I live in southern California, and often (read: most nights) between 1:00am-3:00am, planes fly low overhead, dispersing what I only imagine might be the sorts of stuff that weakens the will. These "trails" manifest as even lines across the sky, and what's worse, they grid it, as to give the sky a checkerboard quality. They also do this in the day.

Is anyone else experiencing this?

GET OFF THE METH! You've obviously been using to much. The paranoid delusions you are experiencing will subside over time with abstinence. You'll realize just how insane you were once it's out of your system and you've slept it off. Now it's just the amphetamine psychosis talking...

Or, it's just the vapour trails that planes leave when they fly, you retard.

They want you to think it's "just vapor trails". This is comparable to fluoride/fluorine.

its goin on all over the US all day everyday. And in other countries I believe. I live in the north east. And they go on all day, ive never noticed any at night.

It sucks theres very little info regarding this topic. Rep. Dennis Kucinich (one of the few patriots left in the govnt) described chemtrails as "exotic Weapons" in some bill a couple years ago. But that provision was later removed.

We cant really tell exactly what theyre spraying becuz of the obvious logistical problems.

However a couple months ago Vanity Fair ran a front page article on the environment/Global Warming. And they publicly discuss with professors and govnt types the idea of seeding the atmosphere for whatever reason.

Yes, I am familiar with the process of seeding. It just doesn't seem viable that they'd seed here in socal where the weather is nearly always perfect. My bet is a cocktail of chemicals targeting the will to achieve (or simply killing those pointless brain cells — woo!)

obviously it wouldnt be the first time the govnt/elite tried to knowingly poison us and dumb us down.

But I mean maybe its part of a greater environmental experiment, and socal is a small part. Theres really a lot of possibilities out there on this one, and so god damn little info.

You psychotic retards, lay off the meth. Its just water vapour, all planes do it. Or it may be exhaust. Flourine? wtf are you going on about?

Commercial planes are loaded with aersol LSD I bet. Like the MK-Ultra mind control project years ago with the CIA...

There was a thread about this awhile back, that one dude that posts her a lot has a lot of information on it. Search function.

You psychotic retards, lay off the meth. Its just water vapour, all planes do it. Or it may be exhaust. Flourine? wtf are you going on about?

Commercial planes are loaded with aersol LSD I bet. Like the MK-Ultra mind control project years ago with the CIA...

your calling me crazy? Stand outside an airport, any airport, hell do every airport. Every plane that flies over you will have an exhaust trail that is thin, and narrow. And it dies down instantly because regular airplanes burn fuel so efficiently.

On the other hand Chemtrails look like exhaust at first, then the "trails" slowly spread out over minutes or hours. And look like clouds. And the same plane or groups of planes keeps flying in the same area making a grid or X formation.

completley different things here

your calling me crazy? Stand outside an airport, any airport, hell do every airport. Every plane that flies over you will have an exhaust trail that is thin, and narrow. And it dies down instantly because regular airplanes burn fuel so efficiently.

On the other hand Chemtrails look like exhaust at first, then the "trails" slowly spread out over minutes or hours. And look like clouds. And the same plane or groups of planes keeps flying in the same area making a grid or X formation.

completley different things here

As skeptical as I am on this subject, this is true.

Some planes leave fucking weird trails in weird patterns.

Pg 195 last paragraph in 1984 Orwell talks about chemtrails.

Pg 195 last paragraph in 1984 Orwell talks about chemtrails.

thx im gnna go check that out

edit: Could you post what chapter and part pg 195 is. I cant find my copy, but i can find some online versions but they dnt have page numbers

your calling me crazy? Stand outside an airport, any airport, hell do every airport. Every plane that flies over you will have an exhaust trail that is thin, and narrow. And it dies down instantly because regular airplanes burn fuel so efficiently.

On the other hand Chemtrails look like exhaust at first, then the "trails" slowly spread out over minutes or hours. And look like clouds. And the same plane or groups of planes keeps flying in the same area making a grid or X formation.

completley different things here

Maybe that is the way the exhaust/vapour trails behave higher up in the air. I am calling you a paranoid psychotic retard tweaker.

Lol you seriously believe this?

The main reason why some contrails stay for longer is that they are going through high humidity, supercooled water vapour, so when something (it) goes through that air its exhausts act as seed particles to turn the water vapour into water, making 'clouds' on its trail ..

The National Airspace System of the United States is oriented in an east-west and north-south grid with aircraft flying at designated 2000-foot increments of elevation.

