I figured this forum would be the best to ask this question but I apologize if I'm wrong.

I know that there is a goal or objective we are often unaware of that drives observable behavior, is it possible to become aware of this drive in order to better your mindstate and life circumstances? Also I was thinking that if this applies to external behavior, why not internal, and I began thinking that all subvocals are also driven by an objective or goal. Lately I've been looking at my actions in retrospect and asking myself what I was trying to accomplish by behaving that way, often times I find that the action I took didn't support the goal that was motivating it. It's hard to try and make myself think this way, I think it would be very difficult to understand the forces driving your subvocals in order to better your mindstate, is that possible? Am I even on the right track?

With creating positive realities for others (not manipulation) being the goal, is trying to pick up on the goals others are trying to achieve with their behavior and rewarding them possible or will that just cause you to make faulty assumptions?

Never mind "others"--in the Highest Reality, we are All One anyway.

If you wish to change the world, change yourself, for you are not in the world; the world is in you.

Never mind "others"--in the Highest Reality, we are All One anyway.

If you wish to change the world, change yourself, for you are not in the world; the world is in you.


I was hoping for a response from you, you seem to be very well informed about all of this. I understand the second part of your post but am having trouble getting the gist of the first sentence. Am I on the right train of thought though, would a good understanding of psychology help with this process?

Does my assumption that every thought is preceeded by a goal or objective make sense? I believe I achieved a state of ego loss several days ago because I was in a state of mind where I was completely content with everything and could stop thinking and just live in the moment, at that time I felt I had no objective to fuel thought because I was perfectly happy with things the way they were. I feel I scracthed the tip of the iceburg with my experience and would really love to learn more.

In my mind there is no destination, only the movement of the journey.

Samatha Meditation (Calm Abiding) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samatha)

Resurrection of the Higher Self (http://www.eoni.com/%7evisionquest/library/miscresurrection.html)

Sacrament of the High (http://www.eoni.com/%7evisionquest/library/SOTH.html)

Solipsism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solipsism)

Pantheism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantheism)


Four Great Sayings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahavakya)

The Human Evasion (http://www.theabsolute.net/minefield/humevas.html)


The Pharmacratic Inquisition (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4555365073003895154&q=christianity+mushrooms)

Pot + Fasting = Smarts (http://www.humpjones.com/rear/entry/dear_humpasaur_does_hunger_make_you_a_smarter_huma n/)

Imagining the Tenth Dimension (http://www.tenthdimension.com/medialinks.php)

8-Circuit Model of Consciousness
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-Circuit_Model_of_Consciousness)
Theres a couple links.

From a similar thread.

Thanks I've been looking for something interesting to read, this should keep me busy. Do you happen to have a link or something I can search to look at the similar thread?

Is trying to become more self-aware of what motivates my behavior and thought patterns something worthwhile in attempt to better myself?

Is trying to become more self-aware of what motivates my behavior and thought patterns something worthwhile in attempt to better myself?

In very general terms, but with some caveats, I'd say yes, fer shur.

Self-awareness is what Zen and Gurdjieffian metaphysics and meditation is all about. Be aware that you are not your thoughts, but the essential self observing those thoughts.

Motivating thoughts? I dunno--lots of thoughts just seem to pop up out of nowhere, and tryiong to figurte out where and why they come from seems like the metaphtysical equivalent of a dg chasing its tail. Actions are different.

I would suggest this--every time you contemplate a significant action--something more earth-shaking than which socks to wear--think about whether you are coming from a place of love, or a place of fear. I have been taught, and accept as true, that all actions can be traced down to one of these two sponsoring emotions.

I figured this forum would be the best to ask this question but I apologize if I'm wrong.

I know that there is a goal or objective we are often unaware of that drives observable behavior, is it possible to become aware of this drive in order to better your mindstate and life circumstances? Also I was thinking that if this applies to external behavior, why not internal, and I began thinking that all subvocals are also driven by an objective or goal. Lately I've been looking at my actions in retrospect and asking myself what I was trying to accomplish by behaving that way, often times I find that the action I took didn't support the goal that was motivating it. It's hard to try and make myself think this way, I think it would be very difficult to understand the forces driving your subvocals in order to better your mindstate, is that possible? Am I even on the right track?

With creating positive realities for others (not manipulation) being the goal, is trying to pick up on the goals others are trying to achieve with their behavior and rewarding them possible or will that just cause you to make faulty assumptions?

