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10457 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Folks, Two nights ago, The Discovery Channel aired a program about Tunguska titled "The Great Siberian Explosion" and I managed to see the last 75% of it. There was no mention of Tesla, but then when they only invite asteroid experts and meteorite experts to investigate, they only get results relative to asteroids and meteorites. I checked into near-future airings and the next listed for the 14 day period is on Saturday 05/15/99 at 6 p.m. Pacific Daylight Time. Check it out! Be Well, David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 11:36:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA26436; Wed, 12 May 1999 11:33:19 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 11:33:19 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 11:34:36 -0700 Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Message-ID: <19990512.113436.-170993.1.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,3-14,16-22,25-30,34,36-37,40-45 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Bvc1J.0.zS6.kbSEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10459 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 12 May 1999 13:39:43 -0400 (EDT) Bill Briggs 614-752-0199 writes: >David, > >When you only have a hammer, everything looks like nails. > Yeah Bill, I knoooooooooooooow................................ They figured out that there was no impact and that the "explosion" occurred above the site. It is curious that a small cluster of trees more or less in the middle of the destruction zone were left standing straight up while all the rest of the trees in the 25 mile (I think) radius were flat out flat and pointed away from where the standing trees were. I also find it curious that the zone was not circular but "butterfly" shaped. The Russian scientist who made the "breakthrough" made a model with little sticks to represent trees and caused explosions of different intensities, different heights and different angles to have different affects on the sticks. As I recall, he got the butterfly, the small group of standing trees,etc. at an angle of 30 degrees and correlated that with actual "things" in space near enough to earth at the time to cause the occurrence. They ruled out various types of asteroidal and meteorital (did I just invent a new word?) material because most would either burn up long before they got very close to the earth or would not burn much mass and thoroughly crash. Instead, whatever "material" the object was made of managed to get its incredible mass through the atmosphere and explode just several thousand feet from the surface. The next time I see the program, I am going to pay much closer attention to the direction relative to the earth........... and where Tesla's laboratory was at the time............... All the best.......... David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 12:47:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA16561; Wed, 12 May 1999 12:46:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 12:46:17 -0700 Message-ID: <3739D354.16172960@infovia.com.ar> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:15:32 -0300 From: jdelac X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [es] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 References: <3738DACA.5B59AC97@sunherald.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"-WU7B1.0.e24.8gTEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10460 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi : I've tested with same results. Thrusting: yes , reversal: no, thrusting on paper: no. I've checked this with 2 and 3 toroids and the same proportions along the coils with identical results. This seemed an effect in the supporting/transporting wires only. I will to check this with other type of setup for distinguishing where is producing the thrust. Or maybe the laser experiment could show the true... Juan Barrios "Kyle R. Mcallister" escribió: > Hi all: > > I have retested with the correct coil configuration. Thrusting? yes. > Reversal of thrust with reversal of polarity? no. Effects on a sliver of > paper? no. But, at least I am making progress. A roll of 24AWG wire will > be here tomorrow. I am going to test with a magnet next, to see if this > might be a magnetic interaction with the earth's field. > > Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 12:59:02 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA21408; Wed, 12 May 1999 12:58:18 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 12:58:18 -0700 Message-ID: <002701be9cb1$e0d8c680$4668fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 14:58:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"6w_6x.0.IE5.PrTEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10461 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: jdelac To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wednesday, May 12, 1999 2:51 PM Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 >Hi : >I've tested with same results. Thrusting: yes , reversal: no, >thrusting on paper: no. >I've checked this with 2 and 3 toroids and the same proportions along the >coils with identical results. >This seemed an effect in the supporting/transporting wires only. >I will to check this with other type of setup for distinguishing >where is producing the thrust. >Or maybe the laser experiment could show the true... > >Juan Barrios > >"Kyle R. Mcallister" escribió: > >> Hi all: >> >> I have retested with the correct coil configuration. Thrusting? yes. >> Reversal of thrust with reversal of polarity? no. Effects on a sliver of >> paper? no. But, at least I am making progress. A roll of 24AWG wire will >> be here tomorrow. I am going to test with a magnet next, to see if this >> might be a magnetic interaction with the earth's field. >> >> Kyle R. Mcallister > > Just how are your coils wound (Kyle yours also) ? I assume although it has never appeared that the coils are fed parallel, and are both coils wound in a CCW direction. Really don't care to here response about don't make a difference if they are symmetrical because we are assured it does. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 13:02:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA22230; Wed, 12 May 1999 12:59:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 12:59:54 -0700 Message-ID: <002d01be9cb2$185e5660$4668fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: New direct response address Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 15:00:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"8_rOd.0.BR5.vsTEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10462 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Direct all direct response to atglab@atgroup.com, please no longer respond to atg0317@wt.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 13:31:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA00674; Wed, 12 May 1999 13:30:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:30:21 -0700 Message-ID: <373A0008.1D9ACBD5@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 15:26:16 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 References: <002701be9cb1$e0d8c680$4668fea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"K10Kn2.0.RA.SJUEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10463 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atglab wrote: > Just how are your coils wound (Kyle yours also) ? > > I assume although it has never appeared that the coils are fed parallel, and > are both coils wound in a CCW direction. Really don't care to here response > about don't make a difference if they are symmetrical because we are assured > it does. My coils are wound this way: wire is sent through top of toroid, under, and back over. Both are wound this way, and the winding direction is CCW. Both are connected in parallel. Power source is 38-50VDC. I see a downward thrust, but no apparent upward thrust. My coils are symmetrical, uses 26AWG. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 13:36:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA01518; Wed, 12 May 1999 13:32:35 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:32:35 -0700 Message-ID: <373A0091.8C08EB56@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 15:28:33 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 References: <3738DACA.5B59AC97@sunherald.infi.net> <3739D354.16172960@infovia.com.ar> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"W1B8J1.0.ZN.YLUEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10464 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: jdelac wrote: > > Hi : > I've tested with same results. Thrusting: yes , reversal: no, > thrusting on paper: no. > I've checked this with 2 and 3 toroids and the same proportions along the > coils with identical results. > This seemed an effect in the supporting/transporting wires only. > I will to check this with other type of setup for distinguishing > where is producing the thrust. > Or maybe the laser experiment could show the true... Great to hear that there is another trying to sort this out. I have also tested the device by placing a balance beam supported weight above the coils, and then discharging the capacitors. No effect on an object 2 inches above the device. Note: the proof mass was non metallic, a cylinder of plastic. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 13:58:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA11417; Wed, 12 May 1999 13:57:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:57:05 -0700 Message-ID: <19990512205628.35264.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.151] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:56:27 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"fQMYc.0.Co2.WiUEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10465 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I read it as a low compression gas engine with a boost in power from the air tanks..... so yes the exhaust would be hot...... think of your car with blower blowing air into the cylinder after combustion.... > >Hi, > >At the site of de Negre engine ( >http://www.zeropollution.com/zeropollution/no_fuel.html ) : > >" However,  MDI vehicle is design to run exclusively on air compressed. A >jet of cold air is delivered at hight pressure into de combustion chamber >which is already charged up with HOT COMPRESSED AIR. This provides enough >force to run the engine." > >Which temperature is the HOT COMPRESSED AIR? Is this really a high >temperature or is it just warm? > >If the temperature is high : Is the exhaust air also hot? > >Regards, >WJ > > _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 14:02:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA12485; Wed, 12 May 1999 14:00:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 14:00:14 -0700 Message-ID: <000801be9cba$841d10a0$4668fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:00:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"yW27y3.0.-23.RlUEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10466 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wednesday, May 12, 1999 3:34 PM Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 >jdelac wrote: >> >> Hi : >> I've tested with same results. Thrusting: yes , reversal: no, >> thrusting on paper: no. >> I've checked this with 2 and 3 toroids and the same proportions along the >> coils with identical results. >> This seemed an effect in the supporting/transporting wires only. >> I will to check this with other type of setup for distinguishing >> where is producing the thrust. >> Or maybe the laser experiment could show the true... > >Great to hear that there is another trying to sort this out. I have also >tested the device by placing a balance beam supported weight above the >coils, and then discharging the capacitors. No effect on an object 2 >inches above the device. Note: the proof mass was non metallic, a >cylinder of plastic. > >Kyle R. Mcallister > If we understand this correctly the weight you are trying to affect is connected to the balance beam and you are looking for the coils to move the weight so that you can confirm movement ? Don't take this as totally accurate but the force seems to drop off in the area of the inverse of the distance cubed. If you have a balance beam connect it to the coils and measure the effect. When one states that no upward thrust can be seen, remember that the up/down thrust will not be visually the same. In one case (downward) gravity is aiding and in the upward gravity is reducing. With a lab balance the effect of gravity in the up/down movements is calculated as expected. Don't expect to see the same upward deviation as downward. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 15:02:59 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA17651; Wed, 12 May 1999 15:00:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 15:00:56 -0700 Message-ID: <002001be9cc2$bc8565c0$405895d1@premio> Reply-To: "Gene Marlin" From: "Gene Marlin" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:59:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"cOxGA.0.gJ4.NeVEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10467 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >The next time I see the program, I am going to pay much closer attention >to the direction relative to the earth........... and where Tesla's >laboratory was at the time............... Coming in from the direction of the Sun (and the Beta-Taurid stream) at an angle of 30 degrees relative to the surface. I am sorry they had no mention of Tesla, but the impact at Tunguska was consistent with computer models of what an impact at that size and angle....and the witnesses *did* see a fireball enter the atmosphere before detonation. The word you are looking for is "meteoritical". From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 15:50:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA00119; Wed, 12 May 1999 15:49:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 15:49:32 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 22:48:48 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <373a0427.73286886@mail-hub> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id PAA00075 Resent-Message-ID: <"pzWPj3.0.d1.xLWEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10468 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 12 May 1999 07:22:05 +0100 (BST), Cornwall RO wrote: >No Robin, >This is the point, we don't think it is a transformer action because the >flux is independent. The flux exists by atmoic dipole moments not a >'manmade' current loop. > >Keep an eye out for George Holtz on vortex-l because he is very >knowledgable and I could forward his non-private messages to this list. [snip] Hi Remi, The source doesn't necessarily have to be a "man-made" primary for transformer action to apply. The whole point is that analyzing transformer action will show you where to look for the source of the energy. BTW if you're looking at what I suspect you may be looking at, then 8 times isn't nearly enough anyway ;). Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 16:05:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA06786; Wed, 12 May 1999 16:04:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:04:44 -0700 Message-ID: <00e301be9ccb$ee3fb800$21a645d1@nimmachine> From: "Psy-Kosh" To: "Free Energy list" Subject: Speak of the death ray, and it shall... Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 19:05:25 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Resent-Message-ID: <"u9l5Q.0.xf1.BaWEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10469 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Gee, this looks familiar: http://www.the-times.co.uk/news/pages/sti/99/05/09/stiinnnws02007.html?19023 95 Actually, I had an idea of how to construct a ligt saber, inspired by the recent disscusions, by combining this tech with some of those famous longitudnal(sp?) electric waves. Basically, my idea was, to take the uv laser, have a ring electrode just touch the beam, connected to a HF, HC power source, but have the other terminal of that power source (ie, the terminal reciving a current 180 degrees out of phase with the first,) be connectid to a small metal plate, or something (don't know what the best shape would be,) and have that angled so that the longitudnal electric wave (longitudnal-electric just rolls off yer tounge, doesn't it?) intersect the uv beam about 2 meters away. The way I see it, an alternating current would be setup between the ring electrode and the intersection point. give yourself a decent power supply, and poof, you got yourself a light saber. I suspect that if your using a high enough frequency, it might, I repeat, might even become somewhat rigid. Psy-Kosh DC2.!/?(?(H)) r++/r+++! Gm a- s++ "The scientist who would rather refute than comprehend demonstrates he has chosen the wrong calling." -The Forever Machine ------------------------------------------------ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 16:15:07 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA10976; Wed, 12 May 1999 16:14:38 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:14:38 -0700 Posted-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 02:11:41 +0400 (MEDT) Message-ID: <373A0A88.1CE622B0@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 02:11:04 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 References: <000801be9cba$841d10a0$4668fea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BWJuL1.0.Ph2.TjWEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10470 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atglab wrote: [snip] > If you have a balance beam connect it to the coils and measure the effect. > When one states that no upward thrust can be seen, remember that the up/down > thrust will not be visually the same. In one case (downward) gravity is > aiding and in the upward gravity is reducing. With a lab balance the effect > of gravity in the up/down movements is calculated as expected. Don't expect > to see the same upward deviation as downward. Maybe, there would be an asymmetry, but depending to the nonlinear elasticity and plasticity of carrying wires. Gravity would be in effect if the wire show plasticity (non elastic movement). If there is no plasticity, contrary it would be easier to move the cores upward than downward due to non perfectly linear dynamic of the wires. Because the non linearity, it ne ed more force to bend wire downward as they are already bend by the weight of the cores. But as the dynamic range is minimal, we can assume linear behaviour in this range. To avoid anomalies on wire elasticity, wires should be carefully twisted or fixed. Again, a laser beam within a small mirror piece attached to toroids can be used to observe the inclination of the toroid by the effect with more precision by the movement of the spot on a scale at a distance. Angle measurement would be more usable than li near movement, as it allow shorter lead length. Shorter leads help to reduce thermal and auxiliary magnetic effects. Regards, hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 16:19:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA13047; Wed, 12 May 1999 16:18:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:18:44 -0700 Message-ID: <010f01be9ccd$db9d4b20$21a645d1@nimmachine> From: "Psy-Kosh" To: References: <00e301be9ccb$ee3fb800$21a645d1@nimmachine> Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray, and it shall... Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 19:19:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Resent-Message-ID: <"zSSQl.0.MB3.JnWEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10471 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have no idea where that "95" came from. must have typed it accidentally. Psy-Kosh DC2.!/?(?(H)) r++/r+++! Gm a- s++ "The scientist who would rather refute than comprehend demonstrates he has chosen the wrong calling." -The Forever Machine ------------------------------------------------ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 16:54:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA27143; Wed, 12 May 1999 16:53:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:53:44 -0700 Message-ID: <003e01be9cca$d1b3c920$405895d1@premio> Reply-To: "Gene Marlin" From: "Gene Marlin" To: Subject: Even more tornadoes Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 17:57:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"lj8_u1.0.wd6.8IXEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10472 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Some of you might find it interesting to hear that Cuba was hit by tornadoes the other day. I still do not believe in weather modification, but I thought you might like to know that a Communist country and enemy of the US just got hit by storms, where tornadoes are rare. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 17:07:28 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA32200; Wed, 12 May 1999 17:05:45 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 17:05:45 -0700 Message-ID: <373A1751.9EDD47E@bway.net> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 20:05:37 -0400 From: Caigan X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray, and it shall... References: <00e301be9ccb$ee3fb800$21a645d1@nimmachine> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"QMFyN2.0.1t7.OTXEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10473 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Psy-Kosh wrote: > > Gee, this looks familiar: > http://www.the-times.co.uk/news/pages/sti/99/05/09/stiinnnws02007.html?19023 Here's the old link: http://www.sddt.com/files/library/98/04/20/tbz.html New Laser Puts More Authority Behind The Command, "Freeze!" By CHRISTINA JOHNSON - johnson@sddt.com San Diego Daily Transcript April 20, 1998 And here's an old interview: Source: National Public Radio's "Talk of the Nation: Science Friday" Broadcast over: KGOU/KROU in Norman, Oklahoma & Harrah, Oklahoma 106.3 and 105.7 FM Friday, July 24, 1998 2:00 - 3:00 p.m. central standard time IRA FLAYTO (host): I want to bring on someone else now who wrote me a letter. He comes from HSV Technologies in San Diego, and he wrote me a letter. I won't read the whole letter to you, just the relevant part. It says, "Dear Mr. Flayto..." It talks about the "Star Trek" television series, and he talks about the phaser weapon. And he says, "It is now possible to manufacture a completely non-lethal beam weapon to supplement and perhaps replace firearms." And he sent me his patent. He has patented a phaser weapon, and his name is Eric Herr, and he is the inventor and Vice President of HSV Technologies in San Diego. He is on the phone now from San Diego. Welcome to the program. ERIC HERR: Thank you for having me on. FLAYTO: Give us a thumbnail sketch for folks who don't know. Describe this new device you have. HERR: First of all, I have to say we don't have a working prototype because such would be beyond our means at about $200,000. However we have conducted some very successful tests at a local university. The phaser weapon uses what is known as tetany, or tetanization, to immobilize a person. This is the stimulation of muscle tissue by a very weak electric current. It is, in fact, a near-exact replication of the normal neural pulse that contracts muscles and is imperceptible. It cannot be felt... unlike the taser or a stun gun pulse. FLAYTO: So it's a real beam that you shoot out with this weapon? HERR: That's right. FLAYTO: And it hits you in some muscle somewhere and causes you to freeze? HERR: That's correct. FLAYTO: And stuns you? HERR: That's right. FLAYTO: And is it harmful... the beam itself, is it harmful if it would hit you in the eye or anything like that? HERR: No, not at all. Not at all. FLAYTO: So it's basically what... an ultraviolet laser? HERR: That's correct. The ultraviolet beam, specifically at 193 nanometers, ionizes molecular oxygen in the air, creates a wire, as it were, through the air to conduct this current. The current is very weak. It's only 20 milliamps. FLAYTO: And how big a device is this now/ HERR: Right now, the laser that would be used is about the size of a small suitcase or typewriter case. FLAYTO: It's not this little hand-held device. HERR: No, not yet. But we're working on that. FLAYTO: Has anybody, law enforcement people, shown any interest in it? HERR: Very, very much. Everyone is interested in it. Especially... there is a federal bureau called OLETC - the Office of Law Enforcement Technology Commercialization - which has shown great interest. FLAYTO: And does it have adjustable setting, you know, for stun... HERR: That's right. FLAYTO: ...kill, whatever... that sort of things on it? HERR: Well, I didn't invent this to do harm to people. It could be lethal if one increased the current about 200 times and held it on the person's chest for five or ten minutes. But otherwise, no, it is quite harmless. FLAYTO: Let me bring on my other guest. Jeff Greenwald, did you want to ask a question? JEFF GREENWALD: I just wanted to make the point that if it can be lethal, eventually it will be lethal. Just that cheery optimistic note about the weapon. HERR: Well, you see, it would be much more economical just to shoot a person with an ordinary bullet. This device... the cheapest laser available now is about $35,000. Not too many people can afford that. FLAYTO: Lawrence Kraus? LAWRENCE KRAUS: In one sense, things like the phaser, of course, in "Star Trek" are realistic because particle beam weapons of one sort or another - whether it be light photons, ultraviolet, X-rays or actual particle beams - have been discussed and I'm sure will be used. The thing that is sort of unrealistic with the phaser, of course, is the fact that you could turn it not just to "stun" but sometimes to "vaporize," depending upon the episode. And there the energetics are such that I once calculates that if you wanted to vaporize the average human being, the energy released would be something like a 1,100 megaton nuclear weapon explosion. So it wouldn't be what we would call environmentally safe right now. FLAYTO: But Eric, you could stop a car with this or something? HERR: By using a stronger current, a single, high-amperage pulse, yes. There is a Swedish company that makes a harpoon-like device with two wires attached to conduct a strong current to the body of a fleeing car, and this current burns out the ICs in the car's printed circuit boards. FLAYTO: All the computer chips in there. Eric, where do you stand with getting this as a practical weapon or as a practical stun gun or something? HERR: We've had some very favorable inquiries from two local companies. We're also working with a major laser manufacturer. We met with them just the other day here in San Diego with the SBIE Convention. They're going to be running some tests on our device in Fort Lauderdale. FLAYTO: How do you test it? HERR: By conducting a current through the ionized air that the beam creates within it. FLAYTO: Do you have to test it out on animals to see if they get stunned? HERR: Well, as a matter of fact, I tested, some years ago, a medical tetanizing device on myself. It was very effective. I could not move my arm and I could not feel anything at all. FLAYTO: Wow! I hate it when that happens! What do you say to people who think if this falls into the wrong hands it becomes a weapon of mass destruction? You could spray a crowd with a laser beam or something like that. HERR: No, that wouldn't happen. They would just be temporarily paralyzed and when the beam was off of them for even a second or two they would become quite normal again. FLAYTO: Eric Herr, thank you for joining us this hour. HERR: Thank you. FLAYTO: And we'll be very interested in seeing what happens. HERR: Thank you. FLAYTO: Let me just remind everybody that Eric Herr is an inventor and Vice President of HSV Technologies in San Diego, California; and my other guests are Lawrence Kraus, author of "The Physics of Star-Trek," and "Beyond Star-Trek: Physics from Alien Invasions to the End of Time;" and Jeff Greenwald, author of "Future Perfect: How Star-Trek Conquered Planet Earth" and a contributor to "Wired" magazine. [END] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 18:11:07 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA17121; Wed, 12 May 1999 18:07:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 18:07:39 -0700 Message-ID: <19990513010744.18897.rocketmail@web124.yahoomail.com> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 18:07:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerry Wayne Decker Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray, and it shall... To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"qsEcu.0.MB4.RNYEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10474 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Caigan et al; found the phaser patent at; http://164.195.100.11/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=/netahtml/search-bool.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=pall&s1=herr&s2=tetanizing&OS=herr+AND+tetanizing&RS=herr+AND+tetanizing ------------------------- --- Caigan wrote: > Psy-Kosh wrote: > > > > Gee, this looks familiar: > > > http://www.the-times.co.uk/news/pages/sti/99/05/09/stiinnnws02007.html?19023 > > Here's the old link: > http://www.sddt.com/files/library/98/04/20/tbz.html > > New Laser Puts More Authority Behind The Command, > "Freeze!" > By CHRISTINA JOHNSON - johnson@sddt.com > San Diego Daily Transcript April 20, 1998 > === ================================= Please respond to jdecker@keelynet.com as I am writing from my work email of jwdatwork@yahoo.com.........thanks! ================================= _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 18:18:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA22267; Wed, 12 May 1999 18:18:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 18:18:07 -0700 Message-ID: <373A2398.7611D573@infovia.com.ar> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 21:58:01 -0300 From: jdelac X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [es] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 References: <002701be9cb1$e0d8c680$4668fea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"xQrKT3.0.qR5.FXYEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10475 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi: Actually, I've wound coils in both directions (CCW and CW), conected in parallel and serial, same direction and inverse direction. Toroids : Nro 1: 5mm/11mm 29 T. Nro 2: 9mm/16mm 48 T. Nro 3: 15mm/25mm 76 T. All wires of 24 AWG and 26 AWG. All tests with 48-50 V and 30K microfarads. atglab escribió: > From: jdelac > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Date: Wednesday, May 12, 1999 2:51 PM > Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 3 > > >Hi : > >I've tested with same results. Thrusting: yes , reversal: no, > >thrusting on paper: no. > >I've checked this with 2 and 3 toroids and the same proportions along the > >coils with identical results. > >This seemed an effect in the supporting/transporting wires only. > >I will to check this with other type of setup for distinguishing > >where is producing the thrust. > >Or maybe the laser experiment could show the true... > > > >Juan Barrios > > > >"Kyle R. Mcallister" escribió: > > > >> Hi all: > >> > >> I have retested with the correct coil configuration. Thrusting? yes. > >> Reversal of thrust with reversal of polarity? no. Effects on a sliver of > >> paper? no. But, at least I am making progress. A roll of 24AWG wire will > >> be here tomorrow. I am going to test with a magnet next, to see if this > >> might be a magnetic interaction with the earth's field. > >> > >> Kyle R. Mcallister > > > > > Just how are your coils wound (Kyle yours also) ? > > I assume although it has never appeared that the coils are fed parallel, and > are both coils wound in a CCW direction. Really don't care to here response > about don't make a difference if they are symmetrical because we are assured > it does. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 12 21:10:22 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA13602; Wed, 12 May 1999 21:09:55 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 21:09:55 -0700 Message-ID: <373A6BBE.1386CD8D@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 23:05:50 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Toroids... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"kwc8s.0.RK3.I2bEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10476 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: I have retested the effect briefly, and there may after all be a slight upward force. The downward motion is anisotropic with polarity, in one polarity it is downward strongly, in the reverse, it is downward, but not as much. Tomorrow I will test for wire interation effects. Juan, any more tests? Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 00:02:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA20683; Thu, 13 May 1999 00:01:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 00:01:58 -0700 From: MKSBoysal@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 03:00:58 EDT Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"F9esT.0.435.cZdEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10477 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: << Hi folks, Speaking about this subject, often I wondered, what kind of Ray Machine or a Device would be if you were to take a part, old micro wave oven pull out the transformer and magnetron and mount them in a metal box with directional antenna, with portable power supply of compact 1.5 kW inverter an a battery (would be kind of heavy gizmo) but can anyone guess or calculate the result of this idea? Like, can it knock the electronics out, or turn a flurencean bulb on? from distance? Or can you use it for game hunting? Of then I wondered about this. MKSB.>> From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 00:29:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA25990; Thu, 13 May 1999 00:29:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 00:29:21 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 17:39:35 -0700 Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Message-ID: <19990513.003226.-246723.0.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,3-4,6-15,17-19,21-27,29-33 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Jvkmc3.0.xL6.HzdEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10478 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Folks, On Wed, 12 May 1999 16:59:38 -0500 "Gene Marlin" writes: > >Coming in from the direction of the Sun (and the Beta-Taurid stream) at an angle of 30 degrees relative to the surface.< Is this info from the program or from another source? In any case, I see am going to have to find out where the sun was relative to longitude at the time of the occurrence. > but the impact at Tunguska was consistent with computer >models of what an impact at that size and angle< I wonder what evidence would be consistent with an accurate computer model of the use of Tesla's (alleged) device. >....and the witnesses *did* see a fireball enter the atmosphere before detonation.< I also wonder what the witnesses would be expected to see if Tesla and his device WERE responsible for the incident. If any one can tell us with any usable accuracy, it is Tesla. Personally, I prefer to hope that Tesla was not involved,given the standard global idiocy as applied to use of massive amounts of power. Sticking with it,......David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 01:22:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA04165; Thu, 13 May 1999 01:22:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 01:22:23 -0700 Message-ID: <373A8734.1C304452@infovia.com.ar> Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 05:03:01 -0300 From: jdelac X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [es] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: 'A' Field and Thrust References: <19990510224205.8945.rocketmail@web114.yahoomail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uyuw53.0.-01._keEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10479 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Yes Jerry, post it here please. Jerry Wayne Decker escribió: > Hi! > > Got an email from Michael so checked out the > site....interesting effect, but I note the paper disc > was subject to vibration from being placed on the > coils. > > "A small paper circle was placed over the center of > the small (top - focusing) coil." > > Analogies; > > 1) an air pallet that floats weights on a cushion of > air > 2) electronic vibrating table football or hockey > where the players vibrate across the surface in a kids > game > 3) a buzzer that has a metal plate suspended over a > coil on a pin, it vibrates due to hysteresis (I > think..) > > I have an intriguing file from the old BBS which I'll > send to the atgroup where the guy claims thrust from > superposed EM fields....might copy it here as its not > too large... > ----------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 01:33:26 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA07741; Thu, 13 May 1999 01:31:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 01:31:17 -0700 Message-ID: <373A895E.33009FA1@infovia.com.ar> Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 05:12:14 -0300 From: jdelac X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [es] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroids... References: <373A6BBE.1386CD8D@sunherald.infi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"B8Igt3.0.su1.KteEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10480 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Kyle and all: No yet...someone post here about an recipient fill with oil... Maybe it is a better way of verifying the thrust.... "Kyle R. Mcallister" escribió: > Hi all: > > I have retested the effect briefly, and there may after all be a slight > upward force. The downward motion is anisotropic with polarity, in one > polarity it is downward strongly, in the reverse, it is downward, but > not as much. Tomorrow I will test for wire interation effects. Juan, any > more tests? > > Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 03:23:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA11471; Thu, 13 May 1999 03:22:18 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 03:22:18 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 11:22:08 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: flux linkage and energy Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"CAOtM1.0.8p2.QVgEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10481 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Robin, I suspect you know that a generator is transformer action :) (Think about it, the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... ) (Think about it, the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... ) (Think about it, the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... ) (Think about it, the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... ) (Think about it, the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... ) (Think about it, the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... ) (Think about it, the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... ) (Think about it, the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... ) Remi in good jest. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 04:40:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id EAA22903; Thu, 13 May 1999 04:39:31 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 04:39:31 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: exeter.city.ac.uk: remi owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 12:39:18 +0100 (BST) From: Cornwall RO X-Sender: remi@exeter To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: A generator is transformer action Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"TlNEZ3.0.ib5.pdhEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10482 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: A generator is transformer action. Think about the simplest type, a bar magnet spining inside a coil. Consider the magnet as one huge dipole and we 'randomise it' by turning it so the flux is a t 90deg to coil's axis, flux through coil is now zero. Now draw an analogy: we create the magnet with minimal energy (align the dipoles) then randomise it whilst linking its flux to something useful... The work we do in creating the bar magnet goes towards the magnet's field energy, this is recouped when we destroy it. The analogy here is the with the cycle utilising the magnetocalorific effect - the excitor coil creates, then the heat destroys when it warms up again. Net zero electrical work in excitor coil. However when the magnet gets destroyed, 'randomised' it is exactly analogous to turning the magnet in the generator 90degs - zero net flux along the axis of the coil BUT it also links to other coils and so does work. Now my confusion about the field energy and the work turning the dipoles has been corrected, I can formulated this and finish the paper. QED. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 06:20:07 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA17037; Thu, 13 May 1999 06:19:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 06:19:30 -0700 Message-ID: <19990513131858.34297.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [192.250.113.22] From: "Chris Moon" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 06:18:56 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"hG_fA2.0.6A4.Y5jEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10483 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hmm could add a new dimesion to the family roast The microwave would only work on 'wet stuff' effectively as metal tends to scatter the wave. The rest treat as Microwave links to a building.. . but for game.. handy for the cooking later. I do have a very healthy respect for the nasty effects of Microwaves and wave guides, I've seen cooked face. However an interesting variation to try as well is a small electo/microwave device.. this might have more punch even on metal. **use a range finder (optical or other to calculate the distance **to the target. **use say two or more microwave devices in wave guides and link them **into some servo mechanism to converge on the target.. overrun the **power in pulses for hi power punches.. Do people still use MASERS? that might have some potential. Since microwaves are 'big' you could try making a version of the Vortex cannon that really smarts. I've got kids and pets so I won't be trying any of these out! but if anybody does I would be interested in the results esp if it could fit on top of a volvo! Cheers Chris M. ><< Hi folks, >Speaking about this subject, often I wondered, what kind of Ray Machine or >a >Device would be if you were to take a part, old micro wave oven pull out >the > transformer and magnetron and mount them in a metal box with directional >antenna, with portable power supply of compact 1.5 kW inverter an a battery >(would be kind of heavy gizmo) but can anyone guess or calculate the result >of this idea? >Like, can it knock the electronics out, or turn a flurencean bulb on? from >distance? > >Or can you use it for game hunting? > >Of then I wondered about this. > >MKSB.>> > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 06:47:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA25714; Thu, 13 May 1999 06:47:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 06:47:11 -0700 Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 08:47:04 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"-FkXm1.0.dH6.UVjEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10484 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Thu, 13 May 1999 MKSBoysal@aol.com wrote: > << Hi folks, > Speaking about this subject, often I wondered, what kind of Ray Machine or a > Device would be if you were to take a part, old micro wave oven pull out the > transformer and magnetron and mount them in a metal box with directional > antenna, with portable power supply of compact 1.5 kW inverter an a battery > (would be kind of heavy gizmo) but can anyone guess or calculate the result > of this idea? > Like, can it knock the electronics out, or turn a flurencean bulb on? from > distance? > > Or can you use it for game hunting? > > Of then I wondered about this. > > MKSB.>> > Unless you are very experienced in dealng with microwaves and microwave power, DO NOT attempt this!! This is dangerous IN THE EXTREME! Microwave ovens are carefully designed with RF-tight seals so that the power does not get out of the enclosure. Sometimes even a bread crumb in the seal will allow some of the microwave energy to get out - energy designed at a frequency to resonate/heat water. If you do the above, you are turning the out-of-doors into a big microwave oven. Microwaves do not always go where you think they are going. They leak through gaps in waveguide flanges, leak around to the back of dish antennas, etc. If you have no experience with microwave antenna design, you can't be guaranteed YOU will be in a safe location anywhere in the vicinity. Several radio amateurs have used high-powered microwave equipment for EME (earth-moon-earth, or moonbounce) communication, but they knew what they were doing. I've heard many horror stories about people who didn't know what they were doing. Many ended up dead. I don't usually sound so gloomy but this is one of the more dangerous things someone could get into. It could injure an entire neighborhood (including the operator). Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 08:24:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA20012; Thu, 13 May 1999 08:08:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 08:08:39 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990513062522.23bfa522@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 06:25:22 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990512003025.01086100@inforamp.net> References: <3.0.6.16.19990511182351.226f007e@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990510231749.009c0a90@inforamp.net> <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"4KWme.0.bu4.thkEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10485 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Colin and all, At 12:30 AM 5/12/99 -0700, you wrote: >>Yes, in context the "pondermotive" force seems to be the force between 2 >>current elements. I have only seen it used in some of Peter Graneau's >>papers, but couldn't find its definition in any electrodynamics or >>mechanics book. Maxwell's books "A Treatise on electricity and magnetism" >>seem to use the term "electromotive". > >The term was used throughout the 1830s to at least the 1850s. Thanks for this info. The term "magnetomotive" is still used. Besides Phipps' book, Whittaker's book "A History of the Theories of Aether and Electricity" might be another reference. > >An excellent question, but ... Well-- I certainly don't think Ampere did >any experiments with antennas ;-) Yes, ;-). I do wonder how many "Amperes" his Volta piles produced? > > >Some I know >>were intra-circuit. Does the VACE results imply that the "polarization" >>currents do NOT travel in closed circuits in each VACE, as there is a >>measurement difference?? >> > >To which measurement do you refer? All of the VACE measurements. I am wondering about the whole concept: Can a "linear" current element be simulated by adding the contributions of many closed small circuits? An analogy might be "Can a electric (monopole) charge be simulated by an array of dipoles?"- maybe within the array, say all dipoles pointing to a point, but not at a distance? If not, then what are the VACE measurements showing? -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 08:25:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA25188; Thu, 13 May 1999 08:22:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 08:22:04 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 11:25:50 -0400 Message-ID: <19990513152550859.AAA282@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"CJSoI2.0.T96.RukEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10486 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Somnebody wrote: ><< Hi folks, >Speaking about this subject, often I wondered, what kind of Ray Machine or a >Device would be if you were to take a part, old micro wave oven pull out the > transformer and magnetron and mount them in a metal box with directional >antenna, with portable power supply of compact 1.5 kW inverter an a battery >(would be kind of heavy gizmo) but can anyone guess or calculate the result >of this idea? >Like, can it knock the electronics out, or turn a flurencean bulb on? from >distance? > >Or can you use it for game hunting? > >Of then I wondered about this. > >MKSB.>> You don't live in my neighborhood, do you? Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 10:06:28 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA00099; Thu, 13 May 1999 10:03:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 10:03:17 -0700 Message-ID: <373ADBF2.3A51@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 10:04:34 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"o_ptk3.0.S1.LNmEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10487 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: MKSBoysal@aol.com wrote: > > << Hi folks, > Speaking about this subject, often I wondered, what kind of Ray Machine or a > Device would be if you were to take a part, old micro wave oven pull out the > transformer and magnetron and mount them in a metal box with directional > antenna, with portable power supply of compact 1.5 kW inverter an a battery > (would be kind of heavy gizmo) but can anyone guess or calculate the result > of this idea? > Like, can it knock the electronics out, or turn a flurencean bulb on? from > distance? > > Or can you use it for game hunting? > > Of then I wondered about this. > > MKSB.>> You might light a fluorescent bulb but not blow it. The frequency of microwave ovens is far too low to produce a directional beam using anything less than a 30' antenna. Long term exposure to those kind of power levels and frequencies will likely give one cataracts and higher chances of all sorts of cancers and other unplesant things. Essentially the same thing is being developed by the DOD (Northrop) using a Varian gyrotron tube operating at mm-wave frequencies (60-140 GHz) and megawatt power levels. At these frequencies the antenna can be about 3' diameter but the power supply is still the size of a small car. There is a recent patent for this thing but I forgot the #. Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 10:07:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA01802; Thu, 13 May 1999 10:06:48 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 10:06:48 -0700 From: tv@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 09:58:22 -0700 Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) Message-ID: <19990513.100507.-400419.0.tv@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1,3,5,7,9-10,12-16,18,21-22,29-33 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"t3Yho1.0._R.eQmEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10488 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Speaking about this subject, often I wondered, what kind of Ray Machine or a >Device would be if you were to take a part, old micro wave oven pull out the > transformer and magnetron and mount them in a metal box with directional >antenna, with portable power supply of compact 1.5 kW inverter an a battery >(would be kind of heavy gizmo) but can anyone guess or calculate the result >of this idea? >Like, can it knock the electronics out, or turn a flurencean bulb on? from >distance? >Or can you use it for game hunting? I went to a talk at a ham radio convention about microwave oven communication. They pulse modulated the magnetron for a high powered microwave link. You could pulse position modulate it for digital or compressed digital voice with a PC. I think you would be disapointed with it as a "ray gun". The heating effects and electromagnetic disruptive effects drop off rapidly with distance. However you can make yourself sick. Beside the obvious heating effects, the microwave energy causes changes in the blood and other systems of the body that can eventually lead to all sorts of maladies. Of course some people radiate their brains with cell phones at very close range for hours on end. Tim ( tv@juno.com ) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 10:12:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA04420; Thu, 13 May 1999 10:11:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 10:11:58 -0700 Message-ID: <373ADE04.4963@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 10:13:24 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"U94JM2.0.z41.UVmEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10489 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Zack Widup wrote: > > On Thu, 13 May 1999 MKSBoysal@aol.com wrote: > > If you do the above, you are turning the out-of-doors into a big > microwave oven. Microwaves do not always go where you think they are > going. They leak through gaps in waveguide flanges, leak around to the > back of dish antennas, etc. If you have no experience with microwave > antenna design, you can't be guaranteed YOU will be in a safe location > anywhere in the vicinity. > > Several radio amateurs have used high-powered microwave equipment for EME > (earth-moon-earth, or moonbounce) communication, but they knew what they > were doing. I've heard many horror stories about people who didn't know > what they were doing. Many ended up dead. > > I don't usually sound so gloomy but this is one of the more dangerous > things someone could get into. It could injure an entire neighborhood > (including the operator). > > Zack Just as a coincidence , someone on e-bay is selling a USN copper mesh suit (no kidding !) just for this purpose. If anyone is desperate to have one search under 'microwave' and it will show up. Have fun and keep in mind that cell-phones given enough use will have effect similar to a larger microwave zapper. Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 11:37:15 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA05920; Thu, 13 May 1999 11:36:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 11:36:23 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990513142748.009049a0@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 14:27:48 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990513062522.23bfa522@earthlink.