My fiance was a very religious woman. I'm an atheist, and for damn good reasons. My fiance was the type that preyed constantly. Even thought that Jesus talked to her and such. I eventually sat her down, tired of all of it and asked her one simple question. "If you were a slave, would you want to be free?" She said, no, at first. She was just trying to avoid me saying what she knew I might say. Eventually she admitted she didn't want to be a slave and I sat down and explained to her how religion works. Through this, I explained the flaw of following the religion, the bondage it was placing on society, it's many uses, and the negatives of it. She came at me with many questions that she thought she could stump me on, I explained them away like it was nothing. She even admitted that my answers made more sense than anything she ever heard from a pastor. Now she is free from it, and is thankful to me for helping her see the truth. It took me 15 minutes to destroy years of brainwashing.

quote:It took me 15 minutes to destroy years of brainwashing.[/B]

Either you're lying or she wasn't that well indoctrinated.

I've explained everything logically and morally wrong to her over and over again, and even though I stump her and she says she has no idea how to answer, the very next day she simply smiles and says "it's true just because I know it is." http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

It's like that with so many of them. They can see the bullshit of all other religions easily, yet when it comes to their own, it's like they somehow have these blinders on. It's like talking to a brick wall.

The truth is that I planted a seed. It took two months for it to grow inside of her. It was a seed of doubt. Eventually, I had her in a position where confusion had set in, and the final blow was dealt within 15 minutes. I de-programmed her. Religions use brainwashing techniques to drill that kind of bullshit into peoples heads. The leaders of churches are those who are brainwashed the most. I too find it amazing how soo many people here on TV about these impressionable people getting brainwashed into these fucked up cults, and say, "what a bunch of idiots", and then go to church for their weekly dose. Duhhhhhh. Yes, people are stupid. Hyms are designed to induce a trance. Exertion such as preying in uncomfortable positions, repetitive bowing etc, releases large amounts of endorphins. Participating in a group releases dopamine. So basically, the first part of church sessions is to induce a trance and a natural body high. That's the touch of god, they tell you, doesn't it feel great. I love drugs too, but it ain't god.

And then comes out the wonderful preacher. The soft spoken, usually male expert in hypnosis, and more under the influence than anyone else in the church. Ever been to a hypnotist? A lot of religious people don't because they are calling up deamons blah blah blah. Not really, they're just relaxing the conscious mind to take over your body, and we can't have this correlation being made amongst the religious body. If you have seen a hypnotist, think about how the Hypnotist speaks in a soothing, calming, relaxed voice. Now think about how you've heard your pastor, priest, minister, etc, speak. It's the same voice tone and speech pattern. They're putting you under hypnosis and brainwashing you.

Basically, after planting some seeds of doubt, I started explaining how religion is administered. She literally just snapped out of it. Even anything she could think up that contested this, I smashed it with ease. She fealt really gullible and started crying.

My fiance was extremely religious. Half of her family are pastors. She was converted and was rapped right up in it cause she believe it saved her from satanism. It was fucked what she believed. I explained the entire thing about what really happened. She just literally snapped out it and saw the truth, simple as that.

See, what most people don't realize is that Christianity, and most mainstream religions, are black magic. Not the typical voodoo witch doctor kind. Black magic, is simply convincing someone of supernatural power, making them believe that things can only happen because of that power. The whole idea being, to remove power from you to make change, and reduce you to waiting for change from the supernatural source. Actually, Satanism and Christianity both work on the same principle giving up power, and are only extremes of eachother when it comes to who you give that power too. Just look at these dumbasses just waiting for the rapture, for Christ's return, so that they can live in his kingdom of peace. This thinking dooms us to our current shitty existence, but it's super profitable. At first it was the royal families that profited by people waiting for christ, then eventually it shifted slowly to the rich elitest making money today. They've taken away our power through religion, and reduced us to slaves groveling at god's feet, or rather, those who control the word of God.

The reality is, if we would just put away are stupid relgious beliefs, understand that most humans only want peace, happiness, and a decent quality of life, we could set out and achieve these goals. Things need to change a little to allow this to take place, but this time is coming soon. We don't need the second coming of Christ to get peace, we only have to persue it and quit relying on god to deliver it.

