Okay, so there are 1.1 billion Catholics in the world, and several hundred million protestants...that means roughly 1/5 of the world is Christian...so, 4 out of 5 people are going to Hell according to common Christian perception. I say that's bullshit. Would God have made a bet and lost? I think not. How could 20% be a win? It can't.

God's bet was that Job wouldn't give in to temptation...that's what sin is, giving in to temptation. If not believing in god comes naturally to you, or if another religion comes naturally to you, then denying God's existence isn't giving in to temptation; it's a philosophical conclusion devoid of anyone's input but our own and founded upon our thoughts alone, not the influences of others. So long as mistakes we make are honest mistakes in our own thoughts, we do not stray into temptation. God would obviously win the bet under those conditions.

According to the Quran (somewhere in Surrah 2, but it's probably mentioned more..), anyone who truly believes in God will go to Heaven.

Numbers of adherents; names of houses of worship, names of leaders, rates of growth: http://www.religioustolerance.org/worldrel.htm

In comparison: http://www.adherents.com/Religions_By_Adherents.html

God isn't trying to bet and win. He is the almighty Creator of the universe, and His intended purpose for our existence is still unknown to us. I presume we will be told when we get to Heaven.

God's perception of Job was that he would remain faithful to God, and not turn from Him; not that he would fight temptation.

Job was already a man of God, and generally, once you are, you cannot turn back (most people who understand that there is a God can't ever fathom our universe without Him in it).

Satan presented a case to God, that if he were allowed to cause Job to suffer tremendously, he would curse and then renounce his "beloved" God.

God knew better, and allowed Satan free reign over Job, to illustrate what it is to have complete faith.

It wasn't really for Satan, it was for future generations to read and say, "What a miserable Christian I am with my fast food life and my high expectations."

The description "mistakes" can be modified per interpretation. Do you mean sin ? Or tripping on a stair and falling ?

If you mean sin, it is inherently programmed into us from conception. God tells us that we are born into it. There is no avoiding that...even for Christians.

The difference is that once you become a Christian, God "remembers not" our transgressions...they have all been forgiven.

God desires those who will be devoted to Him, no matter the circumstance.

That is how God wins, because it is ultimately most gratifying to Him.

[This message has been edited by Digital_Savior (edited 04-04-2005).]

Not to be presumptuous, but...do you have AIM ?

Kinda bored...*lol*

Username: desired hush

hehehehe

Funny question...

Why did jehovah only send his prophets

and visions and saviors to one tribe

of people? Why not give a moses and

a jesus to the mongols and the hopis?

Instead, all these peoples had to

invent false prophets and miracles,

fake gods even! How can you blame

them for their confused blasphemy?

Lacking their own divine intervention,

they had to make up silly stories

to feel special too. The only parts

they might be right about were things

they copied from the jewish scriptures.

I guess the only logical answer to

these troubling questions is god works

in mysterious ways. Amen.

uh.... HEX?! :P have i seen your nimble ass playing rune? my rune identity was "guesswhat". greetings nevertheless...

Okay, I can't even defend what I wrote last night. I actually disagree with myself. I apologize for posting while under the influence of drugs.

What ive never gotten is why God created man in the first place? I mean he couldnt have been bored because if hes omnipotent then he would already know what was gonning to happen and therefor it wouldnt be interesting?

But that doesnt mean that His authority does not exist. So your argument fails because it states that if you dont believe in God then you dont go to hell. But you also fail to answer where do they go after they die?

But you fall for temptation every day. Gods word or yours you sin to God and to yourself on a regular basis. Saying that you wont eat ice cream because your fat and if you do then you have sinned to yourself. So then that makes you God.

So what your argument does as a way of life makes the ultimate authority for oneself as oneself. So there is no God to you. Then how does that make it true? People at one point in time thought that there were no microscopic organisms, yet we know today there are. How are you to know that there is no God and you make the descisions?

With that said, if you follow your plan, do you go to heaven?

quote:Originally posted by Viraljimmy:

Funny question...

Why did jehovah only send his prophets

and visions and saviors to one tribe

of people? Why not give a moses and

a jesus to the mongols and the hopis?

Instead, all these peoples had to

invent false prophets and miracles,

fake gods even! How can you blame

them for their confused blasphemy?

Lacking their own divine intervention,

they had to make up silly stories

to feel special too. The only parts

they might be right about were things

they copied from the jewish scriptures.

I guess the only logical answer to

these troubling questions is god works

in mysterious ways. Amen.

Yup.

You are SO right ! Why didn't I see the perfection of your jaded opinions before now ?

I am enlightened.

Thanks.

quote:Originally posted by Fai1safe:

What ive never gotten is why God created man in the first place? I mean he couldnt have been bored because if hes omnipotent then he would already know what was gonning to happen and therefor it wouldnt be interesting?

Inquiring Christian minds want to know the same thing.

I can't wait to get to heaven...

Duh, God created everything for his glory. No need to pull out Christian excuse #45123.

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

Okay, so there are 1.1 billion Catholics in the world, and several hundred million protestants...that means roughly 1/5 of the world is Christian...so, 4 out of 5 people are going to Hell according to common Christian perception. I say that's bullshit. Would God have made a bet and lost? I think not. How could 20% be a win? It can't.

God's bet was that Job wouldn't give in to temptation...that's what sin is, giving in to temptation. If not believing in god comes naturally to you, or if another religion comes naturally to you, then denying God's existence isn't giving in to temptation; it's a philosophical conclusion devoid of anyone's input but our own and founded upon our thoughts alone, not the influences of others. So long as mistakes we make are honest mistakes in our own thoughts, we do not stray into temptation. God would obviously win the bet under those conditions.

You first apply scientific fact to something that's not scientific and then you hold it to it's mythology. That's like saying "Dodo birds are existinct, but it says in Alice In Wonderland she speaks to a Dodo. Where is this Dodo?!" As if you believe it but can't stand the fact that you believe something that's completely illogical.

That's where the difference between knowing and believing come in, in the first place. It's perfectly fine to believe something you can't prove, but knowing something that can't be proven is insane.

You're playing a tug of war with your spirituality. Either who accept the doctrine as it is and don't try to apply science to it or you apply science to it completely and you accept your findings as they are. Mixing it up will get you nowhere.

Cheers,

Lost

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

You are SO right ! Why didn't I see the perfection of your jaded opinions before now ?

It seems your reply says nothing.

My statement was sarcastic,

but isn't that what you actually

believe?

If not, correct me. Thanks.

What about forgiveness?

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

Inquiring Christian minds want to know the same thing.

I can't wait to get to heaven...

Neither can i... If god exists or not to tell me is another question but when i die ill shore know the truth. Oh and isnt it a sin or something to want to die.

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

Okay, I can't even defend what I wrote last night. I actually disagree with myself. I apologize for posting while under the influence of drugs.

For those who are wondering why I'd post such crap.