I know that this sounds like two wrong topics to have together, but just bear with me.

As a user of both, I think I might be able to put Christianity in a way for some to understand easier. Some of you are hopeless right now as I have read some of these religious posts.

A person that hasn't had a personal relationship with God and insists on telling a Christian what he feels and beleives, as a Christian, is fake; That is the equivalent of person who has never slammed heroin telling a slammer, that what he feels isn't real!

You really think that when you've never experienced what that great slam of the horse feels like in your arm, you're in any position to tell him that what he feels isn't there! Bullshit! It's there, it feels great, and there isn't any damn thing that you can say to make it not so!

Okay, now take that heroin feeling and take away all the bad shit that comes from the drug use.

Now replace those negatives with being so happy, peaceful, and content, with who you are in your own skin that it's hard to remove your smile.

Knowing (not thinking), that you can conquer any challenge without any help but from God. Not drugs, not alcohol, not violence, not a spouse or loved one, just him! And I'm not talking about praying here either. I'm talking about him just being there guiding the way and taking the load.

I could go on and on with the positives, but until many of you aren't so angry with the idea of people actually being so happy in their lives that they want others to experience the same happiness, you'll just blow this post off also.

Why in the world; even if Christianity is something that you don't believe in, would you want to discourage another persons true hapiness?

The answer is because misery loves company!

Sorry guys but were not buying any misery right now!

can you buy god for 50 bucks?

where i can see heroin, taste it, feel it, hear it if i drop it, buy it, and experience it, god has never shown himself to me. i dont believe that if there is a god he intervenes in earthly matters.

but then again, i doint try and convert christians to my beliefs, unlike them.

Mike?

Go arogent Christian guy,

Interesting that you compare Christianiny to heroin, a substance that eventuly controls every aspect of its user's life until they can no longer function in normal society. I would have used a more positive example like love or adrenalin or sex, but if you want to think of it that way it's fine by me.

Who are you talking to anyways? If this stuff is directed towards Atheists and Agnostics try to see it from their side. They usualy have no problem with people being happy, they just do like any organization that has a history of hate and intolerance. Pretty much everywhere the Chritians get a foot hold at least one group of hatemongers will spring up with some new group of people to kill in God's name.

A personal relationship with God is free.

I'm not trying to be arrogant and I'm sorry it came across that way.

I used heroin as my example because it is the only thing that has given me close to the feeling of the Holy Spirit in my life.

I can't say that all the Christians that try to tell you about their religion are doing it because they care about you; The sad fact is, that I've seen some do it just to get their Jesus card filled for the week.

These people feel like they are helping Christianity by making sure you get saved right then! They don't realize how much harm this does to peoples opinion of Christ.

I can say that most of the Christians I've met are very happy to talk about the thing that changed their live for the better. Just like all people that find a good thing!

Christians are taught to love thy neighbor, and many take this serious. They do care about showing you something that can make your life more fullfilling and happy.

I'm not one to debate Christianity. The fact is that many Christians think I'm a very dysfunctional Christian. There are too many people that get so caught up in being a Christian, that they forget about just taking time to get close to God.

I'm a Christian because I felt the Holy Spirit in a Vineyard Church in Michigan. I have continued to see Gods work and felt him through my Christian life.

If I would have had these feelings and seen these things while praying to allah, then I'd be Islamic.

I'm a very black and white person and I do not fear God. He's given me no reason to fear him reguardless of what I've read and been told.

I'm rambling now and my ideals are not important. I was simply trying to post a different way to look at a great thing.

Thats actually a pretty thoughtful analysis.

If more Christians though like that the world would be a better place. Sorry if I sounded alot harsh.

Wow - that really gives credit to the notion that religion is the opiate of the masses.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif)

[This message has been edited by dearestnight_falcon (edited 11-12-2004).]

Everybody needs a crutch of some sort to get through life. Religion can be a great one if used properly.

But sorry it doesn't numb the senses like opiates. Although it would be great if each time I wanted to get closer to God I would have to slam some "H" first. Sometimes life just isn't fair.

By the way, Who the hell is Mike? Or do I not want to know!

[This message has been edited by Intergalactic Explorer (edited 11-12-2004).]

Intergalactic, this is a very valid point that I like a lot. Christians do know. They do know that God exists, that they talk to God, that He is real. They know it as well as I know it that the sky is blue.

The question, then, is who's idea is more valid, given these two people:

The Atheist - Knows for a fact that God does not exist. Knows it with all his heart.

The Theist - Knows for a fact that God does does exist. Knows it with all his heart.

The answer is that both are equally correct, since they "know" it with equal intensity. And we have moral relativism.

