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Obbe
2006-07-30, 20:54
It is clear to me, after seeing the results of my thread on Human Conscience and God, that the overall population in this forum is uneducated in the field of the spiritual uses of cannabis and other entheogens. I think that’s ridiculous, as this is a forum to discuss our religious and spiritual beliefs.

However, I do personally believe in spiritual enhancement that can be found in cannabis. These beliefs, believe it our not, were not included in that earlier thread. And since nearly everyone who commented was more concerned with my comment on marijuana then on any of the connections that I presented, I decided to compound this collection of information on that subject you found more interesting.

Before we get started on this, I would like to point out that none of the following belongs in BLTC. Yes, this has to do with drugs, but not the recreational use or aspect of these drugs. The following is from a spiritual, ritualistic point of view, usually involving a focus or meditative state to enter the correct state of mind. That’s the reason some people are so quick to disbelieve, and why recreational drug users miss the point. It takes practice, patience, and the right frame of mind; entheogens are tools, and like any tool are only as good as their master.

I have tried posting things like this in BLTC before, but the majority of their population doesn’t believe in such things. And so they never try, and never experience it. You could go to church ever Sunday and not listen to the sermon. You could get in your car and drive around in circles all day and never drive anywhere useful. And you could use entheogens recreationally, and miss out on the spiritual benefits.

This is many peoples spiritual guide, and as such has the right to belong here. That all taken care of, we can now move on to the basics: How any person can experience a taste of the spiritual benefits of cannabis.

MB: "Don't you think that if marijuana had such potentials that people would have discovered them long ago? I mean, everyone 'gets high' at one time or another, but no one I know of gains any psychic powers or finds God through weed."

Blake: "In reference to the first part of your question, people did actually discover the spiritual potentials of marijuana long ago. References to this herb in the ancient Vedic texts of India, indicate that it was being used by Rishis and Yogis at that time to gain deepened perceptions. As for the fact that 'everyone gets high' as you said, yet few find God or greater personal power, this is just a result of cultural influences. Lets look at it this way. Compare marijuana to driving a car. As soon as you take a puff you're behind the drivers' seat. The engine's running and you can go anywhere you want. But just because you own a car though, does not guarantee that you will take it to useful, productive or enlightening places. You may just drive in circles, get in a wreck or simply drive it off a cliff. It all depends upon your intention when you're driving as to where you end up, and what you'll do when you get there. Marijuana is the same way. Although it contains great potentials for self-transformation and can take you to places you never dreamed of, its effect is still primarily limited to the mind that is driving it, so to speak."

“…first of all, the whole image of marijuana must be changed. It is usually viewed as a 'recreational drug' but this is a serious underestimation of its potential. Believing that marijuana is just a toy is like treating the space shuttle as just another Forth of July bottle rocket. By approaching marijuana with more respect, we are then in a position to gain more from it. This herb can teach us much more than most people imagine. In many shamanic traditions it is believed that peyote, psiloscybe mushrooms, ayahuasca and others, contain wisdom-increasing properties. It is believed that they hold sacred lessons, and an Earth intelligence that can be learned from. This is the whole meaning behind the word ‘entheogens”

"Basically, when we say ‘getting high', we mean getting into high feelings, and this is the same as saying 'getting into a higher personal vibration'. Science has shown through EKG readings and a number of other electromagnetic measurement devices, that the body emits energy at varying frequencies. These frequencies, especially in the case of brain waves, change as our state of consciousness changes. Studies have shown that positive feelings create a characteristically different set of emitted brain wave frequencies than those of a depressed nature. The high frequencies or feelings created through the intake of marijuana are likewise very different from most peoples' everyday state of consciousness. When used properly, marijuana can thus raise our vibrational rate of being, or in other words our state of consciousness. It can even do this on a semi-permanent or permanent basis."

MB: "And people don't usually recognize this fact, because they're using the wrong intention?"

Blake: "That's right. When they smoke their intention is usually focused just on feeling a little better, or upon using the smoke as an avenue for interaction with others. So instead of realizing they have just undergone an important and powerful shift of consciousness, they waste a glorious opportunity. They fritter away a wonderful means to gain greater inner strength by focusing upon trivial things."

