Islamic Tolerance, and Tiny Minority of Extremists Alert lol... Gawd, I wonder what our resident Multiculturalists have to say about that?

Up to 1.3 percent of Indonesian Muslims nationwide admit using violence against people or objects they consider contradictory to their beliefs, a survey found, with more than 40 percent ready to wage war for their faith.

That means 1.3% out of the 200 Million Indonesian Muslims, that could be a staggering number, what's that a couple of million Indonesians have committed violence against others, in the name of Islam.

The survey, conducted from 2001 to March 2006, found 43.5 percent of respondents were ready to wage war on threatening non-Muslim groups, 40 percent would use violence against those blaspheming Islam and 14.7 percent would tear down churches without official permits.

LoL let's do that math, 43.5% out of 200 Million!! That's insane, how many prospective Jihadists is that? Of course we can't actually blame Islamic Ideology for this, despite the dozens upon dozens of enjoinings to commit violence found in the Quran and in the Hadiths.

http://www.thejakartapost.com/detailweekly.asp?fileid=20060728.@03

The problem is not the belief in Islam - it's the belief in ideological supremacy...a trait that would pass with the individual no matter what their belief is.

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

The problem is not the belief in Islam - it's the belief in ideological supremacy...a trait that would pass with the individual no matter what their belief is.

Islam teaches Ideological Supremacy and enjoins followers to commit acts of violence to preserve or to "protect" that Ideological Supremacy, hence the nearly 100 Million Indonesians willing to go to Jihad. To you guys, its never Islam's fault, eventhough the overwhelming utterences of Jihad and intolerance that are present in the Quran and the Hadiths.

Hoping this will somehow past is utter nonsense, you have to challenge the difficult passages in the religion, and quit pretending it is a "religion of peace" when it is obviously not.

quote:Originally posted by Jeebus Mic:



Islam teaches Ideological Supremacy and enjoins followers to commit acts of violence to preserve or to "protect" that Ideological Supremacy, hence the nearly 100 Million Indonesians willing to go to Jihad. To you guys, its never Islam's fault, eventhough the overwhelming utterences of Jihad and intolerance that are present in the Quran and the Hadiths.

Hoping this will somehow past is utter nonsense, you have to challenge the difficult passages in the religion, and quit pretending it is a "religion of peace" when it is obviously not.

I don't know if you are aware of this, but almost every fucking philosophical view on life will not exist in someone's mind unless it is seen as superior to the other available options. Whether or not this is conditioned at first, it inevitably boils down to an individual's acceptance and enactment of ideological supremacy.

This can be seen amongsts atheists, agnostics, Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, republicans, democrats, fascists, socialists, mysoginists, existentialists, universalists, and any other philosophy.

Mental constructs are memes - for one to accept a meme, the meme must be seen as valuable, moreso than the competition, for it to implant. Once implanted, it will be propogated further if it was arrived at through a superior attitude.

Atheism that attempts to justify itself is no less annoying or worthless than evangelistic theology.

Memes are the basis of mental disorders, and their very existence is a sign of a weak spirit: If you cannot accept that your ideas are just as much shit as another's, then you are seriously insane.

There is no justification for a single one of your ideas - they are all based upon complete nonsense! Trying to spread an idea due to its 'rightness' is akin to force-feeding those you supposedly care for (and empathize with) a giant heap of feces!

Stop twisting the statistics, it said 43.5% would defend their faith not go on a violent Jihad. How many American Christians do you think would answer the same?

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

I don't know if you are aware of this, but almost every fucking philosophical view on life will not exist in someone's mind unless it is seen as superior to the other available options. Whether or not this is conditioned at first, it inevitably boils down to an individual's acceptance and enactment of ideological supremacy.

This can be seen amongsts atheists, agnostics, Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, republicans, democrats, fascists, socialists, mysoginists, existentialists, universalists, and any other philosophy.

Mental constructs are memes - for one to accept a meme, the meme must be seen as valuable, moreso than the competition, for it to implant. Once implanted, it will be propogated further if it was arrived at through a superior attitude.

Atheism that attempts to justify itself is no less annoying or worthless than evangelistic theology.

Memes are the basis of mental disorders, and their very existence is a sign of a weak spirit: If you cannot accept that your ideas are just as much shit as another's, then you are seriously insane.

