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View Full Version : My opinion and beliefs on Jesus: LOOONG


countdown2chaos
2007-11-11, 03:16
Jesus of Nazareth is the Eternal Son who incarnated on Earth and whose life and teachings are portrayed as the fullest revelation of the personality and attitude of God ever given to humanity.
To “follow Jesus” means to personally share his religious faith and to enter into the spirit of Jesus’ life of unselfish service for man. One of the most important things in human living is to find out what Jesus believed, to discover his ideals, and to strive for the achievement of his exalted life purpose. Of all human knowledge, that which is of greatest value to know the religious life of Jesus and how he lived it.
The Eternal Son, Jesus did not come here to “save or relieve us” from our sins as the Christians believe, but simply to teach us that we can be forgiven, and will be forgiven by God, and to show us how God wishes us to live.
And let this statement be said again, Jesus WAS NOT God the Creator, but the Archangel Michael.
Jesus enjoyed a sublime and wholehearted faith in God. He experienced the ordinary ups and downs of mortal existence, but he never religiously doubted the certainty of God’s watchcare and guidance. His faith was the outgrowth of the insight born of the activity of the divine presence, his soul. His faith was neither traditional nor merely intellectual; it was wholly personal and purely spiritual.
The human Jesus saw God as being holy, just, and great, as well as being true, beautiful, and good. All these attributes of divinity he focused in his mind as the “will of the Father in Heaven.” Jesus’ God was at one and the same time “The Holy One of Israel” and “The living and loving Father in Heaven.” The concept of God as a Father was not original with Jesus, but he exalted and elevated the idea into a sublime experience by achieving a new revelation of God and by proclaiming that every mortal creature is a child of this Father of love, a son of God.
Jesus did not cling to faith in God as would a struggling soul at war with the universe and at death grips with a hostile and sinful world; he did not resort to faith merely as a consolation in the midst of difficulties or as a comfort in threatened despair; faith was not just an illusory compensation for the unpleasant realities and the sorrows of living. In the very face of all the natural difficulties and the temporal contradictions of mortal existence, he experienced the tranquility of supreme and unquestioned trust in God and felt the tremendous thrill of living, by faith, in the very presence of the Heavenly Father. And this triumphant faith was a living experience of actual spirit attainment. Jesus’ great contribution to the values of human experience was not that he reveled so many new ideas about the Father in Heave, but rather that he so magnificently and humanly demonstrated a new and higher type of living faith in God. Never once, in the life of any one mortal, did God ever become such a living reality as in the human experience of Jesus of Nazareth.
Theology may fix, formulate, define, and dogmatize faith, but in the human life of Jesus faith was personal, living, original, spontaneous, and purely spiritual. This faith was not the reverence for tradition, nor a mere intellectual belief which he held as a sacred creed, but rather a sublime experience and a profound conviction which securely held him. His faith was so real all-encompassing that it absolutely swept away any spiritual doubts and effectively destroyed every conflicting desire. Nothing was able to tear him away from the spiritual anchorage of this fervent, sublime, and undaunted faith. Even in the face of apparent defeat of in the throes of disappointment and threatening despair, he calmly stood in the divine presence free from fear and fully conscious of spiritual invincibility. Jesus enjoyed the invigorating assurance of the possession of unflinching faith, and in each of life’s trying situations he unfailingly exhibited an unquestioning loyalty to the Father’s will. And this superb faith was undaunted even by the cruel and crushing threat of an ignominious death.
The all-consuming and indomitable spiritual faith of Jesus never became fanatical, for it never attempted to run away with his well-balanced intellectual judgments concerning the proportional values of practical and commonplace social, economic, and moral life situations. The Son of Man was splendidly unified human personality; he was perfectly endowed divine being; he was also magnificently co-ordinated as a combined human and divine being functioning on Earth as a single personality. Always did Jesus co-ordinate the faith of the soul and with the wisdom-appraisals of seasoned experience. Personal faith, spiritual hope, and moral devotion were always correlated in a matchless religious unity of harmonious association with the keen realizations of the reality and sacredness of all human loyalties – personal honor, family love, religious obligation, social duty, and economic necessity.