I'm into white magic. I believe that you can only bring about change by observing,understanding, and seeking out appropriate solutions. You can pray to god for the cure to cancer, but it's the good scientists that devote their lives to researching it who are going to deliver. Most being atheists, or at very least, week believers in religion. The reality is that God does nothing, or really, their is no god so don't wait for him/her to do shit.

If you have any specific questions that your brainwashed person keeps asking, please feel free and I'll tell you the answers.

Just incase anyone was wondering if they are brainwashed, this is the test. If you have a belief, but cannot explain why you have this belief, it is not your own, and was put their by someone else.

So basically, the first part of church sessions is to induce a trance and a natural body high

The soft spoken, usually male expert in hypnosis

They're putting you under hypnosis and brainwashing you.

Paranoid

The whole idea being, to remove power from you to make change, and reduce you to waiting for change from the supernatural source

Opposite from my experience with Christianity.

The reality is, if we would just put away are stupid relgious beliefs, understand that most humans only want peace, happiness, and a decent quality of life, we could set out and achieve these goals.

I doubt it.

Wow, you re-brainwashed her.

You're not supposed to do that, you're supposed to let them find out on their own, or you just allowing them to enter into another form of church which is your own set of beliefs.

I hypnotized people before, I know cause it's how I did it. It's all about getting them into the right mind frame.

quote:Originally posted by ate:

Wow, you re-brainwashed her.

You're not supposed to do that, you're supposed to let them find out on their own, or you just allowing them to enter into another form of church which is your own set of beliefs.

QFT

I didn't re-brainwash her, I just told her the truth, no mind tricks, no nothing. It made sense, more sense than christianity. Even things you instill in people to believe while under, when presented with enough truth and logic, it goes up in smoke.

Nah, you gave her your belief system. If you gave it to her you just transfered her over from hers, which was previously whatever, to yours, which was previously whatever.

When has she ever come up with one on her own?

Have you?

^Die, troll.

quote:

The reality is, if we would just put away are stupid relgious beliefs, understand that most humans only want peace, happiness, and a decent quality of life, we could set out and achieve these goals. Things need to change a little to allow this to take place, but this time is coming soon. We don't need the second coming of Christ to get peace, we only have to persue it and quit relying on god to deliver it.

[/B]

So true people are willing to do anything here if told they have eternity of peace (suicide bombers are the most known example), insted we should work for peace here, I wish more people thought like this.

I hate to break it to you, but your wife is going to have a resurgence several years down the road. It's going to suck. I hope you're prepared.

If your fiancé had been particularly religious to begin with, she would never have agreed to marry a person with whom she disagreed about what is for religious people THE MOST FUNDAMENTAL QUESTION OF LIFE, THE UNIVERSE, AND EVERYTHING. So, in other words, you got a person with weak/noncommittal beliefs to agree with you, which isn't much of a feat.

Incidentally, if she actually was particularly religious and she agreed to marry you, she is likely to look on it later as a mistake as she starts to miss her religion, so in that case your marriage is in trouble before it has begun.

[Edit: and anybody who spells "prayed" p-r-e-y-e-d probably couldn't convince a car salesman to part with a Chevy Nova, so I seriously doubt the veracity of your claims as to her supposed religiosity].



[This message has been edited by Sephiroth (edited 10-03-2006).]

And what happened later on that evening? Post Pics.

quote:Originally posted by Sephiroth:

[Edit: and anybody who spells "prayed" p-r-e-y-e-d probably couldn't convince a car salesman to part with a Chevy Nova, so I seriously doubt the veracity of your claims as to her supposed religiosity].



How many times have you complained about Rust using semantics in an argument?

Well that has nothing to do with semantics. It's a really fucking stupid argument ... as if someone convincing couldn't make a spelling mistake... but he's not arguing semantics.

quote:Originally posted by ate:

Wow, you re-brainwashed her.

You're not supposed to do that, you're supposed to let them find out on their own, or you just allowing them to enter into another form of church which is your own set of beliefs.

For once I agree with ate. You're no better than the church by forcing her into atheism, not to mention if her family are pastors, then she's probably more certain about her beliefs than the average joe.

