Log in

View Full Version : Religion and Science


trustt
2009-01-02, 01:32
In this age where we cannot even think of our life without a Cell Phone do you think we still need to practice religion so as to not get labeled as Atheists? Frankly, Religion is coming in our way of everything we do or want to do. I mean take the example of Gene Engineering we surely have to find a way out of this mess..:)

Roxberry
2009-01-02, 03:27
In this age where we cannot even think of our life without a Cell Phone do you think we still need to practice religion so as to not get labeled as Atheists?
Are you or does someone you know actually practice a religion because of a fear or dislike, etc. of the "atheist" label?

What does the "Cell Phone" age have to do with those not wanting labels? I don't get the relationship between your first sentence and the following two.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-02, 05:22
. I mean take the example of Gene Engineering we surely have to find a way out of this mess..:)

Why? Why can we not create? Gods create, why can't we?

trustt
2009-01-03, 16:07
Why does Religion not support Clone Engineering??

countdown2chaos
2009-01-03, 16:49
Why does Religion not support Clone Engineering??

I don't know, I'm not religious, I'm just spiritual.

Rizzo in a box
2009-01-03, 17:40
Why? Why can we not create? Gods create, why can't we?

We can not create anything, we only piece together parts of other creation and call it something new.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-03, 23:55
We can not create anything, we only piece together parts of other creation and call it something new.

Agreed, however I did not mean "create" as the tense you took it. Such as the original source "created" the Infinite Creator and the Infinite Creator created the Logos, and they created sub-logos who created sub-logos, etc. All the same, all One, cannot "create" what has always been.

BrokeProphet
2009-01-04, 02:08
Why pray for a miracle to rid you of your infection, when you can go to the store, get some orange peel mold, and be done?

Why pray to walk again, when a doctor can use stem cells to cure you?

Why pray for a kidney transplant when a doctor can go to your vat grown clone, rip out a kidney, and have you out of the hospital and pissing like a teenager in just a few days?

-----------

As scientific knowledge increases, God gets smaller. God, even now, fills ONLY the gaps of scientific knowledge. The only realms God gets power in (soul, afterlife, etc.) are realms of "knowledge" that could have been easily made up bullshit.

As we begin to shrink those gaps, God will just seem more and more like Zeus and Thor. Who are dead now b/c we know thunder and lightning are the results of static electricity, releasing of electrons and so forth. Not b/c God's fight in our big 'ol scary sky.

This is why I believe religion has attempted, with some success even to this day, to keep it's boot on the neck of scientific achievement.

----------

Bronze Age beliefs dictating our scientific progression FTL.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-04, 06:54
As scientific knowledge increases, God gets smaller. God, even now, fills ONLY the gaps of scientific knowledge.

This is why I believe religion has attempted, with some success even to this day, to keep it's boot on the neck of scientific achievement.

However, you are only semi-right, religion of the west maybe, but scientific knowledge doesn't contradict Taoism or Buddhism or Hinduism or Shinto.
As science goes on, religion may decline, but spirituality will not, it can and will only rise as people become more enlightened and see through Dogma and religious bullshit and come closer to the true Original Source.

BrokeProphet
2009-01-04, 23:24
However, you are only semi-right, religion of the west maybe, but scientific knowledge doesn't contradict Taoism or Buddhism or Hinduism or Shinto.
As science goes on, religion may decline, but spirituality will not, it can and will only rise as people become more enlightened and see through Dogma and religious bullshit and come closer to the true Original Source.

Those religions are designed differently and you are correct, the Eastern religions allow for more scientific thought. I personally think Hinduism is the best designed in regards to adapting towards new scientific information.

And as science goes on and Jesus goes the way of Zeus and Thor, it seems he might be replaced by Xenu, or Joseph Smith. Who knows when these things become mythology. Who knows what religion spirituality will lead us to, and what detrimental effects this new God or Gods will have on humankind. I say detrimental b/c by just looking at the track record thus far, it seems likely.

I appreciate you condemnation of religious dogma and rhetoric, but I believe spirituality ultimately enables such dogma and rhetoric. All it takes is a few charismatic assholes to lie about something EASILY lied about (spirit, god, afterlife) and BAM you have a new religion breathing down the neck of the secular.

