http://thezeitgeistmovement.com/

The Goal:
The Means is the End:
We intend to restore the fundamental necessities and environmental awareness of the species through the avocation of the most current understandings of who and what we truly are, coupled with how science, nature and technology (rather than religion, politics and money) hold the keys to our personal growth, not only as individual human beings, but as a civilization.

i for one agree. So i joined ¬_¬

You don't need to join this stupid movement to find hope and understanding in our species. Read a philosophy book and then live outdoors for a few weeks, you'll find your own understanding of what life truely means.

To hell with this zeigest garbage.

You don't need to join this stupid movement to find hope and understanding in our species. Read a philosophy book and then live outdoors for a few weeks, you'll find your own understanding of what life truely means.

To hell with this zeigest garbage.

to hell with you! the first one was great, but the second one is just inspiring and gives hope. its all about unity and abandoning outdated detrimental traditions of the past.its about being open minded and be presented with information that is not conspiracy, its FACT. you can research it for yourself. about 10 percent of it is debatable i doubt you even watched the second one, because i promotes open mindedness, and self scrutiny. just like science. in the end its not "zeitgeist" that matters its the information it conveys and hopefully instills upon you. zeitgeist may not be the center of the impending revolution, but its on the forefront in the mainstream which helps open people's eyes to it. open your eyes. wake up.

and YOU need to read a grammar book, truly.

You don't need to join this stupid movement to find hope and understanding in our species. Read a philosophy book and then live outdoors for a few weeks, you'll find your own understanding of what life truely means.

To hell with this zeigest garbage.

this.

to hell with you! the first one was great, but the second one is just inspiring and gives hope. its all about unity and abandoning outdated detrimental traditions of the past.its about being open minded and be presented with information that is not conspiracy, its FACT. you can research it for yourself. about 10 percent of it is debatable i doubt you even watched the second one, because i promotes open mindedness, and self scrutiny. just like science. in the end its not "zeitgeist" that matters its the information it conveys and hopefully instills upon you. zeitgeist may not be the center of the impending revolution, but its on the forefront in the mainstream which helps open people's eyes to it. open your eyes. wake up.

and YOU need to read a grammar book, truly.

I'm going to agree with the other guy.

For example, you say the movie promotes open-mindedness, therefore you must have an open mind. But apparently you DONT b/c you are telling ppl to go to hell b/c they dont believe your BS. So you curse them out and what not. sounds really fascist to me

I just joined it.

The peasants trying to beat the overlords. Maybe this time.

I read about the "venus project"....Communist Manifesto

I'm going to agree with the other guy.

For example, you say the movie promotes open-mindedness, therefore you must have an open mind. But apparently you DONT b/c you are telling ppl to go to hell b/c they dont believe your BS. So you curse them out and what not. sounds really fascist to me

This basically. The entire conspiracy subculture isn't very open to disagreement. It presents simple ideas as absolute truth (spock casually proclaims an entire set of ideas to be fact etc.) without citing sources, and calls everyone who argues with them sheep.

The pdf on that website, on the other hand, avoids making specific claims, appeals to things people consider obvious and without spending any time making a connection states that they imply that his terrible idea of utopia is the way we need to do things. He says that change is good, and people need to be more accepting of it for advancements to be made. Incredibly, he cites the industrialization of killing that took place during the world wars as an example of this. That entire phenomenon wasn't the product of sheer human ingenuity, it was a consequence of multiple nations with the imperialism fueled idea that they were invincible and could easily destroy anyone they wanted requiring victory over one another at any cost. Tanks were not what changed the shape of the war, the need to change the shape of the war was why tanks were invented. The tactical advantages required were specified, and the tank was developed from scratch with those in mind.

Need drives change, not the other way around.

Need drives change, not the other way around.
I stand in the middle, based on this. I think Joseph is right in saying that this "age" has to come to an end, you can see how it's straining to survive anyway. I think that in the next 10 years or so there will be a major war or conflict--and this will be the catalyst for the change he's talking about.

This "Zeitgeist Movement" is a really bad idea because while it preaches the right ideas, it inspires countless emo 15-year-old pseudo-intellectuals who don't understand them. Joseph kind of reminds me of Leary in a way, minus the drugs and whatnot.

