So, after reading for a while on how a power meter works from wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_meter),...I was wondering if I connects the my house's neutral line to my neighbor's neutral line, and my neighbor connects their neutral line to mine, will the power meter still runs ?

Also, I've heard of something like phase alternator that might work slowing down the power meter, does anyone knows about something like that or schematics to that kind of stuff ?

So, after reading for a while on how a power meter works from wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_meter),...I was wondering if I connects the my house's neutral line to my neighbor's neutral line, and my neighbor connects their neutral line to mine, will the power meter still runs ?

Also, I've heard of something like phase alternator that might work slowing down the power meter, does anyone knows about something like that or schematics to that kind of stuff ?

The neutrals are all tied to the same voltage above ground, so it doesn't matter if you connect everyones neutral together.

And you would want to look at the power factor for slowing down the meter.

Ah, if you don't know how to do it, DON'T!

If you get caught foolin with the meter, you are in trouble.

The neutrals are all tied to the same voltage above ground, so it doesn't matter if you connect everyones neutral together.

And you would want to look at the power factor for slowing down the meter.

Well, I'm not sure about that, but from the wiki article there,....the reason behind the spinning disc is :

"The metallic disc is acted upon by two coils. One coil is connected in such a way that it produces a magnetic flux in proportion to the voltage and the other produces a magnetic flux in proportion to the current. The field of the voltage coil is delayed by 90 degrees using a lag coil. [1]This produces eddy currents in the disc and the effect is such that a force is exerted on the disc in proportion to the product of the instantaneous current and voltage. A permanent magnet exerts an opposing force proportional to the speed of rotation of the disc - this acts as a brake which causes the disc to stop spinning when power stops being drawn rather than allowing it to spin faster and faster. This causes the disc to rotate at a speed proportional to the power being used."

So, if you connect yourself to someone's neutral, that would cause only ONE of the coil to produce magnetic flux,....which makes me wonder if it would work....

I don't see any way that connecting the neutrals of two homes will possibly slow down the meter. Especially considering the fact that the neutrals in a 120VAC home connection are always wired to ground, so your homes are already connected anyway.

The two coils in the meter are wired together, just 90 degrees out of phase.

What I'm saying is that the disc in the power meter works something like a electric motor, it only spins IF both it's terminal were connected, so if you take your live from it and terminate your neutral somewhere else(by passing the meter), then magnetic flux would only formed in one of it's coil, so it won't spin....

And I don't think your neutral are earthed. The neutral line seemed to me like it's going back to the step down transformer from where it came from.....

Yea, the neutral on the distribution transformer is attached to the lower power line, which is connected to earth somewhere.

The meter has the voltage coil in parallel with the input and ground, so it is always active. Any power you source through the input will has some of it going through the current coil, no matter where it's terminated. The only solution is to modify the phase.

So, is there any easy and simple to do step-by-step guide or schematics that you know of that I can construct myself to attach it to the fuse/breaker box ?

I tried googling it but there's no much around...

btw, I'm not sure about your area, but all the hi-tension cable I've seen have something like 4cables, so I assume that it carried R,Y,B, and neutral back to w/e it came from......

Many newer meters can detect out of phase signals, and will flag the meter as tampered. The best way to cheat the meter is to simply connect to the wires before it, so less power flows through the meter.

Many newer meters can detect out of phase signals, and will flag the meter as tampered. The best way to cheat the meter is to simply connect to the wires before it, so less power flows through the meter.

Running a motor is a highly inductive load (relatively speaking), thus it changes the phase between current and voltage anyway. Last I checked, it isn't illegal to run lots of motors.

What the meters might do is signal the reader than a power factor is beyond some threshold, and if it is that way for a long period of time, the power company might charge you for power factor correction, which adds alot more to your bill.

Is there something like some circuit board that can change the phase of the current in my house that I can built ? I think I've seen the kind of attachment on sale in ebay somewhere, but I can't find more details about them...

I mean, running lots of motor in my home will consume more power rather than saves me some electricity, right ?

