So, today these young Samaritans come to our class in order to publicise how "wrong" premature sex is and how we should keep it on holding hands untill we are "mature enough". They said "mature enough" as if it meant 40.That not being enough, they started talking about how "wrong" science was and that we have been wasting our lives with biology and physics when God alone holds the answer to all questions.



Here are some of the not-so-religious responses to such statements :

1. If God had wanted us to have sex after we are 21, he wouldn't had given us erections and menstrual cicluses when we were 12.

2. If God were righteous and unmistakeable, then no one would turn evil or die.

3. If God were righteous and unmistakeable, then what the hell were Bill Clinton and Madlen Olbreight (kiss me, grammar whores!)

4. If God didn't invent science, then we sure as hell got worked up for nothing about those chemical bomb threats

5. If God didn't want us to learn physics, then we made a biiiiiiig boo-boo with going to the moon and consolating around cold fusion

6. If God was to forgive everyone for their crimes, we wouldn't be condemned to hell.

So, the next time someone starts comparing religion and science in God's favour, arrange a meeting with that retart and the latter. Whatever God is, if he IS, he sure as hell doesn't mind people doing wrong things in his name, so don't praise the Lordwith the Good Book. Praise him as you find fit and deserving. Instead of reciting "Hail Marry" do a research, at least the reasearch will prove to be good for something while you are still alive.

What kind of school do you go to, Private?

You're thinking of god as if it were a person who thinks and acts like a person does. If god does exist I'm sure he's doesn't really care about things like that. Those are mostly just church instated regulations to control disease, population, and money.

"1. If God had wanted us to have sex after we are 21, he wouldn't had given us erections and menstrual cicluses when we were 12."

- I don't think god gives guys erections. I'm pretty sure naked girls do.

"2. If God were righteous and unmistakeable, then no one would turn evil or die."

- Why? God supposedly gave us freewill so we would be more like him (capable of making decisions), which is normally what causes "evil" and he supposedly made us die to be less like him. Or - according to the bible "them".

"3. If God were righteous and unmistakeable, then what the hell were Bill Clinton and Madlen Olbreight (kiss me, grammar whores!)"

- That didn't even make sense. What the hell do they have to do with god or being riteous and unmistakeable, for that matter?

"4. If God didn't invent science, then we sure as hell got worked up for nothing about those chemical bomb threats"

- God supposedly created everything, therefore he obviously created science.

"5. If God didn't want us to learn physics, then we made a biiiiiiig boo-boo with going to the moon and consolating around cold fusion"

- Why? It states in the bible he gave us the universe. I think that means we're allowed to go anywhere we want and do pretty much whatever we want with it.

"6. If God was to forgive everyone for their crimes, we wouldn't be condemned to hell."

- Yea?

Are you fourteen?

Cheers,

Lost

*LAUGHS OUT LOUD*

You're so awesome, Lost !

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

*LAUGHS OUT LOUD*

You're so awesome, Lost !

*Digitally high fives Digital Savior*

Cheers,

Lost

quote:Originally posted by LostCause:

"1. If God had wanted us to have sex after we are 21, he wouldn't had given us erections and menstrual cicluses when we were 12."

- I don't think god gives guys erections. I'm pretty sure naked girls do.

While i gotta admit you did wrek him quite abit i loved the way you avoided that question. So what is the anwser. If god wanted us only to have sex when we are adults and mature why do we go through puberty at such an age? Why do we get an interest in girls at such an age? I mean hell the average age for a males and females to go through puberty is 12-16 so why so young and imature as you put it?

quote:Originally posted by Fai1safe:

While i gotta admit you did wrek him quite abit i loved the way you avoided that question. So what is the anwser. If god wanted us only to have sex when we are adults and mature why do we go through puberty at such an age? Why do we get an interest in girls at such an age? I mean hell the average age for a males and females to go through puberty is 12-16 so why so young and imature as you put it?

I think the maturity question is from a modern point of view. People used to be married during puberty. Also, life span has increased (not counting back when God allow people to live over 120 years).

The Bible does not say that you should be mature before you have sex. God says that you should be married, and have sex only with your spouse.

In some ways, kids today are more mature than they were when i was a kid. Kids were more "protected" from the realities of life. But in today's world, kids can turn on TV or the internet and be bombarded by filth-- and i'm not just talking about sex. But in some ways, kids in the past were more mature out of necessity -- family survival.

