If he exists, is he or is he not a massive underacheiver?

I mean, the world, while very nice and all that, could be alot better.

Any ideas?

If there is a god, I think most reasonable people would assume that he's at least incompetent; or maybe, just maybe: doesn't give a shit!- George Carlin

If there is a god, I think most reasonable people would assume that he's at least incompetent; or maybe, just maybe: doesn't give a shit!- George Carlin

me4god...
I could do so much better

Does god believe in himself?

Maybe he aimed for less, in which case he's an overachiever.

Maybe he aimed for less, in which case he's an overachiever.

Although if he's omnipotent, he can do anything, including hitting exactly where he aimed. Therefore by overacheiving, he underachieved.

Discuss.

When you achieve a cetain level of spiritual development, you will be able to look at the world, or any aspect of it, and see the perfection in it.
We create our own reality.

But there is a collective consciousness which trumps any individual consciousness. That is, we have war and poverty and hunger because we as a group choose to have it that way. The reason we so choose is based the illusion of separation. We think that because people poorer or darker-skinned or whatever are separate from and/or inferior to us. Kenya is such a mess right now not only due to tribalism run amok, but because of everyone who has ever uttered the word "nigger" or thought that Africa doesn't matter due to lack of proximity and/or oil.

Words and thoughts have more power than we realize.

Does god believe in himself?

Of course I do.

Of course I do.

Glad to hear it. We are all, after all, created in the image and likeness of God--actually, more likeness than image. We create our own reality, and we create ourselves and we create the face of God we see.

Don't forget that Jesus said that anything he can do, we can do better. (Not in those exact words of course, but that was the gist.)

Glad to hear it. We are all, after all, created in the image and likeness of God--actually, more likeness than image.

So, this would mean God has flaws as well?

Of course I do.

You are me!?

So, this would mean God has flaws as well?

Nice question. God does not have control of our individual will even though we are an outreach of him. God(s) do not make decisions based on personal desire therefore to be "flawed" is impossible.

Nice question. God does not have control of our individual will even though we are an outreach of him. God(s) do not make decisions based on personal desire therefore to be "flawed" is impossible.

Is emotional judgement flaw worthy?

Such as, judging based on jealousy, anger, wrath, etc.

I think so.

Abusive Husband "I punched that bitch in the face b/c she was getting on my nerves"
Abusive God "I punched humanity in the face based on the actions of the first two of my creations, who acted that way b/c they were decieved by another of my creations. I cursed all of humanity till the end of time based on the actions of the first two."

The concept of a Christian God is so fucking laughable, I am still amazed there exist in great numbers fools this guillible.

Is emotional judgement flaw worthy?

Such as, judging based on jealousy, anger, wrath, etc.

I think so.

Abusive Husband "I punched that bitch in the face b/c she was getting on my nerves"
Abusive God "I punched humanity in the face based on the actions of the first two of my creations, who acted that way b/c they were decieved by another of my creations. I cursed all of humanity till the end of time based on the actions of the first two."

The concept of a Christian God is so fucking laughable, I am still amazed there exist in great numbers fools this guillible.

Uh, your idea of god and mine differ.

Maybe he aimed for less, in which case he's an overachiever.

Well he can do anything and everything, and he aimed for less... isn't that the definition of an underachiever?

So, this would mean God has flaws as well?

No, that means that we are perfect.

If he exists, is he or is he not a massive underacheiver?

I mean, the world, while very nice and all that, could be alot better.

Any ideas?

Yahweh is a self-decieved, ignorant, sado-masochistic, hateful, "-ism" and insane of all underachievers. However, the transcendental God I believe is an achiever in the fullest sense of the word... The Transcendental God who I will call The Father is The Fullness of All.

So, this would mean God has flaws as well?

The creator God sure does have flaws... The Secret Book of John explains it very well. Founded in ignorance, claims to be the only God, Embodies negative aspects of humanity... Yea I would say he is the devil...