Here is a simple experiment anybody could try to get a taste of what their talking about:

· Step 1 - Hold the intention of 'exploring the high' in the mind before a smoke session. By 'exploring' we mean observing it in detail, while at the same time focusing on getting higher and higher.

· Step 2 - Take a puff of smoke and hold it in the lungs in a calm, relaxed manner.

· Step 3 - While holding this breath, notice the onset of 'the high' as it enters the lungs and spreads throughout the body. Be particularly observant of the high feelings in the area of the heart.

· Step 4 - Exhale while remaining focused on your observation of the high state now present in the body/mind. Let thoughts continue to slip away to the point that only awareness of the high remains. Know that you can be a state of mind rather than a string of thoughts.

· Step 5 - Know that the high is a sacred thing. It is an opportunity for unlimited personal gain, and to view it as such opens the door to this potential. Remain focused on the high itself and when thoughts intrude, return to that focus. As the mind remains focused on only the high, the high is then amplified even more.

· Step 6 - The high is at this point, even higher than it was originally. In other words, the pitch of feeling and level of energy associated with it are increasing to greater and greater levels. This occurs because anything the mind focuses upon it increases. Don't get overwhelmed by this. Stay relaxed, and see just how far you can 'explore the high'. As the high increases stay focused upon it, and this will increase it even more, especially with a second and third puff. It will be felt bodywide, but take particular notice of the feelings in the heart, the head and base of the spine. Stay with this focus for at least 20 minutes.

http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_spirit6.shtml

Now then, some of you may be knowledgeable in the Buddhist practices and meditations. One such meditation is known as shamatha. This is single-pointed meditation, tranquil-abiding, where you calm you mind and body down and let your thoughts slowly leave you until only one remains. One emotion, one object of meditation…. whatever it may be, as long as they are meditating in relation to a positive object to enhance their ability to focus.

I am not a Buddhist myself, as I do not agree with some of their explanations and such. But, I do agree with the basic philosophy, and the practices. I use cannabis as a spiritual guide often, by practicing single pointed meditation on the high. It only takes a puff or two, and through intention, you can control the vibrations of your entire body. Certain points along your body however produce very positive energies when focused on.

And yes, those points are indeed charkas as you might have guessed. The following ritual goes into more detail:

The Herbal Chakra Meditation

Sit or lie comfortably. Take one puff of sacrament and immediately begin focusing on the feelings throughout the body. Those new to this practice may begin by focusing upon the high in a very small area of the body, such as the tip of the right index finger. Be carefully aware of every subtle detail of feeling in this area. Allow your awareness of the high to spread to the entire finger, then the hand, arm, both arms, chest, torso, head, legs and feet, (not necessarily in that order). Do not avoid any pain, fear or other unpleasantness found anywhere in the body. [Such feelings are usually the result of Intentions which inhibit personal growth, and these can be "reprogrammed". Fear can be replaced by love, confusion by clarity, and pain by vibrant energy/positivity.]

As thoughts inevitably run though the mind, (in the case of most persons) simply relax, and return again and again to a feeling-awareness focus on the high, even if this means doing so a hundred times every minute. Chronic, rampant, seemingly unstoppable thoughts in the mind are a symptom of stored stress in ones' being. As the practice of meditation proceeds, stress is released, and the tendency of thoughts to intrude upon this process will gradually diminish. Succeeding meditations will tend to get easier and easier, just as you will learn to get higher and higher. Be patient and don't let the simplicity of this method of meditation deceive you.

