Classic Descartes argument.

My friend says the foolproof argument for God's existence is "perfection". He claims nothing in this world is perfect, and that because nothing is perfect, the only way we have the idea of perfection is because God bestowed it upon us, as a little signature when he created everything. He supports this by saying "perfecto" or something in Gaelic means Godlike.

I'm trying to tell him that there's thousands of concepts not achievable or real, but merely an idea, and they were all made by humans. I'm trying to debunk his theory, but Descartes wasn't much of an idiot, and it's hard. I'm trying to write a list of a couple of ideas that do not appear in our world, and yet were created by man. Any ideas, or help on a counterargument?

wrong forum dick

Your friend should read Plato.

Thats the gayest thing I've ever heard.

Heres the real proof that god exists:

You know how at certain points in your life, everything seems to fall apart at exactly the same time? Like in the same day...everything you took for granted gets stripped from you at the same time? You lose your job, your woman, your friends, and you find yourself completely and utterly alone without any way to pay your rent?

The universe isnt capable of such perfect synchronization. Thats gods touch right there.

quote:Originally posted by SilentMind:

Thats the gayest thing I've ever heard.

Heres the real proof that god exists:

You know how at certain points in your life, everything seems to fall apart at exactly the same time? Like in the same day...everything you took for granted gets stripped from you at the same time? You lose your job, your woman, your friends, and you find yourself completely and utterly alone without any way to pay your rent?

The universe isnt capable of such perfect synchronization. Thats gods touch right there.

Jee, God sure is an asshole.

quote:Originally posted by king koopa:

Jee, God sure is an asshole.



Thats kind of the whole premise of christianity. Havent you ever read the bible?

quote:Originally posted by king koopa:

Jee, God sure is an asshole.

seconded. We don't need him. It's funny how only when we are weak that we blame supernatural beings to come to our help.

What if God was one of us?

quote:Originally posted by SilentMind:



Thats kind of the whole premise of christianity. Havent you ever read the bible?

You're assuming he's talking about the Christian God. But regardless, most Christians haven't even read the Ten Commandments, let alone the Bible.

quote:Originally posted by SilentMind:



Thats kind of the whole premise of christianity. Havent you ever read the bible?

No, my friend, have you...

www.truechistian.com (http://www.truechistian.com)

There are many versions of "gods" word. God must have been very sloppy, considering he is perfect and all...

quote:Originally posted by AeroDynamic:

What if God was one of us?

You mean... like.... just a stranger on a bus?

quote:Originally posted by Spike Spiegel:

You mean... like.... just a stranger on a bus?

...perhaps trying to make his or her way home?

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

You're assuming he's talking about the Christian God. But regardless, most Christians haven't even read the Ten Commandments, let alone the Bible.

I'm not even religious in any way and I've read the bible just to see what the big deal was.

hahaha

...you believe in a supernatural being!

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

...perhaps trying to make his or her way home?

He could even be a slob like one of us...

Really makes you think, huh?

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

Your friend should read Plato.

Please don't post in my threads.

quote:Originally posted by Kleenex:

hahaha

...you believe in a supernatural being!

Science damn you!

quote:Originally posted by Rykoshet:

Please don't post in my threads.

I'll post wherever the fuck I want to, asshole. And your friend really should read Plato.

quote:Originally posted by robinhoody:

Science damn you!

Science H. Logic!

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

I'll post wherever the fuck I want to, asshole. And your friend really should read Plato.

"Plato is a bore."

-Nietzche.

Also you're fat.

he's got you there deadendgirl... you are pretty damn fat.

quote:Originally posted by Kleenex:

hahaha

...you believe in a supernatural being!

Science Damn It, I forgot about that.

Well, I'm glad we got the productive stuff out of the way, maybe now we can get back to screwing around.

quote:Originally posted by Rykoshet:

Well, I'm glad we got the productive stuff out of the way, maybe now we can get back to screwing around.

Easy there, Mayor McSass...

quote:Originally posted by pongsifu:

I'm not even religious in any way and I've read the bible just to see what the big deal was.



I'm 100% aethist. I dont believe in the afterlife in any way shape or form. (I cant completely deny the presence of a higher power, but it does seem silly to insinuate that its sentient, or filled with love)

But the bible is the single most influencial. book out there. Any semi-intellectual mind needs to have read it, even if its just as a learning experience.

I respect you.

