about half of my family are jehovah's witnesses. i was raised as one by my parents, but my three older brothers and one older sister have since rejected it, as have i. i have now been officially agnostic for about 2 years, after seriously doubting the religion for the past 5 or so.

i could ramble for literally hours, but i just want to ask &TOTSE what they think of J-Ho's and why?

ready

set

GO!

I just ask them ( politely ) to go away, and tell that I'm not interested. I do think they can be annoying, but if they don't actually harm me because of my beliefs ( atheist ), then why should I harm them?

I know a guy who once dropped a bucket of water on them from his bedroom window, that's just pushing it. It's only a minor discomfort that they ring my bell at nine in the morning when I'm having an off day.

Doesn't take away that I find their beliefs to be amongst the more retarded, though.

[This message has been edited by Dre Crabbe (edited 01-11-2007).]

i took the time to try and convince them how there wrong, and that made them come back once a week to talk to me. Wich resulted in me flipping out telling them to never return

I'm not a big fan of being woken up a sunday to see a load of people in suits trying to tell me my religion (jewish) is wrong.

Could you be kind enough to tell me if the all claims made in thes some what dramatized youtube video are true? Well at least the ones about Jehovah witnesses it gets kinda Jesusy at the end.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-40YmWfg9sQ&mode=related&search= http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTpotSD8ml8&mode=related&search=

My dad always used to talk to Jehovahs witnesses just becuase he was interested in learning about their religion. He would keep telling them that they had no chance of converting him, but they kept trying anyways. Dad never seemed to mind, though.

I think religion should be discovered not thrust in your face but, other than that I have nothing against them.

Kind of like June bugs--annoying but harmless if you don't swallow them.

quote:Originally posted by kurdt318:

I think religion should be discovered not thrust in your face but, other than that I have nothing against them.

They got a bunch of kids killed when the convinced them not to take or denied them blood transfusions.

Have anything else against them now?

Had family who were JW's but they were not in your face about it and hardly ever went to church, however have also had lots of them knocking on the door over the years and once bought a car from one and found a form under the seat. The form was a record of the person/household they visited with details such as names etc, so that explained why some of them knew my name even though I had never met that one before!

I found it pointless to discuss anything with them as they were extremely dogmatic and set in their beliefs, they do not listen to any other points of view, their only purpose in visiting is to gain new converts. Went thru a period of just ignoring them and then other members of my family became involved when they excommunicated one of their friends, a young gay guy.

Decided the best approach could be the one that worked on the Mormons, that is discover a glaring contradiction in their teachings and ask them to explain it. In the case of the mormons they were stumped and left promising to consult their 'elders' and return with an answer, they never did!

For the JW's I had to get one of their bibles as they do not recognise any other. After some reading I found the contradiction(all too easy!) and presented that next time they called. This particular JW was an older bloke in mid 70's who had been a jdub since 16yrs old. These guys study constantly and you would think after so long he would know all there was to know about his bible and religion, after all he was at my door to teach me! But he was dumbfounded by the contradiction and absolutely unable to resolve it, stating that he had never seen it that way and saying he would consult his study group and return with an answer. Still waiting!

Peace http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

ok there are not many J hos here i live, but i see evangelists around town. when they stop, me i try to outlast their patience by talking to them about islam, buddhimsm, judaism and whatnot.

Dude my Thea and her husband turned Jehovah. I hate it now. I don't even like them being here. My cousins are still cool though.

I love Jahovah's Witnesses. My bestest best friend is one, and I'm a pagan and she knows this and is still my friend. I was all "omg!" at the accepting nature of these people.

Blows my balls. Or boobies, whatever

I used to be one, but going to church monday, wedensday, and friday, and sunday isnt fun.

quote:Originally posted by redzed:



For the JW's I had to get one of their bibles as they do not recognise any other. After some reading I found the contradiction(all too easy!) and presented that next time they called. This particular JW was an older bloke in mid 70's who had been a jdub since 16yrs old. These guys study constantly and you would think after so long he would know all there was to know about his bible and religion, after all he was at my door to teach me! But he was dumbfounded by the contradiction and absolutely unable to resolve it, stating that he had never seen it that way and saying he would consult his study group and return with an answer. Still waiting!

Peace http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)



Could you explain what the contradiction was? Im pretty sure that their bible is pretty mcuh the same as most aside from the fact that they use Jehovah, instead of lord, father, etc and they don't have "thou's" and "arts".

