This is like almost like watching a tennis match between a pro & a one-legged moron.:D

I've lived most of my life in an area with a significant jewish population, about 7mi east of downtown, Donnie knows where I'm talking about, and while I've known several Huffmans and Hoffmans NONE of them were kikes.
Same with Metzgers and Schwartz's among other German names that get bandied about here as being automatically jewish.
Hell, in all of this great country of ours you can probably find more than one jew named Alex Linder.
The ones who claim to be able to tell a jew solely by name are the same ones who say they can tell a kike with just a glance of a snapshot.

Search further back, anyone, even you can find out the truth, but it takes time and effort.

In other words, you have zero proof. Understood.

Can you answer the following: What is the name of LBJ's "primary biographer" you spoke of?

What is the name of the book he wrote where he claims LBJ was a Jew?

Or was that a lie, Fred?

I linked the source, if you choose to ignore it, that's your perrogative. But to refuse to review the data and cast aspersions in the dark, that says alot about you.

In other words, I'm an asshole with no proof of anything I've said.

Fuck off shitbag.

I linked the source, if you choose to ignore it, that's your perrogative.[sic] But to refuse to review the data and cast aspersions in the dark, that says alot[sic] about you.


That's a lie, Fred.

You never linked a source to any "primary biographer" or a book he wrote claiming LBJ was a Jew.

Why can't you just give the name of the individual or this alleged book?

How hard is that?

Fuck off shitbag.


Originally Posted by Donnie in Ohio
In other words, I'm an asshole with no proof of anything I've said. (spoofed post by Fred)




Who is ranting now, Fred?

You have nothing, but your empty assertions & wikipedia source from your JIDF friends.

Does your mama know you suck?

Fred, he is just trying to push your buttons, don't bother with him,

Same with Metzgers and Schwartz's among other German names that get bandied about here as being automatically jewish. by Mike Todd


I don't think they are automatically assumed to be jewish , just open to reasonable speculation. I think that names ending in "Man or Mann" have a reasonable suspicion, since so many jews use those labels. Schawrz is particularly common as a yid name, Mel Brooks even used it in his movie's to denote kike-ish-ness.

Names like Hoff-man/Huff-man, Rosen-veldt, Eisen-hower, Tru-man have a decidedly kike-ish flavour. So it should at least be open to reasonable speculation on whether there may have been a nigger in the woodpile somewhere back. Names that end in "Man", have a color in them or a country name are more suspect than others. Many old German names have been adopted by the heebs also to disguise their "heebishness". I think it is disingenuous to come right out and flatly state a recent political figure is unequivocally not a heeb. I mean how the hell would someone know this? And what would their intentions be to argue against a heeb supporter not being a jew?

You have nothing, but your empty assertions & wikipedia source from your JIDF friends.

Does your mama know you suck?


Pay close attention, gentle reader, and watch the dance:

Fred, can you answer the following:

What is the name of LBJ's "primary biographer" you spoke of?

What is the name of the book he wrote where he claims LBJ was a Jew?

Or was that a lie, Fred?

Fred, he is just trying to push your buttons.
Yeah, I know. Liars and other folks who imitate kikes really get under my skin.

This foul ball does the best kike impersonation I've seen. But you know the rules.

Fred, he is just trying to push your buttons, don't bother with him.

Let's run that through the 'ol VNNF translator, shall we?:

Fred, WTF! Shut up for Chrissake! You look like a delusional lying loon! Abort! I say again, abort immediately!

Pay close attention, gentle reader, and watch the dance:

Fred, can you answer the following:

What is the name of LBJ's "primary biographer" you spoke of?

What is the name of the book he wrote where he claims LBJ was a Jew?

Or was that a lie, Fred?

His primary biographer is the Geneology Website for the Latter Day Saints, which was quoted in every link I posted. So, that is the primary source.

Make anything you want of it, I don't give a shit, you've been exposed.

I don't think they are automatically assumed to be jewish , just open to reasonable speculation. I think that names ending in "Man or Mann" have a reasonable suspicion, since so many jews use those labels. Schawrz is particularly common as a yid name, Mel Brooks even used it in his movie's to denote kike-ish-ness.Not saying they're not. Just saying it's not automatic.
A name can be one thread in a cord of circumstantial evidence but it's not the whole cord.

Yeah, I know. Liars and other folks who imitate kikes really get under my skin.

This foul ball does the best kike impersonation I've seen. But you know the rules.

Actually Fred, I think DiO has you dead to rights, and you can't wiggle off that hook.

Yeah, I know. Liars and other folks who imitate kikes really get under my skin.


You're the proven liar, Fred.

Fred, can you answer the following:

What is the name of LBJ's "primary biographer" you spoke of?

What is the name of the book he wrote where he claims LBJ was a Jew?

JEWS TRACK ETHNICITY THROUGH MATERNITY

LBJ's primary biographer believes he was a jew.

LBJ Was Secretly Jewish (http://www.jfkmontreal.com/johnson%27s_hidden_loyalties.htm#Secret%20Ethnicity)

This is where it all started. He has no answer for it.

You claim to have been a marine. They only take or make men. Wormy bastards like you have no manliness in them.

His primary biographer is the Geneology [sic] Website for the Latter Day Saints, which was quoted in every link I posted. So, that is the primary source.


Lmao.

There is no biography of LBJ on the genealogy website of the LDS.

That's a lie, Fred.

Do you understand what a "biography" actually is?

Let's run that through the 'ol VNNF translator, shall we?:

Fred, WTF! Shut up for Chrissake! You look like a delusional lying loon! Abort! I say again, abort immediately! by Donnie

Let me run it through the SF translator for you Donnie , and explain it so you can understand,

I've already seen this scenario in action over at Kosherfront , the neocon squads over there use it all the time. Same thing every time , they want the target to call them a kike so they can run to JB and get them banned.

You claim to have been a marine. They only take or make men. Wormy bastards like you have no manliness in them.


How does it feel to know, I'm talking about deep down, that you've been made to look foolish?

It's readily apparent why you were (repeatedly) banned from Stormfront, Fred.

Actually Fred, I think DiO has you dead to rights, and you can't wiggle on that hook.Donnie knows the meaning of every word in the English language. Except one. That word is MERCY.:D

I've already seen this scenario in action over at Kosherfront , the neocon squads over there use it all the time. Same thing every time , they want the target to call them a kike so they can run to JB and get them banned.


