well, techinically i have said that i am buddhist, but thats just coz im not anything else, and its the thing i link closest to my way of thinking, now the thing is, how many other people are buddhist, and how buddhist are you, and when/how did you become a buddhist

i just wanna know where i stand in this whole scheme of things

Do you follow the teachings of Buddha?

of course i do, or i try to, i can't be a vegetarian coz i dont wanna take substitutes for iron which im low on, so i need to eat red meat, and i swear a lot, but apart from that i try to stay in the good books so to speak.

so yes, i do kinda follow the teachings of buddha as well as i can

ps. the clostest buddhist temple is 2 hours away and im 14 and my parents wont let me go there alone... adn they dont want to take me either

that's okay, you can do just as well without going to a temple.. you might miss out on meeting folks knowledgeable on the subject, though.

is there a problem if you are more into nichiren buddhism but you go to a kadampa buddhist centre?

coz thats only like a 15 minute bus ride away and so its easy to get to, and then its slightly more oficial if you know what i mean, but i dont want to go to the wrong buddhist group

quote:Originally posted by MRman:

of course i do, or i try to, i can't be a vegetarian coz i dont wanna take substitutes for iron which im low on, so i need to eat red meat, and i swear a lot, but apart from that i try to stay in the good books so to speak.

so yes, i do kinda follow the teachings of buddha as well as i can

ps. the clostest buddhist temple is 2 hours away and im 14 and my parents wont let me go there alone... adn they dont want to take me either

The Buddha himself was not a vegetarian. That was a practice adopted by later Buddhists who decided to take it upon themselves to strengthen the already flawless system.

Sangha is an important aspect of practice, though IMO it doesn't matter at all what sort of temple you go to. When they change the message of the Buddha, just ignore it or something. I'm unfamiliar with both your temple and the one you are thinking of going to, but I'm sure the differences aren't TOO broad anyways. Just follow the 8-fold path, meditate, and recognize dependent arising and you are following the dharma.

quote:Originally posted by MRman:

is there a problem if you are more into nichiren buddhism but you go to a kadampa buddhist centre?

coz thats only like a 15 minute bus ride away and so its easy to get to, and then its slightly more oficial if you know what i mean, but i dont want to go to the wrong buddhist group

it doesn't matter what temple you go to, it won't matter. they will accept you and let you practice there. buddhists of different sects often practice at the same temple.

you can talk about buddhism online too. i found this place http://tinyurl.com/rhclw to be very helpful. this place offers a very wide ranged sangha and is very helpful when you have questions.

well i was raised orthodox christian but i never really liked it. i started looking into other religions and i found buddhism suits me the best. i have seriously considered becoming a monk and decided i will wait until some other time. i am a heavy lay practioner.

[This message has been edited by Graemy (edited 08-03-2006).]

I was raised a Roman Catholic by a religious Irish family. But I came to a point in my life where I needed to know what I believed and why. I couldn't find any reason why I should believe in God or the Bible so I abandoned it. When I learned about the teachings of the Buddha I fell in love with the religion immediatly. So, I learned some more about it and I tried it out. Now I can say with confidence that I am a Buddhist and am loving every minute of it.

quote:Originally posted by Iam:

The Buddha himself was not a vegetarian. That was a practice adopted by later Buddhists who decided to take it upon themselves to strengthen the already flawless system.

Sangha is an important aspect of practice, though IMO it doesn't matter at all what sort of temple you go to. When they change the message of the Buddha, just ignore it or something. I'm unfamiliar with both your temple and the one you are thinking of going to, but I'm sure the differences aren't TOO broad anyways. Just follow the 8-fold path, meditate, and recognize dependent arising and you are following the dharma.

What is dependent arising and how does one recognize it?

quote:Originally posted by Iam:

The Buddha himself was not a vegetarian. That was a practice adopted by later Buddhists who decided to take it upon themselves to strengthen the already flawless system.



This is true. According to legend, the Buddha died after eating a bad piece of meat; after all, he did say "Eat what is put into your begging bowl..." http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

quote:Originally posted by Abrahim:

What is dependent arising and how does one recognize it?

It is basically summed up as: everything is the result of previous actions, i.e. everything is connected. A good mental picture of this are the knots in a fish net, everything is linked.

Also, nothing is predestined or controlled by forces such as God, but only by your actions.