I have a few cousins that are J.W's. I could ask them questions for anyone. Their is a documentary my cousin told me about thats going to be on PBS in a few months. knocking.org is the site, it has PBS time listing and stuff there. Check it out, its supposedly accurate as J.W as allowed them to visit their facilities and such. The trailer is here: http://tinyurl.com/2n9gjb

The first trailer is pretty interesting, its talks about the "groundwork" for american democracy (they visited supreme court like over 50 times). There is also some info. about blood there.

Also to above poster: That many times?

As for the Q777, fuck you, you ignorant fuck. It's also fucked that the government would force blood into someones body against their own will simply because she was under 16 (she was only 15) and "didn't know any better."

[This message has been edited by john_deer (edited 01-18-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by john_deer:



As for the Q777, fuck you, you ignorant fuck. It's also fucked that the government would force blood into someones body against their own will simply because she was under 16 (she was only 15) and "didn't know any better."



This is not about the government forcing people to accept blood. This is about a group that one day pulled it out of there butts that not getting blood transfusions please God. More than that they brain wash other people not to get blood transfusion. And on top of that they brain wash kids that they can not get blood transfusion. Their beliefs cut kids off of leukemia treatment. And this kids do not know better with there heads full of mumbo jumbol. Not that I like the idea of the government forcing people forcing people to accept blood but I really do not like to idea of parents filling kids minds with such.

If that dosn't sound wrong to you let me put it in perspective. It is just like convincing a child that if he drinks some poison they will wake up in a place of infinite candies and puppies.

everytime i see a JW i think of the south park episode... joseph smith dumb dumb dumb dumb

Also, please don't say that they pulled it out of their ass.Their believes only cut someone off with the most common leukemia. AS their are many treatments.

Maybe the child is too young to make his/her own decision if he beliefs he'll wake up in "la-la" land. And even if the kid is old enough to make his/her own decision, its their own beliefs.

Unless you live under a rock with no human contact you are being "brainwashed". I really do see "the parent filling the kids mind with mumbo jumbol" as not brainwashing but merely passing down beliefs. If the kid is old enough to make his/her own decision, they'll likely be looking to other sources to discover information. (EX: talking to doctor about alternatives, finding reason behind beliefs, etc.)

To Pseud0nym: Were you ever baptised? What age did you "reject" it? A few of my cousins are as is one/three remaining grandparents. I bring my grandma once a year to the memorial, just because she might stop making me food if I don't !GASP! I was thinking of starting to go again just because its been so long. (End of this month there is an assembly, I might start with that...)

[This message has been edited by john_deer (edited 01-18-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by john_deer:



Could you explain what the contradiction was? Im pretty sure that their bible is pretty mcuh the same as most aside from the fact that they use Jehovah, instead of lord, father, etc and they don't have "thou's" and "arts".



To quote Hawkeye, Au contraire http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif) consider the first verse of the Gospel of John. Here's a modern version: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God". compare with JW text: "In the beginning the Word was, and the Word was with God, and the word was a god." Note how great a difference is made by the addition of the letter a and the use of a small g god. Small difference? Compare to later verse in John 4:23-25 "God is a Spirit" compared to God is Spirit". In a survey of a dozen different modern bible translations, half held that God is a Spirit, the other half God is Spirit. That's one of the biggest hurdles in the path of biblical inerrancy, the huge difference in meaning performed by a single vowel, remembering lots of the old languages did not have vowels to begin with and .. I could go on http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif)

So the JW's say the Word, commonly identified as Jesus by 'orthodox' xians, is a little g kind of god, not the real deal big G God! Big deal http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)! Yeah well when they come knocking with a sermon, it is a big deal cause amongst other nonsense, they are saying Jesus and God/Jehovah are not the same being, they are different, more like Jesus is a prophet, he's special and all, but ... their translation reads otherwise.

You need a New World Translation to get the context/picture, but Isaiah says: "This is what Jehovah has said, the King of Israel, and the repurchaser of him, Jehovah of armies, I am the first and I am the last, and besides me there is no God." (44:6) then in Revelation 1:17-18 one reads this: I am the First and the Last, and the living one; and I became dead, but look! I am living forever and ever, .... cross referenced to Romans 5:6 which says: " For, indeed, Christ, while we were yet weak, died for ungodly men at the appointed time." which makes it abundantly clear who the JW's believe the First and the Last of the Revelation is!

