http://www.christiansforcannabis.com/

Weed is stupid. Don't be an idiot.

marley smnoked lots o weed, but the bible says not to, so obviously marley is in hell now



why am i readin on these forums, just makes me sicker than thinkin bout religion

quote:Originally posted by SerioOria:

marley smnoked lots o weed, but the bible says not to, so obviously marley is in hell now



why am i readin on these forums, just makes me sicker than thinkin bout religion

You want to talk about Marley go to Rock and Roll.

-Val

quote:Originally posted by SerioOria:

marley smnoked lots o weed, but the bible says not to, so obviously marley is in hell now



why am i readin on these forums, just makes me sicker than thinkin bout religion



In the bible, it says God gave us all the herbs to use. It doesn't say anywhere to not smoke weed. It says not to be a drunkard. You can drink just don't be an alcoholic. Also Marley was religious, he studied the bible, just the old testament and he didn't believe in Jesus. Interestingly enough though, the founder of Rastafarianism, Haile Selassie I(Ras Tafari)believed in both the new and old testaments. And smoked bud.

[This message has been edited by KISE (edited 07-12-2005).]

http://rastaites.com/speeches/faith.html

Haile Selassie I(Ras Tafari):the Bible.Ras means duke.

quote:Originally posted by KISE:



In the bible, it says God gave us all the herbs to use. It doesn't say anywhere to not smoke weed. It says not to be a drunkard. You can drink just don't be an alcoholic. Also Marley was religious, he studied the bible, just the old testament and he didn't believe in Jesus. Interestingly enough though, the founder of Rastafarianism, Haile Selassie I(Ras Tafari)believed in both the new and old testaments. And smoked bud.



First, you are bending the word of God to suit your desires. That's dangerous.

Second, you seem to ignore other verses that go against you.

God says that we are to obey the laws of our lands, unless they go against Him directly, so that we may remain blameless in the sight of the world. Basically, we ought not to be breaking any laws.

The law in the US states that marijuana is illegal for sale, consumption, or traffic, so it is going against God to do so.

I am not saying you should quit, I am saying you should stop using this forum to form a pep rally to support weed consumption, which is probably confusing everyone. If that's what you want to do with your Christianity, fine, but don't try to twist the Bible around to make it seem alright.

We are also warned not to cloud our minds, which weed does.

I know, because I do it daily.

[This message has been edited by Digital_Savior (edited 07-12-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

First, you are bending the word of God to suit your desires. That's dangerous.

Second, you seem to ignore other verses that go against you.

God says that we are to obey the laws of our lands, unless they go against Him directly, so that we may remain blameless in the eyes of the world. Basically, we ought not to be breaking any laws.

The law in the US is against marijuana use, so it is going against God to break the law on this matter.

I am not saying you should quit, I am saying you should stop using this forum to form a pep rally to support weed consumption, and confusing everyone. If that's what you want to do with your Christianity, fine, but don't try to twist the Bible around to make it seem alright.

We are also warned not to cloud our minds, which weed does.

I know, because I do it daily.



I live in CA and I have a medical card. I walk into legal shops and buy it.

Why did God create marijuana, to look at? He created THC and the receptors in the brain that recieve it. I suppose you think legal pharmaceuticals are good, even though they damage your liver and kill over 760,000 people a year.

There is another member here that has the same situation...

In your case, it is legal, though one could argue that FEDERAL law still prohibits it, and supercedes any and all state law.

But Cali does what it wants. LMAO

Anyway, my contention was not with whether or not it was ok for YOU, but that you were using the Bible to defend your use. Not cool.

quote:Originally posted by KISE:

Why did God create marijuana, to look at? He created THC and the receptors in the brain that recieve it. I suppose you think legal pharmaceuticals are good, even though they damage your liver and kill over 760,000 people a year.

You cannot manipulate something, and then pretend that it is the way God meant it to be used.

Hemp can be used for MANY good things, all of which benefit humanity - paper goods, clothing, and essential oils, to name just a few.

God did not say, "Consume all things, even mind altering things."

By your logic, we should be munching on poisenous mushrooms daily.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

You cannot manipulate something, and then pretend that it is the way God meant it to be used.