Let your awareness travel freely from one area of the body to the next, as it will be inclined to do. Feel every subtle detail of the high, body-wide. Areas of particular stress or activity will attract your awareness, and hold it for longer periods than the rest of the body. Allow this to happen, as it is a function of natural self-healing processes, energy body activity and the expansion of consciousness. Don't be concerned or irritated by intruding thoughts, just continue to return to a feeling/awareness-oriented focus on the high within the body, in a relaxed manner

http://www.eoni.com/~visionquest/library/SOTH.html

I don’t have time for much else, as I have to go get high so I can broadcast my show over shoutcast. So here’s some information that relates pot to the bible for you practitioners of that faith:

http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_spirit2.shtml

Laila
2006-07-30, 23:19
You sir, are fucking BRILLIANT. lookin forward to hearing more of you on Totse. =)

Graemy
2006-07-31, 01:03
using cannabis would be like using a cruch when both of your legs can run miles

Obbe
2006-07-31, 01:59
quote:Originally posted by Graemy:

using cannabis would be like using a cruch when both of your legs can run miles

why do you say this?

Aft3r ImaGe
2006-07-31, 02:33
quote:Originally posted by Obbe:

why do you say this?

Meditation?

Edit: But Obbe I support what your doing with "untraditional" religion 100%.

[This message has been edited by Aft3r ImaGe (edited 07-31-2006).]

---Beany---
2006-07-31, 11:47
Personally weed has helped increased my understandings no end. Philosophising and reading spiritual material has been one of my favorite activities to do whilst high (Also writing short stories).

One thing I found however was that whenever I wasn't high I found my ability to focus and reach deeper levels of consciousness was made harder than normal. I was able to focus amazingly whilst high, but then my thoughts were like a bingo machine when I wasn't.

I think drugs are great for glimpses of what can be experienced and understood, but to rely on them for spiritual exploration may be a bad thing. It's almost like taking steroids before a competition. They do good during, but in the long term they only provide memories of what can be achieved through natural means.

Weed helps you focus. With increased focus you can maintain your concentration on spiritual concepts much longer, and therefore spend more time exploring it's relevance to your own experience of life. But the depth of your understandings will diminish as your focus lessens.

Obbe
2006-07-31, 12:40
The random thought patteren is a very important tool once you learn how to use it. It DOES make it harder to focus then usual, which is in part of the point. When we can train our minds to harness the power of the high and focus souly on it, and not on other random trains of thought, you have achived a great mental and spiritual accomplishment.

Graemy
2006-07-31, 14:54
if you use weed to meditate it will be harder to do it normally, what you are doing is going the fast way.

what beany was saying is that just like when you use steroids eventually you will have to keep using steroids or you won't be able to continue.

weed may quite your mind, but a person who spent time and effort on developing his skill can do it when he wants, he doesnt need weed.



[This message has been edited by Graemy (edited 07-31-2006).]

Xerxes89
2006-07-31, 18:21
quote:Originally posted by Graemy:

if you use weed to meditate it will be

weed may quite your mind, but a person who spent time and effort on developing his skill can do it when he wants, he doesnt need weed.



Exactly!

Obbe
2006-07-31, 18:35
quote:Originally posted by Graemy:



weed may quite your mind, but a person who spent time and effort on developing his skill can do it when he wants, he doesnt need weed.



no, no, you're having trouble understanding me. Have you smoked weed? It does not quite your mind, it makes it harder. It takes more out of you to focus on the vibrations. This is why the high is also so much more powerfull, and why it requires so little weed...a puff or 2 isnt much.

Im not sure, but im going to guess your mistaken idea of what im trying to communicate is because you didnt read all of that...or the links.

And about meditating on not using weed, it becomes even easier, because its easier to clear your mind when you're sober. And, after a few times practicing with the herb, it becomes easy to remember the vibrations, and enter the same state when sober.

The people who wrote these claimed they could stay in the state indefinatly, and never have to smoke it.



[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 07-31-2006).]

Graemy
2006-07-31, 20:27
i have smoked weed,before i was a buddhist, and it took more than a puff or 2 it took 30 minutes for me to get high and it does quite your mind

the reason you aren't a buddhist is because buddhism looks down upon mind altering substances such as weed.

Obbe
2006-07-31, 21:53
quote:Originally posted by Graemy:

i have smoked weed,before i was a buddhist, and it took more than a puff or 2 it took 30 minutes for me to get high and it does quite your mind

the reason you aren't a buddhist is because buddhism looks down upon mind altering substances such as weed.