Abrahim, I found a good guide for you.. here - http://buddhanet.net/e-learning/depend.htm

I'm glad to see you're still around and knowledgable, Social! I remember a couple years back when I was Ezratal and we'd talk about Buddhism on here quite a bit.

thankyou very much everybody, im gonna check out this buddhist place on the weekend, so hopefully all goes well

it is a new buddhist practice from what i have learned

At a monestary monks are offered food and live in the footsteps of buudha. They eat whatever is brought to them but are only allowed to eat until noon and then they fast for the rest of the day. GO out and expierence worship with your fellow believers. It's much easier to grasp.

[This message has been edited by Tikvah (edited 08-12-2006).]

quote:Originally posted by Tikvah:

At a monestary monks are offered food and live in the footsteps of buudha. They eat whatever is brought to them but are only allowed to eat until noon and then they fast for the rest of the day. GO out and expierence worship with your fellow believers. It's much easier to grasp.

1) They only eat one meal a day, and it is lunch. Not (anytime before noon they can eat).

2) There is no 'worship'.

3) Eat my penis.

actually that is only at some monestaries some of them only do that on holidays. some times monks travel around with a beging bowl and ask for food. all depends on the traditions

quote:Originally posted by MRman:

now the thing is, how many other people are buddhist, and how buddhist are you, and when/how did you become a buddhist

i just wanna know where i stand in this whole scheme of things

dont say buddhist too much or it will be a sin. I'm lay buddhist. I was born buddhist, hindu.

Being a buddhist is better than being theist or atheist cause its not one of those religions claiming to have all the answers but gives emphasis on personal happiness.

be sure to follow the theravada form cause mahayan is a hindu ripoff

Einstein on Buddhism

Buddhism has the characteristics of what would be expected in a cosmic religion for the future: It transcends a personal God, avoids dogmas and theology; it covers both the natural and spritual; and it is based on a religious sense aspiring from the experience of all things, natural and spiritual, as a meaningful unity.

-Albert Einstein



If there is any religion that would cope with modern scientific needs it would be Buddhism.

-Albert Einstein



A human being is part of the whole, called by us 'Universe'; a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest--a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and affection for a few persons nearest us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compasion to embrace all living creatures and the whole nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to achieve this completely but striving for such achievement is, in itself, a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security.

-Albert Einstein



Buddhism is great but they dont scare anyone...

quote:Originally posted by homosuperior:



be sure to follow the theravada form cause mahayan is a hindu ripoff



I like you.

quote:Originally posted by Iam:

I like you.

finally some respect

I am a practicing Mahayana Buddhist but I go to a Zen center on occasion due to location. It is something I strongly believe in but I do not always follow all five precepts. I need to eat meat because I'm a relatively poor college student and can't afford supplements and I do occasionaly drink and so forth, although I often find myself turning to zazen before the effects have even wore off. I recomend reading the Tipitaka, I've found it pretty helpful. Even though I was raised Roman Catholic I feel so much more (for lack of a better word) right as a buddhist, it just feels right. Good luck everyone on your search for enlightenment.

homosuperior, you seem to be someone who believes they are on a higher level than others and have a great desire for respect. Don't let that desire cloud your mind and cause more suffering and take you farther from enlightenment.

I don't agree with the begging bowl thing.

Sorry for triple posting but I figured everyone could benefit from this. Download a digital mani wheel and turn your hard drive into a constant source of good dharma. Heres a link to one http://tinyurl.com/fvnrt Having this digital mani wheel can only help even if you are not a Tibetan Buddhist (which I'm not) but I like to be open to all ideas...

quote:Originally posted by Moridin:

Sorry for triple posting but I figured everyone could benefit from this. Download a digital mani wheel and turn your hard drive into a constant source of good dharma. Heres a link to one http://tinyurl.com/fvnrt Having this digital mani wheel can only help even if you are not a Tibetan Buddhist (which I'm not) but I like to be open to all ideas...

I dunno, sounds sort of...supah-stishuz.

Doing good deeds and charitable acts, thinking positively and benefiting oneself and others are the most effective ways, in my opinion, to bring good to yourself. I mean by sending forth positivity I believe it is reflected back.

quote:Originally posted by Abrahim:

I don't agree with the begging bowl thing.

Not everyone does it. mostly it is traveling monks or certain monestaries. most monestaries grow their own food.

well i guess i should post what i follow. I follow a mix of Theravada, a little Mahayana, and Chan(Zen)

I was close to becoming buddist a while ago, to the point of looking around for something that would help me read sanscrit.

But, thinking about it, i couldn't get the thought out of my head that buddist's seem unwilling to pay for life's pleasures, and i was doubtful that the cessation(sp) of suffering would bring a state of massive happieness.