She's most likely just telling you what you want to here because she loves you, You'll find out eventually that she hasn't lost her faith at all, then you'll have some problems.

quote:Originally posted by ate:

Nah, you gave her your belief system. If you gave it to her you just transfered her over from hers, which was previously whatever, to yours, which was previously whatever.

When has she ever come up with one on her own?

Have you?



Yup, ate made a very good point.

OP, how would you feel if she tried to convert you? You'd be offended? upset?

Just love her for who she is, and as was stated, let her find out on her own.

You probably won't accept this, but you did the same thing the church does.

"I just told her the truth, no mind tricks, no nothing. It made sense, more sense than christianity."

Yeah, it makes 100% sense to you, and the rest of us. But religion also makes sense to a lot of the people who believe it for their own reasons.

In my opinion, appologiese, and let her be her own person.

You have the right to help her, you just can't abridge her free-will, if currently accepting a belief system that is personal to her, then we will eventually live that experience as long as it needs for her to realize what it gives you back in life. If she's led ahead before she finds it to be the whole truth that she's decided, then it's still going to be a belief that she accepted because someone told her, that was replaced by a belief that someone else told her. It could eventually cause problems.

A loveing relationship consistes of one looking out for one anothers interest as well as allowing them to exist without too much of your own influence. Part of a persons spiritual developement is moving on when they wish and are ready to move on, as if it were a single decision.

So you can still help her on her way, although it's up to you to know what is her free will and desire to change her belief system to find a better one, and to know when she will only be delayed further if she is interrupted in the learning process.

quote:Originally posted by ate:

Wow, you re-brainwashed her.

You're not supposed to do that, you're supposed to let them find out on their own, or you just allowing them to enter into another form of church which is your own set of beliefs.



Zing-o!!

The way I see it, part of christianity is teaching the followers to not to listen to anything that doesn't support their views. To be ignorant of anything that might be purposely created to sway your views. Truth and knowledge, two things Jesus always preached, is the one thing that the Church in his name dispises. Why would that be? And since she would never read anything contradicting, she would have never questioned her beliefs if I hadn't made arguements that did. Why am I all of a sudden a bad person for spreading knowledge that broke down her faith? Any arguement anyone has come at me as an atheist, I've been able to quash it with ease and send my opponent running away with their tale between their legs, usually questioning their own beliefs. I talked to a minister once, now he plays golf on sundays and takes part in charity work instead.

Didn't it ever cross your mind that maybe I'm just dead on right. Most of my beliefs can be backed by science, and at the very least, logic. Maybe in the absense of a logical alternative, people may be devout believers, but when challenged by a stronger arguement, unless total ignorance is kept, they will undoubtedly lose faith. Truth and knowledge is powerful against lies and deception.

It's like saying I'm a bad person for telling someone who believes in creationism about evolution. Is this brainwashing and manipulation, or informing the misguided?

Ate- I only gave her the skills she didn't posess to look for the most likely, and logical answers. She found them, and in turn ended up in my boat. Not cause I told her what to think, but to think.

easeoflife22, don't listen to the fucktards, you didn't "re-brainwash" her, they're all probably a bunch of pussy agnostics.

Convincing someone that they're wrong isn't "re-brainwashing" them. Sorry. You're wrong. Or you're playing semantics, in which case you can give me a bj while assraping yourself with a pinecone.

quote:Originally posted by easeoflife22:

Ate- I only gave her the skills she didn't posess to look for the most likely, and logical answers. She found them, and in turn ended up in my boat. Not cause I told her what to think, but to think.

You fed her the answers. you told us you fed her tha answers, you even set her up to get the responce you wanted.

What's even worse is that people here are trying to show YOU what we see to be the truth, and you're not even considering it.

Why should anyone consider anything? You expected her to be enlightened, we expect you, if you come to a forum, to atleast aknowledg and consider that you may not be 100% right.

From what I've seen most of the regular responders here are athiests, we're not saying this is how it is because we're bible huggers, or agnostics like that one fag said. We did it because regardless of what we believe there are some standards that need to be kept.

Why not even consider the possibility that you may not be this infalible creature, maybe you did go about it slightly the wrong way. I mean jeez, you're not God afterall :-P you can make mistakes.

We listened to and considered your side. grant us the same privilage.