I'm pretty sure that people will eventually realize the sense of what he's saying, but really the only thing he's saying in Addendum (the 2nd video) which is the script for Zeitgeist Movement is that
1. there will be change
2. accept it when it happens
3. he doesn't know how to start it; he simply says to "self-educate" which I think is great. We as humans would be much better off if people self-educated themselves and I think that's at the core of this whole thing.

I didn't join this, btw. I think there are too many people in it who would just force it down my throats when they haven't done any work themselves, which is probably exactly the opposite of what Joseph wanted.

I stand in the middle, based on this. I think Joseph is right in saying that this "age" has to come to an end, you can see how it's straining to survive anyway. I think that in the next 10 years or so there will be a major war or conflict--and this will be the catalyst for the change he's talking about.

This "Zeitgeist Movement" is a really bad idea because while it preaches the right ideas, it inspires countless emo 15-year-old pseudo-intellectuals who don't understand them. Joseph kind of reminds me of Leary in a way, minus the drugs and whatnot.

I'm pretty sure that people will eventually realize the sense of what he's saying, but really the only thing he's saying in Addendum (the 2nd video) which is the script for Zeitgeist Movement is that
1. there will be change
2. accept it when it happens
3. he doesn't know how to start it; he simply says to "self-educate" which I think is great. We as humans would be much better off if people self-educated themselves and I think that's at the core of this whole thing.

I didn't join this, btw. I think there are too many people in it who would just force it down my throats when they haven't done any work themselves, which is probably exactly the opposite of what Joseph wanted.

At the heart of his plan is machine control of law/governing. I wouldn't have any problem with that, except for one thing; he mentioned giving them the ability to modify themselves.

If there's one surefire way to fuck ourselves over, it's that. Recursive algorithm using environmental noise as a parameter = fucking unpredictable. I don't care how you do it, but the end result is most certainly something along the lines of all humans being killed so that sculptures can be constructed out of our fingernails.

I also don't like how he talks about how we should be using the scientific method and then goes ahead and claims that very specific things will work, based on some sort of vague theories about human society. He's making these claims without actually verifying anything.

Personally I think he's wrong about all that; human greed, fear, pain and suffering is, while stupid and pointless in excess, still the primary force behind everything we're proud of as a species. This isn't really backed up any more than his ideas, it's just that I've seen how difficult it is to try to accomplish something without impending disaster looming in the background. Without a motivating force, people will do whatever gives them the greatest immediate satisfaction, and unless they learn to derive that satisfaction from steps towards a larger goal (very difficult when you're trying to learn new things).

Basically, if no one had to do anything, how many people do you think would end up just sitting at home drinking beer and watching tv and pursuing all the other ways we've come up with to entertain yourself, all the time? What would people in such a world have to live for?

In general I think any effort at purposefully organizing human society is wrong and ill conceived. Everyone is different, everyone needs to make their own lives. It's not the place of other people to tell them how they should do that. The value of life can't be put in terms of a function of how much everyone has or how well we cooperate or how resources are distributed; the value of life is what you make it, and people need to let you do that.

the end result is most certainly something along the lines of all humans being killed so that sculptures can be constructed out of our fingernails.

I actually found this image morbidly interesting.

This basically. The entire conspiracy subculture isn't very open to disagreement. It presents simple ideas as absolute truth (spock casually proclaims an entire set of ideas to be fact etc.) without citing sources, and calls everyone who argues with them sheep.

The pdf on that website, on the other hand, avoids making specific claims, appeals to things people consider obvious and without spending any time making a connection states that they imply that his terrible idea of utopia is the way we need to do things. He says that change is good, and people need to be more accepting of it for advancements to be made. Incredibly, he cites the industrialization of killing that took place during the world wars as an example of this. That entire phenomenon wasn't the product of sheer human ingenuity, it was a consequence of multiple nations with the imperialism fueled idea that they were invincible and could easily destroy anyone they wanted requiring victory over one another at any cost. Tanks were not what changed the shape of the war, the need to change the shape of the war was why tanks were invented. The tactical advantages required were specified, and the tank was developed from scratch with those in mind.

