Watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZuknsnphEU

It's a homemade video of cool quotes from famous atheists. Some of them are kind of funny, and some of them will make you think a little (maybe, I don't know). Enjoy

Thanks,

THough i would've preferred just a list of them, seeing as the video had annoying music and took forever to copy them down by typing.

But i appreciate it, thanks.

I had to laugh at the video response "not so great atheist quotes"

quote:Originally posted by Blades of Hate:

Thanks,

THough i would've preferred just a list of them, seeing as the video had annoying music and took forever to copy them down by typing.

But i appreciate it, thanks.

Copy/paste?

quote:Originally posted by Lamabot:

I had to laugh at the video response "not so great atheist quotes"

The person that made it is a complete moron. Not saying because I'm atheist,but because most of those quotes are harshly true about life. It seems as though they are too "real" for the dream world most christians live in. It's also pretty funny how he used tons of quotes from former communist leaders.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the great leader of the evangelicals Ted Haggard, get pinned for fucking a gay prostitute and smoking meth? Not to mention he met with the president once a week. Not to mention tons of priests touching little boys.

hahahaha

Response from an Xian idiot trying to degrade atheism [which is like trying to kill a table]:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOY_E6nwd2g&mode=related&search=

And then a funny take on that same response, by someone intelligent:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8RP8VoWHJ8&mode=related&search=

A man commented: good luck running a soceity w/o religion even tho it has caused problems... it also creates stablity because if people thought that there was no afterlife wth not just do w/e they want it won't matter in the end... and also if you atheists wonder why christians don't like you...it's because of asshole commets like those in the vid.

Now this worries me. I'm an atheist and I don't go around maiming people. Rust is an atheist and he's a stand up guy. AngryFemme certainly doesn't act like a wacko either. So this says nothing whatsoever about atheists, but loads about the theist saying it. Evidently he'd do whatever the fuck he wanted if he didn't have a carrot waved in front of his face.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU&mode=related&search=

quote:Originally posted by glutamate antagonist:

h ttp://www. youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU&mode=related&search= (http: //www.yout ube.com/wa tch?v=fdVu cvo-kDU&mo de=related &search=)

that videos good. Aside from the celebrities, i dont give a fuck about them.

quote:Originally posted by Hare_Geist:

A man commented: good luck running a soceity w/o religion even tho it has caused problems... it also creates stablity because if people thought that there was no afterlife wth not just do w/e they want it won't matter in the end... and also if you atheists wonder why christians don't like you...it's because of asshole commets like those in the vid.

Now this worries me. I'm an atheist and I don't go around maiming people. Rust is an atheist and he's a stand up guy. AngryFemme certainly doesn't act like a wacko either. So this says nothing whatsoever about atheists, but loads about the theist saying it. Evidently he'd do whatever the fuck he wanted if he didn't have a carrot waved in front of his face.

Which just goes to show, Atheists work for a better future for humanity, even knowing they'll never be around for ever to witness the fruits of their labour.

Where has religious people are like children they only work out of fear of punishment for not doing what they're told, and the hope of being rewarded for being on their best behaviour. But if you take that away from them, they become like the school bully, because they know the teacher no longer as the authority too cane them.

quote:Originally posted by Source:

Which just goes to show, Atheists work for a better future for humanity, even knowing they'll never be around for ever to witness the fruits of their labour.

Nevermind that we practice good morals out of the kindness of our hearts without believing that we will be rewarded for it by some absentee God who is holding a dogma-initiated raffle for "Who Gets Eternal Afterlife in Paradise."

I have gained this from philosophy: that I do without being commanded what others do only from fear of the law.

quote:Originally posted by Source:

Which just goes to show, Atheists work for a better future for humanity, even knowing they'll never be around for ever to witness the fruits of their labour.

Where has religious people are like children they only work out of fear of punishment for not doing what they're told, and the hope of being rewarded for being on their best behaviour. But if you take that away from them, they become like the school bully, because they know the teacher no longer as the authority too cane them.

Atheist as an identity is negative and similar to what atheists complain about religion. If your an atheist it's pretty simple you don't believe in god. It's a catagory of people who don't follow organized religion. Taking this catagory and organizing it creating identity with it is just the same as doing so with a book of ideas. Atheism is not a way of life it's a non belief. You shouldn't make it an ideal like your comments very clearly make it out that you do.

^Yeah I agree, I would never capitalise atheism as if it's some sort of philosophy or belief. You can no more generalise atheists than you can "people who don't collect stamps".

However, religious generalisations are far more justified.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

If your an atheist it's pretty simple you don't believe in god. It's a catagory of people who don't follow organized religion.

Choosing to forgo organized religion does not an atheist make! There are tons of theists who don't follow organized religion. Should they be grouped under this categorical umbrella, too?

You are lamenting the idea that these people (atheists) are identifying themselves by their non-beliefs and, in the same sentence, defining them as "a category of people" - (another wide-reaching umbrella huddling them all together) - so you're identifying them as a group, while complaining that they identify themselves as non-believers, individually. It doesn't make any sense.

quote:Taking this catagory and organizing it creating identity with it is just the same as doing so with a book of ideas.

yango, that just isn't so. Non-believers are going to be identified as non-believers regardless if they're organized or not. As soon as they profess outloud their non-belief, they are instantly categorized as differentiating themselves from believers, both personally and publicly.

How can they not identify themselves with what they don't believe in? You make it seem as though that is illogical, when it's a given. How religious people identify themselves by harboring belief instead of non-belief is also a given, and not at all illogical.

I also think the holy texts you are referring to as "book of ideas" is understated. Ask theists if they consider their holy books "ideas", then duck when the shit hits the fan. If they felt their holy texts were nothing but "ideas", then they'd be admitting that the Bible was just full of notions and opinions. They believe it to be much, much more than that. It's called "The Word of God" and not "The Ideas of God" for a reason - to drive home the fact to those who subscribe to it that the words contained therein are NOT subject to question, NOT affected by outside opinion, and NOT up for debate.

quote: Atheism is not a way of life it's a non belief.

How can having religion be a way of life, but not having religion NOT be a way of life? Life is what you experience. Could you agree with that? If so, how can shaping your belief system and sticking to one method NOT count as a way of life?

quote:

You shouldn't make it an ideal like your comments very clearly make it out that you do.

An ideal is defined as a concept or state of affairs that is highly desirable, something to strive towards and worthy of imitation. Anyone, with any strong conviction towards something (or against something), is expressing their ideals. You just can't take the concept of non-belief and expect atheists to somehow expel it from their ideals. By definition, it is what it is.

Blah blah blah you know exactly what I meant.