I am of the opinion that religion should just go away and take its primary enabler spirituality with it.

trumbly
2009-01-05, 06:54
orange peel mold? for an infection? have you really taken that for an infection?
Anyway, during christmas I noticed the history channel was scientifically proving a lot of the christian religious happenings, like the burning bush, the plagues of Egypt, other stuff I can't remember right now. They did a pretty good job.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-05, 07:08
orange peel mold? for an infection? have you really taken that for an infection?
Anyway, during christmas I noticed the history channel was scientifically proving a lot of the christian religious happenings, like the burning bush, the plagues of Egypt, other stuff I can't remember right now. They did a pretty good job.

I have no problem with "miracles" Quantum physics is key to that. I can move a light pen and a needle and paper with willing myself to do so, call that "magick" "telekinesis" w/e you want. Not a big deal.

l33t-haX0r
2009-01-06, 17:59
I have no problem with "miracles" Quantum physics is key to that. I can move a light pen and a needle and paper with willing myself to do so, call that "magick" "telekinesis" w/e you want. Not a big deal.

How is quantum physics key to miracles? Can you explain yourself?

Also, it is a big deal.

If you can move a needle and paper using thought alone then please take yourself to the closest scientific institution and evidence your claims. It will be the biggest discovery and revolution in science.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-06, 20:00
How is quantum physics key to miracles? Can you explain yourself?

Also, it is a big deal.

If you can move a needle and paper using thought alone then please take yourself to the closest scientific institution and evidence your claims. It will be the biggest discovery and revolution in science.

Hm, let me rephrase, big deal to ignorant people who ignore universal truths and energy.
And quantum physics is working with energy, and how energy connects everything, there is nothing but energy, thought is energy, "God" created through "thought" how else would we be here? All is in the mind. If I want a needle to move, I make it move by thought.

Simple enough to understand?

l33t-haX0r
2009-01-06, 20:44
Hm, let me rephrase, big deal to ignorant people who ignore universal truths and energy.
And quantum physics is working with energy, and how energy connects everything, there is nothing but energy, thought is energy, "God" created through "thought" how else would we be here? All is in the mind. If I want a needle to move, I make it move by thought.

Simple enough to understand?

Deepak Chopra and others including yourself should stop hijacking the term quantum physics as a metaphor for fabricated spiritual mechanisms. It doesn't add any credibility to your abstract platitudes. Let's be honest here, your ideas do not involve quantum physics.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-07, 03:25
Deepak Chopra and others including yourself should stop hijacking the term quantum physics as a metaphor for fabricated spiritual mechanisms. It doesn't add any credibility to your abstract platitudes. Let's be honest here, your ideas do not involve quantum physics.

Don't exactly know who that guy is, besides ArmsMerchant saying his name before, and answer this, does, or does not quantum physics deal with energy? Simple question, a yes or a no would suffice. And "abstract platitudes" lol, and since when did I need any credibility from the ignorant? I was never looking for credibility. People like you make me lol. ;)

PastorSehmish
2009-01-07, 07:16
The simple truth (visit my website (http://www.thesimpletruth.com.au)) is that God makes physics work, and the only reason you can take accurate measurements of anything is because God is consistent. Without God the universe would simply implode.

Glad I could enlighten you all.

God Bless,
Dr Pastor Emeritus Wayne Sehmish

l33t-haX0r
2009-01-07, 09:17
Don't exactly know who that guy is, besides ArmsMerchant saying his name before, and answer this, does, or does not quantum physics deal with energy? Simple question, a yes or a no would suffice. And "abstract platitudes" lol, and since when did I need any credibility from the ignorant? I was never looking for credibility. People like you make me lol. ;)

Physics deals with energy, the first law of thermodynamics deals with energy, bioenergetics deals with energy. Why quantum phyics? Quantum is just a buzzword used by new age groups, cults and healers. Can you justify why you are using the term quantum physics or explain how quantum physics ties in with your claims of telekenisis?

Remarks like "energy is everything", "we are all connected through energy", "the spiritual quality of the rock", "god is consistent", "thought is energy", "god created through thought" are meaningless comments.

