Hey athiests, religious theological believers of what ever when will you realize you dumb shits realize the you were created by aliens

Back it up, man.

You gotta elaborate.

Not post a short little

"HEY, BELIEVE THIS!!"

then expect

"Thank you."

from us

Yeah no shit. Thats how "prophets" start religions.

quote:Originally posted by Electron:

when will you realize you dumb shits realize the you were created by aliens

When evidence is presented that shows it to be more scientifically sound than evolution.

Did anyone notice that this is just pushing it back further?

Where did the aliens come from?

quote:Originally posted by Merlinman2005:

Back it up, man.

You gotta elaborate.

Not post a short little

"HEY, BELIEVE THIS!!"

then expect

"Thank you."

from us

They were created by us, of course.

naw, I dunno.

when will u goddam idiots realize the dinoroids r teh creator of univarse???

It's people like you that make solipsism such an attractive theory. I can put up with idiocy created out of nothing to entertain, but somebody independently doing this kind of thing?

quote:Originally posted by I_Like_Traffic_Lights:

It's people like you that make solipsism such an attractive theory. I can put up with idiocy created out of nothing to entertain, but somebody independently doing this kind of thing?



I'm just trying to tell myself that i didnt really say that... or this.

LOLOLOLOL

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:



I'm just trying to tell myself that i didnt really say that... or this.

LOLOLOLOL



Exactly. Morons are delightful when they're just dreams.

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:

Did anyone notice that this is just pushing it back further?

Where did the aliens come from?

Why can't we assume that they were always there? Or does only god have the privileged to have that assumption made about him?

The question of our origens will be unanswered until we find the missing link. Or whatever.

[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-14-2007).]

We are products of our own imaginations.

quote:Originally posted by Rizzo in a box:

We are products of our own imaginations.

What we experience is actually a phenomenon created via the synthetic a-priori innate concepts of our mind, such as time and space, projected upon the external world, the thing-in-itself, causing us to experience whatever it is we experience that is nothing but our mind, like a processor being fed raw information, trying to make order out of chaos. :P

Nah, I'm just messing with ya.

Or am I? ;P

We're in the matrix. Anybody here go by the name of neo?

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

We're in the matrix. Anybody here go by the name of neo?

Well actually.... http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif)

Life comes from the sun?

quote:Originally posted by Electron:

Hey athiests, religious theological believers of what ever when will you realize you dumb shits realize the you were created by aliens

Oh shit I forgot atheists don't believe in a God, so I guess that means none of them believe aliens could of created us. Your stupid, and don't know shit.

quote:Originally posted by DieSmokin:

Oh shit I forgot atheists don't believe in a God, so I guess that means none of them believe aliens could of created us. You're stupid, and don't know shit.

It's you are stupid, not "his stupid".

[This message has been edited by DrGay (edited 01-14-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by DrGay:

It's you are stupid, not "his stupid".



Hey, Electron made the same mistake in the thread title. Furthermore, he can't even stucture a sentance properly.

[This message has been edited by piewalker101 (edited 01-14-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by Electron:

Hey athiests, religious theological believers of what ever when will you realize you dumb shits realize the you were created by aliens

Ok, for the sake of argument, let us all assume we were created by aliens.

Now...

<UL TYPE=SQUARE> Why did these aliens create us? Motivation?

How did they do it?

Why did they send us here?

How did these greater alien beings come to be? Did they evolve from single cell life forms on their own planet? Or did the Alien God create them all with one vast sweep of His mighty tentacle? </UL>

Just assuming that we were the product of aliens doesn't solve anything. It just puts all the questions back a step.

[This message has been edited by flatplat (edited 01-15-2007).]

Ooooookay, lets see, where to begin....



Well kiddies, lets travel back about...ohhhh, 50,000 years ago. The world was different back then. There was much less water. Man was more developed then we believe, but also possessed a balance with nature and life which many of us today lack.

The earth was not the only thing different. So was the solar system. In the region we now call the asteroid belt, which is made mostly of ice BTW, there once existed a planet called Tiamat. Tiamat was an ocean planet, with very little to perhaps no land. It was so luminescent, reflecting the suns rays, that it was believed by early human tribes to be a second sun.

Then along came an advanced species of humanoid giants from somewhere out in space. They came in two groups, arriving in our solar system after fighting a tremendous battle. The losers, selfish and negative in nature, were being pursued by the wiser, more compassionate winners.

Around this time, Tiamat was destroyed. It could have been natural, I suppose. But thats quite a coincidence. There is some indication, that the losers arrived in the solar system early, and set up a decoy on Tiamat. Then, they fled to Earth and hid in the cracks of the Earth, under continents and beneath oceans. The following aliens destroyed the planet Tiamat, creating the asteroid belt. Large amounts of ice fell to Earth creating the first of two 'floods'.

The effects of this first flood were disastrous. Mankind was left dazed, confused, in a state of fear. The environment was destroyed, death was abundant. It was now that the aliens re-surfaced, eager to return to space.

However, before the 'good-aliens' left, they somehow got the idea the losers may have hid on earth....maybe they scanned it, maybe it was just speculation. Maybe they considered destroying earth, and perhaps our existence persuaded them not to. However, they did set up a force field, in which the aliens could not pass through. The moon is part of this field.

After discovering their predicament, these giants realized they were going to have to stay on earth until they figured a way out. They wanted someone to do the manual labor, to mine their minerals, to farm the land, to do the work. They needed some slaves.

Who better then the confused somewhat intelligent creatures already living here? We were already in such a state of shock, manipulation would be easy.

Throughout the world, small groups of the giants traveled, amazing tribal groups with their beauty, knowledge and 'magic'. These giants were Gods, who came down from the stars.

Giants began to manipulate the communities. They would choose favorite humans, probably biased on physical and mental characteristics, and would take them back to their headquarters. There, they began to genetically manipulate the chosen people, and send them back to their villages as the chosen ones of God. Political and economic systems changed from democratic to dictatorships in nature. They began to take root of our culture.

They also worked on a genetically superior slave race with some of our kidnapped ancestors. However, the first of their creations, although physically superior and smarter then their original counterparts, retained their balance and connection to nature. These people, the Sons of the Serpents, left. They went and started a community of their own.

The aliens went back to the drawing board, this time creating the Adamic race, which had access to upper brain functions cut off. Physically improved but dumbed down enough to make good slaves.

The Sons of the Serpents shared DNA with them, and viewed the Adamic race as cousins. They could not let them be used as slaves by the selfish extraterrestrials for their own selfish purposes. So, they went and freed some of them.

This pissed off the Brotherhood of the Serpent(the aliens). So, they started a nuclear war. Wrecking havoc on the ecosystem, the planet was forced into an noncyclic poleshift. The 2nd 'flood', as well as other disasters. Nobody predicted this. As a result, their was a lot of cross breeding of races and all the humanoid species around at the time. We are the result of that.

I kinda gotta go. So I'll finish up with a few quick points.

-We are still be manipulated. Everything is an outlet of manipulation.

-The next cyclic poleshift is in 6 years. Global Warming is something thats very obvious at this point, but the whole cause may be media bull to cover up that the planet is actually experiencing prepoleshift changes.

-There is, to this day, a whole lot of occult shit going around. And its all very secret.

Keep an open mind, and always question everything!!! Especially this!

edit-i also left out alotof details, but, i dont have the time.

[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 01-15-2007).]

Proof?

Let us start with skepticism.

Tiamat, even if you believe in it, was theorized to be a planet between Mars and Jupiter, but was shattered and formed Earth and the asteroid belt. At no point in time, even if you believe in tiamat, did it exist at the same time as earth.

The "giants" could not have survived on earth because of the obvious differences such as air, gravity and water. If Tiamat was covered with water then it couldn't have had such an oxygen generating mechanism as we have here. Because it was further than mars which has temperatures varying from -90C to -30C with an average of -60C, the temperature would have not allowed the water to be in any form but ice throughout this time. So, we have a planet that could not support life in any shape or form in the first place, but even if it did, the conditions are so radically different that no way would its inhabitants survive living on earth.

Because they were "giants" they wouldn't be able to function properly on earth, because only low gravity allows for giant stature. Increased gravity would have fucked up with internal organs as well as skeletal structure and bodily fluids.

If these giants lived on earth, they would have to live in a location that would supply them with all their needs, technology and space (they ARE giants right?). Such location would have already been spotted by earth's satellites. If underground, radar and magnetic, ultrasound, transversal wave or any other type of analysis would have located them already.

You cannot abduct humans, modify their DNA and then release them as fully functional beings. The same DNA is persistent throughout your body. If certain cells would have had radically different DNA (anything that causes rather noticeable change on DNA level can be considered radical) then massive cellular rejection would follow. You cannot change all the DNA in a body. That stuff is out of the comic books.

Theory-Debunked?

[This message has been edited by Lamabot (edited 01-15-2007).]

