Why is it that when you ask Catholics about the major sins, they'll mention homosexuality and abortion, but manage to miss premarital sex? I get that it's not quite as bad as killing a fetus, but premarital sex is supposed to be a bad thing. Somehow the message is getting out wrong and we end up with a bunch of impressionable idiots having babies when they're too fucking young because their religion has taught them improperly. Why the hell does this happen? I figure it must be the Church's fault because not every single person is a dumbass who only hears what they want to.

...if that didn't make sense that's because it's an angry rant resulting from the recently acquired knowledge that my sister is pregnant

they do mention pre-marital sex as being very wrong. you must not have been listening.

Clearly, you aren't talking to the right/enough Catholics.

Call me when they do something right.

How many people are we talking about here, 1? 2? 5? 10? You're either not talking to enough people or you're not talking to the right people (those who actually attend and listen to Church sermons/read the bible).

Pre-marital sex being a huge sin is the reason they don't support birth control. I thought that would be obvious to even a lay person.

quote:Originally posted by Zman:

they do mention pre-marital sex as being very wrong. you must not have been listening.

What he/she said!

Go to a Catholic school. Count the number of people having sex in the bathrooms and such places. It's slightly higher than that of normal public schools. Of course all people that go to catholic schools aren't fundementalists, but still the school should be enforcing a no-relationship policy if they're so holy. I say no-relationship because we all know that if kids are making out when we can see them, dont ask what they're doing when we can't see them.

I had 13 years of catholic schooling. I know the doctrine inside and out. Glitter is just a dumbass. Premarital sex is constantly being harped on as being this unspeakable evil. Next, no one had sex in the bathrooms at my school, so I don't know what you're talking about. You'd be caught in about 3 seconds just due to there being like 2 bathrooms in my school and the sheer number of people. Next, people didn't make out at my school because not only would you get caught, you'd probably get detention for public display of affection.

So I know about all of this from firsthand experience. Read up before you bash something. Oh, and before anyone says I'm a sympathizer, I'm an atheist and I don't like catholicism. However, I know what the fuck I'm talking about. I just hate people getting their shit wrong.

edit: I know all catholic schools aren't like mine, however i was using mine as an example. there might be catholic schools where people have sex in the bathrooms, but having been in countless catholic schools in my time, i've never even heard of it happening. Anyway...

[This message has been edited by Fanglekai (edited 03-16-2005).]

I go to a catholic school and while there is a lot of sex, most of those people aren't catholics and it is happening off school property.

quote:Originally posted by napoleon_complex:

I went to a catholic school and while there was a lot of sex, most of those people aren't catholics and it is happening off school property.

quote:Originally posted by napoleon_complex:

most of those people aren't catholics

Correct. If I recall correctly, pre-marital sex is the second worst sin (after murder). Of course, rape, masturbation and adultery all fall under the banner of "lust" and all of this. So it's kind of a broad (lawl get it broads = girls) topic.

When I hear about major sins I think about breaking the big ten, and I went to Catholic school for 10 years. Things like killing someone or coveting my neighbors wife.

Who cares about homosexuality, abortions, or premarital sex. They do teach about safe sex in Catholic schools, so that covers their asses on two out of three. And I refuse to dwell on homosexuality, so there.

...I still don't see what fags have to do with your sister being pregnant...

[This message has been edited by Eudaemonistic_SOB (edited 03-17-2005).]

It says it clearly in the Bible. It's been known and reminded. But I don't know, sex would somehow insult alot of people in a way during church.

quote:If I recall correctly, pre-marital sex is the second worst sin (after murder). Of course, rape, masturbation and adultery all fall under the banner of "lust" and all of this.

I'm not Catholic, but my understanding is that, in God's eyes, sin is sin.. no ranking.

A little white lie that was never even verbalized is a sin same as mass murder. I can not remember the verses but God's Word says that

'even if you keep the whole law, but stumble on one point, you are completely guilty'

AND

'if you even look at a woman with lust, you have already committed adultery in your heart'

not to mention that we were concieved in sin (Psalm 51:5)

And because we are sinful by thought, word and deed, we are subject to "everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power" (2 Thessalonians 1:9)

BUT THE GOOD NEWS IS:

God has done something about it. 'For God so loved the world, that He gave his only-begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life' (John 3:16)

Therefore: "He who believes on Him is not condemned, but he who does not believe is comdemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only-begotten Son of God' (John 3:18)

There are different levels of sin. Telling a white lie is not the same a mass murder. There are venial sins and there are mortal sins.

quote:Originally posted by napoleon_complex:

There are different levels of sin. Telling a white lie is not the same a mass murder. There are venial sins and there are mortal sins.

according to the Church, or God's Word?

