You know what some Muslim religious leader said to him. He told the pope to apologize or he would burn every catholic church.

Pretty stupid if you ask me.

Cool username...Hendrix was God on Earth.

quote:Originally posted by Spanish Castle Magic:

You know what some Muslim religious leader said to him. He told the pope to apologize or he would burn every catholic church.

Pretty stupid if you ask me.

Do you have any sources or proof of your statement?

Actually, I think they just put sort of a 'hit' out on the pope. And then when that became public knowledge, everyone decided that the pope should have been more 'sensitive' in his speech. Fucking pussies.

The Pope should raise an army and just be like "make my day"

Hendrix was the man.

Awww, come on guys, we need to be more sensitive and understanding of Muslims.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

I'm not violent!!! I'll fucking kill you, bitch!!

http://tinyurl.com/yjnmdm

quote:Originally posted by Zman:

The Pope should raise an army and just be like "make my day"



Fuck, at least wait till we get this Iraq Hell over!

Get our troops out, and then the Pope can start his cursades from Italy to Iran.....

Like christians can say ANYONE else is violent??

Right.

It does seem every muslim comes equipped with a bomb though...

quote:Originally posted by Zman:

The Pope should raise an army and just be like "make my day"

Hendrix was the man.

Lol, 1,098,366,000 person strong army.

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g249/jmcca127/BritishMuslims-ps.jpg

- ♫.i.b.y.v.n.t.h.♫

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

Cool username...Hendrix was God on Earth.

Hendrix sucked, and so do you.

Haha the POPE criticizing Islam?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

You'd think after 21 [failed] crusades, the Pope would be taught to SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Which is what I'd like all of you to do. You're the reason Islamic extremists don't have to change tactics.

Fuck off.

Religions are only as peaceful as their followers.

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

Cool username...Hendrix was God on Earth.

Roger That.

The pope called Islam a violent religion...



Wow...just...wow...

I'm not going to even waste my typing energy explaining what a hypocrite he actually is.

I'm getting so sick of people misquoting that speech. Read the entire thing, then see the part the make the fuss about. It is something which has been taken out of context and blown out of proportion, and used by the Islamic militants to stir up trouble with the masses, who don;t know any better. Get your facts straight, and don't misquote people.

quote:Originally posted by trichocereus pachanoi:

I'm getting so sick of people misquoting that speech. Read the entire thing, then see the part the make the fuss about. It is something which has been taken out of context and blown out of proportion, and used by the Islamic militants to stir up trouble with the masses, who don;t know any better. Get your facts straight, and don't misquote people.



Thank fuck for someone understanding.

quote:Originally posted by panthermodern:

Awww, come on guys, we need to be more sensitive and understanding of Muslims.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

I'll give them sensitivity. Watch how sensitive this little red button is.

quote:Originally posted by smallpox champion:

I'm not violent!!! I'll fucking kill you, bitch!!

Lol thats exactly what they're like. Fucking stupid really

Really? See I am Islamic. I've only been in a fight once in my life. So why don't you explain to me how I'm violent? I'd love to hear your explanation.

quote:Originally posted by DXM User:

Hendrix sucked, and so do you.



You don't have emotions, do you?

Hendrix could move Dick Cheney's heart...and defibrulators can barely do that.

quote:Originally posted by blackarmchair:

Really? See I am Islamic. I've only been in a fight once in my life. So why don't you explain to me how I'm violent? I'd love to hear your explanation.

I uh, um...

<.<

>.>

SHUT THE FUCK UP RAGHEAD

quote:Originally posted by DXM User:

Hendrix sucked, and so do you.

Haha the POPE criticizing Islam?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

You'd think after 21 [failed] crusades, the Pope would be taught to SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Which is what I'd like all of you to do. You're the reason Islamic extremists don't have to change tactics.

Fuck off.

Hello, Mr. Fallacy! (http://www.fallacyfiles.org/tuquoque.html)

quote:Originally posted by Spanish Castle Magic:

You know what some Muslim religious leader said to him. He told the pope to apologize or he would burn every catholic church.

Pretty stupid if you ask me.

You son of a bitch piece of shit I don't fucking have tourettes goddamnit!

quote:Originally posted by IanBoyd3:

You son of a bitch piece of shit I don't fucking have tourettes goddamnit!

Irony.



Truth: The pope might not be a guy I admire, but at least he has balls. That I'll admit.

quote:Originally posted by Spanish Castle Magic:

You know what some Muslim religious leader said to him. He told the pope to apologize or he would burn every catholic church.

Pretty stupid if you ask me.

Thats because islam is not a peaceful religion. I would know too as I have researched it for years. Infact I take muslims to school on other sites when they find it hard to believe their prophet was a pedophile, terrorist, etc.



[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-08-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by DXM User:

Hendrix sucked, and so do you.

Haha the POPE criticizing Islam?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

You'd think after 21 [failed] crusades, the Pope would be taught to SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Which is what I'd like all of you to do. You're the reason Islamic extremists don't have to change tactics.

Fuck off.

your a fag on so many levels.

21 (failed) crusades.

Each an attempt to liberate the middleeast from their ISLAMIC conquerers/slave drivers/child kidnappers.



Qur'an, 9:29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

heres an idea. go to the vatican and scream out "THE POPE IS A HOMOSEXUAL!!!"

then when youre done, go to Iran and scream out "THE AYATOLLAH IS HOMOSEXUAL!!!"

bring a bullet proof vest

If there's anything counter to peace and progress in the world - it's religion.

quote:Originally posted by Antagonist:

If there's anything counter to peace and progress in the world - it's religion.

Not really. It's just certain people.

For example, how are Buddhism and Taoism opposed to peace and progress? If anything, Buddhism is a great supporter of progress; progress of the self (which is the most important progress there is, IMO, because if we can't progress ourselves, how can we progress our species?).