Jesus brought to God, as a man of the realm, the greatest of all offerings: the consecration and dedication of his own will to the majestic service of doing the divine will. Jesus always consistently interpreted religion wholly into terms of the Father’s will. When you study the career of Jesus, as concerns prayer or any other feature of the religious life, look not so much for what he taught as for what he did. Jesus never prayed as a religious duty. To him prayer was a sincere expression of spiritual attitude, a declaration of soul loyalty, a recital of personal devotion, an expression of thanksgiving, and avoidance of emotional tension, a prevention of conflict, an exaltation of intellection, an ennoblement of desire, a vindication of moral decision, an enrichment of thought, an invigoration of higher inclinations, a consecration of impulse, a clarification of viewpoint, a declaration of faith; a transcendental surrender of will, a sublime assertion of confidence, a revelation of courage, the proclamation of discovery, a confession of supreme devotion, the validation of consecration, a technique for the adjustment of difficulties, and the mighty mobolilization of the combined soul powers to withstand all human tendencies toward selfishness, evil, and sin. He lived just such a life of prayerful consecration to the doing of his Father’s will and ended his life triumphantly with just such a prayer. The secret of his unparalleled religious life, (reverent. RELIGIOUS, DEVOUT, PIOUS indicate a spirit of reverence toward God. RELIGIOUS is a general word, applying to whatever pertains to faith or worship, do not confuse the meanings of the words here, by organized religion and their corrupt practices, when religion is spoken of with Jesus, think of it more as “spiritual”) was this consciousness of the presence of God; and he attainted it by intelligent prayer and sincere worship – unbroken communion with God – and not by leadings, voices, visions, or extraordinary religious practices.
In the earthly life of Jesus, religion was a living experience, a direct and personal movement from spiritual reverence to practical righteousness. The faith of Jesus bore the transcendent fruit of divine spirit. His faith was not immature and credulous like that of a child, but in many ways did resemble the unsuspecting trust of the child mind. Jesus trusted God much as a child trusts a parent. He has profound confidence in the universe – just such a trust as the child has in its parental environment. Jesus’ wholehearted faith in the fundamental goodness of the universe very much resembled the child’s trust in the security of its earthly surroundings. H depended on the Heavenly Father as a child leans upon its earthly parent, his fervent faith never for one moment doubted the certainty of the Heavenly Father’s overcare. He was not disturbed seriously by fears, doubts, and skepticism. Unbelief did not inhibit the free and original expression of his life. He combined the stalwart and intelligent courage of a full-grown man with the sincere and trusting optimism of a believing child. His faith grew to such heights of trust that it was devoid of fear.
The faith of Jesus attained the purity of a child’s trust. His faith was so absolute and undoubting that it responded to the charm of the contact of fellow beings and to the wonders of the universe. His sense of dependence on the divine was so complete and so confident that it yielded the joy and the assurance of absolute personal security. There was no hesitating pretense in his religious experience. In this giant intellect of the full-grown man the faith of the child reigned supreme in all matters relating to the religious consciousness. It is not strange that he once said, “Except you become as a little child, you shall not enter the Kingdom.” Notwithstanding the Jesus’ faith was childlike, it was in no sense childish.
Jesus does not require his disciples to believe in him, but rather to believe with him, believe in the reality of the love of God and in full confidence accept the security of the assurance of sonship with the Heavenly Father. Jesus desires that all his followers should fully share his transcendent faith. Jesus most touchingly challenged his followers, not only to believe what he believed, but also to believe as he believed. This is the full significance of his one supreme requirement, “Follow me.”
Jesus’ earthly life was devoted to one great purpose – doing as the Father’s will, living the human life religiously and by faith. The faith of Jesus was trusting, like that of a child, but it was wholly free from presumption. He made robust and manly decisions, courageously faced manifold disappointments, resolutely surmounted extraordinary difficulties, and unflinchingly confronted the stern requirements of duty. It required a strong will and an unfailing confidence to believe what Jesus believed and as he believed.
The common people heard Jesus gladly, and they will again respond to the presentation of his sincere human life of consecrated religious motivation if such truths shall again be proclaimed to the world. The people hard him gladly because he was one of them, an unpretentious layman; the world’s greatest religious teacher was indeed a layman.