The difference between turbojet and turbofan can also make quite a large difference in contrail patterns.

And if they're trying to spray shit on us then dumping it into the atmosphere at a 20,000 feet isnt going to put them in any predictable place, and those releasing the drugs/whatever shit it 'is' will also get affected ..

The OP is right,...this phenomena has been known to the US army since the early days of jet engine in the late50s-early60s. And since then, they have been using this kind of dissemination method to disseminate a large quantity of chem weapons over a large area.

Eyewitness who had witnessed the use of agen orange back in the vietnam war had observed the same thing.

My guess is that the OP had witnessed the use of some kind of retardant being sprayed in his area. That will explain the existence of this thread.

Or maybe they are spraying chemical that will make the populace embrace diversity better or turn them into pro-multi-cults. Just maybe...

There have also been reports of unmarked black helicopters(the kind that are also reported near UFO encounter sites) spraying areas with stuff. It would explain the cluster of cancer cases in some areas. In "Alien Agenda" Marrs talked about a case in someplace I can't remember where a helicopter sprayed some jello-ish stuff around a neighborhood that made people sick, even if they just touched it it would affect them pretty quickly. The government has tested stuff on citizens(MK-ULTRA), it's not that unlikely. Most people have very limited knowledge of the history of the country and the "bad" stuff they're doing, the hidden history.

your calling me crazy? Stand outside an airport, any airport, hell do every airport. Every plane that flies over you will have an exhaust trail that is thin, and narrow. And it dies down instantly because regular airplanes burn fuel so efficiently.

On the other hand Chemtrails look like exhaust at first, then the "trails" slowly spread out over minutes or hours. And look like clouds. And the same plane or groups of planes keeps flying in the same area making a grid or X formation.

completley different things here

This. The umbrella effect, among other things, is what earns my skepticism.


My guess is that the OP had witnessed the use of some kind of retardant being sprayed in his area. That will explain the existence of this thread.


Well aren't you a little firecracker.

I second the retardant theory.

Well aren't you a little firecracker.

A wee bit bigger than you'd originally thought.

thx im gnna go check that out

edit: Could you post what chapter and part pg 195 is. I cant find my copy, but i can find some online versions but they dnt have page numbers
13 pages deep into chapter 9

13 pages deep into chapter 9

Or you can just tell him to Crtl-F [keyword].

This is rot.


'Umbrella effect' - easily explained.
The spreading out of the trail is when they're in pockets on warmer, dryer air. Thicker, whiter trails will be the result of more humid air. Thats why they persist longer in regions of light clouds.

Moving air and light winds will also push them into interesting patterns, and that's how you get broken lines and spiral patterns that resemble no flightpath.


Mind you, if the words 'Warney,''RIP Steve,' 'Not happy John!' And "Kev07' appear in the air, don't panic.
That's just a skywriter. Not a secret code.



And I live under the flightpath of my city's biggest airport. So I've seen plenty of the bastards.

This is rot.


'Umbrella effect' - easily explained.
The spreading out of the trail is when they're in pockets on warmer, dryer air. Thicker, whiter trails will be the result of more humid air. Thats why they persist longer in regions of light clouds.

Moving air and light winds will also push them into interesting patterns, and that's how you get broken lines and spiral patterns that resemble no flightpath.


Mind you, if the words 'Warney,''RIP Steve,' 'Not happy John!' And "Kev07' appear in the air, don't panic.
That's just a skywriter. Not a secret code.



And I live under the flightpath of my city's biggest airport. So I've seen plenty of the bastards.

That's what THEY want you to think...just because it's easily explainable doesn't mean it's true...

And can you guarantee they *didn't* add anything to it ?

Perhaps they had even go as far as adding stuff into the gas your car is running on, just that you never know.

That's what THEY want you to think...just because it's easily explainable doesn't mean it's true...

And can you guarantee they *didn't* add anything to it ?

Perhaps they had even go as far as adding stuff into the gas your car is running on, just that you never know.


I'm totally with this guy. Fuck the bastards. They fuck up everything. Maybe the aliens have mind control over world leaders?

And can you guarantee they *didn't* add anything to it ?

Ok, I'll bite. :)

The burden of proof isn't on me. You have to show they are actually adding something.

But you must go further. You think they're spraying a retardant, do you? Then it's up to you to provide information on exactly what this retardant is, detect it, and the advantages of administering it in such a manner to the populace. Dispersing chemical substances from 20,000 - 30,000 feet? That's a really inexact way of doing things, you realize? All those people in power, wanting to control us an' all - they'd be putting themselves at risk. Why would anyone do that?