This isn't Stormfront.

I've never asked Alex to ban anyone, in over 6 years of posting.

Fred however, has. And he's been here for like 2 months.

"I sent this to Alex.

George, Donnie and a few others are doing everything they can to destroy the continuity of the "Jack Boot" thread and the 9/11 discussion in it.

That has clearly morphed into an activism thread, and rule 7 states that disrupting such threads is against the rules.

Alex, I don't generally complain about anything that happens on a public forum, but these two, in particular are making any conversation of any substance a nightmare.

Can you please do something about it"?

So, yea.

You claim to have been a marine. They only take or make men. by Fred

Obviously, they have lowered their standards now and will take anyone to fight for the heebs. They even give spics citizenship as a perk. Dumb spics go over to Iraq and get their dumb spic asses shot off for the heebs. If they survive, they come back and get their spic asses shot off in LA, but they're Amerikans now. Lets face it , you have to pretty stupid to join up and volunteer to get your ass shot off for the heebs .


This isn't Stormfront. by Don

But, I was talking about SF, this is a thread discussing SF.

Donnie knows the meaning of every word in the English language. Except one. That word is MERCY.:D



Nah, I just know how to use spell-check. :D

Still no evidence to support your position, pussyboy?

You have your cadre of 'also-rans' for support, but you have no courage for producing anything to support your anti position?

You're a joke, pussyboy. I hope your husband deprives you again tonight.

Now watch him turn it into a personal attack so he never has to support his lies. He is an anti and gives us all a bad name. You're a kike-lover Duncie.

But, I was talking about SF, this is a thread discussing SF.

And our lizard overlords.

And our lizard overlords. by Donnie


I have another lizard for you Don, he is the one that put the backscatter scanners in at the airports to control dumb sheep like you.

http://salon.glenrose.net/img/chertoff.jpg

And our lizard overlords.
Speak for yourself, freak.

Still no evidence to support your position, pussyboy?

You have your cadre of 'also-rans' for support, but you have no courage for producing anything to support your anti position?

You're a joke, pussyboy. I hope your husband deprives you again tonight.

Now watch him turn it into a personal attack so he never has to support his lies. He is an anti and gives us all a bad name. You're a kike-lover Duncie.


The readers of this thread are well aware of who has been telling lies, Fred.

Name one lie I've ever told anywhere on VNNF & I'll never post on this forum again, Fred.

Let's hear it.

Don't dodge the issue, you slime ball, show me where LBJ is a gentile. You have nothing but a JIDF source. We all know they are slimy like you, they hide the fact that they are jews, but the geneology doesn't lie.

You're using jew tactics to avoid answering to your bullshit lying assertions. Show me your proof, shithead, you've seen mine.

You're lying to hide the fact that you can't prove your case. You're a liar.

These fucking reptilian slimeballs have absolutely no heart and are cold blooded killers, did it ever occur to you that this is why they are called FUCKING lizards? Calling them reptiles is probably lizard libel, a more fitting moniker would be parasites. But the fact is, they do look just like fucking reptiles,

http://www.breitbart.com/images/2006/7/17/D8ITRJ080/D8ITRJ080_preview.jpg

Except one. That word is MERCY

Excuse me, but the term is "No Mercy" (for the enemies of WN).

Don't dodge the issue, you slime ball, show me where LBJ is a gentile. You have nothing but a JIDF source. We all know they are slimy like you, they hide the fact that they are jews, but the geneology[sic] doesn't lie.

You're using jew tactics to avoid answering to your bullshit lying assertions. Show me your proof, shithead, you've seen mine.

You're lying to hide the fact that you can't prove your case. You're a liar.



"JIDF source".

Just listen to yourself, nutbar.

Anyone can simply google "LBJ biography" or go to a library and check out a book. Is every site or book on LBJ a "JIDF source"?

You made the extraordinary claim that LBJ was a Jew.

Your only evidence is that he had an ancestor with the last name of Huffman, as if everyone with the name of "Huffman" is Jewish, which I know for a fact is simply untrue.

From that, you conclude he was a Jew.

You have no evidence.

And how many fucking times are you going to consecutively misspell genealogy, dude?

Don't dodge the issue, you slime ball, show me where LBJ is a gentile. You have nothing but a JIDF source. We all know they are slimy like you, they hide the fact that they are jews, but the geneology doesn't lie.

You're using jew tactics to avoid answering to your bullshit lying assertions. Show me your proof, shithead, you've seen mine.

You're lying to hide the fact that you can't prove your case. You're a liar.Uh...Fred?
Point of order. It's not up to Donnie to prove LBJ was a gentile. It's up to you to prove he was a jew.

Lacking a factual argument and failing to prove your lies by dodging and by personal attacks has nothing to do with mercy, it is called cowardice.

"JIDF source".

Anyone can simply google "LBJ biography"

Then post something substantive if you can. This is about the facts and your case is sorely lacking any of those.

Uh...Fred?
Point of order. It's not up to Donnie to prove LBJ was a gentile. It's up to you to prove he was a jew.

And/or Lizard Overlord.

Uh...Fred?
Point of order. It's not up to Donnie to prove LBJ was a gentile. It's up to you to prove he was a jew.
I did that, he just ignores it.

I think Donnie might be somebody other than who he says he is. I think he is a pusedo for another poster, a sock-puppet. I think I know who he is.

Then post something substantive if you can. This is about the facts and your case is sorely lacking any of those.Among White people the burden of proof lies with the accuser. To do it any other way would be...well, jewish.

I did that, he just ignores it.

The fact that LBJ has an ancestor named Huffman is not proof he was a Jew, Fred.

I think Donnie might be somebody other than who he says he is. I think he is a pusedo[sic] for another poster, a sock-puppet. I think I know who he is

Do tell.

Originally Posted by Jack Boot
Agreed. It would help if we weren't at each others throats, but that seems to be the nature of the thing.

Alex expresses the opinion that we have a "groupthink" model here, resulting in a structure of "censorious wanks and lickspittles", while at the same time conceding most of the people expelled did have it coming.

Actually, we prefer a bit more decorum while discussing the same issues being discussed on his board. Groupthink? No. Minimum basic requirement for social interaction.

Nor have we "spewed lies" about him, his record is open since the days of the NA breakup.I would even have supported him then if he wasn't bringing Bill White to the table.That would have been a mistake on my part.

