You hear me say that. But it occurs to me that I've rarely if ever recommended some actual books. So here, try some of these on for size before you say stupid things. And hey, maybe you can find a hole I missed and bust my chops here online. Heh, that'll be the day. Happy reading, kids.

"Atheism: The Case Against God" - the basic text on atheism. It's a pretty good treatment of the subject, though it seems to focus an inordinate amount of attention on Christianity.

"Christianity on Trial" - An excellent defense of Christianity's good works in the world, and it avoids getting into the theological debate. A quality historical text.

The Bible - Skim through it at least once. And get down and really study important books like Job and the Gospels.

"The Myth Maker - Paul and the Invention of Christianity" - the best general discussion I've read of the gradual growth of the Savior Cult called Christianity.

"Nonzero: The Logic of Human Destiny" - the author is actually a grudging theist, but the text is a demolition par excellence of the Daniel Quinn types.

Bump. You kids need to read this shit.

quote:Originally posted by Armed&Angry:

"The Myth Maker - Paul and the Invention of Christianity" - the best general discussion I've read of the gradual growth of the Savior Cult called Christianity.



See also:

"The Christian Conspiracy" by Dr. L. David Moore - This book details the founding of the Christian church from ground zero through the ecumenical councils and into present day with all it's schizms and factions.

quote:Originally posted by Armed&Angry:

You hear me say that. But it occurs to me that I've rarely if ever recommended some actual books. So here, try some of these on for size before you say stupid things. And hey, maybe you can find a hole I missed and bust my chops here online. Heh, that'll be the day. Happy reading, kids.

"Atheism: The Case Against God" - the basic text on atheism. It's a pretty good treatment of the subject, though it seems to focus an inordinate amount of attention on Christianity.

"Christianity on Trial" - An excellent defense of Christianity's good works in the world, and it avoids getting into the theological debate. A quality historical text.

The Bible - Skim through it at least once. And get down and really study important books like Job and the Gospels.

"The Myth Maker - Paul and the Invention of Christianity" - the best general discussion I've read of the gradual growth of the Savior Cult called Christianity.

"Nonzero: The Logic of Human Destiny" - the author is actually a grudging theist, but the text is a demolition par excellence of the Daniel Quinn types.



WOW! HOW EXCITING.....i cant wait to get stuck in.

theres gonna be some really exciting evenings ahead.......

rolling all over my living room floor laughing in floods of tears.........

sides splitting...

but on a more serious note......im sure these are interesting books to anyone interested in general religious thought...

but as you well know by now......not for me im afraid....but its nice of you to put some of your sources up nevertheless.

quote:Originally posted by ChaosWyrm:

"The Christian Conspiracy" by Dr. L. David Moore - This book details the founding of the Christian church from ground zero through the ecumenical councils and into present day with all it's schizms and factions.

I shall have to pick that one up. As for you, eBlip, if you're not willing to read a few books now and then, don't be surprised when people call you a dumbass. Because, well, you are.

I'm not always able to log on to Totse, so therefore I miss out on many conversations.

Armed & Angry, from the gist of your post I take it, you are theist. Just curious, what is the meaning of dropping the A ?

Books are simply a persons illustrations and ideas on how they perceive a subject.

I suggest reading the book, En Route to Global Occupation by Gary Kah, or that last publication of William Cooper, the one about the White Horse or Dramatic Prophecies of the Great Pyramids by Benavides.

Um... what? No, I'm an atheist. I just realize that certain religions, despite their falsity, have had a positive effect on human society. If you knew I meant this, and were just being a smartass, then wake up and realize that the world doesn't consist of neat, black and white concepts. Otherwise, I hope this clarifies things.

As for your reading selections... I'll head down to the library and check on those when I get a chance. At the moment, my plate is sorta full with reading - gotta finish "Atlas Shrugged," polish off "Europe: A History," and then reread certain portions of "The New Dealer's War" in preparation for an encroaching argument. I'll get to them, gimme some time.

I siggest to a lot of you non christians, read a king james bible. The wording is a pain, but it gives you an idea of the meaning of the bible. Not some one's interpretation.

Other then that, I suggest the thordo bodel, don't know if I spelt it right though.

No, not being a smartass. I'm not an atheist, so I don't understand the reasoning.

As far as I am concerned, its all going on right now, two forces, 21st century style.

quote:Originally posted by Syko:

I siggest to a lot of you non christians, read a king james bible. The wording is a pain, but it gives you an idea of the meaning of the bible. Not some one's interpretation.

