Being an athiest dosent hurt people who believe in god and vice verca so why do both sides try to convert the other? No where in any bible I have read does it say that converting other will be rewarded. Even if you believe that y ou will be rewarded in the after life by how many people you convert then there has to be better ways then shouting out my sides right. Maybe people should use this forum to discuss there religion and listen to others ideas. And as for the athiests if you scroll down tothe bottom of the select topic bar there are plenty of spaces with out names for you to discuss nothing in. Everyone understand athieism there nothing more to say about it other then nothing.

That's bull, barely anyone understands atheism, including most people who claim to be atheist. It's not the lack of beliefs or spirituality...it's the lack of a deity. There's as many varieties of atheists as there are theists.

You are right. No where, to my knowledge, does the bible say people will be rewarded for converting others. However, the bible does command all believers in God to spread his word to the world ( The Great Commission)

Assume there is a God, and the associated heaven and hell. If you're suposed to help people, what could help them more than saving them from going to hell?

If no one understands athiests the 100's of topics in this forum about athiestism has helped.

Even if any of the topics here are trying to convert people how many people do you think will be converted online by you?

My point is that there should be people discusing there diffrences her not forcing others to conform. We dont live in colonial times yet must the people here still persucute or try to force conversion.

atheism is not a belief, its a conclusion...

quote:Originally posted by mesbekevin:

Being an athiest dosent hurt people who believe in god and vice verca so why do both sides try to convert the other?

On the contrary, belief in an imaginary god does an immense amount of harm.

Besides the beaten-to-death historical examples of the Crusades, Inquisition, etc. we've have modern day creationists, trying to cripple science because they disagree with it, abortion clinic bombers, Islamic terrorists, gay bashers, etc.

Outside of North America, India and Pakistan both have the nuke and are quite ready to use it over religious differences; Arabs and Jews playing tit-for-tat because their books tell them different things about who deserves what land; bombs going off in Ireland because some people don't like the pope.

Nobody is trying to convert anybody. People here just enjoy debating their beliefes and trying to get their point across. If you feel that people are trying to convert one and other here, and you don't like that, then leave.

I love how so many people waste their time making topics about how we're all wasting our time debating [or attemtping to convert one and other in this case]. Very ironic.

As for athiests leaving, that one is answered real quick:

quote:My God Can Beat the Shit Out of Your God:

For discussing any and all religious viewpoints. Intolerance will not be tolerated. Keeping your sense of humor is required. Posting messages about theological paradoxes is encouraged.

Althiesm is a 'religious viewpoint' so athiest discussion is to take place here on the forums. If you don't like it, leave. Its very simple.

If you feel we are pretty much wasting our tiem here, stop wasting your time trying to convince us, and just go away. You will be able to do so much more with your time.

i'm not writing this to convert anyone to athiesm although I am strongly identified as ahthiest. If you are christian then you should understand infinity. christians preach about god being alive forever yet they can't understand rocks being here forever even though it is far more relevant. plus the fact that every force exerted on earth is also applied in space causing the very creation of earth. and if space hasn't been here forever then how would a god create a planet without matter since it can neither be made nor destroyed. Another point, can you show me heaven? no. Can I show you rocks? yes. Atheism is just a more complex yet exact theorization of how the earth was composed. I fall under the field of a scientologist athiest and any athiest of this "category" would most definitely agree with this belief, b/c they aren't afraid to admit that we will all just die one day and it will be over with. I do not hide behind a greater image as a false sense of security. Which makes me stronger and superior. so in other words unless you can get your head out of ur ass long enough to take in and consider some of the things i have written here then fuck u! http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

You couldn't even absorb your grammar and spelling lessons, so I refuse to absorb what you wrote. It's ignorant and arrogant. You're probably a young teen just trying to rebel against what your parents taught you...or you had shitty/no parents that gave you no support to learn a fucking thing.

quote:Atheism is just a more complex yet exact theorization of how the earth was composed.

No it isn't. Atheism is simply a belief that there is no God. An atheist can believe anything in regards to how the earth was created, there is no 'complex yet exact theorization of how the earth was composed' that all aatheists agree on.

quote:and if space hasn't been here forever then how would a god create a planet without matter since it can neither be made nor destroyed.

If God exists, he would not be bound by any limits. Creating the universe [or world] wouldn't be a 'work with what you've got' situation. If no matter exists he would create it.

quote:Another point, can you show me heaven? no. Can I show you rocks? yes.

Gods existance isn't dependant on whether or not heaven/hell exist. But that aside, can you show me your thoughts? No. Does that mean they don't exist? No. The things we don't understand/know could fill every book on the planet. A lack of current udnerstanding/knowledge towards something doesn't prove its not there. Hell, if people didn't go out on a limb and research and experiment with things people might think are illogical or simply don't exist, science wouldn't be where it is today. We as humans have a way of reaching a desired conclusion; it seems to me that we're more likely to discover something if we know what we're searching for rather then simply feeling our way through the dark, and before we discover something or fully understand it for that matter, it may seem obscure or illogical.

quote:I do not hide behind a greater image as a false sense of security.

