View Full Version : a few questions about magnets
starjones
2008-12-29, 03:14
1. is it possible to make a liquid magnet? im curious because ive hear when you cut a magnet in half, no matter how many times, it will always have a north and south pole. and so what, weather its possible or not, would the magnet (theoretically if its not possible) do?
2. what would happen it you took many many magnets and created a hollow sphere with all the north poles facing inward and all southpoles outword. then, make a solid sphere to fit inside the hollow shere, and you made the solid sphere out of magnets with the north pole pointing out ward
would the ball float?
3. if you took an object suspended in air by a magnet, (like the device above), put it in a vacuum, then gave it a spin, would it ever stop spinning?
is missing
2008-12-29, 03:41
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
i doubt the liquid magnet thing. sure, you can get induced paramagnetism, but real ferromagnetism doesn't seem like it would happen.
actually, im pretty sure the guy above me doesn't know what he is talking about.
l33t-haX0r
2008-12-29, 05:22
1. is it possible to make a liquid magnet? im curious because ive hear when you cut a magnet in half, no matter how many times, it will always have a north and south pole. and so what, weather its possible or not, would the magnet (theoretically if its not possible) do?
2. what would happen it you took many many magnets and created a hollow sphere with all the north poles facing inward and all southpoles outword. then, make a solid sphere to fit inside the hollow shere, and you made the solid sphere out of magnets with the north pole pointing out ward
would the ball float?
3. if you took an object suspended in air by a magnet, (like the device above), put it in a vacuum, then gave it a spin, would it ever stop spinning?
1. You can get ferromagnetic particles suspended in a fluid, or a ferrofluid. As for a magnetic liquid i'm pretty sure you need a crystal structure for ferromagnetism, so no. Water becomes magnetic in the presence of a large magnetic field (paramagnetism), see the levitating frog.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=me5Zzm2TXh4&feature=related
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=zpBxCnHU8Ao&feature=related
2. There would be no magnetic field inside or outside either spherical shell so nothing would happen. Maxwell's laws say that the magnetic flux through a closed surface is zero. You can think of it as adding loads of tiny vector arrows pointing in the direction of the field at every place inside or outside the shell. They would all add to give zero.
3. If you suspended an object above a superconducting magnet using the Meissner effect and set it spinning in a vacuum i don't think it would ever stop. I think it's pretty much the same as setting something spinning in space.
Sentinel
2008-12-29, 17:06
Eh what about hysteresis? And induced currents and such? Isn't something spinning in a magnetic field going to have some sort of internal resistance to the changing magnetic field (from the frame of reference of the object spinning)?
But again, they do have magnetic bearings, which, although are NOT frictionless, are pretty darn close.
2. There would be no magnetic field inside or outside either spherical shell so nothing would happen. Maxwell's laws say that the magnetic flux through a closed surface is zero. You can think of it as adding loads of tiny vector arrows pointing in the direction of the field at every place inside or outside the shell. They would all add to give zero.
Does no net flux imply no field at any point inside? I should hope not, my good sir, or I could use that to prove that there is no magnetic field at any point in space :O
Mantikore
2008-12-30, 13:14
http://www.unitednuclear.com/magnets.htm
go down to magnaview fluid
starjones
2008-12-30, 19:26
http://www.unitednuclear.com/magnets.htm
go down to magnaview fluid
holy shit, (from the link)
"Beware - you must think ahead when moving these magnets.
If carrying one into another room, carefully plan the route you will be taking. Sensitive instruments like computers & monitors will be affected in an entire room. Loose metallic objects and other magnets may become airborne and fly at great speed to attach themselves to these magnets. If you get caught in between the two, you can be severely injured. These magnets will crush bones in the blink of an eye.
Two of these magnets close together can create an almost unbelievable magnetic field that can be incredibly dangerous.
Of all the unique items we offer for sale, we consider these items the most dangerous of all. Our normal packing & shipping personnel refuse to package these magnets - our engineers have to do it. This is no joke or exaggeration - and we cannot stress it strongly enough. You must be extremely careful - and know what you're doing with these magnets.
Two Supermagnets can very easily get out of control, crush fingers and instantly break ribs or even your arm if opposing poles fly at each other.
A small child recently lost his hand when his father left two # 31 supermagnets unattended. The child picked one up and when he approached the other magnet on a nearby table,
it became airborne and obliterated his small hand.
starjones
2008-12-30, 19:31
http://www.unitednuclear.com/magnets.htm
go down to magnaview fluid
THAT IS AWESOME (and cheaper than i thought it would be, i might buy some)
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l162/jojo_mcpoppins/magnaview.jpg
^liquid magnet
Sentinel
2008-12-31, 20:33
Yeah that magnetic fluid is some COOL shit. Did you read about how they can use it to make super-low friction ball bearings?
Also, those super-huge magnets are fuckin' sweet. I have plans somewhere for a levitating bed using eight of those. The corners would be chained to posts, so it wouldn't flip over!
starjones
2008-12-31, 22:19
Yeah that magnetic fluid is some COOL shit. Did you read about how they can use it to make super-low friction ball bearings?