It is true that I have strongly suggested that Linder's ethnicity is not all that it should be. I have no proof, but base it on his long-term record of behavior, quite clearly disruptive and deliberately divisive. Maybe that is a "lie". I don't know. Don't really care - I personally remain convinced that VNNF is false-flag. That's not a policy statement, but it is my assessment of that project.

Does Jack think Alex is a lizard too?

From Latter Day Saints Website:

Huffman is jewish, just in case you didn't know.

Quote:
Birth: 27 Aug 1908
Stonewall, Gillespie, Tx
Death: 22 Jan 1973
Stonewall, Gillespie, Tx
Burial:
Stonewall, Gillespie Co., Tx, Lbj Ranch
Parents
Father: Samuel Ealy Jr JOHNSON (AFN: QTML-13) Family
Mother: Rebekah BAINES (AFN: QTML-28)

Quote:
Family Group Record FamilySearch™ Ancestral File v4.19
Search Results | Download GEDCOM | Print
Husband's Name
Samuel Ealy Jr JOHNSON (AFN:QTML-13) Pedigree
Born: 11 Oct 1877 Place: Buda, Hays, Tx
Died: 23 Oct 1937 Place: Austin, Travis, Tx
Married: 20 Aug 1907 Place: Fredericksburg, Gillespie, Tx
Father: Samuel Ealy Sr JOHNSON (AFN:HTH1-NC) Family
Mother: Eliza C. BUNTON (AFN:HTH1-PJ)
Wife's Name
Rebekah BAINES (AFN:QTML-28) Pedigree
Born: 26 Jun 1881 Place: Mckinney, Collin, Tx
Died: 12 Sep 1958 Place: Austin, Travis, Texas
Married: 20 Aug 1907 Place: Fredericksburg, Gillespie, Tx
Father: Joseph Wilson BAINES (AFN:QTMK-JJ) Family
Mother: Ruth Ament HUFFMAN (AFN:QTMP-R9)



http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp

Continued:

Ruth Ament HUFFMAN
B: 10 Dec 1854
Rowlett, , Tx
D: 13 Feb 1936
San Antonio, Bexar, Tx

John S. HUFFMAN
B: 7 May 1824
, Bourbon, Ky
D: 22 Jun 1865
, Collin, Texas
M: 1848

This link traces LBJ's tree back 6 generations, it's loaded with jews.
http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp

Does Jack think Alex is a lizard too?

I have it on good authority that Alex prefers "Reptilian-American".

Does Jack think Alex is a lizard too?

Funny thing is, Alex wouldn't ban Boot for that post. (I don't think, I should add)

I don't think there is a definite an sewer to the "Is LBJ a bona fide kike" question, but I think he should get the "Friends of kike-holohoax-numero-uno-heeb-protector" and "Fuck-America" award for his fine work in prosecuting a no-win war in Vietnam and lining the lizards pockets in NY with cash while letting the heebs shoot up an American Navy ship and calling off the calvary.


When the U.S. fighter planes are within minutes of the Liberty, Rear Admiral Lawrence Geis – commanding the Six Fleet carriers – receives an order from Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara to recall the planes. Admiral Geis calls the White House personally to confirm the insane order. McNamara comes on the line, then President Lyndon Johnson. Johnson confirms that the aircraft are to return, saying that he will not have Israel embarrassed. Admiral Geis – and it is hard to judge him considering the ingrained obedience to a chain of command that makes the military – recalls the aircraft.
Meanwhile the Israeli aircraft fly off as three Israeli torpedo boats make toward the Liberty. Several miles distant they begin firing torpedoes at the ship, five in all. One torpedo hits amidships, drowning about two dozen crewmen. The captain gives the order to abandon ship. The torpedo boats then approach within 100 feet and circle about the ship. With “USS Liberty” on the hull of the ship in full view, not to mention the American flag on the mast, they fire machine guns at anything on deck that moves. They strafe the life rafts on deck and those being lowered into the water by crewmen. The torpedo boat phase of the attack lasts about an hour

The heebs finally relented in their attack when a SOVIET surveillance ship moved in to monitor the situation. And someone wants to argue if this POTUS was a heeb or not, (don't actions speak louder than words)? Unbelievable.


http://ariwatch.com/OurAlly/USSLiberty.htm

http://sites.google.com/site/usslibertyinquiry/_/rsrc/1259313994048/essay4-image001-full.jpg

Ruth Ament HUFFMAN
B: 10 Dec 1854
Rowlett, , Tx
D: 13 Feb 1936
San Antonio, Bexar, Tx

John S. HUFFMAN
B: 7 May 1824
, Bourbon, Ky
D: 22 Jun 1865
, Collin, Texas
M: 1848


What evidence do you have that they are Jews, nutbar?

Absolutely none.

What evidence do you have that they are Jews, nutbar?

Absolutely none.Prior to the formation of what is now known as the state of Israel that area was known as Palestine. There is a town in Texas incorporated under the name of Palestine. Palestine, Texas. LBJ and his wife were both native Texans. Understand, or do I have to draw you a map?

What evidence do you have that they are Jews, nutbar?

Absolutely none.What evidence do you present that they are not, especially in light of the fact that they were heavily involved in jewish orgs.?

What evidence do you present that they are not, especially in light of the fact that they were heavily involved in jewish orgs?

Despite Sisyphean attempts to craft it otherwise, the burden of proof lies on you, Fred.

Why don't you just admit that LBJ wasn't a Jew?

but you would never know it by his actions because he sure fucked over America.

the Civil Rights Act of 1964, signed into law by President Lyndon Johnson just a few hours after House approval on July 2, 1964. The act outlawed segregation in businesses such as theaters, restaurants, and hotels. It banned discriminatory practices in employment and ended segregation in public places such as swimming pools, libraries, and public schools.

Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965*(Hart-Celler Act, INS, Act of 1965,*Pub.L.*89-236)[1]*abolished the*National Origins Formula*that had been in place in the*United States*since the*Immigration Act of 1924. It was proposed by*United States Representative*Emanuel Celler*of*New York. On October 3, 1965, President*Lyndon B. Johnson*signed the legislation into law, saying "This [old] system violates the basic principle of American democracy, the principle that values and rewards each man on the basis of his merit as a man. It has been un-American in the highest sense, because it has been untrue to the faith that brought thousands to these shores even before we were a country.

