It just occured to me that I can't think of any Protestant mystics. I'm just drawing a complete blank. I can think of Catholic mystics, Muslim mystics, Hindu mystics, Buddhist mystics, Jewish mystics, etc., etc., etc. - but no Protestants. I'm probably missing somebody really obvious, but - alas - it's not coming to me.

Does anyone know of any? Maybe Digital Saviour can help me out, since s/he seems the Protestant spokesperson of the board.

Nope. Don't specialize in mysticism.

Perhaps I should remedy that short-coming.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

Oh, and...Digital_Savior = She

http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif)

I don't know specific denomination mysticism. The mysticism is usually the underlying myth of the story, so I'd imagine the various "protestant"/"catholic"/"episocopal"/whatever to have the same mysticism with different interpretations.

I could be wrong though.

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

Oh, and...Digital_Savior = She

http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif)

I figured as much, but I didn't want to make any assumptions.

quote:Originally posted by I_Like_Traffic_Lights:

I don't know specific denomination mysticism. The mysticism is usually the underlying myth of the story, so I'd imagine the various "protestant"/"catholic"/"episocopal"/whatever to have the same mysticism with different interpretations.

I could be wrong though.



Could you clarify what you meant in your post? I'm sorry, but I didn't understand it.

The mysticism is the story being the religion. I don't see why Protestant mysticism should differ from catholic mysticism. In that the mysticism is the variuos myths and legends and stories at the heart of the faith, the denominations sprouted out from disagreement on what these symbols mean.

I may be misunderstanding the question, however, as we all have different meanings for what words mean. Our mystics might not be the same mystics, so their mysticism would not be the same either.

I belive all modern denominational churches excluding Orthodox, Coptic and a few others are offshoot of Lutherans who are a offshoot of the Catholic church.

By mystics do you mean people like saints or miricle workers? I geuss the new churches either were not looking or did not believe in raising people to such status.

Interesting you should mention this, I remember discussing "protestant mysticism" in my Lutheran catechism class a long time ago (five years or more). We studied Johann Arndt's True Christianity (1605) (http://www.theocentric.com/theoarchives/000100.html). Can't say I was interested in it at the time, but hey, I was 15 http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif).

the thing is that protestantism is such a simple plain biblical form of christianity that it is lacking elements like this that the more liturgical churches have. look at catholic mystics st francis of asissi, catherine of sienna, and many others. in protestantism you just basicly go to church, and pray plain prayers. I do not mean to offend. but this is one of the main reasons I leaft the protestants. it just seemed like it was lacking something in comparrison with other more ancient, and traditional churches.

Yeah as people have already pointed out, protestantism has generally stayed away from mysticism and the spiritual (aside from hardcore charismatics, but even then they have a very limited form of spirituality).

There is, however, a growing interest in mysticism and experiental worship/ spiritual experiences and understanding among protestants. Things such as Taize still services (google it if you're interested), meditation, lectio divina and a resurgance in the use of liturgy among the "emerging church". Alot of RCC monastry's offer programs for developing christian spirituality.

There is definatley an interest out there, its just that protestantism tends to shun the spiritual.... especially the dominant paradigm that comes out of the US.

At one of the bible studies I go to we recently had a minister come along and take us through some breathing/mediation (similar to the Buddhist method) and some guided meditations, which was pretty cool.

Protestantism lacks tradition. Therefore, any genuinely spiritual roots and subsequent mysticism is equally bereft in this faith.

Pentacostals are fairly mystical.

Protestant and Catholics believe the same thing although a few hundred years ago the Catholic church started taking the piss out there follwers by charging them money to perform miracles and not letting them read the bible for themselves. Thats why the protestants formed there own church which was basically the same thing minus the instructions from the pope and the people could read the bible for themselves and make up there own mind.

Einstein on God and Mysticism:

"Ah, this is what I mean about religion and science going hand-in-hand! Each has a place, but each must be relegated to its sphere. Let's assume that we are dealing with a theoretical physicist or scientist who is very well-acquaintcd with the different laws of the universe, such as how the planets orbit the sun and how the satellites in turn orbit around their respectivc planets. Now, this man who has studied and understands these different laws-how could he possibly believe in one God who would be capable of disturbing the paths of these great orbiting masses? No, the natural laws of science have not only been worked out theoretically but have been proven also in practice. I cannot then believe in this concept of an anthropomorphic God who has the powers of interfering with these natural laws. As I said before, the most beautiful and most profound religious emotion that we can experience is the sensation of the mystical. And this mysticality is the power of all true science. If there is any such concept as a God, it is a subtle spirit, not an image of a man that so many have fixed in their minds. In essence, my religion consists of a humble admiration for this illimitable superior spirit that reveals itself in the slight details that we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble minds."

I don't agree with the aspect of God that Einstein describes. He basically states that there is no singular entity of God, because the order of the universe excludes an entity that could interfere with it (that's what I derived from this).

However, he is forgetting one key factor about God...

He is God.

He can do whatever He wants.

Would He ? Depends. Will He ? Perhaps. Has He ? Certainly.