There is no justification for a single one of your ideas - they are all based upon complete nonsense! Trying to spread an idea due to its 'rightness' is akin to force-feeding those you supposedly care for (and empathize with) a giant heap of feces!



yeah, but you forget... Whoever doesnt want to go to war, is GAY.

quote:Originally posted by Hexadecimal:

I don't know if you are aware of this, but almost every fucking philosophical view on life will not exist in someone's mind unless it is seen as superior to the other available options. Whether or not this is conditioned at first, it inevitably boils down to an individual's acceptance and enactment of ideological supremacy.

This can be seen amongsts atheists, agnostics, Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, republicans, democrats, fascists, socialists, mysoginists, existentialists, universalists, and any other philosophy.

Mental constructs are memes - for one to accept a meme, the meme must be seen as valuable, moreso than the competition, for it to implant. Once implanted, it will be propogated further if it was arrived at through a superior attitude.

Atheism that attempts to justify itself is no less annoying or worthless than evangelistic theology.

Memes are the basis of mental disorders, and their very existence is a sign of a weak spirit: If you cannot accept that your ideas are just as much shit as another's, then you are seriously insane.

There is no justification for a single one of your ideas - they are all based upon complete nonsense! Trying to spread an idea due to its 'rightness' is akin to force-feeding those you supposedly care for (and empathize with) a giant heap of feces!





Of course I'm aware, but are you aware how Islam obsessively tries to asserts its own Supremacy? Can you find an example in any other Philosophy that states believers of other Philosophies being equal to a pig, a dog, feces, semen, urine? I dare you to look up what is Pak and what is Naji, and you'll what Islam defines as "Najis". Look at Islamic Shariah, how it in court the testimony of a Christian is less that of a Muslim, a Hindu even less that of a Christian. No other philosophy even attempts to assert itself in such a supremacists manner.

so we should see 50% of Atheists willing to go on a Holy War? Agnostics willing to injure non-Agnostics for their beliefs? Surely with the Billions of Christians on this planet we should be able to recruit 100 Million Crusaders right?? We should be able to poll a result with 50% of Republicans wanting to kill Democrats, and vice versa? Right? There should be Existentialists Death Squads Running around killing people right?

you can view your particular philosophy as better than anothers, but you can't enforce it with the sword. Which Islam openly does, and supports this ideologically. Other Philosophies doesn't have text hard wired in there to kill or maim someone who doesn't believe in what they are teaching, the case is not the same for Islam.



I wonder what you consider to be nonsense, the idea that 100s of millions of extremists and Jihadists running around the world could possibly be influenced by their intolerant religion?

I would never claim that someone is above being influenced - this, however, is not a problem rooted in the faith of Islam, but a problem rooted in individuals that choose to take an idea so serious that they are willing to kill over it.

Stereotyping is complete bullshit: Let's say some 600 million Muslims in the world are willing to go to Holy War. Providing that the Quran doesn't entirely promote peace, you're still off if you claim the religion is violent. The religion, in fundamental extremism, is a tool of Mid-East government and organizations to rally together those that are willing to fight the developed nations of the world.

This willingness to fight does not come from Islam - it comes from opression, sanctions, and a multitude of other bullshit systems working inside and outside the nations of the Mid-East. Islam is nothing but a unifying tool to direct these willing men and women into a war that's promised to relieve the people of the West's methods. Still though, it is not Islam that is violent - it is some half billion Muslims, each deciding that there is something worth killing for, that are the basis of Mid-East violence.

And on your paragraph about other faiths and their murderous tendancies: Take a look at these philosophical groups in povert nations where oppression exists at the hands of the local government and the world governments - it is here that you have the recipe for violence, and here that you have violence regardless of the local beliefs.

The faith is not the problem.

quote:Originally posted by Rawk:

Stop twisting the statistics, it said 43.5% would defend their faith not go on a violent Jihad. How many American Christians do you think would answer the same?

