I was thinking about it, and researching some too, and Islam seems like the ideal religion for me. I currently consider myself a christian, but I am having doubts in christ. I am a firm believer in God on the other hand. From what I have gathered, Islam still believes in the same God, but they only believe Jesus was a prophet. They also believe in the other prophets.

What specific "doubts in Christ" do you have?

You're going to have to go a little more indepth here.

Like Christianity, Islam is demonstratably false.

Islam to me seems like a much more personal religion then christianity.

Religion is not always about believing in a god, it's about living a good life and being happy. Or falsly believing in gods and hell punishment... whatever your cup of tea is.

While trying to stay completely disinterested, I will still say Islam is one religion I could never bring myself to follow. I think it has something to do with its murderous, child-sexing messenger that promises you kiddie virgins and rivers flowing with wine(even though the religion condemns usage of such things).

Better be good, or we'll lock your ass up without charges. I love the West, and how swiftly it crushes its enemies. Fuck Islam and fuck Christianity.

quote:Originally posted by Snoopy:

Better be good, or we'll lock your ass up without charges. I love the West, and how swiftly it crushes its enemies. Fuck Islam and fuck Christianity.



Small contradiction there, the West is all about christianity.

quote:Originally posted by Drag0n Editi0n:

I was thinking about it, and researching some too, and Islam seems like the ideal religion for me. I currently consider myself a christian, but I am having doubts in christ. I am a firm believer in God on the other hand. From what I have gathered, Islam still believes in the same God, but they only believe Jesus was a prophet. They also believe in the other prophets.

Yes, Moslems believe that Jesus of Nazareth was not "Christ" but a prophet, albeit a special one, because he was the only prophet that could perform miracles. Read the Qu'ran if you want to follow Islam, first of all, to learn about Islam, and second of all, it is a requirement for Moslems to read the Qu'ran atleast once in their lives.

quote:Originally posted by jsaxton14:

Like Christianity, Islam is demonstratably false.

You must be the well without water or cloud without rain the Bible warned me of!

quote:Originally posted by elfstone:

Small contradiction there, the West is all about christianity.

No it's not. Christianity still exist but it's something completely different now. The Pope warns against religion becoming a product of consumption, to a bunch of teenagers wearing Eastpack backpacks with pictures of Jesus on it. The Pope and Jesus are owned, literally.

quote:Originally posted by Drag0n Editi0n:

I was thinking about it, and researching some too, and Islam seems like the ideal religion for me. I currently consider myself a christian, but I am having doubts in christ. I am a firm believer in God on the other hand. From what I have gathered, Islam still believes in the same God, but they only believe Jesus was a prophet. They also believe in the other prophets.

Have you also considered Judaism? It's a tough row to hoe, but superior to Islam. It's also the original.

quote:Originally posted by KikoSanchez:

While trying to stay completely disinterested, I will still say Islam is one religion I could never bring myself to follow. I think it has something to do with its murderous, child-sexing messenger that promises you kiddie virgins and rivers flowing with wine(even though the religion condemns usage of such things).

Mohamed said nothing of the sort that was Hassan-i-Sabah; leader of the hashashin, who called himself Islamic but was rejected as a Muslim (ostrasised) because of his assasinations of various people.

Islam is good. I am islamic and I will continue to be for the rest of my life because it is the only religion that doesn't brag about stuff like Jesus being the son of God and stuff.

[This message has been edited by midgetbasketball (edited 08-23-2005).]

quote:Originally posted by Snoopy:

No it's not. Christianity still exist but it's something completely different now. The Pope warns against religion becoming a product of consumption, to a bunch of teenagers wearing Eastpack backpacks with pictures of Jesus on it. The Pope and Jesus are owned, literally.

Maybe in Europe. With creationism in schools on the other side of the ocean, christianity is slowly forging its second dark age.

quote:Originally posted by midgetbasketball:



Islam is good. I am islamic and I will continue to be for the rest of my life because it is the only religion that doesn't brag about stuff like Jesus being the son of God and stuff.



You really put a lot of thought on your criteria :P

quote:Originally posted by elfstone:

Maybe in Europe. With creationism in schools on the other side of the ocean, christianity is slowly forging its second dark age.