Hemp can be used for MANY good things, all of which benefit humanity - paper goods, clothing, and essential oils, to name just a few.

God did not say, "Consume all things, even mind altering things."

By your logic, we should be munching on poisenous mushrooms daily.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

THC isn't poison. And wine is a mind altering substance. There's really no argument against it's use in the bible. Anyway I was just showing an interesting website that shows not all christians are close minded.

quote:Originally posted by KISE:

THC isn't poison. And wine is a mind altering substance. There's really no argument against it's use in the bible. Anyway I was just showing an interesting website that shows not all christians are close minded.



Where's the manipulation? I honestly believe that herbs are Gods medicine, including weed and opium, and that you are better off using these than man made synthetics. You can grow these in your own backyard.

Why is it so important to me? Because there's been hundreds of thousands of people locked behind bars for using a common herb while right now as we speak some youngster is ordering pharmaceuticals on line with their mother's credit card. It's cruel.

What are you doing up so late anyway? You're in the same time zone as me. It's 3:30am.

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

There is another member here that has the same situation...

In your case, it is legal, though one could argue that FEDERAL law still prohibits it, and supercedes any and all state law.

But Cali does what it wants. LMAO

Anyway, my contention was not with whether or not it was ok for YOU, but that you were using the Bible to defend your use. Not cool.



Cali and 10 other states.

It's always interesting to me when people claim to know what God would want or would allow. Just an observation.

I think Weed should have been legallized a long time ago, the bible does not say anything bad about these herbs. In fact weed increases alpha brain wave patters, causing increased creativity, increased metabolisim, which reduces cholestorol. I have read that people use cannibis to learn how to astral project while they are meditating. So why would god say it is bad. Doctors prescribe it to people, yeah its real bad? Only confused poloticians that think it is very bad because it is a gateway drug, alcohol isnt a gateway drug?, FUCK ALCOHOL it kills and hurts to many people, weed should be sold locally to people 21 and older, if they mass produce it, weed would be cheaper for everyone instead of illegal and expensive from our drug dealers. Which means the people would be able to save more money, instead of being broke all the time from their habbit. I belive god is more concered with the hungry in this world. Gov't should tax it and put that money into feeding the poor, housing the poor, ect. But instead they waste more money each year robbing the poor and throwing them in jail over a plant.

quote:Originally posted by Skankinsasquatch:

It's always interesting to me when people claim to know what God would want or would allow. Just an observation.



Well, since you're muslim, I guess you can easily claim that Allah says no to all intoxication. We only know God through our holy books. For you that's the koran. For me it's the bible. The bible makes no such claims about intoxication, only addiction.

We have to be careful when we listen to morality based on humanistic principles.

"Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds." And it was so. The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. Genisis 1:11-12

This scripture was given to me by an avid user of cannibis. How can I say that cannibis is bad and evil when by saying so contradicts the word of God? God said it was good.

I also can't judge anybody for what they consume because this was written. "Jesus called the crowd to him and said, "Listen and understand. What goes into a man's mouth does not make him 'unclean,' but what comes out of his mouth, that is what makes him 'unclean.' "

Then the disciples came to him and asked, "Do you know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this?" He replied, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots. Leave them; they are blind guides.[e] If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit." Mathew 15:10-13.

Of course this was said about ceremonial washing of hands before a meal. However, the message is; what comes out of man's heart is what should concern us. If cannibis causes a person to do evil then their is the crime against God. However, all things on this earth were given to us and for us. Even cocain in it's various forms is used for medical reasons along with other strong narcotics. There is too much conflict in scripture to say that cannibis and other narcotics are completly evil. We have to look at the intent of the consumer to determine if it is right or wrong.

I've seen that all things are useful or destructive. But, it is what comes from the heart that defines if it is evil or not. A hammer and a shotgun are both tools with their intended purposes but that purpose changes by the intent of the heart of who holds them. This is true for all things.

Do I propose that we go against the laws of the land? Of course not, the scripture is clear but there is a fine line we must keep in mind. If the government creates laws that oppose God's laws, for example: our government declares that abortion is legal but does that make it right in the eyes of God? I hope I made my point clear? Just because it's a law doesn't make it right.

