I've been reading around on this fight lately, and was just curious to see what you guys thought about this.
For those few who don't know, Brock Lesnar - former WWE wrestler and NCAA wrestling champ will be fighting former UFC HW champion Frank Mir.

As far as who's going to win goes, I have no clue. K-1 didn't really show off Lesnar's ability very well so I don't know how well he's going to do. Supposedly Mir is in really good shape cardio-wise, but he likely still can't go an entire 3 round match without tiring. Lesnar is highly unlikely to be on par with Mir as far as technique goes, but physically he's faster, stronger, and unless he's really been slacking off, his endurance should be just as good as ever.

The most obvious scenario I think people see happening is that Lesnar will throw Mir to the mat, attempt to ground and pound, and Mir will catch him in an armbar. Others think Lesnar will succeed at the ground and pound and TKO Mir.
Either way, most people agree that Lesnar will throw Mir down and try to ground and pound him.

Again, I have no clue what might happen. Lesnar might try to avoid any submission attempt by staying on his feet, Mir might catch his jaw with a kick. Lesnar could have a glass jaw.
Looking at the K-1 fight, Lesnar seemed pretty awkward to me on his feet. A lot of people have said his stand up technique is poor, and considering Lesnar has been training for what? A year and a half? I definitely believe it, many of the guys in the UFC have been at least doing some striking since they were around 14.
Another strange thing about the K-1 fight was that Lesnar's opponent actually TAPPED from strikes, not a submission. It could be that Min Soo Kim was just a complete wimp, or maybe Lesnar has some serious power behind those punches. If that's the case, and he can hit that hard while on the ground like that, it'll be interesting to see one of them connect while he's standing up and can throw his body into it.

Well anyhow, what are your thoughts on this?

I dont know much about him but I was a huge wwe fan when he came in there, I know how fake it is and everything but fuck was he a monster I always wished he would actually get in some real fights to see what he can do.

My thoughts are... who the hell cares? Why do we want to watch a 'pro wrestler' fight?? Fucking stupid.

My thoughts are... who the hell cares? Why do I want to watch a 'pro wrestler' fight?? Fucking stupid.

Fixed.
Plenty of people are interested in this fight, including myself. I don't care for pro wrestling at all, but anyone who's done some research on the matter can see that Brock Lesnar isn't just a strong guy with zero skill coming out of the WWE. I'd explain it to you, but having seen the comments you post on here, it's obvious the truth is what's in your own mind and reality can take a hike because what you predict (while 90% of the time wrong as I've seen) goes. Can't recall who said it, but awhile back it was mentioned that one would make a mint going against everything you say regarding MMA.

My thoughts are... who the hell cares? Why do we want to watch a 'pro wrestler' fight?? Fucking stupid.

what about ken shamrock when he was in his prime?? he beat bas rutten twice


the lesnar mir fight should be a good one. I have a feeling that mir will win

Fixed.
Plenty of people are interested in this fight, including myself. I don't care for pro wrestling at all, but anyone who's done some research on the matter can see that Brock Lesnar isn't just a strong guy with zero skill coming out of the WWE. I'd explain it to you, but having seen the comments you post on here, it's obvious the truth is what's in your own mind and reality can take a hike because what you predict (while 90% of the time wrong as I've seen) goes. Can't recall who said it, but awhile back it was mentioned that one would make a mint going against everything you say regarding MMA.

Haha it was me after he predicted Kimbo Slice would lose to Ray Mercer (although he put in a get out clause stating "if Ray Mercer is even a shadow of his former self he will still win", which he apparantly wasn't, or something to that effect).

Lots of people are interested in the Brock Lesnar fight because he is somewhat of a celebrity being a former WWE star, that is true. But he also has a phenomenal college wrestling record, he was one of the greatest wrestlers in the country.
He seems to be a very talented and promising fighter. It's also an exciting fight as he's up against Frank Mir who was heavyweight champion until a car accident, so he's in the opposite position to Brock career wise.

I genuinely wouldn't bet on this as it could go either way, it could as easily result in Mir defeating Brock by submission as it could be an overwhelming TKO by Lesnar.

what about ken shamrock when he was in his prime?? he beat bas rutten twice

Ken Shamrock did a lot for the sport, but his prime as a MMA fighter doesn't really mean much compared to the fighters of today, he was old, and his prime as an athlete has nothing to do with is best performances as an MMA fighter. First generation MMA fighters can't be compared to the newer guys.

The same applies to Ruten.

Guys like Lesnar are just fighting now for the money, to be involved in a sport thats considered 'hot.

Haha it was me after he predicted Kimbo Slice would lose to Ray Mercer (although he put in a get out clause stating "if Ray Mercer is even a shadow of his former self he will still win", which he apparantly wasn't, or something to that effect).