You're exaggerating this shit. The USA is the country of crack cocaine, NASCAR, niggers, food eating contests, sexual insanity, etc. I hardly see Christianity getting in the way of that. And all the boy raping priests aren't helping much either. There is no Christianity anymore.

quote:Originally posted by elfstone:

Maybe in Europe. With creationism in schools on the other side of the ocean, christianity is slowly forging its second dark age.

You're exaggerating this shit. The USA is the country of crack cocaine, NASCAR, niggers, food eating contests, sexual insanity, etc. I hardly see Christianity getting in the way of that. And all the boy raping priests aren't helping much either. There is no Christianity anymore.

I actually dated a Muslim girl and she taught me a lot about it. I even read a few chapters of the Qu'ran and fasted for 2 Ramadan's. Here is the passage that made me stray away from it. Forget about the whole terrorist stuff, and just read this passage from the Qu'ran itself. I would like to see if anyone can justify it's meaning:

Chapter 2, the AL-BAQARA (THE COW), section 191 says:

"And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith."



I don't care if this is about protecting Islam or a nation. I believe that a religion that justifies murder in anyway is not a peaceful one. Instad of rewarding those that fought for the holy land, Allah should instead reward those that stood their ground and refused to fight.

land195, what you don't understand is that when the Quran was written there was a lot of animosity and opposition against the prophet and his teachings (most notably from the Quraysh tribes) which resulted in many conflicts and violence. Muhammad didn't write the Quran, his companions did after his death based on the prophecies he recited orally. The roots of that verse you quoted are not to justify the killings of random innocent people but instead is the calling to defend the original practices and teachings of Muhammad which were in jeoprady of becomming annhilated from it's enemies seeking to regain the rulling authority over Mecca at the time. Had they not been killed after battle they would have returned back to Mecca after regrouping which was the case many times before. They just wouldn't give up until they lost majority. It was a kill or be killed scenario. They might have not retaliated immediately but they would have surely done so over time if the opportunity presented itself which history had already shown.

It's interesting to note that much of the Quran was organized and codified mostly by the 3rd Caliph Uthman in order to gain personal favor and make sure he would have as much authority as possible. Everyone realized this and eventualy asked Uthman to abdicate but he refused, so the Kharijites executed him.

Also I doubt your translation is accurate since the original text is in Arabic and can be misinterpreted in many ways. You need to fully understand Arabic to literaly understand the true meanings of the Quran. One of the biggest misunderstandings in Islam concerns the term jihad which does not mean holy war as many of you believe. The term actualy means "a struggle", "a striving", or "a great effort", all of which would accurately describe what kind of situation early Muslims had to endure before and after the prophet's death.

And finaly something about Islam I'd like to mention is how it relates to communism in one very special way. It works well on paper and in our imaginations, however corruption is what gives it a tainted and bad reputation. If all Muslims actualy practiced the true teachings of Islam, they would be living very peaceful, spiritual lives. Unfortunately though, there always seems to be a minority of leaders who have absolute control of the majority and exploit their power for their own personal gains as is the case in both communism and Islam.

Kia Kordestani:

Ok, so my questions for you are these:

What would you consider Islam to be, the teachings of the prophets, or the written words of the Quran? If there is a difference, which one is the basis of true Islam?

Is there a following of Muslims that follow only the prophet's words and ignore the Quran altogether? Sort of like the watered down Cristianity that concetrates on Jesus only?

quote:Originally posted by land195:



Ok, so my questions for you are these:

What would you consider Islam to be, the teachings of the prophets, or the written words of the Quran? If there is a difference, which one is the basis of true Islam?



The teaching of the prophet is called the Hadith. So it would be the written words of the Qu'ran.

quote:

Is there a following of Muslims that follow only the prophet's words and ignore the Quran altogether? Sort of like the watered down Cristianity that concetrates on Jesus only?

No. That is the difference, Jesus was just a man. A human being. As well as Muhammed was.



Thats what always baffled me about Christianity, how Jesus is considered a god. Wouldn't that almost lower Gods position as being almighty? By saying a human is almost on his level.

quote:Originally posted by midgetbasketball:

Mohamed said nothing of the sort that was Hassan-i-Sabah; leader of the hashashin, who called himself Islamic but was rejected as a Muslim (ostrasised) because of his assasinations of various people.

Islam is good. I am islamic and I will continue to be for the rest of my life because it is the only religion that doesn't brag about stuff like Jesus being the son of God and stuff.



