I am wanting to learn more about the religino of Islam. Could anyone give me some basic information? The beliefs, customs, rituals, etc. Any help is appreciated.

Sure,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam http://www.shia.org/ http://www.islam-guide.com/ http://www.islamonline.net/english/index.shtml http://www.islamicity.com/ http://www.islamworld.net/

some of those are Sunni, some are Shi'a

Kelto, I think it is great that you offered to help this person...that's totally cool.

But I have to point out that (judging by your past remarks) if this individual had asked the same question about Christianity, or any other religion with which you do not identify or feel sympathetic to, you would have told "him" not to be a moron, and Google it himself.

Just an observation, and I could be totally wrong.

Thank you for the links. Could you please tell me what is SUnni, and what is Shi'a?

Sunni and Shia are two sects of Islam. Their differences are mainly political in nature, and they are united on the authentic source of their religion, the Quran.

The difference arose, at the death of the Prophet of Islam, over who would be the next successor as Caliph (leader/ruler of the land).

I would advise not to get entangled in this area, as it doesn't serve much good or reflect what the faith is actually about.

-[Soofi]

Thank you, the information is very much appreciated.

Onos! http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0042/0042_01.asp

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

Kelto, I think it is great that you offered to help this person...that's totally cool.

But I have to point out that (judging by your past remarks) if this individual had asked the same question about Christianity, or any other religion with which you do not identify or feel sympathetic to, you would have told "him" not to be a moron, and Google it himself.

Just an observation, and I could be totally wrong.

I would've helped him all the same, despite my views. Believe me, I am critical of parts of all Middle Eastern religions.

quote:Originally posted by Soofi:

Sunni and Shia are two sects of Islam. Their differences are mainly political in nature, and they are united on the authentic source of their religion, the Quran.

The difference arose, at the death of the Prophet of Islam, over who would be the next successor as Caliph (leader/ruler of the land).

I would advise not to get entangled in this area, as it doesn't serve much good or reflect what the faith is actually about.

-[Soofi]

Yes, they are mainly political in nature, but some types of Shi'a, and Sunni are more tolerant of certain ideas, and things while other types are oppressive. Are you a Sufi?

[This message has been edited by Keltoiberserker (edited 02-10-2005).]

Please say you're a Sufi, because I would like to learn more about them.

If I were a Muslim, I would be a Sufi mostly becaue of their "Mystical" practices, the spinning, the trances, the chanting. They just look so in tune with their beliefs even to a physical level.

[This message has been edited by Krispy (edited 02-10-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by Keltoiberserker:

Are you a Sufi?



The answer is a yes and no. Officially I don't like to put labels on myself like that. Sufi is a strong word, and in my view, denotes saintliness. So for that reason, I would say no. I realize my handle (Soofi) can be a little misleading, but it has a different meaning, depending on the cultural backdrop.

However, I do align myself with the inner mystical tradition of Islam. So it would be more accurate to say I am a student of this path.

-[Soofi]

Krispy,

You can ask me any questions you like about Islam / Sufism (tasawwuf). Don't take me as an authority on the subject, but maybe I could shed some light on the issues.

-[Soofi]

quote:Originally posted by Soofi:

The answer is a yes and no. Officially I don't like to put labels on myself like that. Sufi is a strong word, and in my view, denotes saintliness. So for that reason, I would say no. I realize my handle (Soofi) can be a little misleading, but it has a different meaning, depending on the cultural backdrop.

However, I do align myself with the inner mystical tradition of Islam. So it would be more accurate to say I am a student of this path.

-[Soofi]

Looks like I have much to learn. Perhaps you could throw me your email address and I could send you some questions?

quote:Originally posted by Krispy:

Looks like I have much to learn. Perhaps you could throw me your email address and I could send you some questions?

You are welcome to e-mail me at anytime. You can reach me at Soofiz [at] gmail.com

However, it might be beneficial to others, if you ask any questions on this discussion board.

If it's something of a personal nature, email is probably more suitable. It's your choice anyway, I don't mind either way.

Take care.