Okay nevermind that comment didn't mean to be short with you AngryFemme because you arn't an idiot. I'm just sick off all these ignorant atheists who think that because they don't believe in god they are right and that anyone who disagrees is a total fool. They lable them all as moronic half wits who follow a faith because they are weak minded and blind fools. Not only that they feel the need to point out these flaws to people of faith and if the people of faith don't see the 'errors' of their religious ways they are too far gone brainwashed robots. That is exactly the complaint that atheists throw out at religious people trying to convert them. Well what makes you think a religious person wants to hear arguments against god if you as an atheist don't want to be presured into god? Atheism is not a system of life like Christianity like I said all it is is not believing in something. It's not something you push on people. Being an atheist is simple you don't believe in god and you live your life you don't try to point out the errors of religion to people of faith who don't want to hear it. Thats the same as some wacko christian on a corner handing out flyers of the 'truth' to the damned. Atheists are just people who don't believe in god it's not a movement. When it becomes a movement it's beyond atheism it is no longer a simple not believing in god it becomes an us v.s them scenario. Thats not something we need in the world.

Being an atheist also makes you part of the most mistrusted minority in the USA. The reason many skeptics speak out against faith is because of the danger that faith poses for this world. The less faith, the better this place will be. Less faith is exactly what this planet needs right now. It's all about critical thinking. These same people speak out against astrology, talking to the dead, and the rest of the utter bullshit that people believe.

If you EVER criticise someone's belief in ANYTHING, then you, yango wango, will be a hypocrite for what you have just posted.

Us skeptics, however, ENCOURAGE beliefs to be criticised (the whole point of critical thinking). That is exactly what we do, and that is why we aren't hypocrites.

wanna know how i know all that was shit? half the people that supposably said that stuff, would have been hung or killed for saying it! lol hahah you guys suck ass!

I'm sick of ignorant atheists too, yango! To be completely forthright, I am sick of ignorant people in general, beliefs notwithstanding. I'm sick of these kinds of ignorant people:

You know them. That group of people who willfully sign in and gather at a religious debate forum with the sole intent to swap ideas and lob their agendas at one another, only to feel persecuted or affronted when they knew full well that differences of opinion were guaranteed to arise.

Why do people enter religious debate forums with expectations for anything less than having other people's beliefs pressed on them, and vice-versa? If I walked away feeling depressed or antagonized every time I read about someone disagreeing or mocking my absence of faith, I would have to medicate myself! I'd probably not log in much at all.

quote: Being an atheist is simple you don't believe in god and you live your life you don't try to point out the errors of religion to people of faith who don't want to hear it. Thats the same as some wacko christian on a corner handing out flyers of the 'truth' to the damned.

No ... it's not the same at all. Not even close! A horrible comparison!

The wacko christian on the corner is infecting unsuspecting passersby with their beliefs. That is a fine example of pushing a belief on someone in a way that would justifiably result in the other person getting their feelings hurt.

Had that person walked up to that streetcorner KNOWING the religious wacko would be ready to pounce, then we'd call that person a fool for not having avoided the situation.

The same would go with the wacko atheist on the corner screaming out at the top of their lungs how utterly foolish belief in God is, ridiculing every single person of faith who walked by. THAT would be cause for admonishment, and THAT is completely stupid and irrational. (Ever see the former happen? Bet you have. Ever see the latter? Bet you haven't.)

This is a different arena, and the same rules of etiquette just do not apply. Luckily, this forum isn't just completely teeming with hateful, spiteful, ignorant people. There is discussion to be had, and lots to be learned, and plenty of awareness to be raised on both sides - but it's not always going to be pretty and candycoated, or polite.

quote: Atheists are just people who don't believe in god it's not a movement. When it becomes a movement it's beyond atheism it is no longer a simple not believing in god it becomes an us v.s them scenario. Thats not something we need in the world.

It's something we already have in this world! Us. vs. Them has been the theme for mankind pretty much since religion evolved. There are believers, there are non-believers. Two conflicting ideologies. What you're suggesting to atheists by criticizing them for "acting like convert-happy Christians" is that they sit down, shut up and be respectful of everyone else, for if we don't, we'll look like them.

Meanwhile, the religious groups get wide-open airtime, because theirs is a view that is protected by the Tolerance Clause and the Freedom of Religion blanket. All religions get that granted to them, in this modern world - but the non-religious had best not raise their voices, because they don't get the luxury of that kind of shelter. They get their hands slapped and a finger shaken at them for daring to challenge or publicly mock the faith that forever has been pushed down THEIR throats.

If the atheist claims to be less ignorant then a christian they would have no need to ever raise their voice. There is no need for an atheist to speak out tell me why would there be? Why would you feel the need to even try and change someones opinion? And I don't mean on this forum, I don't mean on the internet. I mean the general conciousness in this society. If someone believes in god and you don't your an atheist and they are a religious person. But why make it us v.s them if you feel religion has already devided. Why bother deviding more? If you feel so right why don't you just feel content that you are above all those people following blindly. What do you want the world to be non religious entirly? Well tell me what would fill the huge gap left over. Tell me how an atheist society would work. How would our spiritual being be satisfied. Religion organizes through the spirit. Romove this from society you are left with a mess and a huge gap to fill, the gap of community and unity. The spiritual experience is real we don't know scientificaly what it is but we know it exsists. What is the purpous of this phenomenon? It's not a big deal that people choose a way you don't believe in to understand what is unexplainable. We all try to understand the meaning behind things. Every person. But don't pull out some bullshit melodrama about atheists being persocuted throughout the years and finally being able to speak. You arn't persecuted. I don't see atheists being burned alive these days. Maybe you have to deal with an annoying christian here and there so fucking what they don't represent the majority and they certainly arn't hurting you. In fact Christians are helping the world right now a hell of alot more then you or me. Not all Christians but Christian people in general. There is nothing wrong with living in virtue even if it is a lie. What do you think people don't question their own faith either? It's not like these people are misguided alot of people become born again or convert later in life or change faith. It's a personal choice. These people arn't hurting anyone. Whereas atheists becoming hostile towards people of faith is a negative thing. I'm not talking about you or to you i'm talking to all atheists that choose to force in any way their opinion on people or ridicule those of faith.

Use paragraphs in the future please. I addressed many of your issues in my prevoius post.

[This message has been edited by Real.PUA (edited 03-24-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by Real.PUA:

Being an atheist also makes you part of the most mistrusted minority in the USA. The reason many skeptics speak out against faith is because of the danger that faith poses for this world. The less faith, the better this place will be. Less faith is exactly what this planet needs right now. It's all about critical thinking. These same people speak out against astrology, talking to the dead, and the rest of the utter bullshit that people believe.

If you EVER criticise someone's belief in ANYTHING, then you, yango wango, will be a hypocrite for what you have just posted.

Us skeptics, however, ENCOURAGE beliefs to be criticised (the whole point of critical thinking). That is exactly what we do, and that is why we aren't hypocrites.