It's a bit more complicated than that. The Nizari Ismaili's had been assassinating people for several generations at that point, but it took Hassan declaring himself the final Imam and telling his followers they no longer needed to obey Sharia that made them outcasts. The drunken gay orgy that followed that proclamation probably didn't help. Seriously, Hassan II was a fucked up dude.

Islam in general is both better and worse than people make it out to be. The jackass who called it "child-sexing" and other assorted bullshit has never given it a serious study. Arguements along those lines have reasonable answers. My beef with Islam is that it's probably the most restrictive social order in the world today.

Islam, great idea. 1400 years ago. Today... lp.org.

I knew it.

quote:Originally posted by land195:

Kia Kordestani:

Ok, so my questions for you are these:

What would you consider Islam to be, the teachings of the prophets, or the written words of the Quran? If there is a difference, which one is the basis of true Islam?

Is there a following of Muslims that follow only the prophet's words and ignore the Quran altogether? Sort of like the watered down Cristianity that concetrates on Jesus only?

The Quran is based on the prophecies from God that Muhammad had witnessed and recited orally. The Sunna and its stories or hadith, are based on the prophet's tradition, deeds, and personal teachings which were used to deal with the growing number of legal and religious challanges that were not explicitly dealt with in the Quran.

The Quran is generaly not considered to preach Islamic law although there are eighty or so verses that deal with matters like inheritance and the status of women, in addition to a handful of penal prescriptions. Because of the countless legal issues that arose which could not be addressed according the the Quran alone, the Ulama (Islam's clerical establishment) looked for answers in the Sunna (the traditions of Muhammad).

So as for your question in regards to what is the true basis of Islam it is hard to say because the religion continued to develope much longer after Muhammad's death. But as for my personal belief I think that the original life of Muhammad which is best portrayed in some of the hadiths within the Sunna should set the proper example of the true basis of Islam.

The only reason this nigger is doing this, as well as learning Arabic and moving to France, is because he's an anti-social moron.

Next he's probably going to tell everyone how he's joining the Iraqi Mujahideen or some anti-American Islamic fundamentalist terrorist group.

quote:Originally posted by Magilla Gorilla:

The only reason this nigger is doing this, as well as learning Arabic and moving to France, is because he's an anti-social moron.

Next he's probably going to tell everyone how he's joining the Iraqi Mujahideen or some anti-American Islamic fundamentalist terrorist group.

When are you going to realize that not every Muslim is a terrorist?

quote:Originally posted by Chinese Food52:

When are you going to realize that not every Muslim is a terrorist?

Where did I say that? Notice how I said "Islamic Fundmentalist."

quote:Originally posted by Magilla Gorilla:

Where did I say that? Notice how I said "Islamic Fundmentalist."

You still implied it, moron.

Magilla Gorilla, you're a waste of oxygen. Do us all a favor and blow your brains out.

quote:Originally posted by elfstone:

Magilla Gorilla, you're a waste of oxygen. Do us all a favor and blow your brains out.

Shut up, you greasy Greek son of a whore.

quote:Originally posted by Magilla Gorilla:

Where did I say that? Notice how I said "Islamic Fundmentalist."

quote:Originally posted by Magilla Gorilla:



Next he's probably going to tell everyone how he's joining the Iraqi Mujahideen or some anti-American Islamic fundamentalist terrorist group.

Right there, you associated his spiritual choice with a terrorist group. He didn't say that he hates the west, or George Bush is an idiot. The only connection is his spiritual choice.

quote:Originally posted by Chinese Food52:

Right there, you associated his spiritual choice with a terrorist group. He didn't say that he hates the west, or George Bush is an idiot. The only connection is his spiritual choice.

Can you not read? I said "anti-American Islamic fundamentalist terrorist group." Is it really that hard to comprehend?

This kid's one of those american hating fags and he wants to run away to France illegally and speak arabic.

quote:Originally posted by Magilla Gorilla:



This kid's one of those american hating fags and he wants to run away to France illegally and speak arabic.

Did he say this in another thread?

quote:Originally posted by Chinese Food52:

Did he say this in another thread?

yes

quote:Originally posted by Magilla Gorilla:

yes

A misunderstanding then.