Perhaps they had even go as far as adding stuff into the gas your car is running on, just that you never know.
Oh, that got a laugh. Cute :D
Once again, it's an inexact, risky way of administering anything. Fuel, at the moment is under close scrutiny (driving is big business), and there are gearheads who really take their cars seriously. I doubt any impurities like that would remain undetected for long. It would have to not alter the combustion process nor cause any extra damage to components.
Also, it would have to survive the combustion, or be a byproduct in order to be present in exhaust. Any chemical candidates?
(Unless you're targeting petrol sniffers - but they're doing enough damage to themselves as it is)

But you must go further. You think they're spraying a retardant, do you? Then it's up to you to provide information on exactly what this retardant is, detect it, and the advantages of administering it in such a manner to the populace. Dispersing chemical substances from 20,000 - 30,000 feet? That's a really inexact way of doing things, you realize? All those people in power, wanting to control us an' all - they'd be putting themselves at risk. Why would anyone do that?

The people who know about it, may also know the "cure" for it.

Personally I think its more likely its some sort of cloud seeding experiment, or something to do with the weather in general.

China has been seeding clouds for awhile now, its well documented.

Ok, I'll bite. :) The burden of proof isn't on me. You have to show they are actually adding something. UMM kkkkay... But you must go further. You think they're spraying a retardant, do you? YESSS ! I do.... Then it's up to you to provide information on exactly what this retardant is, detect it, and the advantages of administering it in such a manner to the populace. OOHHH, sure I will. Dispersing chemical substances from 20,000 - 30,000 feet? That's a really inexact way of doing things, you realize? LOlololo !!11!!!! Re-read what OP had said. He said "between 1:00am-3:00am, planes fly low overhead" Which puts the plane around 1500-2000ft, where vapor trials can be clearly visible.-------(Ting !) All those people in power, wanting to control us an' all - they'd be putting themselves at risk. Why would anyone do that? Why ??? So that when very real and very possible conspiracy theory such as this surfaced, retarded people(those who had been exposed to retardants) such as your self would ask "why? why? why? why? why? why?,.....why would they want to do that ??????!!!??----(ting !) Oh, that got a laugh. Cute :D Once again, it's an inexact, risky way of administering anything. TING !---third count... Fuel, at the moment is under close scrutiny (driving is big business), I see....driving is a big business eh...(ting-ting-ting) and there are gearheads who really take their cars seriously. I doubt any impurities like that would remain undetected for long. I assume that all those gearheads have a mass spectrometer and F.T.I.R machines in thier garage somewhere...and they run a series of tests on their gas just as soon as they came home from a gas station.....(ting!) It would have to not alter the combustion process nor cause any extra damage to components. Also, it would have to survive the combustion, or be a byproduct in order to be present in exhaust. Any chemical candidates? I see, just like you can tell the difference between leaded and unleaded gas, right ? Oh, wait, you only know the gas you're using is unleaded because they are labeled as "unleaded" in the gas station...lol---(ting!) (Unless you're targeting petrol sniffers - but they're doing enough damage to themselves as it is) Sadly, by now we know that it didn't just affect only petrol sniffers......and not to mention, you scored 6hits on the tard-o-meter.......

I think I like you, Methematician. Down with the man! Revolution!

Did you seriously consider how complex this would actually be?


LOlololo !!11!!!! Re-read what OP had said. He said "between 1:00am-3:00am, planes fly low overhead" Which puts the plane around 1500-2000ft, where vapor trials can be clearly visible.-------(Ting !)

So I misread the OP. But it doesn't really change the problems with administering it from the air. So no, you get no ting here.
The inveteracies with spraying the air with chemicals is that is indiscriminate – something akin to spray drift with herbicides (which WOULD be impacted by height) is hardly a problem. See next point for more on what I mean.

Why ??? So that when very real and very possible conspiracy theory such as this surfaced, retarded people(those who had been exposed to retardants) such as your self would ask "why? why? why? why? why? why?,.....why would they want to do that ??????!!!??----(ting !)

What is there to do but ask why why why when there is no substantial evidence to back up your claims? Really, I'm still waiting for the identity of your retardant. (or hell, even\ theoretical list of substances they could be using!)
And really, adding a retardant to either the air or to peoples fuel is quite senseless. I don't know about where you live, but here the general population is currently so disinterested in political affairs that the government has very little to worry about. There is no fear of revolution. As long as people are housed, fed and have their ipod jammed into their ears, they usually wont get passed general grumbling on certain taxes and a handful of protests. Why? They're still living in relative ease and comfort.
How could you justify the cost of going around adding extra chemicals to the air when your people are no real threat?

