That quote kind of sums up one of the biggest and most intricate things that I think about. How do I, or you, know that everything and everyone else around us is real? Maybe this is all some kind of trick, or we're all just some figment of some higher being's imagination.

Something to ponder.

Um, yeah, DeCartes said it few centuries ago,

Cogito Ergo Sum.

And how do you know of your own existence?

I think, therefore I am.

That's how I know I exist.

Sometime's I wonder that except I don't think I am in the imagination of some higher being. I think that everything else could just be a creation of my mind.

quote:Originally posted by Bollocks:

I think, therefore I am.

That's how I know I exist.

Thats BS. How bout when you were born, you didnt think, yet you were. I dont know shit, but I can tell you this, your existance is not limited to the amount of brain activity in your skull.

After all, we all die in the end, yet we still exist.



[This message has been edited by ChildOfRebellion (edited 09-13-2006).]

But I did think. I just don't remember my thinking. And the "I think..." thing doesn't apply to physical bodies asomuch it applies to us, inside. If that makes any sense. I can't really explain it.

A more appropriate conclusion would be, "I think, therefore something is."

Afterall, if you cannot trust the reality of the world around you, why trust the one in your crazy little skull?

quote:Thats BS. How bout when you were born, you didnt think, yet you were. I dont know shit, but I can tell you this, your existance is not limited to the amount of brain activity in your skull.

After all, we all die in the end, yet we still exist.

The title of this thread is “of my own existence I am certain”. In ‘Meditations on First Philosophy’, Descartes threw everything he had the slightest doubt about out the window, and then built up the truth with what was left; which was his own existence and that of God’s; but any sane man would realise that the only think Descartes was certain about was his own existence because the logic for how he figured out the existence of God is really shitty and even a two year old could shoot it down.

How does he know he existed as a baby? Does he have any memories of this? Descartes said memories trick us. How do we know our parents telling us about us as babies isn’t a trick of our mind? Silly, yes, but you get the idea.

quote:A more appropriate conclusion would be, "I think, therefore something is."

Afterall, if you cannot trust the reality of the world around you, why trust the one in your crazy little skull?

That is really stupid. "I exist" is immune to Descartes' method of doubt because it is impossible to be mistaken about one's own existence. If we don't exist then we can't be mistaken, so we might as well believe we do.

“Williams provides a meticulous and exhaustive examination of this objection. He argues, first, that it is impossible to make sense of "there is thinking" without relativising it to something. It seems at first as though this something needn't be a thinker, the "I", but Williams goes through each of the possibilities, demonstrating that none of them can do the job. He concludes that Descartes is justified in his formulation (though possibly without realising why that was so).”

That was more of a prod at defining the individual, Sparky. What are 'you' if the whole of the Universe and all of your experiences are a fabrication?

It wouldn't bother me to explain this if you weren't so obnoxious.

newton said every action has an opposit and equal reaction. we know we exist because we see the reactions to our actions. but then again all of this is a hologram and we only exist in those sparks of energy the pass between our brain cells

And how exactly do we know Newton was justified in his conclusion?



Entheogenic

quote:Originally posted by MongolianThroatCancer:

newton said every action has an opposit and equal reaction. we know we exist because we see the reactions to our actions.

No, we know we exist because [see Raw_Power's post].

quote:Originally posted by Entheogenic:

And how exactly do we know Newton was justified in his conclusion?



Entheogenic

i think the fact that im responding to this post answers that

quote:Originally posted by MongolianThroatCancer:

i think the fact that im responding to this post answers that

No it doesn't. You're just a figment of my imagination. Nothing is actually reacting; the universe was created in this instance, and all of my memories are false.

Psychedelics anyone?

I think about this exact situation all the time. As if I am the original being in the universe, and everything else revolves around me as if I was the main character in a huge, elaborate story, and I'm following a set path according to the story.

The set path isn't predetermined destiny though, it's something different that I just can't put my finger on...

[This message has been edited by SydMorrison (edited 09-14-2006).]

quote:Originally posted by SydMorrison:

Psychedelics anyone?

I think about this exact situation all the time. As if I am the original being in the universe, and everything else revolves around me as if I was the main character in a huge, elaborate story, and I'm following a set path according to the story.

The set path isn't predetermined destiny though, it's something different that I just can't put my finger on...



Actually, you're just a minor character in my story.

quote:Originally posted by Twisted_Ferret:

Actually, you're just a minor character in my story.

Well, this is one hell of a story!

Study some quantum physics, especially the part about Heisenberg's Uncertainty Theory and Schroedinger's cat.

The observer not only affects reality, but creates it.

And at a personal level, we all choose how we experience reality.

but thats if you assume we're just energy, yeah you're all right, but the fact that this is my life and im typing this because i am. so fuck all of ya'll. im god, im real, so fuck you ohdsgf;oh;jdgfhjdshgfjds

quote:Originally posted by UnknownVeritas:

That was more of a prod at defining the individual, Sparky. What are 'you' if the whole of the Universe and all of your experiences are a fabrication?



I am the observer.

No comments means I win http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)



[This message has been edited by ChildOfRebellion (edited 09-15-2006).]