How can this resolve with JW doctrine? Two "I am the First and Last"? Both Jehovah and Jesus declare themselves to be "First" and "Last". How then are they different? How can there be two Beings with a genuine claim to be the First and Last?

Best read in context, there's lots more, like Isaiah 9:6 blah blah blah the debate rages on http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif), John 14: 6-9 JW version still makes Jesus to say "he who has seen me has seen the Father" Phillipians 2:5-7 compare with Colossians 2:9, aah and 1:15, 17, 19, consider Colossians 1:27&28, also 3:14, and Hebrews 1:3-13 and if your not totally bored by then ... there's more http://www.totse.com/bbs/confused.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/confused.gif) http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

Peace http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

I have a class with Jehovah's witness. He is very depressed and doesn't hide it either. He is against partying, celebrating, meeting girls. A very boring person, but kind at heart.

There is this cute redhead and black girl that bring me the watchtower mags once a month. I keep hoping for a three way, but not yet. Ill post pics if it happens.

quote:Originally posted by El Coolio:

everytime i see a JW i think of the south park episode... joseph smith dumb dumb dumb dumb

Mormons (Latter-Day Saints now) and JW are COMPLETELY different in their religion.

quote:Originally posted by AxiD:

I have a class with Jehovah's witness. He is very depressed and doesn't hide it either. He is against partying, celebrating, meeting girls. A very boring person, but kind at heart.

OMG. is his name tarryn?

quote:Originally posted by Q777:

Could you be kind enough to tell me if the all claims made in thes some what dramatized youtube video are true? Well at least the ones about Jehovah witnesses it gets kinda Jesusy at the end.

h ttp://www. youtube.com/watch?v=-40YmWfg9sQ&mode=related&search= (http: //www.yout ube.com/wa tch?v=-40Y mWfg9sQ&mo de=related &search=) h ttp://www. youtube.com/watch?v=RTpotSD8ml8&mode=related&search= (http: //www.yout ube.com/wa tch?v=RTpo tSD8ml8&mo de=related &search=)



those videos don't really focus on jehovahs witnesses' beliefs but more about the consequences of them, mainly the bad stuff. also, i can safely say that the maker of that video is just your regular joe blow christian or catholic which means he is biased about J-Ho's. for example, the maker of the video openly criticises the thing against blood transfutions because its homicidal but if JW was the true religion then they would be completely justified in being against it, so right from the start, the maker had an anti-JW viewpoint. however, if JW is a false religion (which it is) then the maker would be justified in their calls of poiontless death. still though, it has alot of truth to it, J-Ho's are just like every other religion really, they criticise other religions but fall victim to the same fundemental flaws that they are against, mainly, hypocrisy.

this is what my mother told me about jw, and wikipedia verifies it...

JW was created because the original guy thought that over 2000 years, christianity had been diluted and misinterpretered. he therefore decided to create a fundamentalist christianity, which follows alleged 1st century christian teachings. also according to my mum, J-ho's only don't believe in full blood transfutions. this raises a point of absolute hypocrisy but i really doubt what my mum said about that is true(she is very soft on the laws-she doesn't object to birthdays and we don't even go to meetings any more). thats all i can really remember about the fundamental ideas behind JW because it's 3:30 Am right now.

JW, is actually a very peaceful religion, they don't promote war at all and all that shit. this is, i believe one of the main reasons they are able to get such large amounts of members-they attract people who need acceptence, who need to be guided and stuff like that. in that sense, the video was right-JW do 'prey' on the weak. i don't know if its just because weak people are usually the ones to turn to religion or if its because JW actually targets them. its hard to say.

in conclusion, compared to most other religions, its one of the better ones but it s is still incredibly flawed, hypocritical and still not compassionate to the right people. you could give $100 000 to charity, adopt a child and be the nicest fucking person in existence but if you are gay, or smoke weed or anything you will be disfellowshipped and publicly shunned by all other J'ho's according to standard procedure. this is all very rude, unfair nd pressuring on the person who is disfellowshipped. they are just scare tactics really. although, if after a 6 month probation period and a meeting with the elders you may be re-addmitted. to me, that seems like the idea of not calling right after a date...they make you scared and they make you come back to them begging for forgiveness in the end.