And because administering this retardant by your suspected method is so indiscriminate, it also has the potential to wreck many great minds. Some governments may not like having a lot of free thinkers hanging around to ask questions, but it cannot be denied that they rely a lot on the intellectual potential of their people to keep them ahead in the international stakes. If you are dicking around and damaging your populace, you are potentially giving yourself a handicap when competing against other countries. How are you going to develop a competitive edge in the sciences, their related technologies and economics if you have no decent brains behind it all?

TING !---third count... I see....driving is a big business eh...(ting-ting-ting) I assume that all those gearheads have a mass spectrometer and F.T.I.R machines in thier garage somewhere...and they run a series of tests on their gas just as soon as they came home from a gas station.....(ting!)


Dumb, dumb, dumb! As a big business with so much of people's precious money invested into it is always under a watchful eye. No one wants to lose money.

Allow me to state this load and clear:
THIS IS A BUSINESS UNDER CLOSE SCRUTINY AS THERE IS A LOT OF MONEY INVOLVED.

And you do not NEED high technology to get your first sniff of something wrong. A car fanatic would be very concerned about the performance of their car. (Or in the days of rising fuel costs - the mileage. So even the average family could pick up on anything unusual)
If the car is not performing the way it was advertised, then questions are going to be asked. (Think automotive societies and associations) Is it the manufacture at fault, or is there something else? If something is suspect with the additives the station has added, or problems sediment, an independent consultant would be called in.

Now speaking of car and accessory manufacturers, along with the transport industry and any other big guns in the business - THESE are the people who are going to hire those with the technology. Not one of these groups is interested in losing money thanks to a little compound that has no business in being there. And good luck to you in finding a compound that would even pass all the preliminary tests - you would have to have something that would not alter viscosity, colour, heat of combustion, etc – because that would raise suspicion. When there is large money involved, you have to know what your paying for.
So if you had enough refineries to supply your country and have NO interest in export or fostering an automotive industry, you may have a chance in getting away with doping at the refinery level. Also, you'd have to watch your import.s
If, you know, you got the oil companies who own the refineries co operation on this. (Here – eight refineries, four different companies. Good luck)

I see, just like you can tell the difference between leaded and unleaded gas, right ? Oh, wait, you only know the gas you're using is unleaded because they are labeled as "unleaded" in the gas station...lol---(ting!) Sadly, by now we know that it didn't just affect only petrol sniffers......and not to mention, you scored 6hits on the tard-o-meter.......

I wouldn't know immediately.. But I would make a damn good guess when my catalytic converter is dead next time it gets checked. Regular unleaded is also lower octane. An observant driver would probably tell the difference after going through a tank or two. (Mileage!)
( And for vise versa, a driver of a car that needs leaded fuel would eventually realize that they had been given the wrong thing when their valves suffer damage.)
You wouldn't know right away. But if a number of people in thew same area started reporting the same sorts of damage to their cars, someone will start to ask questions.


( And for honesty's sake - Tard o meter? What are you, twelve?)

Did you seriously consider how complex this would actually be?




So I misread the OP. But it doesn't really change the problems with administering it from the air. So no, you get no ting here.
The inveteracies with spraying the air with chemicals is that is indiscriminate – something akin to spray drift with herbicides (which WOULD be impacted by height) is hardly a problem. See next point for more on what I mean.

Have you ever heard of "agent orange" ???? Indiscriminate is good when you want it to cover the whole population.

What is there to do but ask why why why when there is no substantial evidence to back up your claims? Really, I'm still waiting for the identity of your retardant. (or hell, even\ theoretical list of substances they could be using!)

Oh, so you're sayin the lack of evidence *is* prof of non-existence...hrmm...(and the tard-o-meter goes wild-ting-ting-ting-ting-ting-tuck) Aw,...it burned itself out.



Theoretical substance : 2,7-tetramethyldibenzochoride,

And really, adding a retardant to either the air or to peoples fuel is quite senseless. I don't know about where you live, but here the general population is currently so disinterested in political affairs that the government has very little to worry about. There is no fear of revolution. As long as people are housed, fed and have their ipod jammed into their ears, they usually wont get passed general grumbling on certain taxes and a handful of protests. Why? They're still living in relative ease and comfort.
How could you justify the cost of going around adding extra chemicals to the air when your people are no real threat?