According to the Bible, there is only one sin.

this is funny! i went to catholic school for 11 years. my 3 younger sisters went (one is still attending so i know what's it's like currently). people making out, having sex, doing drugs, the same as in public school (which i attended for my last 2 years in highschool). they are a little more raunchy in catholic school, from my experience. the girls were dirtier, the boys were nastier. other than that, it all sucked. only reason i was sent to catholic school is so i could learn for myself that catholicism is bs. well, all four of us (including the one that is still waiting to be confirmed) have come to the same conclusion. logic outweighs bs any day, and that's all the catholic religion is based on!

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:

according to the Church, or God's Word?

Well considering this thread has the catholic church in it's title.....

quote:Originally posted by GlitterPunk112358:

Why is it that when you ask Catholics about the major sins, they'll mention homosexuality and abortion, but manage to miss premarital sex? I get that it's not quite as bad as killing a fetus, but premarital sex is supposed to be a bad thing. Somehow the message is getting out wrong and we end up with a bunch of impressionable idiots having babies when they're too fucking young because their religion has taught them improperly. Why the hell does this happen? I figure it must be the Church's fault because not every single person is a dumbass who only hears what they want to.

...if that didn't make sense that's because it's an angry rant resulting from the recently acquired knowledge that my sister is pregnant

truth be told they do believe that is a bad sin, but its just to "inconvenient" and "plitically incorrect" to stop kids from taking the rabbit hole life.

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

According to the Bible, there is only one unforgivable sin.

There yah go.

quote:Originally posted by insanelogic:

this is funny! i went to catholic school for 11 years. my 3 younger sisters went (one is still attending so i know what's it's like currently). people making out, having sex, doing drugs, the same as in public school (which i attended for my last 2 years in highschool). they are a little more raunchy in catholic school, from my experience. the girls were dirtier, the boys were nastier. other than that, it all sucked. only reason i was sent to catholic school is so i could learn for myself that catholicism is bs. well, all four of us (including the one that is still waiting to be confirmed) have come to the same conclusion. logic outweighs bs any day, and that's all the catholic religion is based on!

Hehe, I'm doing the same thing. Going through my last 2 years of high school at public school. Spent the first 2.5 at Catholic.

I've found basically the same thing as you. There is just as much sex and drugs at catholic school as there is at public school. Just a bit more at public school due to the number of kids. But ratio-wise, it's basically the same.

Hell, I smoked better/more pot and opium; snorted better coke and meth; ate better shrooms and acid at my private school than kids at my public school get. Of course I still have all my old connections, so this doesn't affect me. But I feel for the kids here and I refuse to deal here; as that is what landed me at this public school in the first place.

quote:According to the Bible, there is only one unforgivable sin.

Which sin is that?

Suicide and the cursing of the Holy Spirit.

Thats two.

its dying not believing in God

I got this extremly right wing pamphlet through the post a couple of weeks ago saying that the wages of sin is death, and as we are all born in sin it is only by the grace of God that we are allowed to draw breath. It also went on to say that those who died in the Tsunami deserved it!

Which led me to wonder, if the punishment for all sin is death, and we're all siners anyway that tends to imply that murder is no worse than the sin of oan... (Wanking for those not up on biblical slang)

death is the punishment for original sin last time I checked, which apparently isn't a problem anymore because our soul doesn't die thanks to Jesus, at least, that is what I was taught in a catholic school. As for the pre-marital sex... personally, the catholic church only teaches this because they are conservative and it wasn't a problem back when people were getting married at 14 and younger, but now it's a bigger issue since we live longer and now get married at 20 and 30...

quote:Originally posted by deptstoremook:

Correct. If I recall correctly, pre-marital sex is the second worst sin (after murder). Of course, rape, masturbation and adultery all fall under the banner of "lust" and all of this. So it's kind of a broad (lawl get it broads = girls) topic.

There is no designation of importance when it comes to sin. A lie is as bad as murder. Sin is sin. It all needs redemption, and Christ offers it fairly, across the board (get it ? Board = Chalk Board !! *LMAO* Oh, wait...that wasn't funny). *winks*

The only sin that God calls attention to (as far as taking precedence over others) is that of not believing in Him.

That is deemed the only "unforgivable" sin.

It is the only sin with a One Way Ticket To Hell attached to it.

The rest of the sins just make us miserable wretches, in need of God's mercy and grace.

quote:Originally posted by napoleon_complex:

Well considering this thread has the catholic church in it's title.....

Don't be a smart ass.

He was trying to ascertain your intention, instead of assuming and giving the wrong answer.

It is important to note the distinction between venial "anything" and the Bible.

I wish the Catholic Church would focus more on the Bible, and less on the laws of men.

Nowhere in the Bible does God designate one sin over another (other than the unforgivable sin, which I mentioned in my last post).

NOWHERE.

MAX:

Which organization was it that sent you this pamphlet ?

I find it really hard to believe that after saying all those things about God (which are true) that they would continue on to say such a thing about the Tsunami victim's.

God's judgement doesn't work like that. Judgement is reserved for our "After Life". Our bodies die, regardless of how we live our lives...they are meant to perish sometime.

It would be completely ignorant and unBiblical for someone to say that "anyone's" death was deserved based on the Bible.

So, again, I ask you who wrote it, and what is it's title ?