Another thing that has loosened the standards of acceptability is transportation... in the past, most people were pretty much stuck where they are.. which means that which means that family values would not, could not, be questioned as much. And going against the communities values would be less tollerated. Now days, "if ya dont like the way things are" people pick up and move away, to find somewhere that they will feel more accepted, or atleast tolerated. Actually, no, i sorta take that back, i think our society is beyond that stage. that stage was more from the 50's,60's and 70's... now, tolleration (to a point-- not counting people's natural ability and desire to be predudiced) is almost anywhere.

Now to the original poster (Alek Tricity). You said, "So, today these young Samaritans come to our class in order to publicise how "wrong" premature sex is and how we should keep it on holding hands untill we are "mature enough". They said "mature enough" as if it meant 40."

The Bible aside for a moment, things that i have noticed during my life..people that have gotten married young, to there first love, tend more often, to stay together, but only when they learn (or have been taught, maybe through close families) how to deal with the tuff times and to enjoy the good times..but not put so much importance on either.. keep it basic, dont look for so much "new, flashy stuff".

The more promiscuous one is, the less value you have on your partner.. and i'm not even talking about cheating on your partner. But when you cheat once, it is easier to do it again. The more cheating/promiscuity, the more the value of love goes down the toilet. This is one place that maturity helps. If you wait to be more mature, you desire to please your mate will be more... not only the desire, but the action of pleasing your partner increases because the level of love is more pure and can mature.

I hope what was written makes sense. This is said, not only from observation, but from making some of those mistakes.

Now i'm going to try to tie this into our relationship with God... the more we try to do "our own thing", even if we love God, the harder it is to want to please God. The more we try to please God, the more our relationship with God can mature.

Boy, talk about 'run-on sentences'. I always hated diagraming sentences.. these would have put me back to pre-school. Oh well, i hope this made some sense.

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:

I think the maturity question is from a modern point of view. People used to be married during puberty.

Ah but wouldnt an Omniscient being know what shall happen in the future and adjust his laws for it.

For instance you are not supposed to use condoms but aids has killed millions of people. So shouldnt he have said "Oh yeah and the eleventh commandment is "Thall shall wearith the condom."" Ok maybe he wouldnt have said it like that but you get the point.

A condom wouldn't be necessary if both partners were virgins and if they only had sex with eachother.....

I pardon your ignorance of the fact that aids can be passed by blood and from parent to child and a ton of different ways.

quote:Originally posted by Fai1safe:

Ah but wouldnt an Omniscient being know what shall happen in the future and adjust his laws for it.

For instance you are not supposed to use condoms but aids has killed millions of people. So shouldnt he have said "Oh yeah and the eleventh commandment is "Thall shall wearith the condom."" Ok maybe he wouldnt have said it like that but you get the point.



what He said was, "Thou shalt not commit adultery". That pretty much covers it.

When i said about modern perspective, that is answering a human question with human answer.

quote:Originally posted by Fai1safe:

I pardon your ignorance of the fact that aids can be passed by blood and from parent to child and a ton of different ways.

AIDS is part of the curse of sin. There would be no disease, had Adam and Eve "done what they were told".

And by the way, earthly speaking, how were humans first infected with AIDS, and how was it spread? (rhetorical question-- i'm not looking for a scientific explaination of AIDS)

Biblically speaking, sin allowed death and suffering to enter the world. And sin continues the spread of diseases. And no, i'm not bashing gays or saying that someone did or did not screw a monkey or even arguing what we have learn from science about how diseases are contracted and spread (because that would fit from an earthly perspective), what i am saying, is that, from a biblical perspective (the big picture), all disease and suffering (and death) is originally caused from sin, both original and continued.

quote:Originally posted by Fai1safe:

I pardon your ignorance of the fact that aids can be passed by blood and from parent to child and a ton of different ways.



I pardon your ignorance that I was talking about sexually transmitted AIDS.

If we were talking about AIDS in general, then I guess your logical solution would be that everyone should stay indoors, isolated?

quote:Originally posted by napoleon_complex:



I pardon your ignorance that I was talking about sexually transmitted AIDS.

If we were talking about AIDS in general, then I guess your logical solution would be that everyone should stay indoors, isolated?

besides that, i'm pretty sure (cant remember though) that the AIDS virus is small enough to pass through condoms, right? and if the condom were used, then the kid couldnt be spawned (aside from condom failure rate). At atleast one point, there would presumably have been some "unsafe" sex to either contract the virus or to procreate.

quote:I pardon your ignorance of the fact that aids can be passed by blood and from parent to child and a ton of different ways.

Also, Fai1safe, i think there is only one way to pass on the AIDS virus (i havent read much about the stuff for quite awhile, so i could be mistaken)... transmission of bodily fluids. It had to be contracted be swapping bodily fluids and then passed on by swapping with someone else.