I just read about an initiatic order in Islam called the Order of Ismaelis, where they have a law that states "Nothing exists, everything is permitted." This only applies to the highest hierarchy, and the followers of the order must have an unquestionable obedience to the leaders. If a Grand Master demanded that a person commit suicide without reason or purpose, he must do so immediately without hesitation.

Thought it was interesting...

I've met some Muslims that are very religious, and I have a tremendous amount of respect for them. Islam is a fucking cool religion if you honestly follow its precepts.

quote:Originally posted by Tyrant:

I just read about an initiatic order in Islam called the Order of Ismaelis, where they have a law that states "Nothing exists, everything is permitted." This only applies to the highest hierarchy, and the followers of the order must have an unquestionable obedience to the leaders. If a Grand Master demanded that a person commit suicide without reason or purpose, he must do so immediately without hesitation.

Thought it was interesting...

I've met some Muslims that are very religious, and I have a tremendous amount of respect for them. Islam is a fucking cool religion if you honestly follow its precepts.

There aren't really any more Nizari Ismaili's, just some descendents. There is an awesome story about how they got Saladin to back off. The contemporary Old Man on the Mountain sent an emmissary to Saladin, to broker a peace treaty. He asked to speak to Saladin privately. Saladin agreed, and sent away all of his retainers except two noblemen. The emissary asked why they weren't sent away, and Saladin responded that they were as brothers to him, and they shared no secrets. The emmissary turned to the two men, and said, "I work for the Old Man. What would you do if I told you to kill this man? (points at Saladin)" They replied that they'd obey at once. Saladin left the Ismaili's alone for the rest of his life.

There's another story about a woman who heard her son had died in their service, as an assassin. She threw a party, and when her son returned alive, put on mourning attire.

Die

http://www.apostatesofislam.com

http://www.faithfreedom.org

http://www.apostatesofislam.com/forum/index.php

http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/index.php http://www.faithfreedom.org/holiday/phpBB2/index.php



According to these links the Quran has been changed over time.

http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-myths-koran-manuscripts.htm

http://www.al-islam.org/encyclopedia/chapter8/3.html

http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Text/

http://www.jodkowski.pl/re/MBright.html

http://cremesti.com/amalid/Islam/Yemeni_Ancient_Koranic_Texts.htm



http://imrepublican.topcities.com/Islam/islam.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2829059.stm

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

http://atheism.about.com/cs/islamandviolence/

http://www.twin-towers.net/al-farooq_photos.htm

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiapcf/southeast/08/17/martyr.culture/index.html

http://muslim-quotes.netfirms.com/jihad.html

http://www.domini.org/openbook/home.htm

http://www.persecution.org

http://frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=9583

http://www.danielpipes.org/

http://www.angelfire.com/hi5/kafirdomunity/action.htm

http://www.geocities.com/khola_mon/BTaliban/Bangla_Taliban_Photos.html

http://www.bwoi.cjb.net

http://www.chechentruth.cjb.net/

http://www.anti-cair-net.org/

http://www.arabsforisrael.com/pages/1/index.htm

http://www.rotter.net/israel/

http://www.geocities.com/the_awful_truth_about_islam/index.htm

http://www.geocities.com/khola_mon/Islam.html

http://www.atcoalition.net/

http://www.taliban-online.info/

http://www.geocities.com/milkmandan2003/TalibanOnline1.html

http://www.truthtree.com/Debating/posts/755.html

http://kafirnation.com/portal/index.asp

http://www.isralert.com/archives/2005/03/deceit_thy_name.php



"Modern Liberals, With Some Exceptions, Are Fascists. They Preach Peace At The Expense Of Liberty, Diversity At The Expense Of Common Sense, Equality At The Expense Of Fairness And Choice At The Expense Of Life. They Are The First To Speak About Rights, Yet They Seek To Deny You Yours If You Disagree With Them. They Vociferate The Importance Of Free Speech, Yet Do Everything In Their Power To Stifle Yours. They Demonize The Very System Which Allows Them The Freedom To Criticize In The First Place, And They Are The Last People In Line When It Comes To Defending The One Country On Earth That Would Ever Tolerate Their Hypocrisy. They Are Divisive, Immoral And Utterly Incapable Of Understanding Why Everything I Just Wrote Is The Truth." - Edward L. Daley

http://massgraves.info/

DECEIT, THY NAME IS ISLAMISM

By Beth Goodtree

Isralert.com source: Isralert subscriber/commentator Beth Goodtree

In Islam, lying or omissions for the 'greater good,' according to a strict or radical Islam/Islamist philosophy is not only acceptable, it is holy and blessed work. It is called al-Takeyya (or al-Taqiyya) and is a strategy outlined in the Hadiths and supported by various interpretations of some of the Suras in the Koran. We have just seen it in action and most people never even caught the whiff of mental ether the Islamists were pouring into the airways of the already comatose and choking non-Islamist world.