You can invent these platitudes all you like as long as you accept that they are just abstract fabricated beliefs that have no relevance to the real word until supported by some sort of theoretical framework that can be tested and found to agree with the evidence.

The problem that I have is that you claim to have some sort of framework involving quantum physics, then you also claim to have experiemental evidence, the fact that you can use thought to move a needle. Why don't you prove this to the scientific community? Are you going to let the biggest discovery in the in human history pass you by? Or have you just bullshitted your way too far, because in the real world there is not spiritual mysticism to hide behind, either you can do it, or you are a liar. Which one?

countdown2chaos
2009-01-07, 12:24
Physics deals with energy, the first law of thermodynamics deals with energy, bioenergetics deals with energy. Why quantum phyics? Quantum is just a buzzword used by new age groups, cults and healers. Can you justify why you are using the term quantum physics or explain how quantum physics ties in with your claims of telekenisis?

Remarks like "energy is everything", "we are all connected through energy", "the spiritual quality of the rock", "god is consistent", "thought is energy", "god created through thought" are meaningless comments.

You can invent these platitudes all you like as long as you accept that they are just abstract fabricated beliefs that have no relevance to the real word until supported by some sort of theoretical framework that can be tested and found to agree with the evidence.

The problem that I have is that you claim to have some sort of framework involving quantum physics, then you also claim to have experiemental evidence, the fact that you can use thought to move a needle. Why don't you prove this to the scientific community? Are you going to let the biggest discovery in the in human history pass you by? Or have you just bullshitted your way too far, because in the real world there is not spiritual mysticism to hide behind, either you can do it, or you are a liar. Which one?

Your pretty funny actually, I could really care less what the scientific community thinks really. And why quantum physics, hmmm:

it is more fundamental than classical mechanics and classical field theory. Notable amongst these principles are both a dual wave-like and particle-like behavior of matter and radiation, and prediction of probabilities in situations where classical physics predicts certainties. Classical physics can be derived as a good approximation to quantum physics, typically in circumstances with large numbers of particles. Thus quantum phenomena are particularly relevant in systems whose dimensions are close to the atomic scale, such as molecules, atoms, electrons, protons and other subatomic particles. Exceptions exist for certain systems which exhibit quantum mechanical effects on macroscopic scale; superfluidity is one well-known example. Quantum theory provides accurate descriptions for many previously unexplained phenomena such as black body radiation and stable electron orbits.

Source: Wikipedia of course for a simple explanation.
And once again, prove to who, what?
And I'm so sorry new agers or whatever use the term too, never read any new age material. So, can't say whether I agree or not with them.
And I never said these two quotes: "the spiritual quality of the rock", "god is consistent," thanks for putting words into my mouth.

an you justify why you are using the term quantum physics or explain how quantum physics ties in with your claims of telekenisis?
Okay, You already agreed Quantum physics deals with energy and sub-atomic partials, even from a physics example, everything is energy, protons, electrons, neutrons. They're all connected and have the same base of constantly flowing, moving energy. Everything in the Universe is composed of Energy of one form or another, including your thoughts. According to the discoveries in Quantum Physics, all forms of matter and energy are attracted to that which is of a like vibration.

Everything vibrates, try reading the 7 Hermetic principles in the Kybalion.
It just seems your the one with the wrong definition of Quantum Physics

Edit: And just an FYI, my friends use to give me the same bullshit until I proved them wrong the way you want me to through action, but why would I want to bring that to the scientific community? I want others to figure things out themselves, which science will do so eventually anyways.

shuu
2009-01-07, 12:47
accidently deleted what was in this post somehow

PastorSehmish
2009-01-07, 13:10
- but energy (potential to cause various phenomena) would actually be the vibration itself of the proposed substance.

And God created that vibration when he spoke the words of creation.

God Bless,
Doctor Pastor Emeritus Wayne Sehmish

countdown2chaos
2009-01-07, 21:06
Correct me if I'm wrong but the hermetic kybalion seems to imply there is a substance which in a 'denser' form is what is identified as matter - it vibrates at different frequencies and at a lower frequeny it is matter. That substance is identified as 'energy' - but energy (potential to cause various phenomena) would actually be the vibration itself of the proposed substance.