My prediction was spot on actually. It was't a 'get out clause', it was a prediction, kind of like the ones you make except mine was actually based upon a substantial knowledge of fighting and fighters coming from years of western and Thai boxing. Anyone that just said "Kimbo will win because he's better", or "Kimbo is just too fast, strong, etc." about that fight, was full of shit. It was impossible to call that fight based upon their performances in MMA because they had NEVER DONE IT BEFORE. My prediction was very simple, that if Ray Mercer had anything left from his boxing career, he would win, and he would have. However if you know ANYTHING about fighters it was PAINFULLY obvious watching them fight that Ray is a SHOT fighter. Aside from just being out of shape, that means that his BRAIN does not let him fight well anymore, because he's taken too much punishment over the years, or he's just too old. His legs were never under him. His chin was gone - which was one of his best assets in his prime he was able to take multiple flush shots from a prime Lennox Lewis, who was one of the biggest punchers EVER.

And most importantly, his reflexes were just not there. It happens to fighters when they get old, they can see the openings, but they just can't take advantage of them.

My prediction for the upcoming fight is a clear win by Kimbo, most likely by submission. Though I don't know if Abbot's chin is any good. At his age it probably isn't, so its possible he will be knocked out, I'd say its about the chances are that he will either be knocked out or submitted early in the fight.

As far as my predictions go, they have actually been COMPLETELY accurate as far as picking fights. Most recently I picked Floyd over Ricky. Not just saying he would win, but I said if his power holds up at welterweight, he would score a stoppage in the late rounds. And thats what happened, Floyd Mayweather Jr. TKO10 Ricky Hatton.

If you think I'm wrong 90% of the time, then you've never seen me post about fights on this forum.

But this is not the case. Are you ready to get owned? Last time we talked on this forum was regarding Mayweather-Hatton, here are some quotes:

I'd like to see sambob's prediction because it'll most likely be the opposite of the outcome.

Rawk said that one.

Then I said this:

Ricky has been down before, the last time he was in with a real welterweight, he was hurt badly several times in the fight. For all we know at this point, Floyd may have enough power to hurt Hatton badly, if this is the case, Hatton will either be knocked out around round 9, or the fight will be stopped due to cuts or possibly bad swelling.

After Floyd knocked out Hatton, what did Rawk say?

The referee was an absolute joke but credit it where it's due Sambob's prediction was pretty accurate.

I don't know why you have such a hard time with me not liking these bullshit MMA fights.

As for "Oblyvaeon", he says:
Plenty of people are interested in this fight, including myself. I don't care for pro wrestling at all, but anyone who's done some research on the matter can see that Brock Lesnar isn't just a strong guy with zero skill coming out of the WWE. I'd explain it to you, but having seen the comments you post on here, it's obvious the truth is what's in your own mind and reality can take a hike because what you predict (while 90% of the time wrong as I've seen) goes. Can't recall who said it, but awhile back it was mentioned that one would make a mint going against everything you say regarding MMA.
2008-01-21 23:15

Well I've already shown you that my picks are pretty damn good, so why don't you try explaining 'it' to me? I make objective predictions and comments based upon the way I see the fighters, just like everyone else SHOULD do. In my experience people only say they won't 'bother' to say something if they don't have anything to say. So come on, spit it out, how do YOU know that Brock Lesnar really IS very skilled?

He was a college wrestling champion? Wow, thats so great. Very admirable I would even say. But MMA, even at the low level money making only fighter like this will fight at, requires more than just Greco-Roman wrestling skills.

He may win, but considering he's untested in MMA, and Frank Mir's comeback record (2-2, both losses coming by way of KNOCK OUT), its hard to pick this one. Frank Mir really is not doing so well. Two of his last four fights (his entire 'comeback') have ended with him getting knocked out. The two fighters that beat him are terrible, with a combined record of 11-3. The two guys he beat (one by decision and one by submission) have a combined record of 13-10. What does this mean? They're terrible, and Frank ir should have beat all four if he wants to be thought of us a live opponent. His last fight was against Antoni Hardonk, who is 5-4.

Anyone else with a bullshit argument? Anyone?

My prediction was spot on actually. It was't a 'get out clause', it was a prediction, kind of like the ones you make except mine was actually based upon a substantial knowledge of fighting and fighters coming from years of western and Thai boxing. Anyone that just said "Kimbo will win because he's better", or "Kimbo is just too fast, strong, etc." about that fight, was full of shit. It was impossible to call that fight based upon their performances in MMA because they had NEVER DONE IT BEFORE. My prediction was very simple, that if Ray Mercer had anything left from his boxing career, he would win, and he would have. However if you know ANYTHING about fighters it was PAINFULLY obvious watching them fight that Ray is a SHOT fighter. Aside from just being out of shape, that means that his BRAIN does not let him fight well anymore, because he's taken too much punishment over the years, or he's just too old. His legs were never under him. His chin was gone - which was one of his best assets in his prime he was able to take multiple flush shots from a prime Lennox Lewis, who was one of the biggest punchers EVER.