The gift that keeps on giving..

1. If God had wanted us to have sex after we are 21, he wouldn't had given us erections and menstrual cicluses when we were 12.

The limitations of sex before a consentual age is a condition set by the government and for good reason. Emotional and mental development is much slower then physical. God's plan says, do not have sex outside of marriage nor lust for a woman in your heart other then your wife, otherwise it is adultry. God's plan say's to abstain until you are married. A lot of disease and other problems may not plague us if we could just do that commandment alone.

God gave Moses this command -

Exodus 20:14 "You shall not commit adultry" Many more conditions to that commandment were given in Leviticus which are to many to quote here but inside adultry lies a great deal of sexual sin and perversion of all kinds. .

Jesus went on to explain what God meant by this commandment - “You have heard that it was said, ‘Do not commit adultery.' But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. Mathew 5:27 (NIV)



2. If God were righteous and unmistakeable, then no one would turn evil or die.

3. If God were righteous and unmistakeable, then what the hell were Bill Clinton and Madlen Olbreight (kiss me, grammar whores!)

The anwser to both of these is this:

"In a large house there are articles not only of gold and silver, but also of wood and clay; some are for noble purposes and some for ignoble. If a man cleanses himself from the latter, he will be an instrument for noble purposes, made holy, useful to the Master and prepared to do any good work." 2 Timothy 2:20-21 (NIV)

We are born sinners, all are wicked from birth and are inclined to do evil (evil defined is more subtle then most realize). Through our lives experiences we are taught, hopefully, what is right and what is wrong in our conduct. Beyond that, I always will hope that all receive the seed of eternal rest through the continual and ever flowing life spoken through God's word.

"And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified." Romans 8:30 (NIV)

Some were made for noble and some for inoble purposes as you can see, God chose who are His. He knows your heart and all of your days. If you are His you will be called.

4. If God didn't invent science, then we sure as hell got worked up for nothing about those chemical bomb threats

Fear has a few dimensions to it. Some are good and of course some are bad. Some fear causes us to walk upright, like the fear of discipline, prison time or punishment from our parents. Fear can also act as a sense of danger or self preservation. Fear can also warn us that the consequences for when we have done something wrong is on us. If you step on someones foot, they may turn around and smack you.

Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, [ Or through the darkest valley ] I will fear no evil, for you are with me; your rod and your staff, they comfort me. Psalm 23:4

There is no fear when the law's of nature or God's commandments are followed. If we only understood and applied just the 10 commandments our communities would benefit greatly.

The Christian did not receive a spirit that makes them a slave again to fear, but we received the Spirit of sonship. [ Or adoption] And by him we cry, “Abba, [ Aramaic for Father] Father.” - Romans 8:15 (NIV)

There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love. 1 John 4:18-(NIV)

From death to life the fear of punishment is removed once love is made perfect in a person and they begin to walk in obediance to God's commandments. As heirs to the Kingdom of God through Christ Jesus God reconciled Himself with Man. To fear death is reasonable but to fear life is not. A chemical bomb designed to destroy us or manipulate us with fear is not the will of God but of man and those under grace need not fear anything of man as God's plan is much more then the carnal and secular.

5. If God didn't want us to learn physics, then we made a biiiiiiig boo-boo with going to the moon and consolating around cold fusion

"God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground." Genesis 1:28

This universe and all that is in it is for our purpose and our needs. Science and nature are seperate things and religion as well. All serve their purpose and we must not lose sight that through the doctines of the commandments we learn how to live in upright spirit and through that study we find our direction for good conduct. Through science we learn how our body and our mind interacts with our universe but do not be fooled to believe that science will replace the commandments. The laws of nature can not be changed. The bible will not explain physics nor can physics explain the spiritual. Both are seperate but both are necessary.

6. If God was to forgive everyone for their crimes, we wouldn't be condemned to hell.

God has made a new covenent (agreement or made peace) with us through the death, burial and resurection of the Christ. God shed His own blood on the cross as atonement for all sin of all mankind though His Son Christ Jesus. All mankind for all generations have been forgiven of their sin but only as a gift that can only be received willingly by the acceptance of what His Son Jesus did for us.

Through the circumcision of the heart God will redeem us and restore our broken spirits. He will lift us up from the ground and dust us off. He will remove the sin of death in our body and cast them to the farthest east and the farthest west. He will cast our sins into the deepest oceans and remember them no more. For once we lived against Him and His anger burned against us but through His Son and counciler we are accepted as purified and holy, being temples worthy to the Holy Spirit of God.