Nope, you hit in on the dot. And Ironically I wrote a paper about that today in school.
Or rather a sum total of energy, vibrations, 'all is mind' and the law of attraction.

l33t-haX0r
2009-01-07, 22:34
Your pretty funny actually, I could really care less what the scientific community thinks really. And why quantum physics, hmmm:

it is more fundamental than classical mechanics and classical field theory. Notable amongst these principles are both a dual wave-like and particle-like behavior of matter and radiation, and prediction of probabilities in situations where classical physics predicts certainties. Classical physics can be derived as a good approximation to quantum physics, typically in circumstances with large numbers of particles. Thus quantum phenomena are particularly relevant in systems whose dimensions are close to the atomic scale, such as molecules, atoms, electrons, protons and other subatomic particles. Exceptions exist for certain systems which exhibit quantum mechanical effects on macroscopic scale; superfluidity is one well-known example. Quantum theory provides accurate descriptions for many previously unexplained phenomena such as black body radiation and stable electron orbits.

Source: Wikipedia of course for a simple explanation.
And once again, prove to who, what?
And I'm so sorry new agers or whatever use the term too, never read any new age material. So, can't say whether I agree or not with them.
And I never said these two quotes: "the spiritual quality of the rock", "god is consistent," thanks for putting words into my mouth.

an you justify why you are using the term quantum physics or explain how quantum physics ties in with your claims of telekenisis?
Okay, You already agreed Quantum physics deals with energy and sub-atomic partials, even from a physics example, everything is energy, protons, electrons, neutrons. They're all connected and have the same base of constantly flowing, moving energy. Everything in the Universe is composed of Energy of one form or another, including your thoughts. According to the discoveries in Quantum Physics, all forms of matter and energy are attracted to that which is of a like vibration.

Everything vibrates, try reading the 7 Hermetic principles in the Kybalion.
It just seems your the one with the wrong definition of Quantum Physics

Edit: And just an FYI, my friends use to give me the same bullshit until I proved them wrong the way you want me to through action, but why would I want to bring that to the scientific community? I want others to figure things out themselves, which science will do so eventually anyways.

I'm not going to debate with you. Some people don't need discrediting, they discredit themselves.

shuu
2009-01-08, 06:18
Nope, you hit in on the dot. And Ironically I wrote a paper about that today in school.
Or rather a sum total of energy, vibrations, 'all is mind' and the law of attraction.

I'm pretty sure quantum physicists don't assert the existance of that kind of energy...
ie this:

a substance which in a 'denser' form is what is identified as matter - it vibrates at different frequencies and at a lower frequeny it is matter.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-08, 12:15
I'm pretty sure quantum physicists don't assert the existance of that kind of energy...
ie this:

Some don't, some do.

Cytosine
2009-01-08, 15:49
Some don't, some do.

Then what the hell is it? If they assert that this matter exists; where could it exist in our universe?

I've read your other posts, and I honestly wonder if you're just trolling. That being said, I run into "new age" types all the time.

If you are so enlightened and have come to understand physical truths of the universe beyond scientific understanding, then fucking prove it. Move something with your mind. Just walk up to someone from CERN and make a pen levitate 12 feet in the air.

I agree that we are "one" with the Universe, and all is "connected" in a sense. But you take it way too far. Understanding this does not give you "thuper powahs", and quantum physics will agree with me on this. Anyone who says otherwise is a hack in my experience.

There is a "truth" to yourself and the Universe, but acting like a brainy 13 year-old who read (and barely understood) "A Brief History of Time" and a Dan Brown novel sure isn't it.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-08, 20:06
Then what the hell is it? If they assert that this matter exists; where could it exist in our universe?

I've read your other posts, and I honestly wonder if you're just trolling. That being said, I run into "new age" types all the time.

If you are so enlightened and have come to understand physical truths of the universe beyond scientific understanding, then fucking prove it. Move something with your mind. Just walk up to someone from CERN and make a pen levitate 12 feet in the air.

I agree that we are "one" with the Universe, and all is "connected" in a sense. But you take it way too far. Understanding this does not give you "thuper powahs", and quantum physics will agree with me on this. Anyone who says otherwise is a hack in my experience.