Ar haaaa....this is where the egg-or-chicken argument starts....

On one hand, you might see it that way, but the truth is : It is the said retardant that had caused people to just sit back and relax as long as they can sit in their own house, well fed with junk food, new ipod keeps showing in the istore...and such. What you mentioned is the effect of the retardant manifesting itself right before your eyes...

And because administering this retardant by your suspected method is so indiscriminate, it also has the potential to wreck many great minds. Some governments may not like having a lot of free thinkers hanging around to ask questions, but it cannot be denied that they rely a lot on the intellectual potential of their people to keep them ahead in the international stakes. If you are dicking around and damaging your populace, you are potentially giving yourself a handicap when competing against other countries. How are you going to develop a competitive edge in the sciences, their related technologies and economics if you have no decent brains behind it all?


I don't know if you know this,...but since the past few decades, the majority of the so-called "great minds" of the U.S were actually made up of FOREIGNERS. Yes, they're actually foreigners that had migrated to the US and prosper. For a start,..just look at the origins of majority of the US's nobel prize winners,...


Dumb, dumb, dumb! As a big business with so much of people's precious money invested into it is always under a watchful eye. No one wants to lose money.

Hmmm....you're sooooo naive. The more money a business is making, the more it is shrouded in secrecy and the more government is involved in it...

Allow me to state this load and clear:
THIS IS A BUSINESS UNDER CLOSE SCRUTINY AS THERE IS A LOT OF MONEY INVOLVED.

Yea yea yea...like you really know everything that goes on in martin lockheed,...

And you do not NEED high technology to get your first sniff of something wrong. A car fanatic would be very concerned about the performance of their car. (Or in the days of rising fuel costs - the mileage. So even the average family could pick up on anything unusual)
If the car is not performing the way it was advertised, then questions are going to be asked. (Think automotive societies and associations) Is it the manufacture at fault, or is there something else? If something is suspect with the additives the station has added, or problems sediment, an independent consultant would be called in.

So in the end,...you would still rely on someone other than you, isn't ??

Now speaking of car and accessory manufacturers, along with the transport industry and any other big guns in the business - THESE are the people who are going to hire those with the technology. Not one of these groups is interested in losing money thanks to a little compound that has no business in being there. And good luck to you in finding a compound that would even pass all the preliminary tests - you would have to have something that would not alter viscosity, colour, heat of combustion, etc – because that would raise suspicion. When there is large money involved, you have to know what your paying for.
So if you had enough refineries to supply your country and have NO interest in export or fostering an automotive industry, you may have a chance in getting away with doping at the refinery level. Also, you'd have to watch your import.s
If, you know, you got the oil companies who own the refineries co operation on this. (Here – eight refineries, four different companies. Good luck)

Dumb ass, Government > Oil companies. If they were taking orders from the government, there's virtually no obstacle whatsoever to implement it.....

I wouldn't know immediately.. But I would make a damn good guess when my catalytic converter is dead next time it gets checked. Regular unleaded is also lower octane. An observant driver would probably tell the difference after going through a tank or two. (Mileage!)
( And for vise versa, a driver of a car that needs leaded fuel would eventually realize that they had been given the wrong thing when their valves suffer damage.)
You wouldn't know right away. But if a number of people in thew same area started reporting the same sorts of damage to their cars, someone will start to ask questions.

So you are saying IF there's no side effect whatsoever then you would never notice it, right ??. That's all I need.

Oh, btw, maybe you should wikipedia--->fuel additives to see what's really in your fuel that you never know it had...

( And for honesty's sake - Tard o meter? What are you, twelve?)

Nope, I'm 30, but my girlfriend's 12 thought....

*looking at her sleeping on my bed*

*saying to myself : what a beauuutiful angel*

Im so glad you just posted that. It was everything that needed to be said, personally im way to lazy to type that out.

...Blather...



I'm not going to even bother breaking that down into quotes.

You have not won me other with your given chemical compound. Lets look at the name of it there there:
2,7-tetramethyldibenzochloride.

Are you missing something after the benzochloride in your name? Like another hydrocarbon chain, perhaps? Or maybe you mean a dichloro benzene?
Let's look at the numbers at the front - 2 and 7. Just two. The prefex is tetra. See my problem?
Also - benzene rings have 6 carbons, and different nomenclature again.So your naming is wrong. Or someone pulled it out of their arse.
Next time - IUPAC names. Then we'll have no confusion.