And most importantly, his reflexes were just not there. It happens to fighters when they get old, they can see the openings, but they just can't take advantage of them.



Firstly, point out where I said you had never made a good prediction?
That statement came BEFORE the Mayweather fight, which you know full well, I had the humility to admit you made a good call, which you did. You're either completely retarded or just dishonest.
I also made the statement after you predicted Ricky Hatton would lose to Castillo, of course Hatton won by KO which you brushed aside with another horseshit excuse claiming anyone could lose to a liver shot, knowing full well that Hatton focuses on the body and it would have been part of his strategy.
Unfortunately I haven't been able to find the post as its past the search functions date range (frustratingly, by a month)

Perhaps you'd like to explain how Kimbo could have won the fight without validating your prediction?
You say Mercer had no skills left over from his boxing days?
Ray Mercer wasn't a zombie in there, he guarded well and threw a range of well aimed punches. That is evidence he had something left from his boxing days (you're line of thought seems to absurdely suggest that a professional athlete can lose all their skills and natural abilities in their 40s)
His chin was gone? Did he get knocked out? Did he even get knocked down by strikes? BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZT
He lost the fight by being taken too the ground and choked out. Naturally if he had anything left from his heyday he would be immune to leg sweeps and clinching, just like all professional boxers :rolleyes:

you're line of thought seems to absurdely suggest that a professional athlete can lose all their skills and natural abilities in their 40s

Yeah, that's absurd, no athlete ever deteriorates before age 40. I mean look at how many 40+ athletes are dominating in sports today.

Like uh

Most professional athletes, that is, any in a sport that causes a lot of wear and tear on the body, suck as boxing, rugby, hockey, football, etc etc., begin to decline sometime after 30.

Ray Mercer was SHOT. Joe Luis Castillo was SHOT. As I've said before, if you can't see this, you know nothing about fighters.

Why do you think its such a big deal for guys like Bernard Hopkins to be compete at such a high level into their 40s? Its VERY uncommon.

Now you're going to say "Well MMA fighters tend to be older, so they must just be better athletes."

Actually, they're worse athletes, so you just don't notice their decline as much because they weren't all that great to begin with, and in the case of guys like Lesnar, they don't even start fighting until they're 30 anyway!

sambob, you need to learn to read man. I'd also like to know how I supposedly think Brock Lesnar is skilled. Nowhere did I even say that. You also seem to think I'm biased towards Brock Lesnar and again, I've listed plenty of points showing how he could easily lose.
Hell, you pretty much destroyed your own credibility by adding yet another "get out clause" by stating Mir is suddenly no good. Just so you can stick your nose back into the air if Lesnar wins, I presume? I'm not even biased towards Lesnar, I just think it's a joke how everyone's biased AGAINST him. I doubt it'll happen, but I'd love to see your excuse if he beat Randy Couture some day. Oh let me guess, he has years of experience and beats younger guys all the time... but he's just getting old, right?

Fighting for the money? That's fucking stupid, you realize how much money he lost by leaving the WWE? If he wanted money, he'd still be there.
If you don't care about the fight, that's perfectly fine. But it's quite clear you don't know a damn thing about the guy, have done zero research into what he's been doing lately, so saying your view is "objective" is laughable, at best.


Anyone else with a bullshit argument? Anyone?
Just you.

For everyone else once again, look at my original post if I sound like I think Lesnar is going to win. I think it's a complete wild card.

I just call 'em like I see 'em. A "get out clause"? See you are now saying I'M biased towards someone. A 'get out clause' would be a bullshit line someone uses if their pick loses. I don't care WHO wins, so I have no stake in it.

Randy Couture IS old, but he is a GREAT natural athlete, and has kept his body in perfect condition, just like Bernard Hopkins who is 40. Couture's age doesn't seem to matter much because the level of competition in MMA on average is so low regardless of age that he can still perform at a relatively high level.

And if you don't think Brock Lesnar is skilled, then what were you too arrogant to explain to me in your last post? You said you would explain it to me.

He IS a skilled wrestler I'm sure, though well out of practice and past his prime. But that has little bearing on his chances in a MMA fight.

Frank Mir HAS been fighting, and sometimes LOSING to bums, this is the TRUTH, so whats wrong with me saying so?