I'd also argue that many Christians and Muslims are not opposed to peace and progress. The reason there is such opposition to the two is that all the media shows is extremists from both religions. You don't get a chance to see the Christians and Muslims that actually care about this world, because the news channels are occupied by the ones who don't care about anything but their own short-sighted ways.

Religion is not necessarily opposed to peace and progress, it would be more accurate to say that people are opposed to it.

[This message has been edited by panthermodern (edited 01-08-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by Xerxes89:

Irony.



Truth: The pope might not be a guy I admire, but at least he has balls. That I'll admit.

What do you expect--heck, before he got promoted to pope, he was the official grand inquisitor.

(The church got all PC, and changed the name of the Inquisition to the Society for the Propagation of the Faith or something like that, but it is the same thing.)



[This message has been edited by ArmsMerchant (edited 01-10-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by panthermodern:

Awww, come on guys, we need to be more sensitive and understanding of Muslims.



We actually do. The entire faith seems to be written off by alot of people just because of some crazy assholes with strap on bombs who are turning the faith into basicaly the new Communism.

I've not seen proof of Muslims being anything BUT violent. Yes, they're nice, friendly, and courteous in public...but you know...so is a wolf in sheep's clothing.

So when they get home you think they start cleaning their AK-47's or something?

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:



Qur'an, 9:29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.



so in other words, this is saying....

" youre either with us, or against us, regardless of what you want to think. if youre against us, we'll blow you up coz its what we do..."

Read the fucking Qu'ran. There's a sit for it. FreeQuran.com or something. I'm too lazy to check and see if that's it. Anyways, after reading you will realize that Islam is indeed a superfucked religion.

I'm reading a book on it right now and have browsed the Koran. I find it to be not much different then Christianity just alot more devotion/submission to god. It's ideology is not evil just as Christianitys isn't. It's just another religion that is currently fueling ideology for the enemy. Islam won't be an issue when people get over the fact sep 11 was highly orchestrated and carried out by sinning madmen.

quote:Originally posted by Zman:

The Pope should raise an army and just be like "make my day"

Funny you should say that, because that time is coming soon.

Welcome to the world of Christian Zionism

Lets not forget the KKK and the countless number of people killed by the Christian Church.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

We actually do. The entire faith seems to be written off by alot of people just because of some crazy assholes with strap on bombs who are turning the faith into basicaly the new Communism.

I was just mocking the standing "sensitivity" response that a lot of extremist politically correct people tend to use when approaching racial and/or cultural problems.

If you look at my second post in the thread, you will see that I agree with you 100%.

Sorry about that I didn't read all the posts.

quote:Originally posted by numblock:

Funny you should say that, because that time is coming soon.

Welcome to the world of Christian Zionism



The Papacy doesn't even exist as a nation anymore, it's merely the Vatican. As far as I'm aware, the Vatican does not have an army of its own (and I remember hearing something along the lines of this allows them to legally use mercenaries, but I haven't heard anything official about this so I won't consider it valid) and not every Catholic is an able-bodied warrior.

quote:Originally posted by DXM User:

Hendrix sucked, and so do you.

Haha the POPE criticizing Islam?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

You'd think after 21 [failed] crusades, the Pope would be taught to SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Which is what I'd like all of you to do. You're the reason Islamic extremists don't have to change tactics.

Fuck off.

Because the Pope participated in those 21 failed Crusades...I think your the one who should shut the fuck up.

quote:The Crusades were a series of military campaigns of a religious character waged by Christians from 1095-1291

Yeah, little over 700 years ago. Last violent Islamic attack? Bout yesterday...Yeah, the Pope is real fucking hypocritical. And yeah I heard the same thing; I'll burn down every church...shot yourself in the foot there, asshole. Haha, I love that poster.

So know what your talking about before posting asswipe.

Cheers,

MOTO

quote:Originally posted by z.neocide:

Lets not forget the KKK and the countless number of people killed by the Christian Church.

The KKK is anti-Catholic, and has persecuted Catholics among those whom they dogmatically hate since its foundation.

quote:Originally posted by trichocereus pachanoi:

The KKK is anti-Catholic, and has persecuted Catholics among those whom they dogmatically hate since its foundation.

But the IRA and other terrorist organisations are strongly Catholic.

Catholicism is just as dogmatic and twisted as every other organised religion.

Well....islam IS a violent religion. There, I went ahead and said it. Actually read the qu'ran, it's not nice.

skepticsannotatedbible.com/

He speaks the truth.

The pope banned polyphonic music once.

The pope is an idiot.

quote:yango wango wrote:

Captain Kaboom wrote:

I've not seen proof of Muslims being anything BUT violent. Yes, they're nice, friendly, and courteous in public...but you know...so is a wolf in sheep's clothing.

So when they get home you think they start cleaning their AK-47's or something?



Nah. But walid shobat recalls how when at his job in america he used to feign sadness at the loss of american soldiers in iraq but would shout "Allahu Akbar!" on the ride home. Then he further elaborates on how him and his muslim buddies would crowd around the TV to watch the war and rejoice over the deaths of american soldiers.

Then theres that CAIR guy who said on TV that the 911 attacks were "unislamic" but later in a private conference refers to the hijackers as the "magnificent 19."

Then you've got various mosques in america and europe where imams teach their flock how to hate "kuffars" (google it) and jews but outside the mosque "islam is a religion of peace."

Also, am I the only one who remembers muslims dancing in the streets when we were attacked?

Most of the muslims I talk to online justify or sympathise with terrorists in one way or another, to varying degrees. And by most I mean like 80%

And last but not least lets not forget about the cartoon protests, the 100 car-arsens a night in france by "youths" (guess who...)