So i shed awar from buddism, and remained an athiest.

quote:Originally posted by MRman

well, techinically i have said that i am buddhist, but thats just coz im not anything else, and its the thing i link closest to my way of thinking

This is why I started looking into Buddhism when I was younger (I'm more than twice your age), but it was still not for me. I'm an atheist and skeptic and Buddhist beliefs still require some faith, which I will never have. I need evidence for belief. I'm at the point where I don't need to find a group to belong in to establish a "title" for what I am. I already do that with my profession, political party, etc.

I do love the explanation given in the following article regarding belief in gods though: http://www.buddhanet.net/ans73.htm

The one thing that bothers me, is that this is said (which I totally agree with):

"The second reason the Buddha did not believe in a god is because there does not seem to be any evidence to support this idea."

But the same author has written about reincarnation. How do you believe in reincarnation with zero evidence?

Anyway, look into it, but remain skeptical and I hope you don't adopt a belief set because of the human need to belong to a group. Good luck.

You don't really sound like a buddhist, the way you talk about yourself.

You're too bound by things; strict and direct interperetation.

Karma and Reincarnation are bullshit. Karma and Reincarnation are bullshit. Karma and Reincarnation are bullshit.

well, i dont believe in the whole reincarnation bullshit, and karma is true in some regards, but thats just if your a politician or something where its easy for something to come and bite you in the arse, but the fact that it definately will is just stupid... im a skeptic in many regards, but i like buddhism coz the aspects to it are good, theres no way i would ever become devout, just kinda run my life around it a tad

quote:Originally posted by MRman:

well, i dont believe in the whole reincarnation bullshit, and karma is true in some regards, but thats just if your a politician or something where its easy for something to come and bite you in the arse

So, where does your body go after you die? In fact, where does it go when skin flakes off, blood cells are replaced, hair falls out.

Does it dissapear?

Of course not, it is obsorbed back into nature, eventually the energy that passed through you will help to form other plants, creatures or fertilise the earth itself.

A re-encarnated being is unaware of it's previous lives. Could 're-encarnation' just be the natural process of energy and matter flow in an ecosystem?

As for Karma, it works in two ways. If you treat people with kindness and respect then they'll probably treat you the same (but at the very least you tried).

The second point, people believing in Karma won't dwell on the darkness in their lives, instead trying to eliminate it with their own good actions.

I don't believe that we can become true buddhists in a western country but it's certainly a great way to live. http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

all religions are just ideas thought up by men. you are free to believe what you choose. but keep in mind, why believe someone else's b.s.?

quote:Originally posted by dsk1231:

all religions are just ideas thought up by men. you are free to believe what you choose. but keep in mind, why believe someone else's b.s.?

Because if you're not believing their BS you're believing YOUR bs.

And buddha was probably smarter than you.

As far as religions go I'd rate Buddhism as the most recommended for those seeking religion.

I personally wouldn't call myself a Buddhist but I do admire his teachings, and I already meditate. I know there is allot more to Buddhism but hey, it's a start.

Also I give them allot of credit for never starting a religious war, being tolerant of differences of beliefs, and generally taking a much more rational, healthy, and less hypocritical moral standard/belief system.

Only complaint is as said earlier reincarnation.

"Of course not, it is absorbed back into nature, eventually the energy that passed through you will help to form other plants, creatures or fertilise the earth itself.

A re-encarnated being is unaware of it's previous lives. Could 're-encarnation' just be the natural process of energy and matter flow in an ecosystem?"

I don't think thats the standard definition of reincarnation, unless you consider reincarnation becoming human fertilizer, in more elegant terms.

"'The second reason the Buddha did not believe in a god is because there does not seem to be any evidence to support this idea.'

But the same author has written about reincarnation. How do you believe in reincarnation with zero evidence?

Anyway, look into it, but remain skeptical and I hope you don't adopt a belief set because of the human need to belong to a group. Good luck."

Well said.

"I don't believe that we can become true Buddhists in a western country but it's certainly a great way to live."

Thats up to debate, but do people in the western world even have the self discipline to become true Buddhists in the first place? Mostly no.

On the other hand I'd be interested in growing more of my food if I had the botanist skills required to do so. If anyone has some information that would help me do so, it would be appreciated.

In reference to karma, I don't believe in karma beyond cause and effect. Your nice to someone, they might be nice back. That is basically what was stated here:

"As for Karma, it works in two ways. If you treat people with kindness and respect then they'll probably treat you the same"

Thats just cause and effect.

"The second point, people believing in Karma won't dwell on the darkness in their lives, instead trying to eliminate it with their own good actions."

Thats not proof of karma thats just the result of people following it. There is nothing cosmic about people being nice out of fear.