Glad I wasn't one of those grunts in Vietnam, Johnson halted bombing of supply lines to the south so the gooks could get more ammo for their AK's. Fucking gooks had high powered AK's and the Army had under powered M-16's that jammed in the mud. Go figure?

President Lyndon B. Johnson informed the nation last night that he has ordered a total halt of bombing of North Vietnam.
The television announcement came after an hour-and-a-half White House meeting with top diplomatic and military advisers, and confirmed recent speculation that such a decision was in the offing. The bombing halt takes effect at 8 a.m. EST today.
Johnson stated that the cessation was not only of bombing, but of all acts involving the use of force, including troop activity, in the North. Unarmed reconnaissance is still permitted, however, he said.

http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1968/11/1/johnson-halts-bombs-ppresident-lyndon-b/

Before 1821, Texas was still a Spanish colony where only Catholics could take up residence. Jews who openly acknowledged their ethnicity could not legally live there.7 Originally, Jews migrated to Texas to seek fortune and freedom. The earliest Jews, who arrived with the conquistadors, came from Sephardic (Spanish-North African-Israel) communities.8 After the Mexican period, Jewry in Texas was essentially populated by immigrants from Germany, eastern Europe, and the Americas.9

Lyndon Johnson’s maternal ancestors, the Huffmans, apparently migrated to Frederick, Maryland from Germany sometime in the mid-eighteenth century. Later they moved to Bourbon, Kentucky and eventually settled in Texas in the mid-to-late nineteenth century.10

According to Jewish law, if a person’s mother is Jewish, then that person is automatically Jewish, regardless of the father’s ethnicity or religion. The facts indicate that both of Lyndon Johnson’s great-grandparents, on the maternal side, were Jewish. These were the grandparents of Lyndon’s mother, Rebecca Baines.11 Their names were John S. Huffman and Mary Elizabeth Perrin.12 John Huffman’s mother was Suzanne Ament, a common Jewish name. Perrin is also a common Jewish name.

Huffman and Perrin had a daughter, Ruth Ament Huffman,13 who married Joseph Baines14 and together they had a daughter, Rebekah Baines,15 Lyndon Johnson’s mother. The line of Jewish mothers can be traced back three generations in Lyndon Johnson’s family tree. There is little doubt that he was Jewish.

To recap, the following is Lyndon Johnson’s maternal family tree:

* Mother: Rebekah Baines (married Sam Johnson, Lyndon’s father)
* Maternal grandparents: Ruth Ament Huffman and Joseph Baines
* Maternal great-grandparents (parents of Ruth Huffman): Mary Elizabeth Perrin and John S. Huffman, III
o Maternal great-great grandparents (parents of Mary Perrin): Dicea Kerby and William Perrin16 (Footnote 20)
o Maternal great-great grandparents (parents of John Huffman, III): Suzanne Ament and John S. Huffman, II17
o Maternal great-great-great grandparents (parents of John Huffman, II): Cathrine Lyter and John Huffman18


Recently it was disclosed that there are many hispanic Jews living in the San Antonio area. Richard Santos, a hispanic Jew and native of San Antonio, wrote a book entitled Silent Heritage: The Sephardim and the Colonization of the Spanish North American Frontier, 1492-1600.24 Santos spoke of his "crypto-Jewish" heritage at the Texas Jewish Historical Society’s 22nd conference on May 11, 2001. Crypto-Jews are Sephardic groups of families who secretly retained their religion and culture after the 15th-century Spanish royal decree deemed it punishable by death. Santos has spent his entire adult life trying to educate the masses about the secret history of his bloodline.25
LBJ's Jewish Ancestry (http://www.jfkmontreal.com/johnson%27s_hidden_loyalties.htm#Secret%20Ethnicity)

LBJ's Jewish Ancestry (http://www.jfkmontreal.com/johnson%27s_hidden_loyalties.htm#Secret%20Ethnicity)

To recap, the following is Lyndon Johnson’s maternal family tree:

* Mother: Rebekah Baines (married Sam Johnson, Lyndon’s father)
* Maternal grandparents: Ruth Ament Huffman and Joseph Baines
* Maternal great-grandparents (parents of Ruth Huffman): Mary Elizabeth Perrin and John S. Huffman, III
o Maternal great-great grandparents (parents of Mary Perrin): Dicea Kerby and William Perrin
o Maternal great-great grandparents (parents of John Huffman, III): Suzanne Ament and John S. Huffman, II
o Maternal great-great-great grandparents (parents of John Huffman, II): Cathrine Lyter and John Huffman



Sigh....

Where is the evidence that any of the above were Jews?

The last name "Huffman", right?

Pathetic.


"Lyndon Baines Johnson was born near Stonewall, Texas, on August 27, 1908, in a small farmhouse on the Pedernales River.

His parents, Samuel Ealy Johnson, Jr. and Rebekah Baines, had three girls and two boys: Johnson and his brother, Sam Houston Johnson (1914–1978), and sisters Rebekah (1910–1978), Josefa (1912–1961), and Lucia (1916–1997).

The nearby small town of Johnson City, Texas was named after Johnson's father's cousin, James Polk Johnson, whose forebears had moved west from Georgia.

The Johnsons were originally of Scots-Irish and English royal ancestry. In school, Johnson was an awkward, talkative youth and was elected president of his 11th-grade class. He graduated from Johnson City High School in 1924 having participated in public speaking, debate, and baseball.

Johnson was maternally descended from a pioneer Baptist clergyman, George Washington Baines, who pastored some eight churches in Texas as well as others in Arkansas and Louisiana. Baines was also the president of Baylor University during the American Civil War. George Baines was the grandfather of Johnson's mother, Rebekah Baines Johnson (1881–1958).

Johnson's grandfather Samuel Ealy Johnson, Sr. was raised as a Baptist. Subsequently, in his early adulthood, he became a member of the Christian Church (Disciples of Christ). In his later years the grandfather became a Christadelphian; Johnson's father also joined the Christadelphian Church toward the end of his life."

You have one hell of a nerve calling me pathetic, useless sausage smoker.