Need drives change, not the other way around.

most people are divided on petty issues. the point of zeitgeist is for people to realize the self scrutiny and openness of "the movement" or revolution, or whatever it IS that's impending. the point is finding a commonality in which most people share. well, at least "US" and not "THEM" which eventual unity will make clear: who is who. i claim no absolute truths if you'll read what i wrote about it. not zeitgeist necessarily, but right now it happens to be bringing to light the absolute corruption of the false institutions. all it does is present for the most part, indisputable facts and saying "isnt it OBVIOUS whats going on here?" zeitgeist only cleverly presents what people who have been paying attention already know to people who are brainwashed by all the false institutions, which is a fairly easy thing to fall victim to. there will always be alarmists like david icke to discredit the genuine conspiracy that does exist. but, there is one. i dont believe in the far out stuff about aliens and an the anunaki and all of that shit, but people everywhere know something is not right, and have for a while. one of the best quotes from the film is along the lines of "history prior to the enlightened age will always be spoken of as corrupt"


its true. we must rise above tradition, imperialism, nationalism, materialism, false institutions, assumed self importance, the illusion of separateness, and the dissolution of as much ego-based thought processes as possible. i call nobody sheep, find a commonality. love your brothers and sisters as we are ALL starstuff.

I stopped watching it about a minute into it because the old mans voice is annoying and hard to understand and he seemed to be rambling about pointless bullshit.

I stopped watching it about a minute into it because the old mans voice is annoying and hard to understand and he seemed to be rambling about pointless bullshit.
Then you have no qualification to post in this thread; GTFO.

Then you have no qualification to post in this thread; GTFO.

When other people will watch a movie, I'll get more enjoyment out of reading a review of it. I read about it and the old man at the beginning was an alcoholic dumbass that exploited other dumbasses. The movie has a good message, question authority, etc, but the beginning is shit and the film is only for people who don't know what I've known for years. So I won't bother watching it.


As with other conspiracy theory films like "fahrenheit 911" people aren't going to pay enough attention and it won't really change anything. The elite will still rule the world.

all it does is present for the most part, indisputable facts and saying "isnt it OBVIOUS whats going on here?" zeitgeist only cleverly presents what people who have been paying attention already know to people who are brainwashed by all the false institutions, which is a fairly easy thing to fall victim to. there will always be alarmists like david icke to discredit the genuine conspiracy that does exist. but, there is one. i dont believe in the far out stuff about aliens and an the anunaki and all of that shit, but people everywhere know something is not right, and have for a while. one of the best quotes from the film is along the lines of "history prior to the enlightened age will always be spoken of as corrupt"


its true. we must rise above tradition, imperialism, nationalism, materialism, false institutions, assumed self importance, the illusion of separateness, and the dissolution of as much ego-based thought processes as possible. i call nobody sheep, find a commonality. love your brothers and sisters as we are ALL starstuff.

That's the problem I'm talking about. It states that these connections are obvious, without demonstrating that it is so. All it really does is offer explanations, that if true, would explain the specific things mentioned. it's the A->B, B, therefore A fallacy.

Acknowledging that we are all connected is a good thing, but you can't just go around building a new world on the idea that you can force everyone else to care about your well being.

You can't just throw away everything an expect your replacement to be better either. Whatever their flaws, our institutions have been contributed to for as long as we've been around by people genuinely trying to make them better. Everything we have today; ideals, technology, legal rights, social mobility, vast war free regions of the world, we've been moving towards this constantly.

Who are you to say that your ideas are superior to the collective effort of so many people, the collective experience of so many years? How can any theory possibly compare to that?

How true is one's overcoming of ego if they approach making a difference in the world as if they carry a messianic voice of higher authority when they are but a man? The world doesn't respond to directives: they ask for reasons, signs, explanations. More so when the carrier of a message has the deportment of the very problem he speaks against.

No man I've met knows how to transform a broken world into a utopia. Accepting that is part of humility: there is no perfect fix we humans are capable of. I cannot be completely free from ego, we cannot be completely selfless, we cannot be perfect. This is no excuse to give up and flounder in the face of life and waste my talents; rather, it is a chance to recognize my own state of being as needing improvement, and working on maturing as an individual, thereby slowly contributing to society as a whole. Through the development of my character, I found that I paint reality by who I am, not what I preach.

How true is one's overcoming of ego if they approach making a difference in the world as if they carry a messianic voice of higher authority when they are but a man? The world doesn't respond to directives: they ask for reasons, signs, explanations. More so when the carrier of a message has the deportment of the very problem he speaks against.