-[Soofi]

Well for starters, what do you feel when you are in those trances, with the chanting. How does it help you spiritually? Are you "Out of Body?" Whats it like? Just give me some info on that stuff.

quote:Originally posted by Krispy:

Well for starters, what do you feel when you are in those trances, with the chanting. How does it help you spiritually? Are you "Out of Body?" Whats it like? Just give me some info on that stuff.

The chanting, like other practices (fasting etc), are actually spiritual exercises/medicine. Not everyone does them, unless there is a good reason to. Sometimes the Shaykh/Guide/teacher may prescribe it to his students if he feels it is necessary.

The chanting is actually called 'dhikr' (remembrance of God). It can be vocal, or silent. Usually, muslims should be in constant dhikr, remembrance of God, at all times. While one is carrying out daily duties in this world, one can be in the divine presence within his heart. One of the purposes of this dhikr, is that it brings great peace to the person's heart, and he focuses solely on the divine. This dhikr is also a form of worship and servitude to God, although the benefits are to the seeker. Keep in mind, however, a sufi does not engage in this dhikr for self interest and rewards.. it is actually for selflessness, even though God may bestow His grace on His own initiation.

The driving force behind this, is purely love, selfless, divine love. Some people live for gain in this world, and others for the pleasures of paradise. A sufi is torn between the two worlds, the material, and the heavens, because he does not worship or serve because of heavenly reward, or status in this world.

It may be difficult to understand this kind of love and longing, as it is unlike anything else. It's not something willed, we can't just wake up one day and say hey, I'm gonna feel like this for God or so and so. A saying from sufi tradition is thus; "what we speak of cannot be seeked, yet seekers only find it".

If I were to liken this dhikr, remembrance of God to something in this world, where you may be able to relate.. is the longing and feelings which one may experience in their love for a girl. You might feel bewildered and intoxicated on the thought of her, and you unconsciously think about her all the time.. something you can't control, it just happens. A state where you have just let go of everything, to chase the Beloved.

This path is all about love. Love, love and love. If there is no love, there is no progress. This is not just any kind of love either. There are lower,cheapened forms of love which most associate with. They are the selfish types of love, where there is anger, jealousy, envy etc. That is, animal level love. Acheiving this highest and purest form of love is difficult, and is very rare. It is a divine love. The most powerful force in existence. It makes the world go around. Although to our immediate senses, there is gravity at work, but the source of that force, is ultimately the divine love. It is part of all existence, but we have to be open to it, receptive, to feel it.

The ego of the human says "there is me" and "there is them". This seperateness. Sometimes it may say, "I am better than them". Again, seperateness. But in reality, this seperateness is an illusion. The only seperateness is in the person's heart.. he becomes fragmented inside, and reflects it on the outside world. For example, one might see a beautiful person, and feel threatened or inferior, so s/he rationalizes it and looks for some minor fault and writes them off as ugly, even though the person was genuinely beautiful. Where was the beauty and where was the ugliness? It was in the observer's heart. If we look down on others, we should feel ashamed and look down upon ourselves.

This behaviour is from the ego, the lower self. Human is not only ego, he has a higher self, a divine element in his being, a soul. One cannot be in a selfless state of love, while being dominated by a selfish ego. So the sufi has to subdue the lower self, and put it to good use. In his desire for the Beloved, he renounces the material world and all its glitter, within his heart, so that he focuses on nothing but the Beloved's Reality. In turn, when the seeker gives away the desires of the self for God, God gives him the world. There may be mystic knowledge, and secrets of reality bestowed on the lover. One of the changes, is that the person becomes spiritually awakened, he begins to see with his inner eye, and where there was once before a world of seperateness, he now sees nothing but Unity. A divine harmony throughout all existence. Where he was once the small drop, he has now merged with the shoreless ocean of love which encompasses all reality.

Again, this can be difficult to comprehend. If one has never experienced love, how can they know what it is like? One must have tasted love, firsthand, to appreciate it fully.

The spinning dances, more popularly known as the whirling dervishes, is not something which all sufi's partake in, although it is quite common among certain spiritual orders/paths. It is an expression of what is happening inside. You may have heard the saying, "jumping for joy". It is similar in principle.. one dances, and whirls, in their ecstatic state of joy, like a child that plays, without even thinking of it as such. A state of being, where one may be sober in the realm of intellect, yet drunk on divine love.