Many newer meters can detect out of phase signals, and will flag the meter as tampered. The best way to cheat the meter is to simply connect to the wires before it, so less power flows through the meter.I thought about how I could do this when I was looking at my downed power lines to my house after Gustav.
At my house, the lines run from the pole to a vertical conduit on the roof that's flush with the outside wall and goes through the roof down to the meter mounted on the wall. So I have access to about 1' of the conduit in my attic where it would be possible to cut into the pipe and tap into the wires. Of course, this would have to be done after a hurricane or something when there's widespread outages and you know there's no chance of the power being turned on anytime soon. ;)

Don't worry, emag, with the right tools and safety boots, you can do whatever you want with the live wires, it's just 110v btw. And if you know much about power connection, you can just wired them into your breaker/fuse box and assign it to maybe your room or just the living room where power consumption is high.

Sadly I can't do this tho, I lives in a apartment where the power meter is located on the outside in public area besides the staircase...

actually to quote the above response, the voltage coming into the house is NOT 110/120. Its stepped down to that before it comes out of the breaker box. All your big switches are double that voltage for dryers and ovens and the like.

The voltage on power lines in most places is thousands of volts until it hits a transformer which converts it into 110/120/whatever. Besides, voltage isn't what kills you anyway, it's the amperage. The shock you can get from a Van De Graff generator can be upwards of 100,000v, but it's almost 0amps, so it just hurts really bad. Ever walk into an electric fence? Those are commonly around 10,000v.

The voltage on power lines in most places is thousands of volts until it hits a transformer which converts it into 110/120/whatever. Besides, voltage isn't what kills you anyway, it's the amperage. The shock you can get from a Van De Graff generator can be upwards of 100,000v, but it's almost 0amps, so it just hurts really bad. Ever walk into an electric fence? Those are commonly around 10,000v.

I must say that you're wrong there, or at least partially right...

VOLTS DOES KILL.

I happened to lay my arm across a pair of truck battery terminals once, and at that time I was sweaty...so I got a mild, 12V / 120A shock. It was 120 amp !!!, but nothing happened. Oh, the same goes for a electric welder aswell,..they're just hi amperage 12V A.C power supply box....it could give you quite a shock, but it won't kill you...(assuming you're a healthy person with no heart condition)

But if you touched a 220V / 60A power lines, there won't be a happy ending......ie; hi voltage kills

Conclusion : Hi-(whatever) KILLS !!!!! But with proper knowledge and equipment or tools, nothing bad will happen...

In general low voltage low current is pretty much harmless. Low voltage high current can cause nasty burns if exposed for more than a fraction of a second. High voltage low current can cause painful shocks, but it otherwise harmless. High voltage high current is deadly.

Neither voltage nor current alone can do anything. They must be combined in the form of power. A small amount of power is able to kill, but only when placed precisely. Low voltage high current across the arms dissipates most of the power as heat, causing burns. A higher voltage allows more current to flow, and penetrate deeper. High voltage low current penetrates deeper, but there isn't enough power to do damage.

I must say that you're wrong there, or at least partially right...

VOLTS DOES KILL.

I happened to lay my arm across a pair of truck battery terminals once, and at that time I was sweaty...so I got a mild, 12V / 120A shock. It was 120 amp !!!, but nothing happened. Oh, the same goes for a electric welder aswell,..they're just hi amperage 12V A.C power supply box....it could give you quite a shock, but it won't kill you...(assuming you're a healthy person with no heart condition)

But if you touched a 220V / 60A power lines, there won't be a happy ending......ie; hi voltage kills

Conclusion : Hi-(whatever) KILLS !!!!! But with proper knowledge and equipment or tools, nothing bad will happen...

lifejunkie posted once that a teacher he had was so sure that 12V couldn't kill you that he made up two salt baths, connected them to a car battery, and stepped into them.

He did not survive.

lifejunkie posted once that a teacher he had was so sure that 12V couldn't kill you that he made up two salt baths, connected them to a car battery, and stepped into them.

He did not survive.

[a] links or pix or it didn't happen

[b] like I said, HI-(whatever) kills....in this case, the retardation of his teacher....(if true)

[c] technically, it wasn't the 12volts that killed him, it was cardiac-arrest that killed him as the results of the "shocking" sensation, he was faint hearted....literally....my bet is (if w/e happened to his teacher is true) he would died of cardiac-arrest even when watching a horror movie anyway...