Any questions?



[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-11-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by mrparks:

Religions are only as peaceful as their followers.

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Most sensiable thing EVER said on totse

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Islam is a religion of peace.

Muslims are a bunch of fucking retards.

quote:Originally posted by Nephtys-Ra:

Islam is a religion of peace.

Muslims are a bunch of fucking retards.

More like...

ISLAM: Its a religion of peace...

(and we'll kill you to prove it)

Seriously though islam is not the peaceful religion they want you to think it is.

quote:Originally posted by JesuitArtiste:



Thank fuck for someone understanding.

Goddammit yes. SOMEBODY CLOSE THIS FUCKING THREAD!

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

More like...

ISLAM: Its a religion of peace...

(and we'll kill you to prove it)

Seriously though islam is not the peaceful religion they want you to think it is.

No, really, there are peaceful Muslims.

You just don't hear about them, because for every 5 of them, theres 1 fuckhead running around blowing himself up and killing a bunch of babies.

I know theres peaceful muslims. And if islam really was a religion of peace the % of fuckheads would bu much smaller. Sad things is the majority of the "peaceful" "moderate" muslims seem to support the "fuckheads" in some way or another, even if just moral.

[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-11-2007).]

Hmm This is interesting http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maHSOB2RFm4&mode=related&search=

quote:Originally posted by landspeed_presents:

Like christians can say ANYONE else is violent??

Right.

It does seem every muslim comes equipped with a bomb though...

dude, the pope is catholic.



alos, i don't think we can really give an accurate insight into islam because all we hear about it is anti-propaganda and suicide bombers on TV. i was always under the impression that the non radicals are generally nice, but its just the extremists that fuck everything up...just like in any other religion.

The problem isn't the religion, it's people interpreting their holy book wrong.

quote:Originally posted by Nephtys-Ra:

The problem isn't the religion, it's people interpreting their holy book wrong.



Well if thats the case than they've been intrepreting it wrong for a very, very long ntime. Indeed they've had it wrong ever since muhammad recited the war verses.

Let me give you an example: Toward the end of muhammad's life him and his brigade of pirates went on dozens of unprovoked raids against jews and caravans. This all culminated with muhammad breaking the treaty with mecca and invading.

Then after muhammad dies his followers go on to attack byzantine. It falls within a decade of his death. They take over north africa by force within 100 years. Then later spain. They also made war with india and china and stole huge swatches of land, such as afganistan, and slaughtered millions because hindus and budhists are not "people of the book" (christians or jews)

Then the pope called the crusades to deal with these rampaging murderers. THis was an attempt to liberate places like spain, egypt, Israel, etc. and to save other civilizations that were in their path. This was sucessful for a short time but after the crusades failed islamic jihad fought its way, tooth and nail, to vienna italy where September 11, 1683, the muslim invasion was finally halted by europe.

Without stolen goods and babes to take back to their homes and destroyed economies islam began to shrink within itself and forget its war waging past; they no longer had the recourses, partly due to the fact that islam destroys economic growth.

Now they are on the verge of re-establishing the caliphate and jihad thanks to oil in the ME.

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

Also, am I the only one who remembers muslims dancing in the streets when we were attacked?

Most of the muslims I talk to online justify or sympathise with terrorists in one way or another, to varying degrees. And by most I mean like 80%

And last but not least lets not forget about the cartoon protests, the 100 car-arsens a night in france by "youths" (guess who...)





Muslims were dancing in the streets in the Vancouver area too so what? 80% is statistic you pull out of your ass completly. Do you know any Muslims? Have you ever had an in depth one on one conversation with a Muslim? Have you ever been to a Mosque to learn the teachings of Islam? Have you been to a Muslim nation (online doesn't count)? Or are you basing this all on things you have read and heard? It's okay to form an opinion on something but really Islam is no different then any other monosthestic faith and the exact same thing could happen using other holy documents. That's really all there is to it. People are just scared of Islam thus get up in arms about it.

[This message has been edited by yango wango (edited 01-11-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by yango wango: Muslims were dancing in the streets in the Vancouver area too so what? 80% is statistic you pull out of your ass completly. Do you know any Muslims? Have you ever had an in depth one on one conversation with a Muslim?

Yeah. I talk to them all the time online and they are generally proud supporters of terrorists such as hamas, plo, hezbolla, etc. Most of them hate israel despite the fact that many so-called "attacks on civilians" have been proven beyond all doubt to be staged by palestinians. Whenever a terrorist group or faction takes controll of a government or country they unanimously herald it and support the terrorists despite evidence submitted regaurding their ties to al-quada or other idiotic orginizations. Bottom Line: Most muslims I know (about ten or them) support or sympathise with terrorists and want sharia (a set of draconian laws based on muhammad's sunna, google it) implimented globally.

EDIT: And believe me, these people seem very "moderate" when you first get to know them.

80% is not a statistic I pull out of my ass. It is a statistic garnered with experience.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:Have you ever been to a Mosque to learn the teachings of Islam?

Dont have to. You seem to think I have no knowledge in this subject. Yeah no shit some mosques condemn terrorism and violence. Possibly even most. (atleast in western countries) The problem is that many (more than you seem to think) do preach hatred. More than a tiny minority for sure; actual numbers are hard to come by as comprehensive invesigation has not been done yet.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:Have you been to a Muslim nation?

Most muslim nations (particularly those under islamic law) have mad problems with violence against non-muslims, death for apostacy, rape (unreported), terrorism, and rabid hatred for infidels, especially jews.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:Islam is no different then any other monosthestic faith and the exact same thing could happen using other holy documents.

No it is the oposite of other monotheistic faiths. Where in the bible does jesus call for killing? Indeed where in the entire bible will you find lasting commands for the slaughter of infidels and the take over of the world?