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19990512003025.01086100@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990511182351.226f007e@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990510231749.009c0a90@inforamp.net> <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"onP1X1.0.JS1.dknEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10490 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 06:25 AM 05/13/99, Dave wrote: >>Some I know >>>were intra-circuit. Does the VACE results imply that the "polarization" >>>currents do NOT travel in closed circuits in each VACE, as there is a >>>measurement difference?? >>> >> >>To which measurement do you refer? > >All of the VACE measurements. I am wondering about the whole concept: Can a >"linear" current element be simulated by adding the contributions of many >closed small circuits? An analogy might be "Can a electric (monopole) >charge be simulated by an array of dipoles?"- maybe within the array, say >all dipoles pointing to a point, but not at a distance? > >If not, then what are the VACE measurements showing? My long (dilettante) answer :-)) But wasn't it "linear" only at the surface of the toroid? Many 'closed small' circuits contribute to the linear "simulation" as many small wheels contribute to a linear movement of a conveyor belt. >From his experimental results-- there appears to be an energy component to the virtual currents that can leave the linear surface of the toroid and impart a *balanced* [curved] force onto another nearby permanent magnet toroid. There is no question [after reading his paper]; this is a non-magnetic interaction. . But is this force the same as the longitudinal Amperian force that Graneau revealed with exploding wires, or the same as the impulse force from ATGroup or Kyle (and now Juan Barrios) etc? I'm not so sure. The angular measurements [in the VACE experiments that use the permanent magnet toroids] seem to indicate that this force law follows curved closed lines-- similar to the B field-- closed, but in the minds of many, this is still considered to be "action at a distance"-- a concept that has so much 'spookiness' attached to it, that we wish to find grounds to dismiss it. What Phipps has done is to make that impossible. The reported *unbalanced* force, however, [the thrusting] from the electromagnet toroids [which received an impulse of current,] could be focusing neutrinos like a ramjet [or aether-- Rick Anderson's theory] or they may be creating a vortex momentum 'A' field [aether smoke ring] which is being "pushed"against, or they may be pushing against the edge of the sidereal universe with a momentum exchange-- or maybe pushing tiny invisible 'bubbles' :-) Your question, "what are the VACE measurements showing?" is also valid for the unbalanced impulse force measurements from the electromagnet toroids. What are those measurements showing? Perhaps the question should be expanded-- studied from the Torsion perspective (electrogravity v magnetogravity) instead of from the inadequate Lorentz force law or the even more adequate Amperian force law. What we really need right now is someone open minded, who really understands this subject. Honest short answer: I don't know :-( Colin Quinney From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 12:27:13 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA25475; Thu, 13 May 1999 12:24:20 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 12:24:20 -0700 From: "Martin" To: Subject: Re: Pulsed Vortex Cannon Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 11:12:32 +0200 Message-ID: <01be9d20$bb893bc0$LocalHost@Martin.icon.co.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"5nuxL.0.yD6.ZRoEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10491 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all >These things were real and worked?????!!.. >I missed out on some fun when I was young! Yep not only on aircraft but for riot control as well, works great. Regards Martin http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/7919/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 13:19:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA06352; Thu, 13 May 1999 13:18:30 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 13:18:30 -0700 From: "Sergei M.Godin" To: Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 00:17:00 +0400 Message-ID: <01be9d7d$8f15dc80$d180dac3@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"le4OJ1.0._Y1.LEpEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10492 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi folks, look at this: http://omzg.sscc.ru/tunguska/ SMG From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 14:35:23 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA12618; Thu, 13 May 1999 14:33:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 14:33:28 -0700 Message-ID: <000301be9d88$5429ef20$13e8fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Tests Coming Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 16:33:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"OGJpB3.0.z43.eKqEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10493 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: We have our sensors built and are calibrating. Hope to begin testing in the next 24 hours. Will keep the list posted when data becomes available. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 15:06:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA25949; Thu, 13 May 1999 15:05:43 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 15:05:43 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 18:04:27 EDT Subject: Re: Toroids, IMPORTANT!!! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"yRLQ1.0.IL6.toqEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10494 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/12/99 7:26:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time, stk@sunherald.infi.net writes: << > Kyle, > If various orientations of the magnet does not change the thrusting then > it would seem the earth's magnetic field is not involved in the interaction. Yes, that is what I meant. > To me it still does not rule out magnetic interactions between the input > leads, also possibly involving the toroids suspension. Correct. It could very well be a wire interaction. Would you know any way to test for this besides changing the orientation of the wires? >> One possibility -- you might be able to short the toroids with a shunt and reduce the capacitor voltage so you get the same peak current. That's certainly not a perfect test but it could (?) be easy and if the thrusting completely disappears it indicates it originates from the toroids. Ken From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 17:26:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA30133; Thu, 13 May 1999 17:26:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 17:26:03 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: More Tornadoes? Tunguska? Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 00:25:22 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <373f6ccf.72738220@mail-hub> References: <01be9d7d$8f15dc80$d180dac3@default> In-Reply-To: <01be9d7d$8f15dc80$d180dac3@default> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id RAA30100 Resent-Message-ID: <"deWOz3.0.dM7.RssEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10495 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 14 May 1999 00:17:00 +0400, Sergei M.Godin wrote: >Hi folks, > >look at this: http://omzg.sscc.ru/tunguska/ > >SMG This host times out. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 20:08:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA06741; Thu, 13 May 1999 20:07:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 20:07:28 -0700 From: MATTIARO@aol.com Message-ID: <9d752dd9.246cec6a@aol.com> Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 23:03:06 EDT Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"PQBhV1.0.Ef1.lDvEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10496 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all. About tampering with the microwave oven, there is one thing I want to say. DON'T. There are too many possibilities to harm or kill yourself and others. Leave the microwave oven as a coffee warmer. :-) Matti From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 20:43:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA15368; Thu, 13 May 1999 20:43:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 20:43:23 -0700 Message-ID: <373B7200.1E61@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 20:44:48 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Speak of the death ray (other interesting idea here) References: <9d752dd9.246cec6a@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"RZ-hd2.0.1m3.QlvEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10497 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: MATTIARO@aol.com wrote: > > > There are too many possibilities to harm or kill yourself and others. > Leave the microwave oven as a coffee warmer. :-) > > Matti I have an even better idea, give it as a present to someone you do not really like. Microwaved food seems to be seriously damaged. There was a fairly credible study done in Switzerland proving this but the scientist who published it had a gag order placed on him at the request of swiss appliance manufacturers association. It was lifted just last year. Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 13 22:50:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA14727; Thu, 13 May 1999 22:50:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 22:50:28 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990513212700.22572aa0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 21:27:00 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: More VACE thoughts In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990513142748.009049a0@inforamp.net> References: <3.0.6.16.19990513062522.23bfa522@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990512003025.01086100@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990511182351.226f007e@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990510231749.009c0a90@inforamp.net> <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"FqCMY3.0.yb3.acxEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10498 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Colin and all, Was: Testing toroid anomalies with laser beam At 02:27 PM 5/13/99 -0700, you wrote: >At 06:25 AM 05/13/99, Dave wrote: >>All of the VACE measurements. I am wondering about the whole concept: Can a >>"linear" current element be simulated by adding the contributions of many >>closed small circuits? An analogy might be "Can a electric (monopole) >>charge be simulated by an array of dipoles?"- maybe within the array, say >>all dipoles pointing to a point, but not at a distance? >> >>If not, then what are the VACE measurements showing? > > >My long (dilettante) answer :-)) > >But wasn't it "linear" only at the surface of the toroid? Many 'closed >small' circuits contribute to the linear "simulation" as many small wheels >contribute to a linear movement of a conveyor belt. No, the surface currents are still closed. In your example, usually the conveyer belt is a loop also, linear in the VACE case means "isolated linear", not a closed circuit or loop. It is virtual because no one, as far as I know, can generate charge at one point in space, have it flow to another point, then disappear. (antennas aside). > >>From his experimental results-- there appears to be an energy component to >the virtual currents that can leave the linear surface of the toroid and >impart a *balanced* [curved] force onto another nearby permanent magnet >toroid. There is no question [after reading his paper]; this is a >non-magnetic interaction. Maybe Ampere himself would define any force between current elements as magnetic, so he would add this to the definition of "magnetic"? :-) Does anyone know when the Biot-Savort law was written? But is this force the same as the longitudinal >Amperian force that Graneau revealed with exploding wires, or the same as >the impulse force from ATGroup or Kyle (and now Juan Barrios) etc? I'm not >so sure. The angular measurements [in the VACE experiments that use the >permanent magnet toroids] seem to indicate that this force law follows >curved closed lines-- similar to the B field-- closed, but in the minds of >many, this is still considered to be "action at a distance"-- a concept >that has so much 'spookiness' attached to it, that we wish to find grounds >to dismiss it. What Phipps has done is to make that impossible. A goog question. Please refresh me, what is "action at a distance", as opposed to a "field"? > >The reported *unbalanced* force, however, [the thrusting] from the >electromagnet toroids [which received an impulse of current,] could be >focusing neutrinos like a ramjet [or aether-- Rick Anderson's theory] or >they may be creating a vortex momentum 'A' field [aether smoke ring] which >is being "pushed"against, or they may be pushing against the edge of the >sidereal universe with a momentum exchange-- or maybe pushing tiny >invisible 'bubbles' :-) > >Your question, "what are the VACE measurements showing?" is also valid for >the unbalanced impulse force measurements from the electromagnet toroids. >What are those measurements showing? Perhaps the question should be >expanded-- studied from the Torsion perspective (electrogravity v >magnetogravity) instead of from the inadequate Lorentz force law or the >even more adequate Amperian force law. What we really need right now is >someone open minded, who really understands this subject. > >Honest short answer: I don't know :-( > >Colin Quinney > Well, I've thought more on the VACE interactions. Could they be considered dipole like? (A current element, if turned 180 deg, has the opposite direction of force, etc) A simple case is 2 PM magnets that I can see in my head: What is their force along the line between them? Compare them to the VACE results: (one could also do this with electric dipoles, etc. I don't see how Newton's third law wouldn't apply, Lorentz, either!) 1. S-N S-N fixed | rotatable, angle alpha VACE Magnet force Ampere, case A Lorentz -cos(alpha) cos(alpha) zero [I am using + as repulsion as Phipps does] One sees the same form.. 2. N | S-N S | rotatable Magnet force Ampere, Case B Lorentz -sin(alpha) -2sin(alpha) sin(alpha) Cannot really compare the magnitudes, but the Lorentz example seems to be the wrong sign for alpha=90 degrees = 2 parallel currents. 3. S-N S-N | |Both rotated together Magnet force Ampere, Case C Lorentz -cos(2alpha)= 1-2cos^2(alpha) 3cos^2(alpha)-2 sin^2(alpha) Here the interaction seems more involved than 2 simple dipoles... Also note that the Ampere force is in line with the vector between the 2 elements, while this is not the case for 2 dipoles. Try case 2 for 2 small magnets for alpha =0. I have been also trying to think of other factors that may produce forces, if they (the differences) cannot be explained by the superposition of closed currents, or to explain no interaction of a VACE and a toroid electromagnet. Things like what if the legs of the VACE Alnico magnets were a different width than the cross pieces, causing a flux density change around the "toroid", 2 cycles per 360 deg. Just a wild speculation. Thanks for your time, -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 00:06:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA28939; Fri, 14 May 1999 00:04:34 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 00:04:34 -0700 Message-ID: <19990514070401.30225.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.24] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Pulsed Vortex Cannon Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 00:04:01 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"TQsdC.0._37.1iyEt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10499 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I one read that.... the germans developed one that "shook wave" traveled supersonic.... the author claimed "you are flying along and suddenly your wing are gone... then you hear the boom"????? could this really be possible???? > >Hi all > > >These things were real and worked?????!!.. > >I missed out on some fun when I was young! > >Yep not only on aircraft but for riot control as well, works great. > >Regards >Martin >http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/7919/ > ttfn, Timothy... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 01:45:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA07785; Fri, 14 May 1999 01:44:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 01:44:58 -0700 Message-ID: <19990514084426.31141.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [205.181.240.22] From: "Chris Moon" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Pulsed Vortex Cannon Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 01:44:25 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"ltG-H3.0.Yv1.9A-Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10500 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Chaps, with modifications, could a car exhaust could be modified to blow 'smoke rings' but that could give variable high frequency pulses. It would be interesting to see how powerful they would be, backfires can be pretty noisey so that some power must exist in the system. Cheers Chris M. > >I one read that.... the germans developed one that "shook wave" traveled >supersonic.... the author claimed "you are flying along and suddenly your >wing are gone... then you hear the boom"????? could this really be >possible???? > >> >>Hi all >> >> >These things were real and worked?????!!.. >> >I missed out on some fun when I was young! >> >>Yep not only on aircraft but for riot control as well, works great. >> >>Regards >>Martin >>http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/7919/ >> > > > > ttfn, > Timothy... > > >_______________________________________________________________ >Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 01:46:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA07912; Fri, 14 May 1999 01:45:42 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 01:45:42 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Tenguska Aim Message-Id: <926671512.8730.783@excite.com> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 01:45:12 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.55 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"jLhaX1.0.Xx1.rA-Et"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10501 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: The claims of projected energy have never been verified experimentally to my knowledge. No one WANTS to believe Tesla accomplished an explosion at Tenguska because it shows our complete ignorance of this process. Personally I believe it might be possible. If Tesla was willing to demonstrate this on the moon,was he simply bluffing? On July 2nd 1994 I did some experimentation that may have led to some unusual effects. I am somewhat convinced that I caused a power outage, because it seems too much of a coincidence for this to be random. In this experiment 2 tesla coils were constructed with secondaries of approximately equal inductances but different geometries. These both used 1500 ft of 18 gauge wire. Both of these coils had a 6/1 diameter ratio and also a 6/1 difference in wire spacing. One coil was 20 in diameter, the other 10 feet. The coils were separated about two feet. The object of this experiment was to determine what would happen when the two systems were operated in agreement and also opposition. For those not familiar with tesla coils it is neccessary to regress. It is found that when the secondary of a quarter wavelength TC is grounded it increases the output voltage at the top of the secondary as expressed in the arcing activity noted by the length of the arcing into space. The earth is used as a reservoir of free electrons. The tesla secondary simply taps into this reservoir electron supply. Often in experimentation it is also noticed that when the input amperage of the primary exceeds a certain value, arcing between the primary and secondary also occurs which is not desirable to produce the high voltage effects on the secondary. Grounding the secondary also helps eliminate this occurance. Now in this experiment the secondaries were both grounded far apart in space with separate grounds. The large coil was grounded to the gas meter about 20 ft away (I dont think the gas co recommends this!) and the smaller coil was grounded by a copper rod driven into the ground right next to the coil.(This was an outdoor effort recorded on tape) The primaries from both systems were wired in series and the two secondary ends placed close in space to observe the respective arcing between them. The initial thinking was that if the coils were functioning identically they should have produced an electrostatic or voltage repulsion since both would be negative or positive at the same time. To change this condition all one needed to do was reverse the connections to one of the primaries which would mean that when one was negative the other would be positive. However the systems operated identically to produce opposing voltage effects still allowed arcing between them. Changing the series primary connections to produce an aiding instead of opposing effect simply increased the length and strength of the arc between them. This experiment simply implies that the smaller coil probably contained much more voltage potential than the larger, and even though arcing between them occured, this happened because one simply overides the other because at any point in time one is more strongly negative or positive than the other and arcing between them still occurs as a fact explained as a greater potential traveling to a lesser potential. These combinations were switched repeatedly for these observations. Unbeknownst to us we were actually sending pulses BACK into the earth by doing this. In the case of a single system all the secondary does is borrow and replace free electrons from the earth. In the case of the systems operating in agreement ( opposite polarities attract) when one secondary is borrowing electrons the other is returning them. In the case of opposition however an excess on one side means that a pumping action BACK into the earth might be occuring since one side pushes the other because of different volumes of potential. Of course the grounding Tesla had at Wardencliff was the very best he could concieve of, and pales in comparison to that of a gas main piping system. Nevertheless about 12 hours after these experiments a loud explosion was heard outside the next morning. The television went blank and we and the rest of the street downward were without power on a perfectly calm summer day. The lightening arrestor on a pole 75 feet away had exploded! We were the only street in town without power! This prompted the neighbors to call the police on us. End of those experiments. I explained to those piggies I couldnt possibly be responsible since I wasnt doing anything today. The electric company came by and tried to find a cause but could find no burnt squirrels in their tour of the street. Looking at my outside apparatus they were simply dumbfounded. OF course everyone agrees that something that only pulls 10 amps maximum could not cause a short of hundreds of amps a half a day later. This is a mystery of coincidence. Stationary electrical waves returning to their source 12 hours later that caused an avalanche of return energy? Scalar waves propagated by two identical polarities with different volumes of potential with groundings placed far apart? These are justified speculations that of course have nothing to do with Tenguska? After all how could such an effect be aimed? That is the million dollar question. HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 06:12:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA26895; Fri, 14 May 1999 06:12:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 06:12:21 -0700 Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 07:11:03 -0600 (MDT) From: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" X-Sender: jdo@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca To: Alik Shereshevsky Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Swiss Microwave study In-Reply-To: <373B7200.1E61@intergate.bc.ca> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"288p83.0.4a6.q42Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10502 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Alik or others: Have you seen the Swiss study? I would like to obtain a copy if anyone knows a reference. This is one reason we do not have a microwave oven in our home. Jorg Ostrowski ________________________________________________________________________ You said: Microwaved food seems to be seriously damaged. There was a fairly credible study done in Switzerland proving this but the scientist who published it had a gag order placed on him at the request of swiss appliance manufacturers association. It was lifted just last year. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 06:28:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA30617; Fri, 14 May 1999 06:27:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 06:27:22 -0700 Message-ID: <001801be9e0d$9b806900$e3edfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 2 Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 08:28:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"u90Ks1.0.IU7.wI2Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10503 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 5:23 PM Subject: Re: Toroids, results pt. 2 >Hi all: > >The test with 26AWG was much more successful. I can confirm that there >is some kind of force being produced, whether it is vertical magnetic >interactions or something else, I don't know. I cannot change the >direction of the motion of the toroids by reversing polarity. The device >always thrusts down. But, the toroids were mistakenly wound opposite. >The coils themselves are wound in different directions. I am now winding >a new toroid so they will both be identical, just different sizes. >Thermal heating is ruled out. I can strike a pulse, get it moving, and >watch carefully its amplitude of swing. When it reaches lowest position, >I can strike another arc, increasing amplitude. When it reaches highest >position, I can strike an arc and nearly stop the device from moving. >ATG0317: what kind of paper did you use for the paper test? Normal >notebook paper was unaffected. The piece used was smaller than the >smallest toroid. Stay tuned... > >Kyle R. Mcallister > Kyle and All: The paper used by atg0317 was a polished surface yellow legal pad type. The dots were taken from a standard hole punch. One thing which could maybe have an effect on the out come (guessing) is that the relative humidity is about 60%-73% and we have problems many times with our printers etc., because of this. Not saying this should have an effect, just mentioning it. Also added moisture would increase the weight. The original tests have been repeated with a lower power level (original coils). The capacitor was reduced to 8,600uf and the voltage 40v. The test is repeatable, we stand by what is being reported. The paper dot is moved and dimpled as stated. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 07:31:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA13639; Fri, 14 May 1999 07:28:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 07:28:26 -0700 Message-ID: <002001be9e15$eae17ae0$74dc82d1@felis> From: "Felis Catus" To: Subject: Microwave Oven Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 10:27:36 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001D_01BE9DF4.62D415C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"VVEJi.0.yK3.9C3Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10504 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BE9DF4.62D415C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable As an amateur radio operator,(WA2YIX) have never heard such allegations = seriously discussed-or even considered- in experimental literature, like = QST. QST is free of the 'commercial pressures', cited by the Swiss = paper- it is paid for by subscriptions from its members and has been = since its founding. Amateur Radio Operators having a "Technician" or = above class of license have had access to the microwave bands since = after WWI when modern telecommunications treaties/ band allocations to = the commercial/nonprofit services were set up. I have never heard such = allegations discussed in the literature amongst license holders here who = do experiment with microwaves reporting in QST- post the Swiss paper = here. 'Quod Et Demonstratum'-(L)-"Im From Missouri...as the Americans = say..."-show me! Does the paper rely upon statistical inferences from = human behaviours- like a possible co relation between cancers and = microwave oven use? Is not human behaviour the ultimate 'soft', = subjective field of inquiry as opposed to the "hard" sciences, like = Physics and Chemistry? Using the mathematical engine of statistical = inferences taught taught as acceptable scientific protocols in = behavioural science, the psychiatrist Karl Jung co-related various = astrological conjunctions/signs with human behaviour! The militant = materialist/Yankee organization PSICOPS critically examined Professor = Jungs mathematical/statistical procedures/protocols used and could not = find any fault in his application of scientific protocols. This is not = to say I am endorsing astrology here, but in the field of human = behaviours you can co-relate anything with anything. If what the Swiss = found is with the realms of 'hard' emperical observation-like the all = too well known effects of radioactive poisioning reported on Hiroshima = and Nagasaki atomic bomb victims after the Great Patriotic War(WWII), I = would like to see it... felis catus felis@frontiernet.net 5/14/99 ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BE9DF4.62D415C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
As an amateur radio = operator,(WA2YIX) have never=20 heard such allegations seriously discussed-or even considered- in = experimental=20 literature, like QST.  QST is free of the 'commercial pressures', = cited by=20 the Swiss paper- it is paid for by subscriptions from its members and = has been=20 since its founding.  Amateur Radio Operators having a=20 "Technician" or above class of license have had access to the=20 microwave bands since after WWI when modern telecommunications treaties/ = band=20 allocations to the commercial/nonprofit services were set up.  I = have never=20 heard such allegations discussed in the literature amongst license = holders here=20 who do experiment with microwaves reporting in QST- post the Swiss paper = here.  'Quod Et Demonstratum'-(L)-"Im From Missouri...as the = Americans=20 say..."-show me!  Does the paper rely upon statistical = inferences from=20 human behaviours- like a possible co relation between cancers and = microwave oven=20 use?  Is not human behaviour the ultimate 'soft', subjective field = of=20 inquiry as opposed to the "hard" sciences, like Physics and=20 Chemistry?  Using the mathematical engine of statistical inferences = taught=20 taught as acceptable scientific protocols in behavioural science, the=20 psychiatrist Karl Jung co-related various astrological = conjunctions/signs with=20 human behaviour!  The militant materialist/Yankee organization = PSICOPS=20 critically examined Professor Jungs mathematical/statistical=20 procedures/protocols used and could not find any fault in his = application of=20 scientific protocols.  This is not to say I am endorsing astrology = here,=20 but in the field of human behaviours you can co-relate anything with=20 anything.  If what the Swiss found is with the realms of 'hard' = emperical=20 observation-like the all too well known effects of radioactive = poisioning=20 reported on Hiroshima and Nagasaki atomic bomb victims after the Great = Patriotic=20 War(WWII), I would like to see it...
felis catus  felis@frontiernet.net =20 5/14/99
------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BE9DF4.62D415C0-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 07:44:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA17766; Fri, 14 May 1999 07:40:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 07:40:14 -0700 Message-ID: <373C50FF.E582F1AA@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 09:36:15 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: New toroid tests Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YcGbq.0.VL4.EN3Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10505 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: I have conducted two tests yesterday, which seem to help clarify the discrepancy between ATG and my observations. 1. A small millimeter ruler was placed beside the toroid assembly, and a pointer was fixed to the toroids. I noticed that in one polarity, the pointer moved downward about one millimeter. In the other polarity, the pointer (and assembly) moved downward a bit, but far less than the first polarity. So it would seem that there is a thrust that changes direction at least somewhat with polarity. 2. I shorted the leads to the toroids with a small length of wire, and discharged the capacitor. The same motion was seen as in the unshorted cases. This test is not definative though, I will try making a shorted lead assembly identical to the toroid leads, and tape it to another toroid assembly with its leads cut off. There will then be no current going to the toroids, and if the effect disappears, we know the reason why. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 08:47:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA05116; Fri, 14 May 1999 08:46:08 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 08:46:08 -0700 Message-ID: <373C1B64.1074@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 08:47:32 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Swiss Microwave study References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ZWL4r2.0.rF1.0L4Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10506 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Jorg D. Ostrowski wrote: > > Alik or others: Have you seen the Swiss study? I would like to obtain a > copy if anyone knows a reference. This is one reason we do not have a > microwave oven in our home. Jorg Ostrowski > I read about it in Nexus magazine, not the last one but one or two issues back. May be 3 issues back. The particular story was in a separate 'box' on the right side of the page. Several times articles have showed up in various place (even "popular mechanics" I think) claiming that eating microwaved food gives one the symptoms of anemia. Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 08:54:51 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA07913; Fri, 14 May 1999 08:54:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 08:54:05 -0700 Message-ID: <373C624C.5138DDED@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 10:50:04 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Toroid lead interactions... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"GHkMf1.0.Yx1.TS4Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10507 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all: I have tested the thrusting effect with disconnected leads taped to a toroid assembly. No current was ever sent through the toroids, only in and back through the leads via shunts. The thrusting effect remained. Unfortunately this is bad news for Rick Andersen's theory. The most logical explanation for the effect I am observing is that it is due to magnetic interactions in the leads. I hope I am wrong... Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 09:16:56 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA15436; Fri, 14 May 1999 09:15:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 09:15:14 -0700 Message-ID: <001201be9e25$0dbe33a0$e3edfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: Toroid lead interactions... Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 11:15:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"6YctM1.0.1n3.Im4Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10508 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Friday, May 14, 1999 10:59 AM Subject: Toroid lead interactions... >Hi all: > >I have tested the thrusting effect with disconnected leads taped to a >toroid assembly. No current was ever sent through the toroids, only in >and back through the leads via shunts. The thrusting effect remained. >Unfortunately this is bad news for Rick Andersen's theory. The most >logical explanation for the effect I am observing is that it is due to >magnetic interactions in the leads. I hope I am wrong... > >Kyle R. Mcallister > Very interesting results. We are still unable to see why you can not see a decided upward movement from center (your seeing a small downward thrust). As stated earlier the distance moved is somewhat reduced although very upward. Of course to remove the lead interactions we moved away from the floating coils to fixed coils, this is where the paper dot test started. You in the beginning stated you thought you saw the paper movement before you were using the full toroid setup similar to ours. Then I remember you stated you could not observe with the toroids ?. Have you repeated this experiment with fixed coils in both directions to see if in fact you can not duplicate this ? Very interesting indeed as we have confirmed it with 1/2 the power input of the original test. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 09:41:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA21903; Fri, 14 May 1999 09:37:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 09:37:39 -0700 Message-ID: <373C6C81.FB440D8@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 11:33:37 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid lead interactions... References: <001201be9e25$0dbe33a0$e3edfea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"U3u832.0.8M5.I55Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10509 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atglab wrote: > Very interesting results. We are still unable to see why you can not see a > decided upward movement from center (your seeing a small downward thrust). > As stated earlier the distance moved is somewhat reduced although very > upward. I think I may know why there is still a difference. In an email, you said you used 26AWG wire, as I am using, but I checked your web page, and notied that you used 24AWG wire...Maybe the thicker wire you use has an effect? It would certainly allow more current to flow. I will try winding new coils with 24AWG. > Of course to remove the lead interactions we moved away from the floating > coils to fixed coils, this is where the paper dot test started. You in the > beginning stated you thought you saw the paper movement before you were > using the full toroid setup similar to ours. Yes, but this was only the paper being bumped by the twitching motion of my wires. I never saw (but hope to!) the strange effects you reported. > Then I remember you stated you > could not observe with the toroids ?. Have you repeated this experiment with > fixed coils in both directions to see if in fact you can not duplicate this > ? No, not yet. I am planning to try this again. Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 10:05:59 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA29214; Fri, 14 May 1999 10:04:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 10:04:59 -0700 Message-ID: <000601be9e2b$ffb84000$e3edfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: Toroid lead interactions... Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 12:05:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"K4KMM3.0.N87.xU5Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10510 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Friday, May 14, 1999 11:41 AM Subject: Re: Toroid lead interactions... > >I think I may know why there is still a difference. In an email, you >said you used 26AWG wire, as I am using, but I checked your web page, >and notied that you used 24AWG wire...Maybe the thicker wire you use has >an effect? It would certainly allow more current to flow. I will try >winding new coils with 24AWG. > Sorry if there was a mis-statement here. For anyone interested the web site will contain the accurate and latest information. > >Kyle R. Mcallister > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 12:32:40 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA12066; Fri, 14 May 1999 12:31:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 12:31:59 -0700 Message-ID: <19990514191424.13876.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.167] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Tenguska Aim/ power outage Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 12:14:23 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"Lc_iE2.0.Ry2.le7Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10511 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On July 2nd 1994 I did some experimentation that may have led to some >unusual effects. I am somewhat convinced that I caused a power outage, Did you repeat the experiment with similar results???? _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 13:21:45 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA25275; Fri, 14 May 1999 13:20:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 13:20:13 -0700 Message-ID: <373C6711.FC679191@telusplanet.net> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 13:10:25 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: lake on mars? References: <19990514070401.30225.qmail@hotmail.com> <373C6494.E7A32655@telusplanet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"l3VUj2.0.mA6.yL8Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10512 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > http://www.offshore-vista.com/identity/index.html > http://www.cbjd.net/orbit/mars/steadlake.html -- *********************************************************** Dance like no one's watching, love like you'll never be hurt, sing like no one's listening, live like it's heaven on earth. -- William Pukey ... You cannot find yourself, only create yourself. -- Anne Sekel ... My candle burns at both ends, It will not last the night, But, ah, my foes, and oh, my friends - it gives a lovely light. -- Edna St. Vincent Millay ... Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- Einstein ... We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are. -- Talmudic Saying ... Yesterday is a canceled check; tomorrow is a promissory note; today is the only cash you have. Spend it wisely. ... What if there were no hypothetical situations? -- Andrew Kohlsmith ... How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives. -- Annie Dillard ... ====================================================================== Don J.S. Adams, Overseer and Registered Agent for Domhnall C G N Adams - (Corporation Sole - Lawful Entity Name) RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 13:29:46 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA26876; Fri, 14 May 1999 13:24:27 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 13:24:27 -0700 Message-ID: <000901be9e47$df6bc080$e3edfea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Toroid Discovery! Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 15:25:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"iQ6MO.0.kZ6.xP8Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10513 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: In an effort to reduce contact arcing and pitting we tried two different solid state switch methods, 1) Using and SCR, 2) Using Fast NPN switching transistor. Much to our surprise we can get nothing (thrust in any direction), additionally paper dot test does not work. We switched back to the relay contactor method and it all works again. The SCR is just plain to slow. The NPN switching transistor appears not to be able to get the current density fast enough to produce the effect. Yet after this testing we wonder if ringing or some interaction of the arcing is involved. We are in the process of adding ring suppression to the relay contact and see if we still have the effect. Appears though that the rate of current buildup is the key to seeing the end result. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 13:53:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA08349; Fri, 14 May 1999 13:49:42 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 13:49:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990514163432.010fb280@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 16:34:32 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: More VACE thoughts In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.16.19990513212700.22572aa0@earthlink.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19990513142748.009049a0@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990513062522.23bfa522@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990512003025.01086100@inforamp.net> <3.0.6.16.19990511182351.226f007e@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990510231749.009c0a90@inforamp.net> <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"WnfQC2.0.I22.Zn8Ft"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10514 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: To Dave and all, At 09:27 PM 05/13/99, Dave wrote: > >Maybe Ampere himself would define any force between current elements as >magnetic, so he would add this to the definition of "magnetic"? :-) >Does anyone know when the Biot-Savort law was written? > I sent one of the VACE papers to a friend of mine [he is an expert on electrodynamics,] and he said that Phipps has very cleverly repudiated Biot-Savart in favor of Ampere's original force law. I am unqualified to discuss it at that level, but I'd sure like to get a handle on it from a visual-model perspective. >Please refresh me, what is "action at a distance", as opposed to a "field"? Years ago my impressions were-- when I was reading some of the history of electrodynamics-- that "action at a distance" was an unexplained and possibly instantaneous force-connection between two points, or objects. In the early part of the 19th century, it was considered "mysticism" or "spooky" by some of the main-line researchers, though. Sorry, but that's all that I can recall... Did you get any impressions? Does anyone even use that term today? Colin From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 16:12:45 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA25997; Fri, 14 May 1999 16:12:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 16:12:01 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 16:09:44 -0700 Subject: Re: Toroid Discovery! Message-ID: <19990514.161356.-195243.3.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,6-9,12-22,25-26,28-29,32-33,36-39,42,44-47,49-56,58-59,61-63,68-69,71-79,81-88 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Ib1h_1.0.6M6.0tAFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10515 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 14 May 1999 15:25:12 -0500 "atglab" writes: >In an effort to reduce contact arcing and pitting we tried two >different solid state switch methods, 1) Using and SCR, 2) Using >Fast NPN switching transistor. Much to our surprise we can get >nothing (thrust in any direction), additionally paper dot test does >not work. snip >The SCR is just plain to slow. The NPN switching transistor >appears not to be able to get the current density fast enough to >produce the effect. snip >Appears though that the rate of current buildup is the key to seeing >the end result. Hi Folks, Got some thoughts here............ I think going to a higher voltage and lower capacitance ( to whatever is appropriate to get the same amount of energy) will give you faster switching times with the SCR or transistor. If you want to check out even faster transfer of the energy, try going to ionized gas switches. I used to work in an explosive detonator factory. (I was doing fine until they discovered I was a pyromaniac. I think they discovered the maniac part first.) Anyway, the explosives are secondary explosives, meaning they need a severe shock to set them off. That shock is provided by the detonators which are also made with secondary explosives. The shock that starts the detonator comes from a little piece of gold wire. Bear in mind that the wires coming from the detonator are something like 20 to 18 ga. Inside the detonator, they are cut off nice and square on the ends and then a piece of gold wire about 1 1/1000 inch dia. is soldered across the ends, creating a dead short. The length of the wire is a little more than 1/16 inch. In the case of the Forestry Department and building demolition, the distance from the firing set to the detonator is hundreds of feet, so the gauge of the wire used is bigger than the detonator wire to keep loses to a minimum. The idea is to dump enough energy fast enough to cause that little gold wire to not have enough time to melt and act as a fuse. We want it to EXPLODE. The firing set really (safety aspects aside) is just a battery operated high voltage supply (~2800 volts) that charges a capacitor, and a switching section to dump the charge on down the line to the little gold wire. The gizmo they use is just a fancy version of a flash tube (like the old thyratron tubes used in really old days before SCRs came around). They were about the size of a walnut or so and had three terminals. Two terminals were at opposite ends and the operating voltage was applied to these. The gas inside was at a certain pressure to insure that the cell does not conduct until ionized. The third terminal was where you apply a short high voltage pulse to merely ionize the gas enough to start conduction. The "trigger" as we called them, was a little bigger for the firing unit that was used for missile warhead detonators and contained Tritium. The firing units for these bigger units charged the capacitor to about 4600 volts or so. Sooooo, I would think that if this kind of switching system can deliver energy fast enough to blow up wire rather than melt it, it ought to be fast enough to help with the toroid experiments. Also, I believe it conducts in both directions until the energy drops below the conduction level, which means that if you find you need the ringing you can still have it. Best of luck.................. David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 17:48:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA14631; Fri, 14 May 1999 17:47:45 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 17:47:45 -0700 Message-ID: <373C9A57.78AC@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 17:49:11 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid Discovery! References: <000901be9e47$df6bc080$e3edfea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4BQrT2.0.Wa3.nGCFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10516 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atglab wrote: > > In an effort to reduce contact arcing and pitting we tried two different > solid state switch methods, 1) Using and SCR, 2) Using Fast NPN switching > transistor. Much to our surprise we can get nothing (thrust in any > direction), additionally paper dot test does not work. > > We switched back to the relay contactor method and it all works again. The > SCR is just plain to slow. The NPN switching transistor appears not to be > able to get the current density fast enough to produce the effect. Yet after > this testing we wonder if ringing or some interaction of the arcing is > involved. We are in the process of adding ring suppression to the relay > contact and see if we still have the effect. > > Appears though that the rate of current buildup is the key to seeing the end > result. It is likely that SCRs and transistors have pretty high resistance. If you want to avoid arcing you may want to try vacuum relays (used for high power RF switching), also whole bunch of paralleled mosfets with fast driver may be better than NPNs/SCRs. Do you have a digital oscilloscope by any chance ? Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 18:15:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA21604; Fri, 14 May 1999 18:14:50 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 18:14:50 -0700 Message-ID: <373CA0AE.15F0@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 18:16:14 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid Discovery! References: <19990514.161356.-195243.3.broompilot@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"lq2dF3.0.TH5.9gCFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10517 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > > They were about the size of a walnut or so and had three terminals. > Two terminals were at opposite ends and the operating voltage was applied > to these. The gas inside was at a certain pressure to insure that the > cell does not conduct until ionized. The third terminal was where you > apply a short high voltage pulse to merely ionize the gas enough to start > conduction. > > The "trigger" as we called them, was a little bigger for the firing unit > that was used for missile warhead detonators and contained Tritium. > The firing units for these bigger units charged the capacitor to about > 4600 volts or so. > > Sooooo, I would think that if this kind of switching system can > deliver energy fast enough to blow up wire rather than melt it, > it ought to be fast enough to help with the toroid experiments. > > Also, I believe it conducts in both directions until the energy drops > below the conduction level, which means that if you find you need the > ringing you can still have it. > > Best of luck.................. > > David > > > E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com > > This sounds much like a Cryton tube (EGG makes them)used to trigger N-bmb detonators. They are a bit expensive and actually have finite life in terms of pulses. You can obtain complete surplus 'pulser modules' that fit NIM racks and have a built-in capacitor. A cheaper alternative is a triggered spark-gap tube (also EGG). Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 18:50:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA28295; Fri, 14 May 1999 18:50:10 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 18:50:10 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 18:53:16 -0700 Subject: Re: Toroid Discovery! Message-ID: <19990514.185316.-72897.0.