This man speaks the truth. Listen up Jeebus Mic and stop letting yourself get sucked into the neo-cons anti Islam propoganda. The same thing happened in the cold war with Communism. We fear the enemy. Thus we fear their ideologys. Well ignoring the positive asspects because we can't see them or choose not to. Communism though flawed in action is a philosophy for a system that is essentialy benifitial to everyone in ideology. In action it ussualy didn't work so. But with Islam it's a faith. YOU think muslims are all extremists. This is where YOU are buying into the media and falling into the new red fear hype. Just take a breather. Talk to an actual moderate Muslim and educate yourself. Oh and turn the fucking t.v off.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

This man speaks the truth. Listen up Jeebus Mic and stop letting yourself get sucked into the neo-cons anti Islam propoganda. The same thing happened in the cold war with Communism. We fear the enemy. Thus we fear their ideologys. Well ignoring the positive asspects because we can't see them or choose not to. Communism though flawed in action is a philosophy for a system that is essentialy benifitial to everyone in ideology. In action it ussualy didn't work so. But with Islam it's a faith. YOU think muslims are all extremists. This is where YOU are buying into the media and falling into the new red fear hype. Just take a breather. Talk to an actual moderate Muslim and educate yourself. Oh and turn the fucking t.v off.



Stop being a fool. I don't think all muslims are extremists, and do not get information from the media. Islam itself has a problem in that its inherently triumphalistic, Muslims have a problem in that they refuse to be content with their belief the world will be muslim.

You have obviously not looked any deeper than what you already believe. You have no knowledge of the subject except not all muslims are terrorists and Christians did it too. Both true, but pretty much useless, congratulations.

Lol. "bu... bu...BUT ItS onLY tEH MinORITY!"

Give me a fucking break. Like I keep saying, although it is a minority COMMITTING the violent acts, it is NOT a minority which supports the radical ideology. People are ignorant tards who ignore this simple fact.

quote:Originally posted by Jeebus Mic:



You have obviously not looked any deeper than what you already believe. You have no knowledge of the subject except not all muslims are terrorists and Christians did it too. Both true, but pretty much useless, congratulations.



I'm constantly learning on the subject and looking deeper but your not giving me anything to work with. Your ideals are wrong and people with common sense generaly disregard them. Islam is not the same as Nazism or Communism. But we treat it as such. Based on our inherent nature to attack the ideas and ideals of those who we are fighting. This has exsisted in war forever. On both sides.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

I'm constantly learning on the subject and looking deeper but your not giving me anything to work with. Your ideals are wrong and people with common sense generaly disregard them. Islam is not the same as Nazism or Communism. But we treat it as such. Based on our inherent nature to attack the ideas and ideals of those who we are fighting. This has exsisted in war forever. On both sides.



hence why in that part of the world, over 1 million christians were killed by islamic fundimentalists.

because they are respectful of other peoples beliefs.

I'm more concerned about the Evangelicals in the United States. They pray for a nuclear WW3 because they believe there country will come out on top. And they have ties throughout the US government. Bush himself calls up that teg haggert fucker everyday.

The jihadest are dangerous, but there waging war from the bottom, Where the evangelicals are waging war from say 80% to the top

quote:Originally posted by Jeebus Mic:



hence why in that part of the world, over 1 million christians were killed by islamic fundimentalists.



Shit happens.

Sorry, but those numbers don't seem very realistic to me. I think their survey (only 1200 people from 200 mil) is skewed. (The Jakata post is very much like a tabloid)

I don't know if you realise, but of the 85% of Indonesians that are counted as Muslims, it is estimated about 40-50% of those are considered 'Kartu Islam' - people who have Islam registered as their religion because they are of a small religious minority, apathetic, agnostic or atheist and have to put down something. (Only six religions are recognised in Indonesia)

Which means the figure of 43.5% must mean almost every halfway devote Muslim that the country has carries agenda against non Muslims. (Which I have trouble believing - the majority of Muslims in Indonesia are known to be far less austere than those in the Middle East) And if that many people really were ready to take down non Islamic groups, we would've seen a hell of a lot more violence than we already have.



[This message has been edited by flatplat (edited 12-23-2006).]

Shut up, Jeebus.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

Neo-cons!

orly?

I fucking hate you. Only tools use that word seriously.

I'm still hoping your post was satire.

Neo-cons? STFU.

