Upon realizing a few things about the motivation behind atheism, I decided that it's bullshit of the worst degree. Self deception!
I used every logical fallacy there is to blind myself to the simple reality that God is.
Experience is all the proof I need. Nothing in this world can explain it, comprehend it, or control it. Only when we give up our attempt to play God does the Truth reveal itself as it is.

Sounds cryptic.

How were you attempting to play God?

Totse is in desperate need of a "yawn" emoticon.

http://www.wii60.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/yawn.jpg

http://www.wii60.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/yawn.jpg

Yawns are contagious:

http://www.wii60.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/yawn.jpg

Yawns are contagious:

http://www.wii60.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/yawn.jpg

lululul

I yawned while searching for that picture. True story. :)

Upon realizing a few things about the motivation behind atheism, I decided that it's bullshit of the worst degree. Self deception!
I used every logical fallacy there is to blind myself to the simple reality that God is.
Experience is all the proof I need. Nothing in this world can explain it, comprehend it, or control it. Only when we give up our attempt to play God does the Truth reveal itself as it is.

It seems THIS is the true self-deception. Allowing the concept of god a 'Pass Go' when it comes to logic and reason and simply taking it on faith. We should hold the idea of god to the same standards of logic and reason as we would anything else.

I hope this post isn't a sign of things to come, because there was a time when Hexadecimal made pretty good posts. This forum has already gone downhill enough, namely because of Jackketch's departure, an atheist with anger-management problems and Obbe's love of spam. On a side note, if I had it my way, I would ban Obbe.

I hope this post isn't a sign of things to come, because there was a time when Hexadecimal made pretty good posts. This forum has already gone downhill enough, namely because of Jackketch's departure, an atheist with anger-management problems and Obbe's love of spam. On a side note, if I had it my way, I would ban Obbe.

+vanhalla

One speaks of science fiction as if it is real, the other is a pure obscurantist. But it's hilarious when they feed each other's egos by validating one another.

I hope this post isn't a sign of things to come, because there was a time when Hexadecimal made pretty good posts. This forum has already gone downhill enough, namely because of Jackketch's departure, an atheist with anger-management problems and Obbe's love of spam. On a side note, if I had it my way, I would ban Obbe.

How'd jack's leaving disrupt the forum? There will be a replacement when Zok gets around to it. If BrokeProphet and Obbe went away, other similar views would soon replace them. That is the fluidity of online discourse with a diversity of opinions. Banning is only an option when rules are broken, not when we don't like how other people present their ideas.

How'd jack's leaving disrupt the forum?

Jackketch was a goldmine for information on historical biblical exegesis. Now that he’s gone, those kinds of questions have fallen out of favour.

Banning is only an option when rules are broken, not when we don't like how other people present their ideas.

It seems evident to me that Obbe is using a classic method of trolling. He presents an unsupported claim that has nothing to do with the topic, knowing full well someone will take the bait. Then he runs circles around them and before you know it, all you have is a ruined thread and three pages of the sentence “I am” hidden under the guise of an argument. In my opinion, he’s nothing but a spammer and spammers should be banned.

What's illogical about atheism?

Jackketch was a goldmine for information on historical biblical exegesis. Now that he’s gone, those kinds of questions have fallen out of favour.

I bet jackketch will still post here when he can.

It seems evident to me that Obbe is using a classic method of trolling. He presents an unsupported claim that has nothing to do with the topic, knowing full well someone will take the bait. Then he runs circles around them and before you know it, all you have is a ruined thread and three pages of the sentence “I am” hidden under the guise of an argument. In my opinion, he’s nothing but a spammer and spammers should be banned.

It's frustrating, I know. You could always put him on ignore if it really bothers you that much.

If BrokeProphet and Obbe went away, other similar views would soon replace them.

I am guilty of being a total asshole when presented with someone possessed of a mental barrier encasing their brain when it comes to all things religious, but I do try to stay on topic of a thread.

Upon realizing a few things about the motivation behind atheism, I decided that it's bullshit of the worst degree. Self deception!
I used every logical fallacy there is to blind myself to the simple reality that God is.
Experience is all the proof I need. Nothing in this world can explain it, comprehend it, or control it. Only when we give up our attempt to play God does the Truth reveal itself as it is.

Good for you.

It's frustrating, I know. You could always put him on ignore if it really bothers you that much.

I thought spamming was greeted with revoked membership here, and that's really all Obbe is doing, isn't it?