I must say that you're wrong there, or at least partially right...

VOLTS DOES KILL.

I happened to lay my arm across a pair of truck battery terminals once, and at that time I was sweaty...so I got a mild, 12V / 120A shock. It was 120 amp !!!, but nothing happened. Oh, the same goes for a electric welder aswell,..they're just hi amperage 12V A.C power supply box....it could give you quite a shock, but it won't kill you...(assuming you're a healthy person with no heart condition)

But if you touched a 220V / 60A power lines, there won't be a happy ending......ie; hi voltage kills

Conclusion : Hi-(whatever) KILLS !!!!! But with proper knowledge and equipment or tools, nothing bad will happen...

LOL ...

It is the current that kills, your battery is rated in terms of amp-hours, and the amount of current that it supplies to a load is determined by the resistance of a load, as any electric circuit is .. your 220V/60A line is the maximum power it can transmit without overheating etc..

It takes around 10mA (0.01A) to kill you if it gets through your heart.

I just measured the resistance between one hand to the other, and it comes out as about 500kohms, I=V/R so 12/500,000 = .000024 A , or 24 microamps ..

With wet fingers, it goes down to about 100kohms .. so about 120 microamps or 0.12mA ..
, at 220v you'll get almost 20 times more current, which would be about 2mA, enough to give you a reasonably nasty shock, but not necessarily kill you, this is with the small surface area of the probes of my multimeter and with a larger area the current can be much higher ..

And just about all of this resistance is in your skin, if the shock burns your skin it gets much lower resistance, letting quite large (>1A) currents going through you, if you put 12v onto open wounds it could kill you probably ..

So it is the current that kills, but you need that voltage to drive the current through ..

For the person that said about the 4 wires on the power lines, that's because it'll be 3 phase power transmission, so you have 3 live phases and a neutral, each house is usually hung off two of the phases for 220v, and one phase to neutral is 120, at least that's how I understand it .. The actual local-level transmission voltages are higher, around 3kv(3000v) but you have transformers to step it down to useful levels.

Now back on topic .. magnets can slow down a meter but they will have 'flags' to tell the person taking a reading that it's been tampered with ..
And they DO always check if it's been tampered with, if they see something odd they will check it out, and you can get fucked by them, even losing your electricity totally sometimes ..

actually to quote the above response, the voltage coming into the house is NOT 110/120. Its stepped down to that before it comes out of the breaker box. All your big switches are double that voltage for dryers and ovens and the like.
You really shouldn't be sayin this if you dont even know how it works. You have TWO 110/120 lines coming into your house, that gives you the 240 for dryer's and the like. The voltage at your power meter is only going to be 110/120.
so, in conclusion,
http://i33.tinypic.com/6tmgs1.jpg

You really shouldn't be sayin this if you dont even know how it works. You have TWO 110/120 lines coming into your house, that gives you the 240 for dryer's and the like. The voltage at your power meter is only going to be 110/120.


stfu acolyte.

I think I've read somewhere that some houses in the USA have 220V connections. (In Australia everything is on 230V).

Anyway to get 220V you would need a 220V line. Two 110V lines won't work because of the phasing.



To provide a solution to the OP: cut the power meter out of the circuit. Get a cable, find both of the cables going into the power meter and attach the new cable across the two cables. If you don't want it to be noticed by other residents then put a black box over it. Of course you need to remove it when they come to check the meters.

Anyway to get 220V you would need a 220V line. Two 110V lines won't work because of the phasing.


Incorrect.
To my understanding:
In the US, you have 3 phase power distribution, as it gets nearer to houses it get's stepped down to lower voltages and as it comes into your house it's down to 110/220v ..
Basically between one phase line and neutral you get 110v and between one phase line and another you get 220v, so when it actually comes into your house you get two of the three phase lines, which are distributed evenly between houses to get the phases balanced ..
For 220v, you connect between the two hot wires, and you get 110v by connecting between one of the hot wires and neutral ..