It's His prerogative, as creator of all things.

Interesting thoughts from Einstein, though.

Well, as I mentioned in an earlier post, I have to leave this forum for awhile to concentrate on other things I should be doing. This is like my Procrastination Forum. http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

A few comments:

I_Like_Traffic_Lights:

I didn’t say that Protestant mysticism had to differ from Catholic mysticism, although I think it most certainly would. (For example, a Catholic could have a mystical experience related to the Virgin Mary, while this would be highly unlikely for a Protestant.) I was just looking for the names of Protestant mystics, actually.

I had considerable difficulty understanding your posts, to be honest.

For example, you wrote:

“In that the mysticism is the variuos myths and legends and stories at the heart of the faith, the denominations sprouted out from disagreement on what these symbols mean.”

Mysticism is not about “myths and legends”, but about the direct experience of divinity (however one may define that). There are mystics of all religions, and even mystics with no religion at all. So I'm a bit unclear on what you were trying to get across.

MasterPython:

“By mystics do you mean people like saints or miricle workers? I geuss the new churches either were not looking or did not believe in raising people to such status. “

No, not really. Mysticism doesn’t even have to be Christian, and it's certainly not an "official" status given by the Church. There are many mystics that were condemned by the Church, in fact.

I think a lot of people might not be familiar with what mysticism is, and that’s why I’ve been confused with the responses. I don't know.

As some others indicated, at first I thought that Protestantism was not particularly well-suited for mysticism. But the more I thought about it, why wouldn’t it be? Protestants believe the individual holds the power of interpretation, not the Church (like Catholics). Thus, it would seem that direct experience of the sacred/God/divinity would be perfectly suited for Protestantism. I just hadn’t heard of any specifically Protestant mystics, and I wasn't sure why.

Thanks for the name, Social Junker. I found some other names online, too. I'll have to look into them.

Thanks for the interesting Einstein quote, Digital Saviour. I always enjoy his thoughts (although I disagree with his interpretation of quantum mechanics).

Wish I could say more but I’m in a rush to do some research!

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

Oh, and...Digital_Savior = She

http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif)

woot! Representin' for the girly homies!

O, yea, I'm drunk.

And I lump Protestantism in with Christianity. I consider their "mystics" kindred despite that their beliefs are altered.

Cheers,

Lost

*laughs at Lost*

I'm here for ya, girl.

Hope you thoroughly enjoyed your intoxication. http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/wink.gif)

I agree with you about Protestantism and Christianity.

God bless.

[This message has been edited by Digital_Savior (edited 10-21-2004).]

quote:Originally posted by LostCause:

woot! Representin' for the girly homies!

O, yea, I'm drunk.

And I lump Protestantism in with Christianity. I consider their "mystics" kindred despite that their beliefs are altered.

Cheers,

Lost



Hmmm.....came back to check responses after a brief sabbatical.

To clarify, I was not suggesting that Protestantism should be separated from Christianity. ?! Not sure where that assumption came from. Can't remember if I said something that would have given that impression.

I think all mystics (Catholic, Protestant, Muslim, Hindu, agnostic, whatever) are kindred when it comes right down to it. Mystical experiences, regardless of religious tradition, are often very similar on a basic level - especially if one defines them in terms of neurophysiology.

However, most mystics do associate with a particular religion/religious sect. Like I mentioned before, a Protestant would probably not have a mystical experience of the Virgin Mary. That's about as likely as a Protestant having a mystical vision of Ganesha. Anything is possible, of course, but one's religious tradition often determines one's mystical experience (or, at the very least, one's interpretation of that mystical experience).

It just surprised me that I couldn't think of the names of any Protestant mystics. I can think of tons of Catholic mystics off the top of my head, but barely any Protestants. There are some, naturally, but I don't think mysticism is as popular in Protestant sects as it is in Catholicism.

I'm a protestant and I've been reading some texts by the well known mystics. I mentioned about it to my HC-Christian protestant friend. He told me all the saints/mystics were satanists and are burning in hell. Not all protestants are like this, but mysticism is generally disrespected(at least here on Lutheric area).

Too bad, maybe I should revert to orthodox. Damn, now that I think of it, it sounds kinda cool.

[This message has been edited by jurainus (edited 10-25-2004).]

quote:Originally posted by jurainus:

I'm a protestant and I've been reading some texts by the well known mystics. I mentioned about it to my HC-Christian protestant friend. He told me all the saints/mystics were satanists and are burning in hell. Not all protestants are like this, but mysticism is generally disrespected(at least here on Lutheric area).

Too bad, maybe I should revert to orthodox. Damn, now that I think of it, it sounds kinda cool.

[This message has been edited by jurainus (edited 10-25-2004).]



So you've been reading texts by Protestant mystics? Could you give me the names of some of them? I'd like to research this further.

Thanks!

quote:Originally posted by Lolita:



So you've been reading texts by Protestant mystics? Could you give me the names of some of them? I'd like to research this further.

Thanks!

Sorry, I meant Catholic mystics :/