Of course I will critisize beliefs I don't see how that would make me a hypocrite. All i'm saying is that atheism isn't a weapon it's nothing but a disregard for a set of beliefs. Beliefs that others follow because they have good reasons to. Just like the reasons you have for believing whatever the hell you believe in and I for what I believe.

Edit: Also to you commented on the world neading less faith but had nothing to say about how you would replace faith or adress the problem you see.

[This message has been edited by yango wango (edited 03-24-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

Well what makes you think a religious person wants to hear arguments against god if you as an atheist don't want to be presured into god?

This sums up my thoughts nicely:

http://www.ebonmusings.org/atheism/theistguide.html

There are things that a religion could do to convert me. They have simply never been accomplished.

^

Same here. I'm not convinced at all by religion. They so far havn't come close to converting me. I just don't know what it's actual purpous is for humanity. The amount of people who have had a mystical or supernatural experience is extremely high. Doesn't mean it's ghosts or aliens or God or whatever but it means its something. There is stuff going on that scientificaly can be proven it just hasn't yet because we can't make any sense out of these things. There is a spiritual part of the human brain we just havn't figured it out or what purpous it serves us. We know ghosts and the experience of viewing them exsists we just don't know what is happening when these ghosts are witnessed. People do study this stuff scientificaly.

Also I see religion doing alot of good. I see it doing alot of bad too but that doesn't mean the good is worth ignoring. I see alot of Christians trying to scientificaly discover answers about religion and I constantly see them questioning their faith. Nothing could convert them because it's what they have chosen. My mother has actually said in debates with her 'so what if all of this is a lie I believe in as long as it makes me happy, i'm part of a community of like minded people, and we are doing good (soup kitchen, etc) so what if heaven is all fake and I just rot in the ground when I die I don't really care if it's wrong in the end because I feel it's helping my life and others now'. She is a liberal christian though. Also if you talked with her you wouldn't know she was a Christian unless you asked. There are countless Christians like this alot of people just focus on the ones causing problems. Believing that they are all causing a problem is bigoted.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

If the atheist claims to be less ignorant then a christian they would have no need to ever raise their voice.

Yes, they would. They would still have the need to be recognized and they would still desire to educate others about the atheist perspective. That's called increasing awareness.

quote: There is no need for an atheist to speak out tell me why would there be?

See above ^

quote: Why would you feel the need to even try and change someones opinion? And I don't mean on this forum, I don't mean on the internet. I mean the general conciousness in this society.

An individual's consciousness can't easily be tampered with via mere suggestion by outside faculties, and this includes the rantings of an atheist. Changing someone's personal opinion is a shady and arduous task. Changing the way a society functions that promotes operating as a collective, intellectual whole versus a bunch of scattered, divided dogmatic cults is just a better direction to head for in the long run. And when I say long run, I mean well past what will ever transpire by way of awareness on this messageboard.



quote: Tell me how an atheist society would work. How would our spiritual being be satisfied.

It would work much like a theist society does now, except that there would be more understanding and tolerance than we are experiencing TODAY! Our outlooks would not have some pre-ordained grand finale that wouldn't permit us to reach our full potential in understanding one another. The only thing that would disappear would be the presence of hostility and prejudiced that is is present today. We wouldn't desire to tear down churches or mosques. We believe that is a fine place for like-minded people to gather and worship! Most atheists aren't concerned with how people spend their private time practicing spirituality. They would just prefer that it not be embedded into just about every facet affecting the decisions societies make as a whole. Freedom of Religion would still be enforced, only it would translate more to: Freedom of Individuality. Because like you said:

quote: Religion organizes through the spirit.

And I agree with that, although of course my position on the spirit is probably not similar to yours. But why bring religion into public forums, which will no doubt affect someone negatively, since we can both agree that there is absolutely NO CHANCE WHATSOEVER of everyone believing the same exact thing ... EVER! An ideal atheist world would have everyone not just recognizing this, but integrating it into their beliefs, passing it on to others, and practicing it in private.

Why incorporate religion into politics? Why teach it to our children so they grow up to learn that it's okay to feel superior to others? ...and 1,000 other more trivial things that illustrate how out of hand it all is. I would absolutely take a bullet if someone (hypothetically) held a gun up to me and said: You die, or humanity loses it's right to be spiritual. That's how strongly I feel about the rights people should have. Most atheists do not desire that people be stripped of their spirituality. They just desire that they be afforded the same kind of rights, and not have to contend with faith seeping into public society, where it impacts MANY and not SOME. They desire that private, spiritual matters be done on their own private, personal time. Not anyone else's.

quote: Romove this from society you are left with a mess and a huge gap to fill, the gap of community and unity.

The same global community that Islam and Judaism shares? Pardon me for screaming, but WHAT UNITY?! Did you mean to just not consider Islam and Judaism and perhaps just focus on the less motivated Christians and Catholics? What about the dozens of other strains that all have differences of beliefs, all have the right to express them freely and openly, and who have been at each other's throats for centuries?

There is such a wide gap already, don't you see? Where we stand right now, the concept of "community unity" is a real knee-slapper.

quote: We all try to understand the meaning behind things. Every person

C'mon, now! Every person? Some, more than others. Some feel they already have all the answers, because when in doubt, or in light of promising exploration of meaning, they don't even need to look any further. It's smarter to them to just become so prejudiced that their faith is the CORRECT faith, that they need not do humanity any favors by agreeing to possibly consider someone else's point of view! Consider the chokehold that unquestioned faith contributes to the statement of "try to understand the meaning behind things". Now consider if it was commonplace for people to observe, analyze, discuss, refute, question, doubt ... in a non-heated, non-prejudiced way that didn't promote violence whenever it got down to the nut-cutting.

quote: But don't pull out some bullshit melodrama about atheists being persocuted throughout the years and finally being able to speak. You arn't persecuted. I don't see atheists being burned alive these days.

Boy, those ungrateful, lucky atheists! They should be more humble, huh? In fact, they'd better watch their step and shut their mouths lest the terror be thrust on them again when history repeats itself ... when this already volatile situation of Religion A -versus- Religion B comes tumbling down on their unbelieving selves! Why, they should consider themselves lucky that the world religions don't all join together in this big ferocious coup and put unbelievers in their place! http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

quote: Maybe you have to deal with an annoying christian here and there so fucking what they don't represent the majority and they certainly arn't hurting you.

Remember - it's atheists versus all believers, not just Christians. You are still of the mindset that atheists are merely "annoyed" by Christians and cannot be capable of feeling compassion towards someone else's spiritual plight.

quote: There is nothing wrong with living in virtue even if it is a lie.

Jesus, yango! Please think about the implications of what you just said, right after quickly admitting that you know good and well that "virtue" is NOT interchangeable among different belief systems. Each religious system is going to have it's own definitions of "virtuous". I invoked Jesus because even He recognized that. He preached his own brand of virtue, and warned against the "false" virtues of other Gods.