Your sins are forgiven and all you have to do is accept it and then you may take your inherrited place in the kingdom of God. However, you must first have to accept that you are a sinner before you can accept that Jesus already paid your price for the way to the Father. Believe, repent and be baptized into the body of Christ.

[This message has been edited by Sig_Intel (edited 03-26-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by Sig_Intel:



Sig_Intel, i would like to welcome you to our little community.

May God use all of the Christians (and all the community) for His Will. In Jesus name, Amen.

quote:Originally posted by Fai1safe:

While i gotta admit you did wrek him quite abit i loved the way you avoided that question. So what is the anwser. If god wanted us only to have sex when we are adults and mature why do we go through puberty at such an age? Why do we get an interest in girls at such an age? I mean hell the average age for a males and females to go through puberty is 12-16 so why so young and imature as you put it?



Okay, what xtreem said, but I wanted to reply myself.

First off, I've said before, I'm no advocate for god, but if this Christian god is the actual god... It's only been in modern times that it's become tabboo to get married before 18. I was married at 17 (divorced at 19)and it's still a big deal when I tell people.

I mean, supposedly The Virgin Mary got married when she was 15 and there's lot's of biblical accounts of girls and boys getting married at similiarily young ages and even younger. I'm Gypsy and in my culture you're often betrothed at birth and back in the Middle East, we sometimes marry before we're even teenagers. Romeo and Juliette were 14, so was Marie Antionette.

Granted, this may not be a great thing, but lets be clear: God never made any age restrictions.

Cheers,

Lost

quote:Originally posted by napoleon_complex:

A condom wouldn't be necessary if both partners were virgins and if they only had sex with eachother.....

Sure this is true, but it's a fantasy. Especially on a global scale.

quote:Originally posted by great_sage=heaven:

Sure this is true, but it's a fantasy. Especially on a global scale.



The real world is for losers. It's way better to discuss made up ideal conditions.

PS This is the worst thread ever. The original post was typical nonsense, and as a result all the responses are in a similar vein.

quote:Originally posted by great_sage=heaven:

Sure this is true, but it's a fantasy. Especially on a global scale.





Maybe, but if done it does work.

Globally yes, but in western countries it could be feasible.

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:

Sig_Intel, i would like to welcome you to our little community.

May God use all of the Christians (and all the community) for His Will. In Jesus name, Amen.



Thankyou and God bless

It's good to be here

You dont get what im saying. Say a girl got aids of her mother and then because the guy she had sex with didnt use a condom he got it aswell and then spread it to others. And Aids can be transfered through blood. Even a drop would do and no it cant pass through condoms. I think it can be passed through saliva but you have to drink like 50 letres or something of it.

Anyway all im trying to say is that through saying condoms are the work of the devil they are just as bad as if they were giving the disease to people.

quote:Originally posted by Fai1safe:

You dont get what im saying. Say a girl got aids of her mother and then because the guy she had sex with didnt use a condom he got it aswell and then spread it to others.

Let me ask you this:

Is this girl someone you know?

I'm only asking because of sensitivities... it is easy to look at these things from an academic POV, and not as peoples real lives.

Either way, way was said, was said. But somewhere in the past there has been unprotected sex between outside of marriage.. even in your "hypothetical" case. The guy must have contracted it somehow... maybe from a bad blood transfusion or something... but somehow, maybe way back down the line, there was adultery.

quote:Originally posted by Fai1safe:

You dont get what im saying. Say a girl got aids of her mother and then because the guy she had sex with didnt use a condom he got it aswell and then spread it to others. And Aids can be transfered through blood. Even a drop would do and no it cant pass through condoms. I think it can be passed through saliva but you have to drink like 50 letres or something of it.

Anyway all im trying to say is that through saying condoms are the work of the devil they are just as bad as if they were giving the disease to people.

IIf he knew that she had AIDS, then they should have worn condoms.

Lost, can you read?

I didn't say that GOD gave a man errections and that God doesn't have free will. I said that one can't see God the way those casually-dresses wimps present him. You can't go around screaming to the world that Jeseus cares and Satan hates. God is omnious in IT'S form, and doesn't judge the actions developed from his creations.

What I meant under the "bomb" part, was that GOD had HIS plans with each and every creation, not the man or the church.

Chemical bombs are NOT holy artifacts made off an ununderstandable substance, but man's inverts of the particles around him.

The Bill Clinton and Madlen Olbreight part :

I'm from a country that suffered greatly under the will of these two during 1999. You wouldn't know jack about it, trust me. There was no "good" God or no "mercifull" miracles when the bombs rained. Just terror and devastation everywhere.And they didn't get punished. Yea.

