At least, not in the sense that most chauvinists mean.

That is, God does not single out or give special preference to ANY race, country, religion, gender, whatever. God created us all, loves us all equally--when Jesus said "the kingdom of God is within you", he meant everyone, not just some arbitrarily-chosen few.

In the highest reality, we are all God--that is, each of us is an individuation of the divine. Jesus hinted at this when he said "all these things I have done, ye shall do also."

What's more, the false idea that God does favor one group has done quite a bit to foster much of the mischief that has been perpetrated over the years.

Thanks to Rocky Anderson, mayor of Salt lake City, for saying "No more God-is-on-our-side religious nonsense."

so true

might wanna tell that to the few million evangelicals in your country

We are our own god, hmmm...

I just think god loves all his creations equally, whats wrong with believing that?

God is omnipotent.

God is omniscient.

God has already seen your future, and whether or not you'll be accepted into heaven.

Predestination is the next logical step.

Only those prechosen make it into heaven.

Since when was the whole spiel about "believe in me and be saved" thing get removed from the Bible?

I am a proud member of the Church of God the Utterly Indifferent.

No matter what you believe in, Jesus is the man.

quote:Originally posted by ArmsMerchant:

At least, not in the sense that most chauvinists mean.

That is, God does not single out or give special preference to ANY race, country, religion, gender, whatever. God created us all, loves us all equally--when Jesus said "the kingdom of God is within you", he meant everyone, not just some arbitrarily-chosen few.

In the highest reality, we are all God--that is, each of us is an individuation of the divine. Jesus hinted at this when he said "all these things I have done, ye shall do also."

What's more, the false idea that God does favor one group has done quite a bit to foster much of the mischief that has been perpetrated over the years.

Thanks to Rocky Anderson, mayor of Salt lake City, for saying "No more God-is-on-our-side religious nonsense."

Well if you want, God chose the Hebrew as his people, but they kept fucking up and straying away, so God went to the Gentiles (non-Jews), and sending Christ as his son to die upon a tree was the "ultimate sacrifice" which made God available to anyone and everyone, so therefore, you're correct in assuming that God isn't there for just one race (this is if we're talking of Christianity).

Mormonism (which Utah is full of), is a bit different. Until like the 70's, they were against blacks. It was partially religious and partially just so more white people would join the church. Kind of like the whole polygamy thing. They really only did that as an enticement to let more people jump on the latter-day saint bandwagon.

If we're talking about muslims, they believe that blacks and middle easterners were the main races Allah loved, but he did allow caucazoids and chinkoids to join, but if you were an infidel (i.e. Christian, Jew, Hindu) then you were to be killed on the spot (according to radical extremists).

Then you have Hinduism and Buddhism, which follows a little more in line with what you're saying. If Christianity wasn't an option, I believe I'd be a full on Buddhist becuase their religion shows true dedication.

I just choose to believe that Christianity is the way, but it's hard to think I could truly fault anyone for believing in a certain religion (except for Jehovah's Witness and Mormonism... and possibly scientology, those are all 3 fucked up ideas) because each of them have their values and morals that have good things for them. When it come down to the main religions, Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, and Hinduism, they all have their pros and cons.

Edit: The way up I broke up my stuff made no sense, so I fixed it.

[This message has been edited by Masero (edited 01-25-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by boozehound420:

might wanna tell that to the few million evangelicals in your country

And what exactly have they been doing? Any terrorism? Violent crime?

quote:Originally posted by CrazyJ32:

And what exactly have they been doing? Any terrorism? Violent crime?

Well, besides the usual fear-mongering, there was the one guy--married with kids--who got outed, had a relationship with a gay male hooker and even purchased meth from the guy.

So much for Christian "family values."

quote:Originally posted by SilentMind:

God is omnipotent.

God is omniscient.

God has already seen your future, and whether or not you'll be accepted into heaven.

Predestination is the next logical step.

Only those prechosen make it into heaven.

This argment is totally specious. It means that one can do any heinous thing one chooses to do, then cop out and deny responsibility by saying that one was "predestined" to do so.

I doubt that argument would cut much ice with a jury.

what makes you say that humans have a god and that there aren't just inept individuals in the world?

got called into work. damn.

[This message has been edited by eXo5 (edited 01-26-2007).]

You're a very smart guy, Arms. It's a shame it took me so long to realize it.

Guess its true what they say; with age comes wisdom http://www.totse.com/bbs/tongue.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/tongue.gif)

God will favor the side he chooses. He has plans of his own, and the group he wishes to win, will.

quote:Originally posted by I_am_god:

We are our own god, hmmm...



I'd class people with that belief as atheists.

Yeah we are all just Gods dream. One conciousness in everything. Our spirit is God. Our mind and body act within

Gods dream. It is all real but it is a delusion. Our mind can except that we are part of Gods dream and harmonize our body to this force surpasing the delusion mind over matter. But humans are flawed. Faith runs through us all but we attach ourselves to certain mental ideas that create barries in our concious and subconcious and in religious situtions sometimes allowing such an extreme that it causes prejudice and violence. On huge scales. Jesus was aware of this somewhere along the lines he said something similar to "make no mistake what I teach will not bring peace".

ok so if god helps those that help themselves, why do those that help themselves need gods help?

I like your point that God isn't on anyone's side.

However, I'm starting to get annoyed by everyone's own perspective's and theories on how we are god, or the universe is god, or the human spirit is god, and so on, when they try to force them on other people (like abrahim).

Erm, wait, I'm not talking about the OP here, though, I wanted to make that clear.

And I'm not saying we can't or shouldn't have our own idealogies about how we think about the world.