Would you like living in a society of sodomisers, rapists and pedophiles? No? Well what if 1 billion people suddenly found the writings of the Marquis De Sade to be virtuous? Would you still want to allow them to live what many people would consider to be a "lie"? Sure, this wouldn't happen overnight - but take Mormons into consideration! They've only been in existence for two hundred very short years, on the grand scale of things. One man had a virtuous vision, others followed, it snowballed, now there are a large number of subscribers. No, I am not comparing Mormons to sadists. I am just trying to show you how "virtue" can vary. Shouldn't we strive for universal virtues that we can all willfully live by, without having to drag what will be inevitably construed as "lies" into it?

quote: What do you think people don't question their own faith either? It's not like these people are misguided alot of people become born again or convert later in life or change faith. It's a personal choice. These people arn't hurting anyone. Whereas atheists becoming hostile towards people of faith is a negative thing.

I'm sorry, but if they believe that God is going to destroy the billions of other people who believe differently, then they are severely misguided.. Most atheists were "born again", so to speak, after living in religious households and experiencing nothing else other than religious societies. Our choice to abandon God is a personal one, too. And we're not hurting anyone.

Other than atheists expressing their disdain for religion, how do you see it as them being hostile? You are just as guilty of overstating their motives as you accuse atheists of overstating religious motives.

Finally, I apologize for being so long-winded (again). I couldn't paraphrase to save my own life. http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif)

Statistics show atheists are more virtuous by modern society's standards, i.e. obeying the law.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

Of course I will critisize beliefs I don't see how that would make me a hypocrite. All i'm saying is that atheism isn't a weapon it's nothing but a disregard for a set of beliefs. Beliefs that others follow because they have good reasons to. Just like the reasons you have for believing whatever the hell you believe in and I for what I believe.

Where you are mistaken is that the skeptics (I wont use the term atheist here because it is too broad) criticise beliefs precisely based on the reasons that people believe them. You claim people have a good reason to believe in psychics, god, and communicating with the dead. The skeptic says there are no good reasons to believe in these things.

quote:Edit: Also to you commented on the world neading less faith but had nothing to say about how you would replace faith or adress the problem you see.

Belief without evidence (ie belief for no good reason) is itself the problem. Thus, faith does not need to be "replaced," it should ideally be eliminated. And where faith once was, rational thought will now be. So I suppose we can "replace faith" with rational thought. Rational thought has a much better chance at solving the problems of the world than faith. Try to think up a good example where rational thought led to some horrible travesty. I can easily name many where faith /dogma was the cause.

Ritual, tradition, and a sense of purpose do have their place in people's lives. These things can (and do) exist without faith.



[This message has been edited by Real.PUA (edited 03-24-2007).]

this whole vid was shit look at my previous post!

"Other than atheists expressing their disdain for religion, how do you see it as them being hostile? You are just as guilty of overstating their motives as you accuse atheists of overstating religious motives."

I think I have indeed overstated you and I apologize for that. However most teenage atheists I have talked to do not have much to say about religion except to slander it and call every element of it completly foolish and that the worshipers are all idiots.

I only argue alot of what I am here in this forum because there are more atheists speaking then others. I'm not a religious person and I most definitly wouldn't stand up for a lot of religious people but I really believe their right for religious freedom and alot of atheists comments I have read here and heard from others around the same general age range are often against this.

Honestly I don't really believe in anything. I don't believe in god and I don't believe in what they taught me in school. I don't know how all this works or why it works. I don't know my place in the world at all. There are alot of contradictory view points presented to us in a society like we live in today so I don't exactly know where I fit in. I don't have a life philosophy that I live by. I don't see anything I have learned as absolutly true except maybe math.

Turning my back on religion is easy but replacing what it was saposed to fill isn't. Atheism doesn't believe in gods exsistence but atheists arn't nihilists (well some are). Each individual atheists beliefs would replace the void of god. But I mean with a life philosophy you can never be sure that it is really right and that is your life philosphy it has to be right and that is why i'm not religious or atheist.

I don't know I actually agree with alot of the stuff you said though it's just not my belief and I actually wish I felt strongly about something either against god or with god. I may say something that sounds like I believe it strongly but what I believe changes by the second. I'm really just arguing. I think alot of what I said had truth but I don't know if it was at all justified or if I was even arguing against something I understood because the internet is limited in communication and missunderstandings are easy. So is argument.

However I still think it's bigoted to insult religious people and their beliefs and will stand by that. I think atheists if they feel they must speak out they should do it in the most tolerant way possible.

Angry teenage atheists are annoying as hell, I so agree with you on that. I try to remind myself that they are still reveling in immaturity. Outspoken atheism is a relatively new concept, if you think about it. We both agreed many posts ago that it's not nearly as dangerous to be an atheist now than it was a long time ago. Because it challenges what is believed by over 3/4 of the rest of the world, young, confused teenagers who decide they are an atheist are just getting high on going against the grain. It's a "I challenge-popular-authoritarian-beliefs" kind of mentality. They will probably (like we all do, eventually) look back on themselves when they're a bit older and laugh over their angsty antics, and sheepishly regret having acted a fool.

Your current belief system deserves respect, yango. That you've put so much thought into it already and are still questioning it demands kudos from me.

I used to feel overly-protective of my religious brethren too. It's hard to have beliefs contrary to the people who are closest to you, like your mom or my dad, or even perfect strangers who exhibit kindness and seem to be very stable. Let me ask you this: Did your transformation from belief to disbelief harm you in any way? Nevermind that you haven't completely decided on something firm. The point is that you're not suffering (or certainly don't seem to be suffering) from the effects of skepticism. Our religious friends, family and acquaintances (real life or internet) wouldn't be suffering if they transformed, either. There's really no sense in "protecting" them from atheists, when it would really be doing them a greater service to be "protecting" them from their faith-based beliefs.

When you allow into the forefront of your thinking any kernel of doubt regarding religious faith, you are practicing good, critical thinking. When you spread it, you are actually taking action to improve society by encouraging others to do the same. Sound, critical thinking takes you places. Faith and hope keeps you bound like a slave. It's only natural for kind, caring people who root for a mentally healthy society to feel sorry for those who are enslaved. So I am completely with you on wanting to see religious people in a positive light regardless of their ill-placed beliefs. Let's treat them with the respect that every other human being deserves, and let's not ever admonish them for the error in their thinking. But let's put our heads together and agree that it probably, most likely, almost beyond a shadow of a doubt, wouldn't be a brilliant idea to let them run countries, permeate the news sources, write the laws, enforce the laws, and teach our children their doctrines.

Real.PUA's last post about rational thought replacing religion was a perfect glimpse into what it would really be like to live in a world without faith. I wish he would expand on it even more and submit it as a textfile, it was so well put.

