It's okay to fear love, but it's hellish to fear the fear of love.

If you fear love (through mis-understanding and lack of experience), then at least you know that it can never harm you. How can it, if it's love? If you fear love, then no matter what your fears are you are always focusing on a positive thing (love). If you fear love then no matter what fears you face you can always be sure that once you've confronted it you will see that it's not a threat at all but in fact fantastic and beautiful. because It's love.

To fear love would be something like this:

You see a girl you really like. You are afraid to talk to her. You can see of all the good things that may happen but they scare you. She may like you, want to stay with you, and maybe have sex with you. All this is positive in your eyes, but the fact that it's unknown makes you nervous about the unknown experiences that may lay ahead. This is a fear of positive experiences (love).

However if you fear the fear of love, then that will be different.

You won't be afraid of a positive thing like before, you will be afraid of a negative things - fear. You will not be focusing on the positive things that come with facing a fear of love, you will be focusing on the bad things that you fear about fear.

To fear fear would be something like this:

There is a girl that you really like. You are afraid to talk to her because if you do your fears will take a hold. You won't be able to talk and she'll think you're totally weak and not worth anything to her at all. You'll go home thinking that you aren't important to girls at all and these things that you love (girls) will never be close to you. All because you fear the fear that you may experience.

So if you fear love, that's okay. It's okay to fear!!! Even the strong people fear, but the reason they are strong is because they fear a positive thing and so have the courage and positivity to confront it.

Weak people however are afraid of fear, so they avoid the things they fear because all they can think of is all the bad things that can happen. After never confronting something, they can never see its beauty and so never be relaxed to it.

Don't be afraid to be afraid. Do what you fear, and know that its okay to be afraid. Although there really is no need.

Fear only had power over you if you fear it.



There may not be many people who understand this. If you are afraid of love then you might not know what it's like to be afraid of the fear of love, and Vica Versa, so you might not relate.

[This message has been edited by ---Beany--- (edited 02-28-2004).]

Is there anybody who is genuinely afraid of positive experiences?

And how do you avoid fearing fear? It's not like you can just decide to stop fearing (or, at least, I can't)

quote:Originally posted by Craftian:

Is there anybody who is genuinely afraid of positive experiences?



Yes, everyone. You may or may not already know, but there is no such thing as a negative experience. You can grow and become stronger with every experience providing your fear of the fear doesn't make you avoid it.

Someone may be experiencing fear when going for a meal with someone they haven't seen for years. This is an obvious positive experience, and you'll know that, but that won't stop you from going for the meal feeling nervous and afraid of the unknown. After the meal they will have learned that it was no threat at all and that they were able to cope, and so they will grow from the experience.

But if they fear the fear IE: They are afraid to experience the fear of stepping into the unknown, then they will most likely avoid those situations, and even if they don't, they will suffer the experience because all they can think about is the fear that they dreaded so much.

Love is all there is, so no matter what you experience you will always grow, as long as you aren't paralyzed by the fear of experiencing fear.



quote:And how do you avoid fearing fear? It's not like you can just decide to stop fearing (or, at least, I can't)

The only way to stop fearing is by experiencing what it is that you fear, then you'll see that it's not scary at all. That's why it's okay to "fear". You can't just simply stop fearing but you can be released by the hold that fear has on you by having trust in the fact that nothing is scary in truth, and these things you fear are okay to experience, and your reactions (such as crying or freaking out) are also okay to experience. This is when, bit by bit, the fear gradually disappears. If you avoid all the things you fear then you will always see those things as a threat and so be more and more limited by them.

The way to avoid fearing fear is to understand that it is okay to fear love. It's completely okay to be nervous with someone, to cry in front of people, to be upset if someone insults you. It doesn't mean you aren't a strong character. In fact it means that you are a strong character, since many other people would be too afraid to express their weaknesses. It means that you aren't afraid to experience those feelings of fear, which many people are, and are crippled by that fear of fear.

To fear love means to be afraid of the unknown, which is why, when you know it, you aren't afraid anymore.

But if you fear the fear of love, then you will avoid the fear and so never come to "know" the love.



[This message has been edited by ---Beany--- (edited 02-28-2004).]

what's love, beany?

^ Shit, I doubt I'm qualified to answer a question like that. It's the kind of question that has thousands of correct answers.

One thing that springs to my mind is its a feeling of unity between you and something else. Like in a relationship, where you know someone so well and deeply that it's almost like you work with each other as one entity. But it's not only exclusive to other people, you can feel a oneness with anything. An enlightened soul feels a unity with everything.

[This message has been edited by ---Beany--- (edited 02-28-2004).]

Well writen. Props. Though many types of fear. Love is always a nice touch.

Am i the only person who thinks Cheerios are kinda crappy? I guess the honey ones are good, but still who came up with the original?

I've never had them. Aren't the hoola shaped like cheerios?

Cheerios are cool.

It's well-written, but I don't agree with you. It's not "fear of the fear of love." It's fear of rejection, of not being able to attain that amount of love.

I believe he means simply being afraid of fear. Avoiding situations because there may be some degree of fear involved. Relationships was merely an example.

You may also be afraid of climbing a tall tall mountain. Which is ok, fear is human, but if you purposly never climb a mountain because it means you'd have to do something that makes you scared that's bad you'll never grow.