But please, don't redefine something as God and then think you're this profound insightful sage, and then try to force it on people. If you're just making stuff up and talking out of your ass, you're on the same level as the religious people.

Again, though, I'm only talking about people who try to make everyone else agree with their theory. I'm all for sharing unique ideas and entertaining different schools of thought, just don't be evangelical about it.

God is a personal being who is the creator of the universe and is powerful and watches over us and cares about us, but he is a particular being and a separate being from the universe.

In common terminology and definitions, I mean. I'm not saying he exists, but that's what the word means.

If you think the universe is all that matters and is the end-all be-all, then say so, but don't mix up definitions by calling it God. That makes people think atheism is a religion.

I'll admit that it can be useful to use euphemisms of God in the context of a discussion with a theist to symbolize that you think what they believe must be a personal being is just existence itself, but please, let's just try to get definitions straight so we can make a little more sense of this absurd enough world.

i wanna know how i didn't say any of the above - and i'm still not addressed?

"Both [North and South] read the same Bible, and pray to the same God; and each invokes His aid against the other. It may seem strange that any men should dare to ask a just God's assistance in wringing their bread from the sweat of other men's faces; but let us judge not that we be not judged. The prayers of both could not be answered; that of neither has been answered fully. The Almighty has His own purposes." -Abraham Lincoln

how bout god probably isn't real, and is in reality a fabrication of early rulers used to inspire a fear and sense of retribution that they could not bring, in an effort to control the masses? just a thought...

quote:Originally posted by chickenpoop:

how bout god probably isn't real, and is in reality a fabrication of early rulers used to inspire a fear and sense of retribution that they could not bring, in an effort to control the masses? just a thought...

I believe we're working under the assumption that there is a God. I am, anyway.

quote:Originally posted by chickenpoop:

how bout god probably isn't real, and is in reality a fabrication of early rulers used to inspire a fear and sense of retribution that they could not bring, in an effort to control the masses? just a thought...

I think your wrong in that rulers might have used the idea of God for their purposes they didn't actually go about creating God and religion for that purpose. God(s) and religion have been around since the time of the cavemen and has more to do with spirituality and trying to explain the world around us..

Yeah it has nothing to do with control more so to do with unity. However this can change really fast if certain leaders decide to bastardize a positive message.

quote:Originally posted by Mr. Dazed and Confused:

No matter what you believe in, Jesus is the man.

How true. Ironically, even though Jesus taught peace, love, and acceptance more people have been killed in his name than any other religion. More people need to walk the walk as opposed to only talking the talk.

quote:Originally posted by ArmsMerchant:

Well, besides the usual fear-mongering, there was the one guy--married with kids--who got outed, had a relationship with a gay male hooker and even purchased meth from the guy.

So much for Christian "family values."



Mate, I'm gobsmacked http://www.totse.com/bbs/confused.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/confused.gif) That^^^^^ says nothing about "Christian family values" and everything about your bias! How about putting some balance into it. Yes there are those who call themselves christian whose actions deny their words. Does that make them different to you and I? Does declaring oneself a christian somehow immunise one against the lures of desires, attachments and aversions? Is not the very act of becoming a christian, the admission of sins, surrender of self, acceptance of grace, admission of one's inadequacy? Is it any wonder individuals holding such thoughts are often weak?

Peace http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/smile.gif)

quote:Originally posted by nostromadu:

How true. Ironically, even though Jesus taught peace, love, and acceptance more people have been killed in his name than any other religion. More people need to walk the walk as opposed to only talking the talk.





On the other hand, he is alledged to have said "I come not to bring peace, but a sword."

This may have been a fabrication--the latest Biblical scholarship--and close analysis of the original Greek texts-- indicates that he never said "let he who is without sin cast the first stone," and the whole incident may well have been simply made up.

Personaly that quote about jesus saying his words will bring the sword my interpretations of that is that he knew in the social/political climate he was in his teachings would bring violence. We all have to remember his teachings back then were incredibly revolutionary that's why he was killed. He knew what he taught would bring violence though that in my opinion was not his goal.

i wanna know what actual responses to some of the sentences wherein, 'i am the one and only true son of god.'was stated.

he never really said he was god, it was more like he fit in to these prophacies pretty well.

quote:Originally posted by eXo5:

ok so if god helps those that help themselves, why do those that help themselves need gods help?

The first statement is a superstition, as far as I am concerned. Prayers of petition and intercession are pretty much a waste of time--God is not Santa Claus, handiong out goodies to the good little boys and girls. God neither judges, nor rewards, nor punishes. His/her/its/whatever love is unconditional, hence evenhanded.

However--God (or the universe, or the force, or the unified field of sentient and loving intelligence--same thing) gives us what we CHOOSE. If you say "I need this", the universe says "Fine--go ahead and need it." If you say "I choose this", you get it.

There are no accidents, no such thing as luck, and no coincidences--God does not make mistakes.

quote:Originally posted by ArmsMerchant:

The first statement is a superstition, as far as I am concerned. Prayers of petition and intercession are pretty much a waste of time--God is not Santa Claus, handiong out goodies to the good little boys and girls. God neither judges, nor rewards, nor punishes. His/her/its/whatever love is unconditional, hence evenhanded.

However--God (or the universe, or the force, or the unified field of sentient and loving intelligence--same thing) gives us what we CHOOSE. If you say "I need this", the universe says "Fine--go ahead and need it." If you say "I choose this", you get it.

There are no accidents, no such thing as luck, and no coincidences--God does not make mistakes.



Your opinion.

quote:Originally posted by MidnightRambler:

Your opinion.



That is my truth.

What is yours--or do you prefer to be a mere nattering nabob of negativism?