I'm looking into buying a 4x4 SUV for off road use in the California deserts. I would be taking people with me to camp for a couple of days at a time, so a truck isn't really an option. There is just too much gear to pack.

Most of the areas I would be going would be hot arid climates, Death Valley for example. Of course, this vehicle would get it's share of woodland mud driving as well. This would need to be able to withstand days of off road abuse without breaking down.

My budget is only about $3500.

I was thinking about the Toyota 4runner, I've heard they're pretty great cars, except for the head gasket issues in the second generation. I was thinking about maybe an early third generation 4runner, around 1996-1998. They are within my price range and seem fit, but I really don't want to go diving in head first without some research.

I also like the Range Rover, but I am beginning to think that they might be a bottomless money pit, despite the cheap price. Parts, I'm sure, are expensive.

So, what does gearheads think? I'm open to other options too, anything within my price range is great.

First and second generation Rangies are, IMO, the best for reliability and parts. The third gen P38A had issues with the air suspension and the bored-out Rover V8 had a nasty habit of loosening its cylinder liners. Also, the P38A's electrical system was very complex.

Engines the earlier model came with were the 3.5 V8, 200TDI, 300TDI and the 3.9 in the US I think. Aim for the 300TDI if you want reliability as it's the simplest engine there, although the 3.9 is one hell of a lot more powerful. It's EFI, but the electricals aren't as complex as the later generations.

A truck is going to hold a hell of a lot more cargo than a 4runner ever will.

get a mid 90's jeep cherokee with a 4.0L. reliable, capable, easy and cheap to fix with an absolutly bottomless aftermarket. you can scale everything about the mods to you budget, and you should be able to get a decent starter vehicle with ~$3000.

A truck is going to hold a hell of a lot more cargo than a 4runner ever will.

This.

http://freenet-homepage.de/BJ45/Overloaded_Nissan.jpg http://www.swapmeetdave.com/Humor/Workshop/OL-Higgins.jpg

This.

http://freenet-homepage.de/BJ45/Overloaded_Nissan.jpg http://www.swapmeetdave.com/Humor/Workshop/OL-Higgins.jpg

That is hilarious. But I need indoor cargo space, because all of our gear (tents, backpacks, sleeping bags, food, water, flashlights) needs to be out of the rain/mud.

First and second generation Rangies are, IMO, the best for reliability and parts. The third gen P38A had issues with the air suspension and the bored-out Rover V8 had a nasty habit of loosening its cylinder liners. Also, the P38A's electrical system was very complex.

Engines the earlier model came with were the 3.5 V8, 200TDI, 300TDI and the 3.9 in the US I think. Aim for the 300TDI if you want reliability as it's the simplest engine there, although the 3.9 is one hell of a lot more powerful. It's EFI, but the electricals aren't as complex as the later generations.

Wow, it sounds like the later Range Rovers have a whole host of electrical demons to deal with. I can deal with most mechanical failures, but if there is an electrical problem, I usually can't handle it, and I hear paying for labor is fairly expensive on Rovers.

I'll definetly look into the earlier models. They are, however, sort of rare around here, but still around. Do you know any particularly good years? Or just anything in the first and second generation?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the 300TDI and the 200TDI are turbo-diesels, right? Sounds spectacular. :)
get a mid 90's jeep cherokee with a 4.0L. reliable, capable, easy and cheap to fix with an absolutly bottomless aftermarket. you can scale everything about the mods to you budget, and you should be able to get a decent starter vehicle with ~$3000.

I was also looking into those, they are absolutely everywhere! Cheap parts too. I just don't know a whole lot about them. My friend's dad used to have one, and it seemed like it had enough torgue to get through most situations.

meh, I throw a tarp on and call it a day. Also, Rubermaid tubs are fucking awesome;)

You guys do know that the canopy on teh back of 4Runners is removeable, right? If you want to use the 4Runner for transporting dirtbikes, just take the canopy off. It's pretty easy. The aftermarket ones are even easier, for some 4x4s. Weigh less and therefore easier to get off and on, not quite as sturdy though.
The 4x4 versus Ute/Pickup thing is a non issue.

You should get a big ol tarpaulin like Jimany said, either way. You can use them as tents, to cover your gear, to keep stuff from falling off the back, as a windbreak tied to the side of your vehicle, to carry shit on (including an injured person), to screen off a changing room or shitter, put them on the ground to stop moisture coming up into your bedding, and even as slip n slides if you pull into a caravan park at any stage.