Meditation is really a lifestyle, an understanding or different outlookon life beyond simple reactive behavior. It is all about being aware. There are teachings on staying aware through dream practice. There are teachings on using your eyes, breath, and body to come to a raised awareness. I truly feel from my own experiences there are higher levels of awareness that not many human beings have the chance to experience in a lifetime, but there are a lucky few. Ultimately, every teaching comes down to finding a way to make one more aware, awake. This applies to all parts of life, not just the time you relax the body. Working, playing, dancing... this awareness carries over and makes life a more rich experience.

How you go about that is really your own business, but I mean it's such a challenging question: If one's path is to raise awareness and stay present, what can be the only end of this path? Sitting around bored, thinking, thinking, letting the thoughts run you wild. We all do it. We all make the grave mistake of taking care of the material, the external, without taking care of the internal at all, and just look at our world: We have everything but are in such a great inner turmoil. It's like we use our mind like a tool; a hammer to bang a nail. But after the nail is banged in, we just keep banging unsure of what else to do with this amazing tool. If we keep banging the hammer too much, it's going to get dull and we'll feel a longing for something else. A need that needs to be fulfilled that we don't know how, so we just bang the hammer instead. I hope that makes some sense.

A meditative person is one who is very sharp and crisp, not dull and sleepy. They know the task is, for the entire lifetime, to figure out how to remain sharp and crisp, despite what you've been taught or are being taught. Despite if a volcano is going to blow onto your house tonight.How to keep this awareness high and perception bright... How to shape one's lifestyle to raise awareness and never lose touch with the real, the pure, the deepest identity you are.

And really, being in higher awareness is the highest happiness one can achieve. Then all things are clear, and fear loses it's grip.

Like anything that grows and dies, we grow habits and kill them off as well. Everyone's lifestyle is a collection of habits that over time, show their fruits. Find the habits that make one more centered, and replace your old ones with new ones, then decide which ones are better.

@ Fuck

How does one implement such a lifestyle and reach such a heightened state of awareness?

we are All One anyway.

hopefully not ..

Want some advice? Stop trying to achieve. Let the universe take you where you need to look. Listen.

I figured this forum would be the best to ask this question but I apologize if I'm wrong.

I know that there is a goal or objective we are often unaware of that drives observable behavior, is it possible to become aware of this drive in order to better your mindstate and life circumstances? Also I was thinking that if this applies to external behavior, why not internal, and I began thinking that all subvocals are also driven by an objective or goal. Lately I've been looking at my actions in retrospect and asking myself what I was trying to accomplish by behaving that way, often times I find that the action I took didn't support the goal that was motivating it. It's hard to try and make myself think this way, I think it would be very difficult to understand the forces driving your subvocals in order to better your mindstate, is that possible? Am I even on the right track?

With creating positive realities for others (not manipulation) being the goal, is trying to pick up on the goals others are trying to achieve with their behavior and rewarding them possible or will that just cause you to make faulty assumptions?

I didn't read your post. Know the past does not exist outside of your own mind. Love Everyone.

if you might be interested, there's a torrent for James Ray's Harmonic Wealth (both the movie and the audio version of the book) floating around, that might be interesting to see/hear, not just for you (op) but for everyone.

if that guy doesn't have a higher (if not possibly the highest) mindstate, then i don't know who has.

Want some advice? Stop trying to achieve. Let the universe take you where you need to look. Listen.

What if you trying is the universe taking you to where you need to go?

Lots and lots of drugs....

Silence your mind and observe the world around you. Nothing more need be done.

What if you trying is the universe taking you to where you need to go?

Then that is that.

Never mind "others"--in the Highest Reality, we are All One anyway.

If you wish to change the world, change yourself, for you are not in the world; the world is in you.

All One is very confusing to some people.

We are all part of the same energy field (like the Force), but each soul is an individual gathering of this energy.
Technically, we are all one, but noone is the same.

I wish I had more time to word this better and think about it more, but I was thinking about the 'we are all one'. Does it have something to do with how all of us 'filter' information from the external environment through our central nervous system, creating pictures of reality that appear consensual because we have organized systems of communication...but the 'I' that is self-aware of 'my' thoughts, the part of me that is objective and analyzing this information is seperate from the 'me' / 'mine' / 'my' body pre-programmed and conditioned to process the information in a unique way in comparison to others.

Re-reading that I'm probably way off. I'm growing up in a suburb on the east coast so I have to go out of my way to find good information about subjects like this as it's quite uncommon around here.