Dear Lamabot:

ZING!

Why would the 'good' aliens, who are apparently the more righteous, be pursuing the 'evil' aliens they had just defeated?

That sounds kinda mean to me.

And how does one destroy an entire planet?

Also, edit, if we were created by aliens, why do we share a common ancestry (as common genetics would suggest) as some apes?

[This message has been edited by socratic (edited 01-15-2007).]

Wow that theory is almost as far fetched as scientology.

Although I agree with him that there is ample evidence to suggest ufos exist, have existed here for thousands of years, and may have started all the "god" religions. Not that I believe it but it is worth investigating atleast.

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

Wow that theory is almost as far fetched as scientology.

Although I agree with him that there is ample evidence to suggest ufos exist, have existed here for thousands of years, and may have started all the "god" religions. Not that I believe it but it is worth investigating atleast.

No, not particularly. I'm yet to hear any substantial evidence that any form of alien technology exists on earth or has in the past.

Well granted no pieces of alien technology have been discovered yet, however sightings and ancient paintings and sculptures of ufos exist in abundance.

Especialy lately. Many profesionals have come forward, at the risk of their careers, to share their stories of ufo/uso sighting. Infact ufo/uso sightings have been seen for thousands of years especially by sailors at sea. The ominous facet of this phenomon is that all these sightings are very similar in description.

But, yes you are right, no substantial evidence has been unearthed yet (atleast that the public knows of) and sightings are merely circumstantial.



[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-15-2007).]

quote:sightings and ancient paintings and sculptures of ufos exist in abundance.

Lots of people have claimed to see angels, there's paintings of angels and sculptures of angels, but that's certainly not good enough for atheists like me, so what makes you think your claims about sightings, ancient paintings and sculptures of UFOS would be any different for people, like me, who do not believe in aliens?

quote:Ecpecialy lately many profesionals have come forward, at the risk of their careers, to share their stories of ufo/uso sighting. Infact ufo/uso sightings have been seen for thousands of years especially by sailors at see. The ominous facet of this phenomon is that all these sightings are very similar in description.

Them being professionals(in what exactly?) brings no more strength to their sightings. And yes, lots of people have seen UFOs - i.e. unidentified flying objects - and because their unidentified this leads humans, with their need to understand everything, to jump to the conclusion that it's alien spaceships.

quote:But, yes you are right, no substantial evidence has been unearthed yet (atleast that the public knows of) and sightings are merely circumstantial.

I agree entirely there.

Actually, no technology of the only kind we can comprehend, can be built upon this knowledge of the spiritual, and timeless experience of life and the creation of life on such planets like earth.

It's simply too many millions of years into the future.

So for now we'll stick with our pea shooters, our digital paintings, our electronic notebooks, and our metal birds, until we learn to not take every piece of technology we can get, and pit it against every other human but ourselves. In turn. Pitting ourselves against ourselves. Like ...retards...big fuckin' colossal, galactic retards.

quote:Hare_Geist Wrote:

Lots of people have claimed to see angels, there's paintings of angels and sculptures of angels,

Well true but the origens of "angels" are easy to explain given their humanoid figure. But what type of object in antiquity did they have to inspire ufo's?



quote:Hare_Geist Wrote:

but that's certainly not good enough for atheists like me,

Of course.

quote:Hare_Geist Wrote:so what makes you think your claims about sightings, ancient paintings and sculptures of UFOS would be any different for people, like me, who do not believe in aliens?

I didn't ask anybody to believe me. Infact I didn't state I believe in them myself, however there is reason to speculate it. Although I say a history channel program of an ancient painting of a woman in a disc-shaped object that looked exactly like a ufo. I cant seem to find it on google but if you search for ancient ufo paintings you will get quite a few results. However I cant be bothered with it, too time consuming.

quote:Hare_Geist Wrote:

Them being professionals(in what exactly?)

Oh avaition, sailing, military positions on ships, boats, aircraft, and other vessels. Pilots, navigators, sea captons, etc, all of which are required to exibit exceptional mental and physical performance to maintain their jobs. In several of the cases the object was witnessed by more than one and even spotted by ground radar.

quote:Hare_Geist Wrote:

brings no more strength to their sightings. And yes, lots of people have seen UFOs - i.e. unidentified flying objects - and because their unidentified this leads humans, with their need to understand everything, to jump to the conclusion that it's alien spaceships.

Except the people unable to identify them are experts at identifying such "unidentifiable" objects. And most of these objects performed maneuvers impossible for current technology to perform, indeed impossible for people and most structures to survive.

quote:I cant seem to find it on google but if you search for ancient ufo paintings you will get quite a few results.

I'm familiar with the paintings. Some looked like reinterpretations of religious paintings, some looked fraudulent, and some looked real.

quote:Except the people unable to identify them are experts at identifying such "unidentifiable" objects. And most of these objects performed maneuvers impossible for current technology to perform, indeed impossible for people and most structures to survive.

I'd like some sources for these experts please.

quote:Hare_Geist Wrote:

I'd like some sources for these experts please.

Japanese pilots over alaska

http://www.ufoevidence.org/topics/JALalaska.htm

(you have to scroll down a bit)

Hell this site has quite a few of them on there. Feel free to refute them if you can, if you know something I dont I will hapily listen and concede if proven wrong.

Disclaimer: I am quite sure that many such ufo sightings are real sightings as in they are not lies and are not objects made by man and of public information. The actual cause of these sightings is anyone's guess as far as I am concerned.

[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-15-2007).]

Lol@hare.

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

http://www.ufoevidence.org/topics/JALalaska.htm

Thanks for the website. I've seen before(it's been posted in Paranoid Delusions), but I'll give it another look over.

quote:Originally posted by Lamabot:

Proof?

Let us start with skepticism.

Tiamat, even if you believe in it, was theorized to be a planet between Mars and Jupiter, but was shattered and formed Earth and the asteroid belt. At no point in time, even if you believe in tiamat, did it exist at the same time as earth.

The "giants" could not have survived on earth because of the obvious differences such as air, gravity and water. If Tiamat was covered with water then it couldn't have had such an oxygen generating mechanism as we have here. Because it was further than mars which has temperatures varying from -90C to -30C with an average of -60C, the temperature would have not allowed the water to be in any form but ice throughout this time. So, we have a planet that could not support life in any shape or form in the first place, but even if it did, the conditions are so radically different that no way would its inhabitants survive living on earth.

Because they were "giants" they wouldn't be able to function properly on earth, because only low gravity allows for giant stature. Increased gravity would have fucked up with internal organs as well as skeletal structure and bodily fluids.

If these giants lived on earth, they would have to live in a location that would supply them with all their needs, technology and space (they ARE giants right?). Such location would have already been spotted by earth's satellites. If underground, radar and magnetic, ultrasound, transversal wave or any other type of analysis would have located them already.

You cannot abduct humans, modify their DNA and then release them as fully functional beings. The same DNA is persistent throughout your body. If certain cells would have had radically different DNA (anything that causes rather noticeable change on DNA level can be considered radical) then massive cellular rejection would follow. You cannot change all the DNA in a body. That stuff is out of the comic books.

Theory-Debunked?



1)i said you should question it

2)i did not say the giants were from tiamat.

3)we can't do that with DNA. we're also pretty damn dumb.

4)they were giants, but not huge. maybe 10ish feet? 8? they lived on Atlantis

and i can't prove any of it more then you can disprove it...well, i can use quote from ancient texts and recent scientific findings to back it up....but i'll wait a few hours, cause its 4:22 am and im tired

edit - 3 to a 4

[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 01-15-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by socratic:

Why would the 'good' aliens, who are apparently the more righteous, be pursuing the 'evil' aliens they had just defeated?

That sounds kinda mean to me.

And how does one destroy an entire planet?

Also, edit, if we were created by aliens, why do we share a common ancestry (as common genetics would suggest) as some apes?



i dunno, to better the universe? It might not even have happened!

I do not know how to destroy a planet.

yes, we do share an ancestor with apes. We are also related to worms...the difference between humans and worms being only about 20 000 genes. I said we were genetically altered. not created from scratch.

Why did Neanderthals, who were smarter then us, suddenly experiance a mysterious decline? They seemed to get stupider, as cro magnon man began to appear out of....no where.

I don't have much time, but I'll post more after work:

Atlantis and strange “God-Men” are mentioned in scriptures such as the Bible, the

Book of Enoch, the Ramayana, the Mahabharata, the Vedas, the Shastras, the Norse

Edda, the Zend Avesta (Persian), the Codex Chimalpopoca (Toltec), the Popul Vuh

(Mayan), the Welsh Triads, the Visuddhi Magga (Buddhist), the Annals of the Four

Masters (Irish), the Ipuwer and Ermitage Papyri (Egyptian), the Annals of Cuauhtitlan

(Mayan), and others.