"all religions are just ideas thought up by men. you are free to believe what you choose. but keep in mind, why believe someone else's b.s.?"

The majority of what you know was thought up by other people. Any education you receive is the knowledge of people before you being passed down so to speak. You language started out as someone else's bs, the computer your using was thought up as someone else's bs, the list goes on and on, to sum it up:

Everything you have not realized completely on your own started out as someone else's bs.



[This message has been edited by Aft3r ImaGe (edited 08-10-2006).]

quote:Originally posted by Moridin:

homosuperior, you seem to be someone who believes they are on a higher level than others and have a great desire for respect. Don't let that desire cloud your mind and cause more suffering and take you farther from enlightenment.

noo i am not like that in real life.its just that ive been a member here since 2002. but thanx for reminding me that

quote:Originally posted by homosuperior:

noo i am not like that in real life.its just that ive been a member here since 2002. but thanx for reminding me that

I love how people say 'real life'. When you're communicating with people over the net, they're real people and it's real conversations. Sure, they can lie about themselves, but so can random strangers you meet in the street.

quote:Originally posted by MRman:

well, i dont believe in the whole reincarnation bullshit

i also didnt beleive it in the beggining.

but i beleive in science and since the 1st law of thermodynamics (law of energy conservation) states that energy cannot be destroyed and since our self has the capacity to do work there exists energy in us and so this energy takes the form of a new body in the next life.

pretty simple eh but dont ask me the dynamics invloved in this energy exchange cause i dont know about it.

anyways if we want a good explaination of why reincarnation must exist watch the movie called "the little buddha" with Keanu Reeves in it, there is a scene where a monk explains the concept to a disbeleiver(the husband).

quote:Originally posted by dsk1231:

all religions are just ideas thought up by men. you are free to believe what you choose. but keep in mind, why believe someone else's b.s.?

"If something doesnt make sense, dont beleive it" - Buddha.

and why believe someone else's b.s.? if it makes your life considerably better wont you?

quote:Originally posted by [b]homosuperior

but i beleive in science and since the 1st law of thermodynamics (law of energy conservation) states that energy cannot be destroyed and since our self has the capacity to do work there exists energy in us and so this energy takes the form of a new body in the next life.[/quote]

I love when people try to use science to prove shit like reincarnation.

Our skin sheds everyday. I can chop my fingers off and bury them and possibly help something grow (or they can decompose in a barren field where nothing grows).

Who "we" are is just memory and emotion. We have fairly strong evidence that both memories and emotions are dependant upon physical and chemical structures in our bodies. Memory can be altered by altering the brain. Emotion can be affected by altering chemical balances. Since both the brain and biochemical processes degrade after death, how can "we" go anywhere? Our bodies decompose and neither matter nor energy is destroyed. There is no need for reincarnation to keep the laws of thermodynamics from falling apart.

notice he didn't say the brain or memory.

he said energy.

and how do you know who we are. memory is a record of the past that "we" keep. and "we" have emotions. emotions are how "we" react. since "we" have emotions and memories then we are more than emotions and memories. you can be emotionless. wouldn't that make "you" someone else? no.

quote:Originally posted by Graemy

notice he didn't say the brain or memory.

he said energy.

He said that the energy "takes the form of a new body in the next life." He also went on to describe how a character in a Keanu Reeves movie gives "a good explaination of why reincarnation must exist".

quote:Originally posted by Graemy

since "we" have emotions and memories then we are more than emotions and memories.

Right, we also have a physical body.



quote:Originally posted by Graemy

you can be emotionless. wouldn't that make "you" someone else? no.

No, you are still the same person even though you have a range of emotions that can change due to physical and environmental factors. There is no scientific need for your personality, emotions, memories, etc, to go into or form a new body after death. The laws of thermodynamics don't prove reincarnation must exist.

i am not saying they thermodynamics can but you said "we" are our emotions and memories. so if there is no scientific need for emotions, memories, personality, etc we are something more that could have the possibility of reincarnation.

quote: Originally posted by Graemy

i am not saying they thermodynamics can but you said "we" are our emotions and memories. so if there is no scientific need for emotions, memories, personality, etc we are something more that could have the possibility of reincarnation.

What the fuck are you talking about? Who said that there is no scientific need for emotions, memories or personality? Some people have more emotions and memories than others and some are comatose and are no more than a living body and a warm pussy like Terry Schiavo. What the fuck does this have do with reincarnation?

no one said, i said if there is no scientific need. i did because i am not completely sure. from my point of view there is no need for it. to become enlightened is to not be clouded by emotions(essentially no emotions), you don't need memories but they are useful, and personality just defines how we act, we don't need to define it. so really there is no need.

quote:Originally posted by Aft3r ImaGe:

I don't think thats the standard definition of reincarnation, unless you consider reincarnation becoming human fertilizer, in more elegant terms.