Yahweh is a self-decieved, ignorant, sado-masochistic, hateful, "-ism" and insane of all underachievers. ...

+1, if I could. This reminds me of Dawkins' immortal quote "The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully"

I can't believe how little folks understand what the Bible is. Inspired by God does not mean dictated by God. What is so hard to understand about that? You have a few dozen authors all writing about their conception of God, and yet you, the readers, have somehow failed to overlook that the very NAME used for this God expressly omits It from being packed into a conception. It's a bunch of writings on the spiritual journeys; a few folks prophesying; and one dude that had a really good relationship with God sharing how to have such a good relationship so that we might have it, too (and he may or may not be a physical incarnation of God...who fucking knows, it was 2000 years ago...either way, his teachings on having a relationship with God ARE indeed perfect - not once have I followed the teachings of Christ and come out of it feeling as though I didn't do the best I possibly could in my relationship with God).

If you ever come to understand what the Bible really is, AWESOME! Then all the 'contradictions' make sense. They're individual's lives! These are spiritual guideposts to all mankind expressed through the nature of many individuals' consciences, dreams, aspirations, actions, setbacks, and so on. It is a collection of many different people trying to understand their place as a child of God, what they felt God's will for them was, and their attempts to fulfill that purpose. Still though, not a one truly knew God's wholeness. Not even Israel knew God's whole will. It's not about subservience to some dictator so you don't burn in a lake, contrary to what some churches preach; it's not about big riches in a palace in the sky when you die; it's not a set-in-stone record of God's demands for every little action we take; it's a book about Love...successes and failures.

Of course though, I read the book day in and day out, so my view of it tends to differ from most folks that call themselves Christians.

The contradictions make sense because they are different opinions of different people from different generations with different views on the nature of god, what god does or doesn't do, will or won't allow, and is or isn't capable of.

Your opinion is just as good as theirs. Actually, it's better when you factor in that we have a whole wealth of knowledge and understanding available to us today that people back then had a flawed understanding or absolutely no concept of.

Back then, literacy was low and knowledge/truth was a closely guarded secret. Books were locked behind heavy doors and watched by armed guards and only approved individuals were allowed access to information. Literacy and knowledge were something that the ruling elite most definately did not want falling into the hands of the peasants and commoners.

Although if he's omnipotent, he can do anything, including hitting exactly where he aimed. Therefore by overacheiving, he underachieved.

Discuss.

Hehe, touche

No, that means that we are perfect.

I stole someone's chocolate today.
Am i still perfect?

I stole someone's chocolate today.
Am i still perfect?

ArmsMerchant spouts a lot of hypocritical shit.
He claims everyone is perfect, yet accuses people who don't agree with his views as "unevolved".

ArmsMerchant spouts a lot of hypocritical shit.
He claims everyone is perfect, yet accuses people who don't agree with his views as "unevolved".

Perhaps I failed to make myself clear. An acorn is perfect in itself, but it is quite unevolved compared to a mature oak tree. And so it is with people. A baby is perfect in itself--ask any mother--but it is weak, helpless and ignorant.

You, Master Q, are perfect as you are, given where you are. You are a child, and so you speak as a child, and think as a child, and understand as a child. There is nothing wrong with that. When you become a man, you will put away childish things.

I make no accusations, nor do I judge--I do ,however, offer observations.

Perhaps I failed to make myself clear. An acorn is perfect in itself, but it is quite unevolved compared to a mature oak tree. And so it is with people. A baby is perfect in itself--ask any mother--but it is weak, helpless and ignorant.


How can something be perfect if it has the capacity to improve?

You, Master Q, are perfect as you are, given where you are. You are a child, and so you speak as a child, and think as a child, and understand as a child. There is nothing wrong with that. When you become a man, you will put away childish things.

No. I think realistically, i've matured beyond the need to seek comfort in the childish imaginary concepts you stick to.
You are no more wiser than me or anybody else on totse, so stop acting like you are.
Narcissism is a childish defence mechanism.

