Please.

Let's post all your views of the exact definition (or undefinable quality) of what GOD is.

I'm tired of people going.

"God doesn't exist."

Me going, "Why?"

And them going, "Why would God create hell?"

This is just horrible, people, you're talking about a CULT, I'm positive that God is not a part of any establishment having to do with money or followings, no priests or ordained people that have papers that say they're spiritual.

So all I want to know is exactly how many views of god there are in this forum.

Ranging from those occult religions, allah, the christ, to the spiritual energy source of consciousness.

Please, even if you have an "undefinable" view of god, make a post and represent yourself here.

<UL TYPE=SQUARE>

*Judeo-Christian god began as Brahman, or the Hindu... Collective as I like to call it.

*God doesnt exist.

*We can't define God.

*God is what you make it out to be.

*The existence of God is logically untenable, and quite possibly the most dangerous and destructive belief in the history of humanity.

*Christian God, Heaven and Hell

</UL>



[This message has been edited by ate (edited 10-30-2006).]

I think the idea of the Judeo-Christian god began as Brahman, or the Hindu... Collective, as I like to call it.



EDIT: I was gonna put more, but didn't really know where to start.

[This message has been edited by Merlinman2005 (edited 10-27-2006).]

God doesnt exist.

Please state your belief and why you believe that in the simplest sense imaginable.

I agree we need a definition of "god".

All these people saying reality is god, or the quantum foam is god, or my dingleberries are god, so god is literally real.

How can you debate the existence of what is un-defined?

We can't define God. This thread will end up just like every other thread before it. Full of guess work.

He's kind of a stranger to me.

God is what you make it out to be.

The more I study religion, the more I realize that there is truly no orginal religon. Each one piggybacked off of prior ones.

quote:Originally posted by Source:

We can't define God. This thread will end up just like every other thread before it. Full of guess work.

Alright, so your answer for this threads is undefined.

*Judeo-Christian god began as Brahman, or the Hindu... Collective as I like to call it.

*God doesnt exist.

*We can't define God.

*God is what you make it out to be.

So we either can't define god, meaning it's still possibly anything from quantum existence, to man in the sky.

God doesn't exist, in the form that nothing created this universe, and nothing is watching this universe.

God is anything you make it out to be, meaning it's a reflective entity meant to serve your consciousness in it's requirement for compansionship, or higher beingness of any kind.

If I'm not getting any of these right, please elaborate on your ideas and make them as defined as possible, so that someone doesn't take them the other way as if they were another definintion of God.

[This message has been edited by ate (edited 10-28-2006).]

The existence of God is logically untenable, and quite possibly the most dangerous and destructive belief in the history of humanity.



Entheogenic

quote:Originally posted by ate:

Alright, so your answer for this threads is undefined.

Well actually it was going to be God doesn't exist, but you said you were sick of hearing that... So instead I played on the idea that if God did exist, he would be beyond our comprehension and there for not able to define him/her.

Ate, I don't know if I missed it anywhere already, but what are your views on God?

[This message has been edited by Source (edited 10-28-2006).]

God is either the universe, comprising it physically and beyond-physical at the same time, hence negating the phole concept of both a "physical" or "spiritual" being as "he" is holding those terms together through very existence, i guess this does link to what scientists are beginning to discover, in almost "conscious" particles making up matter, and even smaller particles making them up...just continuing, with no limmit, the very idea stores their existence almost.

Or

God is mearly energy, like in our thoughts and minds, a pure energy beyond space, time and matter, but highly involved in them at the same time (involved seems like the wrong word though, as that would have to involve effort, and the idea of effort and God does not fit in my oppinion, what people call "God" cannot "try" to do something...hence why most religions are a pile of shite).

or

God doesn't exist as an "actual" being, only as an "illusion" in the human mind, but at the same time, this does make the existence very real, as what has "created" him has the energy to continue and shape his existence within the human mind, which is actually something phenomenally powerful. Hence, despite "God" not existing there is something beyond this concept, which is integral to matter and conscious thought in the universe.

I really don't know which to think, my understanding of God is undecided, in some ways higher purpose seems so clear and obvious, and laid out peacefuly in my mind. In other ways, this feels like ego seeking to use a tool to understand the incomprehensible.

quote:Originally posted by Source:

Ate, I don't know if I missed it anywhere already, but what are your views on God?