Also, those super-huge magnets are fuckin' sweet. I have plans somewhere for a levitating bed using eight of those. The corners would be chained to posts, so it wouldn't flip over!
you might want to reconsider the bed thing, according to the website:
"Beware - you must think ahead when moving these magnets.
If carrying one into another room, carefully plan the route you will be taking. Sensitive instruments like computers & monitors will be affected in an entire room. Loose metallic objects and other magnets may become airborne and fly at great speed to attach themselves to these magnets. If you get caught in between the two, you can be severely injured.
you might want to reconsider the bed thing, according to the website:
"Beware - you must think ahead when moving these magnets.
If carrying one into another room, carefully plan the route you will be taking. Sensitive instruments like computers & monitors will be affected in an entire room. Loose metallic objects and other magnets may become airborne and fly at great speed to attach themselves to these magnets. If you get caught in between the two, you can be severely injured.
As long as you kept it in a relatively empty room, it should work fine. It is possible to keep your computer/porn storage device more than 10 feet from where you sleep.
Psychiatrist_7
2009-01-04, 23:36
As long as you kept it in a relatively empty room, it should work fine. It is possible to keep your computer/porn storage device more than 10 feet from where you sleep.
Then that day comes along where you bring that hooker home and her various ho rings and bracelets are ripped from her body and you have to find a place to bury her as she bleeds to death in your empty magnetic bed room.
Carbonbased
2009-01-05, 07:51
I have to wonder if it would all of that magnetism would be safe/healthy in the long run, haven't strong magnetic fields been shown to cause memory loss (that may have only been in supper electro magnets). Also I don't thing the amalgam in dental filings is that paramagnetic being primarily silver but still your laying on hundreds of pounds of magnetic potential.
And if all of the chains broke at once the bed could flip and you would be crushed horribly;)
But still that magnetic bed still sounds fucken cool :D
starjones
2009-01-05, 19:48
could you freeze a liquid magnet?
crazygoatemonky
2009-01-07, 07:19
1. is it possible to make a liquid magnet? im curious because ive hear when you cut a magnet in half, no matter how many times, it will always have a north and south pole. and so what, weather its possible or not, would the magnet (theoretically if its not possible) do? Don't think so. But you could, I guess, get liquid-like magnets (hence that guy's link).
2. what would happen it you took many many magnets and created a hollow sphere with all the north poles facing inward and all southpoles outword. then, make a solid sphere to fit inside the hollow shere, and you made the solid sphere out of magnets with the north pole pointing out ward
would the ball float?
No. Think about it, for each pair of north poles repelling each other on the bottom, there would be the same thing on top. They'd all cancel. Not to mention which, it's actually pretty easy to make things float with magnets (Maglev trains, those little toys with the ring magnets, etc.) when the magnetic forces are exactly opposite the gravitational ones.
3. if you took an object suspended in air by a magnet, (like the device above), put it in a vacuum, then gave it a spin, would it ever stop spinning?
In theory no. In practice: yes, there will always be some minute amount of air causing resistance.
wolfy_9005
2009-01-08, 03:55
In theory no. In practice: yes, there will always be some minute amount of air causing resistance.
Air resistance....in a vacuum....the question the guy was asking i think was "if i suspended an object with a magnet in a vacuum and spun it would it stop/slow down?"
Where the air in a vacuum coming from to slow it down?
crazygoatemonky
2009-01-08, 09:25
Air resistance....in a vacuum....the question the guy was asking i think was "if i suspended an object with a magnet in a vacuum and spun it would it stop/slow down?"
Where the air in a vacuum coming from to slow it down?
In practice there's no such thing as a perfect vacuum. That's all I was really saying. In theory, a sphere rotated and suspended in a vacuum would never stop. In reality, it would (slowly).
is missing
2009-01-08, 18:30
To all you fuckers saying it would spin forever in a theoretically perfect vacuum: go fuck yourselves. This is like third grade level shit.
A rotating magnet generates electric current in surrounding metal conductors. Surrounding = at any distance. The resulting current is inversely proportional to the square of the distance but, since it is not possible to remove all conducting components to an infinite distance, they will slowly extract the mechanical energy of rotation. If this magnet exists anywhere in the universe, it is impossible for it to spin forever, even if it is contained in a theoretically perfect vacuum.
And, RAOVQ, you can fuck yourself too. I know exactly what I'm talking about.
l33t-haX0r
2009-01-08, 20:53
To all you fuckers saying it would spin forever in a theoretically perfect vacuum: go fuck yourselves. This is like third grade level shit.
A rotating magnet generates electric current in surrounding metal conductors. Surrounding = at any distance. The resulting current is inversely proportional to the square of the distance but, since it is not possible to remove all conducting components to an infinite distance, they will slowly extract the mechanical energy of rotation. If this magnet exists anywhere in the universe, it is impossible for it to spin forever, even if it is contained in a theoretically perfect vacuum.
And, RAOVQ, you can fuck yourself too. I know exactly what I'm talking about.
Who ever said the magnet is rotating?
The law you are looking for is that the induced EMF is proportional to the rate of change of flux linkage.
Mantikore
2009-01-09, 08:36
could you freeze a liquid magnet?
well, if its the magnaview fluid, youd just have to freeze the liquid its suspended in i guess
How do you build a sphere with the whole surface being one pole? If you can build that, then there is a lot of money to be made.