I've used them for all those things and more. They're pretty much essential, no matter what kinda 4x4 you get. And they store easy. Underneath the drivers & passengers seat for small ones, under/behind the back seat (pull the cushion up/forward, where you usually store the guns/rifles) for the larger ones, and in the bottom of the bed for the real big suckers. Don't get a hole in them though. The plastic ones that usually come in blue or silver are the best IMHO. The canvas ones are a different beast entirely, not even tarpaulins really.

Nissan pathfinder! I had a V6 one, very capable even in stock trim, and reliable. The 4 banger should be good too although underpowered. The jeep cherokee is a good truck BUT they LOVE to break offroad and otherwise have a number of reliability problems.

You could just get a pickup and put a cap on it to keep your stuff 'safe', you know. Ideally, a X-tra cab.... but newer ones will definitely be out of your price range. Toyotas and nissans are the way to go, 4 cylinders for optimum reliability and mileage.... 6 for grunt or hauling power.

^Yeah, from experience & reputation, the old Nissan Patrols are very good, as are Toyota Landcruisers, and some Hiluxes.

You guys do know that the canopy on teh back of 4Runners is removeable, right?

Not since 1989.

I am bias.

Hilux/4runner is the way to go. I have the second gen 3.0l turbo. I drive close to 100miles a day to work and back. At work, i drive on all sorts of terrain mud, metal/rock, sand, rubbish, you name it. And in the last three years, it has yet to give me any problems. It has some 370,000km on the clock. No problem. Give them a test run.
They will not be as fast or powerful as their american counterparts, but when it comes to taking it off road, nothing comes close. And as always, they are built like a tank.

Not since 1989.

EDIT: After hitting google to get a pic to show you, I saw that you guys got 4Runners we didn't get. We only got the first (lots of those) and some 2nd generation 4Runners. My mistake.

I am bias.

Hilux/4runner is the way to go. I have the second gen 3.0l turbo. I drive close to 100miles a day to work and back. At work, i drive on all sorts of terrain mud, metal/rock, sand, rubbish, you name it. And in the last three years, it has yet to give me any problems. It has some 370,000km on the clock. No problem. Give them a test run.
They will not be as fast or powerful as their american counterparts, but when it comes to taking it off road, nothing comes close. And as always, they are built like a tank.

I heard the second generation had head gasket issues. Is there anything about your 4runner you dislike? What kind of mileage do you get with the turbo?

I heard the second generation had head gasket issues. Is there anything about your 4runner you dislike? What kind of mileage do you get with the turbo?

I'm getting 400 to a 50l tank. I have real no issues with it.

The speakers are crap, they are 4" front and back, sound like crap and no changing them unless you are keen on cutting up the interior.

The thing that might piss you off the most is the tailgate. It opens up downwards, like a pickup. And that can be a bitch. The third gens have a door that opens upwards, like station-wagons. If you prefer that.

Third gens have more power, more space, different engines. The interior is much better, much more creature comforts.
But, really besides the look they are totally different machines.

Also, the third gen added a center diff, so i guess it could be seen as AWD rather than 4WD. I guess thats a good thing.

Ah, and the gasket problem does not exist on the 3.0. Its on the smaller engines, which i would not reccomend anyway. If you need a heavy-duty spartan workhorse, I dont think there's much to outclass the Hilux/4Runner. But you could always look at the 70-series LandCruiser. Or hell, even the FJ40 if you dont mind it being. Bang for the buck.

Get a cherokee, all the offroad guys around her have them. They are cheap, reliable, easy to work on, easy to mod. Solid axle front and rear. They have a lot of cargo room, you can fold the rear seat and sleep in them.

http://www.pirate4x4.com

Is a massive 4x4 forum, American based.
I'm sure they could give you a lot better advice then totse

http://www.pirate4x4.com

Is a massive 4x4 forum, American based.
I'm sure they could give you a lot better advice then totse

get the fuck uto you fuckig condescending papsmeaar.

Alright, so I've decided on the 3rd generation 4Runner. They don't have the head gasket problem of the second generation, and they have loads of power. Plus, it's a comfy ride. I'm still searching on craigslist for a good deal though. Another plus is that parts are almost as cheap as Jeeps, because there is such a huge surplus here.