Visitation of beings from outside our solar system is not as farfetched as it might seem

and is a possibility greeted by many top scientists, including Albert Einstein. Carl

Sagan personally estimated that this planet has been visited at least 5,000 times. In the

book, Mankind, Child of the Stars, the authors quote Dr. Harrison H. Brown of the

California Institute of Technology who they say:

quote:

…estimates that virtually every star in our galaxy has a planetary system, in each of which

from two or four planets might have an Earth-like environment and chemistry that encourages

our kind of life to exist. He gives the enormous figure of 100 billion stars with planets in

the Milky Way galaxy alone.

In the Bible and other scriptures, we read

about these “Fallen Angels” and their

sojourn on Earth; for in ancient days, their

arrival and activities were not concealed as

they are now.

quote:There were giants in the Earth in those days;

and also after that, when the sons of God

came in unto the daughters of men, and they

bear children to them…the mighty men which

were of old, men of renown. (Genesis, Chapter

6-8)

quote:

They come from a far country, from the end of

heaven… (Isaiah 13:3)



quote:

Who are these that fly in a cloud, as the doves

to their windows…? (Isaiah 9:8)

The Bible takes the position that the Nephilim were a malign presence and insists that

their leaders committed a great “sin” by interfering with the evolution of humankind:

quote:

And the great dragon was cast down, the old serpent, he that is called the Devil and Satan,

the deceiver of the whole world, he was cast down to Earth and his angels were cast down

with him. (Revelation)

quote:

And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the Earth, and daughters

were born unto them, that the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and

they took them wives of all that they chose. (Genesis, Chapter 6-8)

quote:

And behold a star fell from heaven…and the children of the Earth began to tremble and

quake before them and to flee from them. And again I saw how they began to gore each other

and to devour each other and the Earth began to cry aloud. (Book of Enoch)

I saw in a vision how the heavens collapsed…and when it fell to Earth I saw how the Earth

was swallowed up in a great abyss…and I lifted up my voice to cry aloud, and said “the

Earth is destroyed.” (Book of Enoch)

And in those days Noah saw the earth that it had sunk down and its destruction was nigh.

And he arose from thence and went to the end of the earth and cried aloud to his grandfather

Enoch, and Noah said bitterly, three times, ‘Hear me, Hear me, Hear me!’ And I (Enoch)

said unto him, Tell me what it is that is falling upon the earth that it is in such evil plight and

shaken…(Book of Enoch)

And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as if it were a

lamp…And the name of the star is called Wormwood; and many men died of the water,

because they were made bitter. (Rev 8:7 – 9:1)



And the fourth angel sounded and a third part of the sun was smitten and the third part of the

moon and the third part of the stars, so as the third part of them was darkened. (Rev 8:7 –

9:1)

And I beheld and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud

voice, Woe, Woe, Woe, to the inhabitants of the Earth (Rev 8:7 – 9:1)

For this they are willingly ignorant of...the world that then was, being overflowed with

water, perished. (2 Peter 3:5)

Celtic records also speak of the Deluge:

I have been in the bark of Dylan, Son of the Wave, when the waters rose as lances, falling

down from the skies, into the exposed abyss. (Book of Taliesin)

The Indians of Lake Missoula, Washington, have in their myths the following account:

One summer morning the people were startled by a rumbling and a shaking of the

Earth…Then the sun was blotted out…Terrified people ran to the hills to get away from the

pounding water…Then a rain of ashes began to fall. It fell for several weeks.

The Ute Indians relate:

The sun was shivered into a thousand fragments, which fell to Earth causing a general conflagration.

Then TA-WATS, fled before the destruction he had wrought, and as he fled, the

burning Earth consumed his feet, legs, body, hands and arms…until at last, swollen with

heat, the eyes of the god burst and tears gushed forth in a flood which spread over the Earth

and extinguished the fire.

The Navajos, Coyoteros, and Pueblos Indians have similar reports, in this vein:

Their only food was meat…for all kinds of game were closed up with them…Then the men

and animals began to come up from their caves and their coming up required several days.

The Earth was at this time very small and the light as scanty as it had been down below, for

there was as yet no heaven, nor sun, nor moon, nor stars.

From Teutonic legends:

…Earth sinks in the sea, the sun turns black, Cast down from Heaven are the hot stars,

Fumes reek, into flames burst, The sky itself is scorched with fire

quote:

Now as I looked upon the living creatures, I saw four wings upon the ground, one by each of

the living creatures, with their four faces. The appearance of the wheels and their composition

was like the color of shiny amber: and all four wings had one likeness: and their composition

was like a wheel in the middle of a wheel. (Book of Ezekiel)

Let’s consider just a few of the strange references from the pages of the Bible testaments,

and think to ourselves whether there is some other tale going on other than that

which has been expounded from the pulpit.

quote:

Then Eve looked up to heaven and saw a shining chariot come drawn by four gleaming

angels whose glory no one born of woman could express nor look on their face and angels

went before the chariot. (Book of Ezekiel)



And it came to pass that when the sun went down and it was dark behold a smoking furnace,

and a burning lamp that passed between those pieces. (Genesis 15:17)

And when the living creatures went, the wheels went by them: and when the living creatures

were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up. (Ezekiel 1:19)



Whithersoever the spirit was to go they went, thither was their spirit to go; and the wheels

were lifted up over against them: for the spirit of the living creature was in the wheels.

(Ezekiel 1:20)

...and the pillar of the cloud went from before their face, and stood behind them.

(Exodus 4:19)

...his going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is

nothing hid from the heat thereof. (Nehemiah 18:10)

And I looked and behold a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud and a fire infolding

itself and a brightness was about it and out of the midst thereof as the color of amber out

of the midst of the fire. (Ezekiel 4:5)

And it came to pass, as Moses entered into the tabernacle, the cloudy pillar descended, and

stood at the door of the tabernacle, and the Lord talked with Moses. And all the people saw

the cloudy pillar stand at the tabernacle door: and all the people rose up and worshipped,

every man in his tent door. (Exodus 33:9)



Then they willingly received him into the ship: and immediately the ship was at the land

whither they went. (John 6: 21)



And from the ancient Aryans and Hindus we have:

quote:

He boarded the aerial vehicle with Khara which was decorated with jewels and the faces of

demons and it moved with noise resembling the sonorous clouds.



So Ravana and Maricha boarded the aerial vehicle resembling a palace (Vimana) from that

hermitage.



Then the demoness brought the Puspaka aerial vehicle and placed Sita on it by bringing her

from the Ashoka forest and she was made to see the battle field with Trijata.

This aerial vehicle marked with Swan soared into the sky with loud noise.

An aerial chariot, the Pushpaka, conveys many people to the capital of Ayodhya. The sky is

full of stupendous flying-machines, dark as night, but picked out by lights with a yellowish

glare. (Mahavira of Bhavabhuti, an 8th Century Jain text, speaking of earlier records)



Now Vata’s chariot’s greatness! Breaking goes it, And Thunderous is its noise, To heaven it

touches, Makes light lurid [a red fiery glare], and whirls dust upon the earth.

The airplane occupied by Salva was very mysterious. It was so extraordinary that sometimes

many airplanes would appear to be in the sky, and sometimes there were apparently none.

Sometimes the plane was visible and sometimes not visible, and the warriors of the Yadu

dynasty were puzzled about the whereabouts of the peculiar airplane. Sometimes they would

see the airplane on the ground, sometimes flying in the sky, sometimes resting on the peak of

a hill and sometimes floating on the water. The wonderful airplane flew in the sky like a

whirling firebrand - it was not steady even for a moment. (The Mahabharata)

The head of Sanskrit at the University of Madras, Dr. V. Raghavan, writes:

quote:

Fifty years of researching this ancient works convinces me that there are livings beings on

other planets, and that they visited earth as far back as 4,000 B.C…There is a just a mass of

fascinating information about flying machines, even fantastic science fiction weapons, that

can be found in translations of the Vedas, Indian epics, and other ancient Sanskrit texts.

Theres lots more to add, and i wanted to bold some of the important things, but i dont have the time. This was all taken out of a book by micheal tsarion by the way, so some of it may not look typed right. It was just copied, quoted, and thrown in.

I hope it makes more sense.

quote:Originally posted by xtreem5150ahm:

Did anyone notice that this is just pushing it back further?

Where did the aliens come from?

Most thought-provoking post on this thread ^

Skyhooks! Crains!

your right we are from the stars.

actualy every single atom in the universe is from the stars

And where are the stars from?

Giants = nephilim = the fallen ones, right?

Supposedly.

Supposedly ...according to some very questionable sources...they fell on purpose, to rape and mix their genetics with our race, to put us all on this hellish path towards a horribly fractured consciousness/ego/self-awareness, so that we may gain greatly from the lessons.

I think this post belongs more in PD with my post on how to make your tin foil hats.

quote:Originally posted by Rizzo in a box:

Giants = nephilim = the fallen ones, right?