SO what I'm working here is imperfect, thanks to your poor nomenclature - but of benzyl chlorides in general - they are flame retardants that irritate the skin and mucous membranes. (They are corrosive!)Thought to be used as a chemical agent in in warfare - well done. Very high doses (Say if someone were exposed to that every night) can cause dizziness and rapid fatigue. You wouldn't be able to go to work in the morning. NOT the desired effect.
Oh and a carcinogen too (Some dibenzyl compounds are antagonistic to DNA isomerase 2. Planer structure also might make it a chelating agent in DNA) Should we also start looking for increased birth defects?

But nothing to suggest that di benzyl and benzyl chlorides can cause states in a given population of people that makes them apathetic to politics but still able to function in their other everyday jobs and activities.


Oh, and no known 'antidote' for any of these related compounds either. (Try and undo the damage of a carcinogen) Members of the federal government all have to sit in parliament, and most seats of government are in major cities. So they have two choices - don't spray any of these chemicals near the joint, and not cover all those people OR risk exposing themselves.
INDISCRIMINANT. The powers that be are still part of the population.
True, this is all just speculation and isn't in any way accurate because I''m not working off a real compound yet, am I? Need to find out where you put those methyl groups.

As for the chicken and the egg argument - You're adding in another factor that needn't be there. Look through history - it's oppressed populations that rise up. If your people are living in comfort, there's no reason to risk upheaval. Odds are there wouldn't be any benefit. And most people are not well educated in politics, part of the reason they ultimately find it boring.
No retardant manifesting itself actually needed.
Also, researcher that migrates to your country to work will be put at risk to exposure, remember?


Onto petrol - Yes, I would need someone else to give me an accurate reading of my fuel content - Unless I were to borrow the equipment from work. (Although there is alot you can tell from your car just be seeing it run, and inspecting components like your valves and spark plugs. Widespread problems would raise alarm and the eye of independent groups )
But what hasn't really gotten across to you is that there are these independent groups out there who can. test for compounds. From motoring associations and environmentalist testing to other companies in the market. You do not need to go searching into the bowels of a company when you only need look at it's product. Sure, you could claim that the government is somehow influencing ALL them as well, paying money to keep them quite and such. Whatever you like. But the more people who get involved or the more people you try and control, the more likely there will be a slip up. You want a conspiracy? You would be better off confining it to a closed group of people.

And international corporations do not necessarily bow down to the whims of the government.


You may say no evidence of something doesn't mean it's not there, but I prefer to think that extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence. And I ain't seeing any of that around. Just pulling your tin foil hat over your ears and whining 'They might! You just don't know!' is not a convincing argument.

^^ Finally some actual science and reasoning .. :)


ETA: 100th post :D

I'm not going to even bother breaking that down into quotes.

It's ok, I still would despite you're being a pussy...

You have not won me other with your given chemical compound. Lets look at the name of it there there:
2,7-tetramethyldibenzochloride.

Are you missing something after the benzochloride in your name? Like another hydrocarbon chain, perhaps? Or maybe you mean a dichloro benzene?
Let's look at the numbers at the front - 2 and 7. Just two. The prefex is tetra. See my problem?
Also - benzene rings have 6 carbons, and different nomenclature again.So your naming is wrong. Or someone pulled it out of their arse.
Next time - IUPAC names. Then we'll have no confusion.

Right, so there's a little typo from my source, so what ??? You think it's easy to smuggle top secrets formulas out of government controlled labs ????

SO what I'm working here is imperfect, thanks to your poor nomenclature - but of benzyl chlorides in general - they are flame retardants that irritate the skin and mucous membranes. (They are corrosive!)Thought to be used as a chemical agent in in warfare - well done. Very high doses (Say if someone were exposed to that every night) can cause dizziness and rapid fatigue. You wouldn't be able to go to work in the morning. NOT the desired effect.
Oh and a carcinogen too (Some dibenzyl compounds are antagonistic to DNA isomerase 2. Planer structure also might make it a chelating agent in DNA) Should we also start looking for increased birth defects?

But nothing to suggest that di benzyl and benzyl chlorides can cause states in a given population of people that makes them apathetic to politics but still able to function in their other everyday jobs and activities.

Right,...in large doses, they do present obvious and severe negative effects,...but when administered from 2000ft above, the actual desired effect could easily achieved....


Oh, and no known 'antidote' for any of these related compounds either. (Try and undo the damage of a carcinogen) Members of the federal government all have to sit in parliament, and most seats of government are in major cities. So they have two choices - don't spray any of these chemicals near the joint, and not cover all those people OR risk exposing themselves.
INDISCRIMINANT. The powers that be are still part of the population.

