First of all my question is whether or not the flood ever happened and theories/scientififc evidence for/against it.My first scientific evidence for the flood is that sea shells have been found on top on various moutain tops around the world.My statement against the flood is that scientists say that the way mountains are formed is when two plates of the earth's crust collide a certain way.Thus when two plates collide and form a mountain underwater which causes the mountain to lift all the shit underwater to be on top of the newly formed mountain.Which would include sea shells.What do you think?

Sounds about right, except for a few things on the "against" side.

First, the shells weren't found on the mountains but in the mountain itself. They also amazingly match the shells that we are expected to find if the top of the mountain was under a lake or sea many years ago. There is a lack of mixing of shells and fossils like you would expect if a flood placed them all there.

A lot of religious and non-religious histories have accounts of a huge flood somewhere.

I don't think it is entirely out of the realm of possibilities.

However, I do not think there was a Noah or an ark.

http://tinyurl.com/95jcn Sort of building off of what Napoleon said. There are many flood myths from around the world.

The bigest against there is is were did all the water come from and were did it go. All the ansers you get from creationist types invole God personaly holding the sky up because that is the only way life as we know it could survive with that much water in the atmoshpere.

quote:Originally posted by MasterPython:

The bigest against there is is were did all the water come from and were did it go. All the ansers you get from creationist types invole God personaly holding the sky up because that is the only way life as we know it could survive with that much water in the atmoshpere.



Although my personal thoughts are that the "canopy theory" is wrong, the water also came from the "fountains of the deep".

As far as, "where did it all go?", the Bible says that the mountains rose up, and the valleys sank. Implying that the earth may have been more flat (oceans being less deep, also).

The theory of "catastrophic plate techtonics" does give a possible, natural way for both "where the water came from" and "where it went". Although, even among "creation scientists", the theory is questionable and even has some (debatable) faults.

If you are interested in the arguements for and against (these are both from creationists viewpoints):

www.answersingenesis.org/tj/v16/i1/plate.asp (http://www.answersingenesis.org/tj/v16/i1/plate.asp)

I'm sure that talk.origins has other arguements against, but i havent looked yet. (and to be honest, i have only read a small article describing the theory)

quote:"Implying that the earth may have been more flat (oceans being less deep, also)."

Not exactly. If you read the entire chapter.

quote:

bible quote:

Psa 104:6 Thou coveredst it with the deep as [with] a garment: the waters stood above the mountains.

Psa 104:7 At thy rebuke they fled; at the voice of thy thunder they hasted away.

Psa 104:8 They go up by the mountains; they go down by the valleys unto the place which thou hast founded for them.

Psa 104:9 Thou hast set a bound that they may not pass over; that they turn not again to cover the earth.

As you can see, They = water (as seen in 104:9) and thus it is what's moving not the mountains. Since this is psalms it is written poetically and appears a bit hard to translate, as if you look at the verse in different bible versions it reads differently, some are clearer but not as poetic.



I know this thread is supposed to be mainly scientific but I wanted to interject about this.

quote:Originally posted by Beta69:

As you can see, They = water (as seen in 104:9) and thus it is what's moving not the mountains. Since this is psalms it is written poetically and appears a bit hard to translate, as if you look at the verse in different bible versions it reads differently, some are clearer but not as poetic.



I know this thread is supposed to be mainly scientific but I wanted to interject about this.



Thank you, i think i stand corrected.

Edit added:

Time for me to go helgermite hunting..

<<off to grab my net and a bucket>>

[This message has been edited by xtreem5150ahm (edited 06-18-2005).]

Many cultures have flood myths. The biblical flood is also a myth, as is most of the Bible.

quote:Originally posted by ArmsMerchant:

Many cultures have flood myths. The biblical flood is also a myth, as is most of the Bible.

Holy shit, Armsmerchant. Are you staying?

We're under a flood watch right now.

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:



Although my personal thoughts are that the "canopy theory" is wrong, the water also came from the "fountains of the deep".

As far as, "where did it all go?", the Bible says that the mountains rose up, and the valleys sank. Implying that the earth may have been more flat (oceans being less deep, also).

The theory of "catastrophic plate techtonics" does give a possible, natural way for both "where the water came from" and "where it went". Although, even among "creation scientists", the theory is questionable and even has some (debatable) faults.

If you are interested in the arguements for and against (these are both from creationists viewpoints):

www .answersin genesis.or g/tj/v16/i1/plate.asp (http: //www.answ ersingenes is.org/tj/ v16/i1/pla te.asp)

I'm sure that talk.origins has other arguements against, but i havent looked yet. (and to be honest, i have only read a small article describing the theory)

If there had been a giant flood it would have flattened the earth, not made altitude differences more extreme.

If there was a flood then all you can base it off of is faith, not science, because it has no science or evidence to back it. Noah did not fit a million+ species all of which he picked up in a few years from around the world onto a small ark. Water doesn't just appear from nowhere to cover the earth. So either, God did it, or it is a load of crap, not look at the evidence for a giant flood encompasing the entire planet.