I only ask; Is civil disobediance required in behest of cannibis for recreational use? I don't think so because that is where it is most destructive. But is there a usefullness besides that?

My wife was diagnosed with breast cancer 6 days after our son was born and is on her third chemo treatment. The use of cannibis has been discussed. We will pray on it.

Kise, can you refrain from posting 50 times in a row ? If you have something to say, say it all at once, unless you are addressing different people with each post.

It's not a rule, just a courtesy to your readers.

Thanks !

Sig, I am very sorry to hear of your wife's cancer.

I will be praying for her. What is her first name, if you don't mind ?

Or, you can IM me at desired hush.

If marijuana is prescribed, it is basically legal. If it will help ease her pain, and give her her appetite back, then I say GO FOR IT.

quote:Originally posted by Sig_Intel:



My wife was diagnosed with breast cancer 6 days after our son was born and is on her third chemo treatment. The use of cannibis has been discussed. We will pray on it.



The only thing I read about drugs that jesus talked about, is he mentioned that any one who smoked would be a thief. He never mentioned what drug, I think its crack.

I will pray for your wife also, Yes cannibis will help with the pain but cannibis is not everything, I think that when cannibis is used the minds brain waves increase, and the brain starts using all of the bodys nutrients to run it, doesnt the brain use most of our bodys energy? I think thats why our bodys start to starve, the munchies set in, and it also dehydrates you, which isnt good, so If a mind keeps its nutrients up along with water, it wont have any problem with cannibis, but I see so many people everyday, smoke every day and they are never healthy, And I blame it on their diet. Also talk to your doctor about the gold treatment, Differnt types of ORMUS elements are used to treat cancer, and these help with the pain greatly, and could help reverse the cancer. She will have to start taking them slow, to make sure they wont hurt her.

http://liquid-chi.com/spiritual_products.php

http ://www.col loidalgold .com/histo ry.htm (http: //www.coll oidalgold. com/histor y.htm)

http://www.colloidalgold.com/



[This message has been edited by godofjacob (edited 07-13-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by Valmont:

You want to talk about Marley go to Rock and Roll.

-Val

go to Rock N Roll and talk about how Marley in in hell, then get flamed for posting in wrong forum again? mods need to stop freaking out about posting in wrong forums; the bounadries need not be so tense and insane.

One more comment:

The main reason weed is illegal is the economy.

quote:Originally posted by Snoopy:

Weed is stupid. Don't be an idiot.

*Has rough doggy style sex with Snoopy*

omg, i hate the US

why do they make alcohol legal but complain about drunk drivers?

smoking marijuana is ALOT safer and has LESS affects than alcohol

stupid people

Theres no such thing of a god. 0 Evidence. You can't prove it. I could say that ghosts don't exist which is fundamentally accepted, because there is 0 evidence, but God is accepted because its part of our culture. In early times kingdoms, exspecially Constantinople (the first civilization to adopt Christianity by proletarian belief) picked the religion because of its positive effect on society, being able to control the their citizens' actions and morals on a divine level, and to make money ie. Only the rich could afford to repent their sins - this money was used to wage wars. The Catholic Church perfected this practice.

Must I even get into the Church of England, which said that each King of the day was connected with God? Must I delve into how the Pope which declared that all Popes can talk with God, if this is so why did all Popes declare the Earth was flat, and persecute scientists for saying it was round? Why be sad when these frauds pass away? I was disgusted of the media coverage that the recent Pope got when he died, this pope who tells poor countries to not use Condoms or birth control, in places like Africa(poor and highest aids rate). When did it become fundamentally accepted that Abortions are wrong? Where is this in the Bible - it isn't, because Abortions didn't exist then - Are they the same as killing? If so everything you masturbate you are killing Thousands(No because it hasn't made contact with the egg?) So is smoking and having a miscarriage murder? Why aren't these questions answered, I'll tell you why, because the men who wrote the bible are merely men, thousands of years ago, they never had a link with god, they could only address the culture and practices of their modern time.