People just need to be made aware that losing your religion does not equal suffering, in any way. Morality still exists, goodness can still be found.

[This message has been edited by AngryFemme (edited 03-25-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by Masta Thief:

wanna know how i know all that was shit? half the people that supposably said that stuff, would have been hung or killed for saying it! lol hahah you guys suck ass!

wanna know about something called privately writing things down in a personal journal or other non public work? Apparently not, because you're a fucking idiot. lol haha YOU suck ass



[This message has been edited by gmail (edited 03-25-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by gmail:

wanna know about something called privately writing things down in a personal journal or other non public work? Apparently not, because you're a fucking idiot. lol haha YOU suck ass



WOW! do you belive every piece of shit the internet tells you? Honest Abe was a Christian!

quote:Originally posted by Masta Thief:

WOW! do you belive every piece of shit the internet tells you? Honest Abe was a Christian!



You couldn't be publicly atheist back then. Many people just wore the christian mask to keep from persecution/public shunning. You think Abe would have been president if people knew he didn't agree with the religion of most of America?

quote:Originally posted by gmail:

You couldn't be publicly atheist back then. Many people just wore the christian mask to keep from persecution/public shunning. You think Abe would have been president if people knew he didn't agree with the religion of most of America?



o i get it! so your one of those people who thinks everyone important in history is gay like Jesus, alexander the great, Georgy Washington and so on! ya no buddy he was Christian and they are not gay!

ps. dont argue bout Alexander he had a wife!

quote:Originally posted by Masta Thief:

WOW! do you belive every piece of shit the internet tells you? Honest Abe was a Christian!

Read it and weep, Masta Thief:

"My earlier views of the unsoundness of the Christian scheme of salvation and the human origin of the scriptures, have become clearer and stronger with advancing years and I see no reason for thinking I shall ever change them".

-- Abraham Lincoln, to Judge J S Wakefield, after Willie Lincoln's death, quoted by Joseph Lewis in "Lincoln the Freethinker," also appearing in Remsburg's "Six Historic Americans"

"It will not do to investigate the subject of religion too closely, as it is apt to lead to Infidelity".

-- Abraham Lincoln, Manford's Magazine, quoted from Franklin Steiner, The Religious Beliefs of Our Presidents, p. 144

"The Bible is not my book nor Christianity my profession".

-- Abraham Lincoln, quoted by Joseph Lewis in "Lincoln the Freethinker"

"Both read the same Bible and pray to the same God, and each invokes his aid against the other. It may seem strange that any men should dare to ask a just God's assistance in wringing their bread from the sweat of other men's faces, but let us judge not that we be not judged."

-- Abraham Lincoln, sarcasm in his Second Innaugural Address (1865)

"The United States government must not undertake to run the Churches. When an individual, in the Church or out of it, becomes dangerous to the public interest he must be checked."

-- Abraham Lincoln, regarding the Churches, quoted from Franklin Steiner, The Religious Beliefs of Our Presidents, p. 143

He was clearly a religious skeptic.

It's funny how you trust in internet sources when it supports your arguments. You've posted many links before in here. Don't even deny it.

There are individuals who take the time to catalogue similar, relevant strings of information and organize it in a tidy display to share with others. The internet just happens to be the new medium to exhibit it on.

The sources of these quotes are verifiable in many other pieces of regular print media.

ABE LINCOLN WAS A CLOSET RELIGIOUS SKEPTIC.

quote:Originally posted by Real.PUA:

Copy/paste?

i agree

quote:Originally posted by AngryFemme:

Read it and weep, Masta Thief:

"My earlier views of the unsoundness of the Christian scheme of salvation and the human origin of the scriptures, have become clearer and stronger with advancing years and I see no reason for thinking I shall ever change them".

-- Abraham Lincoln, to Judge J S Wakefield, after Willie Lincoln's death, quoted by Joseph Lewis in "Lincoln the Freethinker," also appearing in Remsburg's "Six Historic Americans"

"It will not do to investigate the subject of religion too closely, as it is apt to lead to Infidelity".

-- Abraham Lincoln, Manford's Magazine, quoted from Franklin Steiner, The Religious Beliefs of Our Presidents, p. 144

"The Bible is not my book nor Christianity my profession".

-- Abraham Lincoln, quoted by Joseph Lewis in "Lincoln the Freethinker"

"Both read the same Bible and pray to the same God, and each invokes his aid against the other. It may seem strange that any men should dare to ask a just God's assistance in wringing their bread from the sweat of other men's faces, but let us judge not that we be not judged."

-- Abraham Lincoln, sarcasm in his Second Innaugural Address (1865)

"The United States government must not undertake to run the Churches. When an individual, in the Church or out of it, becomes dangerous to the public interest he must be checked."

-- Abraham Lincoln, regarding the Churches, quoted from Franklin Steiner, The Religious Beliefs of Our Presidents, p. 143

He was clearly a religious skeptic.

It's funny how you trust in internet sources when it supports your arguments. You've posted many links before in here. Don't even deny it.

There are individuals who take the time to catalogue similar, relevant strings of information and organize it in a tidy display to share with others. The internet just happens to be the new medium to exhibit it on.

The sources of these quotes are verifiable in many other pieces of regular print media.

ABE LINCOLN WAS A CLOSET RELIGIOUS SKEPTIC.



one your a dumbass if you think i use links! i only used it once or twice when i was arguing hare_giest and some other faggs who kept telling me they wouldnt believe me if i didnt provide links! and thats what i have told them about using the internet! So next time dont steal my shit you piece of shit athiest fuck!

two i told you before conspiracy theorys dont acount for much in an arguement between intelligent people! and the Second Innaugural Address doesnt say shit bout him not believing in God! all he said was he dont understand how two people with the same God could still kill each other or w/e!

ps. never say eat it again you fucking athiest bitch!

Gee, Masta Thief...

Are you going to raise your kids to be loving, forgiving, peaceful Christians like you?

http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

You call everything that isn't in complete agreement with your thoughts a "conspiracy theory".

Your dialogue with people is a disgrace to anything even CLOSE to what Jesus preached. How is anyone ever going to take you seriously when you talk like that?

Edit: Eat it.



[This message has been edited by AngryFemme (edited 03-26-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by AngryFemme:

Gee, Masta Thief...

Are you going to raise your kids to be loving, forgiving, peaceful Christians like you?

http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/rolleyes.gif)

You call everything that isn't in complete agreement with your thoughts a "conspiracy theory".

Your dialogue with people is a disgrace to anything even CLOSE to what Jesus preached. How is anyone ever going to take you seriously when you talk like that?