Incorrect.
To my understanding:
In the US, you have 3 phase power distribution, as it gets nearer to houses it get's stepped down to lower voltages and as it comes into your house it's down to 110/220v ..
Basically between one phase line and neutral you get 110v and between one phase line and another you get 220v, so when it actually comes into your house you get two of the three phase lines, which are distributed evenly between houses to get the phases balanced ..
For 220v, you connect between the two hot wires, and you get 110v by connecting between one of the hot wires and neutral ..

The three phases are 120 degrees apart. In the USA connecting any two phases together will be 208V.

The three phases are 120 degrees apart. In the USA connecting any two phases together will be 208V.

This. Actually, this is a fairly common way to run 220/240V appliances.

My gott, the level of ignorance and misunderstanding in regards to electricity and domestic power supply in this thread is ...electrifying...


To provide a solution to the OP: cut the power meter out of the circuit. Get a cable, find both of the cables going into the power meter and attach the new cable across the two cables. If you don't want it to be noticed by other residents then put a black box over it. Of course you need to remove it when they come to check the meters.

[a] that's not a practical solution,

I'm seeking for a power meter [B]hack, not a by-pass ...

I just did a huge post explaining everything you wanted to know.

All about NZ's power & its 240 V AC & 50hertz thing.
& NZ 3 phase & why 7 the different ways of 3 phase.

About the reason theres 3 phases & why they use 2 of them on each house & how.

All about how to by pass the meter, two different ways & how THEY check it & how to get past that.
& two other methods & how to clean that up too.

& because TOTSE wants you to log in every damn time you need to post.

It all got wiped.

This thread is dead to me now.

eesakiwi; when you have written up a post and TOTSE has timed out, right click on one of the links that link to within TOTSE, select open in new window and log in there. Then you can post the post.

People in here really don't know much about this stuff. Il state a few things.

This is for Au anyway but id be suprised if they didn't earth the Neutrals in the US.

There is a link between Neutral and Earth called MEN (main earth neutral). This brings everything down to the Ns voltage potentional. This prevents people from getting an electric shock when they touch something thats faulty and earthed.

Adding phases togther doesn't up the voltage. If you want 220v then you need a 22ov line in. Accross 2 phases in the US im guessing its 220 volts. If you want 120 then youd cross a phase and neutral. (Im not sure what your voltages are in the US but thats the general idea anyway)

Theres alot of different meters out there. Simply disconnecting the neutral from the meter will stop it from spinning. It's only there to power the meter. The power will still go through the line and the load side of the meter. Older meters anyway.

Some modern meters will measure the power factor and charge you for it

And if you do find a way of buggering your meter, dont steal all your power. Many fools have been caught like that

http://techpubs.sgi.com/library/dynaweb_docs/0650/SGI_Admin/books/OrOn2_SitePrep/sgi_html/figures/site.wire.220v.30a.us.gif

Bitchtits.

Ughhh.....since you all have a hard time imagining what I'm talking abooooot, here :

http://xs432.xs.to/xs432/08445/power_trip312.jpg

So, in theory (my own theory, nah actually it's a hypothesis),

House A could get electricity and without tripin' the power meter because it's neutral is terminated to the ground. It might work, but using earth as neutral is not very efficient.
It's called Single Wire-Earth Thingy. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_wire_earth_return)

So, static_firefly, do you live in the very back of the outback there ? Somewhere near mountain ? Outback Mountain perhaps ?:D

And on house B, my guess it it will absolutely work, cos you're using an actual neutral as the return path, just not yours.

House C is there cos there's some space left....


The main reason I prefer to bypass using the neutral line is because it's easier to handle (cos it's not live) and easier to connect as you can connect them from your breaker box INSIDE your home, and wired them to somewhere through your backyard...

So, hypothetically this hypothesis will work. Anyone want to give it a try or have any other comments/questions ?????

So, hypothetically this hypothesis will work. Anyone want to give it a try or have any other comments/questions ?????

At each house the neutral is bonded to earth , yes .. now I'm not hugely read up on US wiring, but if the bonding to earth is done before the meter then it should work. BUT you'd have to disable the ground falt inturrupter and bypass it, you'd also have no protection against faulty appliances, leading to a potentially dangerous situation ..