I am guilty of being a total asshole when presented with someone possessed of a mental barrier encasing their brain when it comes to all things religious, but I do try to stay on topic of a thread.

Don't worry, you're nothing like Obbe. You can just be a be a bit unwarranted in your use of the all caps button and bold text.

I thought spamming was greeted with revoked membership here, and that's really all Obbe is doing, isn't it?

But you know that the concept of God is a fuzzy one, at best - and so obscure and riddled in metaphor that it can apply to many different things for many different people. Obbe uses the phrase "God" as the catalyst to his perceived truths, and that gives him the right to post here.

If Obbe were to go into Money,Money,Money or Backyard Ballistics and opine about his "I am" revelation in thread after thread, it would definitely be considered spam and he'd probably get infracted for it. But unless this forum were to adopt very stringent, unnecessary rules for what we can call God and what we can't - then Obbe's concept should be allowed to be posted, no matter how ridiculous or self-refuting it may seem to you and I.

Why wouldn't putting him on ignore serve the same purpose for you (not having to read his posts) as banning him would?

... that's really all Obbe is doing, isn't it?

Thats all you're willing to see it as, it seems.

But you know that the concept of God is a fuzzy one, at best - and so obscure and riddled in metaphor that it can apply to many different things for many different people. Obbe uses the phrase "God" as the catalyst to his perceived truths, and that gives him the right to post here.

If Obbe were to go into Money,Money,Money or Backyard Ballistics and opine about his "I am" revelation in thread after thread, it would definitely be considered spam and he'd probably get infracted for it. But unless this forum were to adopt very stringent, unnecessary rules for what we can call God and what we can't - then Obbe's concept should be allowed to be posted, no matter how ridiculous or self-refuting it may seem to you and I.

Why wouldn't putting him on ignore serve the same purpose for you (not having to read his posts) as banning him would?

His notion of God is absolutely beside the point. The problem is him taking entire threads off topic with nothing but a phrase stated repetitiously. If he were in politics and he did nothing but fill up threads with nothing but "Ron Paul should win", he would be banned by now.

His notion of God is absolutely beside the point.

His notion of his concept being ultimately God is entirely the point!

His notion of his concept being ultimately God is entirely the point!

You're wrong. :p

You're wrong. :p

No ... you're wrong.

You're wrong. :p

No, you're just letting Obbe get the best of you.

Tell you what - talk to your buddy jack about it, see if he'll support banning Obbe. You might even consider dropping an e-mail to Lost Cause, because I'm sure she sticks her head in here occasionally. You know where I stand on it.

I feel bad for Hex.

At least when a thread gets 'derailed' by me, its usually through continued explanation and discussion over my response to the OP.

This is just Obbe-hate.

I feel bad for Hex.

Don't feel bad for Hex, he'll likely waltz back in and take this thread back over. Consider it interim discussion during the absence of the OP :p

Don't feel bad for Hex, he'll likely waltz back in and take this thread back over. Consider it interim discussion during the absence of the OP :p

I hope so, I am interested in what he has to say.

+vanhalla

One speaks of science fiction as if it is real, the other is a pure obscurantist. But it's hilarious when they feed each other's egos by validating one another.

I'm sorry but I think thoughts are real things, maybe you don't, but what ever.
Our brains react to an imaginary stimulus much like they react to a physical stimulus, and since I read so much my brain has had many experiences that are not plausible in my physical perception of spacetime, but are possible in the Astral perspective. Maybe my beliefs seem far out but I think that is because your brains aren't experienced in thinking in that context, so you brush it off as metaphysical piddle paddle. Honestly I don't think you people will ever find meaning in these ideas, at least not in this incarnation. But in the end All will see 'Thou Art That'.

No Obbe, when you derail a thread it is to say this:

Everything is an illusion, all that can be known is 'I AM'.

That's it. Your philosophy (in addition to being so simple the whole thing fits in a fotune cookie) is inserted AS IS into every single thread you comment on, and much like your philosophy as a whole, it has absolutely no merit or value to anything at anytime. It always derails a post. It is what trolls do.

I picture you underneath a bridge, with a T-shirt that says in backwards crayon scrawled letters 'I AM', hopping from one leg to the other typing 'I AM' onto a drool covered keyboard.

It is what trolls do.


^This.

Trolling is annoying, but it is not a bannable offense. HOORAY for the ignore function that is in place.

It always derails a post. It is what trolls do.

Derailing any thread is not my intention. The derailment is caused by others asking for explanation.

Just ignore me!