It's more simple then that. My consciousness is such that I see an energy in everything, especially plants. I see it like a vibrant energy, things look brighter. I can "feel" this energy and know that that is the same energy that is in me, too. In people, I can see the "masks" or egos that people are attached to and I can "see" the energy behind their eyes that is just waiting to come out. It's not nearly as vibrant as in plants, but it doesn't mean it doesn't exist in one form or another.

Granted, I can see through my mask some of the time, but it's hard to keep it going all the time.

But that should answer your question about what "we are one" means. It's that "energy" that connects us, "that which lets you see, not what you see. That that lets you think, not what you think and that which lets you hear, not what you hear."

Thanks for the response.

I once met someone who said the same thing except his perception was limited to plants. Did you train yourself to achieve a state of consciousness that allows you to percieve and feel energies in objects and living things? Did you just kind of 'get it' one day? Is there any advice or anything you could recommend to help someone achieve that mindstate? I would be very interested in picking up on the masks and egos that others put up as well, is there anyway you could give more detail or an example of that? Right now I'm far from spiritually evolved but I'm making conscious efforts to get there, a woman I used to see who got messages from 'angels' said I have the potential if I am willing to put out the effort.

Of course you have the potential. We ALL have the potential. It's just, some of us choose to work on ourselves and some of us don't. Genetics and Karma play a role somewhat, but there is no reason why you cannot experience any of that regardless of either. Genetics only play a role as to how much "information" or "light" one can hold in ones body without it getting hurt or you dying. I don't mean to scare you with that, because the amount of "light" you will receive will not kill you. I.E. our bodies couldn't possibly get the amount of "light" that say, "God" has because our genetics simply do not allow that. We haven't evolved that far yet. Our bodies know what it can take and what it cannot take. But that's another topic altogether and one that is new to me.

All our lives are made up of present moments. Time is realitive and only exists within this reality, the reality of the majority on earth at this moment. When you are aware of the present moment, you will notice a peace and fullness devolping within you. At first this may be subtle, but through practice it will grow. Advice on getting there? Watch yourself. Watch everything you do and everything you think about. Next time you have a judgmental thought, a negative or positive thought, watch it and realize that "Oh, I had a thought". Once you see that thought, don't get upset that you had a negative thought or happy that you had a positive thought. Accept that that was your thought at that moment and move on. Also, try and accept your present circumstances. You aren't where you'd like to be? Don't put that into a future catagory saying that "Someday I will 'achieve' this". It is not about "achieving" anything. It is an undoing, an unlearning of everything you thought was you. So, through acceptance of the present moment and total surrender that you are where you are and that is that, you can truly begin to see beyond the facade. Try this when stoned if you smoke. Sit down somewhere and breath. Feel the breath and notice the space between things. If you are able to hear the outside noises, hear them and "feel" the space between them. Know that sound comes from nothing, is suspended in space, which is nothing, and returns to nothing a moment later. That is practice that will help you see through your mask and see through other people's masks. Through acceptance of the present moment you gain a greater clarity of perception so you can easily see the tricks the ego likes to play.

It happened to me through practice. I am still on my journey. I still am learning and growing and I still have my faults and pitfalls from time to time. The great thing about this journey, though is that it never really ends. There is always more to discover and always more to learn and create. It is infinite.

When I said I could "see through people's mask" I didn't nessarily mean I could tell when someone was putting up a fake self or hiding something. That is generally the case for all because everyone is too attached to there false self they call "ego" so they don't really know any better. They don't really know that their personality and sense of self is actually an illusion and they certainly don't know how to go beyond it. I ment that I could see the "good" or "God essence" in people. I could see that which binds me to them and them to me, kind of thing. Now, regarding ESP, that is something that you develop, but it is not something I try to cultivate. I suppose you could say I can see through lies and games most of the time, but honestly, I haven't really been tested. I don't get lied to often so I don't know.

And I highly recommend you read the book "The Power of Now" by Eckhart Tolle. I could see glimpses of what I talked about before, but now I can sustain that without much effort. It is still bumpy at times as I am still growing, but things like those books help tremdously. Also, I recommend a yoga class as well. It helped me along the path as well and still does. Especially when things might get a bit bumpy.

Watch yourself. Watch everything you do and everything you think about. It is an undoing, an unlearning of everything you thought was you
(Sorry don't know how to multi-quote)

I've been trying to observe myself, my actions and my reflexive thoughts from a '3rd person objective perspective'. I've been conditioned for 20 years to think my reflexive egocentric thought patterns are 'me' so it's difficult to undo this and requires consistent conscious effort. I've been trying to identify the goal or objective underlying my behaviors, actions, emotions and thoughts.