Edit: Eat it.





aw fuck, damn you conspiracy theorist people! you can never win an arguement agaisnt them, they are too fucking stubborn! you could argue that trees are illusions and youd still win! i give up you people are too fucking retarded to deal with!

ps. i give up with the conspiracy retard people only, the rest of you normal retards still have tyo get owned by me!

quote:Originally posted by Masta Thief:

one your a dumbass if you think i use links! i only used it once or twice when i was arguing hare_giest and some other faggs who kept telling me they wouldnt believe me if i didnt provide links! and thats what i have told them about using the internet! So next time dont steal my shit you piece of shit athiest fuck!

two i told you before conspiracy theorys dont acount for much in an arguement between intelligent people! and the Second Innaugural Address doesnt say shit bout him not believing in God! all he said was he dont understand how two people with the same God could still kill each other or w/e!

ps. never say eat it again you fucking athiest bitch!

Your lack of undereating astounds me. In that thread (the thread that was eaten by totes) I was of the "faggs" that you referring to that wanted you to provide a pictures of a drawings you they found in Africa of dinosaurs. That was not using links that is backing up your claims. Never mind the Pictures you never found. But it no use arguing about that thread since totse destroyed that thread.

[This message has been edited by Q777 (edited 03-26-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by AngryFemme:

But let's put our heads together and agree that it probably, most likely, almost beyond a shadow of a doubt, wouldn't be a brilliant idea to let them run countries, permeate the news sources, write the laws, enforce the laws, and teach our children their doctrines.

I definitly agree. Though as far as my sceptisism goes I guess I just kind of believed in God for most of my childhood but just took it for granted. Then I stopped believing and started asking to not go to church anymore and then I stopped going to church. I don't think this hurt me. However now I am having quite the identity crisis. In the end it's good to be critical but some days I feel so nihilistic that I wish I actually believed in God and it was all simple I would die and then go to heaven and all that stuff.

But its not nearly that simple. Because of the media and esspecialy the internet I have been exposed like alot of us to so many different ideas that now I think alot of us are left sitting here wondering what the hell the point is if everything means something and at the same time means absolutly nothing to another point of view. As a society we definitly need some kind of way of community that isn't faith. Some sort of culture that isn't pop culture or faith but both could be a part. I feel in the west we have very little culture of our own and what little is our culture is generaly fake pop media garbage. I think like alot of people I wish there was something to hold onto that wasn't forced but something everybody in the west could proudly say they are a part of. Everyone no matter the faith or lack of faith. I don't know what this could be though. If religion can connect a group of people together there must be something beyond religion that can connect all these different groups including people skeptic of these groups into one. Something everyone can believe in. Who knows we can dream.

Masta Theif please stop swearing your being a bad Christian.

Dialogue like this is so important.

Recognizing problems in society, finding the common denominator of all these problems, sharing experiences and POV's, and looking for a way to improve the human condition without having to rely on a supernatural entity to interfere in it is major, MAJOR progress for mankind.

I am as optimistic as ever.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:



As a society we definitly need some kind of way of community that isn't faith. Some sort of culture that isn't pop culture or faith but both could be a part. I feel in the west we have very little culture of our own and what little is our culture is generaly fake pop media garbage. I think like alot of people I wish there was something to hold onto that wasn't forced but something everybody in the west could proudly say they are a part of.

What we're doing right here is a good start, yango. It might seem like a small, insignificant step right now, but every great change starts somewhere, right?

I agree with some of your points regarding the west and the choked culture we've created for ourselves that kind of puts the Big Picture in the backseat while focusing on immediate gratifications and creature comforts.

I think the majority of westerners have just opted to not think about it at all, and ignore the problems, and ignore faith, and ignore the alternatives to faith, and just hope like hell that it all works out in the end so they can continue going to baseball games and eating apple pie and being able to own all the things that they want.

I think the internet has done more good than harm as far as bringing people together from different cultures, regions, backgrounds and trains of thought to discuss, resolve and initiate change in a world that is in dire need of it.

quote:Originally posted by Masta Thief:

ps. i give up with the conspiracy retard people only, the rest of you normal retards still have tyo get owned by me!



The only thing you have ever "owned" is a hateful, prejudiced, bigoted attitude against anyone who didn't share in your belief system.

quote:Originally posted by Hare_Geist:



Rust is an atheist and he's a stand up guy. AngryFemme certainly doesn't act like a wacko either.

I'm an atheist, do I act normal http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/frown.gif)?

quote:Originally posted by AngryFemme:

The only thing you have ever "owned" is a hateful, prejudiced, bigoted attitude against anyone who didn't share in your belief system.

Yep i owned you too! haha

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

If the atheist claims to be less ignorant then a christian they would have no need to ever raise their voice.

Ok, I do have to say something to this.

An Atheist will only believe things that are based on facts, a christion does not <----ignorant?

how is believing in things that are real ignorant? please, explain?

Ok, Atheist might not have the answer to everything (creation of earth, life,...) but we're ok with that, so what if we don't know? I'd rather not know then percist in delusion. It's ignorant to believe in some story about how everything came to be.



btw, angryfemme, I added you to yahoo, atleast if your addy is what is says it is in your profile.

[This message has been edited by sybil (edited 03-27-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by sybil:



An Atheist will only believe things that are based on facts, a christion does not <----ignorant?



To say this you must assume that 100% of these groups are exactly the same,you fail at applying logic to your posts.

quote:Originally posted by SAMMY249:

To say this you must assume that 100% of these groups are exactly the same,you fail at applying logic to your posts.

An Atheist, normaly speaking believes in things that he can touch, see, smell, hear, anything, thus facts! If he believes in something that is not a fact, he is no longer a Atheist, imo.

But then again, imo, no Atheist is the same. The only thing Atheist have in common is that they discard any kind of fiction, anything that is not a fact. But besides that Atheist are free thinkers who try to figure things out for themselves rather then to follow the flock.

Christians ALWAYS believe in SOMETHING that is not a fact, there is always SOMETHING, otherwise they wouldn't be christians. So no, I do not lack logic.

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

The only thing Atheist have in common is that they discard any kind of fiction, anything that is not a fact.

Incorrect. The only thing atheists have in common is that we don't believe that God/gods exist. There is nothing in the definition of atheist that precludes us from believing in any other irrational thing or idea.

quote:Originally posted by xray:

[QUOTE]Originally posted by sybil:

[b]There is nothing in the definition of atheist that precludes us from believing in any other irrational thing or idea.



Irrational things like love or hate, I concure, but a tru born Atheist will also discard any kind of irrational things such as ghosts and such. Or what else did you have in mind when saying irrational thing or idea?

If you are refering to UFO's, ufo's arn't irrational, there is a vast universe out there and we have explored like...0.1% of it or something? There is a very slim chance of there beeing something else but us out there alive, and it's a speculation, not a fact.

An atheist is someone who dosnt believe there is a god i am amazed at how ignorant you actually are.