It's been awhile since I've read Genesis, but, if my memory serves me well, which I doubt it will, weren't the Nephilim merely angels who found woman attractive and so began, well, fucking them?

I don't think there's any mention of them being fallen angels, but, as I have hinted at, I have a terrible memory.

Oh no, my bad. I just looked it up and found out that the Nephilim were the outcome of the Sons of God having children with humans.

This leads me to a question though: did God have more sons than just Jesus?

I am God's illegitamate son.



No lie.

quote:

Thirty-six underground cities have been discovered in Cappadocia so far and some are huge

complexes going down eight levels. The ventilation systems are so efficient that even eight

floors down the air is still fresh. Thirty vast underground cities and tunnel complexes have

also been found near Derinkuya in Turkey.

Scholar and researcher, J. J. Hurtak declares:

quote:

In our research in Africa, the Far East and the mountains of South America, we have come

across statuary of very grotesque beings, who according to the Indian and Shamanistic tradition, went into the Earth at the time of a great cataclysm. . .

The Apache Indians tell stories of tunnels between their lands and the city of Tiahuanaco and claim that their ancestors traveled for years by this route. The Indian chiefs also assured that the tunnels were

quote:

...carved out by rays that destroy the living rock.

And that their creators were:

quote:

...beings who live near the stars. (From Uriel’s Machine by Christopher Knight and Robert

Lomas)

One of the ways in which they sought to accomplish their goal involved biogenetic

interference with and alteration of the indigenous Earth inhabitants. Such a practice

was known to be a cardinal sin, and so, originally, normal sexual intercourse was

attempted with unsatisfactory results:

quote:

And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the Earth, and daughters

were born unto them, that the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and

they took them wives of all that they chose. (Genesis 6-8)

quote:

And the daughters of Cain with whom the angels had companied conceived, but they were

unable to bring forth their children, and they died. And of the children who were in their

wombs some died, and some came forth, having split open the bellies of their mothers they

came forth by their navels. (The Ethiopian Kebra Nagast)

Authors Max H. Flint and Otto O. Binder wrote in their book, Mankind, Child of the

Stars:

quote:

Cro-Magnon Man appeared with a mysteriously improved skeletal characteristics and with

a cranial capacity that is amazingly in excess by 100 cubic centimeters of that of modern man…A similarly large degree of brain expansion occurred in absolutely no other species on Earth in all the ages of the past, not has any genus shown evidence of brain mutation of a comparable magnitude since antiquity.

The monarchies of any age have been responsible for atrocious crimes. And yet, the monarchs themselves claim rulership by “Divine Right.” James VI of Scotland became

James I of England and was the main proponent of this. The origins of the sanctity of kings

goes back to pre-diluvian times, however.

quote:

The state of monarchy is the most supreme thing upon earth, for kings are not only God's lieutenants upon earth, and sit upon god's throne, but even by God himself are called gods...and so their power after a certain relation compared to divine power...for if you will consider the attributes to God, you shall see how they agree in the person of a king...to dispute

what God does is blasphemy...so it is sedition in subjects to dispute what a king may do in the height of his power. I would not have you meddle with such ancient rights of mine as I have received from my predecessors... James VI (King of Scotland and England).

Many scholars have pondered why it is that certain ancient cultures like the Sumerian, Indo-Aryan and Egyptian have alphabets, mathematical concepts, and symbolic cosmologies, all just appearing fully formed without record of the normal antecedent and cumulatory stratifications that must attend these achievements. Here are some examples of the quandaries that beset the scholars and

academes. Sir Leonard Woolley in his Ur of the Chaldees wrote:

quote:

There is nothing to show to what race the first inhabitants of Mesopotamia belonged…At a date which we cannot fix, people of a new race made their way into the valley, coming

whence we do not know…

And Professor W. B. Emery wrote in his Archaic Egypt the following:

quote:

At approximately 3400 years BC a great change took place in Egypt and the country passed

rapidly from a state of advanced Neolithic culture…to two well organized monarchies…at

the same time writing appears. Monumental architecture and the arts and crafts developed to an astonishing degree…there appears to be little or no background to these fundamental developments…

In Colin Renfrew’s Before Civilization, the following passage:

quote:

Archaeologists all over the world have realized that much of prehistory as written in the existing textbooks, is inadequate, some of it quite simply wrong…It has been suggested…that the changes now at work in prehistory herald the shift to a ‘new paradigm,’…made necessary by the collapse of the first paradigm…

In Our Haunted Planet by John

Keel, we read:

quote:

According to the traditions of many isolated peoples, the first great emperors in Asia were god-kings who came down from the sky, displayed amazing superhuman abilities, and took over. There was a veritable worldwide epidemic of these god-kings between 5,000 and 1,000 BC…

In the Apocalyptic Fragment of Clement, we

read:

quote:

And on Earth shall be monsters, a generation of dragons of men, and likewise of serpents.

Thats all for the moment. I got stuff to do...

quote:Originally posted by Hare_Geist:

Oh no, my bad. I just looked it up and found out that the Nephilim were the outcome of the Sons of God having children with humans.

This leads me to a question though: did God have more sons than just Jesus?

There is a lot of misinformation.

quote:Originally posted by Lamabot:

Why can't we assume that they were always there? Or does only god have the privileged to have that assumption made about him?

Hi Lamabot,

If they exist and if they have existed forever, they would be "gods".

It's restating the question that comes up over and over, in Totse (well, not exclusively Totse) is, "If God Created, who created God".... to which the flip-side of the same question would be, "what was before the big bang (iow, where did the energy come from and what "caused" it to eventually "bang" ".

Someone or something had to have existed forever.... but i think that it is interesting that God says in His Word that He is the Everlasting to Everlasting.



As far as aliens having created us (under the assumption that they were the uncreated), then the outworkings of that thought become the same as an atheist worldview... i.e. there is no ultimate meaning to life. (this goes the same for any "non-personal" deity).

God Bless,

johnny

On Atlantis genetic experiments were begun on indigenous Earth humans with the equipment that was brought from the alien planet of origin:

quote:

And God said: Let us make man in our image, after our likeness…(Genesis 1:26)



The race that they subsequently created, the “Sons of the Serpents,” possessed the DNA of their alien fathers, as well as that of the indigenous Earth people, the Homo Sapiens. (In the Bible, the correct translation of “create” is “build.”) These genetically

created offspring were made to serve the needs of their creators in the “Garden of

Edinu or Eden.” They are “Homo Atlantis.”

quote:

The original pre-visitation Earth inhabitants were probably the Cro-Magnon, Engis, Homo

Erectus or Neanderthals. There could have been some other race altogether, but given the suppression of data in these subjects, it is doubtful if we will ever know the truth about our Earth ancestors. Recent findings seem to indicate that both Neanderthal and Cro-Magnon races were genetically interfered with and were the victims of hybridization.

Unluckily for the “Serpent Masters,” this first-born progeny eventually began to chafe

against their imposed servitude. Their human qualities and sensibilities were such that

they were not only lofty of intellect, but were possessed of a moral and spiritual

dimension utterly lacking in their extraterrestrial masters. As a result of this, they openly began to resist their creators whom they disliked and came to physically outnumber.

Being “naked” ultimately meant that the members of the hybrid “Adamic” servant

race would be strictly forbidden to partake of something now referred to as the “Tree

of the Knowledge of Good and Evil” or the “Tree of Life.” These were other cryptic

euphemisms for the knowledge of biology and genetics.

quote:

The DNA was always likened to a tree with 22 branches, or later, in esoteric lore, pathways. The knowledge of genetic science was symbolized by possession of a straight staff with a serpent motif. This is the reason why even today, the medical profession uses the Hermetic Caduceus. There is nothing esoteric about the term, “Tree of Good and Evil.” When it is realized that the reference is to DNA, all becomes clear. Both sides, literally, the good and the evil had knowledge of the “Tree.” Therefore, it should read as the “Tree of the Good and/or the Evil.”

Alan Alford is just one of many scientists who is open to the concept of alien intervention when accounting for the anomalies surrounding the origin and evolution of man. He writes:

quote:

Homo sapiens has acquired a modern anatomy, language capability, and a sophisticated

brain (well beyond the needs of its everyday existence) apparently in defiance of the laws of Darwinism. There are a number of possible explanations for this anomaly. One is that mankind evolved in the sea, and that crucial fossil evidence is thus missing. Another is that Darwinian theory itself has a missing link. And a third explanation is that the genes for modern man were suddenly implanted by an intelligent extraterrestrial species who colonized the Earth.

Researcher Laurence Gardner puts it this way:

quote:

It took man over a million years to progress from using stones as he found them to the realization that they could be chipped and flaked to better purpose. It then took another 500,000 years before Neanderthal man mastered the concept of stone tools, and a further 50,000 years before crops were cultivated and metallurgy was discovered. Hence, by all scales of evolutionary reckoning, we should still be far removed from any basic understanding of mathematics, engineering or science – but here we are, only 7,000 years later, landing probes on Mars…So, how did we inherit wisdom, and from whom?