Words don't express it will, although a very nice and lengthy discussion would.

quote:Originally posted by Mellow_Fellow:

God is either the universe, comprising it physically and beyond-physical at the same time, hence negating the whole concept of both a "physical" or "spiritual" being as "he" is holding those terms together through very existence, I guess this does link to what scientists are beginning to discover, in almost "conscious" particles making up matter, and even smaller particles making them up...just continuing, with no limit, the very idea stores their existence almost.

Or

God is merely energy, like in our thoughts and minds, a pure energy beyond space, time and matter, but highly involved in them at the same time (involved seems like the wrong word though, as that would have to involve effort, and the idea of effort and God does not fit in my opinion, what people call "God" cannot "try" to do something...hence why most religions are a pile of shit).

or

God doesn't exist as an "actual" being, only as an "illusion" in the human mind, but at the same time, this does make the existence very real, as what has "created" him has the energy to continue and shape his existence within the human mind, which is actually something phenomenally powerful. Hence, despite "God" not existing there is something beyond this concept, which is integral to matter and conscious thought in the universe.

I really don't know which to think, my understanding of God is undecided, in some ways higher purpose seems so clear and obvious, and laid out peacefully in my mind. In other ways, this feels like ego seeking to use a tool to understand the incomprehensible.

Ok, this is going to be very hard for some people to understand.

But I believe that God is all these things. At the same time.

Nothing exists until we create it.

God exists because he created us.

We exist because we created ourselves.

We are creating our future.

We are creating God.

We will eventually fulfill our imaginations and become that God.



And now discuss that ad infinitum and I will have a chance to explain it.

quote:Originally posted by ate:

And now discuss that ad infinitum and I will have a chance to explain it.

From what I've gathered about you from this statement and others is that you have major control issues. You can explain it without anyone discussing it "ad infinitum".

How about starting with this:

"Nothing exists until we create it."

How about explaining that.

You can, explain that right?

Why don't we just be nice, and help each other, because we're not all the same. If I don't know what I need to explain. Then how and I supposd to explain anything that's going to be useful to you?

So let's try and act as equals here, working together..

You know.

If you don't want to you don't have to.

gee whiz ate

pretend we started discussing that line

what would you expect to see? What do you think we'd have to say about it?

Lemme start

Hmm, we don't create wind. We didn't make the planet, we make observations, sure. Rules, sure. But there's plenty we haven't created, that still exists.

quote:Originally posted by ate:

How about explaining that.

You can, explain that right?

I can't explain it because I didn't make the claim, you did. You made the claim that nothing exists until we create it.

Ok IMO god is word that is given to ignorance. when a person doesnt know why something occured or how something happened they usually attribute it to some higher power or some divine being. they then make up attributes that suit this being and *poof* we have god. or what some people do is group things together and label them god.

quote:Originally posted by Martini:

Originally posted by ate:

How about explaining that.

You can, explain that right?

I can't explain it because I didn't make the claim, you did. You made the claim that nothing exists until we create it.



Okkkk, so you're giving me a little more information on what you actually want me to explain.

So now you're saying in response to that, that we didn't create much of what we experience.

Now...

Stick with me.

You good? Yes?

This isn't just one explanation of one thing, this has many aspects and many explanations to be done, so if we can get started then let's, this will take a long time, notice the "ad infinitum part".

Well.

From our current point of view on life, we didn't create anything, in fact we don't really do much but control these bodies and these bodies manipulate the materials that are already place around us, we didn't put them there, but they're there and so we use them, naturally because it's in our nature, we are animals. And we know this because it's so common, it's all over the planet, and everywhere in life, in all it's various forms, it keeps repeating this, consciousness simply controls a body and the body can "move" things, it can act physically, yet that's pretty much all it can do.

Now with the mind.

You can get some different things to happen.

We have science and technology now a days.

Before, basically as close to the animals as the animals are to the land. Now we have separated our race and mind with a

higher understanding of reality and the universe, a more expanded version blah blah blah kids go to school and learn about all sorts of interesting things...

and then we have different ways of incorporating this into our lives, through creations of sorts. Instead of just moving bulk matter around a bit, and acting like animals, we can actually move the matter inside the mater around and create new substances. We can harness the energy inside the matter and whatnot, so on and so forth.