Other then that, I suggest the thordo bodel, don't know if I spelt it right though.

Yeah, because the King James Bible is closest to the original meaning. It's a mistranslation of a mistranslation of a historically fallacial sequel to the mistranslated version of the Hebrew Bible. Yup, that's a goddamn unimpeachable source.

The KJV does have the advantage of being regarded as authoritative for centuries, making its role in history and Chrsitian theology more significant than later (often worse) translations. Plus its language is more flowery.

Well, as soon as I run out of books, I'll definitly try to get at least one of those books on your list A&A.

quote:Originally posted by Syko:



Other then that, I suggest the thordo bodel, don't know if I spelt it right though.

That's "Bardo Thodol" or Tibetan Book of the Dead in common parlance...

quote:Originally posted by Syko:

I siggest to a lot of you non christians, read a king james bible. The wording is a pain, but it gives you an idea of the meaning of the bible. Not some one's interpretation.

Other then that, I suggest the thordo bodel, don't know if I spelt it right though.

Are you serious? The King James version sucks big time, and grossly distorts the original texts. For instance, consider the famous phrase "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live." The orignal source says "poisoner," not witch. Thing is, James had a hard-on for witches. Which, by the way, is why the Scottish play has so much supernatural shit in it.

King James, indeed. It is to laugh.

Getting off topic a bit, but, much if not all modern religions were based on....mmmmm...paganism. King James has been retranslated, but I thought it was a book NOT to be taken literally. If so, then there would be no rich in heaven, cause a camel can't get through the eye of a needle.

The Bible, King James or not, does provide basic principles of healthy living.

quote:Originally posted by ArmsMerchant:

. Thing is, James had a hard-on for witches. Which, by the way, is why the Scottish play has so much supernatural shit in it.

King James, indeed. It is to laugh.

Props for the MacB reference. By far my favorite of Shakespeare's works, though I certainly can't say I've read them all.

Since we're on the topic of book suggestions, I'd recommend "The Demon-Haunted

World: Science As a Candle in the Dark" by Carl Sagan.

quote:Originally posted by Shotokan_Brawler:

Well, as soon as I run out of books, I'll definitly try to get at least one of those books on your list A&A.

Your brain will thank you, lad! And thanks for the suggestion, Dark_Magneto, I've seen that one at Barnes&Noble a couple times. Think I'll pick it up once I finish with my current reading regimen.

quote:Originally posted by eBlip:



WOW! HOW EXCITING.....i cant wait to get stuck in.

theres gonna be some really exciting evenings ahead.......

rolling all over my living room floor laughing in floods of tears.........

sides splitting...

but on a more serious note......im sure these are interesting books to anyone interested in general religious thought...

but as you well know by now......not for me im afraid....but its nice of you to put some of your sources up nevertheless.



Huh. Seems to me that in order to effectively debate with an opponent, it is of great advantage to know the data the opponent has. Frankly, if I suspected I was in disagreement with the basic premises of these books, I'd make damned sure I read them - just so I would sound like I knew what I was talking about in any attack I might levy.

<shrug> But if dismissing the words without knowing them (and I opine that to be foolish), then that surely is your choice.

There are other religoins than christianity, of course. May a suggest a dive into the occult, the gnostic or the spiritual?

Techgnosis by Erik Davis is about myth and mysticism and how it relates to the modern age and high technology

Finnegan's Wake covers a broad range of religious ideas, and other ideas,and is full of crazy word plays(but goddamn is that book hard to understand)

Anything by Aleister Crowley, he is THE english speaking occultist of the 20th century

And Prometheus Rising by Robert Anton Wilson, which has bits of stuff from the previous mentioned books, and more!

quote:Originally posted by CheapShot:

There are other religoins than christianity, of course. May a suggest a dive into the occult, the gnostic or the spiritual?



These faiths still suffer from a lack of empirical basis, so sorry, think I'll pass. As a side note, I've never read "Finnegan's Wake" but I have listened to the song of the same name. Good tune.

Hmmm...I wouldn't recomend anything by Crowley to someone without any background in magick. It took me 2 years before I understood what the hell "the great beast" was talking about.

For those interested in western high magick I suggest "Modern Magick by Donald Kraig" it's a bit thick but it covers everything you need to know about ceromonial magick.

Once you have read that I suggest you pick up a book on the kabala. I liked Principles of the Qabalah by Amber Jayanti. But I think most books out there on pretty much the same level.