yep, that's enough of my psycho babble for now. talking about Jo Ho's just pisses me off.

quote:Originally posted by Dre Crabbe:



I know a guy who once dropped a bucket of water on them from his bedroom window, that's just pushing it. (edited 01-11-2007).]

i have a friend who is middle eastern. his dad and him support Lebanon and all that shit. his dad who is kindof insane. he's the most uptight, hypocritical person i have ever met. anyway, one of his sons was converted to jw so now he sprays water on visting jo-hos for 'brainwashing' his son. he also dances, yes dances when he sees isrealites/palestinians die on TV. he's still a nice guy, just completely unreasonable.

quote:Originally posted by Pseud0nym:



JW was created because the original guy thought that over 2000 years, christianity had been diluted and misinterpretered. he therefore decided to create a fundamentalist christianity, which follows alleged 1st century christian teachings. also according to my mum, J-ho's only don't believe in full blood transfutions.

Yea, the guy who created what was formerly called "Bible students" was i think protestent, and he saw that the religon was laced with doctrines and was very close to the political world (Which he later found was going to be destroyed by God). And you have to think that because they are slowly "purifying" christianity, they are constantly making changes in their beliefs. Now mostly minor things and quite rarly but in the 30s there was alot of change. (For example until the late twenties they used to celebrate christmas.)

As for the blood thing, they reject taking in whole blood and blood fractions (Like plasma, red/white blood cells and something else...) However, they are unclear as to if the things that make up these fractions are unacceptable, and therefore it is up to each individual christian to decide. (The things like Hemoglobin, globins, water, etc all make up blood)

I guess I am considered a "weak agnostic" but if I do pick a religion maybe one day, I'll be sure to check out J.W's again before making up my mind. They are so different than all other christians (they go in the ministry, no war, have very strong love within their religion (and outside of)).

quote:Originally posted by john_deer:

I'll be sure to check out J.W's again before making up my mind. They are so different than all other christians (they go in the ministry, no war, have very strong love within their religion (and outside of)).



From what have you formed the opinion they "have a very strong love"? Is it in the way they ostracise gays? Or indeed any one of their members who leaves? I've met ostracised ex JW's who have family members, brothers, sisters, parents, who will not speak to them, who will literally cross to the other side of the road to avoid them? I know a young gay guy who was kicked out of home at sixteen and left to fend for himself, no home, no income, still at school! How is this JW practice indicative of " very strong love within their religion (and outside of)"?

Peace http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

I remember a little while ago, a Joho family wouldn't let their dying daughter get...I think it was a bone marrow transplant. Anyway, that really bothered me. How could you be morally opposed to saving your own daughter?

If they don't bug me, I won't bug them.

Don't attack my beliefs, and your's(Jehovas, or any other) will be left intact as well. I only ask for common curtousy, but I respect what anyone believes.

Dropping buckets of water is just a bit overboard. If anything, if you see them down the road a bit, post a symbol of your religion, or lack there of on your front door. They should leave you alone, then.

My uncle got 2 jehova's witnesses to pull a tree stump out of his back yard.

I'm usually polite to them, sometimes I'll just invite them in for coffee or something, a bit of a chat, but these people are nice. They know from my mother that none of us are interested in becoming a JW, but still, when you're bored and lonely a bit of conversation is good.

[This message has been edited by EssJay (edited 01-19-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by Sick_Boy:

I remember a little while ago, a Joho family wouldn't let their dying daughter get...I think it was a bone marrow transplant. Anyway, that really bothered me. How could you be morally opposed to saving your own daughter?

This may sound like lunacy, but maybe they thought that since their daughter was a believer, she was going to Heaven, so it would be better to let her drift into Heaven than suffer here on earth a bit longer? I don't know.

Yeah, I still don't get it. I know that when I have children, I will fight fiercly for their survival, if need be. And even if I was religious (ie thought they would be going to a "better place") I would still try and save them for selfish reasons.

Edit - Some family friends lost their 20 year old daughter 2 years ago. Seeing what it's done to their family makes it incomprehensible to me why anyone would just 'let' that happen to them.

[This message has been edited by Sick_Boy (edited 01-19-2007).]

Thier stag parties are the BEST! But I got grossed out when they brought out the donkey.

quote:Originally posted by trainjustleft:

Thier stag parties are the BEST! But I got grossed out when they brought out the donkey.

wah?! 0_o