Word of warning: the power companies are good at spotting people who try to bypass the meters, and if they catch you they will Rape you 'till the sun shines out your ass ..
Things such as getting all your electricity cut off, paying heavy fines etc etc ..

At each house the neutral is bonded to earth , yes .. now I'm not hugely read up on US wiring, but if the bonding to earth is done before the meter then it should work. BUT you'd have to disable the ground falt inturrupter and bypass it, you'd also have no protection against faulty appliances, leading to a potentially dangerous situation ..

Word of warning: the power companies are good at spotting people who try to bypass the meters, and if they catch you they will Rape you 'till the sun shines out your ass ..
Things such as getting all your electricity cut off, paying heavy fines etc etc ..

Nein. Earth grounding is done at the power plant, all distribution stations, every time it passes a distribution transformer, and inside your home. The only possible power you could draw is EMF around the ground loop, and it will be practically nonexistent.

Honestly, I don't see any way that this could work. How do you guys come up with that?

Theres alot of different meters out there. Simply disconnecting the neutral from the meter will stop it from spinning. It's only there to power the meter. The power will still go through the line and the load side of the meter. Older meters anyway.

And if you do find a way of buggering your meter, dont steal all your power. Many fools have been caught like that


Yeah, thats it. "Cut the Black wire"

Some put a magnetic reed swith in line with the black wire & then put a tube of black 'shrink wrap' over the wire.
Then to stop the meter, put a magnet beside the wire.
or whatever (I guess you have to have a reed switch thats closed all the time)

Yeah the meter readers don't like seeing the lights on & the little disc not moving....
----------------------
Houses sometimes (mostly) use two phases, one for the hotwater & stove, the other for the wall sockets/lights etc.
That way theres a average over several houses, like theres people at home using power & theres no one at the next house > averages out.

What I don't get is why America use both 110Volt & 220 Volt.

We use 240 Volt & becouse we are sold shitty 220 volt light bulbs they are always blowing...
(except 3 Phase, which is only used in engeering etc & its 440 Volt anyway)

Antiquity of the 120V supply, really. 240VAC is more efficient, but stepping up the voltage along the distribution makes it a moot point until you get to the home where it is stepped down again to high current.

At each house the neutral is bonded to earth , yes .. now I'm not hugely read up on US wiring, but if the bonding to earth is done before the meter then it should work. BUT you'd have to disable the ground falt inturrupter and bypass it, you'd also have no protection against faulty appliances, leading to a potentially dangerous situation ..

NHOAAAA !111 NO NO NO NO !!!!11!!
+
*bangs head repeatedly onto my laptop*

You leave the earthline undisturbed. Like I said, YOU EARTH THE NEUTRAL, NOT CONNECT THE NEUTRAL TO THE EARTH/GROUND LINE !!!!

http://xs433.xs.to/xs433/08446/power_trip_2108.jpg

[a] either you connect it after it's going into the fuse/breaker box .... or...

before it goes into the fuse/breaker box.

Nein. Earth grounding is done at the power plant, all distribution stations, every time it passes a distribution transformer, and inside your home. The only possible power you could draw is EMF around the ground loop, and it will be practically nonexistent.


And what part of [B]SINGLE WIRE EARTH RETURN from that wikipedia link that did you *NOT* understand ?????
------------------------------
EDIT :
The only reason I did not post this in the BAD IDEA is because it's full of tards who think rubbing a degausser against DVD will damage it. Now am I getting the same thing here ?????

http://xs433.xs.to/xs433/08446/power_trip_2108.jpg

[a] either you connect it after it's going into the fuse/breaker box .... or...

[b] before it goes into the fuse/breaker box.


Looking at the diagram, yes it'd work , just cut it after it's been earthed, not before :) .. and cut it inside the breaker box so it's not visible to anyone taking a reading etc ..

Now, if you're proposing using the physical earth to 'steal' power from your neighbours through their grounded neutrals if you pounded in a few more earth rods and wired them properly so still safe etc it might work.. but the soil generally has a very high resistance/impedance and this varies with how wet etc the soil happens to be ..


As I said, they're not really people to mess with though, power companies have pretty much become experts at finding people who try to get around and if they do find you you'll be severely punished for it .. keep in mind that the kwh meter, while on your house, is their property ..