What evidence do you present that they are not, especially in light of the fact that they were heavily involved in jewish orgs.? by Fred

What I don't understand, is what the hell is the benefit of arguing that LBJ wasn't a heeb when he acted just like a nigger loving jew. It would seem even if you won, you were still a loser? It is like arguing the government position on 911, if you win, you get some niggers hand shoved up your ass in the airport TSA line. The whole argument seems designed only to defend the indefensible. The only reason I can think of is that LBJ is Don's hero and/or role model, (or he is really just trying to get you to slip up and call him a heeb).

What I don't understand, is what the hell is the benefit of arguing that LBJ wasn't a heeb when he acted just like a nigger loving jew. It would seem even if you won, you were still a loser? It is like arguing the government position on 911, if you win, you get some niggers hand shoved up your ass in the airport TSA line. The whole argument seems designed only to defend the indefensible. The only reason I can think of is that LBJ is Don's hero and/or role model, (or he is really just trying to get you to slip up and call him a heeb).
Notice he posts his tripe without a link? Cowardly POS.

You have one hell of a nerve calling me pathetic, useless sausage smoker.

22+ posts a day of the kind of shit you post?

Yea, pathetic fits.

And you're a proven liar.

Well, at least I try to support my argument with other than personal attacks. Your position is weaker than puppy piss and everyone except your 'also-rans' see it.

Well, at least I try to support my argument with other than personal attacks. Your position is weaker than puppy piss and everyone except your 'also-rans' see it.


Dude, you've been making personal attacks for fucking two months straight.

This is VNNF. If you are going to dish it out, prepare to have a nice big helping served right back.

You have no position. You're a proven liar, and come across as volatile, if not actually unstable.

And double-fuck your folksy "weaker than puppy piss" analogies, and the Lizard Overlord you rode in on.

The truth hurts, huh Doggie? :D

The truth hurts, huh Doggie?

What truth?

You haven't posted any truth, Fred.

In fact, you're a proven liar, as anyone who has been reading this thread figured out a loooong time ago.

What truth?

You haven't posted any truth, Fred.

In fact, you're a proven liar, as anyone who has been reading this thread figured out a loooong time ago.

Why not post a poll, poochie boy. You lose, get used to it. :D

Why not post a poll, poochie boy. You lose, get used to it. :D


Declare victory all you want, nutbar.

No poll is necessary.

People can just read through this thread and make up their own minds as to who "lost".

Why not post a poll, poochie boy.

Excellent idea, Fred.

Fred O'Malley (senior member):

As the plaintiff in this matter, by any reasonable standard of the rules of evidence, be it 'beyond a reasonable doubt', or by a 'preponderance of the evidence' you have failed to lift the burden of proof from your shoulders.

You leave this court no other choice but to find in favor of the defendant, Donnie in Ohio (non-pod).

This court stands adjourned.

Fred O'Malley (senior member):

As the plaintiff in this matter, by any reasonable standard of the rules of evidence, be it 'beyond a reasonable doubt', or by a 'preponderance of the evidence' you have failed to lift the burden of proof from your shoulders.

You leave this court no other choice but to find in favor of the defendant, Donnie in Ohio (non-pod).

This court stands adjourned.


"If the lizard don't fit, you must acquit".

The Donnie and Freddie show!

Guess what, fellas? LBJ isn't a joo, and if he was, he ain't anymore, 'cause.... (breaking news alert!)

LBJ IS DEAD

He's worm food. Dust. Zilch. Muck. Maybe a mushroom.

LBJ IS DEAD

That's what they want you to think.

The bloke is dead let it go. We have more important things to discuss than if LBJ was a jew or not.

Where are we now? Brooklyn?

Hey Donnie, congratulations on beating Fred. Now lets see if you can prove that chemtrails is the imagination of nutbars. Your advocate and debating judge Mike Todd says the burden of proof lies on the accuser.

Among White people the burden of proof lies with the accuser. To do it any other way would be...well, jewish.

UFOs, Chemtrails, Lizard overlords, inter-dimensional insect flying "rods", etc. Really far-out shit.

Lets see what you're made of farmer-boy.

Your advocate and debating judge Mike Todd says the burden of proof lies on the accuser. That's not me saying that. Anglo/Saxon jurisprudence does.

What I don't understand, is what the hell is the benefit of arguing that LBJ wasn't a heeb when he acted just like a nigger loving jew.

He acted like a nigger too, so we should call him black, and cry like a baby when people say he's white?

You retards with emotional problems are not helping at all, and I'm starting to suspect that's for a reason.

I doubt even 1/10 Huffmans is jewish.

Hey, Fred. If I can find a jew named O'Malley, does that prove you're a jew?

By your reasoning in the LBJ case, it does.


It would seem even if you won, you were still a loser? It is like arguing the government position on 911, if you win, you get some niggers hand shoved up your ass in the airport TSA line. The whole argument seems designed only to defend the indefensible. The only reason I can think of is that LBJ is Don's hero and/or role model, (or he is really just trying to get you to slip up and call him a heeb).

Listen up, little retard. We all feel the same way about LBJ. What we disagree on is calling someone a jew without evidence. You think that's just fine. And that lying about such helps our cause. In fact, it does not. You hurt our cause. Not just with the lying, but with the complete lack of emotional control.

What truth?

You haven't posted any truth, Fred.


So haven't you, Donnie boy, despite your firmly believing otherwise.

I will admit that Freddy is indeed stable, and sometimes even intellectually dishonest, and I'm glad I'm having this opportunity to tell him that; but you, sir, are really one hell of a mental midget.

But don't worry; lots of other people (some who even post here, as a matter of fact) are too, so you are not alone.

Why not post a poll, poochie boy. You lose, get used to it. :D

The truth isn't decided by polls.

You have come up with one site that claims Huffmans were jews. And they act like they have evidence, but if you read it closely, it's merely an assertion on their part. One that is unbacked, apparently, by any other source on the net. As for the LDS files, they mean nothing. There are jews running under every surname out there. This ought to be obvious, and certainly not a reason for you to break out the tears and epithets when it's pointed out.

Even when Jew Alan Sabrosky says Mossad did 9/11. You still deny that Jews did 9/11.

Didn't need a jew to tell me. Figured it out on my own. The more interesting question is why this particular jew makes this particular claim. Jews always take all sides of publicly prominent questions. That's worth keeping in mind.

Defending LBJ because LBJ allowed the attack on the USS Liberty to carry on?

He didn't defend LBJ? Why do you lie? Repeatedly? Is is merely a character defect, or is there a deeper reason? The same base behavior is common to a number of you.