There is no knowledge of a divine ruler, its primitive thinking to explain what we can't explain, men are like that, much like the way men do not want to ask for directions when driving, they are arrogant. To say there must be a divine ruler to explain the universe would just pose the question of there must be something that created the divine ruler. Eventually something came from nothing in time, the most logical conclusion is Religion was created by man, its myth. Nothing governs out universe but laws of science.

Don't believe this is possible? Just look at the hundreds of religions before Christianity. Human's are so easily fooled. Pretty much all of the millions of Egyptians believed in the god of Ra, etc. Sun gods, etc. WHY DO YOU THINK YOU HAVE IT FIGURED OUT NOW? IS STILL THE SAME SCENERIO JUST A STRONGER ARGUMENT THAN BEFORE.

Survival of the fitest.

The End.

[This message has been edited by SThornton (edited 07-14-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by KISE:



Well, since you're muslim, I guess you can easily claim that Allah says no to all intoxication. We only know God through our holy books. For you that's the koran. For me it's the bible. The bible makes no such claims about intoxication, only addiction.

I'm agnostic, partially because of people like you (but mainly because the presence of a higher being and his desires are not worth worrying to me...especially if its impossible for man to understand him). I stick up for Islam because I'm an advocate of tolerance towards religions and an attacker of ignorance. The Book of Job is an interesting study in exactly what is the downfall of presuming what God wants.

quote:Originally posted by SThornton:

Theres no such thing of a god. 0 Evidence. You can't prove it. I could say that ghosts don't exist which is fundamentally accepted, because there is 0 evidence, but God is accepted because its part of our culture. In early times kingdoms, exspecially Constantinople (the first civilization to adopt Christianity by proletarian belief) picked the religion because of its positive effect on society, being able to control the their citizens' actions and morals on a divine level, and to make money ie. Only the rich could afford to repent their sins - this money was used to wage wars. The Catholic Church perfected this practice.

Must I even get into the Church of England, which said that each King of the day was connected with God? Must I delve into how the Pope which declared that all Popes can talk with God, if this is so why did all Popes declare the Earth was flat, and persecute scientists for saying it was round? Why be sad when these frauds pass away? I was disgusted of the media coverage that the recent Pope got when he died, this pope who tells poor countries to not use Condoms or birth control, in places like Africa(poor and highest aids rate). When did it become fundamentally accepted that Abortions are wrong? Where is this in the Bible - it isn't, because Abortions didn't exist then - Are they the same as killing? If so everything you masturbate you are killing Thousands(No because it hasn't made contact with the egg?) So is smoking and having a miscarriage murder? Why aren't these questions answered, I'll tell you why, because the men who wrote the bible are merely men, thousands of years ago, they never had a link with god, they could only address the culture and practices of their modern time.

There is no knowledge of a divine ruler, its primitive thinking to explain what we can't explain, men are like that, much like the way men do not want to ask for directions when driving, they are arrogant. To say there must be a divine ruler to explain the universe would just pose the question of there must be something that created the divine ruler. Eventually something came from nothing in time, the most logical conclusion is Religion was created by man, its myth. Nothing governs out universe but laws of science.

Don't believe this is possible? Just look at the hundreds of religions before Christianity. Human's are so easily fooled. Pretty much all of the millions of Egyptians believed in the god of Ra, etc. Sun gods, etc. WHY DO YOU THINK YOU HAVE IT FIGURED OUT NOW? IS STILL THE SAME SCENERIO JUST A STRONGER ARGUMENT THAN BEFORE.

Survival of the fitest.

The End.





Religion defies proof...that's the point. That's what faith is all about. The point is that God is a concept that can't be grasped on any immediate level so we personify him as a man and call him our father for methaphorical purposes. This is why I'm so quick to bash literal interpretations of religious texts because I think those were made to get a point across, not to be dogmatic. What many atheists don't understand is that religion embodies a concept that we're not supposed to completely understand...proof can't be applied here. That's not to fire upon atheists...many atheists make very observing points (Marx's "religion is the opium of people"). I think Nietzsche said it best with "There are no facts, only interpretations.". As grounded as science and math may seem, remember that science is in a revisionist process as much as religion. String theory as a prime example. String theory estimates that there are 26 dimensions, that the universe is crafted of 1 dimensional vibrating strings (in which direction are the strings vibrating if they are 1 dimensional one might ask?), and that standard math and physics simply don't work to prove this.