I'm very interested in this 'unlearning' and undoing myself, I'm ordering the book 'undoing yourself too' to try and help this process. I've been thinking a lot about it on my own lately and been referring to it as dissacociation. When I understand more about psychology etc. I want to try and elaborate on the concept as much as possible. I've read a lot of Timothy Leary and I feel he had achieved an extremely advanced state of consciousness, especially for the time frame which he was born into.

I've read Eckerts book over the summer but I wasn't as open to it as I should have been. I was in fact very upset to see that someone had written a best-selling book like that because weeks before I had even heard about the book I was coming up with strikingly similar concepts (mostly inspired from what I learned from Leary), I felt 'cheated' in a way. I lent the book to a friend but will read it more thoroughly when I get it back. I think he only scratched the surface and that it is possible to come up with more elaborate and detailed concepts. I think there will be a lot of advances in this area of knowledge in the upcoming years, I can't wait to see how quick the progression is.

I'm surprised you didn't get much out of his book, but I guess you weren't as open to it then. Did you read "The Power of Now" or his other one, "A New Earth"?

And Leary was great. I came to this knowledge at first through his theory of the eight circuit model of consciousness. You should check out Richard Alpert, the other psychologist who was with Leary during his Harvard years and afterwards. He's also known as "Ram Dass". Check out his books, "Be Here Now" and "A meditators Guidebook". Great stuff. He took the more spiritual side of things after using LSD.

I was recommed A New Earth, I didn't really absorb much of what I read the first time through, I kind of rushed through it half heartedly. I have heard of Ram Dass and watched some of his videos on youtube but I never knew he wrote books as well, I'll have to check them out.

As for Leary, after reading his first book that landed him a spot at harvard I accepted most of his following work that others dismissed as 'LSD inspired nonsense'.

The Power of Now is a better book. A new Earth is more a manifesto then a self help book.

arm, you never fail to amaze me.

arm, you never fail to amaze me.

I agree, Arms I was thinking about what you said, how the motivation behind everything is fear or love. At first I thought you were wrong and approval /disapproval /confusion worked as better bases, but I realized I was misunderstanding fear. Fear of 'change' is what I think motivates peoples behavior...fear of an imagined situation in the environment causes anxiety which causes a security operation to avoid the greater anxiety and select the lesser, and many people operate in search of security rather then satisfaction...thats a really vague definition but I think it gets the point across?

I have no idea about love, I just understood the connection with fear from books I've read. Something I didn't think about that may help is meditation, right? I know there is a lot of 'mainstream' articles about meditation that I assume are simplified, is there any good techniques I should try to practice? Also, I read something about 'The Great White Brotherhood' which is supposidly a spiritually evolved group that can communicate telepathically? I've read some books that said humans are not the top of the food chain and something to expect upon further evolution is telepathic communication.

how the motivation behind everything is fear or love.

bullshit, they don´t polarize, so the right terms are angst and anger. it´s not north and south-east, black and light grey, male and animal - it´s north and south, black and white etc.

we evolved from simple creatures, and they don´t know love, the know flee or attack ..

drink period blood

Damn i tried to read this thread with a open mind, but by the end i was a bit angry and thinking there is only I and that Ayn rand = Ayn Rand

Dance for five hours straight while listing to "row row fight the powah"...

oh and,

Undoing Yourself With Energized Meditation - RAW

Eckheart Tolle

YES!

.

I know that there is a goal or objective we are often unaware of that drives observable behavior, is it possible to become aware of this drive in order to better your mindstate and life circumstances?

Fucking crazy that you put that into words i have been trying to for a while lol. yes lsd did it to me a few years ago but its not always for the better man.

To achieve a higher mind state begin incorporating that goal into your life.

There are lots of routes/paths/possibilities.

I have been taught, and accept as true, that all actions can be traced down to one of these two sponsoring emotions.

http://home.comcast.net/~patrick.swayze/darko.jpg

5char

Funny, when I saw that movie I thought of the exact same thing Arms is talking about.

http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~noelh/Duality.htm

The best achievement you could hope for in the life is a sin free death.
Only then may you move on.

Physical life is actually death in a coffin made of flesh. Our spiritual abilities are restrained.

What we think of death is actually where we live our REAL lives.

Dance for five hours straight while listing to "row row fight the powah"...

oh and,

Undoing Yourself With Energized Meditation - RAW

Eckheart Tolle

YES!

that book isn't written by RAW silly