Definition of religious: reverent. RELIGIOUS, DEVOUT, PIOUS indicate a spirit of reverence toward God. RELIGIOUS is a general word, applying to whatever pertains to faith or worship.

shitty wok
2007-11-11, 05:11
Congrats, you've regurgitated the general idea of Christianity.

i poop in your cereal
2007-11-11, 12:08
You might want to kinda... Reform that HUGE FUCKING WALL OF TEXT.

No way in hell I'm gonna read that.

Pyronos
2007-11-11, 13:00
Here's MY opinion and beliefs on Jesus:
HE IS A FAIRY TALE LIKE SANTA AND THE TOOTH FAIRY.
HE DID NOT EXIST.

/thread

Quageschi
2007-11-11, 17:17
Here's MY opinion and beliefs on Jesus:
HE IS A FAIRY TALE LIKE SANTA AND THE TOOTH FAIRY.
HE DID NOT EXIST.

/thread

I agree, but I think he did exist. He was just some really charismatic guy that knew a few magic tricks (water to wine).

shitty wok
2007-11-11, 18:36
knew a few magic tricks (water to wine).

He just copied Dionysus' trick.

BrokeProphet
2007-11-11, 20:14
Congrats, you've regurgitated the general idea of Christianity.

+1...

countdown2chaos
2007-11-12, 02:44
Congrats, you've regurgitated the general idea of Christianity.

HAH, you apprently didn't read but the 1st line.

1. I don't believe Jesus is God.
2. I think he's an arch angel.
3. I don't agree with Christianity in almost any aspects, so could I of "regurgitated" it.
4. This is in no-way "Christian"- Church is VERY different from this.

countdown2chaos
2007-11-12, 02:45
You might want to kinda... Reform that HUGE FUCKING WALL OF TEXT.

No way in hell I'm gonna read that.

See, here's the problem, it's so much writting, you can't make it not a brick. ;)

Thought Riot
2007-11-12, 05:02
Here's MY opinion and beliefs on Jesus:
HE IS A FAIRY TALE LIKE SANTA AND THE TOOTH FAIRY.
HE DID NOT EXIST.

/thread

well, jesus himself existed, there's really no debate on that.

I think I can sum up the teachings of Jesus (to me) in a very short list:

Love
Understanding
Forgiveness

That's what (IMO) Christianity should be. Who cares about what happens after we die?

Pyronos
2007-11-12, 12:14
well, jesus himself existed, there's really no debate on that.

Source?

The fact is that there aren't any historical records that document the existence of Jesus, and the very VERY few that do exist have been proven to be either hoaxes or derivative of the Bible.

There was no Jesus.

valo567
2007-11-13, 21:33
If Jesus was going around and doing all this miraculous shit stated in the bible, why is the bible the only book that has those acts recorded? If he had done all of those things around priests and SCRIBES, why was none of this recorded by any of them? The monks kept meticulous records and even had manuscripts that dated back to ancient Greece in good condition. If there were anything written about this in any other text besides the bible, im sure the monks would have kept it safe.

Religion is a form of mind control. In my own opinion, people shouldnt be brought up from birth to believe in a religion. They should be able to make their own choices instead of being forced into it.

TruthWielder
2007-11-14, 01:01
If Jesus was going around and doing all this miraculous shit stated in the bible, why is the bible the only book that has those acts recorded? If he had done all of those things around priests and SCRIBES, why was none of this recorded by any of them? The monks kept meticulous records and even had manuscripts that dated back to ancient Greece in good condition. If there were anything written about this in any other text besides the bible, im sure the monks would have kept it safe.