Islam is a totally different animal my friend. It has been from before the founder died. This should tell you something. For example christianity didn't become intollerent until some 300 years after jesus died.

Islam was violent and intollerent while the founder was alive. Explain that.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:That's really all there is to it. People are just scared of Islam thus get up in arms about it.

People better start being scared of islam very soon. Parts of europe, for example, are on the verge of becomming full-blown islamic states, like France.



[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-12-2007).]

You prove a good debate but I honestly think the point you are trying to make is trash. I am learning about Islam and am going to Turkey this summer. I plan to go to Lebanon as well. I want to actually see the culture with my own eyes. From what I have read so far Islam has proven itself to be similar except with more devotion to other such faiths. I'm not interested in joining any of these faiths. But I believe in ones right to practice them without persecution and intolerant judgement. All faiths.

"Lev 24:16 And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, [and] all the congregation shall certainly stone him: as well the stranger, as he that is born in the land, when he blasphemeth the name [of the LORD], shall be put to death." - The holy bible

This statement could also create suicide bombers under the proper circumstances.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

You prove a good debate

Thats because I have looked at all the facts.

A little over a year and a half ago I used to share your position regaurding faiths. At that time I already had much knowledge about christianity and its founder. Not the case with islam...

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

but I honestly think the point you are trying to make is trash.

That is an opinion based on a lack of knowledge.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

I am learning about Islam and am going to Turkey this summer.

Stay away from the rural areas or else you might just find out how "peaceful" this religion truly is.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

I plan to go to Lebanon as well. I want to actually see the culture with my own eyes.

Be careful there as well. You might want to keep to the northern half.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

From what I have read so far Islam has proven itself to be similar except with more devotion to other such faiths.

This "devotion" you speak of is actually a very powerful brainwashing technique. Islam says that only good muslims can go to paradise and to be good you must follow the laborious 5 pillars.

FYI: did you know that in islam noone is garunteed paradise, no matter how hard they try to be good? The exception being of course if they die while fighting/killing infidels.

Important note: This is the primordial difference between islam and christianity. In christianity salvation is only assured by accepting christ for forgiveness of sins. In islam violence is your only sure success. This should make you think.



quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

But I believe in ones right to practice them without persecution and intolerant judgement. All faiths.

A very noble belief indeed but one denied by islamic scripture.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

"Lev 24:16 And he that blasphemeth the name of the LORD, he shall surely be put to death, [and] all the congregation shall certainly stone him: as well the stranger, as he that is born in the land, when he blasphemeth the name [of the LORD], shall be put to death." - The holy bible

This statement could also create suicide bombers under the proper circumstances.

Notice how it said shall, not kill them. Could it be that god means that he will be the executioner in this case?

(and yeah I see your point. The point im tryong to put forward is that this can be intrepreted either way, not the case with islam. Also note that the bible doesn't mandate global conquest, oppression of infidels, nor conversion by the sword. If there is any doubt in the old testament than that is shattered by the new.)



[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-12-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

People better start being scared of islam very soon. Parts of europe, for example, are on the verge of becomming full-blown islamic states, like France.



Wait, wait, wait. So as your "facts" you say you've talked to muslims online. You can also find people online that want others to shit on them. 80% from anecdotal experience is still from your ass, you just basically said your statistics are true because they are without giving any sort of explanation.

Because of a few bad apples you judge an entire religion and that in itself isn't fair. You can have whatever opinion you like, but you're making it sound like you actually know what you're talking about and trying to convince people that you're some sort of expert on Islam when all you've done is look at a few websites and texts that twist it all around so it fits your preconcieved beliefs. It's like saying catholicism is a religion of violence because of the crusades and pedophile priests (since where talking about muhammed being a "violent pedophile" at a time when taking 10 year old brides was common and taking 10 year old boys today isn't)

You've never gone at looking at it with an open and unbiased mind, ever, I can guarantee that.

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

Wait, wait, wait. So as your "facts" you say you've talked to muslims online. You can also find people online that want others to shit on them.

In my post I clearly called these "facts" statistics not "facts." Im sure if you try hard enough you can find a group of muslims that would give the opposite result. Such as the sufi sect. However these are completely random muslims that just so happen to visit the same site that I do, therefore a decent, if not perfect, statistic.

Now stop putting words in my mouth.

quote:[b]Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

80% from anecdotal experience is still from your ass, you just basically said your statistics are true because they are without giving any sort of explanation.

I said no such thing, however if you look at the rest of my post (at the top of this page) you will see more evidence.

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

Because of a few bad apples you judge an entire religion and that in itself isn't fair.

hahahahahaha.

The judgement was made long before I met these guys. This judgment actually is based on facts.



quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

all you've done is look at a few websites and texts that twist it all around so it fits your preconcieved beliefs.

Completely untrue. I have read thousands of pages, including source material, some of it written by an apostate that memorized the quran by age 12, got a doctorate from, of all places, Al-Ahzar UN Cairo (considered by many to be the source of sunni spirituality) used to preach at a large mosque and even taught theology at said Uni.

His name is Mark Gabriel and I can point you to two of his books, free download.

EDIT: I also reccomend you download and read the quran. My favorite is Divine Islam's Quran Viewer 2.9. It is 150MB but worth every kilobyte as it is an app that contains some 30 or so translations including the original arabic (unicode) You can download it here. (http://www.programurl.com/qur-an-viewer-koran-.htm) (link doesn't always work)

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

It's like saying catholicism is a religion of violence because of the crusades

Ha ha ha. Indeed, such a fallacy is a common human mistake, I would never do such a thing. http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

Im gonna let you in on a little secret: When I still had the dilusion that islam is a "religion of peace" I got in a heated debate with my mother about it, me insisting it actually is peaceful.