I believe there is most likely a God [its not a definitive beliefe however, which probably seems clear]. I do not use this as a sense of security, not at all. I will agree, some may follow certain religions to shelter themselves of the fact that they may simply die one day and that will be the end of it all [it would be a subconcious reason no doubt] but that doesn't mean that everyone who believes in God, or follows a religion is doing it for this reason. I myself feel that theres a chance we will all just die and be gone, and that doesn't negate any belief in a God. Gods existance is by no means dependant on mine or anyone elses.

quote:Which makes me stronger and superior.

Anyone who believes in God or follows a certain religion because they fear some of the things that death may be is no doubt a bit weak minded. They lack the ability to accept that non-existance [for example] may be what we are all going to fall into when we die because they fear it. Logically this makes anyone who doesn't believe something out of fear stronger and superior [mentally], whether they believe in God, follow a certain religion, or not.

quote:unless you can get your head out of ur ass long enough to take in and consider some of the things i have written here then fuck u! http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

You too friend! http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

quote:Originally posted by SurahAhriman:

Assume there is a God, and the associated heaven and hell. If you're suposed to help people, what could help them more than saving them from going to hell?

Not inventing hell in the first place would be helpful.

quote:Originally posted by whateva:

atheism is not a belief, its a conclusion...

Uhh, well any conclusion you come to IS a belief. Unless you have somehow gathered ALL the facts, which my dear sir, you haven't. Now I used to claim atheism, not that I have become a religious moron because that's just fucking stupid, but I have accepted that I don't know jack shit, and will spend every second of my life gathering more information, looking at existance from every angle I can (this in part refers to good drugs for you dolts). Anyway the point is, to make a conclusion you have decided on a belief because you do not know everything about existance.

[This message has been edited by Froonhed (edited 01-30-2004).]

quote:Originally posted by Froonhed:

Uhh, well any conclusion you come to IS a belief.

Would you say that you believe Santa Claus doesn't exist?

Ok, check it out. There are 2 distinct different types of atheism: strong atheism and weak atheism.

A strong atheist believes that no gods exist whatsoever. They deny any and all gods whatsoever and claim that there is no way they can exist in our current reality.

The weak atheist simply lacks a belief in gods. They don't claim god exists or doesn't exist, they just don't believe in any gods.

Agnostics are undecided and/or believe it is impossible to know if gods exist or not.

Babies are de facto weak atheists. Since they lack the ability to understand or make a decision reguarding the god proposal, they don't posess a belief in any gods and are therfore weak atheists.

If you lived out in the wilderness your whole life and never heard of gods or anything like that, you would be a weak atheist as well.

I, myself, am a weak atheist in the most sense. Some projections of god that are internally contradictory like the Christian concept I reject, but the ultimate concept of god I don't have a belief in but remain open to.

I don't say it's impossible and I don't say it's true either. I don't find it likely that there would be some form of supernatural creator, but im open to the idea thatjust maybe there could be some form of one if given empirical supporting evidence strongly implicating it.

well if you want to speak of christian believers(myself being one)you shouldnt have any alterior motive when tryin to preach to someone other than to educate them about christ and hopefully convert them so as they will be saved. there isnt any reward for converting people. there is rewards for living a holy life and spreading the word of god but nuthin for conversion counts.(and trust me i have some idea what im talkin bout, i just spent the last half a week in a theology school and i regularly debate with priests and the such)

quote:Originally posted by Dark_Magneto:

Not inventing hell in the first place would be helpful.



Amusing but poignant. Again I applaud you Dark_Magneto.

-=CW=-

agnosticism is, in my opinion, the only reasonable belief system (if you can call it that) that is out there. athiests, true, to the point athiests, are making as uninformed a decision as any religious biblethumping freak. simply choosing to belief that there is no possible way to prove or disprove the existence of a higher being, and choosing not to side with either side of the debate IS the only reasonable stand to take...

just my opinion though...

What about being fully open to any ideas, be them for Gods existance or against, while at the same time still leaning towards one side more? That seems reasonable.

The way I see it, anything that gets you through your life better is reasonable.

quote:Originally posted by Craftian:

Would you say that you believe Santa Claus doesn't exist?

I don't see your point here, and why are you so obsessed with Santa Claus? Yes, I believe he doesn't exist. The stories reckon he lives at the North Pole, dudes have been there, and didn't see him, that still doesn't mean I know he doesn't exist because I haven't personally scoured the entire universe.

That and people are quick to admit the whole Santa Clause thing is nothing more then a story for children.