+1, if I could. This reminds me of Dawkins' immortal quote "The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully"

LoL, actually it was but I only remember what I wrote that is the rest. Atheist are half way to being Gnostic, the realized the improbability of seeing divinity in the world we have created for ourselves, the saying "Nature has imprinted upon all the idea of God." However, in the name of Stephan A. Hoeller a Gnostic Bishop who said turning a workshop:

"If a God made the physical universe and this God loves us why is it that insects need to eat each other or any other animal need to eat each other for that instance? If this is not enough how is it that the earth is in the middle of a cosmic shooting gallery? How is it that a NATURAL DISASTER that has the potential to wipe out all life be made by a God especially one that supposedly loves us?" <---This is a paraphrase

Depending on the gnostic you talk to they may feel the natural world is not evil but the system we set up for our species (sociopoliticial, socioeconomic doctrines that lead to so much imperfection and evil). Another gnostic may believe the natural world and system are evil, that depends on the personal view, so that quote above may or may not apply to all Gnostic's.

Gnostic's believe in something outside of the physical universe called the Pleroma or Fullness. Thats where we belong and were we will return, for those who wake up and smell the coffee so to speak. We have that Fullness within us and when we recognize it within we can return to it again. I personally equate it to an internal homing beacon that will lead you back to were you whence came.

So all you athiest out there in all the persecution you face against many are ironically blessed by Christ in my view because, you realize the lack of divinity in universe now all you need to do to be a gnostic is realize that: "The reason why it cant be found outside is because, it was all internal in the first place and that above all your carnal desires, above all your thoughts, feelings and preoccupations that is where your divinity lies and lies in everything and everyone... This what I call discovery of the light is what is called Gnosis, but it cant just be explained by words alone but experienced as well."

What about the theist? Well I am a theist I believe in God but that was only after going through a time of agnosticism only to become Gnostic... See the paradox?

WHo the hell said we have to see divinity in all things? Is their divinity in the face of an intestinal parasite?

So all you athiest out there in all the persecution you face against many are ironically blessed by Christ in my view because, you realize the lack of divinity in universe now all you need to do to be a gnostic is realize that: "The reason why it cant be found outside is because, it was all internal in the first place and that above all your carnal desires, above all your thoughts, feelings and preoccupations that is where your divinity lies and lies in everything and everyone... This what I call discovery of the light is what is called Gnosis, but it cant just be explained by words alone but experienced as well."

An athiest is without theism by choice. It is much easier to believe that there is some magical force out there and it gives a fuck about us. It is much easier to believe that b/c it is a more desirable outcome than the REALITY we KNOW.

There is nothing divine in this universe. There is only the IDEA of something divine. Call it Gnosis, call it God, it makes no matter, I call it correctly FALSE.

An athiest is without theism by choice.

Really? Can you choose what you believe? You can choose what you say you believe, but you can't decide what is and isn't the truth (or what you perceive as truth)

WHo the hell said we have to see divinity in all things? Is their divinity in the face of an intestinal parasite?

"Jesus said, "I am the light that is over all things. I am all: from me all came forth, and to me all attained.
Split a piece of wood; I am there.
Lift up the stone, and you will find me there." - Gospel of Thomas Saying 77

What is under a stone but perhaps bugs? Large or Small, Gross or Beautiful, Good or Bad everything can have divinity the problem to the Gnostic is that its in an imperfect state.

An athiest is without theism by choice.

It is much easier to believe that there is some magical force out there and it gives a fuck about us. It is much easier to believe that b/c it is a more desirable outcome than the REALITY we KNOW.There is nothing divine in this universe. There is only the IDEA of something divine. Call it Gnosis, call it God, it makes no matter, I call it correctly FALSE.

Exactly you came to that discovery on your own, naturally not by force thats what makes you halfway there...
... Of course the other half is still in ignorance and do not know what you say.

Really? Can you choose what you believe? You can choose what you say you believe, but you can't decide what is and isn't the truth (or what you perceive as truth)

Are you asking me? Or BrokeProphet?