If they suspect power is being stolen they add up all the meter reading in the street for each phase and see if it matches the meter at the nearest transformer, substation etc. If they notice something odd they put a new meter on the pole that leads to your house and see whos stealing power there.

"So, static_firefly, do you live in the very back of the outback there ? Somewhere near mountain ? Outback Mountain perhaps ?"

I don't understand what you mean. I live in the city and im an electriction. Just to clear things up Aussie houses are single phase. Everything runs on 240v. Out the phase and back through the neutral.

Although this isnt on topic people who steal power join onto the mains into the house into a breaker then through a contactor which is controled via your real main switch. That way if the power guys come along and flick the main switch everything will go out.
If you dont use the contactor when they flick the switch heaps of shit will remain on :P.

Remember now simply take out the neutral on the meter and it will stop spinning. Some of the old meters will even spin backwards if there wired backwards.

However in AU the meters have seals on them that only the power company have so they know when they have been broken and the neutral has to be soldered so it can't be disconected although really if you know what your doing you could simply cut the black wire for a week or so and re solder it back on and no one is the wiser. Unless the new meters can detect this, I dunno.


I think I understand where your coming from when you talk about useing your neighbours Neutral now. You leave your neutral intact so the meter is still on however the current exits via your neighbours house.

Your earthing idea is the same but easyer. The current will flow to earth and accross to your neighbours earth stake and through the MEN onto there neutral. How far apart are your earth stakes?

I dunno enough about the meters to know if it will work or not. It would be pretty cool if it caused his meter to spin faster to account for the lost power :P but that might just be pipe dreams.

Just to clear things up Aussie houses are single phase. Everything runs on 240v. Out the phase and back through the neutral.

Our house has three phases. Many air conditioners are three phase.


However in AU the meters have seals on them that only the power company have so they know when they have been broken and the neutral has to be soldered so it can't be disconected although really if you know what your doing you could simply cut the black wire for a week or so and re solder it back on and no one is the wiser. Unless the new meters can detect this, I dunno.


Rather than cutting, it is less obtrusive if you simply desolder the wire and pull it out. Then solder it back on when you need to. No one will notice.

How far apart are your earth stakes?


That shouldn't matter.

Well I ment most houses are single phase anyway, just to show contrast to the US where they have 2 phases and a neutral (apperently)

If his plan is to run his meter useing the earth as a replacement for the Neutral the closer his earth stake is to his neighbours house will be important because thats where the current is going to go, right up his neighbours stake into the neutral and back to the station. Otherwise its going to have to go to the nearest transformer's earth stake.

Ok I see what you mean firefly.

And what part of SINGLE WIRE EARTH RETURN from that wikipedia link that did you *NOT* understand ?????

What part of the most basic functioning of the power meter do YOU not understand? You still have fucking 120V across the mains and you have current running through the metered side, therefore the meter is not going to be affected.

You do realize I'm an electrical engineer, right? Knowing this stuff is kinda my job...

Here is a pretty picture I drew you:
http://i36.tinypic.com/jtba6x.jpg

I don't understand what you mean. I live in the city and im an electriction. Just to clear things up Aussie houses are single phase. Everything runs on 240v. Out the phase and back through the neutral.

Nah, just wondering if you lived in the outback area, cos from the wiki link, it says that places in the outback of AU are using a SINGLE LINED grid. Just curious if you happened to know about it.....

=====================

What part of the most basic functioning of the power meter do YOU not understand? You still have fucking 120V across the mains and you have current running through the metered side, therefore the meter is not going to be affected.

Well, firstly, why then does every meter (I'm talking about analog meters here) have to have at least 4terminals. I mean, if a single line would suffice to make the power meter works, why would those manufacturers included another two(2) cooper terminals on their meter, it just don't seemed to make sense to me. I mean, why waste material (coopers in this case) on making unnecessary terminals ?

And secondly, what part of connecting a motor to a single live wire won't make it run did you not understand ???? Well, to me, a watt-hour-meter is just like an electric motor or a voltmeter/ammeter. It just can't work without a closed circuit. Reminder though....all these I am talking about is for ANALOG INSTRUMENTS and not the current electronic probes.