Being afraid happens, it's a defense mechanism. A lot of people have just let it go over board so that they're afraid of the thought that they're afraid. Afraid of life.

quote:Yes, everyone. You may or may not already know, but there is no such thing as a negative experience. You can grow and become stronger with every experience providing your fear of the fear doesn't make you avoid it.

Death. How do you "grow" from death? To assume that you do, is to assume that their is life, or experience after it...

quote:Originally posted by Rust:

Death. How do you "grow" from death? To assume that you do, is to assume that their is life, or experience after it...

What is Death? What dies? Is even a single unit of energy lost/destroyed?

Or is death a name given to something because it is not understood, and thus, feared?

LoveCompassionEquanimity http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

quote:Originally posted by I_Like_Traffic_Lights:

I believe he means simply being afraid of fear. Avoiding situations because there may be some degree of fear involved. Relationships was merely an example.

You may also be afraid of climbing a tall tall mountain. Which is ok, fear is human, but if you purposly never climb a mountain because it means you'd have to do something that makes you scared that's bad you'll never grow.

Being afraid happens, it's a defense mechanism. A lot of people have just let it go over board so that they're afraid of the thought that they're afraid. Afraid of life.

Yes that's it. There's more to my message but you get the gist. Nice one.

quote:Originally posted by Rust:

Death. How do you "grow" from death? To assume that you do, is to assume that their is life, or experience after it...

To believe death is an end seems crazy to me. I believe that death is only the death of the body, and since we are spirit, after death we take all our aquired wisdom to the next life. We may not be aware of the wisdom within us, but it's there. When I say "Grow" I guess i mean facing fears and becoming wiser from the experience. Wisdom is what comes as you move closer to the "truth". Closer to God or whatever the ultimate reality is, which is everything. So to understand ultimate reality you can't be afraid of it.

Exactly, if at the moment of death you still have fear controlling your conciousness than you've missed something and must go back to learn more. If you embrace the concept of your death without fear than you're ready. I don't mean suicide either because that's being afraid of life, so that's way off.

Or perhaps there's no higher purpose, either way there's nothing really to fear.

quote:Originally posted by I_Like_Traffic_Lights:

Or perhaps there's no higher purpose, either way there's nothing really to fear.

Apart from fear itself.

Or at least the only thing to fear is the fear of fe......... oh never mind. Lol

FDR was an incestual dyke loving asshole who wiped his ass with the constitution.

Here's an interesting thought.

If you feared doing something bad such as murdering someone. Is this also a fear that you should face?

I think it is, but I can't be assed to give it much more thought at the mo.

quote:Originally posted by Charles Thunder:

It's well-written, but I don't agree with you. It's not "fear of the fear of love." It's fear of rejection, of not being able to attain that amount of love.

Yeah, what he said.

Verily is it written, perfect love casts out fear.

I don't think someone is afraid to murder someone. I think that it is the fear of hell, or maybe just the idea of hell. Should you go to hell to expirence it? Could that, be the meaning of life? I don't think so but its just an idea.

Don't bring hell into this. Hell was created by people who LOVE fear. What is hell, after all, but the most fearful place of torment that whoever is the greatest bit of afraid of. The system this man brings in is free of hell I'm sure. Since it seems similar to my line of thinking and I don't think there's a hell.

Hell in a sense, to me, is repeating the circle of life and birth again because you haven't faced your fears to realize fear is a silly concept. Murder, in MY sense of belief's shouldn't be feared. At the same time it shouldn't really be practiced because you are making a fellow life have to start learning AGAIN and that's not helping anybody. As for the meaning of life, I take the semi-existentialist view of there is no meaning of life until you give it a meaning.

There's no point in living, so make your point.

while you still can.

fear is an illusion created by the ego. fear when faced, is a coward...

Okay, so if there are no negative experiences growth is achieved through all experiences and all experiences are positive; then, it would be a positive experience to murder someone and learning and growth would come from murdering another.

Somehow, that just doesn't seem correct.

One doesn't fear, fear itself, that makes no sense.

i think there must have been toast burning causing me to leave as i don't seem to have given enough of an explanation about fear.

fear stops us walking off a cliff. we feel it and that feeling will quite happily jump up and down a scale of fear. fear is pretty important here.

we have a desire to do something, 'get up and sing...' fear overtakes desire. in this instance, it is an illusion created by the ego. and we are defeated by it.

if i have not quite explained myself correctly... it is due to my brain playing around from lack of sleep (not TOTSE... recording)

fuck. everything. and. run.

quote:Originally posted by ---Beany---:

To believe death is an end seems crazy to me.

What's so crazy about that? You don't exist, you're born, you live for awhile, you die and revert back to your nonexistent state.

That's the whole fucking point of death, to stop you right then and there. Do not pass go, do not collect 200 virgins.

quote:Originally posted by crunked:

Okay, so if there are no negative experiences growth is achieved through all experiences and all experiences are positive; then, it would be a positive experience to murder someone and learning and growth would come from murdering another.

Somehow, that just doesn't seem correct.



All experiences are positive. There's no such thing as a negative experience. An experience that we perceive as negative is only negative because we don't properly understand its value.

A negative experience is good because it forces us to face fears, and through them we experience unhappiness. By understanding unhappiness we can further understand how to move away from it for good.

A positive experience is good because through it we experience love which attracts us closer to god.