I have since become more acquainted with the "religion of peace."

And one more thing, do you think the crusades may have been a retaliation for muslim conquest/violence/opression?

Or perhaps an attempt to liberate dhimmis under islamic occupation? I dont supposed you've ever asked yourself the obvious question: "What were muslims doing there in the first place?"

(If you'd like I can answere it for you)

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

and pedophile priests (since where talking about muhammed being a "violent pedophile" at a time when taking 10 year old brides was common and taking 10 year old boys today isn't)

Iv heard that fallacy before and I have yet to be presented with (by muslim or otherwise) evidence that this practice was common. (before muhammad, after him it became obviously popular, dificult to find old ass men marrying little girls before)

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

youv never gone at looking at it with an open and unbiased mind, ever, I can guarantee that.

Who the hell are you to make such baseless claims about me?



[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-12-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

In my post I clearly called these "facts" statistics not "facts." Im sure if you try hard enough you can find a group of muslims that would give the opposite result. Such as the sufi sect. However these are completely random muslims that just so happen to visit the same site that I do, therefore a decent, if not perfect, statistic.

I used the word facts because that is how you word what you say. You state plainly that the entire islamic religion is evil as it is somehow a given. Like all you have to do is open up the book and it tells you to jihad America right there. Posting a few out of context passages would be the same as posting out of context bible passages. You can find something that seems awful by todays standards or contradict the main teachings of the text. These are not perfect books, sometimes biases wound up in them. Even if certain people use those passages to excuse their actions the true muslims don't tolerate their actions.

quote:Now stop putting words in my mouth.

Then quit implying things and come out and say them. I honestly don't care what you know historically or about a piece of text. What I care is about the human beings right now. And no matter how many people you talk to online you can't just say that they are all bad people because of what they believe.

quote:I said no such thing, however if you look at the rest of my post you will see more evidence.

Rhetoric is NOT evidence.

quote:hahahahahaha.

The judgement was made long before I met these guys. This judgment actually is based on facts.

Of course by "facts" you mean your biases, emotions, etc.



quote:Completely untrue. I have read thousands of pages, including source material, some of it written by an apostate that memorized the quran by age 12, got a doctorate from, of all places, Al-Ahzar UN Cairo (considered by many to be the source of sunni spirituality) used to preach at a large mosque and even taught theology at said Uni.

His name is Mark Gabriel and I can point you to two of his books, free download.

So what? And i'm sure you can find a million nutballs writing garbage in every religion.



quote:Im gonna let you in on a little secret: When I still had the dilusion that islam is a "religion of peace" I got in a heated debate with my mother about it, me insisting it actually is peaceful.

"I remember defending those niggers until a gang of them beat me up and raped my sisters, now I know better than to trust any nigger"

quote:I have since become more acquainted with the "religion of peace."

And one more thing, do you think the crusades may have been a retaliation for muslim conquest/violence/opression?

Or perhaps an attempt to liberate dhimmis under islamic occupation? I dont supposed you've ever asked yourself the obvious question: "What were muslims doing there in the first place?"

(If you'd like I can answere it for you)

"Two wrongs make a right"



quote:Iv heard that fallacy before and I have yet to be presented with (by muslim or otherwise) evidence that this practice was common. (before muhammad, after him it became obviously popular, dificult to find old ass men marrying little girls before)

Fair enough, i'll be waiting for your evidence with sources. And again people that you talk to online don't count, they can lie for one, something tells me you've never talked to a muslim outside of your wank-filled hate on internet fantasy.



[This message has been edited by psuedogunslinger (edited 01-12-2007).]

quote:psuedogunslinger wrote:

I used the word facts because that is how you word what you say. You state plainly that the entire islamic religion is evil as it is somehow a given. Like all you have to do is open up the book and it tells you to jihad America right there.

That is becuase it is evil. I know this because of research and debate Iv had with muslims.

Speaking of "Jihad on America..."

quote: http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/011325.php

In 1786 Thomas Jefferson, then US ambassador to France, and John Adams, then US Ambassador to Britain, met in London with Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja, the Dey’s ambassador to Britain, in an attempt to negotiate a peace treaty based on Congress’ vote of funding. To the US Congress these two future Presidents later reported the reasons for the Muslims’ hostility towards America, a nation with which they had no previous contacts.

“…that it was founded on the Laws of their Prophet, that it was written in their Koran, that all nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, and that every Musselman (Muslim) who should be slain in Battle was sure to go to Paradise.”



quote:psuedogunslinger wrote:

Posting a few out of context passages would be the same as posting out of context bible passages. You can find something that seems awful by todays standards or contradict the main teachings of the text.

Yeah. Ok I suppose killing 800 jews on the pretext they were "planning to drop a rock on muhammad's head" is somehow out of context.

Or perhaps the time muhammad's band of pirates raided a jewish village for no reason other than the fact they were jews and the pirates were low on cash. How about when they had two camels rip an old lady in half? Out of context? Oh and while they were at it they slaughtered her entire family except one girl that muhammad "married." (In islamic marriage sex is obligatory of the woman, legal rape perhaps? Find me such an occurence in the bible.)

Lets also not forget the time gold ol muhammad and his bandits went on a different raid (against whom may you ask? The jooooos, yeah you guessed it) and lit a fire on the leader's chest to interrogate the location of hidden goods from him. Oh and marry his daughter off to muhammad, surprise -surprise.

Out of context perhaps?

Also, why did muhammad's second wife, aisha, say "You have made us (women) equal to dogs and donkeys"

She also commented that muslim wives have it much harder than infidel wives.

I guess thats out of context too.

quote:psuedogunslinger wrote:

Then quit implying things and come out and say them. I honestly don't care what you know historically or about a piece of text.

