according to science, everything that happens is only a chemical reaction. you seeing something is a chemical reaction, and that reaction goes all the way into your brain. you thinking is only a complicated set of chemical reactions.

so if one were to have a super powerfull computer, and one could type in the position of all atoms and particles, and of all energy, then it could predict the future.

discuss.

Wouldn't the Chaos Theory negate this?

whats the chaos theory?

Chaos Theory (http://tinyurl.com/bmd93)

Havn't you ever heard that old adage about a butterfly flapping its wings and then creating a storm a month later across the world?

It basically deals with the fact complex systems like weather or the Stock Market are very difficult (if not impossible) to predict over an extended time.

Someone smarter than me can go into more depth I'm sure.

Ian Malcolm goes on about it for like 20 god damn pages in Jurassic Park. http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif)

[This message has been edited by Paradise Lost (edited 08-30-2005).]

yes, they are hard to predict: the weather, for example, can only be predicted for a few days, and not even accurately. but that is from sat pics. if we had the position of each and every atom, and we knew every factor that could influence it, the we could tell you how much it is going to rain in 234 years from now, at 2:37 in the morning. acurate to the droplet...

Thanks to Heisenberg's uncertainty principle it is impossible to know both the position and momentum of any particle simultaneously. So, you would never be able to compile the information to any degree of arbitrary accuracy and therefore, would not be able to predict the future.

The idea that you would be able to predict the future if only you knew the position and momentum of every particle is know as the deterministic model of the universe, which although was popular during Newton's time, was basically proved incorrect by quantum mechanics.

Beat me to in, danreil, and said it better than I would've.

quote:Originally posted by danreil:

Thanks to Heisenberg's uncertainty principle it is impossible to know both the position and momentum of any particle simultaneously. So, you would never be able to compile the information to any degree of arbitrary accuracy and therefore, would not be able to predict the future.

The idea that you would be able to predict the future if only you knew the position and momentum of every particle is know as the deterministic model of the universe, which although was popular during Newton's time, was basically proved incorrect by quantum mechanics.

Please elaborate a little bit more, specifically on the quantum part.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncertainty_principle

I think this is one of the most mind-boggling findings of modern science, its implications are not limited to determinism but go as far as spirituality and human consciousness (according to some people anyway).

I went into my philosophy class believing in free will. After thinking about it for a bit I realised that the argument for everything being pre-determined is stronger than I intially thought

Besides the uncertainty principle it would be virtually impossible to know the position and momentum of every atom in the universe. What I consider important is that although we may never be able to harness determinism and predict the future, we still may be at some level predestined to whatever may happen. One application of this idea might be to an omniscient being such as the Christian god, and to whether he can still be considered good or just in sending people to hell while having advance knowledge of one's decisions before their creation. That is of course if a god sending people to hell can be considered good or just in any circumstance.



[This message has been edited by Perspicacious (edited 09-01-2005).]