I know, I never claimed to be one. And you still dont understand. Im not talking about getting high....if you actually go t the websites and read the entire articles, all of whats going on is you. Your focus makes you get higher and higher.

A puff or two is all you need for this practice.

This isnt getting high. But as a result, the 'high' (vibrations in chakras) get very powerfull.

This isnt anything to do with buddhisim, i said the meditation was the same. Except this one uses an entheogen.

Graemy
2006-07-31, 22:16
you always assume that if someone doesn't agree with you they didn't see your whole side of the story

i have been high before and i know what happens. i will never get high again because it is wrong. why? because it alters my perception of reality to a negative point. if used correctly it could and will clear the mind. the only problem is when you aren't high your mind generates random thoughts because the person hasn't properly quited his mind. he would be using the quick way.

Obbe
2006-07-31, 23:01
quote:Originally posted by Graemy:

you always assume that if someone doesn't agree with you they didn't see your whole side of the story

i have been high before and i know what happens. i will never get high again because it is wrong. why? because it alters my perception of reality to a negative point. if used correctly it could and will clear the mind. the only problem is when you aren't high your mind generates random thoughts because the person hasn't properly quited his mind. he would be using the quick way.



then i suppose thats simply where our beliefs differ. But like i said, I am not buddhist. And as a buddhist, i would hope you would remember the moto 'it dosnt matter what you have faith in, but that you have faith'. So please, kindly stop trying to point out to me how my beliefs are wrong simply because their different then yours.

Graemy
2006-07-31, 23:21
so now you are attacking my beliefs.

i didn't say your beliefs were wrong i was telling you my experiance and you took it out of context and blew it out of proportion

i may have come across as pushing that yours were wrong

Beany said the same thing as me.

buddhists don't follow that motto. buddhists follow the motto, that, if you find it right then follow it. i found what you said to be false so i am providing an alternative answer.

Obbe
2006-07-31, 23:28
quote:Originally posted by Graemy:

so now you are attacking my beliefs.

i didn't say your beliefs were wrong i was telling you my experiance and you took it out of context and blew it out of proportion

i may have come across as pushing that yours were wrong

Beany said the same thing as me.

buddhists don't follow that motto. buddhists follow the motto, that, if you find it right then follow it. i found what you said to be false so i am providing an alternative answer.



well then thanks for an alternative. But im still set in my ways.

Aft3r ImaGe
2006-07-31, 23:59
Look at it this way:

Everybody's mind is different, for example you said pot makes your mind have many random thoughts and when you learn to control this it allows you to increase your understanding, helps you focus, etc.

Now my mind is different than most people because I have had drastically random thoughts my whole life. Not only have I learned to control it, but it can be very helpful when being creative etc. I can also achive many different "states" of mind of my own free will without the aid of a drug. I think this is what Graemy is suggesting he/or/she can do too.

What he is saying is that when one reaches the disired state of mind without the drug that would do it, doing the drug becomes pointless and may actually lessen your ability to reach that state without drugs.

This does not mean it is wrong to use a drug in conjunction with meditation, which for anyone who uses drugs is actually a very wise, responsible, and recommended thing to do, as opposed to just getting stoned and acting like a typical stoner.

I'm not buddhist but I do meditate, thats my choice, if substances help you meditate by all means use them, but you may notice you will reach a point were it will be possible, and maybe more desirable to reach the same mental states without the use of a substance.

After all we are all just trying to explore concousness, and life, how you do it is up to you.

Obbe
2006-08-01, 02:55
im open for change

jacobjc73
2006-08-01, 05:50
Ever since I started smoking marijuana, philosophical thoughts have much easier to come by. The thought process is changed and you can look at yourself through a different perception. When I obtain shrooms in the near future, I will be using it as an introspective session to work out some things that have been on my mind.

Drugs in general are what started the concept of god. People ate substances which allowed them to enter other worldly realms and percieve things which would not have been if not for the drug/plant. Shamans have been doing it since the beginning of religion, so why can't we?

redzed
2006-08-02, 07:48
quote:Originally posted by Obbe:

It is clear to me, after seeing the results of my thread on Human Conscience and God, that the overall population in this forum is uneducated in the field of the spiritual uses of cannabis and other entheogens. I think that’s ridiculous, as this is a forum to discuss our religious and spiritual beliefs.