So basically.

Like a cube, we are working and understanding every piece of this reality from the outside in, slowly discovering everything on the outside, every piece of land, and now working inward and micro scaling the world and our bodies.

And the interesting part.

Is eventually we get to our minds.

Micro scaling, psychology, beliefs, mystical experience, religion, science and the effect of quantum observation, consciousness, self awareness and all this good stuff.

Entirely new to us. We can see the rest. The physical. We have the bodies to do it, it's right in front of us.

But this consciousness thing, this energy thing. We can' touch it, we can't even detect it, we can only feel it, and see either results of it's, or signs of it's presence IE: brainwaves, or something like physical action.

SO!

This brings a sort of new understand or area to learn from about the universe, also opening us up as we go along. Now we are coming to a sort of turning point with our understanding of the way things work, in a plethora of ways.

For what this relates to and for what I see.

Time is now taking on a new shape, it occurs differently and originates from a different place than we previously thought.

Consciousness is the same.

Emotion is the same.

Death is the same.

Space is the same.

And so basically, all of reality is expanding into something new. At this point. Because we're going as far as we can go, without knowing things, because we still claim that either certain things are impossible, or that we simply don't have explanations for them.

And for this, one can assume that our current understanding is old and outdated and is going to be replaced through some process which has been happening all along.

So, of the many things that we are discovering, it's the quantum connection between all matter and space, and how these tiny "consciousness" particles that literally react only to consciousness, as if they were either the same exact substance, or a form of the same substance both connected in some way that isn't bounded by physical law.

So with this our consciousness in relation to how our reality is experienced is altered, and from that, because the reality is altered on a scale which transcends space and time, just that, space and time take on a new form.

And it's not like this isn't just asking to happen, there are so many things that we don't understand, not things out in space that we haven't seen, but simple biological effects of the human body in nature and on other bodies that we can't make sense of through the everyday understanding.

Now. As for all these things "RECENTLY" pointing to some type of reality which we are not understanding at the moment, or is simply impossible to be understood in our current state, creating our reality, or creating what we experience is defined right in there.

The only we what we experience would not be what we create is if we looked at time from a linear view. But if there's a linear view, then things take on a physical shape and are bounded by those physical laws, but just the things we are talking about, all of the universe on a quantum level and OUR CONSCIOUSNESS have RECENTLY been discovered, based on our evolutionary process, to react and interact with each other on a way which does not correspond or at least does not entirely fit within the view of the physical.

Basically it transcends it. Laws of speed and the linear process of cause and effect do not apply, creation and experience happens simultaneously, with this quantum view.

So it makes sense the, that it would literally be possible for us to experience life in this limited way all this point, thinking that we haven't been aware of the creation process of our reality, when the whole time we have.



Now.

What are signs of not being aware of the creation process?

Well first you have to be aware, so self-consciousness is a must.

And look, we became self-conscious just a little bit ago.



And now what, if we weren't aware that we were in charge of things, yet we really still were and our actions and thoughts had an affect, then you would think it would be like driving a semi, holding the weight of a trillion tons around a lava pit, one false move and it all goes down the drain.

Now look at society, look at the planet, look at all the unexplained areas of experience, look at all the separated views, and then look at the recent discoveries of science AND RELIGION, and put them all together.

Now.

This was in no way an answer.

This wasn't supposed to explain anything.

Because you don't like to do this, I don't know why, maybe you don't like me.

So.

I say to you. If you would really like to do this.

Then understand IT'S A MUTUAL PROCESS.

All I am trying to do here is invoke another good question, once you do that. All this big mass of integrated yet spread out information can become narrowed down.

Understood, and made more "neat".

But I cannot do that, unless you help me. I mean. I could. But where's the fun in that if you're not there the whole way, so that it's literally a creation that both of us are putting our energy into, and helping to shape. So that both of us truly understand.

Now look.

Did you absolutely truly understand absolutely everything I just said, how it relates to that quote, and how the whole thing ties into everything I said?

No?

Well, good, we're on schedule, you have to continue asking questions, so that I know what to explain, just like I said in the first place. Would you like to do this yes or no?