So you're saying a person with a surname that can be Jewish, who is acting on behalf of Jewish interests, couldn't possibly be a quarter Jew?

Did he say that? No. Do you know that he didn't say that? Yes. Do you pretend that it said it anyway? Yes. Why? Because you're dishonest and have emotional problems like your friends? Quite possibly.

His point, as you know, but pretend not to, is that no proof save one dubious site making one unbacked assertion claims that Huffmans were jews.

That's not good enough. And you can't make up the difference with tears and curses.

I will admit that Freddy is indeed stable, and sometimes even intellectually dishonest, and I'm glad I'm having this opportunity to tell him that; but you, sir, are really one hell of a mental midget.

Well, there's some lips on that midget, because he has outtalked the rest of you with admirable economy. A few terse, obvious questions and you dissolve into a snuffling, cursing heap. Toddlerish, itz!

This foul ball does the best kike impersonation I've seen. But you know the rules.


If you really believe that, then you're as ignorant of jew-style as you are of spelling and the difference between proof and opinion. Jews tend to try to shriek others down with epithets and curses. That comes a lot closer to describing your behavior than Donnie's. And everybody outside your bitty clique sees it that way.

Jews tend to try to shriek others down with epithets and curses.
That hasn't been my experience. They follow the instructions given them.
The Handbook of Paid Zionist Megaphony Shill Tactics (http://www.stormfront.org/forum/t625486/)

This isn't Stormfront.

I've never asked Alex to ban anyone, in over 6 years of posting.

That's true. But in Fred's defense, that could be because we're the same person, as suggested by those other heavy-headed scholars who recently exited stage left. If we are the same person, then we hardly need ask ourselves what we're already thinking. An alternate theory is we're coinjoined at the head, and can read each other's thoughts, no asking required, like those twins of a recent thread. There are many possibilities to be considered. In this situation, the old sporting advice is best: stay low, and don't get beat.


[I]"I sent this to Alex.

George, Donnie and a few others are doing everything they can to destroy the continuity of the "Jack Boot" thread and the 9/11 discussion in it.

You can feel the desperate, sweaty junkie-shakes in the urgent need to get all doubt-raisers banned. Most off-putting. Really furls my tuft (Grinch allusion).

That hasn't been my experience. They follow the instructions given them.
The Handbook of Paid Zionist Megaphony Shill Tactics (http://www.stormfront.org/forum/t625486/)

7. If all else fails then try to bait your enemy into losing his cool and cussing you out.

So, Donnie's the jew. Baiting you. Using a known tactic. And it still works. Fred...what are you saying about yourself? You're as pathetic as the Polack who bet on the replay.

I'm guessing that your real problem is a) you're not real smart. I infer this from your frequent misspellings. b) you have little emotional control. I infer this from 87% of your posts. c) these deficits lead you to misinterpret even the slightest questioning of any point you raise as proof of the hostile intent and probable jewiness of the questioner.

But the intelligent can see Donnie merely raised the weak spots in your argument to the light, and you flipped out. Which leads a rational man to conclude: 1) you have no emotional control; 2) you are stupid enough not to be able to discern the difference between rational questions and hostile attacks (evidence for 2) is strong, since you apparently don't realize that a family tree is not a 'biography'; or if you do, then you dishonestly pretend they are the same); 3) you are trying to lead people away from the truth about 9/11 by mixing the facts with ridiculous lies.

How would a reasonable man act, since you obviously aren't or can't figure it out enough to fake it, or deliberately desire to appear irrational?

He would say, it's not much, but I have one source asserting that one of LBJ's grandparents was a jewess, named Huffman. I can't find any other sources that back this up, but I did go to the LDS files and at least prove a long line of Huffmans back up the family tree, along with some other names often used by jews. It's not conclusive, but it is suggestive.

That's how an honest man would write up the evidence you've presented. You presented it as conclusive and then started crying when someone merely pointed out that it's in fact far from that.

Off topic, but as a kid I vaguely recall reading something about Lee Oswald's mother having Jew relatives. Wish I had time to research .

Behind every burning bush: a JEW! with a Bic lighter!:D

That's hardly fair or honest, Alex.

I admit that the evidence I presented isn't conclusive, but your boy Donnie simply ignored it and attacked me personally instead. All I wanted him to do was speak to the facts, but that obviously was far too much to ask.

Tell me how he got a PM I sent to you. I never asked you to ban him, only to put a bug in his ear to stop trashing this thread and derailing it, which he has admitted he was doing.

I suppose maybe I am stupid and illitterate. Stupid for ever engaging that asshole and illitterate because I have large fingers, mistype words and don't use spellcheck because my PC has issues with that program.

You have defended him and his attacking style from the beginning. Instead of muzzling that dog, you set him upon the rest of us and let him know there would never be any repercussions no matter what he did. When we all see him as belligerant, antagonistic and disruptive, you just let it slide and ridicule the rest of us. If you are one and the same, that would sure explain alot.

I don't have a problem with anyone disagreeing with me, when its in the interest of exploring the truth or finding answers. That isn't what's happened here. This started with denegrating remarks from Donnie and there has been no let up.

Let him push my buttons? Fuck him. I have never been one to run from a fight, and I rachet up at every exchange, whether in person or in writing. That is my nature, to confront disrespect and treachery with anger and hostility. And, it is your way too.

Everybody in this thread is wrong and Donnie is right? C'mon, that's an unreasonable position to stake out. His assinine acts are plain for all to see.

What I don't understand is why he hasn't been reigned in at some point, it's as obvious as can be what he has been doing. Is Donnie here to test our patience?

We new VNNF folks were inundated with Donnie types, we are very well aware of their tactics, MO, and evil intent. We came here hoping not to have to deal with trolls. His actions fit the definition of internet troll, search for it yourself if you disagree. Why would you allow, even encourage, anyone to attack your newest members? It makes no rational sense to me.

I don't think there is a definite an sewer to the "Is LBJ a bona fide kike" question, but I think he should get the "Friends of kike-holohoax-numero-uno-heeb-protector" and "Fuck-America" award for his fine work in prosecuting a no-win war in Vietnam and lining the lizards pockets in NY with cash while letting the heebs shoot up an American Navy ship and calling off the calvary.




The heebs finally relented in their attack when a SOVIET surveillance ship moved in to monitor the situation. And someone wants to argue if this POTUS was a heeb or not, (don't actions speak louder than words)? Unbelievable.