There is a "truth" to yourself and the Universe, but acting like a brainy 13 year-old who read (and barely understood) "A Brief History of Time" and a Dan Brown novel sure isn't it.

I'll take this piece by piece,

"Then what the hell is it? If they assert that this matter exists; where could it exist in our universe? "
-Don't understand what your asking.

"I've read your other posts, and I honestly wonder if you're just trolling. That being said, I run into "new age" types all the time."
-If you read my post, then you would have read before, I don't really know much about "new age" beliefs.


"If you are so enlightened and have come to understand physical truths of the universe beyond scientific understanding, then fucking prove it. Move something with your mind. Just walk up to someone from CERN and make a pen levitate 12 feet in the air."
-When did I comment on how "enlightened" I was and what I understand and do not? And what's the point of proving something to people who just want to disprove it? And I never said I could make a pen levitate 12 feet. ;) I can push it though. Have you ever tried to push a needle? Do it, I want you to try it yourself, put a needle on a frictionless surface and imagine it to move, think about it moving, and will the needle to move and only concentrate on the needle moving. You'll be amazed. ;)

"I agree that we are "one" with the Universe, and all is "connected" in a sense. But you take it way too far. Understanding this does not give you "thuper powahs", and quantum physics will agree with me on this. Anyone who says otherwise is a hack in my experience."
-Who said understanding something will "give you powers" (what are powers anyways?) understanding something is understanding something, doing something is doing something, completely different. If you are able to do something, wonderful, good for you, but what does it matter? Not to mention it takes practice, not knowledge or "enlightenment" to move a needle or a pen across a piece of glass. I love it when people put words into others mouths.

"There is a "truth" to yourself and the Universe, but acting like a brainy 13 year-old who read (and barely understood) "A Brief History of Time" and a Dan Brown novel sure isn't it."
-Never read a Dan Brown novel, and never heard of "A brief history in time." And what is acting brainy exactly?

Rizzo in a box
2009-01-09, 07:58
I actually got into all the fringe stuff I'm into because of this article on Consciousness & Quantum Reality:

http://twm.co.nz/herbert.htm

Rust
2009-01-13, 15:35
Okay, You already agreed Quantum physics deals with energy and sub-atomic partials, even from a physics example, everything is energy, protons, electrons, neutrons. They're all connected and have the same base of constantly flowing, moving energy. Everything in the Universe is composed of Energy of one form or another, including your thoughts. According to the discoveries in Quantum Physics, all forms of matter and energy are attracted to that which is of a like vibration.

I have no problem with "miracles" Quantum physics is key to that. I can move a light pen and a needle and paper with willing myself to do so, call that "magick" "telekinesis" w/e you want. Not a big deal

Care to substantiate any of that?

People here don't doubt your ability to bullshit on the Internet. We accept you are quite adept at that. We want you to show how you're not full of shit. If you're not going to, then please shut the fuck up. Thanks.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-15, 02:21
Care to substantiate any of that?

People here don't doubt your ability to bullshit on the Internet. We accept you are quite adept at that. We want you to show how you're not full of shit. If you're not going to, then please shut the fuck up. Thanks.

Here, I will prove it to you, try yourself, really, take a needle and put it in a glass surface and imagine it moving, ask it to move, then will it to move, and in your mind, make it move forward, and after not forcing, but concentrating, it will move. And about the other person who said why don't you show CERN. lol, they already know this stuff, don't you think? They just hide it from you of course, do you think they want to blab off about that kind of stuff, and me show myself do it when everyone will just find someway to try and disprove it furthering an argument? Try it yourself, you are the best source of information. So I will prove I'm "not full of shit" by you doing it. And ability? Its not an "ability," it just like breathing, is breathing really an ability? Well, maybe, but you get the point. Just try it yourself.

Rust
2009-01-15, 02:44
Here, I will prove it to you, try yourself, really, take a needle and put it in a glass surface and imagine it moving, ask it to move, then will it to move, and in your mind, make it move forward, and after not forcing, but concentrating, it will move.

...