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

Irrational things like love or hate, I concure, but a tru born Atheist will also discard any kind of irrational things such as ghosts and such. Or what else did you have in mind when saying irrational thing or idea?

A true born atheist? Yes, I mean any irrational thing besides God/gods. Atheism is not synonymous with rationalism. An atheist can believe that a race of purple fairies are going to take over the Earth in the year 2010 without any evidence whatsoever, and still be an atheist.

quote:Originally posted by SAMMY249:

An atheist is someone who dosnt believe there is a god i am amazed at how ignorant you actually are.

me, or the guy I'm talking to?

anyway, if it's directed to me, I'll respond right away. Atheism in it's purest form isn't just the disregard of God, it's also the discarding of anything not factual.

A = not

Theism = the belief in the existence of one or more gods or deities.

Deities = A deity or god is a postulated preternatural or supernatural being, who is usually, but not always, of significant power, worshipped, thought holy, divine, or sacred, held in high regard, or respected by human beings.

as quoted from Wiki

So no, not just discarding God, but everything that is not a fact.

[This message has been edited by sybil (edited 03-27-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

me, or the guy I'm talking to?

anyway, if it's directed to me, I'll respond right away. Atheism in it's purest form isn't just the disregard of God, it's also the discarding of anything not factual.

A = not

Theism = the belief in the existence of one or more gods or deities.

Deities = A deity or god is a postulated preternatural or supernatural being, who is usually, but not always, of significant power, worshipped, thought holy, divine, or sacred, held in high regard, or respected by human beings.

So no, not just discarding God, but everything that is not a fact.

sybil, everything that is not a fact is not defined as a god or deity. Get your definitions in order.

quote:Originally posted by xray:

sybil, everything that is not a fact is not defined as a god or deity. Get your definitions in order.

I never said that everything that is not a fact is a god?

and I know why you said this, because I only mentioned gods and deities, but read even more between the lines.

A God or deity are not facts, so everything else that are not facts are also things that Atheist discard, well, atleast hard atheists.

Ofcourse interpretations are made to your own likings. I'm always intrested in hearing somebody elses oppinion on what he sees as atheism, but I do not appreciat people trying to tear down my way of thinking and my views upon atheism.

I've said it before and i'll say it again, I don't like argueing about stuff like this on the internet cause I can't really write English that good, so it's hard for me to write down what I mean to say.

But I still stick to my point, think for yourself, figure things out for yourself, don't be guided by what the "rules" tell you, or by following the rest of the herd. Try thinking deeper and using logics.

Edit: btw, my "defenition" about Atheism is correct. What you mean to say is, the way how I interpret it is isn't correct, though as I've said before, free thinking FTW. and I don't appreciate you thinking that your "deffention" (though it's more of the interpretation that you ment) is correct to everyone.

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

A God or deity are not facts, so everything else that are not facts are also things that Atheist discard, well, atleast hard atheists.

That's not a logical progression. You can't logically say that because atheists don't believe in God/gods because they aren't based on facts, they must therefore not have belief in anything else that aren't based on facts. And that includes 'hard' atheists. That's so irrational, by your own definition you aren't an atheist.

I'm playing poker tonight with a friend who is a hardcore atheist, yet he firmly believes that one particular pair of underwear that he owns brings him luck. Find me one definition of atheist that excludes him from being one and I'll eat my own underwear.



quote:Originally posted by sybil:

Ofcourse interpretations are made to your own likings. I'm always intrested in hearing somebody elses oppinion on what he sees as atheism, but I do not appreciat people trying to tear down my way of thinking and my views upon atheism.

I really don't care if you appreciate it or not. 'Atheism' is not a word that one can have opinions on in regard to its definition. Look at the very definitions you provided.

A = not

Theism = the belief in the existence of one or more gods or deities.

Deities = A deity or god is a postulated preternatural or supernatural being, who is usually, but not always, of significant power, worshipped, thought holy, divine, or sacred, held in high regard, or respected by human beings.

That is it. That's the definition. There are no definitions that exclude atheists from believing in any other thing. You can't have opinions about word definitions that are clear cut and rigid. They are what they are.



quote:Originally posted by sybil:

Edit: btw, my "defenition" about Atheism is correct. What you mean to say is, the way how I interpret it is isn't correct

No, what I mean to say is that your definition of atheism is incorrect.

no, my deffenition is right, the way I interpret it, is, in your opinion wrong.

And yes, I don't believe in anything that isn't based on facts, but hard Atheists are based on facts.

Anyway,like I said, everybody has his own interpretation of everything. That's why I'm not liking this, You're arguing, trying to say I'm wrong. I'm not wrong, you're not wrong, you think what you like, as I think what I like.

Like I said, I love hearing peoples opinions about something, but not about somebody elses interpretation of something, because everybody interprets everyting in a different way.

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

no, my deffenition is right, the way I interpret it, is, in your opinion wrong.

Which words in which definitions are you interpreting for you to come to the conclusion that atheists don't believe in anything that aren't facts?

Watch your negatives in there.

Atheism:

[French athéisme, from athée, atheist, from Greek atheos, godless : a-, without; see a-1 + theos, god; see dhēs- in Indo-European roots.]

All atheism is, is the lack of belief in god[s]. Nothing beyond that.

Like you, I assume, are an a non-stamp collector. And astampist, if you will.

That does not mean your hobbies include "not collecting stamps".

[This message has been edited by glutamate antagonist (edited 03-28-2007).]

sybil's interpretation of atheism is by his own de facto standard. In (keyword:)practice, atheists only become atheists because by their own personal judgement, God just "lacked in fact". I think that's what he may have been driving at, and I bet he could have articulated it a lot better in Flemish!

http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif)

xray's definition is the correctly implied one, for all practical intents and purposes. It means disbelief in gods, nothing more or less.

The usefulness of a word is dependent on it's simplest form of meaning. Subcategorize it too often, and it becomes cliche.

quote:Originally posted by AngryFemme:

sybil's interpretation of atheism is by his own de facto standard.

Yes, I understand that, but having your own reality that no one else shares when it comes to word definitions doesn't make much sense. You can be steadfast in your opinion that an orange is called a banana, but that isn't very useful when words are primarily used for communication and no one else will know what you're talking about.

sybil, let me ask you this: Everyone who is sure whether they believe in God/gods are labeled either theists or atheists. Which of those two categories would someone who believes it is absolutely impossible for God/gods to exist, yet believes that walking under a ladder is bad luck and that the world will end in ten years because he can feel it in his heart be in?

quote:Originally posted by xray:



Yes, I understand that, but having your own reality that no one else shares when it comes to word definitions doesn't make much sense.

You are preaching to the choir on that point, xray. That's pretty much what I was trying to convey when I typed: The usefulness of a word is dependent on it's simplest form of meaning.