The bible was a little too anti-climatic for my taste...

quote:Originally posted by SilentMind:



I'm 100% aethist. I dont believe in the afterlife in any way shape or form. (I cant completely deny the presence of a higher power, but it does seem silly to insinuate that its sentient, or filled with love)

But the bible is the single most influencial. book out there. Any semi-intellectual mind needs to have read it, even if its just as a learning experience.

I respect you.

I read the stories of Jesus like I read the stories of Gilgamesh, but to say that you are an atheist is just as big a leap of faith as to say you are a religious zealot. Either way, you're placing your faith in something that cannot be proven and taking it as a fact.

My God has 3 dicks.

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

I read the stories of Jesus like I read the stories of Gilgamesh, but to say that you are an atheist is just as big a leap of faith as to say you are a religious zealot. Either way, you're placing your faith in something that cannot be proven and taking it as a fact.

Jesus fucking Christ, you are so dumb.

I lol'd.

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

I read the stories of Jesus like I read the stories of Gilgamesh, but to say that you are an atheist is just as big a leap of faith as to say you are a religious zealot. Either way, you're placing your faith in something that cannot be proven and taking it as a fact.

Yes, but this way you don't have to pray an hour a week or follow some silly little rules.

quote:Originally posted by Rykoshet:

Yes, but this way you don't have to pray an hour a week or follow some silly little rules.

One can believe in God, yet not "pray an hour a week" or "follow silly little rules." In other words, you can believe in God without submitting yourself to religious doctrine. There's a difference between spirituality and religion.

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

One can believe in God, yet not "pray an hour a week" or "follow silly little rules." In other words, you can believe in God without submitting yourself to religious doctrine. There's a difference between spirituality and religion.

Be that as it may, there really is no different meaning to "Get the fuck out of my thread". I'd MOO it out for you, but Kate ate my English to MOO dictionary.

quote:Originally posted by Rykoshet:

Be that as it may, there really is no different meaning to "Get the fuck out of my thread". I'd MOO it out for you, but Kate ate my English to MOO dictionary.

Oh well that's intelligent.

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

One can believe in God, yet not "pray an hour a week" or "follow silly little rules." In other words, you can believe in God without submitting yourself to religious doctrine. There's a difference between spirituality and religion.

Commitment. lol

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

One can believe in God, yet not "pray an hour a week" or "follow silly little rules." In other words, you can believe in God without submitting yourself to religious doctrine. There's a difference between spirituality and religion.

So, you're basically saying that you'll condemn yourself to hell? good job, dumbass.

quote:Originally posted by Aseren:

So, you're basically saying that you'll condemn yourself to hell? good job, dumbass.



I don't quite see how you got that from what I posted....lol.

quote:Originally posted by SilentMind:

Thats the gayest thing I've ever heard.

Heres the real proof that god exists:

You know how at certain points in your life, everything seems to fall apart at exactly the same time? Like in the same day...everything you took for granted gets stripped from you at the same time? You lose your job, your woman, your friends, and you find yourself completely and utterly alone without any way to pay your rent?

The universe isnt capable of such perfect synchronization. Thats gods touch right there.

That's the gayest thing you've ever heard is it? no-one study DesCartes anymore, because this asshat doesn't agree with it, despite the fact that he arguably the most celebrated philosopher in the last millenium, and his theories have been debated endlessly.



/rant



anyway, it's called the trademark argument (im sure someone will have already said this) so look it up. my most original critisisim of this is that DesCartes states that something cannot create something more perfect than itself. However, perfectiion is not a spectrum, something is either perfect or not.

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

I don't quite see how you got that from what I posted....lol.

I knew that would happen, which is why I called you a dumbass.

quote:Originally posted by Leeroy:

However, perfectiion is not a spectrum, something is either perfect or not.

Perfection is an imaginary quality.

quote:Originally posted by deadendgirl:

I read the stories of Jesus like I read the stories of Gilgamesh, but to say that you are an atheist is just as big a leap of faith as to say you are a religious zealot. Either way, you're placing your faith in something that cannot be proven and taking it as a fact.

No, no, no, no, NO! Oh my fucking Science, I hear this at least once a day now. http://www.totse.com/bbs/mad.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/mad.gif) Check out the ten thousand threads on this in here before you repeat such a disgustingly overused pseudo-intellectual myth!

[This message has been edited by Twisted_Ferret (edited 11-17-2006).]