So I will prove I'm "not full of shit" by you doing it. And ability? Its not an "ability," it just like breathing, is breathing really an ability? Well, maybe, but you get the point. Just try it yourself.


Well I tried it and nothing happened. I concentrated on the needle moving, I visualized it moving in my mind, and it did not move. I told it to move, and it did not move. You are full of shit, it appears. Of course, the easy cop-out is to claim that I'm doing it wrong, which is, I'm guessing, why you wanted me to try it in the first place and provide absolutely nothing else to substantiate the things you've alleged.


Also, you made plenty of other claims besides the needle (e.g. "everything is energy, protons, electrons, neutrons.").

GoRdo
2009-01-15, 05:43
Well I tried it and nothing happened. I concentrated on the needle moving, I visualized it moving in my mind, and it did not move. I told it to move, and it did not move. You are full of shit, it appears. Of course, the easy cop-out is to claim that I'm doing it wrong, which is, I'm guessing, why you wanted me to try it in the first place and provide absolutely nothing else to substantiate the things you've alleged.


Also, you made plenty of other claims besides the needle (e.g. "everything is energy, protons, electrons, neutrons.").

umm everything is energy essentially? matter is energy, space is energy, energy is energy? if theres something other than that im sure its energy aswel?!? I know that guy is a fake but, he wasnt lieing about that.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-15, 12:23
Well I tried it and nothing happened. I concentrated on the needle moving, I visualized it moving in my mind, and it did not move. I told it to move, and it did not move. You are full of shit, it appears. Of course, the easy cop-out is to claim that I'm doing it wrong, which is, I'm guessing, why you wanted me to try it in the first place and provide absolutely nothing else to substantiate the things you've alleged.


Also, you made plenty of other claims besides the needle (e.g. "everything is energy, protons, electrons, neutrons.").

Besides being stupid in your 2nd part of the post, it takes some practice, don't expect to do it the first time. Its pointless to prove this any other way, one reason it is not working though is doubt, you doubt it will move I'm sure, thought is energy and will keep it there.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-15, 12:24
umm everything is energy essentially? matter is energy, space is energy, energy is energy? if theres something other than that im sure its energy aswel?!? I know that guy is a fake but, he wasnt lieing about that.

What's fake?

Rust
2009-01-15, 15:17
Besides being stupid in your 2nd part of the post,

What's stupid about wanting you to substantiate that utter nonsense?

Not everything is "energy" in Science. Science does not define "energy" as "everything". It defines it as the capacity to do work.

Not to mention that the phrase you used was "everything is energy, protons, electrons, neutrons" which either means you think everything is all those things at the same time - which is wrong - or that it's one of those things at least - which means you've made a distinction between energy and those particles.

Before you call what I say stupid, read a fucking book.


it takes some practice, don't expect to do it the first time. Its pointless to prove this any other way, one reason it is not working though is doubt, you doubt it will move I'm sure, thought is energy and will keep it there.

Another ridiculous cop-out. You haven't shown that this would work without doubt, much less that doubt would affect it in this way.

We can say the exact same ridiculous and baseless assertions of anything (e.g. "Say 'abracadabra frogitus maximus' and a frog will appear... Oh, but if it doesn't work it means you're doubting it").

Either substantiate your claims or admit that you cannot.

Rust
2009-01-15, 15:19
umm everything is energy essentially? matter is energy, space is energy, energy is energy? if theres something other than that im sure its energy aswel?!? I know that guy is a fake but, he wasnt lieing about that.

No, it isn't. Science doesn't define energy as "everything".

So either you're wrong, or you're using an unscientific definition to deal with scientific concepts.

countdown2chaos
2009-01-15, 20:21
What's stupid about wanting you to substantiate that utter nonsense?

Not everything is "energy" in Science. Science does not define "energy" as "everything". It defines it as the capacity to do work.

Not to mention that the phrase you used was "everything is energy, protons, electrons, neutrons" which either means you think everything is all those things at the same time - which is wrong - or that it's one of those things at least - which means you've made a distinction between energy and those particles.

Before you call what I say stupid, read a fucking book.



Another ridiculous cop-out. You haven't shown that this would work without doubt, much less that doubt would affect it in this way.