They (Max H. Flint, Otto O. Binder, Alfred Wallace, Laurence Gardner) draw our attention to 35,000 years BC to the specific transition from the species of Neanderthals who were not our ancestors to Cro-Magnon who are believed to be. They write:

quote:

And the greatest riddle of all comes up – where did Cro-Magnon Man, the first of our own Homo sapiens species, come from 35,000 years ago?

The disappearance of Neanderthal Man and the advent of Cro-Magnon Man at approximately the same time is one of the truly big stumbling blocks to the Evolution theory, for they are non-sequitur species. Neanderthal most decidedly could not be the direct ancestor of Cro-Magnon, for they were two distinctly different types of human, physically and even skeletally.

Had a big brain, but small mental capacity. Was a mass of muscle. Was replaced suddenly by Cro-Magnon, who was a completely separate species.

…Neanderthal most decidedly could not be the direct ancestor of Cro-Magnon, for they were two distinctly different types of human, physically and even skeletally.

Neanderthal Man endured both cold and mild cycles with apparently equal success. He continued to exist in western Europe right up to about 35,000 years ago, and then he abruptly disappeared. The evolutionary tendencies that he exhibited during this period are extremely puzzling. For he seems to have gotten more “primitive,” not less so.



Classical Evolution theory simply cannot account for these two events. First, the abrupt disappearance of a whole well-entrenched species, plus the abrupt debut of a better species. Second, the fact that the Neanderthal species retrogressed and became more primitive as time went on. Natural selection and survival-of-the-fittest are square pegs that cannot be hammered into those round holes…

The following passage reveals the wrath of the Atlanteans, not only toward their “first born,” but also toward the Eves:

quote:

Because thou hast done this, though art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shall you eat all the days of thy life.

(Genesis 3:14)



In Eve’s scene at the tree…nothing is said to indicate that the serpent who appeared and

spoke to her was a deity in his own right, who had been revered in the Levant for at least seven thousand years before the composition of the Book of Genesis.

(Joseph Campbell, Occidental Mythology)



The appellation Satan, in Hebrew…belongs by right to the first and cruelest “Adversary” of all other Gods–Jehovah, not in the serpent which spoke only words of sympathy and wisdom.

(Madame Helena Petrovna Blavatsky)



Woman have always been marginalized and degraded in post-diluvian times, because of

their allegiance to the “First Born.” The Book of Genesis reveals the intense hatred that the Bent Ones have toward the female. The tyrannies which have been perpetrated against womankind through all the centuries, though disguised as a male versus female problem, are certainly not at all confined to this, which is why very little is changing. The gender problem and dichotomy are but a carefully crafted manifestation of a greater malevolence, an all pervasive ancient loathing for Earth’s original inhabitants. Once we approach the problem from its root, we will see progress. When we look back across the historical time of patriarchy…there seems to be some terrible

inevitability, a relentless desire to crush the female essence, human and divine. The question of why is one of the most puzzling of our time…

(Leonard Schlain, The Alphabet and the Goddess)

And, just for fun, I'll throw in something from the research section of the book:

Ancient Skeletons Expand Man's Past

By Robert S. Boyd (Knight Ridder Newspapers)

quote:

An astonishing number of previously unknown relatives are turning up in the human family scrapbook, as archaeologists dig up the remains of long-lost great-great-uncles and aunts who once shared our planet. The fossils of three more ancient ancestors were reported this year. Scientists have now identified

at least 17 prehuman species that once walked on Earth. The skulls and bones of more than 5,000 archaic individuals have been found, some dating more than 5 million years, according to Rick Potts, director of the Human Origins Program at the Smithsonian Institution.

The latest find, reported earlier this month, appears to introduce the earliest members of our family tree yet discovered — a colony of 5.5 million-year-old forest dwellers living in what is now Ethiopia. Their remains share features common to both apes and humans. Thanks to the rapid pace of discovery, the

number of known or suspected human ancestors has almost doubled since the 1980s. Experts have been forced to rewrite their textbooks and encyclopedias.



A Tangled Family tree



The old idea of a straight line of evolution leading steadily upward from apes to shaggy cavemen to clean-shaven Wall Street brokers has been abandoned.

“Our evolutionary history now looks more like a tangled bush than a simple tree,” Leslie Aiello, an anthropologist at University College, London, wrote in the journal Nature.

Some of these vanished species were “immensely successful,” Potts reports in his book, “Humanity's Descent.” One line, called Homo erectus, survived for almost 2 million years — at least 10 times longer than modern humans have been around. But all except our own species, Homo sapiens, turned out to be

evolutionary dead ends. In the struggle for survival, our own forebears out-competed, out-thought and possibly slaughtered less versatile, less intelligent rival species.

The last of our ancient cousins, the lumbering Neanderthals, coexisted with Homo sapiens in Europe and the Near East until about 25,000 years ago. They may even have mated with our forebears. Homo erectus survived until about 50,000 years ago, overlapping with both Neanderthals and early Homo sapiens.



In the latest version of the story of human origins, we are members of a large family called “hominids,” which arose in Africa and included apes and humans. The apes and our ancestors parted ways about 6 million years ago. Our branch of the hominids eventually split into various subfamilies, tribes, genera and species. A species is a collection of creatures that can breed with one another. A genus is a closely related group of species. A tribe is a group of genera (the plural of “genus”). At last count, there were

three tribes, five genera and 18 species assigned to the hominid family, including six extinct species of the genus Homo and us.



The Adaptability Factor





Anthropologists don't all agree on the details of these classifications, but the general outline is broadly accepted. Orangutans, gorillas, chimpanzees and humans are the only survivors of these multiple evolutionary experiments. The question, said Potts, is “What allowed some hominids to endure while others died out?” Part of the answer is that Homo sapiens was better able than more specialized species to adapt to the rapidly changing climate of its homeland in Africa between 200,000 and 100,000 years ago,

when what had been a warm, moist environment turned cold and dry.

“If a species is tied to a given setting, it can be annihilated if the setting changes,” William Schopf, director of the Center for the Study of Evolution and the Origin of Life at the University of California, Los Angeles, wrote in his book, “Cradle of Life.” In addition to its adaptability, the ability of Homo sapiens to use language was the key new behavior that let our ancestors prevail over their rivals, according to Ian Tattersall, curator of anthropology at the American Museum of Natural History in New York. Speech enabled our forebears to communicate and cooperate more effectively to hunt prey, escape predators and pass on skills to the next generation.

Pre-Modern Homo Sapiens



The Jinniushan cranium found in 1985 by a student excavation team from Peking University under the direction of Prof. Lu Zun'e, is one of the more recent fossil human specimens discovered in China. The cranium was directly associated with a partial skeleton, including a complete pelvis, portions of the spinal column, and nearly complete hand and foot bones. The remains were recovered from a collapsed limestone cave in Yingkou county, Liaoning. The human bearing deposits have been dated to approximately 250-280,000 years ago. The Jinniushan cranium shows certain derived features that ally it to early forms of H. sapiens. These traits include a cranial capacity within the range of modern people, thin vault bones, an expansion of the parietal region, a more gracile cranial base and a more rounded occipital bone, posteriorly. In other respects it shares features with H. erectus such as projecting brow ridges, low cranial height and an elongate, strongly buttressed cranial vault.

In this oblique view many of the salient features of the Jinniushan cranium discussed above can be clearly seen. This cranium, as well as those from Dali and Maba to be discussed below display derived traits generally associated with H. sapiens yet are definitely more archaic looking than early modern humans. They may best be characterized as pre-modern forms of H. sapiens. Such “pre-modern” human specimens have only recently come to light in China. The presence of these transitional forms in China during the Late Middle through Early Late Pleistocene has been used to support the argument for local evolutionary continuity in China between H. erectus and modern humans.

The Dali specimen from Shaanxi, is dated to approximately 180,000 YA. It is similar in many ways to Jinniushan and represents a pre-modern form of H. sapiens. Its cranial capacity is intermediate between earlier forms of H. erectus and later more modern forms of H. sapiens, although it overlaps the range of variation seen in both. Dali is also intermediate in its morphological character, retaining many features associated with Asian H. erectus while evincing a number of derived features associated with modern humans such as expansion of the parietals and transformation in cranial base anatomy.

In this oblique view the long, low contour of the Dali cranial vault is readily apparent. The upper jaw has been fractured and dislocated upwards giving the cranium the appearance of having a very short face. Actually the face would be very similar in overall dimensions to the Jinniushan cranium upon reconstruction. The Dali cranium has extremely robust brow ridges. They do not, however, assume the straight bar-like character of the brow seen at Zhoukoudian and are more similar structurally to the brow

seen in archaic humans from Europe and Africa. Dali is dated to a time when Neanderthals were spread throughout much of Europe. The facial anatomy of Dali is very different from that seen in Neanderthals

and is much more similar to that seen in later, more modern looking humans not only in China but northern and eastern Africa as well. This lateral view of Dali shows the rounding of the posterior contour of the skull, differing in this respect from the “pinched” look seen in H. erectus. The base of the Dali cranium is much more modern looking than that of H. erectus. The tympanic plate is thin and foreshortened, much as in modern humans and quite distinct from the tubular form seen in H. erectus.