This fight cannot be called until you see it because Mir is not the fighter he used to be, and because of injury his performance is impossible to count on. Lesnar is not experienced, so its hard to say what he can do.

Much like the Kimbo Slice - Ray Mercer fight. Nobody had seen Kimbo fighting MMA before, so anyone who said he would win by submission was just talking out of their ass. Lets face it, all Kimbo was before that fight was a poor 80s Mike Tyson impersonation. He fought in the same style.

And yes Brock Lesnar is doing it for the money. Pro wrestling is on the decline, MMA is getting richer every day. Lesnar knows that you don't have to spend years fighting in the amateurs to get experience, and years fighting tomato cans in the pros to get recognition like you do in boxing to make the big bucks. In MMA, all you need is a name, and a couple of decent performances.

Furthermore, Lesnar is at his peak as an athlete. This is his last chance to do something real in his life as an athlete, as opposed to just a pro wrestling performer/actor.

To tell me that I dont know a damn thing about the fight is realistic, as I've already told people here more about the two fighters (especially Mir, people seem to forget that he's a nobody now just because was once the 'champ' of SOMETHING), than you have bothered to. All you're doing is complaining about what I'm saying, rather than actually providing any kind of argument to what I'm saying. Well, you try, but you're failing.

I can't wait for this fight. I keep wishing it would be live on basic cable (like ESPN 2 or something) but I know it will never come true. Love the UFC heavyweight fights, as much of a poser as that makes me.

Is there any way to watch this via streaming, keeping in mind sopcast won't work as I'm behind a college firewall?

Man, I'm much more excited to see Nogueira fight Syliva and take the belt. Lesnar vs Mir sounds cool too though.

i hope mir wins

i hope mir wins

He's easily got the technical advantage on his side. I've been reading and watching a lot of interviews, this fight has probably been getting more publicity than it deserves, but as a result this could be huge for Mir. If he wins, he could become extremely popular simply because he beat Brock Lesnar and nothing else. Doesn't matter that Brock Lesnar isn't even a top contender, he's just a well known household name. With all the press this fight is getting, this could save Mir's ass big time. A win by either side is going to help their career massively, whether it's warranted or not.

I don't think Lesnar is gonna be used to getting hit in the nose by someone with no gloves.

It's hard to say who will win because Lesnar is so athletic and big and an already skilled wrestler.
And Mir is obviously skilled he took the hw belt easily back before his injury.

Gonna be a good fight to watch I think.

Looks like Lesnar lost to a knee bar at 1:30 in the first round. No surprise there I think. As awkward as his striking is, it's fucking powerful. I can't wait to see how he develops in the next couple of years. This fight has also made me something of a Mir fan, he's shown nothing but class for the past month regarding this fight.

War Noguiera!

What'd I say. As long as a ref understands how good of a chin Nogueira has, and gives him a few seconds after a knockdown, which they have so far, he will beat any heavyweight currently in the UFC. Fact.

Lesnar looked like he had massive power and potential. All he has to do is work on submissions, more importantly submission defense, and keep his standup at least at some sort of standard, and he will be a force. If he can't build up decent submission defense, then it won't even matter that he's a good wrestler, his career will go nowhere.

I'm fucking GLAD I don't have to "look forward" to Sylvia's boring ass defending the title. That fight was pissing me off until it went to the mat.
Sure, Sylvia wins a lot I'll give him credit where it's due, but damn. I'm glad Nog won that shit.

Loved the fight. Interesting how fast the match can switch directions in MMA.

I'm fucking GLAD I don't have to "look forward" to Sylvia's boring ass defending the title.

Same here man.

As for Lesnar, yea he showed some potential and maybe with more training he could be a legitimate contender, who knows.

I'm fucking GLAD I don't have to "look forward" to Sylvia's boring ass defending the title. That fight was pissing me off until it went to the mat.
Sure, Sylvia wins a lot I'll give him credit where it's due, but damn. I'm glad Nog won that shit.

fuck you and fuck your gay ass jiu jiutsu loving. that shit is fucking queer. sylvia pwns. plus he's from like half an hour away from me.

Anybody who thought a guy who had trained striking, submissions, and submission defense for only a year could beat a former MMA champ who lost his title recently only due to injury is full of shit.

Anybody who thought a guy who had trained striking, submissions, and submission defense for only a year could beat a former MMA champ who lost his title recently only due to injury is full of shit.

Correction he lost his title due to being COUTURED!!!:mad:

you're talking about the wrong fight

Anybody who thought a guy who had trained striking, submissions, and submission defense for only a year could beat a former MMA champ who lost his title recently only due to injury is full of shit.

agreed

and Flannery, your a fucking troll, you have no say in anything.