I picture you underneath a bridge, with a T-shirt that says in backwards crayon scrawled letters 'I AM', hopping from one leg to the other typing 'I AM' onto a drool covered keyboard.

This seriously made me lol. :)

I'm sorry but I think thoughts are real things, maybe you don't, but what ever.
Our brains react to an imaginary stimulus much like they react to a physical stimulus, and since I read so much my brain has had many experiences that are not plausible in my physical perception of spacetime, but are possible in the Astral perspective. Maybe my beliefs seem far out but I think that is because your brains aren't experienced in thinking in that context, so you brush it off as metaphysical piddle paddle. Honestly I don't think you people will ever find meaning in these ideas, at least not in this incarnation. But in the end All will see 'Thou Art That'.

That's fine, I'm just referring to the very fact that you often quote and speak in terminology taken directly from science fiction books as if they were facts.

I picture you underneath a bridge, with a T-shirt that says in backwards crayon scrawled letters 'I AM', hopping from one leg to the other typing 'I AM' onto a drool covered keyboard.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=IOh1tQ3VbkA

I.... R?

To be honest... I'm kinda glad we have the posters that we do, it's not like we'd be very active if no-one was here :(

That's fine, I'm just referring to the very fact that you often quote and speak in terminology taken directly from science fiction books as if they were facts.
Most of the ideas are from metaphysical books but they can be linked with sci-fi/fantasy books.
And I'm not saying this is the only way to see it, there are many ways one can perceive the universe. Besides, whenever you put these abstract ideas into words they get degraded and people read into them to literally, these are very symbolic concepts. No one can just give you understanding, you must find meaning within yourself.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=IOh1tQ3VbkA

:eek:

Upon realizing a few things about the motivation behind atheism, I decided that it's bullshit of the worst degree. Self deception!
I used every logical fallacy there is to blind myself to the simple reality that God is.
Experience is all the proof I need. Nothing in this world can explain it, comprehend it, or control it. Only when we give up our attempt to play God does the Truth reveal itself as it is.


Should you not have ended your post with /sarcasm ?

Derailing any thread is not my intention. The derailment is caused by others asking for explanation.

If such is true, why not just post a link to one of your (very) many explanation posts in stead of derailing any more threads?

If such is true, why not just post a link to one of your (very) many explanation posts in stead of derailing any more threads?

I have thought about doing that, and decided it would be pointless ... in which of those explanations have those more skeptical of my concept (BrokeProphet, AngryFemme, Hare_Geist, Surak, etc) not continued criticizing the explanation to a point where most people would find the discussion hard to follow?

I am always having to retype things, return to points already mentioned. The whole process has exhausted me to the point that in many threads where I would like to present my opinion, I have refrained from doing so, as another exhausting explanation-of-great-length would be sure to ensue.

Instead, lately I have been playing around with the idea of creating a thread for the sole purpose of explaining my concept of God.

I have thought about doing that, and decided it would be pointless ... in which of those explanations have those more skeptical of my concept (BrokeProphet, AngryFemme, Hare_Geist, Surak, etc) not continued criticizing the explanation to a point where most people would find the discussion hard to follow?

The point would be that you would not derail any more threads .

It would also allow anyone interested to be able to read the arguments against your ideas, without having to rehash them in yet another thread.

I am always having to retype things, return to points already mentioned. The whole process has exhausted me to the point that in many threads where I would like to present my opinion, I have refrained from doing so, as another exhausting explanation-of-great-length would be sure to ensue.

Why do you feel the need to type yet another lengthy explanation? Nothing has changed since you typed it the first time?

Instead, lately I have been playing around with the idea of creating a thread for the sole purpose of explaining my concept of God.

That would be the best route to take.

Instead, lately I have been playing around with the idea of creating a thread for the sole purpose of explaining my concept of God.
Indubitably that would be the best decision.

I second that and vow to keep MY assholery out of it.

It would also allow anyone interested to be able to read the arguments against your ideas, without having to rehash them in yet another thread.

The problem I see in that, is that in one thread the same 'arguments' are brought up again and again, despite already being discussed.

Why do you feel the need to type yet another lengthy explanation? Nothing has changed since you typed it the first time?

Except maybe the person I am explaining it to. Note that my explanations are never lengthy at first ... thats just the way the discussions end up.

That would be the best route to take.

Indubitably that would be the best decision.

It will happen, but not tonight.

I second that and vow to keep MY assholery out of it.

Why? You're one of my concepts biggest critics.

I would want you to tell me why you believe its false. Not like we would be derailing anyones thread.

Why? You're one of my concepts biggest critics.