However, I do personally believe in spiritual enhancement that can be found in cannabis. These beliefs, believe it our not, were not included in that earlier thread. And since nearly everyone who commented was more concerned with my comment on marijuana then on any of the connections that I presented, I decided to compound this collection of information on that subject you found more interesting.





Dr. Timothy Leary said that cannabis was the chemical pathway to the fifth level of consciousness, however, like other levels there is also another path. That is meditation practices such as buddhists use, so there is more than one way to get to higher levels of consciousness. Check it out: http://deoxy.org/8circuit.htm

Suggest you also Google 'endo-cannabinoids'

What if the effect of cannabis on the brain is simply a coincidence in that it mimics a naturally occurring neuro-transmitter? Does cannabis still get the gong as a spiritual gift from on high?

Namaste http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

Obbe
2006-08-02, 16:44
quote:Originally posted by redzed:

Dr. Timothy Leary said that cannabis was the chemical pathway to the fifth level of consciousness, however, like other levels there is also another path. That is meditation practices such as buddhists use, so there is more than one way to get to higher levels of consciousness. Check it out: http://deoxy.org/8circuit.htm

Suggest you also Google 'endo-cannabinoids'

What if the effect of cannabis on the brain is simply a coincidence in that it mimics a naturally occurring neuro-transmitter? Does cannabis still get the gong as a spiritual gift from on high?

Namaste http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

I find that highly interesting, and why wouldnt it still get the gong? I love how science can sometimes explain religion and spirituality.

The naturally occuring nero-transmitter seems only natuarlly activated when an individual experiances 'FREE-FALL, AT THE PROPER EVOLUTIONARY TIME'. As you said, deep concentraed meditation is another path. So why wouldnt it still get the gong?

It is simply my belief that combining the two is a very effective method. Others will inevitably have other opinions...but arguing never got us anywhere.

Twisted_Ferret
2006-08-03, 00:34
I find the shamanic, ritualistic, religious, and meditational (if that's a word http://www.totse.com/bbs/tongue.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/tongue.gif)) uses of drugs incredibly fascinating. Anyone who has more on these subjects - whether personal experiences, links, what-have-you - I ask to please post!

Obbe
2006-08-03, 01:23
quote:Originally posted by Twisted_Ferret:

I find the shamanic, ritualistic, religious, and meditational (if that's a word http://www.totse.com/bbs/tongue.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/tongue.gif)) uses of drugs incredibly fascinating. Anyone who has more on these subjects - whether personal experiences, links, what-have-you - I ask to please post!

heres the best you'll find.

http://www.erowid.org/entheogens/spiritual.shtml

ate
2006-08-04, 02:08
quote:Originally posted by Laila:

You sir, are fucking BRILLIANT. lookin forward to hearing more of you on Totse. =)



This is what I thought when I read that.

Good, good, writing.



Graemy, if you haven't been at this understanding, and totally commited relationship of the "high", than you haven't been "high" like this period and you just don't know.

I don't think people are getting it. Weed is an something that makes the obsticales that stand in your way of reaching a higher level of awareness much more visible and perceivable.

It makes things hard. It put those obsticales right up to your face, and you can either decide the glass is half empty...It's a negative state...there's a depression here, it's not worth it.

Or you can decide the glass is half full, and go, OH! Look I can see the top, I'm now away from the level that I would consider my goal, and now I have to WORK for it! Thinking in this state, accepting the realizations that catch you off guard and working to handle them and learn from them is what creates your ability to handle life much deeper rooted to your consciousness.

The fact that it's something that doesn't "help" you, IS THE VERY REASON IT WORKS!

That's what I think he meant by missing the point, the very fact that it may make things harder for you, shows you that there is room for improvement.

While say you hadn't ran into that experience, you would still be at the base level where things wouldn't have changed so much so quickly.

People can't handle that and so they get frightened and think it is "wrong".