I'd go on a jihad

http://www.apostatesofislam.com

http://www.faithfreedom.org

http://www.apostatesofislam.com/forum/index.php

http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/index.php

http://www.faithfreedom.org/holiday/phpBB2/index.php

http://www.unitedamericancommittee.org/

http://www.activistchat.com/phpBB2/index.php

http://www.activistchat.com

http://islam-watch.org/CommunityServer/forums/default.aspx

http://islam-watch.org

http://www.masada2000.org/islam.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2829059.stm

http://www.islam-watch.org/

http://www.homestead.com/prosites-prs/

http://www.atcoalition.net/

http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/gallery/

http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/gallery/pages/6-Mein%20Kampf_jpg_jpg_jpg.htm

http://www.papillonsartpalace.com/moslem.htm

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

http://atheism.about.com/cs/islamandviolence/

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiapcf/southeast/08/17/martyr.culture/index.html

http://muslim-quotes.netfirms.com/jihad.html

http://www.domini.org/openbook/home.htm

http://www.persecution.org

http://frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=9583

http://www.danielpipes.org/

http://www.angelfire.com/hi5/kafirdomunity/action.htm

http://www.geocities.com/khola_mon/BTaliban/Bangla_Taliban_Photos.html

http://www.bwoi.cjb.net

http://www.chechentruth.cjb.net/

http://www.anti-cair-net.org/

http://www.arabsforisrael.com/pages/1/index.htm

http://www.rotter.net/israel/

http://www.geocities.com/khola_mon/Islam.html

http://www.geocities.com/milkmandan2003/TalibanOnline1.html

http://www.truthtree.com/Debating/posts/755.html

http://www.isralert.com/archives/2005/03/deceit_thy_name.php

http://www.factsandlogic.org

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d191/zakirnaik/zakicaptured.gif

http://www.prophetofdoom.net/

http://www.venusproject.com/prophet_of_doom/toc.html

http://www.venusproject.com/prophet_of_doom/quotes1.html#terrorism

http://www.pmw.org.il/

http://tinyurl.com/ydc9qj



According to these links the Quran has been changed over time.

http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-myths-koran-manuscripts.htm

http://www.al-islam.org/encyclopedia/chapter8/3.html

http://www.answering-islam.org/Quran/Text/

http://www.jodkowski.pl/re/MBright.html

http://cremesti.com/amalid/Islam/Yemeni_Ancient_Koranic_Texts.htm

---------

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=5197

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=5237

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles.php?article_id=5258

quote:Originally posted by Rawk:

How many American Christians do you think would answer the same?

more than half at least, I bet you.

quote:Originally posted by Nephtys-Ra:



I fucking hate you.



I don't like you either.

quote:Originally posted by boozehound420:

I'm more concerned about the Evangelicals in the United States. They pray for a nuclear WW3 because they believe there country will come out on top. And they have ties throughout the US government. Bush himself calls up that teg haggert fucker everyday.

The jihadest are dangerous, but there waging war from the bottom, Where the evangelicals are waging war from say 80% to the top



Why is this so prevalent amongst Liberals? They're utterly freaking out about a fictional Christian Apocalypse whilst Militant Islam is quickly trying to bring about just that. 3/4 of the World's Conflicts envolves muslims in one way or another, yet they're afraid of Evangelists??? Just insane.

quote:Originally posted by Jeebus Mic:



Why is this so prevalent amongst Liberals? They're utterly freaking out about a fictional Christian Apocalypse whilst Militant Islam is quickly trying to bring about just that. 3/4 of the World's Conflicts envolves muslims in one way or another, yet they're afraid of Evangelists??? Just insane.



STFU NOW

quote:Originally posted by ViVe CUERVO:



STFU NOW

No BITCH.



[This message has been edited by Jeebus Mic (edited 12-26-2006).]

Could you please it's annoying.

The problem with you people is you don't actually look at Islamic Ideology, Jihad is Islamic Ideology, Infidels are "Naji" things; naji meaning feces, urine, saliva of a dog, ect that's Islamic Ideology, a woman needs four pious male witnesses for a rape case, a Christian's testimony in court isn't worth as much as a Muslims, it's ok to kill an Apostate, that's the "Superior" Ideology that Islam teaches.

Who gives a shit!

Islamic hate has nothing to do with Islam itself. It has to do with governments claiming hate on the US and UN and saying that it is Allah's will that we be destroyed.