This is for christians... do you believe what "christ" said in the bible.

(have u ever even read it?)

Maybe christians hate jesus, because they go against everything he said. Need proof?

Just read the red words in the bible (the ones jesus said)... Then think about how christians act and what they say.

Jesus: "Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you."

Jesus: "When you pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking."

Jesus: "Hear, and understand: Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man."

Jesus: "Hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye."

Jesus: "Many shall come in my name (christians), and they shall deceive many nations."

Interesting...

Nobody can do as Jesus did, he set too high a standard.

Shouldn't even try, it's just not possible for a normal human.

[This message has been edited by Kikey_Kikeowitz (edited 08-01-2003).]

quote:Originally posted by Kikey_Kikeowitz:

[B]Nobody can do as Jesus did, he set too high a standard.[B]

I see what you're saying. But the point was that christians are anti-christ, because they teach opposite ideals.

quote:Originally posted by Viraljimmy:

I see what you're saying. But the point was that christians are anti-christ, because they teach opposite ideals.

Perhaps you could share some specific examples, drawing from accepted Christian doctrine? How have various Christian groups violated these tenets?

[This message has been edited by Armed&Angry (edited 08-02-2003).]

I am sad to say that you are exactly right. The vast majority of those who call themselfs "christians" are actualy "anti-christ" in that thier actions go against what Jesus taught. I'm a Christian and I do my best to live as Jesus lived. I do not allow any hate in my heart, not even against my enemies. It is impossable for man alone to live as Christ lived however if we have the Holy Spirit in us it is possable. Anyone who calls himself a Christian and yet has hate in his heart is not a Christian. Anyone who calls himself a Christian and Does not whole heartedly fallow Christ and Strive to live and think as Christ did is a Liar, a deciever and an "anti-Christ". They do more damage to the Christian movement than any unone else. They are the children of the devil not Children of God. It's not easy to be a christian, it is a strugle but it can be done and has been done by thousands. With God all things are possable.

i was born into a strongly christian family and went to church like clockwork until i was 14 years old......

the reason i left was that i felt that church was just politics...my son is better than your son....my house is bigger than your house etc....

then we never really got taught much at church...it was lame and boring stuff, not even put across properly or with enthusiasm...

in the time i went to church the only person i found who had read the complete bible, was my father...

church was just ritual bullshit....

i knew some people that really helped others , but they were either social workers or little old women who had nothing to do with church.

IN MY TIME SPENT AT THE CHURCHES I NEVER ONCE MET A PERSON I WOULD SAY IS A TRUE CHRISTIAN.......I CAN FIND AND PROVE MAJORLY THAT THEY DO NOT BELIEVE IN GOD.....

THE WAY CHRISTIANITY IS PRACTICED IN ENGLAND IS A FARCE...IT IS PATHETIC AND IS NOT WORTHY TO BE CALLED A RELIGION.

PEOPLE WILL SAY I AM WRONG....BUT I WOULD SAY AS A MATTER OF FACT .......1 IN 2000 CHRISTIANS ACTUALLY BELIEVE IN GOD...THE REST ARE JUST FOLLOWING A ROUTINE....

BY THE WAY THE FIRST COMMANDMENT IS 'THOU SHALT HAVE NO GOD BEFORE ME'' SO WHY DO CHRISTIANS AND CATHOLICS SPEND ALL DAY PRAISING JESUS AND MARY...WHY NOT JUST CUT TO THE CHASE....OBEY GOD AND PRAISE HIM.....

AND BY THE WAY IN THE BIBLE JESUS SAID 'I AM THE SON OF MAN'....HE NEVER ONCE SAID I AM THE SON OF GOD......

HE MAY HAVE LATER SAID THAT GOD WAS HIS FATHER....BUT IS GOD NOT THE FATHER OF ALL PEOPLE IN THE EYES OF A BELIEVER....BUT HE NEVER SAID THAT HE WAS THE SON OF GOD......



[This message has been edited by eBlip (edited 08-02-2003).]

quote:Originally posted by Armed&Angry:

Perhaps you could share some specific examples, drawing from accepted Christian doctrine? How have various Christian groups violated these tenets?