In life, every change happens instantly and everything is moving quickly. When your percetpion alters in order to actually see this is fact.

It's not becuase you're high, it's because you're seeing clearly.





[This message has been edited by ate (edited 08-04-2006).]

Obbe
2006-08-04, 02:48
quote:Originally posted by ate:



The fact that it's something that doesn't "help" you, IS THE VERY REASON IT WORKS!



As usual, ate, you've hit the nail on the head.



On a side note ate, i've noticed the way you explain things is often the way i try to(and usually fail at)explain things...send me your brain!

ate
2006-08-04, 03:12
Dude, I read your post and I was like, holy shit this guys got it!

Hrm.....join forces ? AIM? I don't know how to send my brain, but we could probably connect on a level useful for expanding one's knowledge/perception/consciousness of life/reality and what the current state of the planetary/terra/earth/ is in in regards to the racial/group/consciousness of humanity.

Anyway. That was an excellent post and you really know how to utilize marijuana.

Well. Where has your practices taken you? I don't know where this would be appriopriate..

Obbe
2006-08-04, 03:17
quote:Originally posted by ate:

Dude, I read your post and I was like, holy shit this guys got it!

Hrm.....join forces ? AIM? I don't know how to send my brain, but we could probably connect on a level useful for expanding one's knowledge/perception/consciousness of life/reality and what the current state of the planetary/terra/earth/ is in in regards to the racial/group/consciousness of humanity.

Anyway. That was an excellent post and you really know how to utilize marijuana.

Well. Where has your practices taken you? I don't know where this would be appriopriate..



I have MSN...and where has it brought me? not too far, as i dont practice as often as i should. But it has brought me a deeper understanding of the complexity of the universe, and connections and such...

Once i saw you post a link about Lobsang Rampa, and i started reading up on that....but theres so many things to read there, i always get too sleepy/stoned, and then i plum forget it!

ate
2006-08-04, 03:26
atefromtotse@msn.com

Obbe
2006-08-04, 03:32
heres mine in case somethin fucklles up

mushi_vanilla@hotmail.com

Zinkovich
2006-08-04, 03:41
Unfortunately, because cannabis uses chemical reactions to create the spritual experience it works differently on my mind.

I have some sort of structural difference on my mind that makes me react to mind altering chemicals extremely differently then others, which is suspected to be related ot severe cases of ADD or autism. Speed calms me down but makes me a silent zombie(the medication my parents put me on was basically speed), Alcohol actually makes my mind become more active, and Cannabis? Well, the dopamine levels in my brain are so fucked up its more like an acid trip than a relaxing experience for me.

Do you know of any drugs that might give me symptoms similar to the normal symptoms that result from cannabis use? I feel I am missing out all due to the fact that my brain's wiring was seriously fucked up from the start.



[This message has been edited by Zinkovich (edited 08-04-2006).]

Obbe
2006-08-04, 03:56
quote:Originally posted by Zinkovich:

Unfortunately, because cannabis uses chemical reactions to create the spritual experience it works differently on my mind.

I have some sort of structural difference on my mind that makes me react to mind altering chemicals extremely differently then others, which is suspected to be related ot severe cases of ADD or autism. Speed calms me down but makes me a silent zombie(the medication my parents put me on was basically speed), Alcohol actually makes my mind become more active, and Cannabis? Well, the dopamine levels in my brain are so fucked up its more like an acid trip than a relaxing experience for me.

Do you know of any drugs that might give me symptoms similar to the normal symptoms that result from cannabis use? I feel I am missing out all due to the fact that my brain's wiring was seriously fucked up from the start.





well, i am no doctor, and according to the link provided by redzed, the only other way the experiance the cannabis experiance is through years of meditation, or space travel.

If I were you, i would experiment with everythig i could get my hands on, keeping the doses low mind you because you dont know what to expect. But since it seems you have a reversal effect of most drugs, except cannabis, which seems to have greatly increased in effect for you. I would appreciate it if you experimented a little more with it, and shared with this thread/erowid in detail.

However, since pot makes you feel liek you're on acid, maybe acid makes you feel like you're on pot? I doubt it, you would prolly just have an insane trip. But its not like LSD is easy to come by anyways.