...

Thats just cause and effect.

...

Thats not proof of karma thats just the result of people following it. There is nothing cosmic about people being nice out of fear.



All very valid. But I'm not one to take anything religious literally.

I think the best thing you can do with religious teachings is to apply them to yourself and your world.

So instead of seeing re-encarnation as a mystical force, I see it as a message that I'm intricately a part of my universe (that gives me comfort).

Then I ponder on Karma. And while I don't think it exists in a magical eye-for-an-eye way, I think it pays to be a 'good' person.

if you get into quatum physics, karma can be explained. Nonlocality or the seamless whole, states that if one thing happens one way something completely opposite will happen. a person did an expirament, he took two particles, he spun one to the right and immediatly the other spun left. so that could be a resemblance of karma. i am not saying it is but it resembles it. just like newtons third law, for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

quote:Originally posted by Graemy

if you get into quatum physics, karma can be explained.

Holy piss and shit videos! Now you want to use science to explain bullshit. No, quantum physics does not explain karma!

quote:Originally posted by Graemy

a person did an expirament, he took two particles, he spun one to the right and immediatly the other spun left.[/quote[

Someone spun subatomic particles, eh?

[quote]Originally posted by Graemy

i am not saying it is but it resembles it.

That's more like it.



quote:Originally posted by Graemy

just like newtons third law, for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

Why bother looking at science and saying "karma can be explained"? We all understand the idea of what karma is. Using laws of motion to prove something about karma is bullshit.

again i said resembles it.

i said it could be explained because John Bell did and expirament where he had two subatomic particles, he sent them off in different direction and spun one of them. he watched the other and imediatly it started spining in the other direction. there were two explanations for this either faster than light information or seamless whole(that we are all connected). since faster than light travel can only happen for massless particles, the principle of Nonlocality was created. if something happens there is going to be an adverse affect, which is the basis of karma. i think this would be the best explanation for it.

i said kinda of like Newtons third law as an analogy for Nonlocality not karma.

quote:Originally posted by Graemy

again i said resembles it.

You said, "if you get into quatum physics, karma can be explained." Cut the bullshit. If all you were doing was giving an analogy, you wouldn't have made a comment like this. Also, analogies aren't necessary. We all understand what the concept of karma is.



quote:Originally posted by Graemy

he had two subatomic particles, he sent them off in different direction and spun one of them.

Please stick to topics where you know what the fuck you're talking about. No one has ever taken a subatomic particle and spun it!



Unless you have some direct scientific evidence for karma, leave science out of the discussion.

There are two definitions held of what Karma is. 1 that fits with the more religiously or philosophically, metaphysically inclined, the other that fits with less religiously inclined.

Karma for the more religiously inclined is when you do something negative or bad it comes round and back to you eventually, same goes for good, so a person who does lots of bad things has bad karma and will get it back on them.

Karma for the less religiously inclined is simply a word reffering to Cause and Effect, when you do something there is a reaction in response.

Buddhism is an interesting point of view because it lets you make-up your own mind. In fact if you obey blindly the buddha says you're going to make buddhism into something else to avoid reality with. If you go out of your way to become enlightened, you aren't going to become enlightened. The burden of proof is on what you feel personally not whatever convincing argument others have to sway your opinion.

Karma, the wheel of life, afterlife etc are metaphors really. You can get into the different schools of buddhism but... i'd just go with whatever the buddha originally wrote and interpret it yourself.

His thoughts on the unknowable questions and trying to answer them (God, afterlife, souls, etc) is like being shot with an arrow and trying to figure out who made the arrow instead of pulling it out. Your time is better spent bettering yourself.

Martini, do you have to nitpick every part of my post?

i do know "what the fuck" i am talking about

http://tinyurl.com/6qlun

there you go. the way it was explained to me, in my physics class was that John Stewart Bell took two particles and changed the angular momentum of one and according to the law of Conservation of Angular momentum the other particle would change and it did. it resembles Karma as in Cause and Effect. just like Newtons third law, witch is Cause and Effect. Cause and Effect is all around us, in Physics, Newtonian mechanics, and plain life. Abrahim hit the nail on the head. i believe Karma as cause and effect.

EDIT: why are you so angry?

[This message has been edited by Graemy (edited 08-11-2006).]

quote:Originally posted by Graemy

i do know "what the fuck" i am talking about

No, you don't. I'm a medical dosimetrist and I've taken more physics classes than you'd ever want to. "he took two particles, he spun one to the right" Sorry, never happened.