[This message has been edited by Armed&Angry (edited 08-02-2003).]

I am saying that "accepted christian doctrine" is what goes against jesus.

If the church said "go home and read what jesus said, then pray in secret for your own answers", then that would be fine.

But then how could they twist it around to control your little minds?

eBlip. I agree with most of what you say. I think that the estimate of 1 in 2000 Christians are actualy Christians is, well rather generous. I turn on the tv to the Christian channels and I am discusted by people who claim to be Spirit filled preachers, but they are married to this world though thier own greed and wealth. Its about money. A horrable thing but it's true. They sit there and talk about God and say they love Jesus but at the same time they have millions of Dollars (Benny Hin makes over 60 mill a year) and do nothing as others starve and go homeless. If they had Christ they wouldn't do that. They lead millions astray by their teaching. and yes I have read the whole bible and I have also read the Koran.

But Jesus DID claim to be God. Several times. There are more scripture refrences than I have time to put down so I'll just put a few. First is John 1:1-5 were Jesus is the word that is with God and IS God.

also some other claims of divinity come from him making claims of attributes that can only belong to God.

OMNIPRESENCE--Matt 18:20 Matt 28:19-20, John 3:13 (Jesus claims to be in Jeruselem and Heaven)

ETERNALITY--John 6:62, John 16:28, John 17:5

OMNISCIENCE--Matt 11:2, Rev 2:23, Matt 24:35

OMNIPOTENCE--John 5:21, John 10:30

ALLOWS HIMSELF TO BE CALLED GOD--John 20:28

PPREEXISTENT--John 8:56-58 this one is very interesting in that it is a direct claim to deity. When he is questioned by the Pharesees he says "before abraham was "I AM". Now the word "I AM" in hebrew was "yahway" Wich was the most sacred name for God. So sacred that the Jews used the name Jehovah instead. This goes back to when moses was talking to god in the burning bush and Moses asked his name and God simply said "I AM" or "I am who I am" So basicly Jesus said "before Abraham was "GOD", or "I'm God" The Jews knew this was a direct claim to deity because they tried to stone him for claiming to be God.

FEW DIRECT CLAIMS--John 14:9, John 5:25, Mark 14:61-62, John 10:36-37.

There is much much more if you want to know more I well tell you.

quote:Originally posted by Viraljimmy:

I am saying that "accepted christian doctrine" is what goes against jesus.

If the church said "go home and read what jesus said, then pray in secret for your own answers", then that would be fine.

But then how could they twist it around to control your little minds?

You give examples of the teachings of Jesus. You do not give examples of the church doctrines that supposedly exist in diametric opposition to them. Do you see the gap in your argument here?

And yes, some Christians are assholes, but damn, eBlip, I think you just got a particularly asshole-ridden church. I went to a nice little place called Ascension Lutheran Church for several years, and while the entire belief system is based on a ridiculously innacurate reading of the historical record, the fact remains that the people there were solid gold. You can be misguided and friendly at the same time.

quote:Originally posted by Armed&Angry:

You give examples of the teachings of Jesus. You do not give examples of the church doctrines that supposedly exist in diametric opposition to them. Do you see the gap in your argument here?

Ok, Armed&Angry. Here goes...

Jesus: "Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you..."

When has the church ever tried to stop war? Never. Especially if it was going to make them money. Crusades, anyone? Just look what happened with this last Iraq war. Every biblethumper in the country was saying how god was backing the war.

Jesus: "When you pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking."

I assume you went to church. How many times did you say the lord's prayer? And for catholics, they know how much chanting-like-the-heathens they do.

I still hear christians say "an eye for an eye". They don't know that jesus said the opposite?

Jesus: "Hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye."

Christians need to see how fucked up they are, then worry about everyone else.

"Love each other" was the message. Everything else is details. But the christians, full of hatred, preach about sinners and sins, and damnation.

Jesus: "Many shall come in my name (christians), and they shall deceive many nations."

What that means, is that the message has been lost. Christianity is just another way to control people now.

Don't go to church. Think for yourself.