It's a mutual agreement to learn, I'm not into the whole present day schooling attitude of a blackboard with words on it, and someone reading them to get information.

This must be interactive, that is the scale of information and experience we are moving into. I ensure you, that if you do oblige, then we will get farther with what I'm asking you now, than any other way. I'm sure of it.

So do you wish to continue?

No, I don't wish to continue. What you do is go on long tangents like a mental patient, and still never prove that "Nothing exists until we create it."

Congratulations on hi-jacking your own thread.

You started in the guise that you want to hear everyone else's opinion on what God is, but again it becomes apparent that you want your ideas on everything to be the center of attention and have everyone discuss ate's genius "ad infinitum".

How about trying succinct posts that get to the point? Long rambling posts are generally considered bad message board etiquette. Go write a book. I'm sure some new age freaks out there might buy it.

Absolutely not, you said I started out wanting to hear your views.

And then you said that I really wanted to tell my own views.

But what was the other option other than posting my views?

Having you speak and post more than myself.

So does 2 and 2 add up to 53 for you? That's what you just made it sound like, and now you're backing down, tsk tsk, what does that spell?

So, you don't know metaphysics, and you don't understand a new age religion, you know phrases like "metaphysical bullshit, new age freaks.." you know what else sounds like that?

Kind something a racist would say about another race, like "jew bastard", or "freedom of rights horseshit", do you get it?

You don't think, you don't have a conscious bone in your body, you can't explain those things, new age, or metaphysics. Just as a racist couldn't come to terms with equal rights or something like accepting everyone views as is.

I believe it's called having prejudice, and we all know what that's based off of! More ego-babble. But then again that's just what this is, although there is a difference.

Do I have a right to do this? After...

1) I ask you a question.

2) You reply, and so I reply.

3) You ask me to explain.

4) I ask you what and how you want me to explain.

5) You cannot continue discussing things at such a level, either the direct method of communication, or the thoughts behind them throw you off and make you twitch, so you literally get angry and tell me to discuss.

6) I answer your wish.

7) You get angry and tell me I've done wrong!



Hahahahahaahahah! You're out of your mind! When you want to discuss something, when you want to make sense, when you want to be able to let other views in and understand them, come back!

Otherwise you sound like some pig! Like some little kid that doesn't know a thing about what he talks about, using words to replace whole understandings, yet to defame those understandings, in order to provide some fake ego-personality of someone who actually understands those subjects! When in truth, all you've done is sit there and state one single word, and then attached a negative connotation to it! Acting like it's so below you, and your understanding of the world is so above it!

Ego-mania in all it's glory!

So! If you want to leave that behind, and speak like a human who knows, explain things, understand them, and really....you know...grow up.. and get "above the bullshit" of trying to act cool or smart and use words to portray you as someone who simply knows all of it. Then post like a conscious being.

Until then. You're simply not one, just a fake and rather shabby portray of what one might look like, if it were you!

Edit!

And here's the kicker!

The best way to find a below average intelligence on an online forum, issss:

Survey says! : They don't read the posts! Yet they still reply to them!

LOL!

[This message has been edited by ate (edited 10-30-2006).]

To mo:

in accordance with bullet 5 in your article at the head of the page - i would like to say that a typo does not trick our minds into 'assuming' that god is real.

fuck all, and fuck you. i need not be influenced by your militaristic propaganda. and fuck christians. if god were to exist, then that would create a hell. and hell, is something that can only exist in someone's mind. for there is no place for us on earth or in the universe to be trasported to so rapidly when we die. fuck the theory of an afterlife because if there actually is one - i feel bad for the people that came before jesus' time.

^ Research the quantum field.

But, so, your views of God are highly religious, and Christian, specifically?

People don't read your posts, Ate, because you don't make them reader friendly. Cut out the condescending bullshit and either make your point (with concrete arguments and examples) or don't, but don't spout pseudoscience and react smugly when you aren't taken seriously; if no one is getting your point, you may want to examine how that point is being made.



Entheogenic

How about no.

I'm not smug.

I'm me.

You can read it if you like, if not reply specifically and say do this differently or say it differently.

Not.

Ate.

We're gonna have to chat.

You gotta change everything for me, cuz I say so.

Good day sizzle.