That's really one of the worst outrages the the kikes ever did. LBJ wanted those sailors dead and on the bottom of the sea just so he'd be able to blame it on the Arabs and use US military might on behalf of the Zionist Entity. The fact is that he withdrew jet fighters that were en route to shoot down the attacking jews.

Imagine the horror of knowing that your own leader, your own commander-in-chief wants you dead. That is what LBJ did to those sailors.

We lost in 'Nam because we were were stabbed in the back by Jew-led, communist sympathizing left wing defeatism.
Remember:
"Military men were dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns for foreign policy." - Kissinger

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/forum/politics-other-controversies/782919-where-outrage-against-kissinger-afghanistan-soldiers.html#ixzz19x7sL4pr

Actually, we prefer a bit more decorum while discussing the same issues being discussed on his board. Groupthink? No. Minimum basic requirement for social interaction.

For example, Decorous Don called VNNF a "toxic dump."


Nor have we "spewed lies" about him, his record is open since the days of the NA breakup.I would even have supported him then if he wasn't bringing Bill White to the table.That would have been a mistake on my part.

I wasn't bringing anyone to any table; that implies I initiated something, when in fact I initiated nothing, and was only involved at the very periphery. Bill White was involved with the various people and factions in the aftermath of Pierce's death. I was only tangentially involved, through a couple of phone conversations. My sole goal, before, during, and after, was to help NA media develop, however that might be, whichever capacity suited whoever came to run the group. Unfortunately, the Streed faction's plan to replace Gliebe with someone competent fell through, for whatever reason. There ended my concern. During the entire sorting-out period,SF allowed all manner of lies to be spread about me from the various camps contesting for the right to consume Pierce's carcass. In retrospect, everything VNNF said about Gliebe/Strom/Walker turned out to be true, and everything said about us proved to be a lie. SF facilitated those lies to be spread, even as it prevented the facts from being laid out for the general audience.

Covering up is Stormfront culture, Jack Boot, and nothing you can say will change that fact.

VNNF is different from you; we reject your culture. Ours is better. It attracts better men, and it's better for our race.


It is true that I have strongly suggested that Linder's ethnicity is not all that it should be.

Awfully weird way to put the implication you're not willing to say straight. Neverthless, as a gesture of goodwill, I will convene a seance and tell my dead relatives to quit slacking.


I have no proof, but base it on his long-term record of behavior, quite clearly disruptive and deliberately divisive.

Disruptive of what? Divisive of what? Unclear antecdent. We don't agree on we, which point I've harped on from day one, which means by definition we cannot be disruptive since there's nothing to disrupt.


Maybe that is a "lie". I don't know. Don't really care - I personally remain convinced that VNNF is false-flag. That's not a policy statement, but it is my assessment of that project.


Must be more of that decorum you're talking about. Accusing serious men acting under their real names of mysterious crimes against nonexistent bodies. Even if you stated plainly what you were rather maliciously implying, the term would be false front, not false flag. VNN is not some kind of act, it's a virtual discussion arena.


Does Jack think Alex is a lizard too?

I will stipulate to that claim. But not just any lizard, not any plain-jane garden monitor or mud-fence skink, nay, I am nature's noblelizard, the chameleon. With independently targetable eyes, a tongue that just won't quit, and more skin hues than a bag of skittles.

http://www.flchams.com/inventory/sm_Urban.jpg

I admit that the evidence I presented isn't conclusive, but your boy Donnie simply ignored it and attacked me personally instead. All I wanted him to do was speak to the facts, but that obviously was far too much to ask.

No, that's not how it went at all. You never, ever admitted it wasn't conclusive, and you cursed out Donnie for pointing it out. You're accusing him of doing what you're doing, which is the jewiest tactic there is.


Tell me how he got a PM I sent to you. I never asked you to ban him, only to put a bug in his ear to stop trashing this thread and derailing it, which he has admitted he was doing.

He didn't get your PM. Either you or I posted it. And I don't think it was me, although I don't care enough to check.


I suppose maybe I am stupid and illitterate.

There's a lot more evidence you're illiterate than that Grandma Huffman was a jew.


Stupid for ever engaging that asshole and illitterate because I have large fingers, mistype words and don't use spellcheck because my PC has issues with that program.

Those are excuses. Now let's think this over. Your main point in posting here is to spread the "truth" about 9/11, if we are to take you at your implicit word. This involves laying out the details of the crime. Details. Details that require precision. So one would think you would take special pains to avoid misspellings that very much indicate LACK of attention to detail, as this would undermine your message and your intent. Are you smart enough to figure this out? The evidence says no. The subtler minds might, again, be led to think your real purpose is to undermine the truth movement. By associating it with lying, illiterate hotheads. I would love to take you at your word, but I'm not a christ-cultist. I'm going to go from your actions. Your actions are suspicious, let's leave it there.


You have defended him and his attacking style from the beginning. Instead of muzzling that dog,

Fred, I've said 100x this site is for men, not women or men who think like them. You think like them. Simple questions are interpreted by you as a personal attack. That is how women think. It's why they are not well suited for politics. It's why people who think like you and many of other expellees end up alone in a tiny room telling each other the same thing. They can't handle any disagreement. Their only technique for handling disagreement is to shout it down. You can't do that here, but boy, you sure as hell would if you could. And that's obvious to all of us.


you set him upon the rest of us and let him know there would never be any repercussions no matter what he did.

Repercussions are for broken rules. He hasn't broken any. He's given you a mild needling and some pointed, obvious questions raised by your posts. Questions that would occur to any intelligent man. Your response was to shriek and cry that you were under attack, oh make it stop. Pathetic.


When we all see him as belligerant, antagonistic and disruptive,

The only ones who see him that way are your mini-clique of ex-SF ninnies. Christ, you guys don't even have the self-control of the women here. You're worse than the women. Shrieking insults, curses; spouting irrationality out of every pore and orifice. You guys are so freakin' dumb you actually think Donnie and I are the same person. You're not just impervious to reason, but to tone and satire. Gee, Wally, that's just what the campaign to uncover the Ultimate Act of Chutzpathology needs - emotionally immature illiterate paranoids pressing its case to the sane public.

you just let it slide and ridicule the rest of us. If you are one and the same, that would sure explain alot.