We can say the exact same ridiculous and baseless assertions of anything (e.g. "Say 'abracadabra frogitus maximus' and a frog will appear... Oh, but if it doesn't work it means you're doubting it").

Either substantiate your claims or admit that you cannot.

Everything is energy, everything comes down to an atom doesn't it? What is an atom? It is energy isn't it? ;) Thanks.
And once again, thought is energy, how did "god" or w/e you believe create? thought, he thought, and as a result of thinking, it became, thought is energy. And I am substantiating my claims, I'm trying to get you to do it yourself then that will be all the proof you ever need rather than me doing it on video which I have no access to first of all, then secondly you'd try to find some problem with what I was doing. Hence is why I'm telling you to do it yourself, not as a cop-out, your the best source of information, do it yourself, actually try to, practice at it. You'll do it soon enough, I assure you with my life.

BrokeProphet
2009-01-15, 21:03
You'll do it soon enough, I assure you with my life.

I am having some trouble with getting this to work also. I appreciate such a level of confidence in my supernatural ability potential however. Since you assert it can happen "soon enough" and do so with your life as collateral, I would like to put a time frame on this.

If Rust and myself are unable to do it, after say 2 weeks of trying, will you kill yourself? It is just energy transference right? No big deal, right? Just put in your will that you would like pics of your dead body posted on totse.

If I am able to do it, it will only be the start of it, of course. I intend to hone this energy (force?) power and throw the moon into the Earth.

I should be able to do it right? I mean the moon, Earth and myself are all the same thing right?

---------A few questions---------

Why hasn't a wizard such as yourself hurled the moon into the Earth by now?

What other wizardly powers do you have?

What kinds of wizardly powers do others have, and what kinds (if any) are impossible to have?

Azure
2009-01-15, 21:30
This was addressed centuries ago. :rolleyes:

Society progresses through three distinct stages of being. As one stage progresses into the other, the previous stage loses a great deal of importance, and eventually withers away altogether.

The first stage is the Theological stage. This stage was required for early man(read as primitive) to gain an understanding of the basic questions of humanity, ie, Why are we here? How did we come into being? And so on and so forth. This could be described as the "Child" era, if given a human lifeline. The child attributes human characteristics to an unknowable and unseen power, much as a child would attribute actions and speech to a favorite toy.

Following that comes the adolescent stage of Metaphysics. In this stage, the world is described in abstract terms and impersonal explanation. Common phrases of this stage include abstract notions of unseen "forces" and "essences". The further this stage progresses towards the final period, the more the preceding stage loses influence, as humanity is PROGRESSING.

The Positivity stage refers to scientific explanation based on observation, experiment, and comparison. Positive explanations rely upon a distinct method, the scientific method, for its justification. This is also referred to as the Adult stage, as it relies on rational, intelligent thought based on scientific fact that only a fully adapted being could comprehend.

Rust
2009-01-15, 22:12
Everything is energy, everything comes down to an atom doesn't it?

Wrong. The atom is comprised of sub-atomic particles. Those sub-atomic particles and in turn comprised of other different particles.

"Everything" does not come down to an atom.

What is an atom? It is energy isn't it? ;) Thanks.

According to who? The mass of atoms can definitely be converted into energy through a couple of different processes, sure. The keyword there being converted.

As in, "I'll convert these pieces of wood into a house". Pieces of wood aren't houses.



I am substantiating my claims, I'm trying to get you to do it yourself then that will be all the proof you ever need rather than me doing it on video which I have no access to first of all, then secondly you'd try to find some problem with what I was doing. Hence is why I'm telling you to do it yourself, not as a cop-out, your the best source of information, do it yourself, actually try to, practice at it. You'll do it soon enough, I assure you with my life.

1. You made more claims than just the needle remark, hence if you were actually trying to substantiate your claims as you say, you would be supporting those as well. Instead, you focus on the needle, and then make a small comment about atoms. You made more claims than that. Get to it.

2. I have tried, more than once, and it has done nothing. When do I stop? Once it works? And if you are full of shit - as everything as of now suggests? Then what? I try till I'm dead?

Tell me a reasonable number of times I have to try until your "substantiation" is a failure.