Funny thing, reading this whilst on H. I'd have to agree with what you've said, it's always a pain when someone speaking in the name of "christianty" voices a personal oppinion that goes against logic.

Well, I hope that there are more people like you and me out there, klling the stereotype of judgement and force from christians... Well, at least not reinforcing it.

Heh. Anarchy.

quote:Originally posted by deptstoremook:

Intergalactic, this is a very valid point that I like a lot. Christians do know. They do know that God exists, that they talk to God, that He is real. They know it as well as I know it that the sky is blue.

The question, then, is who's idea is more valid, given these two people:

The Atheist - Knows for a fact that God does not exist. Knows it with all his heart.

The Theist - Knows for a fact that God does does exist. Knows it with all his heart.

The answer is that both are equally correct, since they "know" it with equal intensity. And we have moral relativism.

That ain't just a moral relativism

Atheists can't be happy without god?

intergalactic, if there were more christians like you, the world would indeed be a better place.

on the whole i dont like christians, not because of their core beliefs, just because of the ones that i have encountered have attitudes that i dont think are good

it seems that you are actually taking the message and living by it, rather than people trying to fill up their jesus card, as you put it.

Yenzarill, get off my post!

That kind of bullshit is just as bad as someone telling me that I can't be happy with my higher power.

That kind of narrow minded shit helps nothing!

Christianity has the same problems as the whole world has today. Tons of followers and not enough leaders who use their own hearts and minds.

I'm not saying that I do what ever I want. I try to follow the guidelines of a Christian, because I know they can really help people live happier lives. Not to mention that I'm a very evil person when I'm in control of my life.

That being said: My personal savior is MY PERSONAL SAVIOR!

There isn't anything that another religious person or anyone else will tell me, that I will take as gospel, until I have ran it through my own system first.

There are many great things in different religions and texts. Does it mean because I like the way the Koran explains certain ways to live; that I'm less of a Christian?

Do I care what that answer is from anyone but myself! Not just no, but FUCK NO!

You can say what ever you want. When any religion is based on loving the earth and people in general; that's a step in the right direction in my opinion.

Even if you don't believe in God, but you're just a good moral loving person. That's a step in the right direction.

Maybe we should just start there and see if every thing else falls into place.

I have a hard time believing that a monk, that spends sixteen to twenty hours a day getting "enlightened", is not feeling some force from his higher power.

I know damn well that I am not disciplined enough to pray for that long. So how the hell do I know if God is touching him in a way that I will never know!

Shit were all standing alone in this flood called society. I am completely happy having my big rock to stand on, and I will guard it with my life!!

This is just my opinion though!

There is no other thread in the one year that I have been here that has filled me with as much enlightenment as this one. I feel so uplifted! Thank you!

I too don't agree with Christians that try to force their religion on people and it is the same as forcing someone to use heroin. In fact, that's such a good analagy I'm gonna use that next time someone tries to convert me! Thanks man!

congratulations Intergalactic Explorer, you are actually a real Christian. (i'm not being sarcastic).

most people i've come across who call themselves 'Christians' say that christ is their lord and saviour but ignore all of his ideas on peace, love and compassion. these types are generally the evangelistic, bigoted and only-worrying-about-their-jesus-card types. believe me, i've met a few, i was raised christian (i've turned pantheist/chaote) and was surrounded mostly by these types of people throughout my life.

i don't think that these people should be termed "Christians" as it isn't really christ's words that they live by, but usually moreso the apostle Paul. a more accurate term would be "Churchians", a label that i first heard from some guy i saw on TV years ago (on oprah or somethign

From a Christian viewpoint, these Churchians are undeserving of the term Christians - its an insult to real christians everywhere.

From any viewpoint, Churchians give Christianity a bad name.

stupid preachy churchians.

Well Chainy good luck! I will tell you how far I usually get, and hopefully you can improve on it.

IE: You going up to these people trying to shove Jesus down their throat; Is like me going "Come on, you got to do it now! You slam this heroin now", to someone who doesn't know the drug.

BT: That not even the same thing! I am trying to save their eternal soul.

IE: Yeah but it is basically still a sales pitch. And you're starting yours with the fucking ending!

BT: What are you talking about!

IE: Just what I said! Look, if I just walked up to you and you could feel right away how awesome slamming heroin felt, I could probably get you hooked on the drug. But I can't! So I'm just high around you until you ask me for some, or ask why I'm so relaxed and happy. You understand now?

BT: You need to get sober.

IE: I am sober you Fucking Bible Thumper! Go eat a dick!

I'm just kidding about that last part, but you can see how fast it deteriorates.

So coooooold.... Need another hit from the G man...

I know, I know! This is why my friends ask me not to witness for Christ! I was crippled and manipulated for a long time. I just try to get people to use their heads now.