Nah,...the power that be had long ceased to be a part of the population. Hey, they didn't dig Alamos for no reason, you know ? And they didn't keep it well maintained for no obvious reasons too, you know ??

True, this is all just speculation and isn't in any way accurate because I''m not working off a real compound yet, am I? Need to find out where you put those methyl groups.

Ok, I'll ask my "source" again, but be aware that he's risking his life just talking to me....

As for the chicken and the egg argument - You're adding in another factor that needn't be there. Look through history - it's oppressed populations that rise up. If your people are living in comfort, there's no reason to risk upheaval. Odds are there wouldn't be any benefit. And most people are not well educated in politics, part of the reason they ultimately find it boring.
No retardant manifesting itself actually needed.

Or perhaps the actual reason why they find politics and other complex issues boring is due to the effect of the said "retardant" itself ???

Also, researcher that migrates to your country to work will be put at risk to exposure, remember?

Not so when they are expendable and easily disposable....and being foreigner, none will miss them, and their disappearance can just be explained by sayin' : "they went back to their country"

Onto petrol - Yes, I would need someone else to give me an accurate reading of my fuel content - Unless I were to borrow the equipment from work. (Although there is alot you can tell from your car just be seeing it run, and inspecting components like your valves and spark plugs. Widespread problems would raise alarm and the eye of independent groups )
But what hasn't really gotten across to you is that there are these independent groups out there who can. test for compounds. From motoring associations and environmentalist testing to other companies in the market. You do not need to go searching into the bowels of a company when you only need look at it's product. Sure, you could claim that the government is somehow influencing ALL them as well, paying money to keep them quite and such. Whatever you like. But the more people who get involved or the more people you try and control, the more likely there will be a slip up. You want a conspiracy? You would be better off confining it to a closed group of people.


Yea-yea-yea....like the fluoride thing, they'd stopped adding them into our drinks. Wait,..

And international corporations do not necessarily bow down to the whims of the government.

Really ? Google,Yahoo, < China.
BP, Shell, Exxon Mobil, blablablal< US (when US told them not to buy oil from iraq)

You may say no evidence of something doesn't mean it's not there, but I prefer to think that extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence. And I ain't seeing any of that around. Just pulling your tin foil hat over your ears and whining 'They might! You just don't know!' is not a convincing argument.

Well, like it or not, it's people like you who'd delayed the idea that earth is round like a ball a few hundred years...sure, you are entitled to held onto your wrong and flawed beliefs,....but ultimately, in the end, it is people like you who will hold humanity back from progress....

Oh btw, do you even have any concrete evidence that gravity exists ??? Nah,...you just believe that gravity exist because your text book said so....and your teacher said so, and your parents said so...not because you have some "extraordinary" evidence to support them...

What they are doing, is spraying barium, and aluminum, the barium for the purpouse of initiating dementia, so they can brainwash people into thinking society, gas prices, and food prices, along with out of control climate change were always happening. PEOPLE ALREADY FUCKING BELIEVE IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN GOING ON!!! It is already taking effect. One of the purpouses of aluminum, is to enhance radiowave manipulation of the brainwaves. If the CT's(chemtrails) are being sprayed, and you become angry, you will notice your heartrate slowing, and you become fatigued. They also directly modify the minds of the famous. They began mind control of main stream rappers in 2003, and the only survivors are Ice T, and an east coast rapper(so far). Just look at retard rappers like Young Joc, and bitch rappers like 50 Cent. They also killed Bearnie Mac, and Issac Hayes. I know they killed Bearnie Mac because he no longer wanted management from Jerry Collins (the fag who sometimes appeared on his show), Collins is an Illuminati family, heavy in TV mental manipulation. They can kill you by slowing your heartbeat, and they can also track your location, everywhere you go where this is being done, and all areas where you've been. They also use chemtrails for weather modification. They put chemicals in fuel of HAARP aircraft which modify the humidity in the vapor trails, if sprayed in the lower atmosphere to increase relative humidity, and if in upper, to create clouds. They fry the upper layer of the atmosphere to control the locations of high, and low pressure areas, and this controls windflow patterns. All the hurricanes fron 2004, to now were created. Issac Hayes was killed for abandoning Scientology, which is an Illuminati cult.

If you need paragraphs, say so. I don't feel like putting them in.