You still avoided explaining the final passage, so I'm waiting for it.



Just because you are one of the rare people on totse that actually READ through the entire post and take their time to type about it, I won't flame you, but you nedd to realise you made a huge self-pwned:

This wasn't an "I think there is no God" but a "People missinterpret God and try to teach the youth from the Bible or Quran" thread.

After reading this, I hope you will see who this thread was aimed against.

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:

Let me ask you this:

Is this girl someone you know?

I'm only asking because of sensitivities... it is easy to look at these things from an academic POV, and not as peoples real lives.

Either way, way was said, was said. But somewhere in the past there has been unprotected sex between outside of marriage.. even in your "hypothetical" case. The guy must have contracted it somehow... maybe from a bad blood transfusion or something... but somehow, maybe way back down the line, there was adultery.

No its nothing personal and i dont no anyone with aids all i was trying to say was that condoms stop disease and unwanted pregnancy which causes a ton of shit when a couple doesnt want a baby and yet still christians say that they are evil. I find it stupid thats all.

quote:Originally posted by Alek Tricity:



Here are some of the not-so-religious responses to such statements :

1. If God had wanted us to have sex after we are 21, he wouldn't had given us erections and menstrual cicluses when we were 12.

2. If God were righteous and unmistakeable, then no one would turn evil or die.

3. If God were righteous and unmistakeable, then what the hell were Bill Clinton and Madlen Olbreight (kiss me, grammar whores!)

4. If God didn't invent science, then we sure as hell got worked up for nothing about those chemical bomb threats

5. If God didn't want us to learn physics, then we made a biiiiiiig boo-boo with going to the moon and consolating around cold fusion

6. If God was to forgive everyone for their crimes, we wouldn't be condemned to hell.



1. Thats true. The Jews were supposed to marry at about 13 (when they were considered men)

2. we choose to do so

3. see above

4. God didnt invent science. Invention implies that one has figured a unique set up for predetermined (or preprogrammed) data, be it natural or digital. God programmed the universe, so invention does not apply

5. God didnt intend fr us to be retarded in the way of physics. That would actually hinder His religion.

6. HAHAHAHAHA. He is willing to forgive you. But you just have to ask.

quote:Originally posted by Alek Tricity:

You can't go around screaming to the world that Jeseus cares and Satan hates.

Why not ?

If I believe in Him with any amount of conviction, I will tell everyone I know the truth, which is that He is a God of love, and Satan wants to drag us down into his muck.

You talk about bombs and war, yet you fail to pin the blame on the deserving party: MAN.

If God interfered the way you seem to want Him to ("pay back all those bomb-happy bastards !"), then you would probably complain that He wasn't allowing us to have free will...

You sound mighty pissed off, and I think you ought to either educate yourself about what God's will is for us (it's all in the Bible), or you need to be quiet.

I say this not because your opinion is not valid, but because you haven't any idea what you're talking about.

I understand that you are angry...and you are entitled to that.

Just make sure you know exactly what you're mad about.

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

Why not ?

If I believe in Him with any amount of conviction, I will tell everyone I know the truth, which is that He is a God of love, and Satan wants to drag us down into his muck.

You talk about bombs and war, yet you fail to pin the blame on the deserving party: MAN.

If God interfered the way you seem to want Him to ("pay back all those bomb-happy bastards !"), then you would probably complain that He wasn't allowing us to have free will...

You sound mighty pissed off, and I think you ought to either educate yourself about what God's will is for us (it's all in the Bible), or you need to be quiet.

I say this not because your opinion is not valid, but because you haven't any idea what you're talking about.

I understand that you are angry...and you are entitled to that.

Just make sure you know exactly what you're mad about.

Oh, I know what I'm mad about. I'm mad about the fact that I emphasised for about three times I wasn't attacking God, but believeing in God via instructions, type as : "in case of great sin, confess and recite ten Hail Marries".

A man is condemned to suffering in his sins just as it is : it shows on his face (the Cain's mark), it destroys him as a singular (the Pharaoh) or as an entire society (Sodoma & Gomora). If these things were to be taken litterally (pardon my spelling), they would loose all the advice the Good Book tried to pass on to us in an indirect way.

Did I make myself ANY more clear?

Alex, you need to take some reading comprehension classes. Your original post was poorly worded, almost completely incoherent, unfounded, immature, underdeveloped, and worst of all: typical.

If you don't understand what I said, that's your problem. I'm done with this post and I'm closing it because I feel like it.

Cheers,

Lost