Religion is a form of mind control. In my own opinion, people shouldnt be brought up from birth to believe in a religion. They should be able to make their own choices instead of being forced into it.

Uh...just letting you know, Jesus is in the Koran. Im pretty sure there are records of Jesus in writing still existent. But no, something dating back to ancient greece aint in good condition.

Anyway, yeah, religion is used and has been used for millenia to manipulate people but that does not mean that assigning yourself a spiritual faith is in any way bad.

OP, excellent musings. I agree with you about 90%. I only disagree with the Archangel and not being God part. Awesome perspective on his life and existence, more lucid and true than most evangelical dickheads.

AngryFemme
2007-11-14, 01:18
Love
Understanding
Forgiveness

That's what (IMO) Christianity should be. Who cares about what happens after we die?

That's what every human being should strive to have a surplus of. Not just Christians. Everyone.

Thought Riot
2007-11-14, 06:37
That's what every human being should strive to have a surplus of. Not just Christians. Everyone.

exactly, which is why I'm Christian, but not a big fan of the Church. Really the Jesuits are the only reason why I even keep any ties to it.

However, I'll be doing some research into the validility of Jesus, but it really doesn't matter to me. The message of the religion (as I interpret it) is what's important to me.

countdown2chaos
2007-11-14, 21:46
Uh...just letting you know, Jesus is in the Koran. Im pretty sure there are records of Jesus in writing still existent. But no, something dating back to ancient greece aint in good condition.

Anyway, yeah, religion is used and has been used for millenia to manipulate people but that does not mean that assigning yourself a spiritual faith is in any way bad.

OP, excellent musings. I agree with you about 90%. I only disagree with the Archangel and not being God part. Awesome perspective on his life and existence, more lucid and true than most evangelical dickheads.

well thanks, but its complicated, but in the gospels+torah there's hints that give it away that he is. and the qur'an says he isn't God, but greater than everything and everyone else. But not God, what else is there? You know, from him just being him, he sure as hell isn't just human, well, i don't believe any of us are, but that's another arguement. -But he's above us that's for sure. And the Torah said if anyone ever looked upon the face of God their soul would be destroyed. So there's reason #1 he isn't but meh.

Agent 008
2007-11-17, 20:17
well, jesus himself existed, there's really no debate on that.

I think I can sum up the teachings of Jesus (to me) in a very short list:

Love
Understanding
Forgiveness

That's what (IMO) Christianity should be. Who cares about what happens after we die?

Exactly. And seeing how people back then were definitely not any smarter than they are today, Jesus must've gotten frustrated while trying to explain what he's talking about to them. Thus in the end he had to come up with a bullshit story and some magic tricks and promise them eternal happiness, thinking "fuck me, those idiots are fucking retarded. Ok, you want eternal life, I'll promise it to you, whatever. Just be good to each other now, ok?".

Kind of like this: http://youtube.com/watch?v=UT5mRmN_y-Y

Pyronos
2007-11-17, 23:00
Uh...just letting you know, Jesus is in the Koran.

And what, may I ask, is Islam?

...wait for it...

It's a religion, derivative of Christianity!
What wonderful, solid evidence you have.

Agent 008
2007-11-17, 23:37
Jesus of Nazareth is the Eternal Son who incarnated on Earth and whose life and teachings are portrayed as the fullest revelation of the personality and attitude of God ever given to humanity.

If you read the Old Testament and compare the personality of God in there with the personality of Jesus, those 2 are completely different.

In short, God acts like an asshole that gets pissed whenever people do not act as they want him to act and cruelly punishes them (death being among the less cruel punishments of his), wiping out entire nations from the face of Earth.