OK. I say this: Islam is a violent, intolerant manifesto invented by a psychopath with the sole purpose of conquering his neighbors, satisfying his lusts, and avenging his "grievences." It is a cancer upon mankind that has been terrorizing the world on a virtuall non-stop rampage that has killed millions in its pursuit of world domination, it will use any tactic to achieve this. It needs to be stopped.

Now with that said: The first victims of islam are the muslims themselves. Islam preys on a human being's most primal and pitiful emotions. They are: lust, fear, and hatred. The quran achieves this by creating the islamic hellhole in which women are locked up at home and separated from the men whom roam freely with nothing to do. The quran disrespects women in ways that shove a wedge between the sexes. So you have gangs of men with no females to mingle with, nothing but constant indoctrination. Indoctrination of hatred for jews, "sons of monkeys and pigs," "a people deviod of understanding," "alla's grievers," and non-muslims. Indoctrination of fear where in the quran alla revels in the many "flavors" of torture he awaits to bestow on the unlucky kafur. And indoctrination in lust where the quran speaks of "black eyed beauties" that are "perpetual virgins" and "pearl eyed boys." Mix this all together and you have a toxic cocktail for breeding suicide bombers, eager to injur the people they hate, ensure their salvation, and satify their virgin hard-on.



quote:psuedogunslinger wrote:What I care is about the human beings right now. And no matter how many people you talk to online you can't just say that they are all bad people because of what they believe.

I never did. Infact a few of the muslims I know are good people. But their religious bias shows through and makes them (if only slightly) more bigoted than they would normally be. If only they would face the ugliness of their "mercy to mankind."

Hating them is easy but they truly are victums of their birthrite and deserving of sympathy.



quote:psuedogunslinger wrote:So what? And i'm sure you can find a million nutballs writing garbage in every religion.

This "nutball" does not write garbage. He does not talk in meaningless inuendos and half-truths as you seem to be thinking. He simply quotes islamic passages as they are, as they have been for 1400 years, and states his opinion. I strongly suggest you read this guy's works, he after all was a muslim most of his life.

quote:psuedogunslinger wrote:

CrazyJ32 Wrote:

Im gonna let you in on a little secret: When I still had the dilusion that islam is a "religion of peace" I got in a heated debate with my mother about it, me insisting it actually is peaceful.

"I remember defending those niggers until a gang of them beat me up and raped my sisters, now I know better than to trust any nigger"

That's a false analogy. I was never beat up by muslims. I however have been beat up and opressed by blacks when I was young and do not refer to them as "niggers." I have plenty of black friends and regard blacks to be generally nicer than whites.

Try again.

quote:psuedogunslinger wrote:

CrazyJ32 wrote:

(The crusades were a retaliation for islamic jihad)

"Two wrongs make a right"

The crusades were partly self-defence. For one thing christians were used to being able to trek to the holy land without fear until muslims started capturing, torturing, and killing them. For another the middleast and north africa were christian nations befriended to europe until the muslims conquered and enslaved them. They had sent many pleas for help to italy but they got there a little late.

Under these islamic "paradises" non-muslims underwent inhuman opression similar to jews in nazi Germany. For example islamic law requires dhimmis pay the jizya tax. During the reigns of several caliphs the jizya collector was required to slap the "dirty" kafur in the face after collecting money. Dhimmis were also required to wear color-coded clothing, unmatching shoes in some cases, ride donkeys (side-saddle), yield to muslims in every venue of traffic, had absolutely no voice in court against a muslim, (I believe there's an actual verse mandating this), had their children stolen to be indoctrinated into jihadism, were subject to randomn rape, robery, assault, murder, arson, and other mayhem, with no recourse. Islamic law also mandates that non-muslim places of worship never be built, maintained, nor repaired. Oh the list goes on and on.

quote:psuedogunslinger wrote:

CrazyJ32 wrote:

Iv heard that fallacy before and I have yet to be presented with (by muslim or otherwise) evidence that this practice was common. (before muhammad, after him it became obviously popular, dificult to find old ass men marrying little girls before)

Fair enough, i'll be waiting for your evidence with sources.

Do a google search for "child bride" and the name of any islamic country.



[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-12-2007).]

^ You can misquote and twist whatever information you want just like the the KKK can. I told you that wasn't the point. I made my point, your opinions--and try to remember that is what they are, not facts--is nothing but a combination of hatred and ignorance, there is no way to debate with someone who is the equivelant of a holocaust denier. I only want to make sure nobody mistook your post for anything more than the intolerance that it conveys.

And honestly this is not an attack on you as you seem to imply i'm sure your a good person, but I know a lot of redneck bigots that are good people too.

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

^ You can misquote and twist whatever information you want just like the the KKK can.

hahahaha. I see im not gonna convince you. You've closed your eyes and ears to the truth. Too frightening?

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

your opinions--and try to remember that is what they are, not facts--is nothing but a combination of hatred and ignorance,

Wrong. They were based on ignorance. Remember: ignorance is a lack of knowledge. And as I said before Iv had discussions with muslims about the violent stuff and their replys are just pathetic excuses. You'd think that if I was wrong they would have put forward new information refuting my claims.

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

there is no way to debate with someone who is the equivelant of a holocaust denier. I only want to make sure nobody mistook your post for anything more than the intolerance that it conveys.

hahahahaha. Thats cute.

quote:Originally posted by psuedogunslinger:

And honestly this is not an attack on you as you seem to imply i'm sure your a good person, but I know a lot of redneck bigots that are good people too. [/B]

Likewise. I also know a few leftest islam apeasers/violence deniers/anti israel bigots.