You started off saying shit like "if you get into quatum physics, karma can be explained."

If you want to change your tune now and say you just wanted to bring up similarities, whatever. I don't see the point.

wait what exactly never happened?

Because the experiment he's refering to did happen. If your not debating the existence of that experiment and merely saying he's misrepresnting the experiment to support his beliefs just say so because your just being needlessly vague right now.

my god this has gotten out of hand

now, stop worrying about the scientific element, in most religions faith is all you need, and it doesnt need to be proven- this is why i dont want to be any other religion coz that just fucken stupid, i dont wanna be beleiving in something thats most likely bullshit...

as for karma, i dont think its an actual thing, rather just something thats good to think about, basically as my school rules state "treat others as you want to be treated"

i figure this is the basis of most religions- like i believe that jesus was a guy, and a good philosopher, but he went too far with the whole son of god thingo

now, as i dont plan on becoming a nun or anything extreme like that im happy with what i reckon... and i consider myself to be buddhist now coz i filled it in for census, unlike my dickhead brother who wrote jedi, but he was gonna write pirate of the carribean

Needlessly vague? Did you miss where I wrote, "No one has ever taken a subatomic particle and spun it!"?

The point is, plenty of people on this board continue to try to use science to prove that there is reincarnation, God, Intelligent Design, etc.

If science could prove any of those things, you'd hear about it...from scientists!

quote:Originally posted by MRman

and i consider myself to be buddhist now coz i filled it in for census

Oh, well why didn't you tell us that? Since you filled it in on a census, it's too late. You're a Buddhist.

its never too late you are what you want to be.

Martini, i said that but that isn't what i meant. it says that it could be3 explained but i didn't mean that, that is why i said later in the post, it resembles it.

quote:Originally posted by Martini:

Needlessly vague? Did you miss where I wrote, "No one has ever taken a subatomic particle and spun it!"?



No I didn't miss it nor did I miss when you said this

quote:Originally posted by Martini:

"he took two particles, he spun one to the right" Sorry, never happened.



hence my confusion regarding your intent.

I am not a Buddhist, but I did follow the philosophy for a little while. The Buddha never preached a religion. He preached a philosophy, and one that I agree with bits of still; namely, no killing for no reason, kindness and generosity, etc. Basically, all the stuff he and jesus agreed upon is pretty fucking righteous stuff. However, I cannot and will not buy into his futily nihilistic mental approach of labelling all things earthly as suffering and saying that this earth holds no value but to get you to Nirvana. I can't and won't accept that this world has no value but something else beyond us does. I will accept that this world has no value and there is nothing else.

basically, I won't allow mystical creatures to play games with my soul where I have to climb their ladder as they tell me. That is fucked up beyond belief.

quote:Originally posted by Gorloche:

I am not a Buddhist, but I did follow the philosophy for a little while. The Buddha never preached a religion. He preached a philosophy, and one that I agree with bits of still; namely, no killing for no reason, kindness and generosity, etc. Basically, all the stuff he and jesus agreed upon is pretty fucking righteous stuff. However, I cannot and will not buy into his futily nihilistic mental approach of labelling all things earthly as suffering and saying that this earth holds no value but to get you to Nirvana. I can't and won't accept that this world has no value but something else beyond us does. I will accept that this world has no value and there is nothing else.

basically, I won't allow mystical creatures to play games with my soul where I have to climb their ladder as they tell me. That is fucked up beyond belief.

That's not the buddhas message, earthly things are fine as long as you avoid craving and follow the middle way. Besides in buddhism suffering is actually a good thing because without it there would be no enlightenment, you can't have one without the other. And yeah I know it's hard to give up the craving for sex, drugs, cash, material things--but remember the buddha dosen't say do what I do or you go to hell. He says do what I say and see for yourself how you start feeling better. You also aren't giving up everything just not going to either extreme and controlling your actions.

Your concept of nirvana is a little off too, it isn't a mythical place like heaven. Quite the opposite nirvana is pure reality and has nothing to do with the supernatural, also unlike heaven it is available to you while you are alive. A mindset.

You make some good points, buddhism has been turned into a religion by different sects but the buddha was originally showing people a spiritual philosophy.



