The whole idea of a omnipotent god in a world where everyone says we have free will is completely contradictary.

god didn't creat man, man created god

You sir are correct!!

yah man thats a crazy idea. I heard of these exsitentialit christians or something who said that since we all started believing in god that he then existed. Kind of hard to explain but it was crazy like we made Him.

Actually, an omnipotent God does not contradict free will. The idea is that he CAN do anything he wants, but he chooses not to, so that free will is preserved.

quote:Originally posted by BacklightLogic:

Actually, an omnipotent God does not contradict free will. The idea is that he CAN do anything he wants, but he chooses not to, so that free will is preserved.

so, all these christian pricks running around saying they have an all powerful god actully believe that their all powerful god sits around and does nothing like a pussy, allthough he has the power to do any and everything

quote:Originally posted by Super Veg:

so, all these christian pricks running around saying they have an all powerful god actully believe that their all powerful god sits around and does nothing like a pussy, allthough he has the power to do any and everything

It doesn't mean that he does nothing. Perhaps he only does what is necessary

If he knows everything and created everything then we cannot have free will because we are all blindly following paths that we cannot even see. He must have created the universe knowing that i would have had 6 weetbix for breakfast this morning, so i didn't have the weetbix by my own free will, but because he planned it before time even started. What if tomorrow i have corn flakes insted? Well, he must have planned that too. Christians who say there is freewill are bullshit. It cannot exist alongside an omniscient god that created everything. The 2 terms contridict each other (but then since when did contridictions ever bother christians).

PS the subject of free will is not only applicable to christianity, but to any monotheistic religion.

quote:Originally posted by Lucky:

yah man thats a crazy idea. I heard of these exsitentialit christians or something who said that since we all started believing in god that he then existed. Kind of hard to explain but it was crazy like we made Him.

Essence precedes existence

[This message has been edited by KikoSanchez (edited 05-21-2004).]

quote:Originally posted by Super Veg:

The whole idea of a omnipotent god in a world where everyone says we have free will is completely contradictary.

god didn't creat man, man created god



Well....just because it may have control over you does not mean it excercises that power. You are assuming that because it can that it will. You will never know, so stop questioning free will this very instance.

quote:Originally posted by stealthdonkey:

If he knows everything and created everything then we cannot have free will because we are all blindly following paths that we cannot even see. He must have created the universe knowing that i would have had 6 weetbix for breakfast this morning, so i didn't have the weetbix by my own free will, but because he planned it before time even started. What if tomorrow i have corn flakes insted? Well, he must have planned that too. Christians who say there is freewill are bullshit. It cannot exist alongside an omniscient god that created everything. The 2 terms contridict each other (but then since when did contridictions ever bother christians).

PS the subject of free will is not only applicable to christianity, but to any monotheistic religion.

Well, I believe Christianity states that god only KNOWS what you will do, but it does not control what you do.

But does he not have a plan for us all?

He told me no.

you should listen to the Rush song "Freewill" - Good Lyrics.

While I disagree with C.S. Lewis on this, his reasoning behind omniscience and free will not contradicting was that souls have always existed. We were created just as God was born, and at that moment we made all of our choices. Life's purpose is to understand our choices, to find out why we chose what we did and to find out the consequences of all our choices. We had free will for an instant, and from there we set our lives; those who understand and learn from their choices are the ones who will be forgiven for they'll understand the wrong choices after they experience them, as they'll repent in their soul for the wrong they committed; those who learn nothing from their choices and refuse to take in the experience will be damned. I like the idea he has, and were I Christian, I'd probably agree with him, but with my circumstances, I find myself in disagreement, though I do agree that we no longer have 'free will' in the typical sense of the term.

quote:Originally posted by stealthdonkey:

If he knows everything and created everything then we cannot have free will because we are all blindly following paths that we cannot even see. He must have created the universe knowing that i would have had 6 weetbix for breakfast this morning, so i didn't have the weetbix by my own free will, but because he planned it before time even started.

If that is true, what's the use then of having given you the opportunity of buying it before eating it, instead of just having it being shoved down your throat every day of your life, geese-wise, and be done with it ?

Actually, what's even the use of you having taste buds so you can appreciate its taste and decide what you like and don't like ?



Edit : furthermore, I suppose that the fact of you having had 6 weetabix this morning, or even having them every morning, is not very high on His agenda.

[This message has been edited by Uncus (edited 05-22-2004).]

quote:Originally posted by KikoSanchez:



Well....just because it may have control over you does not mean it excercises that power. You are assuming that because it can that it will. You will never know, so stop questioning free will this very instance.



He may also be assuming this because he's reasoning from a human consciousness level. Humans would probably act that way. Give human beings a means of control over another person and it is to be expected that he or she will start assuming that it's his or her right and duty to control that person.