The Maba cranium, dated to approximately 120,000 years ago was discovered in 1958 in the southern Chinese province of Guangdong. It was the first substantial specimen of a pre-modern form of H. sapiens found in East Asia. It was initially thought to be an Asian Neanderthal but does not in fact show any

of the derived features of Neanderthals as known from Europe and the Near East. The Maba skull is similar to other more complete finds of pre-modern H. sapiens subsequently found in China, differing only in minor ways, such as the size and shape of the orbits and nasal bones. Maba is also somewhat reminiscent of the recently discovered Narmada skull from India.

Alien Skull Discovered in Bulgaria



Leyla Degirmen, UFO Roundup correspondent in the Balkans, has come across a strange story in the Turkish newspaper Milliyet, which stated that an alien skull was found last May in southern Bulgaria.

“On May 21, 2001, a villager found an unusual skull on Rodolp Mountain in Bulgaria,” somewhere near Ardino and Madan, about 200 kilometers (120 miles) south of Sofia, the national capital.



“Some scientists held a meeting in Asenovgrad. Prof. Yordan Yordanov, one of the best-known anthropologists in Europe, claimed that he had never seen a human or an animal skull like this in his life. Katya Melamet, one of the archaeologists at the Bulgarian Science Academy, has also told that she has

never seen anything like this.”



“The story of the villager is also very interesting,” Leyla writes, “He claimed that he had seen five people, with yellow metallic clothes, in his dream. They told the villager to go to the area on the 21st of May, and when he went there, he found the skull and a (small) elliptical metal object.”



“The skull is (weighs) about 250 grams and has six holes in it to (which apparently) belong to the senses. The skull also has no mouth hole.”

“This summary is from an article published in Milliyet on January 4, 2002."

Thats it, I'm tired.... http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif)

[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 01-16-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by Lamabot:

Tiamat, even if you believe in it, was theorized to be a planet between Mars and Jupiter, but was shattered and formed Earth and the asteroid belt. At no point in time, even if you believe in tiamat, did it exist at the same time as earth.

I forgot this, it bugged me.

If it didn't exist while Earth was around, how come certain ancient texts mention it?

Very interesting read Obbe!

Thankyou.

Sure, there were beliefs in aliens in Egypt, China, Babylon, and Sumer, but just because the belief is that old doesn't mean it's anymore believable than God or Zeus. Also, in ancient civilizations like Sumer, it's hard to discern Gods from aliens, because cosmology was inherently supernatural for them.

Well you just stated the whole argumnent without even realizing it, being that these archaic people had no way of understanding the technology of their (hypothetical) alien visitors so just decided they were gods and their technology was "magic."

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

Well you just stated the whole argumnent without even realizing it, being that these archaic people had no way of understanding the technology of their (hypothetical) alien visitors so just decided they were gods and their technology was "magic."

Yes, an argument impossible to prove that sounds like the result of reading H.P. Lovecraft one too many times.

A related argument is the argument that life didn't start on earth, another unsubstantiated argument that is not very likely: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panspermia

quote:No undisputed evidence has ever been published in a mainstream scientific journal to suggest that intelligent alien species have visited the Earth. The majority view in the scientific community seems to be an acceptance that the existence of intelligent life elsewhere in the Universe is at least highly probable, due to the sheer number of potential sites where life could take hold. However, the special theory of relativity holds that travel over the vast distances between stars would be limited to the speed of light, and so take such a long time that many scientists think it unlikely that such travel would be practical for life forms as we know them. Nevertheless, a small core of researchers continue to monitor the skies for signs of transmissions from other stars. The Search for Extra-Terrestrial Intelligence (SETI) project is the most popular example. Over the past century, thousands of people have reported UFO sightings in countries all over the world, but these reports have never been shown to be genuine.



[This message has been edited by Hare_Geist (edited 01-16-2007).]

quote:Hare_Geist Wrote:

However, the special theory of relativity holds that travel over the vast distances between stars would be limited to the speed of light, and so take such a long time that many scientists think it unlikely that such travel would be practical for life forms as we know them.

LOL that same theory of relativity states that matter accelerated to such a speed undergoes a much shorter rate of time elapsation, thus, in conguction with increased mass, accounts for the unbalanced energy--&gt;speed ratio caused by near-light speed, and therefor still conforms to the conservation of mass and energy law.



[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-16-2007).]

Right. And now you jump to the conclusion that there are beings in a distant planet evolved enough to create ships that go at the speed of light and can travel vast space, reaching the destination of earth, which they amazingly discovered contained life in this vast universe full of millions upon millions of lifeless planets, and were able to reach here without dying of old age first with your only evidence being some ancient texts written by people who crushed the heads of their babies to shape them like the heads of their gods!

[This message has been edited by Hare_Geist (edited 01-16-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by Hare_Geist:

and were able to reach here without dying of old age first.[/B]

Read my post above. In it I explain that if a ship can reach near light speed, yeah it could take 100's or 1000's of years to reach a distant planet but according to relativity the aliens inside would age much slower. The theory of relativity is much more than just a speed limit.

And besides I never stated I believe in it. I take it with a grain of salt just like everything else, I dont think even Obie believes in it 100%.

How much slower exactly would they age?

quote:Originally posted by Hare_Geist:

How much slower exactly would they age?

Depends on how close to the speed of light. Think of it like a spring, the faster you go the more the spring is compressed, the slower time is for you. Hypotheticly (pretend the earth, solar system, and galaxy do not move) getting in your car and driving slows down your time slightly. They once proved this by making two identical atomic clocks and flew one in a cargo plane around the earth. When the two clocks met the airborne one was behind by one second.

This is half the reason you cant break the speed of light. (using positive energy, there are hypothetical ways to use a mysteroius negative energy to perform all kinds of miracles) The other half of the reason is because your mass gradually increases as you accelerate, in the same proportion to time deceleration.

The conservation of mass and energy (CME) law prohibits any mass and/or energy from dissapearing or appearing from nowhere. They are interconvertable but that is beyond the scope of this discussion. Because of CME the idea that you cant break past the speed of light, even though you have used the amount of energy to is impossible. This is where increased mass comes into play. As your mass increases the energy used that would normally bring you past light speed is being used to increase your (or it is being converted into) mass. And due to the fact mass is increasing your time elapsation is decreasing because increased mass = slower molecules, chemicals, bodies, etc. etc. Or atleast that is my understanding of it.



To put it a better way, if you have enough energy to accelerate yourself to 2x the speed of light (in a universe with no speed limit) and use it in this universe, you would not know the difference due to time elapsation change. If you transported yourself to [b]alternate universe with no speed limit it would seem you are going just as fast in that universe with said amount of energy as it seems you are going in this universe with said speed limit.



On a side note no current propulsion system exists (in real life as well on the drawing board) that could get humans, indeed any spacecraft, anywhere close to the speed of light. For example the recent plasma propulsion system can achieve something like a max of 60,000 miles per second whereas light hits around 186,000 mps.

quote:Originally posted by Obbe:

i dunno, to better the universe? It might not even have happened!

I do not know how to destroy a planet.

yes, we do share an ancestor with apes. We are also related to worms...the difference between humans and worms being only about 20 000 genes. I said we were genetically altered. not created from scratch.

Why did Neanderthals, who were smarter then us, suddenly experiance a mysterious decline? They seemed to get stupider, as cro magnon man began to appear out of....no where.

One can't entirely alter the genetics of an organism all at once to create a new organism. Unless one can implant new DNA or alter the old DNA of every cell in their body, which is a shitload.

The various breeds of 'human' came about the same way as different breeds of any other organism, no aliens required. Here I was under the impression homo sapien sapien was the smarter, and that Neanderthals only had slight physiological differences (aside from level of intelligence), such as thicker skulls and wider hips for baby-birthing.

Neanderthals obviously didn't take well to the Ice Ages, did they?

quote:Originally posted by Rizzo in a box:

Giants = nephilim = the fallen ones, right?

Nephilim were the descendants of the Fallen, which is why they were so supernaturally powerful.

At least, that's my impression.

It's not hard to claim supernatural ancestry when one is bigger. Not to mention how ignorant and gullible the ancient peoples were.

Edit: And now that I think about it, claiming Angels to be aliens is extremely ignorant, considering the time and culture differences between the concepts of aliens and Angels.

[This message has been edited by socratic (edited 01-16-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by socratic:



One can't entirely alter the genetics of an organism all at once to create a new organism. Unless one can implant new DNA or alter the old DNA of every cell in their body, which is a shitload.