quote:Originally posted by SThornton:

Theres no such thing of a god. 0 Evidence. You can't prove it. I could say that ghosts don't exist which is fundamentally accepted, because there is 0 evidence, but God is accepted because its part of our culture. In early times kingdoms, exspecially Constantinople (the first civilization to adopt Christianity by proletarian belief) picked the religion because of its positive effect on society, being able to control the their citizens' actions and morals on a divine level, and to make money ie. Only the rich could afford to repent their sins - this money was used to wage wars. The Catholic Church perfected this practice.

Must I even get into the Church of England, which said that each King of the day was connected with God? Must I delve into how the Pope which declared that all Popes can talk with God, if this is so why did all Popes declare the Earth was flat, and persecute scientists for saying it was round? Why be sad when these frauds pass away? I was disgusted of the media coverage that the recent Pope got when he died, this pope who tells poor countries to not use Condoms or birth control, in places like Africa(poor and highest aids rate). When did it become fundamentally accepted that Abortions are wrong? Where is this in the Bible - it isn't, because Abortions didn't exist then - Are they the same as killing? If so everything you masturbate you are killing Thousands(No because it hasn't made contact with the egg?) So is smoking and having a miscarriage murder? Why aren't these questions answered, I'll tell you why, because the men who wrote the bible are merely men, thousands of years ago, they never had a link with god, they could only address the culture and practices of their modern time.

There is no knowledge of a divine ruler, its primitive thinking to explain what we can't explain, men are like that, much like the way men do not want to ask for directions when driving, they are arrogant. To say there must be a divine ruler to explain the universe would just pose the question of there must be something that created the divine ruler. Eventually something came from nothing in time, the most logical conclusion is Religion was created by man, its myth. Nothing governs out universe but laws of science.

Don't believe this is possible? Just look at the hundreds of religions before Christianity. Human's are so easily fooled. Pretty much all of the millions of Egyptians believed in the god of Ra, etc. Sun gods, etc. WHY DO YOU THINK YOU HAVE IT FIGURED OUT NOW? IS STILL THE SAME SCENERIO JUST A STRONGER ARGUMENT THAN BEFORE.

Survival of the fitest.

The End.



He really hasnt read about the gods and what they used to acheive their mind power. They are real you dumb ass, the human mind makes gods possible. Primitive thinking to explain what we cant explain, it already has been explained thats the beauty of research.

[This message has been edited by godofjacob (edited 07-14-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by bumpkins505:

omg, i hate the US

why do they make alcohol legal but complain about drunk drivers?

smoking marijuana is ALOT safer and has LESS affects than alcohol

stupid people

AGREED !!

And if they legalized it, they could tax the crap out of it and get rid of the national deficit in under 20 years.

That's more than can be said of any plan they've got NOW.

quote:Originally posted by Digital_Savior:

AGREED !!

And if they legalized it, they could tax the crap out of it and get rid of the national deficit in under 20 years.

That's more than can be said of any plan they've got NOW.

As I said in my first post, I say feed the poor.

quote:Originally posted by SThornton:

Theres no such thing of a god. 0 Evidence. You can't prove it.

Simply put: Lack of evidence is not evidence.

quote:Originally posted by Skankinsasquatch:

String theory as a prime example. String theory estimates that there are 26 dimensions, that the universe is crafted of 1 dimensional vibrating strings (in which direction are the strings vibrating if they are 1 dimensional one might ask?), and that standard math and physics simply don't work to prove this.

First of all, String Theory does not postulate the existance of 26 dimensions. It postulates the existane of 10 dimensions. I believe you are thinking of Super String Theory.

With that out of the way, I'd just like to mention that you probably have never taken a look at the tensor calculus behind (Super) String Theory. String Theory is based on fact. If you are interested in having a basic conceptual idea of where we got the crazy idea that there were more than three spacial dimensions I would reccomend that you start by looking into Kaluza Klein theory. Enough science, AIM me if you want to know more (jsaxton14).