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-4,7-11,14-16,19-27 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wdAmJ3.0.yv6.IBDFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10518 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 14 May 1999 18:16:14 -0400 Alik Shereshevsky writes: >This sounds much like a Cryton tube (EGG makes them)used to >trigger N-bmb detonators. They are a bit expensive and actually >have finite life in terms of pulses. You can obtain complete >surplus 'pulser modules' that fit NIM racks and have a built-in >capacitor. A cheaper alternative is a triggered spark-gap >tube (also EGG). Good thing you brought up that term. Triggered spark gaps is all that these little puppies were. It's just that the one used in our military version had a ceramic housing and Tritium rather than a glass housing and a non-radioactive gas inside. I think Radio Shack still sells a low power flash tube as well as the appropriate trigger coil. For less than $10.00 one could start checking out discharge speeds while looking for sources of triggered spark gaps to handle the actual power used in the experiments. I think I'll hoof on over to Radio Shack............ David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 20:51:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA20463; Fri, 14 May 1999 20:50:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 20:50:28 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Tenguska Aim/plant coil Message-Id: <926737577.1600.630@excite.com> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 20:06:17 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.48 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"awYQo1.0.e_4.3yEFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10519 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 14 May 1999 12:14:23 PDT, flytch er wrote: > On July 2nd 1994 I did some experimentation that may have led to some > >unusual effects. I am somewhat convinced that I caused a power outage, > > > Did you repeat the experiment with similar results???? No, the whole incident just caused a unwanted suspicion that I was responsible. Those kind of experiments need to be made in the country,not the city with prying eyes of neighbors. This outdoor 10 ft diameter coil was eventually disguised or served to function as a morning glory trellis of tremendous proportions. This coil consisted of about 48 turns of 14 gauge wire at 1/2 inch separation between winds. Coincidentally in the constuction of this coil it came to be practical for it to be made with 64 corners or posts. A 25 ft tree was several feet away from the coil. The top two thirds of the tree was dead. The morning glories climbed the length of the tree and broke off the top third of the tree by the weight of the vines! It was like Jack and the Beanstalk; the bases and roots grew very large also. I also grew cucumbers that would surprize me all the time because they were easily concealed in the thick foilage surrounding the coil. IT seemed that this coil accentuated plant life; I have read before that even a single loop of conductor can do this by recieving vibrations from the environment; if this is the case 48 loops produced magnificent results. Or maybe it has something to do with I ching and the 64 sides. Inside the coil most of the light was eventually blocked and some strange species of parasitic plant life appeared in this forest environment. The weeds that tried to grow were brought done by a vinelike pale single stranded small diameter stemlike growth that appeared to strangle its victim. Never seen that plant before. This was in 1995 and after that season the coil was demolished in spring of 1996. HDN _______________________________________________________________ > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 20:52:22 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA21095; Fri, 14 May 1999 20:51:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 20:51:56 -0700 From: Bmd2323@aol.com Message-ID: <9b64b3fc.246e492a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 23:51:06 EDT Subject: lightsaber To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"F9jvp3.0.W95.SzEFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10520 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: hi all, A while back someone posted that they thought that it would be possible to build something like a lightsaber. I can't seem to find any more postings dealing with the subject, so either I accidentally deleted them, or no one's said much more about it. I've got $500 for whomever can produce one that works more or less like the ones in the films (i.e., capable of cutting through old guys, metal, etc. has a visible beam, and can operate for at least 15 minutes. Groovy sound effects as you slash it through the air are not necessary, but would be a nice touch.) I can also promise you future orders if you can deliver. Brian Drake (Bmd2323@aol.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 20:58:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA24688; Fri, 14 May 1999 20:57:51 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 20:57:51 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid lead interactions... Message-Id: <926740670.4660.603@excite.com> Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 20:57:50 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.48 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"2THjv.0.f16.-2FFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10521 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Can someone repost the toroid experiment website,seemed to have deleted by mistake. HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 21:14:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA30195; Fri, 14 May 1999 21:14:18 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 21:14:18 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 19:53:28 -0700 Subject: A Toroid Affair Message-ID: <19990514.195523.-166591.1.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-13,16-24 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"TKbVH3.0.eN7.PIFFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10522 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Folks, Me again I hoofed over to the local Radio Shack and discovered they have a Xenon strobe tube for $3.29. It is rated at: 200v min. 400v max. operating voltage. 4 (count'em all) watt seconds max. 4000v min. trigger voltage 60 flashes per second max. Somewhere in the dungeon I think I have two photoflash tubes and two trigger coils I bought 20 years ago or so for one of those projects that I'll get around to one of these days......................... Later........... David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 21:20:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA00261; Fri, 14 May 1999 21:20:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 21:20:02 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990514195733.26379228@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 19:57:33 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Tenguska Aim/plant coil In-Reply-To: <926737577.1600.630@excite.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"aJC0I.0.z3.nNFFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10523 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 08:06 PM 5/14/99 PDT, Harvey wrote: > No, the whole incident just caused a unwanted suspicion that I was >responsible. Those kind of experiments need to be made in the country,not >the city >with prying eyes of neighbors. This outdoor 10 ft diameter coil was >eventually disguised or served to function as a morning glory trellis of >tremendous >proportions. This coil consisted of about 48 turns >of 14 gauge wire at 1/2 inch separation between winds. Coincidentally in the >constuction of this coil it came to be practical for it to be made with 64 >corners or posts. A 25 ft tree was several feet away from the coil. The top >two thirds of the tree was dead. The morning glories climbed the length of >the tree and broke off the top third of the tree by the weight of the vines! >It was like Jack and the Beanstalk; the bases and roots grew very large >also. I also grew cucumbers that would surprize me all the time because they >were easily concealed in the thick foilage surrounding the coil. IT seemed >that this coil >accentuated plant life. Very interesting description! Are all the plants gone too? This coil was one of the 2 primaries? What was the diameter of each secondary? From a previous post: > In this experiment 2 tesla coils were constructed >with secondaries of approximately equal inductances >but different geometries. These both used 1500 ft of 18 gauge wire. Both of >these coils had a 6/1 diameter ratio and also a 6/1 difference in wire >spacing. One coil was 20 in diameter, the other 10 feet. The coils were >separated about two feet. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 22:18:45 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA12898; Fri, 14 May 1999 22:18:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 22:18:24 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Toroid Discovery! Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 01:22:19 -0400 Message-ID: <19990515052219031.AAC130@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"-4vwB3.0.N93.VEGFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10524 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Alik wrote: >This sounds much like a Cryton tube (EGG makes them)used to trigger >N-bmb detonators. They are a bit expensive and actually have finite life >in terms of pulses. You can obtain complete >surplus 'pulser modules' that fit NIM racks and have a built-in >capacitor. A cheaper alternative is a triggered spark-gap >tube (also EGG). > >Alik S. Hi again Alik, I believe this is called a Crytron tube, it was used for H bombs, and the company is EG&G. Doc Edgerton, the E of EG&G, invented the stroboscope, which you might want to tear apart and have a look at that power supply, if you have a cheap strobe handy. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 22:18:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA12946; Fri, 14 May 1999 22:18:27 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 22:18:27 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Toroid Discovery! Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 01:22:16 -0400 Message-ID: <19990515052216562.AAA130@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"E0qtZ.0.5A3.YEGFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10525 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Alik wrote: >It is likely that SCRs and transistors have pretty high resistance. If >you want to avoid arcing you may want to try vacuum relays (used for >high power RF switching), also whole bunch of paralleled mosfets with >fast driver may be better >than NPNs/SCRs. > >Do you have a digital oscilloscope by any chance ? > > >Alik S. Hey There, When I was doing my experimentation with a DC motor driven version of my cavitation device, I wanted a speed controller, and tried an SCR first. It was very noisy, electrically, and I burned out several due to the high resistance heat build up, before I switched to a MOSFET controller. The MOSFET is much more efficient, and produced a nice smooth V and I. The motor ran like a dream after that. If you don't get the effect with a MOSFET, then I would suspect that the arc is necessary for reasons that are difficult to explain. I'm working on a possible explaination now. Gary Hawkins of Horizon Technology did some experiments that are related (they had thrust features), which I don't have time to convey, but hopefully will have a possible explaination soon. Try it with the arc, and with a MOSFET if you can afford one or can borrow one, and see what happens. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 22:22:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA14870; Fri, 14 May 1999 22:22:21 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 22:22:21 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 01:21:19 EDT Subject: Re: Toroid Discovery! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"-1YUt1.0.Fe3.CIGFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10526 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/14/99 6:50:23 PM Pacific Daylight Time, broompilot@juno.com writes: << Good thing you brought up that term. Triggered spark gaps is all that these little puppies were. It's just that the one used in our military version had a ceramic housing and Tritium rather than a glass housing and a non-radioactive gas inside. I think Radio Shack still sells a low power flash tube as well as the appropriate trigger coil. For less than $10.00 one could start checking out discharge speeds while looking for sources of triggered spark gaps to handle the actual power used in the experiments. I think I'll hoof on over to Radio Shack............ David >> I've worked with the these devices but some years ago our group discovered that for most experiments if your current is high enough to sustain an arc you can just manually close the circuit with two conductors --- with due respect for any HV present. With lower voltages and currents at some point it will not work well, but it is worth considering because its low cost and simplicity. Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 22:24:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA16564; Fri, 14 May 1999 22:24:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 22:24:23 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: lightsaber Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 01:28:18 -0400 Message-ID: <19990515052818812.AAA216@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"FbyWM.0.j24.7KGFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10527 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >hi all, > >A while back someone posted that they thought that it would be possible to >build something like a lightsaber. I can't seem to find any more postings >dealing with the subject, so either I accidentally deleted them, or no one's >said much more about it. I've got $500 for whomever can produce one that >works more or less like the ones in the films (i.e., capable of cutting >through old guys, metal, etc. has a visible beam, and can operate for at >least 15 minutes. Groovy sound effects as you slash it through the air are >not necessary, but would be a nice touch.) I can also promise you future >orders if you can deliver. > >Brian Drake >(Bmd2323@aol.com) Hey! Watch it with the old guy stuff, would'ja? We're not all THAT bad! Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 22:37:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA21291; Fri, 14 May 1999 22:37:06 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 22:37:06 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Toroid Discovery! Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 01:40:58 -0400 Message-ID: <19990515054058265.AAA160@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"z6nbc1.0.SC5.1WGFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10528 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Ken wrote: > David >> >I've worked with the these devices but some years ago our group discovered >that for most experiments if your current is high enough to sustain an arc >you can just manually close the circuit with two conductors --- with due >respect for any HV present. With lower voltages and currents at some point >it will not work well, but it is worth considering because its low cost and >simplicity. > Ken >Keasy@aol.com Hi Ken, This is a good suggestion, and I might add that you should try a couple of separate single knife switches, one on the positive side, and one on the negative, and a double knife switch, which would close the circuit simultaneously on both the + and the - lead. You should also consider that the thrust may not be happening in the same place every time due to your configuration changes. You should treat the entire configuration, power supply, coils, and switches as possible places where the thrust may occur. I know that you are trying to prove a particular theory, but the fact is, this may be a mass transfer phenomenon, or a capacitance phenomenon instead of a coil thing. Try holding your paper over various parts of your configuration other than just the coil. You might be surprised. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 14 22:58:14 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA26480; Fri, 14 May 1999 22:57:49 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 22:57:49 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 02:01:40 -0400 Message-ID: <19990515060140203.AAA203@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"4l_CP2.0.fT6.SpGFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10529 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: WJ Schreef: >At the http://www.zeropollution.com/zeropollution/index.html they say that a >compressor in the car, the airtanks fills in 4,5 hours. How many watthours is >the compressor using? > >Regards, >WJ > >Michael T Huffman schreef: Yo, I want to make it perfectly clear to everyone that have never schreefed, not even in my wildest dreams. To answer your question, WJ, you would need to know the exact make and model of the compressor, the motor that is driving it, and have the motor manufacturer send you a copy of the efficiency audit that they do to determine the horsepower and wattage used under varying loads. Or you could buy one, and measure the input with a good power analyzer. Nothing else will do, really. This would not be a cheap test to perform. I've done them. You can't just guess or crunch numbers, and expect to be anywhere near the ballpark on something like that. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 15 01:46:15 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA02146; Sat, 15 May 1999 01:45:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 01:45:44 -0700 Message-ID: <19990515084549.18250.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.71] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: schreefed????? Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 01:45:49 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"AmiGi2.0.RX.tGJFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10530 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >WJ Schreef: > >At the http://www.zeropollution.com/zeropollution/index.html they say >that a > >compressor in the car, the airtanks fills in 4,5 hours. How many >watthours is > >the compressor using? > >Yo, > > I want to make it perfectly clear to everyone that have never >schreefed, not even in my wildest dreams. To answer your question, WJ, you >would need to know the exact make and model of the compressor, the motor >that is driving it, and have the motor manufacturer send you a copy of the >efficiency audit that they do to determine the horsepower and wattage used >under varying loads. Or you could buy one, and measure the input with a >good power analyzer. Nothing else will do, really. This would not be a >cheap test to perform. I've done them. You can't just guess or crunch >numbers, and expect to be anywhere near the ballpark on something like >that. > >Knuke Not really true... when you are buying a commercial compressor and comparing the stats... they are all competing on a narrow efficiency edge.... yes, your hardware variety is anyone's guess, BUT, not the real ones.... I am currently looking for some charts, but don't like to lie to salesmen....so does anyone have any leads??? ttfn, Timothy... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 15 15:40:08 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA08595; Sat, 15 May 1999 15:38:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 15:38:54 -0700 Message-ID: <373DD921.E89CC174@telusplanet.net> Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 15:29:21 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: lightsaber References: <9b64b3fc.246e492a@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"N0hXG3.0.C62.-TVFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10531 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Brian, I imagine the hardest part to this is coming up with the power supply... I'm betting the tech to produce the out put results already pretty much exists... But I'd bet there wont be any kind of conventional tech in the public domain that would allow for a small enough, powerful enough power supply.... short of maybe some kind of cold fusion gizmo in miniature... Bmd2323@aol.com wrote: > > hi all, > > A while back someone posted that they thought that it would be possible to > build something like a lightsaber. I can't seem to find any more postings > dealing with the subject, so either I accidentally deleted them, or no one's > said much more about it. I've got $500 for whomever can produce one that > works more or less like the ones in the films (i.e., capable of cutting > through old guys, metal, etc. has a visible beam, and can operate for at > least 15 minutes. Groovy sound effects as you slash it through the air are > not necessary, but would be a nice touch.) I can also promise you future > orders if you can deliver. > > Brian Drake > (Bmd2323@aol.com) -- *********************************************************** Dance like no one's watching, love like you'll never be hurt, sing like no one's listening, live like it's heaven on earth. -- William Pukey ... You cannot find yourself, only create yourself. -- Anne Sekel ... My candle burns at both ends, It will not last the night, But, ah, my foes, and oh, my friends - it gives a lovely light. -- Edna St. Vincent Millay ... Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- Einstein ... We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are. -- Talmudic Saying ... Yesterday is a canceled check; tomorrow is a promissory note; today is the only cash you have. Spend it wisely. ... What if there were no hypothetical situations? -- Andrew Kohlsmith ... How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives. -- Annie Dillard ... ====================================================================== Don J.S. Adams, Overseer and Registered Agent for Domhnall C G N Adams - (Corporation Sole - Lawful Entity Name) RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 15 16:13:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA18854; Sat, 15 May 1999 16:11:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 16:11:15 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: schreefed????? Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 19:15:11 -0400 Message-ID: <19990515231511515.AAA65@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"R2gJZ.0.Qc4.JyVFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10532 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Not really true... when you are buying a commercial compressor and comparing >the stats... they are all competing on a narrow efficiency edge.... yes, >your hardware variety is anyone's guess, BUT, not the real ones.... I am >currently looking for some charts, but don't like to lie to salesmen....so >does anyone have any leads??? > > > ttfn, > Timothy... Hi Tim, I'm afraid that I have to continue to disagree. Not only will a motor experience a wide range of loads while running a compressor due to the fact that it will be much easier to run when the tank is empty than it will be when the tank is nearing the full mark, there a whole host of other parameters to be considered when pumping air that make it impossible to anticipate what your actual watt-hours will be. Humidity, the condition of the filtration on the air inlet on the compressor, the way the system is plumbed, the material of the plumbing (Reynolds Number), the diameter of the plumbing, etc., all add to complexity of the system. Salesmen are professional liars, and will almost always tell you what they think you want to hear just to sell their machine. You have to get a power analyser or at least a watt hour meter, and run the system, in place, to find out the cost. The Negre motor people should have done this by now. Why don't you just ask them, and tell us what they say? Knuke PS What's "ttfn"? Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 15 18:04:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA05249; Sat, 15 May 1999 18:04:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 18:04:13 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990515205556.00a78c10@inforamp.net> X-Sender: quinney@inforamp.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 20:55:56 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Quinney Subject: Re: lightsaber In-Reply-To: <373DD921.E89CC174@telusplanet.net> References: <9b64b3fc.246e492a@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"X5MYC2.0.wH1.CcXFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10533 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi all, Ok. Just for fun: A pulse circuit firing a high voltage capacitor discharge through two ultraviolet lasers. The conductive ionized paths cross each other @ 1 meter out. To conserve energy, the pulse is timed to briefly fire only to the camera's open shutter. Shaping the visible ionization field to be more 'sword-like' in shape, can be achieved with multiple sequential paths.. (a type of scanning) again-- with synchronization to the camera. It probably wouldn't hurt to emit a jet of argon gas from the "handles" either. Colin At 03:29 PM 05/15/99 -0500, you wrote: >Brian, > >I imagine the hardest part to this is coming up with the power supply... >I'm betting the tech to produce the out put results already pretty much >exists... But I'd bet there wont be any kind of conventional tech in >the public domain that would allow for a small enough, powerful enough >power supply.... short of maybe some kind of cold fusion gizmo in >miniature... > >Bmd2323@aol.com wrote: >> >> hi all, >> >> A while back someone posted that they thought that it would be possible to >> build something like a lightsaber. I can't seem to find any more postings >> dealing with the subject, so either I accidentally deleted them, or no one's >> said much more about it. I've got $500 for whomever can produce one that >> works more or less like the ones in the films (i.e., capable of cutting >> through old guys, metal, etc. has a visible beam, and can operate for at >> least 15 minutes. Groovy sound effects as you slash it through the air are >> not necessary, but would be a nice touch.) I can also promise you future >> orders if you can deliver. >> >> Brian Drake >> (Bmd2323@aol.com) > >-- >*********************************************************** > >Dance like no one's watching, love like you'll never be >hurt, sing like no one's listening, live like it's heaven on earth. -- >William Pukey >... > >You cannot find yourself, only create yourself. -- >Anne Sekel >... > >My candle burns at both ends, It will not >last the night, But, ah, my foes, and oh, my friends - it >gives a lovely light. -- Edna St. Vincent Millay >... > >Not everything that can be counted >counts, and not everything that counts can be >counted. -- Einstein >... > >We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are. -- Talmudic >Saying >... > >Yesterday is a canceled check; tomorrow is a promissory note; today is >the only cash you have. Spend it wisely. >... > >What if there were no hypothetical situations? -- Andrew Kohlsmith >... > >How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives. -- Annie >Dillard >... > >====================================================================== >Don J.S. Adams, Overseer and Registered Agent for >Domhnall C G N Adams - (Corporation Sole - Lawful Entity Name) > >RAVE Communications > >206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA >780-998-4066 Canada > >http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave > >alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com > > > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 12:14:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA15976; Sun, 16 May 1999 12:13:35 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 12:13:35 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 12:17:04 -0700 Subject: Home made trigger coils Message-ID: <19990516.121934.-186455.2.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-10,14-20 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"d4n_23.0.Sv3.UZnFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10534 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi folks, I found a usefull page concerning flashtubes and trigger coils: http://www.misty.com/people/don/donflash.html He's got all sorts of info on the various aspects of flashing a tube. He has a section on building your own trigger coils, which I think would also be good for a triggered spark gap. It ought to be easy to build a triggered gap out of three nails attached to a piece of wood. Or one nail into each end of a piece of glass or plastic tubing with the trigger nail in a small hole in the tubing right at the gap but not pushed in far enough to be in the path of the gap. David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 15:49:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA11343; Sun, 16 May 1999 15:47:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 15:47:59 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 14:12:35 -0700 Subject: Microwave oven stuff Message-ID: <19990516.155222.-103853.0.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,3-5,7-11,15-22,24-25,27-28,30-32,35-38,40-45 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Y7-N2.0.8n2.ViqFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10535 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi Folks, I have had several occasions to dig into microwave ovens to attempt to repair and then proceed with salvaging parts. The magnets on the magnetron tube are typically ~2 1/4 in. O.D. x 13/16 in. I.D. X 1/2 in. thick. They are pretty powerful, you don't want your fingers in the way when you introduce the magnets to each other. For a 700 watt oven, the transformer knocks out around ~2200 volts with no load and ~ 1250 volts during operation ( ~1+ amp ). A 700 watt oven is around 50% efficient. It draws around 1350 watts. In terms of going portable, that is about 115 amps. from a 12 volt battery without considering inverter efficiency. We're not going to be cooking deer on the hoof this way. TRIVIA: I used to help build 30 kw. and 60 kw. microwave generators for commercial microwave ovens. These ovens were 30 feet long and about 16 to 20 feet tall. I was talking to our engineer one day and he mentioned that they will heat up just about any substance that had dipolar molecules. In the food industry, water is the most common dipolar substance and fats/oils are the second most common. The cooking can be controlled to some extent by how the fats/oils are distributed in the food. If you want the outside crispy and the inside not so, then the outside is coated with a light coating of oil (pretty much the same as with contact or convection air cooking) Also.....The microwaves have a tendency to kill bacteria. Before a certain candy bar hit the market, our test oven was used to see how well it would melt the chocolate off of broken bars that got jammed in the machine and in some cases, fallen to the floor. I questioned our engineer about bacteria and he said "no problem". Our company built a monster microwave generator on a truck trailer to be towed around planting fields to penetrate the soil with microwaves in order to sterilize it. Apparently, it worked to a depth of about 18 inches. This may be how some bags of sterile potting soil may be sterilized. Be Well, David ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 17:59:15 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA05820; Sun, 16 May 1999 17:58:43 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 17:58:43 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Home made trigger coils Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 21:02:40 -0400 Message-ID: <19990517010240687.AAA195@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"hpf133.0.rQ1.3dsFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10536 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Hi folks, > >I found a usefull page concerning flashtubes and trigger coils: > >http://www.misty.com/people/don/donflash.html Hey There! I just checked out the other site at: http://www.repairfaq.org/ What GOLDMINES! Thanks for the URL. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 20:11:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA16392; Sun, 16 May 1999 20:11:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 20:11:05 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 03:10:26 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <374586c1.86633336@mail-hub> References: <19990516.155222.-103853.0.broompilot@juno.com> In-Reply-To: <19990516.155222.-103853.0.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id UAA16348 Resent-Message-ID: <"zelon1.0.104.9ZuFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10537 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 16 May 1999 14:12:35 -0700, broompilot@juno.com wrote: [snip] >Our company built a monster microwave generator on a truck trailer >to be towed around planting fields to penetrate the soil with microwaves >in order to sterilize it. Apparently, it worked to a depth >of about 18 inches. [snip] I've often wondered if this could be used in africa to destroy locust egg pods in the ground. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 22:31:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA24927; Sun, 16 May 1999 22:31:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 22:31:23 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 22:37:06 -0700 Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Message-ID: <19990516.223707.-186125.0.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,3-10,12-25 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"R_3xS3.0.K56.hcwFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10538 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 03:10:26 GMT rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) writes: >On Sun, 16 May 1999 14:12:35 -0700, broompilot@juno.com wrote: [snip] >I've often wondered if this could be used in africa to destroy locust >egg pods in the ground. Now there is something to think about. I am thinking that the bacteria may have succumbed more do to resonance of some sort than due to heating. How much water or other bipolar material do bacteria have? Commercial microwave ovens operate at 950 Mhz. and the standard home version runs at 2450 Mhz. Some ovens are called "commercial" because they are suitable for restaurant use (bigger cavities, rustless steel, a bit more power,etc. than the home models) but they still operate at 2450 Mhz. It may be that the locust egg pod destruction potential hangs on their dipole content. I wonder...... David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 23:19:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA01377; Sun, 16 May 1999 23:19:06 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 23:19:06 -0700 Message-ID: <19990517061835.10160.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.99] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 23:18:35 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"ulyM_2.0.QL.PJxFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10540 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: >On Sun, 16 May 1999 14:12:35 -0700, broompilot@juno.com wrote: >[snip] > >Our company built a monster microwave generator on a truck trailer > >to be towed around planting fields to penetrate the soil with microwaves > >in order to sterilize it. Apparently, it worked to a depth > >of about 18 inches. >[snip] >I've often wondered if this could be used in africa to destroy locust >egg pods in the ground. Yes, However.... how many acres a day can you cover???? and at what cost/acre???? _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 23:19:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA01346; Sun, 16 May 1999 23:19:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 23:19:03 -0700 From: MATTIARO@aol.com Message-ID: <3a166bd4.24710e8d@aol.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 02:17:49 EDT Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"vU_fQ2.0.xK.MJxFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10539 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi. A quicky test would be to place a raw chicken egg into the microwave oven and see that operation. The idea just came to me, and I haven't had a chance to talk to my wife about it yet. I wonder if she would be willing to clean the oven. :-) Most probably the shell would crack and the egg just oozing out of the shell. But in other hand, if the pressure builds up too fast .... hmmm .... "kaboom"??? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 23:33:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA05514; Sun, 16 May 1999 23:32:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 23:32:46 -0700 Message-ID: <005601bea02f$1007b440$5b1a0fcb@default> From: "Glenville T. Sawyer" To: Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 16:02:37 +0930 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"3zURs1.0.3M1.DWxFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10541 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Oh no - the "egg in the microwave trick" - Messy my boy, VERY VERY messy ! Glenville. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 23:40:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA07800; Sun, 16 May 1999 23:39:09 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 23:39:09 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 06:38:34 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <3749b81d.99273746@mail-hub> References: <19990517061835.10160.qmail@hotmail.com> In-Reply-To: <19990517061835.10160.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id XAA07775 Resent-Message-ID: <"c7i-y.0.iv1.DcxFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10542 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 16 May 1999 23:18:35 PDT, flytch er wrote: >>On Sun, 16 May 1999 14:12:35 -0700, broompilot@juno.com wrote: >>[snip] >> >Our company built a monster microwave generator on a truck trailer >> >to be towed around planting fields to penetrate the soil with microwaves >> >in order to sterilize it. Apparently, it worked to a depth >> >of about 18 inches. >>[snip] >>I've often wondered if this could be used in africa to destroy locust >>egg pods in the ground. > >Yes, However.... how many acres a day can you cover???? and at what >cost/acre???? Well if it's used to sterilise fields, the cost can't be too high (initial purchase cost, then the cost of fuel for the truck, which wouldn't be much more than the normal cost of fuel for a truck). And I seem to remember that locusts tend to lay their eggs in patches, which if discovered could probably be treated fairly easily this way. It would also be a non-toxic method (no insecticides), and the savings on crops would probably pay the costs 100 times over. Nevertheless I suppose only field trials would really tell how effective it would be. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 16 23:55:30 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA13165; Sun, 16 May 1999 23:55:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 23:55:07 -0700 Message-ID: <19990517065436.45324.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.99] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 23:54:35 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"0sdtg3.0.cD3.BrxFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10543 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > >>[snip] > >>I've often wondered if this could be used in africa to destroy locust > >>egg pods in the ground. > > > >Yes, However.... how many acres a day can you cover???? and at what > >cost/acre???? >Well if it's used to sterilise fields, the cost can't be too high >(initial purchase cost, then the cost of fuel for the truck, which >wouldn't be much more than the normal cost of fuel for a truck). >And I seem to remember that locusts tend to lay their eggs in patches, >which if discovered could probably be treated fairly easily this way. >It would also be a non-toxic method (no insecticides), and the savings >on crops would probably pay the costs 100 times over. Nevertheless I >suppose only field trials would really tell how effective it would be. > >Regards, > >Robin van Spaandonk > True.... this dose sound really good Robin........ _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 00:11:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA20837; Mon, 17 May 1999 00:08:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:08:44 -0700 Message-ID: <19990517070957.23850.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.99] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:09:56 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"AYAau2.0.Q55.y1yFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10544 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >which if discovered could probably be treated fairly easily this way. >It would also be a non-toxic method (no insecticides), and the savings >on crops would probably pay the costs 100 times over. Nevertheless I >suppose only field trials would really tell how effective it would be. > On second thought... I live near an area where there is a lot of strawberries grown.... and I have never seen this method used.... they cover the fields with plastic and inject gas into it .... 18 inches sounds about par for what they get too.... so I wonder if it's new or just more costly???? I'm sure the this county would welcome microwaves as we impose fines to the growers for using the gas and they still us it and just treat the fines as a business expense.... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 00:18:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA24594; Mon, 17 May 1999 00:17:53 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:17:53 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 07:17:18 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <374dc257.101891848@mail-hub> References: <19990517070957.23850.qmail@hotmail.com> In-Reply-To: <19990517070957.23850.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id AAA24576 Resent-Message-ID: <"_wXz12.0.B06.XAyFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10545 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 00:09:56 PDT, flytch er wrote: [snip] >On second thought... I live near an area where there is a lot of >strawberries grown.... and I have never seen this method used.... they cover [snip] Perhaps you could ask next time you get a chance? Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 00:21:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA26129; Mon, 17 May 1999 00:20:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:20:07 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:25:40 -0700 Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Message-ID: <19990517.002653.-42053.1.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-27,29-36 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4LYCz1.0.AO6.cCyFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10547 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 02:17:49 EDT MATTIARO@aol.com writes: >Hi. > > A quicky test would be to place a raw chicken egg into the microwave >oven >and see that operation. I have seen what happens. > The idea just came to me, and I haven't had a chance to talk to my >wife >about it yet. I wonder if she would be willing to clean the oven. >:-) I think she will be more willing to leave you than clean the oven. > Most probably the shell would crack and the egg just oozing out of >the >shell. But in other hand, if the pressure builds up too fast .... >hmmm .... > "kaboom"??? KABOOM?......KABOOM? Every time the microwave-oven-challenged quota hirees at work did that trick, the company just ordered more ovens and charlesed (chucked) the egged ones because even our chemists had not found a solvent that could dissolve all the bumps, let alone, get rid of the "aroma". Yours in matrimonial harmony..............David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 00:21:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA26055; Mon, 17 May 1999 00:20:01 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:20:01 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:13:02 -0700 Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Message-ID: <19990517.002653.-42053.0.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-6,8-9,11-16 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_425b3.0.0N6.WCyFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10546 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 16 May 1999 23:18:35 PDT "flytch er" writes: >Yes, However.... how many acres a day can you cover???? and at what >cost/acre???? I have no idea. All I can say is that there was a Caterpiller diesel engine driving a 220/440 volt 60HZ. generator for power. This was around 1978,as I recall.............. Who knows what is available these days? David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 00:50:26 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA00383; Mon, 17 May 1999 00:47:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:47:07 -0700 Message-Id: From: Duncan Purvis Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 8:48:32 +0000 To: Alik Shereshevsky , "Jorg D. Ostrowski" Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Swiss Microwave study Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Mailer: TFS Gateway /221000000/221020552/0/221110198/222140740/ X-Engine: "TFS Engine Release 3.12 Build 137e" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id AAA00343 Resent-Message-ID: <"Qz_Mm2.0.p5.wbyFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10548 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: see: http://www.peg.apc.org/~nexus/microwave.html, this may give you a clue? Duncan ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Swiss Microwave study Author: MIME:"Jorg D. Ostrowski" at INTERNET Date: 15/05/99 01:00 Alik or others: Have you seen the Swiss study? I would like to obtain a copy if anyone knows a reference. This is one reason we do not have a microwave oven in our home. Jorg Ostrowski ______________________________________________________________________ __ You said: Microwaved food seems to be seriously damaged. There was a fairly credible study done in Switzerland proving this but the scientist who published it had a gag order placed on him at the request of swiss appliance manufacturers association. It was lifted just last year. ------------------------------------------------------------ Scientific Generics Limited Tel: +44 1223 875200 Harston Mill Fax: +44 1223 875201 United Kingdom http://www.generics.co.uk Harston Cambridge CB2 5NH Registered in England No 2081960 ------------------------------------------------------------ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 00:51:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA00574; Mon, 17 May 1999 00:47:38 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:47:38 -0700 Message-ID: <19990517065939.95522.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.99] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 23:59:39 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"lasdL.0.t8.PcyFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10549 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Hi. > > A quicky test would be to place a raw chicken egg into the microwave >oven >and see that operation. > The idea just came to me, and I haven't had a chance to talk to my wife >about it yet. I wonder if she would be willing to clean the oven. :-) > Most probably the shell would crack and the egg just oozing out of the >shell. But in other hand, if the pressure builds up too fast .... hmmm >.... > "kaboom"??? Done that!!!! try using two...yes two heavy ziplock bags/oven bags .... no clean up:) _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 01:41:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA15198; Mon, 17 May 1999 01:41:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 01:41:03 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 01:47:27 -0700 Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff..... Message-ID: <19990517.014727.-42053.4.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-8,10,13-18 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"F1o3R1.0.Nj3.UOzFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10550 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Sun, 16 May 1999 23:59:39 PDT "flytch er" writes: >>.... >> "kaboom"??? >Done that!!!! try using two...yes two heavy ziplock bags/oven bags >.... no >clean up:) Yeah, right!!!!! Depends on the quality of the bags........Even current U.S bags (made in blurbistan) don't satisfy me........I match and raise, three layers of 7497 Pyrex glass 1/4 inch thick and I wear Swiss Bomoplot 353 goggles. Anyone call? Still alive........David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 01:56:26 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA18867; Mon, 17 May 1999 01:56:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 01:56:03 -0700 Message-ID: <19990517085532.43389.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.99] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff..... Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 01:55:31 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"UR3_m.0.ic4.ZczFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10551 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >On Sun, 16 May 1999 23:59:39 PDT "flytch er" writes: > >>.... > >> "kaboom"??? > >Done that!!!! try using two...yes two heavy ziplock bags/oven bags > >.... no > >clean up:) > >Yeah, right!!!!! Depends on the quality of the bags........Even current >U.S bags (made in >blurbistan) don't satisfy me........I match and raise, three layers of >7497 Pyrex glass 1/4 inch thick and I wear Swiss Bomoplot 353 goggles. >Anyone call? DON'T FOGET THE NOSE PLUGS..................ROTFLMAO......... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 01:58:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA18975; Mon, 17 May 1999 01:57:00 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 01:57:00 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 02:03:18 -0700 Subject: Microwave Stuff Message-ID: <19990517.020342.-42053.5.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"agteI2.0.Ke4.RdzFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10552 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-6,8-16 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Y9VrH.0.-V5._qzFt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10553 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 01:55:31 PDT "flytch er" writes: > >DON'T FOGET THE NOSE PLUGS..................ROTFLMAO......... Yes ...Of Course....You are right....... Although, with my allergies, ROTFLMAO does not compute. I am sure that if I was not thoroughly overcomed by my allergies, I would with out a doubt recognize that term................. Are you a chef in a Belgum restaurant? David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 02:34:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA26108; Mon, 17 May 1999 02:33:29 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 02:33:29 -0700 From: Grod123456@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 05:33:14 EDT Subject: Re: Microwave Stuff ...ENOUGH ALREADY!!! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"pwGJo1.0.nN6.f9-Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10554 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Come on guys !!!!! Enough nonsense !!!! My mailbox fills up too fast! If you guys wanna chat please write back and forth directly... NOT TO FREENRG-L@ESKIMO.COM !!!! Thankyou Please Enough Chatter!! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 03:34:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA02561; Mon, 17 May 1999 03:32:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 03:32:04 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 03:38:09 -0700 Subject: Re: Microwave Stuff ...ENOUGH ALREADY!!! Message-ID: <19990517.033809.-42053.9.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"IeIhi2.0.wd.a0_Ft"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10555 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 05:33:14 EDT Grod123456@aol.com writes: >Come on guys !!!!! Enough nonsense !!!! My mailbox fills up too >fast! If you guys wanna chat please write back and forth directly... >NOT TO FREENRG-L@ESKIMO.COM !!!! >Thankyou > >Please Enough Chatter!! Hello Grod123456@aol.com, My name is David. You may have seen it on previous posts. So, just who are you? Obviously, more than your mail box is clogged. Which of our hairs is up your clogged mail box? Do you have the courtesy do be more specific? Do you have the intelligence to be more specific? Information, no matter how seemingly trivial to clogged up persons, is a vital part of experimentation. My understanding is that this discussion list is about experimentation and all that goes with it. What experiment are you working on? What can a person with a clogged anything contribute? David E-Mail Address: broompilot@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 06:22:19 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA00055; Mon, 17 May 1999 06:21:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 06:21:24 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 06:27:21 -0700 Subject: Re: Microwave Stuff ...ENOUGH ALREADY!!! Message-ID: <19990517.062721.-90547.0.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-32,34-42,44-56,58-61,63-82 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"kgtyq1.0.m.JV1Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10556 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 03:38:09 -0700 broompilot@juno.com writes >Hello Grod123456@aol.com, > >My name is David. >You may have seen it on previous posts. >So, just who are you? >Obviously, more than your mail box is clogged. >Which of our hairs is up your clogged mail box? > >Do you have the courtesy do be more specific? >Do you have the intelligence to be more specific? > >Information, no matter how seemingly trivial to >clogged up persons, is a vital part of experimentation. >My understanding is that this discussion list is about >experimentation and all that goes with it. > >What experiment are you working on? >What can a person with a clogged anything contribute? > >David Hello Folks, I wish to help come to an understanding as to why WE are here. I do not know why you are here. I am here because I am a creative person. I feel that all creative persons HAVE to EXPRESS their creativity. That is what LIFE is for US. Personally, I can't sing, I can't write songs, I can't paint a picture, You should have been around when I thought I could play the violin................ However,.........help build linear accelerators for research. Been there,done that. Help build linear accelerators for medical use? (Cancer reduction) Sign my name? Yes. Been there,done that. Inspect eye surgery equipment,O.K to poke in someone's eye without infection possibilities? Sign my name? Yes. Been there, done that. Inspect Rapid Transit train cars so not likely somebody gets hurt.? Sign my name? Yes. Been there,done that. Assemble control units for electron beam pattern generators, to make integrated circuits. If something doesn't work right, is my name there? Yes. Ben there,done that. Inspect medical laser parts and assemblies; If the tattoo on somebody's ass is MORE than removed, ..............Is David's name on the list that lawyer is waiving around? Couldn't Duck it could I? Yes. There seem to be many reasons why folks wish to help make changes to the environment in which they wallow....... If we have something to do... do it with integrity. If we have something to say....say it with integrity. Mr./Miss/Mz. Grod123456@aol.com I apologize for not giving you the space you deserve as a person, not to mention a person who is HERE. But, Could you at least explain your gripe and, perhaps the feelings that cause your gripe to exist? Sometimes, my name is asshole.......... What is yours? David. ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 07:00:37 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA17449; Mon, 17 May 1999 06:56:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 06:56:04 -0700 Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 08:56:02 -0500 (CDT) From: Zack Widup Subject: Re: Microwave Stuff ...ENOUGH ALREADY!!! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: <19990517.062721.-90547.0.broompilot@juno.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"H8o6J3.0.YG4.q_1Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10557 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 broompilot@juno.com wrote: > On Mon, 17 May 1999 03:38:09 -0700 broompilot@juno.com writes > >Hello Grod123456@aol.com, > > > >My name is David. > >You may have seen it on previous posts. > >So, just who are you? [snip] > > > >What experiment are you working on? > >What can a person with a clogged anything contribute? > > > >David > > Hello Folks, > I wish to help come to an understanding as to why WE are here. > > I do not know why you are here. > > I am here because I am a creative person. > > I feel that all creative persons HAVE to EXPRESS their creativity. > That is what LIFE is for US. > Hey, I thought this thread was humorous! At least it wasn't a flame war and didn't hurt anybody. Usually these things come up once in a while on every discussion group I've been on, they last a day or two and blow over. Just get a chuckle from them if you're inclined, or use the "delete" key and wait till they pass! Zack From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 10:23:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA07557; Mon, 17 May 1999 10:22:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 10:22:15 -0700 Message-ID: <000101bea089$eaeb3780$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Toroid Update Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:22:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"JU9fi2.0.-r1.615Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10559 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: We have added some updated information to http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm Seems like some of our co-experimenters are having trouble duplicating similar results, so we have added another test for them to try. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 11:48:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA03516; Mon, 17 May 1999 11:44:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 11:44:57 -0700 From: mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl Message-Id: <374061FE.469BFAAA@elektro.fontys.nl> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 20:37:50 +0200 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [nl]C-QXW07103 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl, de, en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <19990512205628.35264.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"RH8eL1.0.rs.fE6Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10560 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi flytch, Can you use this hot exhaustgases to heat a Stirling engine? Or is the temperature not high enough? Regards, WJ flytch er schreef: > I read it as a low compression gas engine with a boost in power from the air > tanks..... so yes the exhaust would be hot...... think of your car with > blower blowing air into the cylinder after combustion.... > > > > >Hi, > > > >At the site of de Negre engine ( > >http://www.zeropollution.com/zeropollution/no_fuel.html ) : > > > >" However, MDI vehicle is design to run exclusively on air compressed. A > >jet of cold air is delivered at hight pressure into de combustion chamber > >which is already charged up with HOT COMPRESSED AIR. This provides enough > >force to run the engine." > > > >Which temperature is the HOT COMPRESSED AIR? Is this really a high > >temperature or is it just warm? > > > >If the temperature is high : Is the exhaust air also hot? > > > >Regards, > >WJ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 12:03:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA10356; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:00:12 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:00:12 -0700 Message-ID: <19990517185935.95202.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.121] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: ROTFLMAO......definition... Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 11:59:35 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"IGXTR3.0.jX2.xS6Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10561 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: R....rolling O....on T....the F....floor L....laughing M....my A....ass O...off...... ttfn, Timothy... _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 12:14:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA15199 for bilb@eskimo.com; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:14:49 -0700 Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:14:49 -0700 X-Envelope-From: atg0317@wt.net Mon May 17 12:14:41 1999 Received: from sys32.hou.wt.net (sys32.hou.wt.net [205.230.159.32]) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA14595 for ; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:14:39 -0700 Received: from y9g6r3 (216-119-131-37.ipset11.wt.net [216.119.131.37]) by sys32.hou.wt.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id OAA16700 for ; Mon, 17 May 1999 14:16:26 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000401bea099$a03f5c60$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: ROTFLMAO......definition... Old-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 14:15:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Diagnostic: Not on the accept list X-Envelope-To: freenrg-l Status: O X-Status: From: flytch er To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, May 17, 1999 2:05 PM Subject: ROTFLMAO......definition... >R....rolling >O....on >T....the >F....floor >L....laughing >M....my >A....ass >O...off...... > > > ttfn, > Timothy... > > >_______________________________________________________________ >Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > Thanks ever so much... This was so insightful. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 12:16:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA15579; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:16:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:16:13 -0700 Message-ID: <19990517191634.58114.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [208.254.227.121] From: "flytch er" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:16:33 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"P181Y.0.Gp3.zh6Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10562 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > >Hi flytch, > >Can you use this hot exhaustgases to heat a Stirling engine? Or is the >temperature not high enough? > >Regards, >WJ No idea WJ, I just read the article at the sight below and answered off the cuff .... hope I didn't offend... but....why would you want two engines???? I was thinking of a simple compressed air engine that could be run off steam too.... a kerosene steam generator is a simple device.... >flytch er schreef: > > > I read it as a low compression gas engine with a boost in power from the >air > > tanks..... so yes the exhaust would be hot...... think of your car with > > blower blowing air into the cylinder after combustion.... > > > > > > > >Hi, > > > > > >At the site of de Negre engine ( > > >http://www.zeropollution.com/zeropollution/no_fuel.html ) : > > > > > >" However, MDI vehicle is design to run exclusively on air compressed. >A > > >jet of cold air is delivered at hight pressure into de combustion >chamber > > >which is already charged up with HOT COMPRESSED AIR. This provides >enough > > >force to run the engine." > > > > > >Which temperature is the HOT COMPRESSED AIR? Is this really a high > > >temperature or is it just warm? > > > > > >If the temperature is high : Is the exhaust air also hot? > > > > > >Regards, > > >WJ > > _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 12:20:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA18004; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:20:42 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:20:42 -0700 Message-ID: <003001bea09a$6e7f5940$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: ROTFLMAO......definition... Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 14:21:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"2ultN3.0.7P4.9m6Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10563 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: -----Original Message----- From: flytch er To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, May 17, 1999 2:05 PM Subject: ROTFLMAO......definition... >R....rolling >O....on >T....the >F....floor >L....laughing >M....my >A....ass >O...off...... > > > ttfn, > Timothy... > > >_______________________________________________________________ >Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > Thanks ever so much... This was so insightful. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 12:18:36 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA16808 for bilb@eskimo.com; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:18:36 -0700 Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:18:36 -0700 X-Envelope-From: atg0317@wt.net Mon May 17 12:18:35 1999 Received: from sys32.hou.wt.net (sys32.hou.wt.net [205.230.159.32]) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA16783 for ; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:18:35 -0700 Received: from y9g6r3 (216-119-131-37.ipset11.wt.net [216.119.131.37]) by sys32.hou.wt.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with SMTP id OAA17200 for ; Mon, 17 May 1999 14:20:20 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000f01bea09a$2c223680$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atg0317" To: Subject: Re: ROTFLMAO......definition... Old-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 14:19:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Diagnostic: Not on the accept list X-Envelope-To: freenrg-l Status: O X-Status: -----Original Message----- From: flytch er To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, May 17, 1999 2:05 PM Subject: ROTFLMAO......definition... >R....rolling >O....on >T....the >F....floor >L....laughing >M....my >A....ass >O...off...... > > > ttfn, > Timothy... > > >_______________________________________________________________ >Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > Thanks ever so much... This was so insightful. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 12:38:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA28005; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:37:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:37:41 -0700 From: mbe1284@elektro.fontys.nl Message-Id: <3740705C.5054CE7C@elektro.fontys.nl> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 21:39:08 +0200 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [nl]C-QXW07103 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: nl, de, en Mime-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Negre air-motor : official website References: <19990517191634.58114.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YHCuL3.0.Ur6.407Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10566 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Flytch, To power a compressor to fill the air tanks. Regards, WJ > {snip} > > No idea WJ, > I just read the article at the sight below and answered off the > cuff .... hope I didn't offend... > but....why would you want two engines???? > I was thinking of a simple compressed air engine that could be run off steam > too.... a kerosene steam generator is a simple device.... {snip} From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 12:39:15 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA27370; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:36:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:36:04 -0700 Message-ID: <37408ACF.4C5BBDED@sunherald.infi.net> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 14:31:59 -0700 From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid Update References: <000101bea089$eaeb3780$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4kREO2.0.Xh6.a-6Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10565 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atglab wrote: > > We have added some updated information to http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm > > Seems like some of our co-experimenters are having trouble duplicating > similar results, so we have added another test for them to try. I have tested the effect with the iron wire. Quite interesting, especially if your probe detected no magnetic field. The effect is not as pronounced with my toroids, but is present. The wire does move. However, a copper wire of equal size does not move. Therefore, the effect would seem to be a conventional magnetic one. If it were gravitational, it would act on any mass, regardless of being ferromagnetic or paramagnetic. Since it does not... I cannot rule out some other kind of nonmagnetic but nongravitational effect though... Kyle R. Mcallister From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 12:43:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA24276; Mon, 17 May 1999 12:32:49 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 12:32:49 -0700 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: <3614f709.2471c854@aol.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:30:28 EDT Subject: Dynamic Profile Matching site working! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"pff6c3.0.9x5.Wx6Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10564 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi all, Sorry about trouble with first site. Thanks, Butch LaFonte Research site 1 or http://hometown.aol.com/hlafonte/index.html From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 13:05:08 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA07566; Mon, 17 May 1999 13:02:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 13:02:13 -0700 Message-ID: <006701bea0a0$23b30960$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: Toroid Update Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:02:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"FWALo.0.4s1.5N7Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10567 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: Kyle R. Mcallister To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, May 17, 1999 2:45 PM Subject: Re: Toroid Update >atglab wrote: >> >> We have added some updated information to http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm >> >> Seems like some of our co-experimenters are having trouble duplicating >> similar results, so we have added another test for them to try. > >I have tested the effect with the iron wire. Quite interesting, >especially if your probe detected no magnetic field. The effect is not >as pronounced with my toroids, but is present. The wire does move. >However, a copper wire of equal size does not move. Therefore, the >effect would seem to be a conventional magnetic one. If it were >gravitational, it would act on any mass, regardless of being >ferromagnetic or paramagnetic. Since it does not... I cannot rule out >some other kind of nonmagnetic but nongravitational effect though... > >Kyle R. Mcallister > Can not disagree with what you say. We tried copper, plastic etc., and found the effect to follow conventional understanding for interaction with a magnetic field. Now, we state again that conventional magnetic field is not present in amount to account for the movement of the mass. The question now is, can the vector potential act in a similar fashion to B and H, or is it possible that 'A' can be changed back from VP to commonly understood induction ? Interesting indeed. This goes back to your tests where you looked into the effect of the earth's mag. field. So did you detect a field coming from the coils ? If so than electrodynamics is wrong (for a properly constructed toroid) in that this should not be happening. Exclude gravitation at this stage. What is felt is that we are seeing a manifestation of a commonly neutral field force (vector 'Scalar') producing a visible effect. Yes this does not say much, but is not left field when one can not see it from common knowledge. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 13:34:07 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA18260; Mon, 17 May 1999 13:33:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 13:33:22 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: plant coil Message-Id: <926973180.29615.279@excite.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 13:33:00 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.137 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"a5oq-3.0.8T4.Iq7Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10568 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Fri, 14 May 1999 19:57:33, Dave Dameron wrote > > Very interesting description! Are all the plants gone too? This coil was > one of the 2 primaries? No, one of two secondaries. Because of the 1/2 in spacing btween turns on the big coil this was very inefficient. I think only 2 turns of copper tubing was used for its primary. I only grew plants the second year around when the coil was not in use. I had morning glories in large containers the first year that didnt do nearly as well and the operation of the coil burnt their stems then; too much power for plant stimulation. Of course these were perenial or yearly plants and die over the winter. What was the diameter of each secondary? From a > previous post: > > In this experiment 2 tesla coils were constructed > >with secondaries of approximately equal inductances > >but different geometries. These both used 1500 ft of 18 gauge wire. Both of > >these coils had a 6/1 diameter ratio and also a 6/1 difference in wire > >spacing. One coil was 20 in diameter, the other 10 feet. The coils were > >separated about two feet. > > -Dave > 20 inch diameter coil had secondary windings side by side,(6/in)about 2 1/2 ft height. Uesd about 5 turns of copper tubing for its primary. HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 13:39:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA22611; Mon, 17 May 1999 13:38:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 13:38:11 -0700 From: dtmiller@nevia.net (Dean T. Miller) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave oven stuff Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 20:37:31 GMT Organization: Miller and Associates Reply-To: dtmiller@nevia.net Message-ID: <37405962.259753277@mail.nevia.net> References: <3a166bd4.24710e8d@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <3a166bd4.24710e8d@aol.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id NAA22590 Resent-Message-ID: <"28SM_.0.CX5.pu7Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10569 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Matt, Yes, the egg explodes. You can cook eggs in a microwave by poking a tiny vent hole in them (and making sure the vent stays on top). On Mon, 17 May 1999 02:17:49 EDT, MATTIARO@aol.com wrote: > A quicky test would be to place a raw chicken egg into the microwave oven >and see that operation. > The idea just came to me, and I haven't had a chance to talk to my wife >about it yet. I wonder if she would be willing to clean the oven. :-) > Most probably the shell would crack and the egg just oozing out of the >shell. But in other hand, if the pressure builds up too fast .... hmmm .... > "kaboom"??? -- Dean -- from (almost) Duh Moines (CDP, KB0ZDF) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 14:22:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA16129; Mon, 17 May 1999 14:20:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 14:20:17 -0700 Message-ID: <37408859.DBD03534@harti.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 23:21:29 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, atglab Subject: Re: Toroid Update References: <000101bea089$eaeb3780$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bG9l21.0.wx3.HW8Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10570 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atglab schrieb: > > We have added some updated information to http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm > > Seems like some of our co-experimenters are having trouble duplicating > similar results, so we have added another test for them to try. Don´t you think the iron wire is affected by magnetic stray fields or standing magnetic waves, as Hami Uccur has explained ? As the RF contact burst appears, there will be stray magnetic fields building up in standing waves with stray fields going out the ferrite ??!. How did you try to measure it with the hall sensor ? Maybe your type of hall sensor has a lowpassfilter built in and can´t display RF magnetic fields ? Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 15:52:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA16598; Mon, 17 May 1999 15:49:36 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:49:36 -0700 Message-ID: <37407EA2.35FD0CB9@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:40:02 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Microwave Stuff ...ENOUGH ALREADY!!! References: <37406A92.10FEA4F9@telusplanet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ymQ1F1.0.F34._p9Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10571 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > Zack I wish more folks like you and Broompilot felt the same way... > it would be more conducive to relaxing and talking creatively.... > sure sometimes we'd go off topic but thats just being human... > and it often lends itself well to connecting different dots as has benn > observed on here before.... just my two cents... > > Zack Widup wrote: > > > > On Mon, 17 May 1999 broompilot@juno.com wrote: > > > > > On Mon, 17 May 1999 03:38:09 -0700 broompilot@juno.com writes > > > >Hello Grod123456@aol.com, > > > > > > > >My name is David. > > > >You may have seen it on previous posts. > > > >So, just who are you? > > [snip] > > > > > > > >What experiment are you working on? > > > >What can a person with a clogged anything contribute? > > > > > > > >David > > > > > > Hello Folks, > > > I wish to help come to an understanding as to why WE are here. > > > > > > I do not know why you are here. > > > > > > I am here because I am a creative person. > > > > > > I feel that all creative persons HAVE to EXPRESS their creativity. > > > That is what LIFE is for US. > > > > > > > Hey, I thought this thread was humorous! At least it wasn't a flame war > > and didn't hurt anybody. > > > > Usually these things come up once in a while on every discussion group > > I've been on, they last a day or two and blow over. Just get a chuckle > > from them if you're inclined, or use the "delete" key and wait till they > > pass! > > > > Zack > > -- > *********************************************************** > > Dance like no one's watching, love like you'll never be > hurt, sing like no one's listening, live like it's heaven on earth. -- > William Pukey > ... > > You cannot find yourself, only create yourself. -- > Anne Sekel > ... > > My candle burns at both ends, It will not > last the night, But, ah, my foes, and oh, my friends - it > gives a lovely light. -- Edna St. Vincent Millay > ... > > Not everything that can be counted > counts, and not everything that counts can be > counted. -- Einstein > ... > > We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are. -- Talmudic > Saying > ... > > Yesterday is a canceled check; tomorrow is a promissory note; today is > the only cash you have. Spend it wisely. > ... > > What if there were no hypothetical situations? -- Andrew Kohlsmith > ... > > How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives. -- Annie > Dillard > ... > > ====================================================================== > Don J.S. Adams, Overseer and Registered Agent for > Domhnall C G N Adams - (Corporation Sole - Lawful Entity Name) > > RAVE Communications > > 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA > 780-998-4066 Canada > > http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave > > alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com -- *********************************************************** Dance like no one's watching, love like you'll never be hurt, sing like no one's listening, live like it's heaven on earth. -- William Pukey ... You cannot find yourself, only create yourself. -- Anne Sekel ... My candle burns at both ends, It will not last the night, But, ah, my foes, and oh, my friends - it gives a lovely light. -- Edna St. Vincent Millay ... Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- Einstein ... We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are. -- Talmudic Saying ... Yesterday is a canceled check; tomorrow is a promissory note; today is the only cash you have. Spend it wisely. ... What if there were no hypothetical situations? -- Andrew Kohlsmith ... How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives. -- Annie Dillard ... ====================================================================== Don J.S. Adams, Overseer and Registered Agent for Domhnall C G N Adams - (Corporation Sole - Lawful Entity Name) RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 15:58:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA21860; Mon, 17 May 1999 15:56:51 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:56:51 -0700 From: Grod123456@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 18:50:40 EDT Subject: Re: Microwave Stuff ...ENOUGH ALREADY!!! To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"3Qxn42.0.PL5.ow9Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10574 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: This will be my only reply on this subject: I don't know how long you have been on this list but quite a few subscribers have been getting a little upset over the comments back and forth about a few subjects. For example: please don't post a letter that simply says "Yes, I agree with you" and nothing else. Or some other statement that does not state any vital information (brainstorming is good but each post SHOULD have an idea to 'volley' back to the other individual or group) ... If I am way off base on this please, let me know... I may be in the wrong group... Oh, and by the way, I AM working on a project also and if you have been around long enough you would have read my posts over the last several months... Otherwise, I am trying to be considerate and not babble TOO much over my ideas... When I feel something is worth while I will post to the group... If someone starts corresponding with me in detail, we will correspond back and forth directly so we don't clog up the group... Please don't take offense to this. If you only knew how 'OPEN" my mind is... I and many others don't want to sift through irrelevant chatter to get to the good stuff. I am now receiving over 40 emails a day through this group. Take care, Rod From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 15:59:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA17366; Mon, 17 May 1999 15:52:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:52:33 -0700 Message-ID: <37407F2B.2D0A460B@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:42:19 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Beardon Site References: <925829555.28736.902@excite.com> <37327951.676646BA@telusplanet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"XdNS2.0.4F4.ms9Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10573 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > Hi Harvey, tried looking up this URL but couldnt access it? > > Harvey Norris wrote: > > > > For those willing to fathom it; > > http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/i/n/infonet/Beardon.htm > > Somehow a medical application of scalar effects > > may be explored but it is hard to continue reading > > this without somekind of reprieve. Been there before? > > Other notes of interest exist on the host site. > > I dont know why mathematics and quantum > > theory has to be so obtuse. That means you think > > you have an inkling of whats going on by reading > > it over and over. I think I need to go back to > > school... HDN > > > > _______________________________________________________ > > Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ > > -- > Harry, I'm going to let you in on a little secret. > Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it, > don't wait for it, just... let it happen. > -- Special Agent Dale Cooper > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > Don J. S. Adams > Managing Consultant > RAVE Communications > > 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA > 780-998-4066 Canada > > http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave > > alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com -- *********************************************************** Dance like no one's watching, love like you'll never be hurt, sing like no one's listening, live like it's heaven on earth. -- William Pukey ... You cannot find yourself, only create yourself. -- Anne Sekel ... My candle burns at both ends, It will not last the night, But, ah, my foes, and oh, my friends - it gives a lovely light. -- Edna St. Vincent Millay ... Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- Einstein ... We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are. -- Talmudic Saying ... Yesterday is a canceled check; tomorrow is a promissory note; today is the only cash you have. Spend it wisely. ... What if there were no hypothetical situations? -- Andrew Kohlsmith ... How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives. -- Annie Dillard ... ====================================================================== Don J.S. Adams, Overseer and Registered Agent for Domhnall C G N Adams - (Corporation Sole - Lawful Entity Name) RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 16:38:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA04126; Mon, 17 May 1999 16:37:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 16:37:44 -0700 Posted-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 02:34:28 +0400 (MEDT) Message-ID: <3740A774.BCEB6CE6@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 02:34:12 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg Subject: Re: Beardon Site References: <925829555.28736.902@excite.com> <37327951.676646BA@telusplanet.net> <37407F2B.2D0A460B@telusplanet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"PCd9s.0.N01.7XAGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10575 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Is this (Don J. S. Adams' posting) a junk mail? Don J. S. Adams wrote: > [snip] hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 17:10:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA15166; Mon, 17 May 1999 17:09:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 17:09:40 -0700 From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199905180006.UAA21030@frogpond.frognet.net> Subject: Hello To: freenrg-L@eskimo.com (scilist) Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 20:06:44 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text Resent-Message-ID: <"sq5s12.0.ti3.4_AGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10576 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hello All, I just thought I would introduce myself. My name is Andrew Cantino. I used to subscribe to this list for a very long time, but then I was off it for a year or more. I have decided to return. Anyone interested can check out my science page at: http://tectonicdesigns.com/sci/ Andrew Cantino From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 19:51:07 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA27109; Mon, 17 May 1999 19:50:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 19:50:40 -0700 From: MATTIARO@aol.com Message-ID: <765a267e.24722dac@aol.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 22:42:52 EDT Subject: Re: Microwave Stuff ...I appologize. To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"9gpbI2.0.Ud6.0MDGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10577 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hello all. When I read about trying to exterminate the locust eggs, I thought that maybe the eggs do not contain water, but is oil based. If that was true, then the microwave bombardment would not work. So in half seriousness I proposed to try a chicken egg to see if it would be destroyed. I have not ever put a raw egg in to the microwave. But apperently some people have. Now I learned something from this. The microwave oven increases the pressure inside fast enough so that the shell "explodes" rather than cracks as boiling it in water. Some people think that science is boring with facts and figures. I am happy to tell you all that "it ain't so". All the funny antitodes that were used to inform what a big mess it would create were FUNNY. I just hpe that EVERYBODY would read them and get a break from the humdrum. I thank all of you for making this a learning lesson that will stay in my mind "till the day that I die". To all that did not appreciate the humor, I appologize and ask for the time that it takes to explode the raw egg in the microwave oven. Also please tell me what the internal pressure was when the shell fragmented. Also could you trace the majority of the egg's particle's trajectory so we could estimate what force was excerted internally by the microwaves. Matti From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 19:54:26 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA28781; Mon, 17 May 1999 19:54:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 19:54:11 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Beardon Site Message-Id: <926996050.27756.199@excite.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 19:54:10 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.21 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"t3jX-.0.Z17.IPDGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10578 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 15:42:19 -0500, Don J. S. Adams wrote: > Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > > Hi Harvey, tried looking up this URL but couldnt access it? heres the letter I got:havent tried accessing lately. > > Harvey Norris wrote:Jeez with all the microwave letters that I deleted without getting the punchline I thought I was in Junk Mail Paradise! More Junk Mail! > > > > > > For those willing to fathom it; > > > http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/i/n/infonet/Beardon.htm > > > Somehow a medical application of scalar effects > > > may be explored but it is hard to continue reading > > > this without somekind of reprieve. Been there before? > > > Other notes of interest exist on the host site. > > > I dont know why mathematics and quantum > > > theory has to be so obtuse. That means you think > > > you have an inkling of whats going on by reading > > > it over and over. I think I need to go back to > > > school... HDN > > > Warren York sent thisTue, 4 May 1999 08:56:10 -0500 From: "Warren E. York" Subject: Re: John Bajak's Device To: tesla4@excite.com Yes Mr. Norris, Tom Berden has been and is now publishing new updates to his work on my site. We call it a growing book for the updates are posted and dated from the old pages. As the data changes and new info is learned the book will grow. You will need to keep checking back for the data will be changing all the time. He has just released Part V and Part VI with one update to Part II. There are at this point Part V through Part VI. Two more updates I am told are on the way. I think one is Part III. The update dates will be in RED so you can't miss them. Look around while you are there. You may learn more than you are ready for. If you need any of the prior update pages just let me know. Some of you may wish to follow a full record of the changes. This way everybody can be a virtual part of ongoing research and development. Warren http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/~infonet warren.york@juno.com =================================================== _______________________________________________________ > > > Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 20:33:17 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA05803; Mon, 17 May 1999 20:32:36 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 20:32:36 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <6e83f33a.2472377b@aol.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 23:24:43 EDT Subject: Re: Toroid Update To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"3x1vx1.0.aQ1.KzDGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10579 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/17/99 1:05:52 PM Pacific Daylight Time, atglab@atgroup.org writes: << > Can not disagree with what you say. We tried copper, plastic etc., and found the effect to follow conventional understanding for interaction with a magnetic field. Now, we state again that conventional magnetic field is not present in amount to account for the movement of the mass. The question now is, can the vector potential act in a similar fashion to B and H, or is it possible that 'A' can be changed back from VP to commonly understood induction ? >> Just a thought, but when you wound the toroids did you match layers with counter currents? For example, with a single toroid layer you will normally have a one turn loop. and external ferromagnetic objects could possibly react with the field from it. (Imagine squishing down the cross-sectional dimension of a toroid and making each turn shorter simultaneously. Eventually you are left with a single loop --- that loop is always there.) Ken Keasy@aol.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 20:40:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA08043; Mon, 17 May 1999 20:39:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 20:39:39 -0700 Message-ID: <3740C2A1.C725FDE4@telusplanet.net> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 20:30:09 -0500 From: "Don J. S. Adams" Reply-To: donadams@telusplanet.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.07 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Beardon Site References: <925829555.28736.902@excite.com> <37327951.676646BA@telusplanet.net> <37407F2B.2D0A460B@telusplanet.net> <3740A774.BCEB6CE6@verisoft.com.tr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"huQ9L3.0.az1.x3EGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10580 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: huh? what are you talking about? hamdi ucar wrote: > > Is this (Don J. S. Adams' posting) a junk mail? > > Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > [snip] > > hamdi ucar -- *********************************************************** Dance like no one's watching, love like you'll never be hurt, sing like no one's listening, live like it's heaven on earth. -- William Pukey ... You cannot find yourself, only create yourself. -- Anne Sekel ... My candle burns at both ends, It will not last the night, But, ah, my foes, and oh, my friends - it gives a lovely light. -- Edna St. Vincent Millay ... Not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted. -- Einstein ... We do not see things as they are, we see things as we are. -- Talmudic Saying ... Yesterday is a canceled check; tomorrow is a promissory note; today is the only cash you have. Spend it wisely. ... What if there were no hypothetical situations? -- Andrew Kohlsmith ... How we spend our days is, of course, how we spend our lives. -- Annie Dillard ... ====================================================================== Don J.S. Adams, Overseer and Registered Agent for Domhnall C G N Adams - (Corporation Sole - Lawful Entity Name) RAVE Communications 206-849-7966 Cell Phone - USA 780-998-4066 Canada http://www.intergate.bc.ca/rave alt e-mail address donjsadams@rocketmail.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 20:59:11 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA13209; Mon, 17 May 1999 20:58:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 20:58:40 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Coffin Nail for Teslas Quarter Wavelength Theory Message-Id: <926999904.17221.375@excite.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 20:58:24 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.8 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"GaaZ9.0.GE3.mLEGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10581 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: An excellent discussion just came in on the Tesla Coil List in which Terry Fritz, the moderator of the list describes some conundrums that are being discussed about how and why the 1/4 wavelength theory is no longer valid, which is a great question for me? In the old days the length of wire was an easy indicator for the aiming point of the predicted frequency oscillation that the PRIMARY had to assume to progenitate the best effects on the SECONDARY. However I have ascertained that something called a top loading or a polar capacitance evidenced by a sphere or more commonly employed toroid on top connection of a TC secondary itself changes the best frequency the primary can use to produce the high voltage effects inherent in the arcing of a TC secondary. If I understand correctly this LOWERS the frequency predicted by a 1/4 wavelength consideration. Inasmuch as this becomes somewhat incomprehensible and obtuse to me I am submitting his full comment to freenrg-l@eskimo.com for comment by others. First I'll mention the problems with the old 1/4 wave and wire length theory. It was assumed that for electricity to travel the length of the secondary, that the electrons would travel through the whole length of the wire. Thus, the electrons would flow from the base, to the terminal, and back. This is very similar to a 1/4 wave antenna. The resonant frequency is simply determined by the time it takes for light to travel the length of the wire. This seemed like a reasonable way to determine Fo and explain why a bare coil resonates at such a low frequency. However, there were problems. Medhurst found that an inductor's Fo frequency was related to the inductance and dimensions of the coil instead of the wire length. Given a coil of a fixed height and diameter, it could be shown that a single capacitance could be used to determine Fo along with the coils inductance regardless of the length of the wire. The wire lengths did not have any correlation and, indeed, it was simple to wind coils that violated a simple wire length model. The next problem was the extreme sensitivity of Fo to external influences. If just the wire length were controlling Fo, then simply placing ones hand near the coil should not alter the frequency to the extreme degree it does. It was obvious that the external fields around the coil were having a very profound influence on the resonating system. Medhurst put these two together into the Cself of the coil. The coil was now an inductor that had a "self capacitance". If you know the inductance and the self capacitance, you know Fo. Medhurst did his excellent work and found an empirical equation to find Cself based only on coil dimensions. It is well known that this equation (the Medhurst equation) can predict the coils Fo frequency with remarkable accuracy. However, there was still a belief that the 1/4 wave model was valid. No one really had any reason not to think that the secondary still acted like a 1/4 wave antenna instead of a simple inductor in parallel with a capacitor. Indeed, the distributed capacitance along the coil fit an antenna model better than a lumped model. Problem was, no one could find the parameters that would govern this system. The Corums changed that. Their "Slow Wave Helical Resonator Theory" adapted transmission line theory to the Tesla coil. They used standard transmission line parameters and equations to form a model that had distributed components of inductance, capacitance, and losses. This model also allowed for 1/4 wave phenomena to still exist. However, there was a problem. No one could ever find the parameters needed to use the equations. Every coil seemed to have it's own parameters. The Corums often sighted the formulas by Kandoian and Sichak for finding the transmission line parameters but, in practice, those parameters never worked well. A small error would give vastly different results. It could also be argued that the use of this empirical formula was not appropriate. However, this theory gave a whole new set of equations and even introduced the smith chart to Tesla coiling. Sounded good, had all the "stuff", based on true electrical engineering theory... Just didn't work. They wrote their work up and it was widely distributed. Few people really understood both Tesla coils and transmission line theory well so the problems were not easy to discover. Most people just read the papers, looked at the equations, fearlessly tried to calculate something with them, and concluded that it looks great and must be true despite the fact that they personally did not have the skills to use the darn thing. So, you assumed that the Corum's model was correct but used Medhurst to find Fo because all that Smith chart stuff was impossible to understand. However, many people realized that "something was wrong"... I am an electrical engineer and I do understand Tesla coils and transmission lines. So "no problem"! I'll just click up MathCad, punch in the Corum's equations, and I'll be set... Two weeks later, nothing was working. The equations gave all kinds of results depending on all kinds of things. I started to listen to the "other guys". Malcolm was the first person I remember that seemed to have a problem with the 1/4 wave theories. It was the coherence theory of the Corum's. Sounded good on paper, but was never demonstrated and violated the conservation of energy. Once I saw that the Corums could be wrong(!), I started going back and checking everything I could. Basically, the 1/4 wave theories didn't work and the lumped models did... The fiber optic probes were coming together about this time (they were originally made to study this problem), so I hooked them up to the coil and made a bunch of measurements. They were easily able to resolve and measure the phase shift from the top to the bottom of the secondary which would once and for all determine how much phase shift was going on. The results were that there was practically no phase shift! Exactly what the lumped models predict! I wrote up the "top and bottom" paper and started the "thrash the 1/4 wave theory" thread on this list. For me, the 1/4 wave theory fell apart like a house of cards. I was finally able to find the "true" transmission line parameters for a coil and it looked like an extremely short antenna "stub" with lots of L and C. Resonant yes, 1/4 wave, not at all... It was like using a 1/4 inch wire in place of a true 108 inch CB antenna. It was simply far far shorter than needed to support 1/4 wave effects. It was far closer to a lumped inductor and capacitor than a 1/4 wave antenna. Soooooo... Where are we now... I now believe that the secondary "can" be modeled as an antenna. A very very short one. My coil has a wavelength of a few thousand feet and it looks like an antenna 2.5 feet long. It does not transmit well at all. There is hardly any phase shift from top to bottom. The reason the wire length theory is not valid is because, unlike in a straight wire antenna, the windings are all magnetically linked to each other. Current at the base of the coil does not need to travel a few thousand feet to reach the top. It only has to travel 2.5 feet and magnetically couple to the top. A far shorter path and I would submit the "coffin nail" for the 1/4 wave theory. The Tesla coil is not a straight wire in free space. It is a coil in free space. The current does not travel trough the wire but is induced in the coil's turns by magnetic induction. Current in the bottom turn can induce current in the top turn in a few nanoseconds. The effects are, for all practical purposes, lumped. The secondary is an inductor, It sits is space and therefor has capacitance due to its physical dimensions as any conductor would. Voltage on the coil stores charge in this capacitance in the space surrounding the secondary. In can do this in a fraction of a nanosecond so the time delays are not significant. This capacitance is linked to the coil's turns all along the coil's length. This capacitance is distributed in that way, but there is practically no time delay involved. Medhurst's equation does accurately predict this capacitance given the dimensions of the cylinder. When you place a top terminal on a coil, it adds capacitance to the structure thus lowering the resonant frequency. The voltage along the secondary is distributed as a sine function with the base being at zero volts and the top being at full voltage. The current is a "delayed" cosine wave. Full current at the base but only maybe 30 of that current is seen at the top of the coil. The current divides between the self capacitance and the top capacitance. Wheeler's equations can tell you the inductance of the coil as can any LCR meter. There are no significant exceptions there. Medhurst's equations can tell you the self capacitance of the inductor also, without exception. Fields programs (like my own E-Tesla3) can determine the resonant frequency of a coil with a top terminal using the rules in the last paragraph along with field theory and Gausses law. It can also generate arrays that show the voltage distribution around a given coil. The accuracy is within 5% despite the fact that I wrote it :-)) Programs like MicroSim can be used to very accurately model Tesla coil systems using lumped parameters although it does not show the inner workings of the secondary coil as we have discussed. So, I think we really do know a lot and we are on the right track. Of course, that's what Tesla, the Corums, and who knows who else thought... The difference is, our ideas seem to work in every situation for everybody. I do not claim to have "invented" any of this. I may have helped to develop some of this or demonstrate something here or there, but many people have contributed to all this, not just me. Indeed, I suspect that Medhurst could have told us all this long ago.... There is still more to be discovered..... Terry _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 23:01:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA14391; Mon, 17 May 1999 23:00:45 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 23:00:45 -0700 Message-ID: <03ec01bea0f4$5a716d80$368280d8@btech> From: "Bill Wallace`" To: Subject: UV blue diamond glow Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 02:04:51 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"-Rh5O.0.hW3.D8GGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10582 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Why specifically does a blue diamond flouresce in UV and not other diamonds? Is it the boron? Is anyone familiar with a website detailing all the other elements besides carbon that can be extremely compressed and the crystal structures they form? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 17 23:57:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA25342; Mon, 17 May 1999 23:56:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 23:56:39 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Remembering Message-Id: <927010599.20512.531@excite.com> Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 23:56:39 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.52 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"hrjxL.0.tB6.dyGGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10583 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I remember a lot of things. I remember putting a large air core inductor into 60 hz resonance, and in order to make it resonate a voltage builds up across it, opposite to the voltage buildup used for its capacity used in series. And they call that series resonance. These coils I used were 56 Henry and produced a 15/1 voltage rise at 60 hz.Since the coils themselves were 1000 ohms I could also safely input 440 volts from a reasonably small transformer. This gave about 440 times 15 or 7000 volts against each element, both the inductor and capacitor again in opposition. "IN OPPOSITION" of course means that concurrent with a measured time period the potential or voltage measured from the end of the connections to the midpoint will show two readings on either side with regard to polarity. The inductor will register an increase in potential to the midpoint; and a potential drop is noted from the midpoint to the end connection through the capacitive element. I remember calling this a "UNOBVIOUS POTENTIAL" similar to 2 forces pressing against themselves. But if these gigantic forces are equal, no movement takes place. Therefore it is simple that in this analogy one force is always greater than the other and the movement that takes place is this difference between the two. So in a series resonant circuit these two high voltages are in opposition with the actual source voltage being the difference between the two large voltages. I remember that when these voltages built up I constructed a mechanism that would lead to their demise: what has been noted as a spark gap. Instead of the normal electr4ical path: a diversion was made so that when the voltage built up on a single element the design was made so that that element was in parallel with an electrode assembly that would easily discharge at 1/64 inch; this discharge itself rendered the circuit in a new non- resonant condition. Accordingly if this arc gap was discharged across the capacity it then appeared as a short connected in series with an inductor which represents resonance reverted to an inductive action; or the other possibility of the short acting in shunt to the inductor in which the resonance changes to capacitive reactance. I remember that in both these cases this was a method of throwing the coil into high frequency at a quarter wavelength signature. I remember that these methods were very inferior to a third method in which two opposite unobvious potentials were reacted. And to conclude; to convey an idea and to make others understand it is far the most significant thing to be done; If one series resonant phase is shorted on the coil; in parallel with another series resonant phase that is shorted with the arc gap across the cap; and if both of these shorts were to magically happen at the same time: what is the logical outcome? The outcome is that instead of a circuit going in and out of series resonance as each side would normally occur the simultaneous firings make the possibiltlity of going from SERIES TO PARALLEL RESONANCE. That is new because all the previous methods represent an oscillation in and out of resonance, rather than a method to oscillate BETWEEN resonances. In this thought experiment each phase reverts back to inductive and capacitive reactances when the arc forms, however a special method can be made where each arc forms identically in time and ALSO PATHWAYS SHARED IN REVERSE! If each pathway reverts back to its reactive condition with the special condition that they are now in parallel; that in itself is a new condition known as parallel resonance. I remember calling that a Binary Resonant System. HDN; sincere in the truth and all that rot. _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 00:14:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA30093; Tue, 18 May 1999 00:14:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 00:14:32 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990517225127.23bfb5f0@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 22:51:27 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Toroid Update In-Reply-To: <37408ACF.4C5BBDED@sunherald.infi.net> References: <000101bea089$eaeb3780$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"PsviC3.0.2M7.ODHGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10584 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi All, At 02:31 PM 5/17/99 -0700, Kyle wrote: >atglab wrote: >> >> We have added some updated information to http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm >> >> Seems like some of our co-experimenters are having trouble duplicating >> similar results, so we have added another test for them to try. > >I have tested the effect with the iron wire. Quite interesting, >especially if your probe detected no magnetic field. The effect is not >as pronounced with my toroids, but is present. The wire does move. >However, a copper wire of equal size does not move. Therefore, the >effect would seem to be a conventional magnetic one. I have started experiments with a single toroid coil and a capacitor pulser. Yes, I can get the toroid to "twitch", but do not know how much is "conventional". When I put an iron rod inside, the movement I see is toward the center of the toroid radially. Have nor observed any axial mevement yet. Can your magnetic probes follow the pulsed field? To see what it is, use the copper wire inside the toroid(s). The voltage observed will be that from a single turn winding. Because a single layer is also a single turn around the circumference of the toroid, (like a longitudinal current in a solenoid) which will place an axial B field at the toroid, I wrapped one lead around the back outside of the toroid to cancel this loop. I still observe the iron rod move in the direction of the center, however the effect may be less. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 01:35:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA13953; Tue, 18 May 1999 01:35:06 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 01:35:06 -0700 From: "Harvey Norris" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Beardon Site Message-Id: <927016474.3013.226@excite.com> Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 01:34:34 PDT X-Mailer: Excite Mail X-Sender-Ip: 207.220.167.33 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Resent-Message-ID: <"WwJny3.0.wP3.vOIGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10585 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Mon, 17 May 1999 15:42:19 -0500, Don J. S. Adams wrote: > Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > > Hi Harvey, tried looking up this URL but couldnt access it? > > > > Harvey Norris wrote: > > > > > > For those willing to fathom it; > > > http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/i/n/infonet/Beardon.htm I tried to access from the letter address myself and could not connect; got an error 404. Maybe a Bell South glitch. Yet the address I used in Bookmarks still takes me to the site. Must have been pre-recorded, huh. HDN _______________________________________________________ Get your free, private email at http://mail.excite.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 09:05:23 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA32718; Tue, 18 May 1999 09:03:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:03:32 -0700 Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 18:03:22 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199905181603.SAA13805@front1.grolier.fr> X-Sender: jplentin@pop3.club-internet.fr X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Jean-Pierre Lentin Subject: Bearden; not Beardon Resent-Message-ID: <"ouUS62.0.7_7.JzOGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10586 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Harvey, Don & all No wonder you could not access the site. Wrong spelling Correct URL for Tom Bearden (as in Thomas E. Bearden) 's book in progress is : http://personal.bellsouth.net/lig/i/n/infonet/Bearden.htm BTW - looks impressive... I just downloaded the 6 chapters... Will take days to read it all... --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jean-Pierre Lentin --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 09:14:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA03306; Tue, 18 May 1999 09:12:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:12:57 -0700 From: alansch@zip.com.au (Alan Schneider) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Beardon Site Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 16:12:55 GMT Message-ID: <3742910a.62036643@smtp.zipworld.com.au> References: <927016474.3013.226@excite.com> In-Reply-To: <927016474.3013.226@excite.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id JAA03269 Resent-Message-ID: <"iWQPc2.0.Zp.96PGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10587 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 18 May 1999 01:34:34 PDT, "Harvey Norris" wrote: >> > > For those willing to fathom it; >> > > http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/i/n/infonet/Beardon.htm >I tried to access from the letter address myself and could not connect; got >an error 404. You must have mistyped it in the email, Harvey... The correct URL is ... http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/i/n/infonet/Bearden.htm Alan From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 09:36:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA12353; Tue, 18 May 1999 09:35:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:35:14 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: eskimo.com: billb owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:35:03 -0700 (PDT) From: William Beaty Reply-To: William Beaty To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Bill B. in Boston Globe monday Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"72Dhv3.0.e03.1RPGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10588 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: I was interviewed recently about my "misconceptions in textbooks" website, and the result just appeared yesterday in the health/science section of the Boston Globe. The online version is here: 5/17/99 Boston Globe article http://www.globe.com/dailyglobe2/137/science/Textbooks_flunk_out+.shtml http://www.amasci.com/miscon/miscon.html If interested, check it out soon, since it's only supposed to be viewable for a couple of days (after that you have to pay $$) ((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))) William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb@eskimo.com http://www.amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits science projects, tesla, weird science Seattle, WA 206-781-3320 freenrg-L taoshum-L vortex-L webhead-L From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 09:43:58 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA15227; Tue, 18 May 1999 09:38:42 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:38:42 -0700 Message-ID: <37416DB9.48FE@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:40:09 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Toroid Update References: <000101bea089$eaeb3780$34f0fea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"YBCvU.0.qj3.IUPGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10589 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: atglab wrote: > > We have added some updated information to http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm > > Seems like some of our co-experimenters are having trouble duplicating > similar results, so we have added another test for them to try. There is a book in Russian that looks into vector potentials 'scalar EM' and all kinds of 'unusual EM'. It discussed an anomalous (longitudinal) force exherted on a current carrying conductor passing through the middle of a toroidal coil. I only mention it as a confirmation of a vaguely-similar effect having been found before. Do not know if it was DC/AC or what the specs were. Always wanted to try it out but never got to it. Author's name was 'Nikolaiev'. If anyone they may be able to locate it I will try to find out the whole name etc. Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 09:51:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA22474; Tue, 18 May 1999 09:50:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:50:17 -0700 From: Andrew Cantino Message-Id: <199905181647.MAA17926@frogpond.frognet.net> Subject: Thoughts To: freenrg-L@eskimo.com (scilist) Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 12:47:21 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text Resent-Message-ID: <"jMcZB.0.3V5.9fPGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10590 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hey All, I'm trying to increase my understanding of magnitism. I do understand gravity, as a warping of space-time. I have a general understanding of gravity, and the equations relating it to mass and acceleration. I am now trying to understand magnitism. I know it directly relates to moving electrons, but what propigates it? How is the 'force' propigated over space to affect another object? Thanks, Andrew Cantino. P.S. This would be the first posting I have done on this group for the last few years. I am also wondering what became of SMOT. What happened with it? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 11:29:19 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA25445; Tue, 18 May 1999 11:28:08 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 11:28:08 -0700 Message-ID: <3741B070.4A98DDBD@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 21:24:48 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg Subject: Re: Beardon Site References: <925829555.28736.902@excite.com> <37327951.676646BA@telusplanet.net> <37407F2B.2D0A460B@telusplanet.net> <3740A774.BCEB6CE6@verisoft.com.tr> <3740C2A1.C725FDE4@telusplanet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"fHBan.0.UD6.t4RGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10591 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: See your posting minus the quoted part of replied postings, no single word you typed except the endlessly selected "quotes". Kbytes of junk. What for this is? Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > huh? what are you talking about? > > hamdi ucar wrote: > > > > Is this (Don J. S. Adams' posting) a junk mail? > > > > Don J. S. Adams wrote: > > > > > [snip] > > > > hamdi ucar > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 12:49:55 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA20762; Tue, 18 May 1999 12:46:55 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 12:46:55 -0700 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 15:46:05 EDT Subject: Hartman link added to understand spin balance To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"KPyb2.0.F45.lESGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10592 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: A link has been added to my site to help better understand the spin balance system. It is part of Stefan Hartman's overunity site. See pages 01 thru 34 and magbat 01 thru 10 www.overunity.com - /tep/ Thanks, Butch LaFonte From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 13:38:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA01111; Tue, 18 May 1999 13:24:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 13:24:46 -0700 Message-ID: <3741CCDD.E79B5B9@harti.com> Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 22:26:05 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy Subject: Newman newest motor datas ! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"CP5b71.0.GH.EoSGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10593 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi All, this is the latest Newman press release. Just posted without a comment. Regards, Stefan. -------- Original Message -------- Betreff: FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE (May 17, 1999) Datum: Mon, 17 May 1999 15:10:14 -0600 Von: josephnewman@earthlink.net (Evan Soule) Rückantwort: "Newman-L Mailing List" An: "Newman-L Mailing List" * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * THE ENERGY MACHINE OF JOSEPH NEWMAN 11445 East Via Linda, Suite 2416 Scottsdale, Arizona 85259 (602) 657-3722 josephnewman@earthlink.net www.josephnewman.com FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE (May 17, 1999) THE "AMP-TURN" SO-CALLED "LAW" IS NOT A LAW OF NATURE! This past week a caring physicist from the Department of Energy of a foreign country invested several days with myself and my life's work for humanity. I do not provide his name in this news release due to the scum-cowards and "mouthpieces for the power brokers" who would seek to unjustly attack him. For all honest and truly caring individuals, the following is his personal testimonial which he prepared following our meeting: "NEW SOURCE OF ENERGY FROM E = mc^2 --- SAFE, INEXPENSIVE, AND NON-POLLUTING "Enrico Fermi, utilizing 400 tons of radioactive material, produced a tiny 0.5 watts energy output which has started the nuclear race with all its misery - the threat of human annihilation, worldwide nuclear waste disposal problems, etc. With no fancy equipment, Joseph Newman --- as witnessed and verified by me --- is now producing with his Newman Energy Machine, for everyone to come and witness, a 1.2 horsepower (890 W) output when a 40 lb. shaft force is applied and with only a power input of a mere 477W (1.2 A, 389 V). That is a power conversion efficiency of more than 100%. The extra 413 W generated could thus only come from a similar mass energy conversion, but thousands of times more efficient than Fermi's nuclear reactor (Fermi 0.5 W from 400 tons vs. Newman 413 W from 400 lbs. of material). In comparison, a 400-ton Newman Energy Machine should then be able to sustain a force of 80,000 lbs on its shaft with a power input of less than 477 Watts. "Joseph Newman also clearly demonstrated to me that the so-called "Amp Turn Law" was not a law. I witnessed 0.2 A drawn by the Newman Energy Machine motor coil and the motor would not rotate (12 Volts applied, 2.4 W). When the current drawn by the Newman Energy Machine motor coil was 20 times less (0.01 A) (coil turns the same), the Newman Energy Machine starts to rotate (50 Volts applied, 0.5 W). The power output was significantly more when 50 Volts was applied. This demonstration clearly convinced me that the Newman Energy Machine runs on Volts and not on Amps as taught and told by Joseph Newman; not Amps, but Mass (mc^2), and the greater the Mass, the greater the power output. "Applying 6.75 W (4.5 A, 1.5 V) to a conventional modern electric motor rated at an efficiency of 80% and more, and geared down for max torque, I could easily with one hand stop its rotation while the power (6.75 W) was being applied. By contrast, when applying only 0.5 W (50 V, 0.01 A) to the 400 lb. Newman Energy Machine, I could not --- even with both hands -- stop the Newman Energy Machine from rotating. "This was all witnessed and verified by me, and yet no one, not even Joseph Newman's neighbors, are rushing to witness this technology. People knowing this and not doing something about it are simply guilty of a crime of humanity. The Newman Energy Machine utilizes mass and voltage pressure to produce this nearly 100% mass to energy conversion. Amps -- for which we pay -- are of no significance to the operation of the Energy Machine. "The Newman Energy Machine can easily be constructed from inexpensive materials (waste iron, aluminum) which makes it affordable for all people of the earth. The electricity produced by the Newman Energy Machine is also cheap as it does not run on amps (for which we now pay), but on mass and voltage. This cheap electricity can then be also utilized to clean up the environment. "To construct two Newman Energy Machine manufacturing plants, an initial investment of $5 million (U.S.) is required. From the impact of this technology will have on humanity, this is an insignificant amount. "The dream of a real, inexpensive, and sustainable electricity and clean water for all -- no more electricity peak load problems, no supply and demand problems, no more air, water, and land pollution -- can now become reality. All it needs is the foresight, love for Humanity, and giving God the glory for having given Joseph Newman the wisdom and endurance to develop the Newman Energy Machine for the well-being of all mankind." [Signed] Physicist (Hons BSc Physics) Department of Energy 14 May 1999 _________________________________ Comments by Joseph Newman: As you can imagine, it was a great pleasure to have a sincere physicist (and someone who truly seeks to understand the magnitude of Mass and E = mc^2) come and speak with me at this critical time of history. This physicist readily agreed with my Mechanical Gyroscopic Particle Explanation of Matter and its significant benefit to humanity. The day before he came to visit my laboratory, I received the following letter which made me feel good and exemplifies why every honest person should obtain a copy of the recently-produced video tape (90 min.). Once again, this individual's name is omitted for the obvious reason of power broker reprisal. _________________________________ From: Overseas To: Joseph Newman, 11445 E. Via Linda Suite 2415 Scottsdale, Arizona 85259 "Dear Joseph: "Firstly, hello. My name is ________________. I work for an Overseas Customs Service and I screen mail daily to try to intercept narcotics, porn, etc. I came across your video going to _________________. I watched the video and was both VERY impressed and depressed. "You look to me like a very good man. A rarity in the world. I was so impressed and excited about your invention --- and sickened by the pathetic forces hindering you. "I believe you and I believe your invention which would help the poor more than the rich, and that's why the powerful do not allow it. "Could you imagine the power that third world countries would acquire with your technology? It would affect billions of people. I believe the U.S. government is scared and paranoid. I wish I had money enough to donate to your cause. This is just a simple note thanking you for your perseverance --- please don't lose hope. This is your life's calling. Even though you may feel hurt and tarnished by dark forces, just remember the big picture. Many, many, many great men have suffered hardship and ridicule --- but in the end we know that they fought a virtuous war and were great. "Good luck in your endeavors. You can't keep a good idea down forever. You will win. Thank you." [Signed] Customs Agent _________________________________ Comments by Joseph Newman: People: WAKE UP! I should be obvious to you why the scum mouthpieces for the power brokers do everything they can in an attempt to keep you, the People, from supporting the production of my life's work for you and all humanity: THEY DON'T WANT YOU, THE PEOPLE, TO HAVE IT! TO ALL THE GOOD PEOPLE: I FIGHT FOR YOU. JOIN ME AS THE ABOVE-TWO CREDIBLE INDIVIDUALS DID LAST WEEK. TOGETHER WE WILL WIN! Sincerely, [Signed] Joseph Westley Newman (602) 657-3722 P. S. Don't be "guilty" of being part "OF A CRIME OF HUMANITY." The caring physicist described above was dining with my family at a local restaurant one evening and he stated, "The first thing they are going to ask me when I return overseas is, 'Does it work?'" Then he BROKE OUT INTO A BIG, HAPPY GRIN ACROSS HIS FACE WITH HIS EYES TWINKLING WITH HAPPINESS! I URGE YOU TO BE HAPPY AND GRIN WITH HIM AND HELP AS HE IS DOING WITH ALL HIS HEART AT THIS VERY INSTANT. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 15:40:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA18800; Tue, 18 May 1999 15:38:49 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 15:38:49 -0700 Message-ID: <000d01bea17f$4dec4180$a9b1fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: VACE & Toroids. Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 17:39:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"VvF3X3.0.ab4.ulUGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10594 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Thanks to the generosity of Colin Quinney we have that feeling of "Being a Day Late" or "A Dollar Short" After going over "Report on VACE Experiments" by Thomas E. Phipps, Jr. we can say we have a good picture of what is happening in our "Toroid A-Field" experiments. Our experimental apparatus seems rather extreme when compared to the setup used by Mr. Phipps. In addition his testing allowed for a stable continuos measurement platform, not at all like our high current shrot pulse (discharge) tests. Reading the VACE paper combined with our testing has presented of us a plethora of new ideas. For those of you testing the pulsed toroids we can only say stop all work until you can read the VACE experiments. Much time will be saved and a little imagination will open windows far greater than would be done otherwise. Thanks again to Colin and Mr. Phipps, this is great work and should be made as public as can be done to show the folly in many of our teachings. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 17:33:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA24008; Tue, 18 May 1999 17:32:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 17:32:56 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990518160941.211fee66@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 16:09:41 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Toroid Update Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"3r2SV.0.1t5.tQWGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10595 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi All, >At 02:31 PM 5/17/99 -0700, Kyle wrote: >>atglab wrote: >>> >>> We have added some updated information to http://www.atgroup.org/field.htm >>> >>> Seems like some of our co-experimenters are having trouble duplicating >>> similar results, so we have added another test for them to try. >I have started experiments with a single toroid coil and a capacitor pulser. >Yes, I can get the toroid to "twitch", but do not know how much is "conventional". Today I covered my toroid windings in epoxy so that there would be no or very little movement between turns. The twitching od the toroid is now almost non existent. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 21:28:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA30481; Tue, 18 May 1999 21:28:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 21:28:15 -0700 Message-ID: <3742394C.84BFBB66@infovia.com.ar> Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 01:08:45 -0300 From: jdelac X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [es] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: VACE & Toroids. References: <000d01bea17f$4dec4180$a9b1fea9@y9g6r3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"fcIQN2.0.AS7.VtZGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10596 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Good!...where I could take this "VACE experiment"? atglab escribió: > Thanks to the generosity of Colin Quinney we have that feeling of "Being a > Day Late" or "A Dollar Short" > > After going over "Report on VACE Experiments" by Thomas E. Phipps, Jr. we > can say we have a good picture of what is happening in our "Toroid A-Field" > experiments. Our experimental apparatus seems rather extreme when compared > to the setup used by Mr. Phipps. In addition his testing allowed for a > stable continuos measurement platform, not at all like our high current > shrot pulse (discharge) tests. > > Reading the VACE paper combined with our testing has presented of us a > plethora of new ideas. > > For those of you testing the pulsed toroids we can only say stop all work > until you can read the VACE experiments. Much time will be saved and a > little imagination will open windows far greater than would be done > otherwise. > > Thanks again to Colin and Mr. Phipps, this is great work and should be made > as public as can be done to show the folly in many of our teachings. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 18 22:02:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA06198; Tue, 18 May 1999 22:00:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 22:00:46 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: VACE & Toroids. Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 01:04:42 -0400 Message-ID: <19990519050442812.AAA249@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"6q8Cg2.0.lW1.-LaGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10597 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hello there, >Thanks to the generosity of Colin Quinney we have that feeling of "Being a >Day Late" or "A Dollar Short" >Thanks again to Colin and Mr. Phipps, this is great work and should be made >as public as can be done to show the folly in many of our teachings. I haven't read the VACE paper, but I was curious to know if it mentioned whether or not Mr. Phipps has tried the laser test. This could be very important. Also, I wanted to say that you should not feel bad about prior art. The fun is in the discovery, and I, for one, learned a lot from reading about your experiments. I wrote to Gary Hawkins, and asked if he had published anything about the experiment he had done, and that I had mentioned a few days ago. He said that he wrote up an article about it, and that it was published in Extraordinary Science Magazine in 1996, but he couldn't remember the month. If any of you get this magazine, or if you know an URL where it may be found, I'd like to see the report. I hate to bother Gary again, as I know he is usually quite busy. The experiment was a real mind blower. It left me stunned when I saw the results, although I think I now know what may be at play here. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 03:24:46 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA32247; Wed, 19 May 1999 03:24:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 03:24:25 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990519182416.00ab7a60@cyllene.uwa.edu.au> X-Sender: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 18:24:16 +0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: John Winterflood Subject: Re: VACE & Toroids. In-Reply-To: <000d01bea17f$4dec4180$a9b1fea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"f6nhT1.0.it7.O5fGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10598 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atglab wrote: >... >After going over "Report on VACE Experiments" by Thomas E. Phipps, Jr >... >...stop all work until you can read the VACE experiments. Where did this article appear? or any suggestions as to how a copy can be obtained? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 08:31:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA07832; Wed, 19 May 1999 08:27:45 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 08:27:45 -0700 Message-ID: <039001bea20a$d4201e80$66e288d0@paul> From: "Paul Delisle" To: "Free Energy List" Subject: Dennis Lee free energy device Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 10:18:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"NzSae.0.Hw1.nXjGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10599 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi All, I just attended a talk given by a distributor that works for Dennis Lee's company. He told us about the free energy device and how they intend to soon (this summer) flood the US with these free energy devices. The distributor had a superficial knowledge of free energy and some of the arguments that he brought didn't seem to make sense to me. Then we were shown a tape where Dennis Lee explains in detail the principle of the device. We had to sign a non-disclosure agreement so I can't give you the details but it is enough to say that it's basically a heat pump. This was invented by someone name Fischer and he has a patent for this invention. I will go on the IBM patent server and see what I can find on this. The tape was definitely more convincing that the speech from the distributor. The principle is simple. I would however like to hear the comments of someone who knows more on this subject. He then showed three prototypes that they have build so far. The last prototype was much smaller and similar to the one they are planning to distribute. The device will supposedly produce 100kW/h. That's a lot of power. It runs on CO2 and uses of the shelf hydraulic motor and parts. The distributor told us that it is possible to go in New Jersey and see the prototype at work. I am always interested when people have something to show other than words. >From what I can see most people don't seem to think that Dennis is very honest. I don't know him and it is possible that he hasn't delivered as promised in the past. But I think it's worth while to check this out and see if the machine really works. The rest is secondary. Bill Beaty I think said that in his long career of searching for free energy he has never seen anything that works. That is a very troubling statement. I don't believe that all the free energy devices that we hear about work but on the other hand I find it equally difficult to believe that none of them works either. Those are the two extremes of the range and as we know the truth is more often somewhere in between. No free energy device that works. Well here is one that I am pretty sure works. Dr. Paulo Correa from Canada has invented a device that is many times overunity. He has filed three patents (5416391, 5449989, 5502354) on it and he will demonstrate to any serious investors. The overunity results are clearly stated in the patent. Dr. Correa is a long time researcher and seem to be a very good and reputable scientist. He has made public demonstration of his device and the results have been verified by knowledgeable people. I have talked to him on the phone about 6 months ago and he was looking for funding to commercialize the device. I don't think that the real problem is in finding a free energy device that works. There is probably a lot of these. The problem is with the collective consciousness of our society. As long as greed and fear still dominate the direction of our actions it will be very difficult to bring free energy devices to the mass level. There is too many interest in keeping the technology that we have now. But hopefully things will change in the coming years. Regards, Paul Delisle From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 08:33:07 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA10134; Wed, 19 May 1999 08:32:52 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 08:32:52 -0700 Message-ID: <000801bea20c$f7a2c720$1659fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: VACE & Toroids. Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 10:33:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"ASAJj3.0.FU2.ZcjGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10600 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: -From: jdelac To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Tuesday, May 18, 1999 11:34 PM Subject: Re: VACE & Toroids. >Good!...where I could take this "VACE experiment"? > >atglab escribió: > The article was published in "Galilean Electrodynamics", Jan/Feb 1999. The title is "Report on VACE Experiments, by Thomas E. Phipps, Jr. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 08:36:26 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA12591; Wed, 19 May 1999 08:36:12 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 08:36:12 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990519071258.237793c4@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 07:12:58 To: William Beaty From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Bill B. in Boston Globe monday Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"CVJN_2.0.d43.hfjGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10601 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: RO X-Status: Hi Bill and all, At 09:35 AM 5/18/99 -0700, you wrote: > >I was interviewed recently about my "misconceptions in textbooks" website, >and the result just appeared yesterday in the health/science section of >the Boston Globe. The online version is here: > > 5/17/99 Boston Globe article > http://www.globe.com/dailyglobe2/137/science/Textbooks_flunk_out+.shtml > http://www.amasci.com/miscon/miscon.html > >If interested, check it out soon, since it's only supposed to be viewable >for a couple of days (after that you have to pay $$) > Thanks again for your articles. I have passed the url's to some friends. In some cases, the textbooks may be partially right. For example, in one sense a common dry cell "supplies" (and absorbs) electrons, as opposed to a generator "pump". Simplified equations: At the negative terminal Zn ->Zn++ +2e- And at the positive terminal 2e- +2Cl -> 2Cl-. The chloride ions migrate to the negative terminal to form ZnCl(2). So the current through the battery is in the form of ions, and the electrons from the negative terminal are provided from the zinc, not "recirculated" from the cloride ions. When the metallic zinc is used up, the battery is dead. Of course the dry cell as a whole is neutral, just like a "charged" capacitor. Another bothersome aspect in science teaching is the politics. For example, the mathematicallycorrect site describes an algebra book where the first algebra equation doesn't appear until past page 100!. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 09:14:54 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA25438; Wed, 19 May 1999 09:12:08 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 09:12:08 -0700 From: HLafonte@aol.com Message-ID: Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 12:08:47 EDT Subject: Important link added to site To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"ATi5w3.0.KD6.NBkGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10603 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: A link to better describe the spin balance system has been added to my site. Thanks, Butch LaFonte LaFonte Research site 1 or http://hometown.aol.com/hlafonte/index.html From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 09:28:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA13524; Wed, 19 May 1999 09:26:45 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 09:26:45 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3742BAE5.5255@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 09:21:41 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Tenguska Aim/plant coil References: <926737577.1600.630@excite.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"oFtSa2.0.AJ3.3PkGt"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10604 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Harvey Norris wrote: > > On Fri, 14 May 1999 12:14:23 PDT, flytch er wrote: > > > On July 2nd 1994 I did some experimentation that may have led to > some > > >unusual effects. I am somewhat convinced that I caused a power outage, There is a web site http://www4.ocws.com/model12_ITS_article.htm with a dual tesla coil system sharing primaries. Their tesla-coils and all the associated gadgetry are beautifully made. Alik S. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 14:47:50 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA30485; Wed, 19 May 1999 14:45:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 14:45:17 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: VACE & Toroids. Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 17:49:16 -0400 Message-ID: <19990519214916640.AAA263@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"i0Xl23.0.ES7.j3pGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10605 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: atlab wrote: >We never feel bad, rather just wish time could have been applied in a way >considered productive rather than some duplication. Our work was based on >the idea of Rick Andersen and we had no idea the Ampere around 1822 had a >good understanding of what seems to be taking place here. Think of it, 1822 >and people are still doing it over and over. The way we spend our time is important, and learning by doing is an excellent way to spend time. It forces us to make observations and think, which is something that is not taught very well in schools, I'm afraid. In every society since the dawn of time, there have been people who have acquired knowledge, and used it to control the time and destiny of large groups of other people. Those types of individuals would rather that we don't think, just to make their lives easier. Examples in the present day are politicians, lawyers, and marketeers. I think that there are many things that were discovered hundreds and even thousands of years ago that are only now being re-discovered, due to this societal mechanism of knowledge supression. I also think that the internet is a kind of flukey catalyst for knowledge development, re-discovery, and distribution that we are lucky to be a part of. I think of the internet almost as a survival tool, anymore. It's quite possible that we may not have it forever, or that our abilitites to express ourselves, and share these learning experiences might be curtailed at some point. So much for that 8^) Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 15:00:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA01853; Wed, 19 May 1999 14:58:58 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 14:58:58 -0700 X-Sender: bailey@shell14.ba.best.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 14:59:40 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com (Freengr List) From: pgb@padrak.com (Patrick Bailey) Subject: June 27-28 AntiGravity Conf. File Updated Resent-Message-ID: <"VyX4y.0.sS.XGpGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10606 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: The announcement website file has been updated for the: AntiGravity Conference scheduled for June 27-28 in Reno, Nevada: http://www.padrak.com/agn/AGNCONF99.html (Caps. sensitive!) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat Apr 10 08:55:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA14954 for bilb@eskimo.com; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 08:55:40 -0700 Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 08:55:40 -0700 X-Envelope-From: pbfred@choice.net Sat Apr 10 08:55:39 1999 Received: from mail1.choice.net (mail1.choice.net [209.173.128.106]) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA14928 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 08:55:39 -0700 Received: from fredcraft (p35.access1.cvg.choice.net [209.173.142.35]) by mail1.choice.net (ChoiceDotNet 513-723-8330) with SMTP id LAA15819 for ; Sat, 10 Apr 1999 11:55:32 -0400 (EDT) From: "Peter Fred" To: Subject: Full disclosure of my device and Ordered Freedom theory Old-Date: Sat, 10 Apr 1999 11:51:28 -0400 Message-ID: <000701be8369$ffaec0c0$4d8eadd1@fredcraft> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2377.0 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.0810.800 X-Diagnostic: Not on the accept list X-Envelope-To: freenrg-l Status: RO X-Status: Hello, I believe you worked on the Podkletnov effect and had your results published on Pete Skegg's web site. I have a gravity theory which I believe is related to the Podkletnov effect. I have kept my work confidential because I had hoped to some how get a patent on my device that is related to my theory. It took me two years to get a ~4.0% weight loss that I believe is not spurious. Now I am trying to get other to replicate my results. Hopefully in time somewhere down the road a decent anti gravity device will be reduced to practice with a sort of public group effort. You might be interested in my device and my theory which are described at my web site which is at http://ww4.choice.net/~pbfred/ Regards Peter Fred From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 15:35:35 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA13800; Wed, 19 May 1999 15:34:47 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 15:34:47 -0700 Message-ID: <19990519223517.6883.rocketmail@web113.yahoomail.com> Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 15:35:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerry Wayne Decker Subject: Re: Dennis Lee free energy device To: Free Energy List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"-dFfH.0.XN3.6opGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10607 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Paul et al! I think its time to nudge 60 minutes and some of the news shows into action to show this wondrous device......Dan Rather will clear up all the smoke. ----------------- --- Paul Delisle wrote: > Hi All, > > I just attended a talk given by a distributor that > works for Dennis > Lee's company. He told us about the free energy > device and how they > intend to soon (this summer) flood the US with these > free energy > devices. > > The distributor had a superficial knowledge of free > energy and some of > the arguments that he brought didn't seem to make > sense to me. Then we > were shown a tape where Dennis Lee explains in > detail the principle of > the device. We had to sign a non-disclosure > agreement so I can't give > you the details but it is enough to say that it's > basically a heat pump. > This was invented by someone name Fischer and he has > a patent for this > invention. I will go on the IBM patent server and > see what I can find on > this. > > The tape was definitely more convincing that the > speech from the > distributor. The principle is simple. I would > however like to hear the > comments of someone who knows more on this subject. > He then showed three > prototypes that they have build so far. The last > prototype was much > smaller and similar to the one they are planning to > distribute. The > device will supposedly produce 100kW/h. That's a lot > of power. It runs > on CO2 and uses of the shelf hydraulic motor and > parts. > > The distributor told us that it is possible to go in > New Jersey and see > the prototype at work. I am always interested when > people have something > to show other than words. > > From what I can see most people don't seem to think > that Dennis is very > honest. I don't know him and it is possible that he > hasn't delivered as > promised in the past. But I think it's worth while > to check this out and > see if the machine really works. The rest is > secondary. > > Bill Beaty I think said that in his long career of > searching for free > energy he has never seen anything that works. That > is a very troubling > statement. I don't believe that all the free energy > devices that we hear > about work but on the other hand I find it equally > difficult to believe > that none of them works either. Those are the two > extremes of the range > and as we know the truth is more often somewhere in > between. > > No free energy device that works. Well here is one > that I am pretty sure > works. Dr. Paulo Correa from Canada has invented a > device that is many > times overunity. He has filed three patents > (5416391, 5449989, 5502354) > on it and he will demonstrate to any serious > investors. The overunity > results are clearly stated in the patent. Dr. Correa > is a long time > researcher and seem to be a very good and reputable > scientist. He has > made public demonstration of his device and the > results have been > verified by knowledgeable people. I have talked to > him on the phone > about 6 months ago and he was looking for funding to > commercialize the > device. > > I don't think that the real problem is in finding a > free energy device > that works. There is probably a lot of these. The > problem is with the > collective consciousness of our society. As long as > greed and fear still > dominate the direction of our actions it will be > very difficult to bring > free energy devices to the mass level. There is too > many interest in > keeping the technology that we have now. But > hopefully things will > change in the coming years. > > Regards, > Paul Delisle > > === ================================= Please respond to jdecker@keelynet.com as I am writing from my work email of jwdatwork@yahoo.com.........thanks! ================================= _____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 15:50:51 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA17117; Wed, 19 May 1999 15:48:36 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 15:48:36 -0700 From: broompilot@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 15:52:20 -0700 Subject: Re: Microwave Stuff ...ENOUGH ALREADY!!! Message-ID: <19990519.155226.-70945.3.broompilot@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 2.0.11 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-17,19-27,29-30,32,34-38,40-45,47-51 X-Juno-Att: 0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"l7HdP2.0.IB4.3_pGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10608 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hello Folks, On Mon, 17 May 1999 18:50:40 EDT Grod123456@aol.com writes: >This will be my only reply on this subject: And hello Rod. Now that I know your name, I now know to whom I am about to apologize. My complaint about your complaint was not about subject matter. It was about no name and not enough info about your complaint. Your "only reply on this subject:" covered everything I needed to know about your complaint. I appreciate it. If you had posted this one instead of the original one, you would have heard something quite different from me, if anything at all. If I had not (at that point) been up for 30 hours straight and not been downing antihistamines and decongestants, I would not have been fatigued, brain-dead and giddy. And, consequently, I would not have been so energetic or abusive in my complaint about your complaint. So Rod, to you especially, and to any one else on the list that my ranting caused discomfort, I APOLOGIZE! Actually, Rod I agree with you about the "I agree with you" only posts and especially the ones that also include the post the person is agreeing with that takes 10 seconds to scroll down. GRRRRRR. Now that I have gotten some sleep and have backed off on the drugs, I notice that several of my posts fit not only the type of post you complained about, but also my own idea of what should not get to be excessive. Oooops.............So much for integrity, eh? Humor (at least that is what I call it) is a natural major part of my personality. I can't help it and I choose not to. I see now, however, that I *can* choose a different e-mail address (i.e...not the list) when I get a tickle to follow up with the non-vital stuff. Point taken..lesson learned. Thanks. By the way, I am all ears when it comes to folks wanting to talk about their projects. Even stuff I am not personally pursuing. I find that some times somebody will say something way off my interests that resonates from left field and causes inspiration that I might not have had. Anyway, Take Care All.............David ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 15:57:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA20084; Wed, 19 May 1999 15:56:38 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 15:56:38 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Dennis Lee free energy device Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 22:56:01 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <374340c5.76518174@mail-hub> References: <039001bea20a$d4201e80$66e288d0@paul> In-Reply-To: <039001bea20a$d4201e80$66e288d0@paul> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id PAA20050 Resent-Message-ID: <"9cYoZ1.0.jv4.b6qGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10609 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Wed, 19 May 1999 10:18:18 -0500, Paul Delisle wrote: [snip] >smaller and similar to the one they are planning to distribute. The >device will supposedly produce 100kW/h. That's a lot of power. It runs [snip] No, actually it's a rate of change in power. A lot of power would be 100 kW. Even then it depends on the price of the device. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 16:31:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA30120; Wed, 19 May 1999 16:30:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 16:30:56 -0700 Message-ID: <37434A77.F3749C99@erie.net> Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 19:34:15 -0400 From: Norm Biss X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Eric Krieg's response to the Dennis Lee Motor Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------9A99F136D7471DEF0191B80C" Resent-Message-ID: <"wTaF33.0.XM7.lcqGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10610 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------9A99F136D7471DEF0191B80C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello all, Eric Krieg has asked me to post the following response to the Dennis Lee FE motor claims. Thank You. Norm Biss Erie, Pa. 5-19-99 --------------9A99F136D7471DEF0191B80C Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from voicenet.com (mail12.voicenet.com [207.103.0.6]) by moose.erie.net (8.9.2/8.9.1) with SMTP id TAA26558 for ; Wed, 19 May 1999 19:17:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 6933 invoked from network); 19 May 1999 23:17:19 -0000 Received: from dialup921-pri.voicenet.com (HELO voicenet.com) (207.103.117.149) by mail12.voicenet.com with SMTP; 19 May 1999 23:17:19 -0000 Message-ID: <37434684.4B0F4C5F@voicenet.com> Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 19:17:24 -0400 From: Eric Krieg Reply-To: eric@voicenet.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.06 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Norm Biss Subject: Please post to the FE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 In response to Paul's account of the Dennis Lee tape. I have offered Dennis Lee $50,000 for proof of a heat based free energy machine - his only real response is to threaten a lawsuit and promise I will never be allowed near the device. As far as I know , the second law of thermodynamics clearly forbid such a device from operating. The following page gives a good overview of related physics: http://www.syc.org/e/skeptic/frenfaq.htm Dennis (like Newman) - mostly offers conspiracy theory, requests for money, mutilated science, pathetic demonstrations, claims of revelation from God and countless other distractions. Both sell tapes purportedly offering proof. - I'm sorry, FE (free e nergy) is something that qualified people would have to assess in person (were they allowed). Insiders have told me Dennis's device does the Newman trick of using external power with only a verbal assurance of being greater than output power. A real FE d evice would not rely on external power but rather feed back any needed input power from output power once running. Like Newman, Lee claims to ship such devices in a month or two - and has been promising as much for over 10 years. I feel bad for ignorant people who have paid as much as $100,000 for Dennis Lee dealerships and are now being asked to get their whole churches to invest money. More information is available on Dennis from: http://www.phact.org/e/dennis.html -- Eric Krieg eric@phact.org http://www.phact.org/e/more.htm --------------9A99F136D7471DEF0191B80C-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 17:14:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA09925; Wed, 19 May 1999 17:14:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 17:14:11 -0700 Message-Id: <4.1.19990519201044.00960620@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: rymel@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 20:11:27 -0400 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rymel Subject: Perpetual Lamps In-Reply-To: <37434A77.F3749C99@erie.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"zyhwG1.0.-Q2.IFrGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10611 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Does anyone know anything about perpetual lamps? Have they foudn anything on how it burns for so long? What the fuel is? From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 17:35:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA16490; Wed, 19 May 1999 17:35:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 17:35:11 -0700 Message-ID: <37434A3D.C8EB6D6@harti.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 01:33:17 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, Paul Delisle Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P. Correa ? References: <039001bea20a$d4201e80$66e288d0@paul> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"o58-G3.0.V14.-YrGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10612 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Paul Delisle schrieb: > > Hi All, > > I just attended a talk given by a distributor that works for Dennis > Lee's company. snip... > The > device will supposedly produce 100kW/h. That's a lot of power. It runs > on CO2 and uses of the shelf hydraulic motor and parts. Kai Schaeffer: kschaeffer@schaeffer-apparatebau.de This guy´s father knows a lot of CO2 machines that violate the second law of thermodynamics ! He has built a few himself but is now working on a 2 gas mixture of N2 and Butan which also can directly convert heat energy into mechanical energy without a cold pole. Kai Schaeffer: kschaeffer@schaeffer-apparatebau.de -snip.. > Dr. Correa is a long time > researcher and seem to be a very good and reputable scientist. He has > made public demonstration of his device and the results have been > verified by knowledgeable people. I have talked to him on the phone > about 6 months ago and he was looking for funding to commercialize the > device. Where did he make the public demos ? Why does he not do more demos ? I am convinced that he is having something real, but he should be more open to show it around ! Does he sell any video tape of it ? > As long as greed and fear still > dominate the direction of our actions it will be very difficult to bring > free energy devices to the mass level. Is he too greedy to give it away for free or at least share some knowledge , so others could replicate it and verify it ? Maybe you can call him again and ask, what his latest news is ? > Regards, > Paul Delisle Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 17:48:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA20430; Wed, 19 May 1999 17:48:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 17:48:25 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Perpetual Lamps Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 20:52:18 -0400 Message-ID: <19990520005218750.AAA165@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"Khc4s3.0.7_4.PlrGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10613 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Does anyone know anything about perpetual lamps? Have they foudn anything >on how it burns for so long? What the fuel is? There was something that I ran across the other day, and I didn't bookmark it, but it can be found, probably, by searching Fusion lamp or fusion light. The DOE has funded it, as well as EPRI, I believe. It's quite a remarkable lamp that is, for now, microwave powered. The bulb contains sulfur and argon, if I remember correctly, and one lamp puts out the equivilent in light of hundreds regular incandescent lamps. It has to be air cooled at the moment, but it is in service in a few trial places. The microwave driver is supposed to be replaced by a solid state device in the near future, alleviating some of the concerns relating to the use of microwaves. Interestingly enough, the lamp is so powerful that one of the main challenges is how to distribute the light inn buildings. Light pipes are employed in some installations, and mirrors in others. There is also a dimmer option available, but it would be the equivilent of dimming all of the light in an entire building if it is employed. It presents some surprising, but not insurmountable engineering problems. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 17:57:15 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA24224; Wed, 19 May 1999 17:56:51 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 17:56:51 -0700 X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhRsPNk4MF9V2uj0tl3x1pyxUP350QIUKVgqLM6NtmCoTJm0ihJ4hel6AKo= From: B777b77@webtv.net (R B) Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 19:56:48 -0500 (EST) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Perpetual Lamps Message-ID: <755-37435DD0-78@postoffice-122.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: Rymel 's message of Wed, 19 May 1999 20:11:27 -0400 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary=WebTV-Mail-1236718569-42 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Resent-Message-ID: <"Tnf822.0.Lw5.JtrGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10614 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: --WebTV-Mail-1236718569-42 Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Read some about it in a book; Perpetual motion : the history of an obsession Arthur W. J. G. Ord-Hume From what I remember no existing examples though. The book tells the most famous accounts of them. The book is out of print but maybe your library has a copy. What was interesting though in the book was the two bells that have been ringing for years under a glass dome. Check it out! --WebTV-Mail-1236718569-42 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Message/RFC822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Received: from mailsorter-101-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net (209.240.198.97) by postoffice-121.bryant.webtv.net; Wed, 19 May 1999 17:18:45 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from mx1.eskimo.com (mx1.eskimo.com [204.122.16.48]) by mailsorter-101-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.graham.14Aug97) with ESMTP id RAA15634 for ; Wed, 19 May 1999 17:18:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA09932; Wed, 19 May 1999 17:14:12 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 17:14:12 -0700 Message-Id: <4.1.19990519201044.00960620@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: rymel@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 20:11:27 -0400 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rymel Subject: Perpetual Lamps In-Reply-To: <37434A77.F3749C99@erie.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"zyhwG1.0.-Q2.IFrGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10611 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Does anyone know anything about perpetual lamps? Have they foudn anything on how it burns for so long? What the fuel is? --WebTV-Mail-1236718569-42-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 18:22:19 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA31133; Wed, 19 May 1999 18:21:51 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 18:21:51 -0700 Message-Id: <199905200121.AA00191@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> From: Motoe Suzuki Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 10:21:42 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P. Correa ? In-Reply-To: <37434A3D.C8EB6D6@harti.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AL-Mail32 Version 1.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"N-6-S1.0.Mc7.kEsGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10615 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, All I have myself conducted some experiments with the aim to reproduce the Correa's experiments and findings, but totally in vain. I have found some serious problems or contradictions in the reports and patent descriptions which have been disclosed by Correa himself, and I have come to conclude that he still conceals something very essential to succeed the experiment. But I have no intension to blame Correa. Now, I agree completely to Stefan's response below. Best regards, Sirase > >> Dr. Correa is a long time >> researcher and seem to be a very good and reputable scientist. He has >> made public demonstration of his device and the results have been >> verified by knowledgeable people. I have talked to him on the phone >> about 6 months ago and he was looking for funding to commercialize the >> device. > Stefan Hartmann wrote: >Where did he make the public demos ? >Why does he not do more demos ? > >I am convinced that he is having something real, but he should be more >open to show it around ! Does he sell any video tape of it ? > >Is he too greedy to give it away for free or at least share some knowledge, > so others could replicate it and verify it ? > >Maybe you can call him again and ask, what his latest news is ? > >Regards, Stefan. > ///////// From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 19:34:09 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA26897; Wed, 19 May 1999 19:33:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 19:33:32 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Perpetual Lamps Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 22:37:28 -0400 Message-ID: <19990520023728453.AAA173@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"NqgPJ2.0.Aa6.xHtGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10616 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >Does anyone know anything about perpetual lamps? Have they foudn anything >on how it burns for so long? What the fuel is? I found the url: http://www.sulfurlamp.com/index.htm Another interesting thing about the lamp is the broad spectrum of light it gives off. It's quite a breakthrough, actually. Check it out. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 19:35:55 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA27900; Wed, 19 May 1999 19:35:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 19:35:26 -0700 Message-Id: <199905200235.AA00192@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> From: Motoe Suzuki Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 11:35:20 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P.Correa ? MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AL-Mail32 Version 1.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"l04cM1.0.rp6.jJtGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10617 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi, All >>There were some mistakes in my previous mail, so I corrected them and posted again here.<< I have myself conducted some experiments with the aim to reproduce the Correa's experiments and findings, but totally in vain. I have found some serious problems or contradictions in the reports and patent descriptions which have been disclosed by Correa himself, and I have come to conclude that he still conceals something very essential to have a succees in the experiment. But I have no intention to blame Correa. Now, I agree completely to Stefan's response below. Best regards, Sirase > >> Dr. Correa is a long time >> researcher and seem to be a very good and reputable scientist. He has >> made public demonstration of his device and the results have been >> verified by knowledgeable people. I have talked to him on the phone >> about 6 months ago and he was looking for funding to commercialize the >> device. > Stefan Hartmann wrote: >Where did he make the public demos ? >Why does he not do more demos ? > >I am convinced that he is having something real, but he should be more >open to show it around ! Does he sell any video tape of it ? > >Is he too greedy to give it away for free or at least share some knowledge, > so others could replicate it and verify it ? > >Maybe you can call him again and ask, what his latest news is ? > >Regards, Stefan. > ///////// From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 20:37:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA10178; Wed, 19 May 1999 20:37:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 20:37:23 -0700 Message-Id: <4.1.19990519233408.00963470@pop.mindspring.com> X-Sender: rymel@pop.mindspring.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.1 Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 23:34:45 -0400 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Rymel Subject: Re: Perpetual Lamps In-Reply-To: <19990520023728453.AAA173@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"nsP993.0.sU2.pDuGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10618 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: thanks for the link, Mike. Do you know if it's possible to make one on your own? >I found the url: http://www.sulfurlamp.com/index.htm > >Another interesting thing about the lamp is the broad spectrum of light it >gives off. It's quite a breakthrough, actually. Check it out. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 21:07:40 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA17488; Wed, 19 May 1999 21:07:22 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 21:07:22 -0700 From: Keasy@aol.com Message-ID: <3a25ab12.2474e42a@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 00:06:02 EDT Subject: Re: Toroid Update To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 246 Resent-Message-ID: <"DUZcu.0.9H4.wfuGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10619 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/18/99 5:34:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time, ddameron@earthlink.net writes: << Today I covered my toroid windings in epoxy so that there would be no or very little movement between turns. The twitching od the toroid is now almost non existent. -Dave >> Interesting --- but it sounds rather strange. If all you effected was the toroids and the wires on them, the overall motion of the toroids should be in no significant way effected (if one believes conventional physics). Or was the "twitching" that was seen relative motion between the two toroids? I thought I understood the motion most everyone was reporting was of the two toroids moving together. Or, could the epoxy have changed how the leads to the toroid were mechanically coupled to the driving electronics? Ken From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 19 22:04:46 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA31460; Wed, 19 May 1999 22:03:50 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 22:03:50 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990519204039.21e7ab92@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 20:40:39 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: Toroid Update In-Reply-To: <3a25ab12.2474e42a@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"57lpL2.0.Th7.sUvGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10620 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Ken and all, At 12:06 AM 5/20/99 EDT, you wrote: >In a message dated 5/18/99 5:34:28 PM Pacific Daylight Time, >ddameron@earthlink.net writes: ><< > Today I covered my toroid windings in epoxy so that there would be no or > very little movement between turns. The twitching od the toroid is now > almost non existent. > -Dave > > >> > >Interesting --- but it sounds rather strange. If all you effected was the >toroids and the wires on them, the overall motion of the toroids should be >in no significant way effected (if one believes conventional physics). Or >was the "twitching" that was seen relative motion between the two toroids? I >thought I understood the motion most everyone was reporting was of the two >toroids moving together. Or, could the epoxy have changed how the leads to >the toroid were mechanically coupled to the driving electronics? Yes, most everyone else has been testing the 2 toroid configuration. So far, in my tests, it's been a single toroid, to understand its motion (if any). I hope to move to a 2 toroid configuration soon. The single toroid motion seems to be caused by: 1) non-perfect winding spacing, so that there is a net force between some turns. 2) Some turns being bound more tightly to the core. 3) Newton's third law while some turns are moving. The epoxy was to bind everything together to test this theory. I had used a thin layer of wax previously, and could see cracks caused by relative movements. So this seems conventional, but not a "DC" effect. I assume this could be a factor in a 2 toroid case too, and will report tests when I get there. -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 00:39:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA29639; Thu, 20 May 1999 00:38:53 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 00:38:53 -0700 From: MKSBoysal@aol.com Message-ID: <2abbdfb9.247515df@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 03:38:07 EDT Subject: Very Unusual Power Invention machine at NZ To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"7mVVE3.0.0F7.DmxGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10621 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Folks, <> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Inertialess Drive Technologies (1995) Ltd has created the first dual-rotating single piece mass. The Inertialess Drive Rotor, a single solid object, can rotate in two planes at 90 degrees to each other simultaneously! It has no centrifugal aspect, its weight does not increase under rotation like conventional spheres and wheels. The rotor exhibits an inertialess aspect at its core under rotation. There are numerous applications to which these special characteristics of the rotor can be advantageously applied. "It is a true alpha to omega, one of a kind that is unrepeatable." The rotor has many potential uses. At this point the Company is concentrating on the development of the rotors power generation and storage capabilities. The company has already used the rotor to create a micro-hydro power generator, called the , kilogram for kilogram the most powerful generator ever built with only one moving part. Many other Nomad energy generation systems driven by other forms of natural replenishable resources are being developed. A power storage device is currently under development. The rotor of course lends itself to many other applications, some of these are outlined further on the Licence page. How does it work? When an outside source of energy (water, compressed air, wind, solar power, steam) is applied to the rotor, because of the rotor's unique dual-rotation ability, the rotor stores the kinetic energy in two planes of rotation, one 90 degrees to the other, whilst at the same time remaining stable. That energy is, for the very first time, easily transported and is recoverable as electric power. Electricity can be induced in coils around such a rotor driven by a natural energy source. Such a power generation system is scalable and can seriously reduce our dependency on fossil and other environmentally damaging fuels. The rotor can also be used conversly to store large amounts of power. Superconductors can be used to suspend the rotor in a vacuum to create a superior form of Kinetic Battery, and provide a superior means of storing power. More information on power storage using the rotor can be found in an Article on this site. A key consideration of the rotor is its transportability without the limitation of gyroscopic forces. In other words, the dual-rotating mass does not get heavier. The rotor has no centrifugal aspect. Unlike its predecessor, the wheel, the rotor does not fly apart at extreme rotational speeds, it only becomes more stable! IDTL95 Home Page http://www.inertialessdrive.co.nz/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 00:43:03 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA31169; Thu, 20 May 1999 00:42:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 00:42:44 -0700 Message-ID: <3743BD17.1089F136@harti.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 09:43:19 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, Motoe Suzuki Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P.Correa ? References: <199905200235.AA00192@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SBwY_2.0.rc7.ppxGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10622 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Motoe Suzuki schrieb: > > Hi, All > > >>There were some mistakes in my previous mail, so I corrected them > and posted again here.<< > > I have myself conducted some experiments with the aim to reproduce the > Correa's experiments and findings, but totally in vain. > I have found some serious problems or contradictions in the reports and > patent descriptions which have been disclosed by Correa himself, and I have > come to conclude that he still conceals something very essential to have a > succees in the experiment. Hi Sirase, which gas and at which pressure level did you use ? You probably have to use H2 gas at pressure levels of 1.5 to 2 Torr ! This was used by Chernetski and only in this pressure range it did work ! If you work with normal air you would have to find the right low pressure level to achive the right glow discharge ! Regards, Stefan. > > But I have no intention to blame Correa. > Now, I agree completely to Stefan's response below. > > Best regards, Sirase > > > >> Dr. Correa is a long time > >> researcher and seem to be a very good and reputable scientist. He has > >> made public demonstration of his device and the results have been > >> verified by knowledgeable people. I have talked to him on the phone > >> about 6 months ago and he was looking for funding to commercialize the > >> device. > > > > Stefan Hartmann wrote: > > >Where did he make the public demos ? > >Why does he not do more demos ? > > > >I am convinced that he is having something real, but he should be more > >open to show it around ! Does he sell any video tape of it ? > > > >Is he too greedy to give it away for free or at least share some knowledge, > > so others could replicate it and verify it ? > > > >Maybe you can call him again and ask, what his latest news is ? > > > >Regards, Stefan. > > > > ///////// -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 01:45:23 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA09825; Thu, 20 May 1999 01:43:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 01:43:56 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19990520103957.006f0d74@ns1.namib.co.za> X-Sender: ijg@ns1.namib.co.za X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 10:39:57 +0200 To: freenrg-L@eskimo.com From: Haiko Bruns Subject: Laser plans Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"dtES2.0.QP2.CjyGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10623 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi just read your paper on the SAP. I found years ago a plan to build a laser from an old flourescent tube. Maybe you know where one can find such a plan or any other plans for lasers and their controllers - as well as oudin and tesla coils. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 02:01:48 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id CAA12401; Thu, 20 May 1999 02:00:56 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 02:00:56 -0700 Message-Id: <199905200900.AA00198@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> From: Motoe Suzuki Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 18:00:52 +0900 To: harti@harti.com Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P.Correa ? In-Reply-To: <3743BD17.1089F136@harti.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AL-Mail32 Version 1.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Resent-Message-ID: <"n_Ia81.0.c13.8zyGt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10624 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Stefan, > >which gas and at which pressure level did you use ? >You probably have to use H2 gas at pressure levels$B!!(Bof 1.5 to 2 Torr ! >This was used by Chernetski and only in this pressure$B!!(Brange it did work ! Which device do you mean by mentioning "it did work"? Is "it" Correa's device or Chernetski's device? > >If you work with normal air you would have to find the right$B!!(Blow pressure >level to achive the right glow discharge ! > Regards, Stefan. $B!!(B $B!!!!!!(BYes, I used normal air with pressure of a few 0.01 to 0.1Pa which allowed to produce a faint violet glow discharge at around 500V DC between aluminum electrodes with 5cm diam. at about 3 cm distance. I have not tried hydrogen, because Correa told in his documents that he got successful results with air. Best regards, Sirase ///////// From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 04:01:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA27056; Thu, 20 May 1999 03:59:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 03:59:17 -0700 Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 04:58:08 -0600 (MDT) From: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" X-Sender: jdo@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca To: Paul Delisle Cc: Free Energy List Subject: Re: Dennis Lee free energy device In-Reply-To: <039001bea20a$d4201e80$66e288d0@paul> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"4sSVV3.0.fc6.4i-Gt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10625 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Paul: Further to your comments below, I would like to know if you had any of our New Jersey colleagues volunteer to make arrangements to view Dennis Lee's technology? I would like to know how it worked out. After having talked to PC, I was NOT convinced that some of the claims being made can be verified, nor was I very impressed at all. However, Dennis Lee's technology (Fischer's stirling engine) is of interest, and much closer to reality. Please give us further updates, especially regarding the long delayed commercialization of the technology. Does the distributor have any guarantees that the release of the DL product(s) will be THIS summer? Afterall, this has been a promise now for many many years (ie. 10?). Jorg Ostrowski ------------------------------------------------------------------------- On Wed, 19 May 1999, Paul Delisle wrote: > > I just attended a talk given by a distributor that works for Dennis > Lee's company. He told us about the free energy device and how they > intend to soon (this summer) flood the US with these free energy > devices. > > The distributor had a superficial knowledge of free energy and some of > the arguments that he brought didn't seem to make sense to me. Then we > were shown a tape where Dennis Lee explains in detail the principle of > the device. We had to sign a non-disclosure agreement so I can't give > you the details but it is enough to say that it's basically a heat pump. > This was invented by someone name Fischer and he has a patent for this > invention. I will go on the IBM patent server and see what I can find on > this. > > The tape was definitely more convincing that the speech from the > distributor. The principle is simple. I would however like to hear the > comments of someone who knows more on this subject. He then showed three > prototypes that they have build so far. The last prototype was much > smaller and similar to the one they are planning to distribute. The > device will supposedly produce 100kW/h. That's a lot of power. It runs > on CO2 and uses of the shelf hydraulic motor and parts. > > The distributor told us that it is possible to go in New Jersey and see > the prototype at work. I am always interested when people have something > to show other than words. > > >From what I can see most people don't seem to think that Dennis is very > honest. I don't know him and it is possible that he hasn't delivered as > promised in the past. But I think it's worth while to check this out and > see if the machine really works. The rest is secondary. > > Bill Beaty I think said that in his long career of searching for free > energy he has never seen anything that works. That is a very troubling > statement. I don't believe that all the free energy devices that we hear > about work but on the other hand I find it equally difficult to believe > that none of them works either. Those are the two extremes of the range > and as we know the truth is more often somewhere in between. > > No free energy device that works. Well here is one that I am pretty sure > works. Dr. Paulo Correa from Canada has invented a device that is many > times overunity. He has filed three patents (5416391, 5449989, 5502354) > on it and he will demonstrate to any serious investors. The overunity > results are clearly stated in the patent. Dr. Correa is a long time > researcher and seem to be a very good and reputable scientist. He has > made public demonstration of his device and the results have been > verified by knowledgeable people. I have talked to him on the phone > about 6 months ago and he was looking for funding to commercialize the > device. > > I don't think that the real problem is in finding a free energy device > that works. There is probably a lot of these. The problem is with the > collective consciousness of our society. As long as greed and fear still > dominate the direction of our actions it will be very difficult to bring > free energy devices to the mass level. There is too many interest in > keeping the technology that we have now. But hopefully things will > change in the coming years. > > Regards, > Paul Delisle > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 06:05:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA18037; Thu, 20 May 1999 06:04:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 06:04:57 -0700 Message-ID: <374408D0.531E952@harti.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 15:06:24 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, Motoe Suzuki Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P.Correa ? References: <199905200900.AA00198@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ZWx_-3.0.kP4.vX0Ht"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10626 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Motoe Suzuki schrieb: > > Hi Stefan, > > > > >which gas and at which pressure level did you use ? > >You probably have to use H2 gas at pressure levels$B!!(Bof 1.5 to 2 Torr ! > >This was used by Chernetski and only in this pressure$B!!(Brange it did work ! > > Which device do you mean by mentioning "it did work"? > Is "it" Correa's device or Chernetski's device? Chernetski´s device. He used RF pulses. The tube was pretty long, around 1 Meter I guess.. I just only saw a video of it. I have the block circuit digrams. These are just LC tank circuits which have a pulsed input. > > > > >If you work with normal air you would have to find the right$B!!(Blow pressure > >level to achive the right glow discharge ! > > Regards, Stefan. > $B!!(B > $B!!!!!!(BYes, I used normal air with pressure of a few 0.01 to 0.1Pa which > allowed to produce a faint violet glow discharge at around 500V DC between > aluminum electrodes with 5cm diam. at about 3 cm distance. Hmm, you have to use probably bigger tubes with a longer distance and maybe also other electrodes, like iron or also try Pb. > I have not tried hydrogen, because Correa told in his documents that he > got successful results with air. I see, heavier molecules weights should also help, maybe Neon could also be used... Do you have a few pics of your setup ? Best regards, Stefan. > Best regards, Sirase > > ///////// -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 06:06:59 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA18481; Thu, 20 May 1999 06:06:07 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 06:06:07 -0700 Message-ID: <37440915.AA205C4B@harti.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 15:07:33 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Laser plans References: <3.0.2.32.19990520103957.006f0d74@ns1.namib.co.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"KffOx.0.gW4._Y0Ht"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10627 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Haiko Bruns schrieb: > > Hi > > just read your paper on the SAP. I found years ago a plan to build a laser > from an old flourescent tube. Maybe you know where one can find such a plan > or any other plans for lasers and their controllers - as well as oudin and > tesla coils. Sorry, I have no idea. Maybe you should ask on the freenrg-l@eskimo.com Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 06:10:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA21665; Thu, 20 May 1999 06:10:16 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 06:10:16 -0700 From: DEADWATE@aol.com Message-ID: <9e3d226.24756391@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 09:09:37 EDT Subject: Re: Perpetual Lamps To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 10 Resent-Message-ID: <"Zzf8-.0.MI5.uc0Ht"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10628 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: In a message dated 5/19/1999 7:35:58 PM Pacific Daylight Time, knuke@LCIA.COM writes: << http://www.sulfurlamp.com/index.htm >> Wow! thanks for the url! Very interesting indeed! I have requested any sales info they may have available as "breakthrough" is putting it mildly! deadwate@AOL.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 07:55:29 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA14834; Thu, 20 May 1999 07:51:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 07:51:11 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Perpetual Lamps Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 10:55:14 -0400 Message-ID: <19990520145514671.AAA280@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"lG1MW3.0.gd3.U52Ht"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10629 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: With the time and the money, you can make just about anything. That's the good part, and the bad part about discussion groups such as these. I don't know what your background is or your age, education, etc., but yes, you can build one. There are no parts or ingredients that are regulated, so you can either take existing stuff and modify it, or make your own parts. It just depends on your skill, knowledge, and the tools that you have available to you. If you do decide to try and construct one of these gizmos, I would suggest that you do it in a public forum like this one, so that more experienced engineers can look at your design and help not make mistakes. It can save you a great deal of time and money, and it might keep you from doing something dangerous. Good Luck! Knuke >thanks for the link, Mike. Do you know if it's possible to make one on >your own? > >>I found the url: http://www.sulfurlamp.com/index.htm >> >>Another interesting thing about the lamp is the broad spectrum of light it >>gives off. It's quite a breakthrough, actually. Check it out. > > Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 08:05:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA19262; Thu, 20 May 1999 08:04:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 08:04:41 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: Perpetual Lamps Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 11:08:45 -0400 Message-ID: <19990520150845218.AAA221@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"wcgKL1.0.ti4.8I2Ht"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10630 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >In a message dated 5/19/1999 7:35:58 PM Pacific Daylight Time, knuke@LCIA.COM >writes: > ><< http://www.sulfurlamp.com/index.htm >> >Wow! thanks for the url! Very interesting indeed! I have requested any >sales info they may have available as "breakthrough" is putting it mildly! > deadwate@AOL.com This lamp will initially appeal or easily lend itself to large spaces such as parks, sports arenas, parking lots, etc.. The indoor uses are going to take some headscratching though. It's a mighty big candle to be lighting up in the middle of the night just to go to the bathroom, for example :) Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 08:11:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA21332; Thu, 20 May 1999 08:10:57 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 08:10:57 -0700 From: Bmd2323@aol.com Message-ID: <1e44332d.24757fbc@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 11:09:48 EDT Subject: Obligatory Phantom Menace post To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 13 Resent-Message-ID: <"2I12P.0.DD5.1O2Ht"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10631 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi guys, Sooner or later someone was going to do this, so I figured I'd beat 'em to the punch and we could get back on track fast. Saw it, loved it, go see it. Not as good as the first one, but still awesome. Effects looked real, I mean so real it was scary. Brian Drake (Bmd2323@aol.com) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 17:18:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA17493; Thu, 20 May 1999 17:16:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 17:16:28 -0700 Message-Id: <199905210016.AA00199@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> From: Motoe Suzuki Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 09:16:27 +0900 To: harti@harti.com Cc: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P.Correa ? In-Reply-To: <374408D0.531E952@harti.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AL-Mail32 Version 1.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Resent-Message-ID: <"FQKj-1.0.AH4.SNAHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10632 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Stefan, Thank you very much for your kind answer. >Chernetski$B%((Bs device. >He used RF pulses.The tube was pretty long, around 1 Meter I guess.. >I just only saw a video of it. I have the block circuit digrams. >These are just LC tank circuits which have a pulsed input. > So, I guess Chernetski's device is much different from Correa's. What I wish to discuss is the hidden features, if any, of Correa's setup. Would you please point out the possible association between the two? > >Hmm, you have to use probably bigger tubes with a longer distance >and maybe also other electrodes, like iron or also try Pb. > On what basis do you think so? I designed my setup in accordance with the information described in Correa's disclosed documents. For example, in his documents, aluminum is reported to be one of the materials that can give a successful result. The size of my electrode was within the range of his successful condition. So, with my aluminum electrodes and air pressure, I should have had success in reproducing Correa's novel phenomenon. But, actually, my result was quite disappointing. >I see, heavier molecules weights should also help, maybe Neon could > also be used... > Again, on what basis do you think so? >Do you have a few pics of your setup ? > No. Sorry. Best regards, Sirase ///////// From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 20 23:41:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id XAA15871; Thu, 20 May 1999 23:40:50 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 23:40:50 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990521171222.008a9a10@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@main.murray.net.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 17:12:22 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: GEOFF EGEL Subject: Re: Obligatory Phantom Menace post In-Reply-To: <1e44332d.24757fbc@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"VrVem3.0.ut3.n_FHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10633 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 11:09 AM 5/20/99 EDT, you wrote: >Hi guys, > >Sooner or later someone was going to do this, so I figured I'd beat 'em to >the punch and we could get back on track fast. Saw it, loved it, go see it. >Not as good as the first one, but still awesome. Effects looked real, I mean >so real it was scary. > > >Brian Drake >(Bmd2323@aol.com) > >Filmed in Sydney Australian But we have to wait another month to see it. First Film I ver saw in cimema in our capital city was Star Wars a new hope was really blown away when I saw it. Can't wait to see the presequel May the force be with us soon Geoff ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Solaris searching for natures energy sources. Our main site http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 Get the complete enecyclopedia of free energy version 1 from us at no cost at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/freebies.html last updated November 1998 my postal address as follows Geoff Egel 18 Sturt Street Loxton 5333 South Australia Australia ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- Energy 21 website now resides at http://www.FortuneCity.com/greenfield/bp/16/index.html Bright Sparks website. http://www2.murray.net.au/users/egel/ our site search facility is located at. http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/orgone.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 01:40:45 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA01953; Fri, 21 May 1999 01:40:24 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 01:40:24 -0700 Message-ID: <0d6201bea366$1580b220$508180d8@btech> From: "Bill Wallace`" To: Subject: Re: Eric Krieg's response to the Dennis Lee Motor Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 04:44:01 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"l6Ttp1.0.MU.ulHHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10634 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: There once was a bishop that was sent a poem by an alchemist on how to turn lead into gold - the alchemist thought to fool the bishop into giving him a handsome payment for the knowledge - the bishop sent the alchemist an empty leather purse with a not saying - for a man that can make his own gold - a purse to carry it in is all he should need! - HAHA! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 03:45:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id DAA13611; Fri, 21 May 1999 03:44:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 03:44:33 -0700 Message-Id: <199905211044.DAA13592@mx1.eskimo.com> From: "Ray Bradshaw" To: Subject: Subspace question. Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 05:40:07 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Aio8O2.0.ZK3.HaJHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10635 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi. I know I hardly ever speak in this group, I tend to be a conservative type of person. Anyways, I was reading through some technical theories on a website and it mentioned the word subspace. I tried to break it down mentally to get a definition, but I didn't prevail with an answer. I do watch Star Trek a lot, but I've never thought about what this word means. Can anyone give me a technical ( not mathematical ) definition for the word "subspace" ? Thanks a lot and I wish nothing but success to you all. Ray Bradshaw From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 04:17:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id EAA18866; Fri, 21 May 1999 04:16:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 04:16:26 -0700 Message-Id: <199905211116.EAA18849@mx1.eskimo.com> From: "Ray Bradshaw" To: Subject: Re: Subspace question. Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 06:11:55 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3raVC3.0.hc4.A2KHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10636 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have found a page which tries to explain subspace in a paranormal aspect. Here is the text below taken directly from the website, any comments about this will be greatly appreciated. -strata: ----------------------------------TEXT FILE------------------------------------ SUBSPACE Subspace-strata: Is the energy signature of what is left of the conciseness of a living thing; In this state all matter is only energy. This form of energy is based on wave lengths. The wave length is located in the Lower Visible range and the Infrared spectrum. The Infrared spectrum and Lower Visible light is also the same energy signature or wave length as the Alpha wave of the Human Brain. Subspace is the dimension that lies in the Lower Visible Light and the Infra-red. Many other Scientist are finding out about shortwave communication with the dead by starting with the frequency around 80 megahertz and going up to around 425 megahertz. The Idea of "KA" is the best way to describe the area of Subspace. In ancient Egypt the realm of "Ka "was the Double, the other side, or the hidden half. Many Pharo's tried to keep the balance of "Ka" during their individual rein's. "With every action there is a equal and opposite reaction." The need to keep the balance was their top priority. This leads us to many interesting conclusions, dealing with subspace-strata. -------------------------------------------END------------------------------ ---------- ---------- > From: Ray Bradshaw > To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com > Subject: Subspace question. > Date: Friday, May 21, 1999 5:40 AM > > Hi. I know I hardly ever speak in this group, I tend to be a conservative > type of person. Anyways, I was reading through some technical theories on a > website and it mentioned the word subspace. I tried to break it down > mentally to get a definition, but I didn't prevail with an answer. I do > watch Star Trek a lot, but I've never thought about what this word means. > Can anyone give me a technical ( not mathematical ) definition for the word > "subspace" ? Thanks a lot and I wish nothing but success to you all. > > Ray Bradshaw > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 06:08:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA14388; Fri, 21 May 1999 06:05:55 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 06:05:55 -0700 Message-ID: <37455A6E.3E260268@harti.com> Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 15:06:54 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, Motoe Suzuki Subject: Re:P.Correa ? References: <199905210016.AA00199@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uEZio1.0.jW3.peLHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10637 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Motoe Suzuki schrieb: > > Hi Stefan, > > Thank you very much for your kind answer. > > >Chernetskis device. > >He used RF pulses.The tube was pretty long, around 1 Meter I guess.. > >I just only saw a video of it. I have the block circuit digrams. > >These are just LC tank circuits which have a pulsed input. > > > So, I guess Chernetski's device is much different from Correa's. Yes a bit ! > What I wish to discuss is the hidden features, if any, of Correa's setup. > Would you please point out the possible association between the two? He also used pretty long tubes, your tube was only a few cms long ? (3 cm distance ?) > > > > >Hmm, you have to use probably bigger tubes with a longer distance > >and maybe also other electrodes, like iron or also try Pb. > > > On what basis do you think so? The Chermetski tube was almost 1 Meter long, as the video shows.. > I designed my setup in accordance with the information described in > Correa's disclosed documents. For example, in his documents, aluminum is > reported to be one of the materials that can give a successful result. I heard Aluminium is not good ! > The size of my electrode was within the range of his successful condition. Probably he has not published all data in his patent and maybe also published the wrong sizes.. If I wanted to get a patent I would also publish "wrong" datas... to secure nobody is copying it too soon... > So, with my aluminum electrodes and air pressure, I should have had > success in reproducing Correa's novel phenomenon. probably not. > But, actually, my result was quite disappointing. Did you measure the Voltage versus current diagramm ? Did you find the glow discharge area in the diagramm ? Did you try to pulse it exactly in this area of the V/I diagramm ? How did you pulse it ? Did you have a 3rd electrode (triode) for the flashing or did you just pulse high voltage DC onto the 2 electrodes ? > >I see, heavier molecules weights should also help, maybe Neon could > > also be used... > > > Again, on what basis do you think so? I have emailed the Russian Prof. Saphorin, who has done a theoretical explanation of the effect , published earlier in Infinite energy magazine ! > > >Do you have a few pics of your setup ? > > > No. Sorry. Best regards, Sirase Regards, Stefan. > > ///////// -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 07:22:28 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA05756; Fri, 21 May 1999 07:19:39 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 07:19:39 -0700 Message-ID: <00e701bea393$b5149ea0$71e288d0@paul> From: "Paul Delisle" To: Subject: Re: Eric Krieg's response to the Dennis Lee Motor Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 09:10:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"eAnH_1.0.iP1.vjMHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10638 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Eric, Thank for the reply to my message. You said that you have offered him $50,000 to be able to check his device and he refused. Seemed that you are very serious about checking him out. Why don't you send someone else check it out, without telling him that you send them. I can understand that Dennis would be reluctant to have you come given the web site you have set up against him. It's a little puzzling to me that someone would spend so much time setting up a web site to criticize someone. Have you lost money with him in the past? What do you do for a living? Don't get me wrong I appreciate what you are doing if it's done without interest of for the sake of revenge. If Lee is a scammer this will keep a lot of people from loosing their money with him. For now I will give him the benefit of the doubt and I will wait and see what happens this summer. Regards, Paul From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 07:27:16 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA10391; Fri, 21 May 1999 07:25:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 07:25:05 -0700 Message-ID: <00f201bea394$772eddc0$71e288d0@paul> From: "Paul Delisle" To: Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P.Correa ? Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 09:16:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"75SQ.0.FY2.0pMHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10639 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi All, >... patent descriptions which have been disclosed by Correa himself, and I have >come to conclude that he still conceals something very essential to have a >succees in the experiment. Yes that is very likely. I asked him if I could build this myself and he was very confident that I wouldn't be able to reproduce it from the patent. Patent are not meant for showing people how to reproduce the invention, their main purpose is to protect the inventor. Paul From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 12:03:10 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA03078; Fri, 21 May 1999 12:02:18 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 12:02:18 -0700 Message-ID: <012f01bea3bb$34c6acc0$71e288d0@paul> From: "Paul Delisle" To: "Free Energy List" , Subject: Re: Eric Krieg's response to the Dennis Lee Motor Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 13:53:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"KH42P3.0._l.wsQHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10640 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Eric, What you say is very wise and I agree with you. It's so easy to fall under the spell of wishful thinking. If you are doing this to save other people from being scammed and not for some personal agenda then you have all my admiration. What do you think of the brown gas torch that Dennis Lee's company sells? As far as I know this is real and there is no scam in this. As for Newman, yes he is one big ego starved human being. It's all over his book. But I believe that some of the things he has discovered are real and could have a real value if allowed to be developed and optimized. Jean-Louis Naudin has demonstrated with great rigueur the overunity results of the Newman engine on his site. So Newman is not totally nuts after all. I don't like his personnality much but I think that we should recognize the validity of some of his concepts. It's good to seperate the research and the man. Not always easy though. Like many I feel like rejecting everything he says because of his lack of scientific rigueur and ego problem. We tend to be extreme in that way in our judgments. I am certainly not in a hurry to give money to people these days. I have been researching FE for a little while now and it's turning more into a social study of the ego gripped and confused human doings than a scientific quest. The human race is pretty pathetic in general. But there is hope and the race is evolving faster than ever. Fast enough? Qui vivra verra. Regards, Paul >Yes, Dennis confirmed himself that the prize money exists. All the many people I've talked to who have gone (except Dennis's most loyal followers) have said his "proof" is pathetic. > Of course Dennis feels hostile towards me. But consider his two biggest problems: lack of money and my meddling. If he has what he claims - why would he not suffer my presence for 24 hours to solve both problems and one fell swoop? Would the Wright brothers have disallowed skeptics to attend their demonstrations? If I was given real proof of something that fantastic, I would gladly change over night from the worlds biggest exposer of false energy claims to the worlds greatest promoter of FE. Lee's and Newman's excuses for not providing quality proof are the only thing perpetual about them. > If you could see all the emails I get from people who have given the likes of Dennis their life's savings, convinced friends to turn over money and suffered the humiliation of stretching out family members for years, then maybe you would understand my desire to provide the truth. I even get emails from people who lost money in the pyramid scam Dennis ran in the 70's. I happen to really like right wing Christian older farmers - the typical kind of person he preys on. I feel it is worth a few hundred hours of my time can save a few million dollars for such people. I also have to do it because I am sick of hypocritical Christian, Patriot and Free Energy leaders who know exactly what's going on and lack the ethics or guts to say what is right. If people like Pat Robertson , Bo Grits, and Gene Mallove would have just said what they know is true - I'd probably be off debunking phony psychics or faith healers. > I think it is fine for you to wait this summer to make up your mind - but just be aware there are still people who have been waiting for Dennis since 1988. > > Eric Krieg eric@phact.org > > >http://www.phact.org/e/skeptic/newman.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 18:39:41 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id SAA07093; Fri, 21 May 1999 18:31:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 18:31:15 -0700 Message-ID: <37460A46.1821@lcia.com> Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 21:37:10 -0400 From: B25B@LCIA.COM (RON BRENNEN) Reply-To: b25b@LCIA.COM X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Dennis Lee and P.Correa ? References: <00f201bea394$772eddc0$71e288d0@paul> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8g-Wi.0.ik1.ZZWHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10641 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Paul Delisle wrote: > > Hi All, > > >... patent descriptions which have been disclosed by Correa himself, > and I have > >come to conclude that he still conceals something very essential to > have a > >succees in the experiment. > > Yes that is very likely. I asked him if I could build this myself and he > was very confident that I wouldn't be able to reproduce it from the > patent. Patent are not meant for showing people how to reproduce the > invention, their main purpose is to protect the inventor. > > Paul If a material fact is witheld from a patent the patent is worthless. Patent law clearly states: A patent must disclose enough details so that a person versed in the art can duplicate it. Some inventors don't relize this and wind up wasting their money. Regards, Ron From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 21 21:15:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA07767; Fri, 21 May 1999 21:13:32 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 21:13:32 -0700 Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 22:12:22 -0600 (MDT) From: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" X-Sender: jdo@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca To: Paul Delisle Cc: Free Energy List , eric@voicenet.com Subject: water torch? In-Reply-To: <012f01bea3bb$34c6acc0$71e288d0@paul> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"_Cq8u3.0.Cv1.hxYHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10642 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: You said: "What do you think of the brown gas torch that Dennis Lee's company sells?" ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Paul: Where did this come from? This is new. You don't mean George Wiseman, do you? Thanks for clarifying this. Jorg ostrowski From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 22 12:32:19 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA03167; Sat, 22 May 1999 12:31:35 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 12:31:35 -0700 X-Sender: bailey@shell14.ba.best.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 12:33:05 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com (Freengr List) From: pgb@padrak.com (Patrick Bailey) Subject: AntiGravity Conference: Speakers and Titles Resent-Message-ID: <"iOrq_1.0.On.MOmHt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10643 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: The AGN AntiGravity Conference, June 27-28, 1999, Reno, NV: Speakers and Titles Has just been posted at: http://www.padrak.com/agn/AGNCONF99.html (case sensitive) From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 23 06:23:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA22396; Sun, 23 May 1999 06:22:55 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 06:22:55 -0700 Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 07:22:32 -0600 (MDT) From: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" X-Sender: jdo@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca To: Norm Biss Cc: vortex-l@eskimo.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Fw: Free Electricity Machine Demonstration In-Reply-To: <3711BBC6.40679A61@erie.net> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"1mtXZ2.0.cT5.j40It"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10644 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: re: Newfoundland, New Jersey > Starting at 1:00 PM on April 10th and repeating each > Saturday in April. ____________________________________________________________ Norm and anyone else: Did you or anyone else go to see any of the demonstrations? Are these machines commercially available and have 3rd party verifications tests been performed? Jorg Ostrowski From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 23 06:34:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA25323; Sun, 23 May 1999 06:33:36 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 06:33:36 -0700 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19990523134025.01877028@popd.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: atech@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 09:40:25 -0400 To: vortex-L@eskimo.com From: "Dennis C. Lee" Subject: Vortex (Rotation) Dynamics Resent-Message-ID: <"oc1z52.0.VB6.mE0It"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10645 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Sorry for my absence folks. I met a new Lady friend (cute angel face, very good body) :) and technology seems to have taken a backseat since I got back from London. I think I'm acclimating to this new energy level though. At 04:22 AM 5/23/99 -0800, you wrote: >What form then is a vibration pattern when considering all vibrations >have three primary modes: longitudinal, transverse and Raleigh? > >NOTE: This is an exercise.... and a great opportunity! Dale, I remember you saying that Quantum Arithmetic was more accurate (or was it precise) than a Searl Square? (be careful my friend) ;) Could you elaborate on this idea? I assume this is in reference to vibration patterns. Perhaps modeling the concept will help in its' visualization? >From Cloud 9; Dennis From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 23 08:49:19 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id IAA15786; Sun, 23 May 1999 08:46:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 08:46:59 -0700 Message-ID: <19990523154626.57803.qmail@hotmail.com> X-Originating-IP: [152.163.204.206] From: "Randy Hargraves" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Exotic Research / swiss ml / TAKAHASHI Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 08:46:26 PDT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; Resent-Message-ID: <"jQdNj.0.Zs3.pB2It"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10646 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Some time in the past there were some postings about an artical in "exotic research magizen or news letter" If i recall correctly it was the swiss ml and some one had figured it out and had plans or a letter of explaination. Does any one one what artical it was in???? What issue????? how to get the magizine??? and does any one here no enough about it to have an opinion.??? Thanks list. Randy Hargraves _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 23 14:07:42 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA06929; Sun, 23 May 1999 14:06:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 14:06:23 -0700 X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQvAD5HsUP74c6RiQfElVBj6F2eXgIUIaVR4Dn8Vn7tzZvIht7NJUV69bk= From: B777b77@webtv.net (R B) Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 15:03:19 -0500 (EST) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: water torch? Message-ID: <626-37485F07-731@postoffice-122.bryant.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" 's message of Fri, 21 May 1999 22:12:22 -0600 (MDT) Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Resent-Message-ID: <"m5X2y3.0.Ai1.Ft6It"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10647 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: You said: "What do you think of the brown gas torch that Dennis Lee's company sells?" ----------------------------------------------- Paul: Where did this come from? This is new. You don't mean George Wiseman, do you? Thanks for clarifying this. Jorg ostrowski Browns Gas Address:http://www.ucsofa.com/Browns%20Gas.htm Dennis Lee's Page; UCSofA Home Address:http://www.ucsofa.com/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 23 17:57:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA30211; Sun, 23 May 1999 17:56:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 17:56:03 -0700 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19990524010254.01889c1c@popd.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: atech@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 21:02:54 -0400 To: vortex-L@eskimo.com From: "Dennis C. Lee" Subject: Meetings & a Larger View Resent-Message-ID: <"akeh_.0.dN7.YEAIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10648 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: >At 07:52 AM 5/23/99 -0800, you wrote: >>Greetings Everyone, >> >>Below is an excellent article by Dan Meador acknowledged by many as an >>expert in Cooperative Federalism (Americanization of the NWO) and >>related matters and author of the book The Masters of DeCeit. I post >>these articles for a number of reasons. Probably the most important is >>the "R" word: responsibility both personal and social. Americans as a >>whole have shirked their responsibility to be responsible citizens in >>charge of their own government. It is no longer our government but a >>collection of greedy and power hungry pirates. > >Steps for the average person to make the gubermint work good. IMHO > >1. Help partner to achieve maximum success financially and reach life's dream of creative social contribution (~15 years). > >2. There will then be time to do law research and litigation against the injustice one encounters in the course life. Don't be a hero. Wait for it to come to you until you are left no choice but lawful self defense. NO FEAR. > >3. Find law page associated to one's home state requirements. Massachussetts example: > >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/legis/laws/mgl/ > >4. Find lawyer code of ethics (Massachusetts example) for one's state: > >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/obcbbo/7626.htm >or >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/obcbbo/rpcnet.htm > >5. Recognize facts of particular case and find appropriate related passages in above materials to use against unjust opposition in court. An 'Achimedian Bath' helps thought and creative levels. Overwhelming legal strategy is possible for the following reasons: > >A. You're an individual with properly earned time, resources, and energy to fight for one's own, as well as others who are worthy of, justice and rights. This is a greater force than a creepy (bunch of) lawyer working on dozens of mostly groundless and almost inevitably illegal cases for a client who is ethically even more destitute than the lawyer(s) himself (themselves). > >B. Why are fascist methods used by the oppressors? Because there is no legal ground to stand on. Belligerent truculence is all that's under the hood. This is also evidence that the truth of the matter is buried well. The State Auditor's Office, using 'Standard Government Auditing Proceedures' established by the U.S. Comptroller General should be employed at the beginning of applicable cases to establish the facts. Freedom of Information inquiries assume that the documentation found is all there is because the agency is believed to be giving all out effort to cooperate. A proper State Auditor's Office inquiry will take more than a year and be able to establish the documentation that should be on public record and what it should cover. At the end of such an inquiry, all facts are known with no loose ends, no questions unanswered, and nothing overlooked. > >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/sao/audresp.htm > >C. You are on just one case at a time so relevent issues are focused on and have been analyzed on a continuous basis. Sometimes the answer evolves after a judgement is made. Go back, undo it, and make it right with timely court proceedure. > >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/legis/laws/mgl/231-6F.htm > >6. Use 'willful and deceptive business practice' laws to file treble damage lawsuit claims everywhere appropriate against all perpetrators of unjust act. > >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/legis/laws/mgl/93A-11.htm > >7. Use all appropriate evidence from court case (judge will list all wrongful acts committed and those who are responsible in final judgement) to bring charges against all attorneys involved in unjust acts with Board Of Bar Overseers. > >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/obcbbo/7626.htm > >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/obcbbo/rpcnet.htm > >8. Use decisions of Board Of Bar Overseers to bring treble damage claims against all attorneys involved with 'willful and deceptive business practice' laws. > >http://www.magnet.state.ma.us/legis/laws/mgl/93A-11.htm > >9. Do it yourself. Hiring a lawyer will result in losing your money as well as the case in my opinion. > >Godspeed good citizens; >Dennis > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 23 19:59:18 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA13443; Sun, 23 May 1999 19:58:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 19:58:46 -0700 Message-Id: <199905240258.AA00204@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> From: Motoe Suzuki Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 11:58:33 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: P.Correa ? In-Reply-To: <37455A6E.3E260268@harti.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AL-Mail32 Version 1.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Resent-Message-ID: <"jMIFo1.0.yH3.c1CIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10649 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi$B!!(B Stefan, >He also used pretty long tubes, your tube was only a few cms long ? >(3 cm distance ?). The Chermetski tube was almost 1 Meter long, as the >video shows.. I heard Aluminium is not good ! > My tube was about 10 cm long, since my Aluminum electrodes had a few cm thickness. Strangely enough for me, you compare my device directly with Chernetski's device, but I tried to reproduce Correa's results. So, again, I would like to ask you to show clearly the theoretical similarity underlying the Chernetski's phenomenon and Correa's one. Also, Please make clear which one your statement is directed to. Which experiment is your information that Aluminum is not good applied to, Chernetski's experiment or Correa's one? > >Probably he has not published all data in his patent and maybe >also published the wrong sizes.. >If I wanted to get a patent I would also publish "wrong" datas... >to secure nobody is copying it too soon... > YES,.. Kind suggestions. I have been aware of this tactical attitude particularly in Free Energy World for years. I don't buy everything that is described in patent documents. In the case of Correa's, his descriptions appear exceptionally clear and detailed. As a result, with his documented information only, no one could have a specific image as to what is concealed behind his descriptions, if any. Thus, I conducted my duplicating test. >Did you measure the Voltage versus current diagramm ? >Did you find the glow discharge area in the diagramm ? >Did you try to pulse it exactly in this area of the V/I diagramm ? >How did you pulse it ? Did you have a 3rd electrode (triode) for the flashing >or did you just pulse high voltage DC onto the 2 electrodes ? I measured the transient current and voltage as a function of time with a high speed digital oscilloscope. I did'nt make the data into V-I diagram. I did try to pulse the current exactly in the Correa's APGD area. My device had no third electrode. I just pulsed high voltage DC onto the 2 electrodes. >I have emailed the Russian Prof. Saphorin, who has done a theoretical >explanation of the effect , published earlier in Infinite energy magazine ! > Thank you very much for the last information. I will check the magazine right now. Paul wrote: > Yes that is very likely. I asked him if I could build this myself and he > was very confident that I wouldn't be able to reproduce it from the > patent. > Paul, I deeply appreciate your information above. Et tu, Brute! And thou, Correa ! It will tread the very usual track straightly that has traced in Free Energy World too many times. Best regards, Sirase ///////// From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 23 21:05:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA00938; Sun, 23 May 1999 21:00:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 21:00:17 -0700 Message-ID: <3748A4FE.15F9@intergate.bc.ca> Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 21:01:50 -0400 From: Alik Shereshevsky Reply-To: alik@intergate.bc.ca X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (OS/2; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: P.Correa ? References: <199905240258.AA00204@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"9l3Jn3.0.ZE.HxCIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10650 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Anyone building plasma/ gas-discharge gizmos may want to take a look at 3 foot x 6 inch pyrex chamber someone is selling on e-bay (item# 105420564 or just look for 'pyrex vacuum') 10 hrs left. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 23 22:37:51 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA23167; Sun, 23 May 1999 22:37:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 22:37:15 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.32.19990524133745.00ad2130@cyllene.uwa.edu.au> X-Sender: jwinter@cyllene.uwa.edu.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (32) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 13:37:45 +0800 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: John Winterflood Subject: Re: Exotic Research / swiss ml / TAKAHASHI In-Reply-To: <19990523154626.57803.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"pLvZW.0.uf5.BMEIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10651 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: At 08:46 23/05/99 PDT, you wrote: >Some time in the past there were some postings >about an artical in "exotic research magizen or news letter" > >If i recall correctly it was the swiss ml >and some one had figured it out and had plans or a letter of explaination. > >Does any one one what artical it was in???? >What issue????? Exotic Research Report - Jul/Aug/Sept 1998 (Vol 2, No 3). >how to get the magizine??? Order it from http://www.exoticresearch.com/report/tocframe.htm exotic@casagrande.com >and does any one here no enough about it to have an opinion.??? I bought the magazine. The article suggests the Testatica needs an aerial and runs of atmospheric static electricity (which seems wrong to me). Cavin Bahlmann's "power wheel" does not self run, neither does it appear to be overunity (unlike Testatica). The entire article appears courtesy of Geoff Egel at :- http://www.fortunecity.com/greenfield/bp/16/powerw.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 24 00:44:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA12220; Mon, 24 May 1999 00:44:05 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 00:44:05 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990524181541.008b7480@main.murray.net.au> X-Sender: egel@main.murray.net.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 18:15:41 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: GEOFF EGEL Subject: Re: Exotic Research / swiss ml / TAKAHASHI In-Reply-To: <19990523154626.57803.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"y8JGG1.0.m-2.5DGIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10652 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I have quiet a good article and photos at my Solaris and Bright sparks websites as below or click the contents button and then select swiss from the word list then shown this will take you to to the swiss ml machine articles Hope this helps Geoff At 08:46 AM 5/23/99 PDT, you wrote: >Some time in the past there were some postings >about an artical in "exotic research magizen or news letter" > >If i recall correctly it was the swiss ml >and some one had figured it out and had plans or a letter of explaination. > >Does any one one what artical it was in???? >What issue????? >how to get the magizine??? > > >and does any one here no enough about it to have an opinion.??? >Thanks list. > >Randy Hargraves > > >_______________________________________________________________ >Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- Solaris searching for natures energy sources. Our main site http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 Get the complete enecyclopedia of free energy version 1 from us at no cost at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/freebies.html last updated November 1998 my postal address as follows Geoff Egel 18 Sturt Street Loxton 5333 South Australia Australia ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- Energy 21 website now resides at http://www.FortuneCity.com/greenfield/bp/16/index.html Bright Sparks website. http://www2.murray.net.au/users/egel/ our site search facility is located at. http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/orgone.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 24 05:31:40 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA20157; Mon, 24 May 1999 05:27:00 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 05:27:00 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01bea5e0$24b43600$19dd82d1@felis> From: "Felis Catus" To: Subject: Re: Exotic Research / swiss ml / TAKAHASHI Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 08:22:48 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01BEA5BE.9BA36AA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"yeP-J3.0.sw4.JMKIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10653 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BEA5BE.9BA36AA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i have no idea. From what I have seen of this-much smoke&thunder but so far no clear, buildable plans to replicate an over unity device-not even one that just powered itself for 'demo' purposes that the design idea might be viable. Do you, like me keep on floppy disc html or txt files and jpeg/gif images you do not want to lose if you have a meltdown/crash of your Hard Drive? When is the last time you looked at your digital wristwatch, and hoped you were not late? Yoshiro Nakamatsu, the inventor of the computer floppy disc and the digital wristwatch on your wrist has found a way to split the water molecule to obtain the same 'energy'[cf: Professor Bearden's Theories on scalar electromagnetism & Russians on 'torsional physics] that is officially obtained by radioactive fission and its 'dirty' radioactive waste results. Please do not hold me to the strict definition of certain physical terms and find fault with my use of them, because it is my imporession that no one in this group, or elsewhere for this matter, really has the 'hard' how to knowlege you seek. If Nakamatsu is the most prolific inventor the world has yet seen, it stands to reason there is a japanese patent on this device. Do you have a friend who is interested and has a native fluency of Japanese? To the best of my knowlege, our US Patent Office at its Virginia headquarters maintains archives of Japanese patents for use by their Examiners to ascertain if a patent application has not already been invented by a Japanese patent holder. Under our rights granted us by the Freedom Of Information Act, are you not able to conduct a hand search of these archives on your own behalf looking for an archival copy of Nakamatsu's Japanese language patent on this apparently working device? Several weeks ago, I called the people putting up this years' Inventors Expo and they said Nakamatsu would be there... felis catus felis@frontiernet.net 5/24/99 -----Original Message----- From: GEOFF EGEL To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Monday, May 24, 1999 3:49 AM Subject: Re: Exotic Research / swiss ml / TAKAHASHI > > >I have quiet a good article and photos at my Solaris and Bright sparks >websites >as below >or click the contents button and then select swiss from the word list then >shown >this will take you to to the swiss ml machine articles > >Hope this helps >Geoff > > > > > > > > > > > >At 08:46 AM 5/23/99 PDT, you wrote: >>Some time in the past there were some postings >>about an artical in "exotic research magizen or news letter" >> >>If i recall correctly it was the swiss ml >>and some one had figured it out and had plans or a letter of explaination. >> >>Does any one one what artical it was in???? >>What issue????? >>how to get the magizine??? >> >> >>and does any one here no enough about it to have an opinion.??? >>Thanks list. >> >>Randy Hargraves >> >> >>_______________________________________________________________ >>Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com >> >> >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- - >--- >Solaris searching for natures energy sources. >Our main site http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135 > >Get the complete enecyclopedia of free energy version 1 from us at no cost >at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/freebies.html > >last updated November 1998 > >my postal address as follows >Geoff Egel >18 Sturt Street >Loxton 5333 >South Australia >Australia >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- - >------- >Energy 21 website now resides at >http://www.FortuneCity.com/greenfield/bp/16/index.html > >Bright Sparks website. > >http://www2.murray.net.au/users/egel/ > >our site search facility is located at. > >http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Lab/1135/orgone.htm > > ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BEA5BE.9BA36AA0 Content-Type: text/plain; name="Nakama~1.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Nakama~1.txt" Welcome to the News Review archive of UK business = and company news. Your search engine has brought you to this archive because it holds = extensive news, comment and information on many companies active in the = United Kingdom. Our database includes synopses of current financial news and comment = from the leading UK newspapers, trade magazines and periodicals such as = The Investors Chronicle. The article below is one of those that has = matched your search criteria. Sunday 25 Feb 1996 Profile: Yoshiro Nakamatsu Kevin Rafferty profiles the amazing Dr `NakaMats', lateral thinking = inventor of the floppy disc, an uncharacteristically inventive Japanese = who holds more patents than anyone else alive or dead.=20 Page reference from newspaper [p. B7]=20 Information is available to registered readers in a variety of = electronic formats including an automated clipping service to help you = monitor your selected companies or business sectors. With its publishing = partners, News Review is building a comprehensive overview of reporting = on the UK business scene to include newspapers, trade magazines and = European publications. News Review is trusted by professional and private investors and = business readers around the world as an aid to decision-making in = fast-moving markets. We provide a variety of low cost subscription based services to take = advantage of the Internet and electronic delivery. Please use the Free Trial registration form See why News Review has become one of the leading Internet services=20 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Published in conjunction with Weekend City Press Review Developed and Managed by Information Providers Limited ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BEA5BE.9BA36AA0 Content-Type: text/plain; name="Nakmts2.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Nakmts2.txt" =20 =20 DAILY NEWS Fort Walton Beach, Fla. May 4, 1990 CREDIT: R. Reid Inventors Flock To Exposition MONROEVILLE., Pa. (AP) - If necessity is the mother of invention, is silliness the father? One might think that, based on some o( the gizmos and gadgets on display Thursday when a convention to market lnventions got under = way. Among the items: a portable fire escape that can be anchored inside a = window in a burning high-rise, a trap designed to lure fleas off a = carpet, and a device designed to repel snosquitoes with sound waves. Also displayed: a plastic gun that clears clogged drains with a blast of = compressed air. a sand laden trash can that won't tip over, and golf = shoes with playing tips stitched across the toes. Would you believe a = zipper tie? =20 Promoters and from around the world showed off their creations at the = Monroeville Expo Mart, in suburban Pittsburgh, seeking investors and = marketers. =20 The start of the three day exhibition marked the unveiling of the = engine, created by Yoshiro Nakamatsu, who became known as the "Edison Of = Japan" after inventing the computer floppy disk and the digital watch.=20 Nakamatsu said his pollution free engine, called Enerex, runs on tap = water alone, and can create three times as much power as a standard = gasoline engine.=20 "It will generate electricity for any purpose", he said. "Petroleum = will exhaust in one hundred years". He said he plans to modify the engine and build a special vehicle = powered by it. =20 Nakamatsu displayed some of his other inventions, including packages = of "Brain Food", which he said contains "good elements" to encourage = clear thinking. The snack food, which tastes like seaweed, is sold in = Japan.=20 Nakamatsu, 62 said listening to Beethoven's Fifth Symphony and = swimming have helped him maintain the creativity that has enabled him to = obtain more than two thousand patents in the United States and Japan.=20 "My best place to create inventions is under the water", he said. "So = I swim every day". =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BEA5BE.9BA36AA0-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 24 09:26:17 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id JAA13570; Mon, 24 May 1999 09:15:02 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 09:15:02 -0700 From: dave.tingley@juno.com To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 12:15:06 -0400 Subject: Re: Exotic Research / swiss ml / TAKAHASHI Message-ID: <19990524.121508.246.0.dave.tingley@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 3.0.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 3-6,8-59 X-Juno-Att: 0 X-Juno-RefParts: 0 Resent-Message-ID: <"mI-Kn1.0.gJ3.4iNIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10654 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: I did a search at www.patents.ibm.com and didn't come up with anything. There are a few article's that show up about him when I did a search on northernlight, but little info other than that he is currently running for mayor of tokyo. Dave On Mon, 24 May 1999 08:22:48 -0400 "Felis Catus" writes: > i have no idea. From what I have seen of this-much smoke&thunder but > so far > no clear, buildable plans to replicate an over unity device-not even > one > that just powered itself for 'demo' purposes that the design idea > might be > viable. Do you, like me keep on floppy disc html or txt files and > jpeg/gif > images you do not want to lose if you have a meltdown/crash of your > Hard > Drive? When is the last time you looked at your digital wristwatch, > and > hoped you were not late? Yoshiro Nakamatsu, the inventor of the > computer > floppy disc and the digital wristwatch on your wrist has found a way > to > split the water molecule to obtain the same 'energy'[cf: Professor > Bearden's > Theories on scalar electromagnetism & Russians on 'torsional > physics] that > is officially obtained by radioactive fission and its 'dirty' > radioactive > waste results. Please do not hold me to the strict definition of > certain > physical terms and find fault with my use of them, because it is my > imporession that no one in this group, or elsewhere for this matter, > really > has the 'hard' how to knowlege you seek. If Nakamatsu is the most > prolific > inventor the world has yet seen, it stands to reason there is a > japanese > patent on this device. Do you have a friend who is interested and > has a > native fluency of Japanese? To the best of my knowlege, our US > Patent > Office at its Virginia headquarters maintains archives of Japanese > patents > for use by their Examiners to ascertain if a patent application has > not > already been invented by a Japanese patent holder. Under our rights > granted > us by the Freedom Of Information Act, are you not able to conduct a > hand > search of these archives on your own behalf looking for an archival > copy of > Nakamatsu's Japanese language patent on this apparently working > device? > Several weeks ago, I called the people putting up this years' > Inventors Expo > and they said Nakamatsu would be there... > felis catus felis@frontiernet.net 5/24/99 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 25 05:11:52 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id FAA09951; Tue, 25 May 1999 05:10:34 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 05:10:34 -0700 Message-Id: <199905251210.OAA16753@poindexter.wirehub.nl> From: "Aris" To: Subject: Re: Dennis Lee free energy device Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 14:12:00 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"oZQ6h.0.NR2.wCfIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10655 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > No free energy device that works. Well here is one that I am pretty sure > works. Dr. Paulo Correa from Canada has invented a device that is many > times overunity. He has filed three patents (5416391, 5449989, 5502354) > on it and he will demonstrate to any serious investors. The overunity > results are clearly stated in the patent. Dr. Correa is a long time > researcher and seem to be a very good and reputable scientist. He has > made public demonstration of his device and the results have been > verified by knowledgeable people. I have talked to him on the phone > about 6 months ago and he was looking for funding to commercialize the > device. + > I don't think that the real problem is in finding a free energy device > that works. There is probably a lot of these. The problem is with the > collective consciousness of our society. As long as greed and fear still > dominate the direction of our actions it will be very difficult to bring > free energy devices to the mass level. There is too many interest in > keeping the technology that we have now. But hopefully things will > change in the coming years. = ??? If you are right about existing working 'overunity' devices then I would like to see one... If you look at the fundemental statement of human rights, it is my right to get that knowledge...;-)) Serious, if there are many FE devices, and there are none at the market there must be some kind of communication problems between inventors & investors... LOL it is just one letter different...;-)).. Anyway both slightly paranoid en egocentric, what the fuck, it's just a stupid game both playing.... If just one inventor would see: "well without the rest off the world I couldn't invent my mega-pie-frieer, soo i'm very gratefull and i will tell the rest about my fantastic invention, soo instead of bombing the tesla museum, people could launch bullshit instead!!!".... Anyway both paranoids are making me very sick!! In case any paranoid is reading this, get well and invent a magic healing machine instead off fearing shit out of ordinary people...GET A LIFE!!! Regards, Aris.... From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 25 10:15:13 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA09373; Tue, 25 May 1999 10:14:26 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 10:14:26 -0700 From: JNaudin509@aol.com Message-ID: <17b1458d.247c3438@aol.com> Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 13:13:28 EDT Subject: ARDA the EHD flying wing, project update To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 144 Resent-Message-ID: <"wCgxu2.0.MI2.ofjIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10656 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dear All, The outer parts of the ARDA v2.0 mk2 Flying wing is now finished, intrado and extrado covered, ailerons/elevators with servos control now fully functional... The ARDA project schedule is always on a good way... First test flight planned for the begining of June. You will find some pictures about the current setup in my "construction log book" at : http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine/delany/256/html/ardav22.htm Stay tuned... Best Regards, Jean-Louis Naudin Email: Jnaudin509@aol.com Overunity Web site: http://members.aol.com/jnaudin509/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 25 13:24:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA09218; Tue, 25 May 1999 13:23:46 -0700 Resent-Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 13:23:46 -0700 From: "Martin" To: "Keelynet" Cc: Subject: Translations of Japanese Patents Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 22:21:52 +0200 Message-ID: <01bea6ec$39b4de80$3fdf1ac4@Martin.icon.co.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"LEnCo2.0.vF2.IRmIt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10657 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Anyone have any idea where I may be able to get translations of Japanese patents(The full versions) either online or any otherway? Regards Martin http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Lab/7919/ From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 25 13:46:24 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA03193; Tue, 25 May 1999 13:40:12 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 13:40:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <374B0A52.A4DAE544@harti.com> Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 22:38:42 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, Motoe Suzuki Subject: Re: P.Correa experiments ? References: <199905240258.AA00204@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"zNnlw2.0.kn.fgmIt"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10658 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Motoe Suzuki schrieb: > > Hi$B!!(B Stefan, > > >He also used pretty long tubes, your tube was only a few cms long ? > >(3 cm distance ?). The Chermetski tube was almost 1 Meter long, as the > >video shows.. I heard Aluminium is not good ! > > > My tube was about 10 cm long, since my Aluminum electrodes had a few > cm thickness. Correa´s devices were also almost 1 meter and more long and at least 10 or 20 cm in diameter ! > > Strangely enough for me, you compare my device directly with > Chernetski's device, but I tried to reproduce Correa's results. > So, again, I would like to ask you to show clearly the theoretical similarity > underlying the Chernetski's phenomenon and Correa's one. > Also, Please make clear which one your statement is directed to. > > Which experiment is your information that Aluminum is not good applied to, > Chernetski's experiment or Correa's one? Aluminium is very easy gased out from the elctrodes, wehn the ions hit the surface. That is why Correa´s tubes had all over the ends aluminium metal scattered around the inner surface ! Not good for the electrodes ! > > >Did you measure the Voltage versus current diagramm ? > >Did you find the glow discharge area in the diagramm ? > >Did you try to pulse it exactly in this area of the V/I diagramm ? > >How did you pulse it ? Did you have a 3rd electrode (triode) for the flashing > >or did you just pulse high voltage DC onto the 2 electrodes ? > > I measured the transient current and voltage as a function of time with a > high speed digital oscilloscope. I did'nt make the data into V-I diagram. I did > try to pulse the current exactly in the Correa's APGD area. How did you know, that you have been in the APGD region (range)? > My device had > no third electrode. I just pulsed high voltage DC onto the 2 electrodes. > I see. > >I have emailed the Russian Prof. Saphorin, who has done a theoretical > >explanation of the effect , published earlier in Infinite energy magazine ! > > > Thank you very much for the last information. I will check the magazine > right now. > Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Tue May 25 22:16:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx2.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA00425; Tue, 25 May 1999 22:15:25 -0700 (PDT) Resent-Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 22:15:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199905260508.AA00208@motoe.popsvr.tokai.jaeri.go.jp> From: Motoe Suzuki Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 14:08:08 +0900 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: P.Correa experiments ? In-Reply-To: <374B0A52.A4DAE544@harti.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AL-Mail32 Version 1.01 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Resent-Message-ID: <"__kTh1.0.Y6.hDuIt"@mx2> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10659 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dear Stefan, > >Correa$B%((Bs devices were also almost 1 meter and more long and >at least 10 or 20 cm in diameter ! > $B!!!!(BO.K. Thank you very much, Stefan. I know it. But I think the length of tube has almost nothing to do with the occurrence of the phenomena. What is significant is the distance, surface area of the electrodes and pressure, not the total length nor diameter. Scientifically, a superficial resemblance of device could not always assure successful result. In fact, the dimensions of YOUR Newman motor were so much different from those of the one that Newman made by himself, you know! > >Aluminium is very easy gased out from the elctrodes, wehn the ions hit >the surface. That is why Correa$B%((Bs tubes had all over the ends aluminium >metal scattered around the inner surface ! Not good for the electrodes ! This is no explanation for the opinion that (aluminum is) "Not good for the electrodes !, implying that Correa's phenomenon cannot occur with aluminum electrodes. (Also, to my knowledge, aluminum belongs to a group of metals that have a considerable durability against sputtering when used as an electrode; aluminum is not so easily sputtered, but not so much resistant.) Instead, according to the observed fact disclosed by Correa, that the inner surface was covered with aluminum vapor deposit, it can well be estimated that such enhanced sputtering of aluminum is an evidence that the BIG current pulse DOES occur repeatedly with aluminum electrodes. > >How did you know, that you have been in the APGD region (range)? > I compared the transient rise of current with voltage change. Best regards, Sirase ///////// From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 26 17:38:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA00085; Wed, 26 May 1999 17:37:13 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 17:37:13 -0700 Message-ID: <374C93CF.86FAF74A@harti.com> Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 02:37:35 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? X-Priority: 1 (Highest) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"byEMG1.0.G1.vE9Jt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10660 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi All, I have experienced an effect, I don´t understand and it might have some good applications, maybe also the output energy is higher than the input... I tried to heat up a grill fire with feeding it some wind. (so that it burns better) I had a long ( ~1 Meter) platic pipe (tube) with about 5 cm inner diameter. Now here is the phaenomen, that I don´t understand. When I blew with my mouth some air directly into the tube in front of the tube and my mouth lipps closed the tube opening, there was only very few wind coming out of the end of the tube. But when I blew with the same amount of wind about 5 to 10 cms away from the tube opening, there was coming a lot more wind out of the other side tube end ! It is a really amazing effect ! Somehow, if you blow the wind from a few cms distance away, there comes more wind out of the the tube ending , than if you blew directly all your air directly into the opening and press your mouth onto it ! How can this be ?? Maybe this way, there will be sucked into the tube more air form the surrounding and will be accelerated with it, so more air comes out of the end of the tube ? If you don´t believe me, try it yourself ! You will also be really amazed, what kind of amplification it gets ! Maybe it ia also somekind of air oscillation inside the tube, that sucks in more air and spits it out at the other end ?? But it does not make any resonance sound. Hmm, very strange. Can anybody explain ? Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 26 19:09:06 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA29749; Wed, 26 May 1999 19:08:33 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 19:08:33 -0700 Message-ID: <374CA906.F8440DAA@ghiocel.com> Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 19:08:06 -0700 From: Dan Ghiocel Organization: Scott Electronic Services LLC X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-AtHome0405 (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? References: <374C93CF.86FAF74A@harti.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"NTpft2.0.mG7.WaAJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10661 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: When you cover the pipe with your mouth, you control the flow, therefore only the air you can expel from your lungs goes through the pipe. When you blow a few inches away from the pipe you provide an force that pushes the surrounding air into the pipe. Once the force gets the air moving into the pipe the inertia will keep it going. This force accelerates the air but it does not control its speed or flow. When you blow, at the beginning you push the air hard, but the flow is low. As the air comes out of the lungs, the pressure decreases, so the higher air flow is not pushed that hard anymore, and since the air flow is controlled by the lungs, the air will slow down. When you blow from further away, the high force at the beginning transfers all the energy to the surrounding air. When the blowing pressure decreases, it does not force a slow down of the air flow, which will continue until the friction uses all the inertial energy. To use a simple model, you can experiment with a swing or pendulum: if you only push it to accelerate it at the extreme of its swing, it will keep swinging with a minimum effort from your part. If you try to hold it all the way through its path, you will end up using a lot of energy and probably the swing will move slower than before. Stefan Hartmann wrote: > > Hi All, > > I have experienced an effect, I don´t understand and it might have > some good applications, maybe also the output energy > is higher than the input... > > I tried to heat up a grill fire with feeding it some wind. > (so that it burns better) > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Wed May 26 21:09:57 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA00750; Wed, 26 May 1999 21:09:34 -0700 Resent-Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 21:09:34 -0700 Message-ID: <374CC4B4.B69ED4DE@verisoft.com.tr> Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 07:06:12 +0300 From: hamdi ucar X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (Win98; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg Subject: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? References: <374C93CF.86FAF74A@harti.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"wE4xa3.0.YB.zLCJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10662 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Stefan Hartmann wrote: > [snip] > > When I blew with my mouth some air directly into the tube > in front of the tube and my mouth lipps closed the tube > opening, there was only very few wind coming out of the end > of the tube. > > But when I blew with the same amount of wind about > 5 to 10 cms away from the tube opening, there > was coming a lot more wind out of the other side > tube end ! > > It is a really amazing effect ! > > Somehow, if you blow the wind from a few cms > distance away, there comes more wind out of the the > tube ending , > than if you blew directly all your air directly > into the opening and press your mouth onto it ! > > How can this be ?? > > Maybe this way, there will be sucked into the tube more air form the > surrounding and will be accelerated with it, so more air comes out of > the end of the tube ? > Yes, it may be explained as impedance matching: :) Your breath have enough pressure to produce more work than to blow this low resistance tube. For example you can also blow 100 m of this tube without difficulty. So the current config does not allow to transfer the power in your breath. But if you narrow you mouth and create a high speed stream, more energy you transferred. In this manner you able to load your breath. This is like to adapt your low voltage, high current power supply to transfer the power to the high impedance load by increasing the output voltage by a transformer. The phenomenon of sucking air by the high speed stream is the transformer action. Air pressure = Electrical current Air flow volume (what is the correct name?) = Voltage Tube conductance = electrical resistance May somebody could give more suitable model to migrate from hydrodynamics to electrical figures. Regards, hamdi ucar From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 06:26:46 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA08803; Thu, 27 May 1999 06:24:11 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 06:24:11 -0700 Message-Id: <199905271324.PAA90720@poindexter.wirehub.nl> From: "Aris" To: Subject: Great joke!! Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 15:25:33 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"7QJeu2.0.S92.wTKJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10663 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Dear all, I'm looking for somebody in Australia wanting to help my building my great new joke...;-)).. Already many thanks and laughters, Aris... From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 07:06:00 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id HAA20620; Thu, 27 May 1999 07:02:09 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 07:02:09 -0700 Message-ID: X-Mailer: XFMail 1.3 [p0] on Linux X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <374C93CF.86FAF74A@harti.com> Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 09:59:29 -0400 (EDT) Organization: Society for Real Time Sender: chuck@cougar.ssi.stratus.com From: Charlie Hodgson To: Stefan Hartmann Subject: RE: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? Cc: Newman-L Mailing List , Free Energy Resent-Message-ID: <"yNqEB2.0.025.X1LJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10664 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Stephan, This, I believe, is similar to how a vacuum aspirator(?) works. You shoot a stream of water through an orafice and the force will also suck air to create a vacuum. Now, comes something I wanted to run by you, which is directly related to your ovservation... In reading about various OU devices (specifically Sweet's VTA and Newman's motor), I speculate that the OU we seem to observe is due to vacuum energy being sucked in as a result of the sparks. i.e., the force of the electrons jumping the gap causes surronding energy/matter to join in, unable to escape the unrush of the electrons as they head home. It's been reported that when the VTA output shorted, the junction frosted over. When the Newman commutator is correctly set, it hisses. (does it also run cold?). I have read about other such behavior on other devices, but can't cite them at this time. Honestly, I never thought much about it until the other day. I wasn't even planning on mentioning these thoughts until I had some time to experiment, but that would be 6 weeks away at the earliest, due to other commitments. I don't believe in coincidences, hence your inquiry told me that the time was right to make public my theory. Charlie BTW: This inspiration came to me late last week when I found an old vacuum aspirator among my various junk and later read Bill Beaty's rant on ACOUSTIMAGNETOELECTRICISM. On 27-May-99 Stefan Hartmann wrote: > Hi All, > > I have experienced an effect, I don´t understand and it might have > some good applications, maybe also the output energy > is higher than the input... > > Somehow, if you blow the wind from a few cms > distance away, there comes more wind out of the the > tube ending , > than if you blew directly all your air directly > into the opening and press your mouth onto it ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 12:46:04 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id MAA14091; Thu, 27 May 1999 12:45:08 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 12:45:08 -0700 Message-ID: <001501bea882$5108d220$687988d1@monorailpc> From: "code" To: Subject: greetings and questions... Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 13:48:46 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01BEA847.A42539C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"l64VL1.0.4S3.33QJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10665 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01BEA847.A42539C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello All, I am new to this list and thought I'd take a moment to introduce = myself. My name is Alan and I have been working with OU/free energy = devices for about 3 years. I have constructed several different = devices...Newman motor/generator, Hendershot device, Bedini generator, = magnetic motors, etc... and wish I could say I have had great success; = but alas, I have had only meager results with the devices I have = constucted. I have been focusing my attention in different areas for = the last year...specifically electromedicine...but have recently = returned to the world of free energy and am interested in working with = others to develop something workable. My goals are simply to attain = power self-sufficiency/get off the damn grid and help others do the = same. I'm not into making a fortune, seeking fame or looking to rip = people off with false claims of some "wonder" device; I just want to = know with all certainty that OU/free energy is possible, share that = knowledge and the means with others and pursue the options that such a = device can provide. =20 Does anyone have any ideas/experiences they are willing to share? Are = there archives available to look at and where do we stand in the realm = of actual OU/free energy devices at this time??? I look forward to sharing with all of you. Best regards, Alan ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01BEA847.A42539C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello All,
 
  I am new to this list and = thought I'd=20 take a moment to introduce myself.  My name is Alan and I have been = working=20 with OU/free energy devices for about 3 years.  I have constructed = several=20 different devices...Newman motor/generator, Hendershot device, Bedini = generator,=20 magnetic motors, etc... and wish I could say I have had great success; = but alas,=20 I have had only meager results with the devices I have constucted.  = I have=20 been focusing my attention in different areas for the last = year...specifically=20 electromedicine...but have recently returned to the world of free energy = and am=20 interested in working with others to develop something workable.  = My goals=20 are simply to attain power self-sufficiency/get off the damn grid and = help=20 others do the same.  I'm not into making a fortune, seeking fame or = looking=20 to rip people off with false claims of some "wonder" = device;  I=20 just want to know with all certainty that OU/free energy is possible, = share that=20 knowledge and the means with others and pursue the options that such a = device=20 can provide. 