I would want you to tell me why you believe its false. Not like we would be derailing anyones thread.

You should just hold a moderated/formatted 1-on-1 debate, similar to those on philosophyforums. It would be much better than the usual thread filled with 20 people chiming in at the same time.

You should just hold a moderated/formatted 1-on-1 debate, similar to those on philosophyforums. It would be much better than the usual thread filled with 20 people chiming in at the same time.

That sounds like it would be kind of fun. I'd be willing to debate.

Is there a mod here that knows how to set something like this up? Here is the sort of format used elsewhere:
http://forums.philosophyforums.com/debates/

Set it up, as on a separate website, or within Totse?


The parameters (http://forums.philosophyforums.com/threads/debates-forum-parameters-7968.html) could be modeled after the guidelines on philosophyforums.com.

A thread would have to be dedicated to it, and policed for stray/spam posts outside of the moderator and participants. Have it stickied, at the very least. I could help there. Anyone could formally moderate it (like you).

It would be kind of neat to see something like this catch on at Totse.

Set it up, as on a separate website, or within Totse?


The parameters (http://forums.philosophyforums.com/threads/debates-forum-parameters-7968.html) could be modeled after the guidelines on philosophyforums.com.

A thread would have to be dedicated to it, and policed for stray/spam posts outside of the moderator and participants. Have it stickied, at the very least. I could help there. Anyone could formally moderate it (like you).

It would be kind of neat to see something like this catch on at Totse.

Yes, here on Totse. It just needs to have absolutely no posts outside the 2 debaters and then immediately locked once the format has ran its course. There should also be a link to a thread for discussion on the debate itself. I will start it if Obbe and Hare want to debate, I just don't know what the topic specifically is they wanted to debate, Obbe's concept of god?

Let's do it!

We'll give Hare and Obbe a chance to agree on a specific time frame when they'll both be available and what the specific topic would be - though I assume the topic would be Obbe's concept of God. I'm here pretty much 'round the clock, save for my sleeping hours, to be able to delete any stray posts or close the thread when necessary.

Once you start a thread for the discussion (that could be linked to the actual debate) - that may be a good time to outline all the parameters and whatnot. I'm sure Hare and Obbe would both need time to prepare.

If Hare and Obbe don't bite on this, hopefully someone else will!

Sounds interesting, good idea. Maybe we should make a specific forum for debating, if enough people are interested that is.

Sounds interesting, good idea. Maybe we should make a specific forum for debating, if enough people are interested that is.

That would be ideal! Easier said than done, though. Maybe if these first few experimental ones turn out well, and enough people show interest, Zok would go to bat for us on a request like that.

I’m up for it, on a couple of conditions:

(1) only three people are allowed to post in the thread; the two debating and the mediator.

(2) the mediator only posts to warn people they’re going off the guidelines.

(3) the debate has to go claim, argument and counterargument. There will be no sophistry, i.e. the type of vague, unsupported claims and off topic questions Obbe likes to throw around.

(4) there is no ad-hom, no genetic fallacy, no talking about anything but the content.

(5) the time limit be a couple of days, rather than a couple of hours, because I like to think my posts through.

(6) ate, Obbe and Spectral all had a thing about making the last post. It should be stressed that “winning” is not about who posts last but who has the correct arguments.

Besides this, I don’t mind what goes. Another thread for discussing the debate would be nice too.

^ In part, that pretty much mirrors the guidelines we were going to pirate from philosophyforums.com

I'm pretty sure Kiko would volunteer as mediator.

On item (1) that you listed, you realize that since we can't "lock" people out of threads, I'd have to just do my very best to delete any stray posts that may crop up. The stickied debate's first post would be a general "Please don't post here , formal debate in progress" ... but you know how people are on here.

(6) ate, Obbe and Spectral all had a thing about making the last post.



Frankly, that's a completely ridiculous claim to make. Now be quiet you.

/thread

As if on cue! Beautiful.

As if on cue! Beautiful.

/thread

Hare, thank you for the kind words however MyGod will continue quite happily without me. I have submitted a couple of names to Zok for possible replacements and I expect he'll reach a decision soon and demod me.

He may decide that no third mod is necessary.

I love this forum but I honestly don't have the time to research and give good answers. And posting is the first and foremost duty of a mod.

In all honesty Jack, even your off the cuff posts are usually much more informative and accurate than most of the other posts here.

You're the best qualified man for the job, and should stay on , even if just on a limited basis as a backup for AngryFemme (who has been doing an excellent job!).