No man I've met knows how to transform a broken world into a utopia. Accepting that is part of humility: there is no perfect fix we humans are capable of. I cannot be completely free from ego, we cannot be completely selfless, we cannot be perfect. This is no excuse to give up and flounder in the face of life and waste my talents; rather, it is a chance to recognize my own state of being as needing improvement, and working on maturing as an individual, thereby slowly contributing to society as a whole. Through the development of my character, I found that I paint reality by who I am, not what I preach.
that's very poetic of you

so what? the guy that made this movie is some kind of functionalist sociologist now? Machine control? fuck that

I laugh at all the kids that write this garbage all over college campuses with chalk. So you hate the current system, most people do, but it's as good as it gets. You just be thankful you can always buy food at a local grocery store. Our ancestors would have killed for that privilage but all we have to do is crystalize labor into money.

Live life for what it is, for you will soon be dead anyway.

i recognize the fact that we are but a crude step between neanderthals and super-beings, but i choose to cognitively function on a level beyond a seemingly doomed superficial society. i can't help that some of you choose to remain stagnant in an ape-like materialistic mindset. rise above the ways of old and ascend into a new age, where we dont need paper and scarcity to govern our culture. help us transcend i into the age of the starchild, wont you?





nah. i'm just a silly idealist pinko.

but i've hung those shoes up to dry. i now identify as a humanist. i want my species to ascend to the stars.

all of you guys calling for machines to rule, haven't you seen "the terminator"? or any of its sequels??

i want my species to ascend to the stars.
sometimes I wish I could live in the future to see that, but then I think that the future also has potential for major and epic fail.

sometimes I wish I could live in the future to see that, but then I think that the future also has potential for major and epic fail.

always has, probably always will.

One point the movie makes is technology is being stunted, in some regards, by big business. I think we can all agree here.

What is everyone's thoughts on the steps we can all take to move forward with positive change?

For example, I like the idea of thermal energy. It seems communities could ban together to generate energy from geo-thermal, thus removing dependency on big oil. I have a friend building a home now using geo-thermal to heat and cool his house.

Are there any sites, we can share, that discuss getting away from our dependency on big business through advances in technology?

Are there any sites, we can share, that discuss getting away from our dependency on big business through advances in technology?
You're posting in it, newbie. :D

the zeitgeist movement and idea is all about unity and to respond to our true spiritual nature, anyone who has read philosophy in a conscious way has a sense of our spiritual nature and our natural search for the truth. the zeitgeist movement encourages us to that search for truth. anyone who understands the actual state of the world knows there's something very very wrong about money, poverty and how goods are distributed, the zeitgeist movement doesn't claim to be the perfect solution but a step towards human development and a more equal society at least. with that said I support the zeitgeist movement and encourage everyone to watch both movies and come up with your own conclusions.

One point the movie makes is technology is being stunted, in some regards, by big business. I think we can all agree here.

What is everyone's thoughts on the steps we can all take to move forward with positive change?

For example, I like the idea of thermal energy. It seems communities could ban together to generate energy from geo-thermal, thus removing dependency on big oil. I have a friend building a home now using geo-thermal to heat and cool his house.

Are there any sites, we can share, that discuss getting away from our dependency on big business through advances in technology?

I hate to play at being Argonplasma here, but it isn't that simple. We are FUCKED without oil.

It is impossible to maintain current crop yields without petrochemical derived fertilizers. You can't replace enough nitrogen in the soil without them.
It is of course possible through crop rotation, nitrogen fixing crops, ect to sustainably produce large amounts of food - probably more now then historically since we know what we're doing to a greater degree.
BUT if lose something like a third of current crop yields through not having nitrogen fertilizers, and yet more through not having industrially produced pesticides even an "agricultural" society with a much lower standard of living than we have today isn't going to be able to support 7 billion people.

I can't believe this piece of shit thread has 1100 views.

I hate to play at being Argonplasma here, but it isn't that simple. We are FUCKED without oil.