(Disclaimer: Im neither right nor left. I have issues with both sides as they spend too much time attacking each other instead of cooperating. For example I also see the incoming catastrophy of global warming for what it really is as well)

When Winston Churchill was trying to convince the ruling party of Britian about the dangers of Hitler he once said: "The era of procrastination, of half-measures, of soothing and baffling expedients, of delays, is coming to a close. In its place, we are entering a period of consequences.”

He also warned us of communism and islamism.

[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-12-2007).]

Well CrazyJ32 I can't really debate your argument. It does give me one perspective one I don't at this time believe in. I don't think I ever will share your sentiments but that's okay. I can respect that you create a very good argument but I would just look stupid if I tried to debate you because you have obviously looked into Islam more then I have at this point. After I travel (and yes I am going to be carefull Turkey is generaly a very safe country Lebanon in general as well esspecialy Beirut as a Canadian traveller I doubt I would run into trouble but still I will be warry of trouble), I hope to see what it's like on the ground of an Islamic society. There are so many mixed messages about Islam I want to put it to rest in my mind since it seems to be our generations enemy and on the most part I believe (on both sides) to be missunderstood. But hey thanks for the pseudo debate hearing others perspectives is good even if they arn't your own in fact those are the best ones to listen to. Though I don't think I will ever feel the same way you do about the faith.

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:



Well if thats the case than they've been intrepreting it wrong for a very, very long ntime. Indeed they've had it wrong ever since muhammad recited the war verses.

Let me give you an example: Toward the end of muhammad's life him and his brigade of pirates went on dozens of unprovoked raids against jews and caravans. This all culminated with muhammad breaking the treaty with mecca and invading.

Then after muhammad dies his followers go on to attack byzantine. It falls within a decade of his death. They take over north africa by force within 100 years. Then later spain. They also made war with india and china and stole huge swatches of land, such as afganistan, and slaughtered millions because hindus and budhists are not "people of the book" (christians or jews)

Then the pope called the crusades to deal with these rampaging murderers. THis was an attempt to liberate places like spain, egypt, Israel, etc. and to save other civilizations that were in their path. This was sucessful for a short time but after the crusades failed islamic jihad fought its way, tooth and nail, to vienna italy where September 11, 1683, the muslim invasion was finally halted by europe.

Without stolen goods and babes to take back to their homes and destroyed economies islam began to shrink within itself and forget its war waging past; they no longer had the recourses, partly due to the fact that islam destroys economic growth.

Now they are on the verge of re-establishing the caliphate and jihad thanks to oil in the ME.

Too bad those noble crusaders, who went to save civilizations, sacked Constantinople, the old capital of the Byantine Empire. Your worldview is sadly twisted. The Crusades wasn't about stopping this disease of Islam, they were to regain the Holy Land, or more specifically Jerusalem, from the Muslim populace because those high and mighty Christians felt that infidels dwelling in the birthplace of Christ was horribly sinful.

Also, let's not get started on the Mughal Kings (who were also responsible for such landmarks as the Taj Mahal, as well as great cruelty to the local Sihks).

I think you'll find that in the end, the Middle Ages was full of violent land-grabbing people on all sides, not just mean ol' Muzzies causing trouble.

PS: Ever wonder why Palestinians (a mostly Muslim population) hate Israel and the Jews? Aside from long-standing religious differences, Israel was created through the seizure of the British Mandate of Palestine (following terrorist attacks by extremist Jews), forcing many Palestiinians from their land and homes. Not to mention the Israelis continue to treat the Muslims like shit.

[This message has been edited by socratic (edited 01-12-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

Well CrazyJ32 I can't really debate your argument. It does give me one perspective one I don't at this time believe in. I don't think I ever will share your sentiments but that's okay. I can respect that you create a very good argument but I would just look stupid if I tried to debate you because you have obviously looked into Islam more then I have at this point.

Well thankyou.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

After I travel (and yes I am going to be carefull Turkey is generaly a very safe country Lebanon in general as well esspecialy Beirut as a Canadian traveller I doubt I would run into trouble but still I will be warry of trouble), I hope to see what it's like on the ground of an Islamic society.

I hope you have a good time. If you find a outgoing guide in lebanon I think you will enjoy your stay.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

There are so many mixed messages about Islam I want to put it to rest in my mind since it seems to be our generations enemy and on the most part I believe (on both sides) to be missunderstood.

Indeed this idealogy is a great threat to western civilization. However I think (atleast the US) will be hit even harder by global warming. The future holds a lot of trepidation for me as well, I believe 100's of millions, if not a billion, will soon die to famine, disease, and war with Dar-al-Islam.

Humanity has a tragic history of learning the hard way, I believe its one of the reasons religions exist in the first place. Or perhaps its the other way around...

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

Though I don't think I will ever feel the same way you do about the faith. [/B]

Never say never.

quote:Originally posted by socratic:



Too bad those noble crusaders, who went to save civilizations, sacked Constantinople, the old capital of the Byantine Empire.

Uhmm Doode... Im fully aware of the mindless atrocities comitted by the crusaders. Nevertheless their conduct, although gastly at times, was nothing compared to Dar-al-Islam's rampages.

quote:Originally posted by socratic:



Your worldview is sadly twisted.

You say that because you dont know me that well.

Or possibly because you assume Im a racist white supremicist anti muslim pig.

Dont assume. To assume is to make an ass out of you an me.

quote:Originally posted by socratic:



The Crusades wasn't about stopping this disease of Islam, they were to regain the Holy Land, or more specifically Jerusalem, from the Muslim populace because those high and mighty Christians felt that infidels dwelling in the birthplace of Christ was horribly sinful.

Not according to the letter by the pope calling for these crusades. And besides, if all they cared about was jerusalem why did they bother with the other countries?

Oh I know collonialism, right?

Perhaps. But what most people dont realize about the crusades is that there was no unity, no accountability. So certain individuals did un-christian things.