[This message has been edited by psuedogunslinger (edited 08-12-2006).]

very good explanation^

Gorloche was right, he didn't preach religion, but a way of life.

quote:Originally posted by Gorloche:

I am not a Buddhist, but I did follow the philosophy for a little while. The Buddha never preached a religion. He preached a philosophy, and one that I agree with bits of still; namely, no killing for no reason, kindness and generosity, etc. Basically, all the stuff he and jesus agreed upon is pretty fucking righteous stuff. However, I cannot and will not buy into his futily nihilistic mental approach of labelling all things earthly as suffering and saying that this earth holds no value but to get you to Nirvana. I can't and won't accept that this world has no value but something else beyond us does. I will accept that this world has no value and there is nothing else.

basically, I won't allow mystical creatures to play games with my soul where I have to climb their ladder as they tell me. That is fucked up beyond belief.

Material things inherently have no value, it is only the use which it gives us.

A person wont find anything good in a comb if he cant use it.

Also, you should read herman hesse's siddhartha, if you want to learn that both materialistic and spiritual journeys are neccesary for enlightenment

So no one is going to give me a lesson/link to a lesson, on growing my own food then...

quote:Originally posted by MRman:

well, i dont believe in the whole reincarnation bullshit, and karma is true in some regards, but thats just if your a politician or something where its easy for something to come and bite you in the arse, but the fact that it definately will is just stupid... im a skeptic in many regards, but i like buddhism coz the aspects to it are good, theres no way i would ever become devout, just kinda run my life around it a tad

Sounds good to me, keep an open mind and expect change, gain knowledge and make your own decisions. If Buddha could do it without the instructions of gurus, priests and prophets, so can anyone else .. if they want to!

Seems to be a lot of confusion about the buddha's teachings on reincarnation. As far as I am able to find out reincarnation is a Hindu concept, Buddha taught rebirth.

Here's a link: http://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/reincarnation.htm

Remember this and you can't go wrong:

quote:"Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it." Buddha

Namaste http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

quote:Originally posted by Aft3r ImaGe:

So no one is going to give me a lesson/link to a lesson, on growing my own food then...

http://tinyurl.com/ewwwl

quote:Originally posted by Graemy:

Originally posted by Aft3r ImaGe:

So no one is going to give me a lesson/link to a lesson, on growing my own food then...

http://tinyurl.com/ewwwl

Thank you VERY much, I've been looking around for something like this for sometime now, but I've only seen very incomplete guides.

I don't plan on growing all my food, and my motives for doing it are just an interest in gardening, and botany, but this should help me alot. You sir have my respect.

your welcome

grow ur own food.

Homer - Hmmmm doughnuts

It's good to hear genuine Buddhist practitioners. I see so many stupid teens claiming to be buddhist because they thinks it makes them cool. Those people need to be hit with a stick. Anyway, MRman, stick with buddhism, meditate, and pretty much just follow the advice given by everyone here (mostly everyone). I don't mean to beat a dead horse but, free your mind with meditation, see the world not as a boundary, but as a piece of an infinite universe of whose current you are riding on, and don't forget to cast off the shackles placed upon your mind at childhood. The spirtual body can accomplish anything, nothing is impossible, the galaxy is a playground for the mind man....whoa.

^^^ woah indeed... but thats true, thank you kindly

man... that was deep.

quote:Originally posted by Diamond Domino:

It's good to hear genuine Buddhist practitioners. I see so many stupid teens claiming to be buddhist because they thinks it makes them cool. Those people need to be hit with a stick. Anyway, MRman, stick with buddhism, meditate, and pretty much just follow the advice given by everyone here (mostly everyone). I don't mean to beat a dead horse but, free your mind with meditation, see the world not as a boundary, but as a piece of an infinite universe of whose current you are riding on, and don't forget to cast off the shackles placed upon your mind at childhood. The spirtual body can accomplish anything, nothing is impossible, the galaxy is a playground for the mind man....whoa.

along with the quote i suggest reading some suttas and sutras.

quote:Originally posted by Graemy:

along with the quote i suggest reading some suttas and sutras.

totse has a large collection of text files relating to them

yep, but you have to watch out for jainist and hindu because they also call them suttas and sutras.

Buddhism: In the teachings of Buddha and sometimes those after him.

Hinduism: In the teachings of the Vedas and some texts after it.

Hinduism is Theistic in most senses and Buddhism does not in most cases focus on any relationship with a God to transcend suffering and reach Nirvana.

Hinduism seems to indicate Eternity while Buddhism seems to indicate impermanence.

The Goal of Hindu's who understand their relation is to become one with God and hopefully achieve a positive afterlife.

The Goal of Buddhists is to transcend all suffering and material to reach the state of Nirvana.

Jainists are a branch of Hinduism more than a branch of Buddhism. Jainists hope to do right by not harming any living creature.

Both the founders of Buddhism and Jainism had a portion of their lives spent as Ascetics and Truth seekers coming from cultures which were predominantly Hindu.