Pg 195 last paragraph in 1984 Orwell talks about chemtrails.
13 pages deep into chapter 9

Pg 195 of '1984', Winston in in the minilove, with other prisoners, there is no mention of chemtrails, and there isn't even a 9th chapter.

If you are referring to the sub-chapters noted by roman numerals then it's way off of pg 195, and there is still no mention of chemtrails.

What they are doing, is spraying barium, and aluminum, the barium for the purpouse of initiating dementia, so they can brainwash people into thinking society, gas prices, and food prices, along with out of control climate change were always happening. PEOPLE ALREADY FUCKING BELIEVE IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN GOING ON!!! It is already taking effect. One of the purpouses of aluminum, is to enhance radiowave manipulation of the brainwaves. If the CT's(chemtrails) are being sprayed, and you become angry, you will notice your heartrate slowing, and you become fatigued. They also directly modify the minds of the famous. They began mind control of main stream rappers in 2003, and the only survivors are Ice T, and an east coast rapper(so far). Just look at retard rappers like Young Joc, and bitch rappers like 50 Cent. They also killed Bearnie Mac, and Issac Hayes. I know they killed Bearnie Mac because he no longer wanted management from Jerry Collins (the fag who sometimes appeared on his show), Collins is an Illuminati family, heavy in TV mental manipulation. They can kill you by slowing your heartbeat, and they can also track your location, everywhere you go where this is being done, and all areas where you've been. They also use chemtrails for weather modification. They put chemicals in fuel of HAARP aircraft which modify the humidity in the vapor trails, if sprayed in the lower atmosphere to increase relative humidity, and if in upper, to create clouds. They fry the upper layer of the atmosphere to control the locations of high, and low pressure areas, and this controls windflow patterns. All the hurricanes fron 2004, to now were created. Issac Hayes was killed for abandoning Scientology, which is an Illuminati cult.

If you need paragraphs, say so. I don't feel like putting them in.

I agree with you about the aluminum thingy,...but that's not really the way it's being done...

Read my "Al and you" thread to know more.....

look at this local news station discovers dangerous chemicals raining down from the 'trails in the sky'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okB-489l6MI

chem trails on NBC

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xoz_oNMJXBc

plenty of others...

happenin over here too.

my automatic conspiracy guess would be its MKultra being sprayed on us, so we take in the subliminal messages they surround us with alot more easily.

Ok, I'll ask my "source" again, but be aware that he's risking his life just talking to me....

That's funny, my "source" told me that nothing of the sort is happening. However he did tell me that they put special chemicals into tin foil so that while when it's put in the oven it's rendered harmless if it is fashioned into a hat it leaches chemicals which are absorbed by the skin and induce extreme unwarranted paranoia in the wearer. :p

They happen here as well and the patterns they leave are fucking crazy. Somedays the sky is full of allsorts of crosses, triangles and even grids.

This stuff also happens at places where it doesn't make any sense to have heavy airtraffic.

And strangely, all the planes stop leaving these trails when they are no longer above the city. They seem to target really small towns aswell like places with only a few thousand inhabitants, but the cities seem to get heavier spraying.

Also, I heard that if commercial pilots would cross eachothers flight corridors in such little time, then they'd lose their license.

I believe they are dropping various chemicals, mostly aluminum and barium molecules. The point is to weaken people's immune system, that's why chemtrails have been reported to give AIDS like symptoms.

I've noticed several times that after they do a shitload of spraying and there is no rain for a while. Then a lot of people actually get sick or have minor skin disorders. I've started to notice that people seem to have acne breakouts exactly the same time.


So yeah, I believe the gubberment/illuminati/reptiles/satan/jews are out to poison you.


BTW, I didn't read all the previous posts because I know I'm right anyway


And here's an interesting video bout chemtrails: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wye2YWRohT4
It actually shows the gadgets attached to the planes that are supposedly leaving the trails. Doesn't prove much, but still interesting.
Also notice that in at least one of the pictures (in the video) you can easily see the wing and how the chemtrail isn't coming from the engines.

If you cant realize that no matter what it is that is being sprayed on you it is that you are being sprayed, if you cant realize that then you it is that has been affected....

I live in southern California, and often (read: most nights) between 1:00am-3:00am, planes fly low overhead, dispersing what I only imagine might be the sorts of stuff that weakens the will. These "trails" manifest as even lines across the sky, and what's worse, they grid it, as to give the sky a checkerboard quality. They also do this in the day.

Is anyone else experiencing this?

It's the stuff that's turned you into a strong and paranoid young adult.