Al-Takeyya is a policy whereby a Muslim may lie, deceive or omit critical truths if it promotes the spreading of Islam AND the conquest of the non-Muslim world. According to William P. Welty, Ph.D., al-Takeyya/Taqiyya is:

"The Islamic principle of lying for the sake of Allah. Falsehoods told to prevent denigration of Islam, to protect oneself, or to promote the cause of Islam are sanctioned by the Qur'an, including lying under penalty of perjury in testimony before the United States Congress, lying or making distorted statements to the media such as claiming that Islam is a religion of peace and deceiving fellow Muslims when the one lying has deemed them to be apostates." (1)

And here is the definition from an Islam encyclopedia website:

"The word "al-Taqiyya" literally means: "Concealing or disguising one's beliefs, convictions, ideas, feelings, opinions, and/or strategies..." (2)

Now here's where the latest Islamist sneak maneuver of al Takeyya/Taqiyya comes into play. The Islamic Commission of Spain issued a decree against al-Qaeda terrorist leader Osama bin Laden. They did this in response to the bombing of a Madrid train last year by al Qaeda.

Mansur Escudero, head of the Federation of Islamic Religious Entities, called on clerics to formally condemn terrorism and pray for all terror victims. He went on to state, ''The terrorist acts of Osama bin Laden and his al Qaeda organization ... which result in the death of civilians, such as women and children ... are totally prohibited and are the object of strong condemnation within Islam.''

Sounds good so far.

But let's examine what this man did not say, as well as the timing of his little media-sensation fatwa.

This fatwa was timed to coincide with the 1-year anniversary of the bombing in Madrid. Sure, several hundred people died, but this is not the first time that hundreds, nay, thousands of people have died at the hands of Muslims merely because they weren't Muslim.

Therefore, one must ask why was there no such fatwa issued in the aftermath of 9-11? And why has no fatwa about the "...death of civilians, such as women and children'' ever been issued regarding the thousands upon thousands of Jewish/Israeli victims of genocidal terror ever been issued?

I will tell you why. This is al-Takeyya/Taqiyya at its most devious and deceptive. And the key word here is 'civilians.'

In radical Islam (Islamism), any Jew living in Israel is not considered either 'innocent' or a 'civilian.' Nor were the people living and working in America on 9-11. Islamists consider the 'Great Satan -- America,' and the 'Little Satan -- Israel,' to be enemy combatants. And this includes every man, woman or child, even babes in arms, even sleeping or in school or playing in playgrounds. This includes any and all who are not Islamists and who oppose being forced to kneel down and pay homage to Allah or his followers. In particular, Christians (whom they call 'Crusaders'), and Jews.

This also includes those of us who refuse to allow the Islamists to insidiously inject their politico-religious dogma into our way of life. And this especially includes Israel, whom the Islamists view as a polluting force in their quest for 'Arab unity' and a Judenrein Middle East.

So the fatwa issued by this Muslim cleric living in Spain was meant to put the free and civilized world into yet another coma. He was hoping we would see this supposedly 'peaceful and tolerant' religious edict and sing the praises of Islam and remind each other how it is a 'peaceful' religion, even though the word 'Islam' also means 'to submit,' and our utter and complete submission is what they are working towards.

The crafter of this latest religious edict, so proudly trumpeted to the world, has achieved nothing more than a clumsy attempt to delude us into thinking that Islamism is really nice and honorable and loving and peaceful. It is also meant to deceive us into believing that even though such edicts were never issued -- and will never be issued -- regarding Americans or Israelis, these particular Muslims are mainstream moderates.