However, there is a paticular herb, with very easy access due to it being legal. I am extreamly interested in how you would react to salvia compared to a 'normal' person.

But beware. Its not like you have the luxary of erowid like any fool.

EDIT- oooo, check out Wild Dagga. Flowers only. MGB sells it if you're interested, i have never tried it personally. Supposed to be the closest thing to a pot-high, but then again, maybe it'll send YOU off into space.

[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 08-04-2006).]

ate
2006-08-04, 04:02
Why do you say pot makes you trip like on acid?

Zinkovich
2006-08-04, 04:13
Because it does, or at least, it is similar to the symptoms described as a result of acid. It certainly wasn't a relaxing or opening experience for me. I was in a LOT of stress but was giddy and overjoyed at the same time.

It is strange that I have not had LSD though; I used to be involved in the whole "psychedelic occult magic" scene(You know the British Punk-popularized kind related to Chaos Magic) and I never took it during my foray into some of the groups in my area.

I'll try to get the other two drugs. At least the stuff is legal and I won't be risking my college record. Although the Faqs I found on salvia makes unsupervised use sound unwise.



[This message has been edited by Zinkovich (edited 08-04-2006).]

ate
2006-08-04, 07:46
Nah, salvias fine unsupervised you won't be doing much moving around.

But, I know what you mean by saying it feels like an acid-trip.

I sometimes get the feeling that there really is no difference between any classes of thing in the world including psychedelics and I feel just one altered state, which is actually considered clarity in which it's the only time you actually see things as they are. Must less defined and specific, but grand and general models of reality.

Obbe
2006-08-04, 15:42
quote:Originally posted by ate:

Nah, salvias fine unsupervised you won't be doing much moving around.

But, I know what you mean by saying it feels like an acid-trip.

I sometimes get the feeling that there really is no difference between any classes of thing in the world including psychedelics and I feel just one altered state, which is actually considered clarity in which it's the only time you actually see things as they are. Must less defined and specific, but grand and general models of reality.



It may scare the holy shit out of him his first time though....espcially since theres no way to tell how he'd react, what with his re-assembled brain and what-not.

Be careful!

EDIT- In fact, if you do use salvia Zinkovich, prehaps you should start with plain leaf instead of extracts. Dosnt do anything to most people, so it would prolly be safe for you.

[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 08-04-2006).]

Obbe
2006-08-05, 03:36
http://www.druglibrary.org/special/tart/tartcont.htm

just discovered this...havn't read it, but it may be interesting.

Kash
2006-08-07, 01:39
quote:Originally posted by Laila:

You sir, are fucking BRILLIANT. lookin forward to hearing more of you on Totse. =)

Agreed.

truorion
2006-08-07, 02:02
quote:Originally posted by Graemy:

if you use weed to meditate it will be harder to do it normally, what you are doing is going the fast way.

what beany was saying is that just like when you use steroids eventually you will have to keep using steroids or you won't be able to continue.

weed may quite your mind, but a person who spent time and effort on developing his skill can do it when he wants, he doesnt need weed.



Well said. Psychedlics are just another way of peering through your 'Third Eye' Chakra.

truorion
2006-08-07, 02:09
quote:Originally posted by ate:



Hrm.....join forces ? AIM? I don't know how to send my brain, but we could probably connect on a level useful for expanding one's knowledge/perception/consciousness of life/reality and what the current state of the planetary/terra/earth/ is in in regards to the racial/group/consciousness of humanity.



For some reason, I found that as an uplifting sign for our human race.

Obbe
2006-08-07, 02:26
quote:Originally posted by truorion:

Well said. Psychedlics are just another way of peering through your 'Third Eye' Chakra.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif)

Hardly anyone understands...oh well...

redzed
2006-08-07, 08:14
quote:Originally posted by Obbe:



well, i am no doctor, and according to the link provided by redzed, the only other way the experiance the cannabis experiance is through years of meditation, or space travel.



There maybe other ways too try this link: http://www.neilslade.com/Papers/Library.html

Lots of articles but scroll thru and enjoy!