You do realize I'm an electrical engineer, right? Knowing this stuff is kinda my job...

Ummmkay, mind to answer these questions :

[a] What exactly is your current job description ?

[b] What product(s)/equipment(s) have you engineered insofar in your capacity as an electrical engineer ?

(i) independently
(ii) in collaboration with other fellow engineers/co-workers

[c] Have you been involved in and/or are currently involved in the research,design,development,engineering and manufacturing of any electrical instruments hereby referred to as watt-hour-meters ?

[d] Have you ever been involved in and/or are currently involved in the installation/uninstallation or the acts of installing/uninstalling of any electrical equipment hereinreferred to as "the watt-hour-meter" ?

[e] Do you have sufficient and complete knowledge at your disposal as to how an analog watt-hour-meter actually works ? Please be reminded that you're still under oath.....

Here is a pretty picture I drew you:
http://i36.tinypic.com/jtba6x.jpg

Would you please explain how Exhibit A facilitates/promotes a better understanding of "how a watt-hour-meter works" ??

____________________________________
"2000years ago, men are reminded to be aware of phalse prophets, least they be deceived and be lead to the path of sin in the name of GOD. Now, we have to be reminded to be aware of phalse engineers who present themself as an authority figure and lead you in the sacred name of ENGINEERING, to the path of illogicaldom"
-St.Metheburg.

Well, firstly, why then does every meter (I'm talking about analog meters here) have to have at least 4terminals. I mean, if a single line would suffice to make the power meter works, why would those manufacturers included another two(2) cooper terminals on their meter, it just don't seemed to make sense to me. I mean, why waste material (coopers in this case) on making unnecessary terminals ?

And secondly, what part of connecting a motor to a single live wire won't make it run did you not understand ???? Well, to me, a watt-hour-meter is just like an electric motor or a voltmeter/ammeter. It just can't work without a closed circuit. Reminder though....all these I am talking about is for ANALOG INSTRUMENTS and not the current electronic probes.

Because you have two inputs and two outputs.

And it is a closed circuit. If you used your own ammeter and voltmeter when you plugged in a DVD player or some shit it would still work as well. There is still 120V across the power to ground and there is current running through the power lead, therefore the power meter is going to record your consumption. And I don't understand why you stipulate that it must be an analog instrument, since both analog and digital mutimeters work by the same principles. A digimeter isn't just a magic device with a pixie inside that tells you how much voltage or current is flowing through a wire.

[a] What exactly is your current job description ?

[b] What product(s)/equipment(s) have you engineered insofar in your capacity as an electrical engineer ?

(i) independently
(ii) in collaboration with other fellow engineers/co-workers

[c] Have you been involved in and/or are currently involved in the research,design,development,engineering and manufacturing of any electrical instruments hereby referred to as watt-hour-meters ?

[d] Have you ever been involved in and/or are currently involved in the installation/uninstallation or the acts of installing/uninstalling of any electrical equipment hereinreferred to as "the watt-hour-meter" ?

[e] Do you have sufficient and complete knowledge at your disposal as to how an analog watt-hour-meter actually works ? Please be reminded that you're still under oath.....

[a] Over the summer I began working for the USDA as a technician, and I do not have all my papers back to me. Before that I was a student researcher for the National Center for Physical Acoustics.

[b] I designed data aquisition software for the NCPA. That particular model recorded local temperature flux whose figures were used to test theories for a joint USDA/NCPA project used for counting fish by sonar. Independantly.

[c] Negative.

[d] Negative.

[e] I do believe so. The operation is of the movement of a spinning aluminum disk whose propulsion is a magnetic field repulsing an eddy current in said aluminum disk. Such propulsive force is directly proportional to the voltage and current.

Would you please explain how Exhibit A facilitates/promotes a better understanding of "how a watt-hour-meter works" ??


This particular technical schematic illustrates the fact that current still flows along the power wire going out of a meter even though the return path has been severed. The internal voltmeter inductor still has current going through it at all times, and the ammeter shunt or magnetic pickup als as current going through it in this case, assuming that current is being drawn.