Back to the point of your post. You essentially claimed that science was just as much of a religion as actual religion. Let me clarify something for you: the difference between religion science is that I can make predictions with science (with 100% accuracy). I highly doubt that anyone can use religion alone to make predictions with the same level of accuracy. The validity of science can generally be proven; the validity of religion can generally not be proven.

I'm not saying religion is false because there isn't a simple test to prove its validity. I'm simply stating science is generally true because there are simple tests that exist to prove its validity. It is incredibly ignorant to argue otherwise. I hope that made sense.

[This message has been edited by jsaxton14 (edited 07-17-2005).]

God says that we are to obey the laws of our lands, UNLESS THEY GO AGAINST HIM DIRECTLY, so that we may remain blameless in the sight of the world. Basically, we ought not to be breaking any laws.

In the bible he said that they were put there for you use and by the gov. putting a law on it is going against his rule of using the plants he put on the earth.

quote:Originally posted by jsaxton14:

First of all, String Theory does not postulate the existance of 26 dimensions. It postulates the existane of 10 dimensions. I believe you are thinking of Super String Theory.

With that out of the way, I'd just like to mention that you probably have never taken a look at the tensor calculus behind (Super) String Theory. String Theory is based on fact. If you are interested in having a basic conceptual idea of where we got the crazy idea that there were more than three spacial dimensions I would reccomend that you start by looking into Kaluza Klein theory. Enough science, AIM me if you want to know more (jsaxton14).

Back to the point of your post. You essentially claimed that science was just as much of a religion as actual religion. Let me clarify something for you: the difference between religion science is that I can make predictions with science (with 100% accuracy). I highly doubt that anyone can use religion alone to make predictions with the same level of accuracy. The validity of science can generally be proven; the validity of religion can generally not be proven.

I'm not saying religion is false because there isn't a simple test to prove its validity. I'm simply stating science is generally true because there are simple tests that exist to prove its validity. It is incredibly ignorant to argue otherwise. I hope that made sense.





Actually, according to wikipedia Bosonic string theory AND superstring theory hypothesize 26 dimensions (well..to be fair, superstring also says there might be 10 or 11). This is all kind of besides the point. The point I was trying to make was that science makes some pretty wacky assertions, not all of them provable. I watched a show on Nova about it. There was some crazy scientist who claimed that string theory wasn't able to satisfy every mathematical and physical aspect they threw at it (the wikipedia entry makes note of it satisfying only certain space-time asymptotes). I can't even see how string theory would ever be proven...the analogy I'm thinking of would be a stick figure stepping off a piece of paper. Science actually does not always give you a 100% accurate result...in fact as any science teacher will tell you, randomness is just as culpable for nature as theory is. My physics teacher made it clear to me that physics is just an estimation of physical properties...its virtually unheard of to be right all the time in an particular field of science. I'm not calling religion and science the same thing; I just think they serve the same purpose. They serve people to explain what is not easily explainable. Christian scientists claim spirtual healing works while doctors claim positive thinking works. Who's right and how do we determine that? The Dali Lama has been attributed with remembering where he left certain objects in his past life, remembering the names of people, etc. Is this feasible according to science or a random event? And if science is truth then are there random events? Or is science a facade that God created? There are so many roads we could take on this; my point is that science doesn't hold truth any more than religion does...and I firmly believe that.

EDIT: Also if Einstein was right about relativity...then we're leading ourselves into a whole other realm of contradictions where truth is relative and we suppose we can find each perspective, but is there proof of that? Proof is more shallow than you think.



[This message has been edited by Skankinsasquatch (edited 07-17-2005).]

Science is not an organization; it's a method. A flawed method, yes. It's a method of logical induction and deduction based upon probability and reproduction.

Religion is a collection of (questionably) logical inductions and deductions based upon faith and possibility.

They still both serve the same purpose. (That is explaining the world around us)

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

Science is not an organization; it's a method. A flawed method, yes. It's a method of logical induction and deduction based upon probability and reproduction.

Religion is a collection of (questionably) logical inductions and deductions based upon faith and possibility.

They still both serve the same purpose. (That is explaining the world around us)

Exactly. Its a question of the tangibility (is that a word?) of truth. Science argues yes, religion argues no.