Camel cakes! We are now familiar with the ploy of lying, omissions and deceit as sanctioned by al-Takeyya/Taqiyya. And some of us are not in a humanist/liberal feel-good coma like lambs going to the slaughter. And we will continue to alert you to the deceptions used by the Islamists.

The lesson to be learned here is not to look for what is said, but what is deliberately not said. If anything, this fatwa, by its omissions and timing (or lack thereof) has simply reinforced the fact that the Islamists do not see Israel or Judeo-Christian America as 'innocent.' It has reaffirmed that they see us all as ripe for deceit and murder in the name of Allah.

http://www.isralert.com/archives/2005/03/deceit_thy_name.php

quote:Originally posted by your enemy:

According to these links the Quran has been changed over time.



So what's your point? I already said earlier that the Quran does not preach Islamic law although there are some 80 verses that deal with specific legal issues that arose during Muhammad's era. Wasn't the Bible also changed and misinterpreted through various translations (excluding the OT)? It would be very common wouldn't you think that a book over a thousand years old changes when translated into hundreds of different languages over time.

Islam is a big hoax. And besides, if you want to be a true muslim your goint to have to blow yourself up.

quote:Originally posted by Spam Man Sam:

Islam is a big hoax. And besides, if you want to be a true muslim your goint to have to blow yourself up.

The worst thing society has done for its idiots was educating them.

There's another story about a woman who heard her son had died in their service, as an assassin. She threw a party, and when her son returned alive, put on mourning attire.

That's actually really awesome and worthy of further investigation. Do you have any other resources on this order?

Most of my information comes from James Wasserman's "The Templars and the Assassins: The Militia of Heaven".

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

Islam to me seems like a much more personal religion then christianity.

Hardly;

if you look at the diversity of followers of the Koran/Bible you'll see that there is a very simular ratio of normal rational 'believers' to hard liners who refuse to accept any other point of veiw.

Originally posted by Spam Man Sam:

Islam is a big hoax. And besides, if you want to be a true muslim your goint to have to blow yourself up.



I dunno if ur kidding or what but the vast majority of muslims are very peaceful and tolerant.

For Christ’s sake, there both fake. The only way you can believe in either religion is though faith. It’s pretty silly that you are picking and choosing which one sounds the best and then trying to believe in it. Most of the followers in any religion only do so because they were taught to do so by their parents at a young age.

[This message has been edited by Perspicacious (edited 09-07-2005).]

everybee is back.



Oh and just for the record, I know how some people like to pull out lines from the Qu'ran that say stuff like destory your enemies or whatever. But this could be interpreted in many ways, since it is only a line. It could be talking about if someone trys to take your land, then destroy them.

Here is a full Surah that is about tolerance. You can't take this in different ways.



quote:

In the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful

1. Say : O ye that reject Faith!

2. I worship not that which ye worship,

3. Nor will ye worship that which I worship.

4. And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship,

5. Nor will ye worship that which I worship.

6. To you be your Way, and to me mine.



You see the last line? To be your way, and to me mine. That is clearly not saying "omgwtf kill every non muslim LOLZ!"

quote:Originally posted by Chinese Food52:

everybee is back.



Oh and just for the record, I know how some people like to pull out lines from the Qu'ran that say stuff like destory your enemies or whatever. But this could be interpreted in many ways, since it is only a line. It could be talking about if someone trys to take your land, then destroy them.

Here is a full Surah that is about tolerance. You can't take this in different ways.



You see the last line? To be your way, and to me mine. That is clearly not saying "omgwtf kill every non muslim LOLZ!"

quote:Originally posted by Drag0n Editi0n:

I was thinking about it, and researching some too, and Islam seems like the ideal religion for me. I currently consider myself a christian, but I am having doubts in christ. I am a firm believer in God on the other hand. From what I have gathered, Islam still believes in the same God, but they only believe Jesus was a prophet. They also believe in the other prophets.

I'll see you in London and I'll supply the explosives at no charge, fag.

I want to be a priest. I am a Humanist. Working around little children has it's benefits.

Send me a nambla catalogue, and the key to my jail cell.

Nobody has menioned the scientific aspect yet.

In that the Quran has predicted major scientific discoveries from the atom to theoretical physics.

It also explains how we are slowly going from the realm of the seen to that of the unseen (theoretical physics?).

All it really comes down to is whether or not you have perspective and an honest heart.

Don't ask me directly about these question google it.