 
Does anyone have any = ideas/experiences they are=20 willing to share?  Are there archives available to look at and = where do we=20 stand in the realm of actual OU/free energy devices at this = time???
 
I look forward to sharing with all = of=20 you.
 
Best regards,
 
          &nbs= p;           =20 Alan
------=_NextPart_000_0012_01BEA847.A42539C0-- From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 13:47:47 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA00183; Thu, 27 May 1999 13:42:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 13:42:54 -0700 Message-ID: <374DAE72.90EBC3D0@harti.com> Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 22:43:30 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Newman-L Mailing List , bill.seiple@ncemcs.com, Free Energy Subject: RE: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"PhiJD.0.m2.EvQJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10666 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > Subject: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? > > Stefan: This is the same principle that steam injectors were based > on, which allowed boiler pressure steam to feed more feedwater into the > boiler against the existing pressure in the boiler. - > bill.seiple@ncemcs.com I am not familiar with this device, how does it exactly work ? Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 13:50:56 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA04105; Thu, 27 May 1999 13:50:08 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 13:50:08 -0700 Message-Id: <199905272050.RAA24252@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: Improving To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 17:51:07 -2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: greetings and questions... Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br Priority: normal In-reply-to: <001501bea882$5108d220$687988d1@monorailpc> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.53/R1) Resent-Message-ID: <"r5zik.0.201.00RJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10667 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > > Does anyone have any ideas/experiences they are willing to share? Are = > there archives available to look at and where do we stand in the realm = > of actual OU/free energy devices at this time??? > > I look forward to sharing with all of you. > > Best regards, > > Alan > I would suggest you try the VTA device. Nobody has duplicated it. --- Marcelo Puhl mark@plug-in.com.br From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 13:52:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA05029; Thu, 27 May 1999 13:51:53 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 13:51:53 -0700 Message-ID: <374DB07E.D1A88141@harti.com> Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 22:52:15 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Newman-L Mailing List , Free Energy , Tufmony@aol.com Subject: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? References: <8a8cd88c.247ed0f1@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_JwYM2.0.NE1.e1RJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10668 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Tufmony@aol.com schrieb: > > It think it probably has more to do with the velocity of the air not the > distance from the tube. > > When you place your lips on the tube, the tube opening determines the > velocity generated in conjunction with the strength of your lungs, with a > specific volume. Well, no, I did it exactly with the same lips-positions, but just directly at the tube entrance. The airflow coming out my mouth was the same speed in both cases. That I did pay attention to ! > But when you blow a few inches(cm) away, you compress the > air from your lungs against your lips and thus the "air volume" is now > compressed and comes out faster but with less volume. What you feel or see > and observe, I guess by the reaction of the coals, is the faster moving air > producing a greater reaction on the coals than the slower moving air when > blown directly. While blowing a few inches away, the tube probably does > create a vacuum and pull some outside air in which is then accelerated to the > velocity of the forced air. > Well, yes, it might be some kind of underpressure vaccuum pump effect which sucks in additional outside air, but it really is amazing, how much air comes this way out of the pipe (tube) at the end, although the inenr diameter is only 5 cm and the tube is about 1 Meter long ! Hamdi Uccard said, it is some kind of "impedance matching", but I saw, that the outputed air at the end of the tube had the same velocity speed as the air coming out of my mouth, maybe even some more speed... ! It feels likes this is an air flow amplifier... Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 13:57:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA08651; Thu, 27 May 1999 13:56:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 13:56:17 -0700 Message-ID: <374DB1AC.DE2E5A14@harti.com> Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 22:57:16 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: flytch er , Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? References: <19990527072604.22086.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"f_CeA1.0.472.n5RJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10669 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: flytch er schrieb: > > It is a pressure wave phenomenon.... Yes, might be a standing wave or something like this, that sucks in additional air or so or some kind of vacuum pump.. >and dose not gain much in the real > world.... ie. the skunk work boys Who is this ? >built a duct around a jet engine that > produced the same effect you have observed but it was concluded that the > drag from the duct was more than the added thrust... however a small scale > use of this venturi effect may have some practical usages... I see, thanks for the info. Regards, Stefan. > -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 14:02:39 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id NAA10337; Thu, 27 May 1999 13:59:37 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 13:59:37 -0700 Message-ID: <374DB261.529569E6@harti.com> Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 23:00:17 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: alik@intergate.bc.ca, Newman-L Mailing List , Free Energy Subject: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? References: <374C93CF.86FAF74A@harti.com> <374CC1C3.600D@intergate.bc.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"MAm262.0.QX2.u8RJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10670 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Alik Shereshevsky schrieb: > > Years ago (1986) here was a VTOL (vertical take off ...) > aircraft design from an outfit called Moshier tech. > that was in turn based on NASA work on fluidic amplifiers. > It was a real neat machine, wish I had one. > > What it did was to blow air from a jet engine into a short > tube open from top and bottom. Fast hot air from the engine > passed its energy to a larger volume of slower air "sucked in" > from above. End result was greater lift than that achievable > with the same jet engine standing on its tail. > > I think you created the same thing. Technically > this is a "fluidic gear-box" where you exchange energy of > smaller volume of fast air for a greater volume of slower > moving air. If you think in electrical terms it could be > looked at as a transformer perhaps (and therefore impedance > matching concept could apply). > > Alik S. Yes, that could be ! But I guess the air coming out at the end of my tube had at least the same speed as I blew out with my mouth... but maybe you are right. Thanks for the good explanation. Must have been a good jet engine. Is it still used ? Best regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 14:15:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA16669; Thu, 27 May 1999 14:14:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 14:14:23 -0700 Message-ID: <374DB399.9E626E0A@harti.com> Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 23:05:29 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, hamdi ucar , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? References: <374C93CF.86FAF74A@harti.com> <374CC4B4.B69ED4DE@verisoft.com.tr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"gGq3V1.0.M44.kMRJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10671 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: hamdi ucar schrieb: > > Stefan Hartmann wrote: > > > [snip] > > > > When I blew with my mouth some air directly into the tube > > in front of the tube and my mouth lipps closed the tube > > opening, there was only very few wind coming out of the end > > of the tube. > > > > But when I blew with the same amount of wind about > > 5 to 10 cms away from the tube opening, there > > was coming a lot more wind out of the other side > > tube end ! > > > > It is a really amazing effect ! > > > > Somehow, if you blow the wind from a few cms > > distance away, there comes more wind out of the the > > tube ending , > > than if you blew directly all your air directly > > into the opening and press your mouth onto it ! > > > > How can this be ?? > > > > Maybe this way, there will be sucked into the tube more air form the > > surrounding and will be accelerated with it, so more air comes out of > > the end of the tube ? > > > > Yes, it may be explained as impedance matching: :) > > Your breath have enough pressure to produce more work than to blow this low resistance tube. For example you can also blow 100 m of this tube without difficulty. So the current config does not allow to transfer the power in your breath. But if you narrow you mouth and create a high speed stream, more energy you transferred. In this manner you able to load your breath. This is like to adapt your low voltage, high current power supply to transfer the power to the high impedance load by increasing the output voltage by a transformer. The phenomenon of sucking air by the high speed stream is the transformer action. > > Air pressure = Electrical current > Air flow volume (what is the correct name?) = Voltage > Tube conductance = electrical resistance Hmm, could be, but I saw the output was at least as fast as my mouth output.-.. > > May somebody could give more suitable model to migrate from hydrodynamics to electrical figures. > > Regards, > > hamdi ucar Regards, Stefan. -- Hartmann Multimedia Service, Dipl. Ing. Stefan Hartmann Keplerstr. 11 B, 10589 Berlin, Germany Tel: ++ 49 30-345 00 497 FAX: ++ 49 30-345 00 498 email: harti@harti.com Web site: http://www.harti.com http://ccard.net fuer Ihren Verkauf im WEB ! From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 14:45:15 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id OAA24255; Thu, 27 May 1999 14:38:06 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 14:38:06 -0700 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 14:37:25 -0700 From: "bob macelvain" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: on X-Expiredinmiddle: true X-Mailer: MailCity Service Subject: Re: greetings and questions... X-Sender-Ip: 209.12.236.159 Organization: MailCity (http://www.mailcity.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"xRGVd3.0.qw5.ziRJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10672 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: ... ... alan ... ... ... ?could you be more specific per your 'meager success' post relative to the magnetic devices you have constructed over the past 3 years? ... ... ... 'close to' 1.0 unity is not necessarily defeat considering all the many ways to increase output efficiency by tweaking ... ... ... ?did you construct the ecklin device? ... ... ... ?how close to 1.0 unity did you achieve? ... ... ... ?what grade of laminated iron are you using? ... ... ... ?what grade of neos are you using? ... ... ... ?are you using 'tinned' coil wire? ... ... ... ?is your input power frequency anywhere close to the natural resonant frequency of your configured apparatus? ... ... ... bob ... ... Get your FREE Email at http://mailcity.lycos.com Get your PERSONALIZED START PAGE at http://my.lycos.com From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 20:57:31 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA07334; Thu, 27 May 1999 20:55:08 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 20:55:08 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990527193203.2f07aa0a@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 19:32:03 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: Re: greetings and questions... In-Reply-To: <001501bea882$5108d220$687988d1@monorailpc> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"q347e3.0.Vo1.SEXJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10673 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi! At 01:48 PM 5/27/99 -0700, you wrote: >Hello All, > > I am new to this list and thought I'd take a moment to introduce myself. My name is Alan and I have been working with OU/free energy devices for about 3 years. >Does anyone have any ideas/experiences they are willing to share? Are there archives available to look at and where do we stand in the realm of actual OU/free energy devices at this time??? The freenrg-l has archives which are interesting to browse through. There are also (Keelynet Bboard) starting at http://www.spiritweb.org/KeelyNet/Public-Messages/m001-199.txt.html -Dave From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Thu May 27 21:02:32 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id VAA10707; Thu, 27 May 1999 21:02:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 21:02:17 -0700 X-Sender: knuke@mail.lcia.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: knuke@LCIA.COM (Michael T Huffman) Subject: Re: greetings and questions... Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 00:06:30 -0400 Message-ID: <19990528040630718.AAA260@mail.lcia.com@lizard> Resent-Message-ID: <"XCOTb3.0.3d2.8LXJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10674 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Alan wrote: >Does anyone have any ideas/experiences they are willing to share? Are there archives available to look at and where do we stand in the realm of actual OU/free energy devices at this time??? > >I look forward to sharing with all of you. > >Best regards, > > Alan Hi Alan! I don't know how you found out about this list, but welcome aboard. Bill Beaty is the moderator, and has all the archives at: http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/flist.html That is his original site, and I don't know if it's the same as the new address that he's been using, http://www.amasci.com/ but if you poke around, you'll find plenty of projects in there. A lot of the members of this list have sites of their own, as well, that are also full of ideas. Knuke Michael T. Huffman Huffman Technology Company 1121 Dustin Drive Lady Lake, Florida 32159 (352)259-1276 knuke@LCIA.COM http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Fri May 28 01:38:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id BAA28146; Fri, 28 May 1999 01:35:20 -0700 Resent-Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 01:35:20 -0700 Sender: gn@wisemansbrand.com Message-ID: <374E5447.32EEB752@wisemansbrand.com> Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 10:31:03 +0200 From: Gerard Nefkens Organization: (inventors site) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: greetings and questions... http://layo.com References: <001501bea882$5108d220$687988d1@monorailpc> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"GUE1P.0.ht6.7LbJt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10675 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Yes You can See: http://layo.com It's not the (not existing) O/-U but after some work it's cheap. PLEASE BE VERY PRUDENT FOR THE OXYGEN ! ! Gerard Nefkens France > code wrote: > > Hello All, > > I am new to this list and thought I'd take a moment to introduce > myself. My name is Alan and I have been working with OU/free energy > devices for about 3 years. I have constructed several different > devices...Newman motor/generator, Hendershot device, Bedini generator, > magnetic motors, etc... and wish I could say I have had great success; > but alas, I have had only meager results with the devices I have > constucted. I have been focusing my attention in different areas for > the last year...specifically electromedicine...but have recently > returned to the world of free energy and am interested in working with > others to develop something workable. My goals are simply to attain > power self-sufficiency/get off the damn grid and help others do the > same. I'm not into making a fortune, seeking fame or looking to rip > people off with false claims of some "wonder" device; I just want to > know with all certainty that OU/free energy is possible, share that > knowledge and the means with others and pursue the options that such a > device can provide. > > Does anyone have any ideas/experiences they are willing to share? Are > there archives available to look at and where do we stand in the realm > of actual OU/free energy devices at this time??? > > I look forward to sharing with all of you. > > Best regards, > > Alan From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 29 06:16:49 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA03405; Sat, 29 May 1999 06:11:41 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 06:11:41 -0700 Message-ID: <374FE7B4.CD34FA5A@harti.com> Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 15:12:20 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: [Fwd: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ?] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Resent-Message-ID: <"OV5ui1.0.6r.DU-Jt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10676 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Betreff: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? Datum: Thu, 27 May 1999 18:14:24 -0400 Von: Alik Shereshevsky Rückantwort: alik@intergate.bc.ca An: harti@harti.com Stefan Hartmann wrote: > > Alik Shereshevsky schrieb: > > > > Years ago (1986) here was a VTOL (vertical take off ...) > > aircraft design from an outfit called Moshier tech. > > that was in turn based on NASA work on fluidic amplifiers. > > It was a real neat machine, wish I had one. > > > > What it did was to blow air from a jet engine into a short > > tube open from top and bottom. Fast hot air from the engine > > passed its energy to a larger volume of slower air "sucked in" > > from above. End result was greater lift than that achievable > > with the same jet engine standing on its tail. > > > > I think you created the same thing. Technically > > this is a "fluidic gear-box" where you exchange energy of > > smaller volume of fast air for a greater volume of slower > > moving air. If you think in electrical terms it could be > > looked at as a transformer perhaps (and therefore impedance > > matching concept could apply). > > > > Alik S. > > Yes, that could be ! > But I guess the air coming out at the end of my tube had at least the > same > speed as I blew out with my mouth... > > but maybe you are right. > > Thanks for the good explanation. > > Must have been a good jet engine. > > Is it still used ? > > Best regards, Stefan. You can see the plane under Moshier Technologies 'Aurora' in Jane's Aircraft 1984/5/6. The engine I think was a a standard tfe731 . The thrust gain was quoted as 1.8. Also , it had the effect of cooling the exhaust to keep the thing from melting parking lots (like a Harrier). It is always possible that you do have something really exotic going on. Could stick pressure sensors (surplus microminiature Endevco sensors pop up here and there) and/or microphones in the tube. Good Luck , Alik S From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 29 06:23:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA05813; Sat, 29 May 1999 06:23:14 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 06:23:14 -0700 Message-ID: <374FE859.52B08220@harti.com> Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 15:15:05 +0200 From: Stefan Hartmann Reply-To: harti@harti.com Organization: Hartmann Multimedia Service X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200 (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Free Energy , Newman-L Mailing List Subject: [Fwd: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ?] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3l1AJ.0.kQ1.2f-Jt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10677 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: -------- Original Message -------- Betreff: Re: plastic tube wind accelerator, how does it work ? Datum: Thu, 27 May 1999 21:05:40 EDT Von: MATTIARO@aol.com An: harti@harti.com Hello all. Take the Bernuli's equation. dV = 1/dP Delta Velocity = inverse function of Delta Pressure. What this means in English is that hiher the velocity, lower the pressure. When you blow into the tube, you are increasing the velocity of the air. And if you increase the velocity, you lower the pressure. That is the phenomena that "sucks" in more air. That is the same principle that makes the Venturi work. See Venturi principle. Matti From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 29 19:02:27 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA30140; Sat, 29 May 1999 19:01:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 19:01:54 -0700 Message-ID: <002501beaa49$48087180$917988d1@monorailpc> From: "code" To: Subject: Re: greetings and questions... Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 20:05:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"Mgt231.0.nM7.Hm9Kt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10678 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Dave, Thanx for the information. Best regards, Alan -----Original Message----- From: Dave Dameron To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Thursday, May 27, 1999 10:03 PM Subject: Re: greetings and questions... >Hi! >At 01:48 PM 5/27/99 -0700, you wrote: >>Hello All, >> >> I am new to this list and thought I'd take a moment to introduce myself. > My name is Alan and I have been working with OU/free energy devices for >about 3 years. > >>Does anyone have any ideas/experiences they are willing to share? Are >there archives available to look at and where do we stand in the realm of >actual OU/free energy devices at this time??? > >The freenrg-l has archives which are interesting to browse through. >There are also (Keelynet Bboard) starting at >http://www.spiritweb.org/KeelyNet/Public-Messages/m001-199.txt.html >-Dave > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 29 19:06:12 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA32154; Sat, 29 May 1999 19:05:28 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 19:05:28 -0700 Message-ID: <002a01beaa49$c97b7b40$917988d1@monorailpc> From: "code" To: Subject: Re: greetings and questions... Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 20:09:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"V4uo83.0.Js7.dp9Kt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10679 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Knuke, I found the list via an internet search but have known of Bill's site for several years. I'm lucky to have found a group of individuals who are actively pursuing this area. I appreciate the information and look forward to sharing any developments. Best regards, Alan -----Original Message----- From: Michael T Huffman To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Thursday, May 27, 1999 10:09 PM Subject: Re: greetings and questions... >Alan wrote: >>Does anyone have any ideas/experiences they are willing to share? Are >there archives available to look at and where do we stand in the realm of >actual OU/free energy devices at this time??? >> >>I look forward to sharing with all of you. >> >>Best regards, >> >> Alan > >Hi Alan! > >I don't know how you found out about this list, but welcome aboard. Bill >Beaty is the moderator, and has all the archives at: > >http://www.eskimo.com/~bilb/freenrgl/flist.html > >That is his original site, and I don't know if it's the same as the new >address that he's been using, > >http://www.amasci.com/ > >but if you poke around, you'll find plenty of projects in there. A lot of >the members of this list have sites of their own, as well, that are also >full of ideas. > >Knuke > >Michael T. Huffman >Huffman Technology Company >1121 Dustin Drive >Lady Lake, Florida 32159 >(352)259-1276 >knuke@LCIA.COM >http://www.aa.net/~knuke/index.htm > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sat May 29 19:16:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id TAA03676; Sat, 29 May 1999 19:14:54 -0700 Resent-Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 19:14:54 -0700 Message-ID: <005b01beaa4b$1b461740$917988d1@monorailpc> From: "code" To: Subject: Re: greetings and questions... http://layo.com Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 20:18:36 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"DnID51.0.Ev.Ty9Kt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10680 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hello Gerard, Thanx for the information; very interesting stuff! Have you or anyone you know actually constructed one of these devices? Thanx again and best regards, Alan -----Original Message----- From: Gerard Nefkens To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Friday, May 28, 1999 2:44 AM Subject: Re: greetings and questions... http://layo.com >Yes You can > >See: >http://layo.com > >It's not the (not existing) O/-U >but after some work it's cheap. > >PLEASE BE VERY PRUDENT FOR THE OXYGEN ! ! > >Gerard Nefkens >France > >> code wrote: >> >> Hello All, >> >> I am new to this list and thought I'd take a moment to introduce >> myself. My name is Alan and I have been working with OU/free energy >> devices for about 3 years. I have constructed several different >> devices...Newman motor/generator, Hendershot device, Bedini generator, >> magnetic motors, etc... and wish I could say I have had great success; >> but alas, I have had only meager results with the devices I have >> constucted. I have been focusing my attention in different areas for >> the last year...specifically electromedicine...but have recently >> returned to the world of free energy and am interested in working with >> others to develop something workable. My goals are simply to attain >> power self-sufficiency/get off the damn grid and help others do the >> same. I'm not into making a fortune, seeking fame or looking to rip >> people off with false claims of some "wonder" device; I just want to >> know with all certainty that OU/free energy is possible, share that >> knowledge and the means with others and pursue the options that such a >> device can provide. >> >> Does anyone have any ideas/experiences they are willing to share? Are >> there archives available to look at and where do we stand in the realm >> of actual OU/free energy devices at this time??? >> >> I look forward to sharing with all of you. >> >> Best regards, >> >> Alan > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 30 17:43:44 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id RAA17372; Sun, 30 May 1999 17:42:59 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 17:42:59 -0700 Message-ID: <006901beaafd$eeeb5300$2d684fc6@default> From: "mrand@access" To: "freenrg-l" Subject: Free Energy Announcement Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 17:38:40 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"KC4W3.0.LF4.IiTKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10681 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: To Freenrg-l: Has anyone here heard of the following press release? Posted as is on another discussion list. Any additonal info? I tried to e-mail starpro but got an error message 'user unknown'. Thanks - Michael >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >RE: Press Release >Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 15:43:06 -0500 >From: starpro starpr-@wt.net > > >Husband and wife inventors in Western Australia have found the solution to >one of the world's most pressing problems. A revolutionary invention that >produces electrical power from a renewable energy source, without recourse >to nature. An invention which will reduce pollution and decrease the effects >of respiratory disease; global warming; the greenhouse effect and holes in >the ozone layer. An invention that does not damage the environment nor rely >on fossil fuels. An invention which can save "billions of dollars", both >economically and environmentally. > > >Patents are pending. But they are now seeking active interest from >large-scale investors and/or companies looking to participate with a view to >manufacture and/or production. Interested parties should contact the >inventors at the address below: > > > > Peter & Susan Olohan > 41/289 Sydney Road > GNANGARA > WESTERN AUSTRALIA 6065 > Phone/Fax: 0116189-4051588 > > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 30 20:49:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA28778; Sun, 30 May 1999 20:49:00 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 20:49:00 -0700 Message-Id: <199905310350.AAA24983@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: That's the question ! To: interact@keelynet.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 00:51:08 -3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Solar roof means toast for free ! Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Resent-Message-ID: <"p8DUv1.0.U17.hQWKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10682 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: http://news1.thdo.bbc.co.uk/low/english/sci/tech/newsid_354000/354646.stm --- Marcelo Puhl mark@plug-in.com.br From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Sun May 30 20:55:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id UAA01846; Sun, 30 May 1999 20:55:17 -0700 Resent-Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 20:55:17 -0700 Message-Id: <199905310357.AAA26198@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: That's the question ! To: "mrand@access" Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 00:57:38 -3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Free Energy Announcement Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br CC: freenrg-l@eskimo.com, interact@keelynet.com Priority: normal In-reply-to: <006901beaafd$eeeb5300$2d684fc6@default> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Resent-Message-ID: <"3o1u42.0.lS.aWWKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10683 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > > Has anyone here heard of the following press release? Posted as is on > another discussion list. Any additonal info? I tried to e-mail starpro > but got an error message 'user unknown'. > > Thanks - Michael > A search on altavista revealed : Peter Olohan - Email:starpro@wt.net I guess you shoul try again. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >RE: Press Release > >Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 15:43:06 -0500 > >From: starpro starpr-@wt.net > > > > > >Husband and wife inventors in Western Australia have found the solution > >to one of the world's most pressing problems. A revolutionary invention > >that produces electrical power from a renewable energy source, without > >recourse to nature. An invention which will reduce pollution and decrease > >the > effects > >of respiratory disease; global warming; the greenhouse effect and holes > >in the ozone layer. An invention that does not damage the environment nor > >rely on fossil fuels. An invention which can save "billions of dollars", > >both economically and environmentally. > > > > > >Patents are pending. But they are now seeking active interest from > >large-scale investors and/or companies looking to participate with a view > to > >manufacture and/or production. Interested parties should contact the > >inventors at the address below: > > > > > > > > Peter & Susan Olohan > > 41/289 Sydney Road > > GNANGARA > > WESTERN AUSTRALIA 6065 > > Phone/Fax: 0116189-4051588 > > > > > > > > --- Marcelo Puhl mark@plug-in.com.br From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 00:23:53 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id AAA05384; Mon, 31 May 1999 00:23:25 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 00:23:25 -0700 Message-Id: <199905310723.JAA94039@poindexter.wirehub.nl> From: "Aris" To: Subject: Re: Free Energy Announcement Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 09:16:40 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"K4I0C2.0.yJ1.jZZKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10684 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Well there is a phone/fax number, anyone can call for information?! Regards, Aris... ---------- > Van: mrand@access > Aan: freenrg-l > Onderwerp: Free Energy Announcement > Datum: maandag 31 mei 1999 2:38 > > To Freenrg-l: > > Has anyone here heard of the following press release? Posted as is on > another discussion list. Any additonal info? I tried to e-mail starpro > but got an error message 'user unknown'. > > Thanks - Michael > > > > Peter & Susan Olohan > > 41/289 Sydney Road > > GNANGARA > > WESTERN AUSTRALIA 6065 > > Phone/Fax: 0116189-4051588 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 04:27:20 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id EAA29604; Mon, 31 May 1999 04:26:43 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 04:26:43 -0700 Message-ID: <375272E1.22FD649D@erie.net> Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 07:30:41 -0400 From: Norm Biss X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "freenrg-l@eskimo.com" Subject: [Fwd: RE: your invention] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"XxU2d3.0.TE7.o7dKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10685 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Michael, Here is what I got in return for my query. They required a receipt for the message. Hope you have some luck. Regards, Norm -------- Original Message -------- Subject: RE: your invention Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 01:53:41 -0500 From: starpro To: "'Norm Biss'" Hi Norm, Could you be a little more specific, we represent a considerable number of inventors worldwide. Not quite sure what you mean re OU device? Regards, Jeff Leight -----Original Message----- From: Norm Biss [SMTP:normpems@erie.net] Sent: Sunday, May 30, 1999 8:04 PM To: starpro@wt.net Subject: your invention To: The poster of the OU device. Could you contact me so we can discuss your invention? Thanks, Norm Biss Erie, Pa. 5-30-99 normpems@erie.net From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 06:25:05 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA15474; Mon, 31 May 1999 06:24:40 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 06:24:40 -0700 Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 07:23:21 -0600 (MDT) From: "Jorg D. Ostrowski" X-Sender: jdo@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca To: Marcelo Puhl Cc: "mrand@access" , freenrg-l@eskimo.com, interact@keelynet.com Subject: Re: FE Announcement/electrical power from a renewable energy source In-Reply-To: <199905310357.AAA26198@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"to4M53.0.hn3.OseKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10686 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Marc or anyone: If you or anyone make any progress with a more detailed description of the above, please post it to the list. Jorg Ostrowski ______________________________________________________________________ On Mon, 31 May 1999, Marcelo Puhl wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > >RE: Press Release > > >Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 15:43:06 -0500 > > >From: starpro starpr-@wt.net > > > > > >Husband and wife inventors in Western Australia have found the solution > > >to one of the world's most pressing problems. A revolutionary invention > > >that produces electrical power from a renewable energy source, without > > >recourse to nature. An invention which will reduce pollution and decrease > > >the > > effects > > >of respiratory disease; global warming; the greenhouse effect and holes > > >in the ozone layer. An invention that does not damage the environment nor > > >rely on fossil fuels. An invention which can save "billions of dollars", > > >both economically and environmentally. > > > > > > > > >Patents are pending. But they are now seeking active interest from > > >large-scale investors and/or companies looking to participate with a view > > to > > >manufacture and/or production. Interested parties should contact the > > >inventors at the address below: > > > > > > > > > > > > Peter & Susan Olohan > > > 41/289 Sydney Road > > > GNANGARA > > > WESTERN AUSTRALIA 6065 > > > Phone/Fax: 0116189-4051588 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > Marcelo Puhl > mark@plug-in.com.br > > From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 06:27:43 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id GAA16463; Mon, 31 May 1999 06:27:15 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 06:27:15 -0700 Message-Id: <199905311329.KAA18785@bigbox.plug-in.com.br> From: "Marcelo Puhl" Organization: That's the question ! To: interact@keelynet.com, freenrg-l@eskimo.com Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 10:29:30 -3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Australian Free Energy device Reply-to: mark@plug-in.com.br Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.11) Resent-Message-ID: <"u5CoC2.0.814.oueKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10687 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Here is a message I got from "starpro": ------- Forwarded Message Follows ------- From: starpro To: "'mark@plug-in.com.br'" Subject: RE: Energy device Date sent: Mon, 31 May 1999 01:49:04 -0500 Marcelo, Thank you for your inquiry. The Inventors can be contacted as follows: PETER & SUSAN OLOHAN 41/289 SYDNEY ROAD GNANGARA WESTERN AUSTRALIA 6065 PHONE/FAX: 6189-4051588 They wish to deal with all inquiries themselves, so if possible I should fax them. Best Regards, Jeff Leight ------------------------------- --- Marcelo Puhl mark@plug-in.com.br From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 10:46:25 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id KAA16043; Mon, 31 May 1999 10:37:09 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 10:37:09 -0700 Message-ID: <000601beab8c$568e73a0$6a11fea9@y9g6r3> From: "atglab" To: Subject: Re: Free Energy Announcement Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 12:38:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Resent-Message-ID: <"gNtuJ2.0.Ww3.4ZiKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10688 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: From: mrand@access To: freenrg-l Date: Sunday, May 30, 1999 7:44 PM Subject: Free Energy Announcement >To Freenrg-l: > >Has anyone here heard of the following press release? Posted as is on >another discussion list. Any additonal info? I tried to e-mail starpro >but got an error message 'user unknown'. > >Thanks - Michael > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>RE: Press Release >>Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 15:43:06 -0500 >>From: starpro starpr-@wt.net >> >> >> >> >> Peter & Susan Olohan >> 41/289 Sydney Road >> GNANGARA >> WESTERN AUSTRALIA 6065 >> Phone/Fax: 0116189-4051588 >> >> >> This seems strange as to the best of my knowledge wt.net is located in Texas. If this release is valid then it was by a third party. From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 11:53:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id LAA03492; Mon, 31 May 1999 11:50:44 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 11:50:44 -0700 Message-ID: <3752D990.DF9FD453@keelynet.com> Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 13:48:48 -0500 From: "Jerry W. Decker" Reply-To: jdecker@keelynet.com Organization: KeelyNet X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Fwd: RE: your invention] References: <375272E1.22FD649D@erie.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"uS-ma1.0.Rs.3ejKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10689 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi Folks! Along with the other queries to Starpro, I received the following; -------------- Subject: RE: the Olohan press release of May 27, 1999 Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 01:48:03 -0500 From: starpro To: "'jdecker@keelynet.com'" Jerry, Thank you for your inquiry. The Inventors can be contacted as follows: PETER & SUSAN OLOHAN 41/289 SYDNEY ROAD GNANGARA WESTERN AUSTRALIA 6065 PHONE/FAX: 6189-4051588 They wish to deal with all inquiries themselves, so if possible I should fax them. Best Regards, Jeff Leight -- Jerry Wayne Decker / jdecker@keelynet.com http://keelynet.com / "From an Art to a Science" Voice : (214) 324-8741 / FAX : (214) 324-3501 KeelyNet - PO BOX 870716 - Mesquite - Republic of Texas - 75187 From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 15:04:01 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id PAA13433; Mon, 31 May 1999 15:03:23 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 15:03:23 -0700 Message-Id: <199905312203.AAA32203@poindexter.wirehub.nl> From: "Aris" To: Subject: Re: Free Energy Announcement Date: Tue, 1 Jun 1999 00:05:54 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3p0Cx2.0.oH3.hSmKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10690 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: > >> Peter & Susan Olohan > >> 41/289 Sydney Road > >> GNANGARA > >> WESTERN AUSTRALIA 6065 > >> Phone/Fax: 0116189-4051588 > >> > >> > >> > > > This seems strange as to the best of my knowledge wt.net is located in > Texas. If this release is valid then it was by a third party. Well for my, I wonder, if any aussie has called or faxed this number.......... I'm very interested.... Regards, Aris... From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 16:50:21 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id QAA11791; Mon, 31 May 1999 16:50:03 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 16:50:03 -0700 X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au X-BPC-Relay-Envelope-To: X-BPC-Relay-Sender-Host: CPE-24-192-27-67.vic.bigpond.net.au [24.192.27.67] X-BPC-Relay-Info: Message delivered directly. From: rvanspaa@vic.bigpond.net.au (Robin van Spaandonk) To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: Free Energy Announcement Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 23:49:30 GMT Organization: Improving Message-ID: <37531fe0.77367474@mail-hub> References: <199905312203.AAA32203@poindexter.wirehub.nl> In-Reply-To: <199905312203.AAA32203@poindexter.wirehub.nl> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by mx1.eskimo.com id QAA11774 Resent-Message-ID: <"THbzv3.0.8u2.g0oKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10691 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: On Tue, 1 Jun 1999 00:05:54 +0200, Aris wrote: [snip] >Well for my, I wonder, if any aussie has called or faxed this >number.......... > >I'm very interested.... > > >Regards, > >Aris... I sent them a fax, but haven't heard anything back yet. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk From freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Mon May 31 22:15:33 1999 Received: (from smartlst@localhost) by mx1.eskimo.com (8.9.1a/8.8.8) id WAA28395; Mon, 31 May 1999 22:14:45 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 22:14:45 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.6.16.19990531203135.2e17271e@earthlink.net> X-Sender: ddameron@earthlink.net (Unverified) X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.6 (16) Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 20:31:35 To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com From: Dave Dameron Subject: More VACE tests In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19990512003025.01086100@inforamp.net> References: <3.0.6.16.19990511182351.226f007e@earthlink.net> <3.0.5.32.19990510231749.009c0a90@inforamp.net> <000a01be9b25$69f34b40$5c1bfea9@y9g6r3> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"hE54o2.0.Vx6.4nsKt"@mx1> Resent-From: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Reply-To: freenrg-l@eskimo.com X-Mailing-List: archive/latest/10692 X-Loop: freenrg-l@eskimo.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: freenrg-l-request@eskimo.com Status: O X-Status: Hi All, In my last post I was testing the interaction of a toroidal electromagnet with a permanent magnet toroid. I had found that I could reverse the slight attraction/repulsion by changing either the current or the sense of the PM toroid (CW/CCW). I estimate the relative permibility of the electromagnet core to be about 50 to 100. Well, I have replaced the toroidal electromagnet with a single loop, without any ferromagnetic material, to get a clearer idea of what's going on. The loop is still on the end of a pendulum. Although the loop isn't an "isolated" straight current element, portions do seem to act that way with just a small neodym. magnet (Fields circulating around the wire, strongest at the wire surface, etc). With the axis of the PM toroid and wire segment aligned, I could see the same attraction/repulsion as with the toroid, but much stronger. However, I found another factor that has a big effect. If I rotate the PM toroid about its axis, I can change the direction of the force. The PM toroid does not have constant cross-sectional area. so the current density varies with 1/this area, if total flux = constant. In another test, I tried running the wire through the toroid, coinciding real and virtual currents, and it always was attracted to some part of the toroid. In another test, If the loop axis is still horizontal, but the PM axis is now vertical, the interaction is like a normal magnet, that is, attracted to one side or other of the wire. I have found some small ceramic ring magnets, but haven't tried to repole them. -Dave