Oh and BTW about your comment that "high and mighty Christians felt infidels dwelling in the birthplace of Christ was horribly sinful" What a load of crap! History records the christians making their pilgrimage to jerusalem for centures without problems until muslims started barring their way, killing them, torturing them, kidnapping them, etc, etc. What do you expect? These bastards steal all this land from christendome, constantinople, jerusalem, byzantine, and many others, cover it with christian blood, and they're just gonna let 'em have it?

quote:Originally posted by socratic:



Also, let's not get started on the Mughal Kings (who were also responsible for such landmarks as the Taj Mahal, as well as great cruelty to the local Sihks).

Yeah and guess who actually engineered these feats! Guess whose (stolen) money and goods payed for these things!

quote:Originally posted by socratic:



I think you'll find that in the end, the Middle Ages was full of violent land-grabbing people on all sides, not just mean ol' Muzzies causing trouble.

Yeah thats true. Every culture had a hand in some mischief or another but only Dar-al-islam went on the conquer everybody and enslave them rampage. Infact its still going on! Google Dafur genocide, hindu holocaust, they just recently took over and lost Somolia.

quote:Originally posted by socratic:



PS: Ever wonder why Palestinians (a mostly Muslim population) hate Israel and the Jews? Aside from long-standing religious differences, Israel was created through the seizure of the British Mandate of Palestine (following terrorist attacks by extremist Jews), forcing many Palestiinians from their land and homes. Not to mention the Israelis continue to treat the Muslims like shit.

Bullshit. The jews have given them so much and got nothing but hate in return. I have heard this rumor of Jewish terrorists before, care to cough up any proof?

Also, google "Pallywood" or "Al Durah the birth of an icon" (for starters) to find what's really going on when these muslims "get treated like shit."

EDIT: Also, palestein has a sizeable christian population. Why arn't they blowing up suicide bombs? Why arn't they stoning IDF soldiers?

Could it be because christianity doesnt teach the same intollerant, antisemitic, psychotic things as islam? Or perhaps they are too busy being subdued as per quran 9:29 by the muslim populace to do anything?

[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-13-2007).]

Islam in its exterme is no longer a religoen but a system of goverment, although some myself included would argue thats all it ever has been since its formation.

i will be happy when they are wiped from the planet.

quote:Originally posted by blackarmchair:

Really? See I am Islamic. I've only been in a fight once in my life. So why don't you explain to me how I'm violent? I'd love to hear your explanation.

See? Islam is, for the mostpart, composed of peaceful people (like the gentleman that I quoted). When a religion contains an assload of people, it only takes a small percent of those people to go crazy and be violent for the religion's reputation to go to shit.

Say that Islam has...100 000 000 followers (it's a-fucking-lot more than that I'm pretty sure).

Now say 2 percent took the Qur'an out of context and decided to kill everyone that isn't Islamic. That's fucking 2 million people, and it's going to seem like alot of fucking people to the world, and it's also going to attract media attention. The media can blow things out of proportion fairly easily. So say they tell the US that it's really 3 to 4 million people, or if they really want to exaggerate, 10 million people.

Everyone in the east (well...alot of people in the east) is going to see this on TV, and automatically think that the religion of Islam is a violent one.

They will completely disregard anything else they hear because we live in a horribly closed minded society, and the people will argue their new found opinion on a religion that they have previously never heard of.

What a great society we live in today eh?

quote:Originally posted by SydMorrison:

Say that Islam has...100 000 000 followers (it's a-fucking-lot more than that I'm pretty sure).

Its 1.4 billion

quote:Originally posted by SydMorrison:

Now say 2 percent took the Qur'an out of context and decided to kill everyone that isn't Islamic. That's fucking 2 million people, and it's going to seem like alot of fucking people to the world,

Yeah we could postulate such baseless theories.

Or we could investigate the quran, and while were at it why not the hadith and muhammad's official bio as well, and see if its not really the "peaceful" muslims taking it out of context.

I have done this and can confirm, beyond all doubt, that theory #2 is correct.

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:



Also, am I the only one who remembers muslims dancing in the streets when we were attacked?





They were handing the children candy and burning American flags.

Thats why we must kill ALL of them, because the children will grow up to hate us anyways.



edit: btw its cultural thing, not religion. And (most) all their cultures happen to be islam. ive heard islam is a peaceful religion, which i believe, just none of the people over there are peacefull.

[This message has been edited by SpeakSoSoftly (edited 01-13-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by SpeakSoSoftly:edit: btw its cultural thing, not religion. And (most) all their cultures happen to be islam. ive heard islam is a peaceful religion, which i believe, just none of the people over there are peacefull.

No its religous. Islam being a peaceful religion is the biggest myth iv ever heard.

Their "religion" teaches them rabid hatred for jews. Their quran calls them all kinds of names and explains how they "killed alla's prophets" and oh how alla hates them, "they are a people deviod of understanding."

One of muhammad's "prophecies" is that "the war with the jews will not end until all are dead except one hiding behind a rock. The rock will say 'there's a jew hiding behind me. Come and kill him.'"

Muhammad slaughtered, tortured, and robbed thousands of jews in his time and place. The only logical reason he had for his hatred for them is they rejected his "prophethood." Muhammad was a very bitter man.

Then when jews declare statehood in land once owned by muslims your damn right their gonna take offence and strike up a religous war to try and take it back. The reason they hate the US is because we support Israel.

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

Cool username...Hendrix was God on Earth.

Clapton is God.

when those ragheads kill in the name of "allah" you tend to think islam is a violent religon

quote:Originally posted by NiGhT PrOwLeR:

when those ragheads kill in the name of "allah" you tend to think islam is a violent religon

If you were paying any attention to my posts you would realize I have made no such fallacy of gross generalization.