On the other hand, Jesus believes that there are no evil people - just misguided ones, doesn't believe that punishing people for their deeds is the way to go; he thinks that you should try to understand them, see what caused them to do evil deeds, and make them feel loved, and then they won't be evil anymore, as people none of us is "born" evil.

As you see, they have completely different philosophies, personalities and attitudes.


To “follow Jesus” means to personally share his religious faith and to enter into the spirit of Jesus’ life of unselfish service for man.

I agree on the unselfish service for man, but don't see what religious faith has to do with it. His philosophy is self-sufficient, it doesn't need blind faith in anything. Thus I bet he introduced the religion of his as an instrument to convince people that he is right, because his philosophy would only work if everyone makes an effort to act according to it. Convincing people that it's worth it is a vital part of his plan, hence the introduction of religious faith to people.

One of the most important things in human living is to find out what Jesus believed, to discover his ideals, and to strive for the achievement of his exalted life purpose.

I wouldn't say it's the most important part of human living, but it would make this world a much nicer place to be. Maybe a bit more boring, but yeah, in general, that'd be nice. But it's virtually impossible to get everyone to follow his teachings - and as long as there are the ones that don't, they would be riding all over the ones that does and using them to their advantage - and that's really really bad.

Unfortunately, that makes Jesus' teachings impractical for everyday life.

Of all human knowledge, that which is of greatest value to know the religious life of Jesus and how he lived it.

Huh? How exactly does knowing Jesus' biography make greater value than knowing how to cure AIDS or cancer, or give to the amputated patients their limbs back?

This is just bullshit.

The Eternal Son, Jesus did not come here to “save or relieve us” from our sins as the Christians believe, but simply to teach us that we can be forgiven, and will be forgiven by God, and to show us how God wishes us to live.

Oh right. So before Jesus people felt self-conscious if they murdered someone, but after Jesus, they realised that it's not a big deal for God and that he will forgive them.

Now you're making Jesus sound like a bad person. Make up your mind, was he good or bad?

And let this statement be said again, Jesus WAS NOT God the Creator, but the Archangel Michael.

Pff of course he is not God the Creator, I thought everyone knew that he is son of God the Creator.

How come is he Archangel Michael though? And why did Archangel Michael decide to take the pseudonym of Jesus? Makes no sense.

Jesus enjoyed a sublime and wholehearted faith in God.

...yet he didn't try to shape his character or attitude to be more like God's. That's a bit contradictory.

He experienced the ordinary ups and downs of mortal existence, but he never religiously doubted the certainty of God’s watchcare and guidance.

Agreed on the ups and downs, although it seems that it was really difficult to bring him down.

On the certainty of God's watchcare: please explain "Why have you forsaken me?" then.

His faith was the outgrowth of the insight born of the activity of the divine presence, his soul.

Please explain in Layman's. I have no idea what you're trying to say here.

His faith was neither traditional nor merely intellectual; it was wholly personal and purely spiritual.

Everyone's faith is personal.

The human Jesus saw God as being holy, just, and great, as well as being true, beautiful, and good.

So he refused to accept the Old Testament God then, right?



Too tired to go through the rest of the post right now, maybe later. But you see my argument, hopefully.

Thought Riot
2007-11-18, 07:54
Exactly. And seeing how people back then were definitely not any smarter than they are today, Jesus must've gotten frustrated while trying to explain what he's talking about to them. Thus in the end he had to come up with a bullshit story and some magic tricks and promise them eternal happiness, thinking "fuck me, those idiots are fucking retarded. Ok, you want eternal life, I'll promise it to you, whatever. Just be good to each other now, ok?".

Kind of like this: http://youtube.com/watch?v=UT5mRmN_y-Y

completely. The way I view the afterlife is that if you are generally a good person, then you're getting whatever positive afterlife may or maynot exist. And if it doesn't, then you're still being a good person whose going to leave a positive impact on his world.

Basically the afterlife doesn't concern me. Living this life well is what matters. The afterlife (if it exists) is just an extension of what we should all strive for.


Damn I wish I was more articulate.