The sufi appears present in this world with his body, but his heart is residing in the divine presence, the heavenly gardens under the Gaze of God, within the heart. In his heart's poverty (and renunciation of the world), he sees every vision, sound, smell, taste, thought, and feeling, as a gift and blessing of God. In a state of heightened awareness and senses.

Being in love alone, is not enough. It has to manifest and take shape in some form, by loving all creatures, and leaving no room for hate or lowly desires. One develops their love through the creation. he loves the people, animals, and plants, although in reality, inwardly, he is loving their Source.

-[Soofi]

Let me clarify a few things. I realize I can go off-topic a little, and talk about things which people may not find of interest.

From outside, people see Sufi's as mystical beings, who seem to live in a world totally different to the common person, which is true in a way, but it's easy to pick up wrong impressions of what they are really about.

What is it like living as a Sufi? What are the perks and different experiences one has? Do you explore reality, and reach different states of consciousness, higher realms etc? These are some questions which most are probably thinking about.

The inner mystical tradition of Islam, is very rich. There is too much to explain in a few words, even in countless volumes, because this tradition extends over 1400 years of knowledge, wisdom, learning and secrets. It is like an ocean or world unto itself. One can look from outside, standing on the shore, and say it looks like this or that, but it always falls short, for one needs to dive within that ocean for themselves and see what there really is to see. A diver may come back to shore, but how will he explain what lies beneath to a people who have never seen the 'alien' world?

A sufi sees many things in this reality which the general population doesn't. His world is different to your world, eventhough you live on earth. One of you is afflicted with despair when some ill happens, while the other thanks God for his illness and sees it as a mercy. Can you live in a world like that?

For the sufi, every aspect of life has a lesson which can be learned from. Every aspect, wether it is concepts of nature, or the speech of someone, or the sounds on the radio, the television, or the mathematical workings of a computer. Most of us are content to see the smoke as smoke and leave it to that, but the sufi will look for the fire, and then he will seek the burning firebrand (wood etc.), and then he may seek out the trees, and so on. The sufi is always trying to find the traces of his Beloved, God.

Every moment of life is precious, and very sacred.

The nature of dreams for a sufi are different than it is for others. His ability to interpret events in life are also unique. His communicating skills and style are also in a class of their own. The sufi may have the ability to talk directly to your heart, and to visit you, in ways you could never imagine. He may have knowledge of the future, but it is unlikely he would tell you.. and he would be beyond cheating others through that means.

However, all these things are just the incidental occurences for the sufi. A sufi is not a sufi for these abilities or desires. One who thinks like that can never be a sufi. They are but gifts of God. And gifts are not always good for a person, because they come with a trial, and wether the person puts them to good use, or for ill purposes.

I hope that answers some of your curiosities.

Peace.

-[Soofi]

Egads! http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/1054/1054_01.asp

quote:Originally posted by AngrySquirrel:

Egads! http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/1054/1054_01.asp

Hahaha, Chick Tracts. No telling how many of those I got working at Krogers. It's strange that people seem to think this is a very effective way to convert people.

quote:Originally posted by Garibaldi:

Hahaha, Chick Tracts. No telling how many of those I got working at Krogers. It's strange that people seem to think this is a very effective way to convert people.



Yep! That's why I pass these to Mormon congregations!

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0061/0061_01.asp

Don't believe anything you see on the news about the religion. It is a strict religion. A lot of things are banned, but there are a lot of the things that are written clearly in the Qu'ran that are happening today. (not biblical codes or anything, clear text). I suggest you get a translation of it and read it.

quote:Originally posted by Sanity0verRated:

I am wanting to learn more about the religino of Islam. Could anyone give me some basic information? The beliefs, customs, rituals, etc. Any help is appreciated.

Hey Abdul, this religon is thousands of years in the past. Look at this map. It's like a map of the poorest and most backwards cave people on earth.

http://btw.imb.org/news_map.asp