It is impossible to maintain current crop yields without petrochemical derived fertilizers. You can't replace enough nitrogen in the soil without them.
It is of course possible through crop rotation, nitrogen fixing crops, ect to sustainably produce large amounts of food - probably more now then historically since we know what we're doing to a greater degree.
BUT if lose something like a third of current crop yields through not having nitrogen fertilizers, and yet more through not having industrially produced pesticides even an "agricultural" society with a much lower standard of living than we have today isn't going to be able to support 7 billion people.

Mesquite, which grows as a weed through the entire southwest, is self fertilizing and from what I can remember has a greater alcohol yield per acre than corn does(but not by much).

I'm not saying that Mesquite is an end all for fuel consumption, but we have an incredible amount of options that most people have never considered. This country is filled with an incredible amount of intelligence and ingenuity, if given the chance I am sure that this problem could easily be overcome.

The most interesting method of producing alcohol based fuels I have ever heard of is doing part of the purification of sewage using cat tail marshes(which is considered useless land) then making fuel out of the cellulose produced by the cat tails.



I think the concept of the Zeitgeist movement is a good idea but it could use some work. It is a good step forward from what we have been putting up with before though.

I hate to play at being Argonplasma here, but it isn't that simple. We are FUCKED without oil.

It is impossible to maintain current crop yields without petrochemical derived fertilizers. You can't replace enough nitrogen in the soil without them.
It is of course possible through crop rotation, nitrogen fixing crops, ect to sustainably produce large amounts of food - probably more now then historically since we know what we're doing to a greater degree.
BUT if lose something like a third of current crop yields through not having nitrogen fertilizers, and yet more through not having industrially produced pesticides even an "agricultural" society with a much lower standard of living than we have today isn't going to be able to support 7 billion people.

Who says you need soil to grow crops? A family could easily start a small hydroponic garden that could yield large amounts of food. Enough to feed several families year round and supply them with a diet much healthier than they could ever get popping vitamins and buying weeks old, pesticide laden, malnourished plants from the grocery store.

I feel as though the Zeitgeist Movement is a step in the right direction. In the movie Joseph even said that this system is not perfect, and in fact was not considered a "utopia." I being of a spiritual nature FEEL the change that the movement can bring about. Based on books I have read that explain where we went wrong, how we could change, and the outcome of those changes; if feel this movement falls in line with those ideals in a positive light. We as a race KNOW something is wrong and rather than to keep perpetcuating(sp) the same old why not try somethingn new....we have nothing to lose but our misery. Nothing ventured nothing gained...We are heading into a time of spiritual awakening and whether you like it or not is is going to happen. The "energy" of the planet is increasing and the frequency causes change. Look around you and notice all the blogs, forums, and groups aimed at change..you would not find that years ago. For those of you who know about the Indigo Children...why do you think they were sent here...why do you think the old souls are returning?? With enough time the new will replace the old and we will fall in line with our divine purpose. I believe everything we are experienceing as a race, culture, even species is in relation to the one directive: UNIFINCATION. We can not have the good without the bad, and it is through the bad that we will all want the good. I'm rambling but there is a lot more than just the zeitgeist movement. In closing I support the zeitgeist movement as well as any other organization that promotes social change and spiritual awakening. I hope that all those who are doubtful or against the change will soon come to your senses and help those who have been trying to help you.

Much Luv

Infinite01

Who says you need soil to grow crops? A family could easily start a small hydroponic garden that could yield large amounts of food. Enough to feed several families year round and supply them with a diet much healthier than they could ever get popping vitamins and buying weeks old, pesticide laden, malnourished plants from the grocery store.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydroponics
Plant nutrients are dissolved in the water used in hydroponics and are mostly in inorganic and ionic form. Primary among the dissolved cations (positively-charged ions) are Ca2+ (calcium), Mg2+ (magnesium), and K+ (potassium); the major nutrient anions in nutrient solutions are NO3− (nitrate), SO42− (sulfate), and H2PO4− (dihydrogen phosphate).

Numerous 'recipes' for hydroponic solutions are available. Many use different combinations of chemicals to reach similar total final compositions. Commonly-used chemicals for the macronutrients include potassium nitrate, calcium nitrate, potassium phosphate, and magnesium sulfate.

Today practically all nitrates are produced with ammonia from the Haber process.
Have fun with producing enough fertilizer without either fossil fuels or limitless energy.
In addition having additional hours of light from electric lighting also helps.