Namaste http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

Obbe
2006-08-07, 17:27
quote:Originally posted by redzed:

There maybe other ways too try this link: http://www .neilslade .com/Paper s/Library.html (http: //www.neil slade.com/ Papers/Lib rary.html)

Lots of articles but scroll thru and enjoy!

Namaste http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

Thank you, thats now bookmarked!

truorion
2006-08-08, 02:23
quote:Originally posted by Obbe:

http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif)

Hardly anyone understands...oh well...

Maybe you could correct me where I'm wrong? Th e brain wave patterns of a tripper on LSD are comparable to that of an experienced meditator. Using psychedelics, therefore would be like using your third eye, or mental imaging during meditation.

Aside from that, I actually agree with you that cannibis, and other psychoactives such as LSD, Peyote, and Psilocybin Mushrooms are important for the use of spiritual growth and religion revelation. There's no good reason to make them illegal, except for the fact they expand the mind and promote critical thinking; a governments worst enemy.

Obbe
2006-08-08, 03:12
quote:Originally posted by truorion:

Maybe you could correct me where I'm wrong? Th e brain wave patterns of a tripper on LSD are comparable to that of an experienced meditator. Using psychedelics, therefore would be like using your third eye, or mental imaging during meditation.

Aside from that, I actually agree with you that cannibis, and other psychoactives such as LSD, Peyote, and Psilocybin Mushrooms are important for the use of spiritual growth and religion revelation. There's no good reason to make them illegal, except for the fact they expand the mind and promote critical thinking; a governments worst enemy.



Thats what i mean, i didnt say you were wrong. I agree with Graemy that meditation can reach this mindstate. I agree there are other ways. Im just saying that using the high as a point of focus is even more useful.

And, from what i've read, most people dont think so. Or that its bad in the long run anyways (steroid-metaphore). I really dont belive that, and i belive that my experiance is proof of it. I cannot give them my mind, my experiance, so their not going to understand. Because while Graemy may have smoked pot, he hasnt done the exercises. And as ate pointed out, he wont get it.

What i wrote after your responces was aimed at the "well said", to Graemys post which overall was negative towards my method of achiving the state. His misunderstanding of my communication. You agreeded with it, indicating your misunderstanding of it. hence, "nobody understands".

And about the third eye...that is one of the chakras mentioned in the original post (or in one of the links, i forget), which i belive is one of the most crucial points to focus on. And if you want to go further into that area of the head, read about popping your frontal lobes in the link provided by redzed.

You'd find it interesting.

Edit-oh, my last paragrah....i ment to add that i agree with you about the third eye, thats why i wrote....that stuff about it.

[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 08-08-2006).]

Aft3r ImaGe
2006-08-08, 06:19
quote:Originally posted by truorion:

Maybe you could correct me where I'm wrong? Th e brain wave patterns of a tripper on LSD are comparable to that of an experienced meditator. Using psychedelics, therefore would be like using your third eye, or mental imaging during meditation.

Aside from that, I actually agree with you that cannibis, and other psychoactives such as LSD, Peyote, and Psilocybin Mushrooms are important for the use of spiritual growth and religion revelation. There's no good reason to make them illegal, except for the fact they expand the mind and promote critical thinking; a governments worst enemy.

Drugs were primarily illegalized to combat the growing leftist movements in the united states. Fun fact. So says "Illegal drugs and how they got that way."

Knowledge is power.



"It is not useful for liberty that we abolish it in order to protect it.

-- Wolfgang Thierse"

Obbe
2006-08-08, 16:17
quote:Originally posted by Aft3r ImaGe:

Drugs were primarily illegalized to combat the growing leftist movements in the united states. Fun fact. So says "Illegal drugs and how they got that way."

Knowledge is power.



"It is not useful for liberty that we abolish it in order to protect it.

-- Wolfgang Thierse"

yeah, and even earlier selfish drugs became illegal because of addicts, (then alcahol was legalized again), and marijuana was made illegal because of certain industrial powers

edit- ^what i wrote sounds stupid, im ashamed

[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 08-08-2006).]