I am sure that you are either misreading what they are saying, or they are crazy.

Glitter: I am sorry you are angered by your sister's condition.

I hope you know that no matter what her mistakes are, she will really need your support.

I also hope that she has a healthy baby, and that she understands and appreciates her new responsibility as a mother.

Take care.

Digital_Savior It was sent by the Oxford Bible church, and I shit you not, it actually said it, clear as day, it went on to say that the country which was worst hit was Indoneasia, a predominantly muslim country, and it was their punishment for denying the truth of christ!

Wish I still had it around, I was actually sickened anyone could be so insensitive!

I think they were sort of counting on the fact tha nobody would read it unless they were a member of said organisation, not ocunting on the fact that I'll read anything put in frount of my nose http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

It didnt have a title, it was just that months news letter, sent to someone else in my dorm.

[This message has been edited by MaxSteiner (edited 03-22-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

Don't be a smart ass.

He was trying to ascertain your intention, instead of assuming and giving the wrong answer.

It is important to note the distinction between venial "anything" and the Bible.

I wish the Catholic Church would focus more on the Bible, and less on the laws of men.

Nowhere in the Bible does God designate one sin over another (other than the unforgivable sin, which I mentioned in my last post).

NOWHERE.

The bible doesn't mention a lot of stuff. The bible doesn't mention abortion, so I should assume that christians should have no stance on it. The bible doesn't mention euthenasia, so I should assume that is a no stance issue as well.

The bible is the starting point of interpretation, it is not the ending point.

I wish people would google their posts before wasting space with things like the above post!

Ecclesiastes 8:8a declares, "No man has authority to restrain the wind with the wind, or authority over the day of death..."

Or this more lenghy but just as good passage 2 Samuel 1:1-16:

1:1 Now it came to pass after the death of Saul, when David was returned from the slaughter of the Amalekites, and David had abode two days in Ziklag;

1:2 It came even to pass on the third day, that, behold, a man came out of the camp from Saul with his clothes rent, and earth upon his head: and [so] it was, when he came to David, that he fell to the earth, and did obeisance.

1:3 And David said unto him, From whence comest thou? And he said unto him, Out of the camp of Israel am I escaped.

1:4 And David said unto him, How went the matter? I pray thee, tell me. And he answered, That the people are fled from the battle, and many of the people also are fallen and dead; and Saul and Jonathan his son are dead also.

1:5 And David said unto the young man that told him, How knowest thou that Saul and Jonathan his son be dead?

1:6 And the young man that told him said, As I happened by chance upon mount Gilboa, behold, Saul leaned upon his spear; and, lo, the chariots and horsemen followed hard after him.

1:7 And when he looked behind him, he saw me, and called unto me. And I answered, Here [am] I.

1:8 And he said unto me, Who [art] thou? And I answered him, I [am] an Amalekite.

1:9 He said unto me again, Stand, I pray thee, upon me, and slay me: for anguish is come upon me, because my life [is] yet whole in me.

1:10 So I stood upon him, and slew him, because I was sure that he could not live after that he was fallen: and I took the crown that [was] upon his head, and the bracelet that [was] on his arm, and have brought them hither unto my lord.

1:11 Then David took hold on his clothes, and rent them; and likewise all the men that [were] with him:

1:12 And they mourned, and wept, and fasted until even, for Saul, and for Jonathan his son, and for the people of the LORD, and for the house of Israel; because they were fallen by the sword.

1:13 And David said unto the young man that told him, Whence [art] thou? And he answered, I [am] the son of a stranger, an Amalekite.

1:14 And David said unto him, How wast thou not afraid to stretch forth thine hand to destroy the LORD'S anointed?

1:15 And David called one of the young men, and said, Go near, [and] fall upon him. And he smote him that he died.

Since both abortion and euthanasia are the taking of anothers life they are both covered by these two passages (As well as "Thou shalt not kill").

And that was after ten seconds of searching!

End of the day the bible covers every possible contingency if you look, hell theres parts in it vague enough to cover anything!

(Please note Im not actualy technicaly a christian, Im a gnostic http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif) )

[This message has been edited by MaxSteiner (edited 03-22-2005).]

But if you take the bible literally...

quote:Originally posted by insanelogic:

this is funny! i went to catholic school for 11 years. my 3 younger sisters went (one is still attending so i know what's it's like currently). people making out, having sex, doing drugs, the same as in public school (which i attended for my last 2 years in highschool). they are a little more raunchy in catholic school, from my experience. the girls were dirtier, the boys were nastier. other than that, it all sucked. only reason i was sent to catholic school is so i could learn for myself that catholicism is bs. well, all four of us (including the one that is still waiting to be confirmed) have come to the same conclusion. logic outweighs bs any day, and that's all the catholic religion is based on!

Now I wish I went to a catholic high school...

ohhh, the skirts...

*drools*

it would b alot easier just 2 ask how many people on earth do hear what was said because human being's r stupid ass creature's that don't think when they act they just act