You've just reminded me of something.

Yes it is possible to change a human beings entire DNA set. Its exactly what viruses do, engineer a virus to do this without changing cell markers (the things that cause organ rejection) and you can alter a human being's dna.

But who knows what kind of affect this would have on the subject. Unlikely a plesant one.

[This message has been edited by CrazyJ32 (edited 01-16-2007).]

quote: Not to mention how intuitive and in touch with the nature of reality the ancient peoples were.

Edit: And now that I think about it, claiming Angels to be aliens is extremely logical[/B]

Fxt.

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

Originally posted by socratic:



One can't entirely alter the genetics of an organism all at once to create a new organism. Unless one can implant new DNA or alter the old DNA of every cell in their body, which is a shitload.

You've just reminded me of something.

Yes it is possible to change a human beings entire DNA set. Its exactly what viruses do, engineer a virus to do this without changing cell markers (the things that cause organ rejection) and you can alter a human being's dna.

But who knows what kind of affect this would have on the subject. Unlikely a plesant one.



No, a virus does not attack every single cell in the entire human body. It attacks one at a time, injecting it's own genetic information into the cell. Viruses don't alter genetics then disappear, they do so to reproduce and in doing so cause illnesses. Some 'super virus' that completely lacks the modus operandi of the virus did not cause humanity as we know it. Why would microscopic organisms become less complicated over time?

quote:Originally posted by ate:



Fxt.

Lawl, fulla crap.

Nope, no such thing.

quote:Originally posted by Hare_Geist:

Sure, there were beliefs in aliens in Egypt, China, Babylon, and Sumer, but just because the belief is that old doesn't mean it's anymore believable than God or Zeus. Also, in ancient civilizations like Sumer, it's hard to discern Gods from aliens, because cosmology was inherently supernatural for them.

Its not that this story appears all over the world, its that it appears in slightly different perspectives all over the world.

On its own, each religion has its stupid nonsensical points. This is a belief of what may have really happened, based on texts, and modern day discoveries.

quote:

I dont think even Obie believes in it 100%.

It is just a rough idea, and there is no way if we can tell if it happened at all close to how i wrote in the opening post. But then again, that itself is missing many details.

I have no idea what you guys are going on about the speed of light and age and what not. I think visitors would have mastered intergalactic travel, if they were thousands of years ahead, so its not an issue. Also, i think their life expectancy would have naturally been longer. (nowadays people live to be over 100, 25 used to be life expectancy.)

socratic, I wish I knew more about genetics, and that you didn't assume we know it all. But, here are a few things to consider:

-The 'aliens' were humanoid. They evolved under similar conditions as to here on Earth. maybe that means they have similar DNA.

-We can cross whales and dolphins, tigers and lions, horses and donkeys, and humans and chips would be able to mate if it wasn't for the slight but important differences in uterus conditions.

-The aliens used their DNA. If we had similar DNA, perhaps it would be very possible. Ever hear of transgenic ape experiments?

-We haven't been studying genes that long. Really, we don't know that much. Theres a whole market for 'patenting' genes right now....the maturity gene, the 'Neanderthal' gene....most of your DNA is owned by a company. And we're beginning to realize that single genes don't really affect us to the extreme we thought. Maybe it is possible.

But how do explain things like the 10,000 year old city they found off of India? Mammoths with dandelions in their mouths found in the North Pole? That ancient, eroded machine found in a ship, that uses very fine teeth and apparently was accurate at doing something with the stars.

I have to go to work, But after I'll try to post some more info. More quotes, more studies.

Try to read them people.



EDIT- Nephilim ARE the giants people...

And i have to cuddle when i get home....so you guys'll just have to wait.





[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 01-17-2007).]

This is very interesting.

For the theory, I see;

There are millions and millions of planet's, and the chances of us being alone out of millions of planets seems unlikely.

An african tribe knew things about space and stars that have only been proved recently.

Thousands of people have seen them over the years, can EVERYONE lie.

They found a ancient artifact in egypt which created 4 v of electricity.

However;

Assuming our physics are correct, then they cant travel faster than the speed of light. This would take them ages to reach earth.

Secondly, why would aliens want to control humans.

Ancient skeletons have been found with identical dna, so tampering is not showing up.

Could the aliens breath oxygen?

Where are they now?

They have not left any structures.

The aliens would not need 4v of electricity.

Why are there no oral traditions from such a HUGE event in our history.

quote:Socratic wrote:

No, a virus does not attack every single cell in the entire human body. It attacks one at a time, injecting it's own genetic information into the cell. Viruses don't alter genetics then disappear, they do so to reproduce and in doing so cause illnesses.

Some viruses change dna of certain cells. Now imagine a virus that does this to all cells without damaging them? It is a therotecial cure for certain genetic deseases I read about somewhere.

quote:Originally posted by Noobuntililearn:

Assuming our physics are correct, then they cant travel faster than the speed of light. This would take them ages to reach earth.

Secondly, why would aliens want to control humans.



And that same law of physics (relativity) states that matter ages slower the faster it is going. Refer to my above posts for a detailed explaination.

quote:Its not that this story appears all over the world, its that it appears in slightly different perspectives all over the world.

Collective unconscious, ala Jung? Just putting it out there.

Man, I'm a-freaking tired.

First, I'll try answer to some questions....just keep in mind, I don't know anything more then you do...all you're questions are just as puzzling to me.

quote:Originally posted by Noobuntililearn:



Assuming our physics are correct, then they cant travel faster than the speed of light. This would take them ages to reach earth.

Maybe CrazyJ32 has an idea...maybe they were not traveling at all too. Perhaps they were using the 6th dimension to fold through the 5th, in the same manner we constantly use the 3rd to move through the 2nd. Maybe ate's got it, they didn't come and stay here by force/need, but because they wanted to fuck with us. Maybe they are us in an alternate realities future, fucking with an alternate version of their past as part of an experiment.

So many possibilities...

quote:

Secondly, why would aliens want to control humans.

We'll, like I said before...after figuring out they were trapped here and had to stay for awhile, they wanted slaves. To mine, to harvest, and to assure they stay in luxury and comfort. At the time, our ancestors were in a fearful confused state at the wake of flood of biblical proportions. If they had the technology, the reason, the ability....why not? Why not improve upon them to make the perfect slave?

And who's DNA better to use then their own?

quote:

Ancient skeletons have been found with identical dna, so tampering is not showing up.

Sure it is. Of course same species are going to contain extremely similar DNA...but do you know how big a difference a little amount of DNA can make? There isn't very many genes separating you from a chimp you know. Maybe it only took them a couple hundred gene implants? Maybe less?

Check out the last quote in my post right above yours.

The other questions can pretty much be answered if you clearly read posted information. But like I said, I don't know anything.

quote:

Collective unconscious



Defiantly a possibility, but it still leave many questions unanswered, like the discoveries of underground cities, of ancient 'modern' technology, the unexplainable development of certain groups, 10,000 year old city, etc.

Socratic

I forgot to mention this while originally addressing you're doubts about genetic manipulation. The thing is, they didn't have to be altering all the DNA of living people, even if the could do it...thats just speculation that makes sense with what we have written in ancient texts and political setups of ancient peoples. They could have easily chosen the 'best' subjects, brought them to their HQ, used them to produce genetically modified offspring, and then sent the offspring back to the communities as kings years later. That might have even been easier, because they would have the chance to manipulate the offspring into a certain kind of 'superior' perspective, better suiting them to their purpose.

-----------------------------

Now, on with more information

-----------------------------

So, lets re-cap. Their first attempt at a slave race (named 'the Sons of the Serpents') failed because they were to smart. These people left, started a community on their own. The 2nd attempt had their upper brain functions cut off. But they were released and educated as well as possible by the Sons of the Serpents.

**note, Serpent does not indicate the aliens were reptilian, they were just called the brotherhood of the serpents back then. They did try creating a 3rd race with reptiles, but this is unimportant at the moment...

from the book...

The ire of the Atlanteans at this snubbing was so intense that they unleashed an atomic war on the “Sons of the Serpent” and their Adamic wards, now resident on Lemuria (Oceania). These latter were not unprepared, however, and being technically advanced, set up to defend themselves and retaliate against their evil adversaries on Atlantis. So, there was on Earth a nuclear war. It was an event that changed the face of Earth history. The war between the gods (the “Serpent Masters”

and the “Sons of the Serpents”) and subsequent paroxysms were recorded by almost

all the cultures of the world:

quote:

And god saw that the wickedness of man was great in the Earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. And it repented the Lord that he had made man on Earth, and it grieved Him at his heart. And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the Earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them. (Genesis 6-8).