I agree that it's not useful when comparing oranges and bananas, although I do believe that today, the words "skeptic" and "atheist" could be somewhat interchangeable without causing mass confusion among those on the receiving end of the communication.

Not too many skeptics believe in God. Not too many atheists aren't skeptics.

The dictionary uses "a person who doubts the truth of a religion, esp. Christianity, or of important elements of it" as a 3rd entry for 'skeptic'.

I recognize that all these derivatives

of word meanings can lead to unhealthy thinking patterns if used in excess, though. Cliches are overused, and run the risk of turning into stereotyping if continually used out of context.

I'm kind of going out on a limb here assuming that sybil even considers himself a skeptic, in addition to being an atheist. But that's what it sounded like he meant, without ever actually having to call the word into play.

quote:Originally posted by AngryFemme:

although I do believe that today, the words "skeptic" and "atheist" could be somewhat interchangeable without causing mass confusion among those on the receiving end of the communication.

Not too many skeptics believe in God. Not too many atheists aren't skeptics.

That may be true (not so true with plenty of Buddhists), but one group generally sharing having more than one thing in common doesn't justify the claims that sybil made about the definition of 'atheist'.



I understand that he's not exactly calling an orange a banana, but I can't not post rebuttals in this forum to someone who writes, "The only thing Atheist have in common is that they discard any kind of fiction, anything that is not a fact." and "but a tru born Atheist will also discard any kind of irrational things such as ghosts and such." and "So no, not just discarding God, but everything that is not a fact."

His choice of words was askew, I feel you on that. "born atheist" being the biggest misnomer, in my opinion.

I guess I was trying to be sympathetic to his communication blunder and his language barrier while somehow agreeing with the points you made, which were all valid ones.

What can I say? I sometimes fail at taking an equipoised approach of responding to posts.

http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif (http://www.totse.com/bbs/biggrin.gif)

I love how a little video showing quotes of atheists started such a huge debate. I figured this thread would get 2 replies and then fade to the back pages.

quote:Originally posted by sybil:



A = not

Theism = the belief in the existence of one or more gods or deities.

Deities = A deity or god is a postulated preternatural or supernatural being, who is usually, but not always, of significant power, worshipped, thought holy, divine, or sacred, held in high regard, or respected by human beings.



Ok, I'm quoting myself here, kinda stupid, anyway, just to show that my deffenition of Atheism is right! Cause this indeed is the deffenition of Atheism. Everything else that I wrote behind or in front of it, is MY OPINION you know what your own opinion means? Well, that's what it is, and that's for each to make out for himself.

You atheists are going to burn up in hell if you don't accept Jesus Christ.

quote:Originally posted by HideandSeek:

You atheists are going to burn up in hell if you don't accept Jesus Christ.

lol

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

Ok, I'm quoting myself here, kinda stupid, anyway, just to show that my deffenition of Atheism is right!

You quoted dictionary definitions that prove you to be 100% wrong. Your definitions show that atheists don't believe in any gods or deities. Deities are defined as preternatural or supernatural beings. One who believes in lucky rabbits feet and any other superstitious belief yet believes that no gods exist is 100% an atheist by definition. Show me a definition of atheist that supports your claim and I'll consider that an alternate definition is acceptable. Until then, arguing without a cite is not going to convince anyone.

I think you don't actually read what I'm typing here, so just read this.

my opinion.

Yeah, I read that part. You can be of the opinion that atheists must have brown hair, but making a factually incorrect statement and calling it an opinion is just being plain stubborn and irrational.

Your last post was not just about your opinion. You claimed that your dictionary definitions prove you right. If you can't see that they clearly prove you wrong, I guess there's not much hope for getting you to accept that having personal definitions of words that no one else agree with won't help you in communicating more efficiently with others.

quote:Originally posted by xray:

I guess there's not much hope for getting you to accept that having personal definitions of words that no one else agree with won't help you in communicating more efficiently with others.

once again, not my personal definition, my opinion -_-

and it isn't irrational, it's what makes this world great, having your own opinion.

[This message has been edited by sybil (edited 03-28-2007).]

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

once again, not my personal definition, my opinion -_-

Your opinion is about your own personal definition. How is this not obvious to you?

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

and it isn't irrational, it's what makes this world great, having your own opinion.

Having an opinion does not mean that it can't be irrational. It's the opinion of many that ghosts exist, but as you wrote earlier, it's an irrational one. Stating that atheists must not have irrational beliefs when not one definition of atheist backs that claim up, is itself irrational. Using your own definition of 'atheist', you can't be one.

quote:Originally posted by Hare_Geist:

A man commented: good luck running a soceity w/o religion even tho it has caused problems... it also creates stablity because if people thought that there was no afterlife wth not just do w/e they want it won't matter in the end... and also if you atheists wonder why christians don't like you...it's because of asshole commets like those in the vid.

Now this worries me. I'm an atheist and I don't go around maiming people. Rust is an atheist and he's a stand up guy. AngryFemme certainly doesn't act like a wacko either. So this says nothing whatsoever about atheists, but loads about the theist saying it. Evidently he'd do whatever the fuck he wanted if he didn't have a carrot waved in front of his face.

Wouldn't you NOT do whatever you wanted because you know when you die, you just DIE.

You would think christians would be more liable to do whatever the fuck they wanted knowing their going to heaven.

quote:Originally posted by yango wango:

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No really. Use paragraphs. I refuse to read that shit.

quote:Originally posted by xray:

Originally posted by sybil:

once again, not my personal definition, my opinion -_-

Your opinion is about your own personal definition. How is this not obvious to you?

quote:Originally posted by sybil:

and it isn't irrational, it's what makes this world great, having your own opinion.

Having an opinion does not mean that it can't be irrational. It's the opinion of many that ghosts exist, but as you wrote earlier, it's an irrational one. Stating that atheists must not have irrational beliefs when not one definition of atheist backs that claim up, is itself irrational. Using your own definition of 'atheist', you can't be one.



I really think I'm expressing myself wrong, or you're understanding me wrong. Cause that last thing you said is so very untru.

Sybil, you are not expressing yourself wrong, others are understanding you wrong.

quote:Originally posted by Painkiller8350:

Sybil, you are not expressing yourself wrong, others are understanding you wrong.

How so? I think I understood him just fine. He claimed "Atheism in it's purest form isn't just the disregard of God, it's also the discarding of anything not factual."

I don't see how I can possibly be understanding him incorrectly.

He claimed "A God or deity are not facts, so everything else that are not facts are also things that Atheist discard, well, atleast hard atheists."

Did I understand that incorrectly? I don't think so. A hard atheist is certain there is no god. Being a hard atheist has nothing to do with being skeptical of any other claims whatsoever.

He claimed that the dictionary definitions he provided prove that his definition of atheist is correct. His definitions proved the opposite. I don't see how you can interpret his words any different than what is evident.