I prefer the Buddha's conclusion as compared to the found of Jainism's conclusion. I am a bigger fan of Hinduism's the Brahman and am not satisfied by Buddhism's avoidance of theism, Buddhists are said to find it a distraction from the course of attaining Nirvana and that it is of no real concern, I disagree and find it is of utmost concern, perhaps not why we are here, but who we return to.

quote:Originally posted by Abrahim:

Buddhism: In the teachings of Buddha and sometimes those after him.

Hinduism: In the teachings of the Vedas and some texts after it.

Hinduism is Theistic in most senses and Buddhism does not in most cases focus on any relationship with a God to transcend suffering and reach Nirvana.

Hinduism seems to indicate Eternity while Buddhism seems to indicate impermanence.

The Goal of Hindu's who understand their relation is to become one with God and hopefully achieve a positive afterlife.

The Goal of Buddhists is to transcend all suffering and material to reach the state of Nirvana.

Jainists are a branch of Hinduism more than a branch of Buddhism. Jainists hope to do right by not harming any living creature.

Both the founders of Buddhism and Jainism had a portion of their lives spent as Ascetics and Truth seekers coming from cultures which were predominantly Hindu.

I prefer the Buddha's conclusion as compared to the found of Jainism's conclusion. I am a bigger fan of Hinduism's the Brahman and am not satisfied by Buddhism's avoidance of theism, Buddhists are said to find it a distraction from the course of attaining Nirvana and that it is of no real concern, I disagree and find it is of utmost concern, perhaps not why we are here, but who we return to.

why does everyone have to have such a greater knowledge and understanding of life than me?... then again being 14, im still a naive little youngster so it doesnt matter

quote:Originally posted by Abrahim

Buddhists are said to find it a distraction from the course of attaining Nirvana and that it is of no real concern, I disagree and find it is of utmost concern, perhaps not why we are here, but who we return to.

Of course you find belief in God to be of concern; you're a Muslim. You believe that unbelievers go to hell. Buddhists are more rational when it comes to belief in gods. I think this answer given by a Buddhist is excellent: http://www.buddhanet.net/ans73.htm

That was a nice article, thanks Martini.

I personally don't really believe that the man who was the Buddha disbelieved in any form of God, I believe it is likely within his mind was some sort of concept similar to The Brahman of essential Vedas based Hinduism.

The article said that all claim their own Gods when this isn't completely true, if one studies even the most ancient religions up to the modern, one can find common core ideas and essentials.

He did mention the concept of salvation but really its about the invasion.

buddhaism is a cleaver way of teaching spirtualy to atheised, is kinda like tricking you into, good karma, but is mostly rooted out from hinduism, just that buddhist belive in a void and hindu people belive in a god, the vedas acctualy predicted the budda to come as a recrination of god to trick atheised into learning spritual teachings, chanting, mediating , and etc..

no buddhism is completely different from hinduism. reincarnation might not even be part of it. the Buddha once found out that one of his monks were teaching it as his teachings, so it might not be part of it.

The hindus believe in castes. buddhists believe in equality (even in women at the time that women weren't seen as equal) they are similar in some ways but so is christianity and buddhism. they both teach love for all things. they have a god, buddhists have a void. all religions are related, some how.

I think that the buddhist idea of reincarnation was really just a poetic expression of collective human memory, and how you can elevate the human condition by using what we have learned, or degrade it by refusing to. I think that the idea of Karma is the same thing--perhaps we are not literally rewarded for past good deeds, but rather the collective human condition is bettered by deeds that help others, and perahps we should see ourselves in others.

Sorry to branch off topic, but perhaps one of you informed practitioners can help clear something up for me.

Do Buddhists believe in evil forces active in the world or evil for that matter? Or is evil merely the result of suffering? Thanks.

quote:Originally posted by karma_sleeper:

Sorry to branch off topic, but perhaps one of you informed practitioners can help clear something up for me.

Do Buddhists believe in evil forces active in the world or evil for that matter? Or is evil merely the result of suffering? Thanks.

evil isnt a force, it is the result of suffering. It is the result of suffering because to get away from the suffering of the world, they do bad things, this is the common way, because people are just plain and simple lazy, or corrupt. Money is usually the root of becoming corrupt or evil, hence the saying 'money is the root of all evil'

Evil isnt directly related to suffering, but it is related in a way

That wasnt very specific but it makes sense to me... probably no-one else though lol

and evil can then cause more suffering so they commit more evil and it goes on and on.

[This message has been edited by Graemy (edited 08-22-2006).]