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon: and the

dragon fought and his angels, and prevailed not…and the great dragon was cast out that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the Earth, and his angels were cast out with him. (Revelation 12:7-12)



Woe unto us! Who shall deliver us out of the land of these almighty Gods? These are the

Gods that smote the Egyptians with all manner of plagues in the wilderness. (Samuel 4:8)



…and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the Lord and by His fierce

anger. (Jeremiah 4:23)

For behold, the Lord will come with fire, and his chariots, like the whirlwind, to render his anger with fury… (Isaiah 1 6:15)



And the kings of the Earth, and the great men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every freeman, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains. And they shall go into the holes of the rocks, and into the caves of the Earth, for fear of the Lord…when he ariseth to shake terribly the Earth. (Isaiah 2)

But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which heaven shall pass away

with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the Earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. (Book of Peter)



And behold, there came a great wind from the wilderness, and smote the four corners of the

house, and it fell upon the young men and they are dead; and only I am escaped alone to tell thee. (Job 18:19)



His lightnings enlightened the world: the earth saw and trembled…The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord. (Psalms 97:4)



While reading these accounts, one may do well to reflect on the personality of the “Lord” and wonder if the activities mentioned are not those to be expected of a more human agency.

quote:

I am the Lord and there is none else. I form the light and create the darkness, I make peace and create evil, I, the Lord, do all these things. (Book of Isaiah)



He that sacrificeth to any god save unto the Lord only, he shall be utterly destroyed.

(Exodus 22:20)



By the sweat of your face will be your bread, until you return to the ground; for out of it you were taken, for dust you are and to dust you will return. (Genesis 3:17-19)



Then shall ye know that I am the LORD, when their slain men shall be among their idols

round about their altars, upon every high hill, in all the tops of the mountains, and under every green tree, and under every thick oak, the place where they did offer sweet savor to all their idols...So will I stretch out my hand upon them, and make the land desolate...and they shall know that I am the LORD. (Ezekiel 6:13-14)

Wherefore, as I live, saith the Lord God; Surely, because thou hast defiled my sanctuary with all thy detestable things, and with all thine abominations, therefore will I also diminish thee; neither shall mine eye spare, neither will I have any pity. (Ezekiel 5:11)

So will I send upon you famine and evil beasts, and they shall bereave thee: and pestilence and blood shall pass through thee; and I will bring the sword upon thee. I the Lord have spoken it. (Ezekiel 5:17)



I will include more shortly, as well as at least one research article, but i have some things to do at the moment.



[This message has been edited by Obbe (edited 01-17-2007).]

It appears, after all, that the words of Madame Helena Blavatsky, who spent her life

researching the actual origins of mankind, are more than appropriate:

quote:

The appellation Satan, in Hebrew, and adversary…belongs by right to the first and cruelest “Adversary” of all other Gods – Jehovah, not in the serpent which spoke only words of sympathy and wisdom.



Under the evil insinuations of their demon Thevetat, the Atlantis race became a nation of evil magicians…the giants and magicians and all flesh died and every man.

From Comyns Beaumont’s The Riddle of Prehistoric Britain:

quote:

…the prehistory of the Atlanteans and the race of Adam possessed peculiar similarities. The supermen of Plato’s island were drowned in a flood like the Adamites, the Giants of old time, men of renown, the men whose thoughts became wholly evil, destroyed in what is called the Flood or universal Deluge. The cause advanced for their destruction was in effect the same in both cases, they being accused of having mastered too many of the divine secrets of, as we should say, science, as the ancients named it, the gods.



The Indians of Lake Tahoe, California say:

quote:

There was a time when their tribe possessed the whole Earth and were strong and numerous,

and rich; but a day came when a people rose up stronger than they and defeated and

enslaved them. Afterward the Great Spirit sent an immense wave across the continent from the sea and this wave engulfed both the oppressors and the oppressed, all but a very small remnant.

The ancient Britons:

quote:

The profligacy of mankind had provided the great Supreme to send a pestilential wind upon the Earth. A pure poison descended, every blast was death…Presently, a tempest fire arose. It split the Earth asunder to the great deep…rain poured down from heaven, and water covered the Earth. (From Destruction of Atlantis by Ignatius Donnelly)

quote:

Bolivian records going back 5,000 years tell of the destruction of civilization in far off

times as the result of a conflict with some non-human race “whose blood was not red like ours.” The Yurucare Indians of Bolivia speak of the demon Aymasune who destroyed plants, animals, and man by causing fire to fall from heaven.

From the Norse Edda, we read:

quote:

Then saw she wade in heavy streams, men – foul murderers and perjurers, and them who

others’ wives seduce to sin, brothers slay brothers; sisters’ children shed each others blood. Hard is the world, sensual sin grows huge. These are the sword-ages, axe-ages, shields are cleft in twain, storm-ages, murder-ages - till the world falls dead...



The Norse legends tell of the “Great Winters” of Wind, Sword, and Wolf which descended upon the Earth:

quote:

The second winter is called the winter of the sword. Those of mankind left alive rob and slay one another for what is left to feed on. Brother slays brother, mighty battles occur in the world.

Their adversarial presence was termed the Midgard Serpent:

quote:

The Midgard Serpent blows so much poison that the whole sky and sea are splattered with it.



Strange flying craft bringing destruction are described:

quote:

The mighty flood frees the ship known as Naglfar, a vessel that the Giants were so long in building…Loki steers the ship of Hel with the Fenris Wolf aboard.





They also speak specifically of Ragnarok, the war between the gods:

quote:

The head of Mimir (fountain of all wisdom), counsels Odin to meet on the field of Vigrid, and to wage there such a war that the power of evil would be destroyed forever, even though his own world would be destroyed with them.

Now death is the portion of doomed men, Red with blood the buildings of gods, The sun turns black in the summer after, Winds whine…





In northern Sweden, the Laplanders preserve their accounts. Their ancient books say:

quote:

I shall reverse the world. I shall bid the rivers flow upward; I shall cause the sea to gather together itself up into a huge towering wall which I shall hurl upon your wicked Earth-children, and thus destroy them and all life.

And let us not neglect the accounts from Egypt, later bastion of the “Sons of the Serpents.” From the Egyptian Ipuwer Papyrus of 1780 BC, we read:

quote:

The land - to its whole extent confusion and terrible noise... For nine days there was no exit from the palace and no one could see the face of his fellow... Towns were destroyed by mighty tides...Upper Egypt suffered devastation...blood everywhere...pestilence throughout the country.…

The Indian philosopher Aulukya discussed in his teachings the miniature solar system within the atom, molecular construction and transformation, as well as the Theory of Relativity, more than 2800 years before Einstein. From the epic Mahabharata, we read the following astonishing passage:

quote:

It was as if the elements had been unleashed. The sun spun round. Scorched by the

incandescent heat of the weapon, the world reeled in fever. Elephants were set on fire by the heat and ran to and fro in a frenzy...water boiled, animals died, the enemy was mown down and the raging of the blaze made the trees collapse….Horses and war chariots were burnt up... Thousands of chariots were destroyed, then deep silence descended on the sea. …The corpses of the fallen were mutilated by the terrible heat so that they no longer looked like human beings. Never before have we seen such a ghastly weapon and never before have we heard of such a weapon.

When the Mahabharata was to be translated in the last half of the nineteenth century into modern languages, the descriptions of ancient warfare were generally expunged.

His Saubha clung to the sky at a league’s length...He threw at me rockets, missiles, spears, spikes, battle-axes, three-bladed javelins, flame-throwers, without pausing....The sky...seemed to hold a hundred suns, a hundred moons...and a hundred myriad stars. Neither day nor night could be made out, or the points of compass.

And again:

quote:

...This weapon was so feared that “in great distress of mind” the king had the bolt reduced to fine powder and thrown into the sea. Even with these precautions, peoples hair and fingernails fell out overnight, birds turned white and their legs became scarlet and blistered, and food went bad...

Gurkha flying in his swift and powerful Vimana hurled against the three cities of the Vrishis and Andhakas a single projectile charged with all the power of the Universe. It was the unknown weapon, the Iron Thunderbolt, a gigantic messenger of death which reduced to ashes the entire race of the Vrishnis and Andhakas… The corpses were so burned as to be unrecognizable. Their hair and nails fell out; pottery broke without apparent cause, and the birds turned white. After a few hours all foodstuffs were infected…To escape from this fire the soldiers threw themselves in streams to wash themselves and their equipment... (Protap

Chandra Roy's translation of 1889)

Thats all for now, I'm going to bed, I'll post the study later...and more quotes from ancient texts, as well as some information on areas of the world today that seem to be ancient nuclear blast sites.

quote:Originally posted by DrGay:

It's you are stupid, not "his stupid".



You understood that I meant You're, so I guess me spelling it correctly would mean absolutely nothing. Stop picking though peoples posts for grammatic errors, it just makes you look like a fool that has nothing relevant to add the the thread.

Is anyone interested with what im posting? If not i'll just stop

quote:Originally posted by Obbe:

Is anyone interested with what im posting? If not i'll just stop

edit-i think i'll put my first post in PD.