Fred, I think you pulled a fast one on the carny working the gate. I don't think you're tall enough for this ride.


I don't have a problem with anyone disagreeing with me, when its in the interest of exploring the truth or finding answers. That isn't what's happened here. This started with denegrating remarks from Donnie and there has been no let up.

Nah. I've seen enough of you to judge. You take any disagreement over anything as a personal insult and attack. If the bra fits, wear it.


Let him push my buttons? Fuck him. I have never been one to run from a fight, and I rachet up at every exchange, whether in person or in writing. That is my nature, to confront disrespect and treachery with anger and hostility. And, it is your way too.

The problem is, online arguing is not "fighting," and you're not able to discern the difference between legitimate questions and insults/attacks. Face it, Fred. You're a hothouse hothead. You need to find a place where the owner/mods agree to protect you, and then you'll blossom just fine. You can stay here, but you will never get the rules you want, because we aren't like you, at least the good people here.


Everybody in this thread is wrong and Donnie is right? C'mon, that's an unreasonable position to stake out. His assinine acts are plain for all to see.


It's 3-4 SF nancies vs VNN regulars. We are on Donnie's side. He's making you all look ridiculous, and you're doing all the heavy work. It takes about one question to make you guys red in the face and sweating like pigs on the run from the butcher's knife. Your main value at this point is comedic. But you made yourself the joke, by your response. Real virtual men don't fall apart at light needling or rational questioning.


What I don't understand is why he hasn't been reigned in at some point, it's as obvious as can be what he has been doing. Is Donnie here to test our patience?


It's only obvious to you and 2-3 of your fellow SF paranoid, thin-skinned dimwits. To the rest of us, the opposite is obvious.


We new VNNF folks were inundated with Donnie types, we are very well aware of their tactics, MO, and evil intent. We came here hoping not to have to deal with trolls. His actions fit the definition of internet troll, search for it yourself if you disagree. Why would you allow, even encourage, anyone to attack your newest members? It makes no rational sense to me.

Troll = anyone beating Fred in an argument.

"Attack" = raising an argument Fred can't answer.

Clear solution: you and the other ninnies find a place where you can bleat to each other. That way your feelings will never be hurt, and no one will every be able to troll your threads by pointing out holes in your logic or raising obvious questions about your 'facts.'

My feelings were never hurt. I was pissed off. I'm unaccustomed to being continually harrassed for no valid reason. There are some mental issues here, but I don't think they're mine.

This is your site, maybe I have been on too many heavy handed, overly moderated ones. I have been trying my best to be a good guest and not wear out my welcome. You interpet that as whiney, while I view it as trying to get along in someone else's house. It is your perrogative to ban me any time you want, I don't control that.

I have a few friends here who are like minded, some are original VNNers, some came over with me. I am also doing some things for a couple of folks, so I'll stick around for a while and see how it plays out.

I guess we can leave it at that.

An internet troll is a person who sends duplicitous messages hoping to get angry responses, or a message sent by such a person.
http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Internet_troll

Edit: I don't like rules, so I don't 'want' any, they get in the way. I only want to be treated equally and with the same respect I give. I don't think that's asking too much.

This is your site, maybe I have been on too many heavy handed, overly moderated ones. I have been trying my best to be a good guest and not wear out my welcome.

We don't welcome people here, we see what they have to add. Long as they follow the rules, all is fine. If they're whiny bitches, then what they have to offer is a target to ridicule. You've made your posts a target-rich environment.


You interpet that as whiney, while I view it as trying to get along in someone else's house. It is your perrogative to ban me any time you want, I don't control that.

prerogative


I have a few friends here who are like minded, some are original VNNers, some came over with me. I am also doing some things for a couple of folks, so I'll stick around for a while and see how it plays out.

I guess we can leave it at that.

Edit: I don't like rules, so I don't 'want' any, they get in the way. I only want to be treated equally and with the same respect I give. That's not asking too much, is it?

The problem is you don't define these words they way we do. I suspect that's not going to change. So far, you have failed to demonstrate that you recognize rational questions, let alone are able to respond to them.

No mod-crutches here, Fred. If you want to win friends and influence people, you need to get a lot thicker skin and better arguments.

No, that's not how it went at all. You never, ever admitted it wasn't conclusive, and you cursed out Donnie for pointing it out. You're accusing him of doing what you're doing, which is the jewiest tactic there is.



He didn't get your PM. Either you or I posted it. And I don't think it was me, although I don't care enough to check.



There's a lot more evidence you're illiterate than that Grandma Huffman was a jew.



Those are excuses. Now let's think this over. Your main point in posting here is to spread the "truth" about 9/11, if we are to take you at your implicit word. This involves laying out the details of the crime. Details. Details that require precision. So one would think you would take special pains to avoid misspellings that very much indicate LACK of attention to detail, as this would undermine your message and your intent. Are you smart enough to figure this out? The evidence says no. The subtler minds might, again, be led to think your real purpose is to undermine the truth movement. By associating it with lying, illiterate hotheads. I would love to take you at your word, but I'm not a christ-cultist. I'm going to go from your actions. Your actions are suspicious, let's leave it there.



Fred, I've said 100x this site is for men, not women or men who think like them. You think like them. Simple questions are interpreted by you as a personal attack. That is how women think. It's why they are not well suited for politics. It's why people who think like you and many of other expellees end up alone in a tiny room telling each other the same thing. They can't handle any disagreement. Their only technique for handling disagreement is to shout it down. You can't do that here, but boy, you sure as hell would if you could. And that's obvious to all of us.



Repercussions are for broken rules. He hasn't broken any. He's given you a mild needling and some pointed, obvious questions raised by your posts. Questions that would occur to any intelligent man. Your response was to shriek and cry that you were under attack, oh make it stop. Pathetic.



The only ones who see him that way are your mini-clique of ex-SF ninnies. Christ, you guys don't even have the self-control of the women here. You're worse than the women. Shrieking insults, curses; spouting irrationality out of every pore and orifice. You guys are so freakin' dumb you actually think Donnie and I are the same person. You're not just impervious to reason, but to tone and satire. Gee, Wally, that's just what the campaign to uncover the Ultimate Act of Chutzpathology needs - emotionally immature illiterate paranoids pressing its case to the sane public.



Fred, I think you pulled a fast one on the carny working the gate. I don't think you're tall enough for this ride.



Nah. I've seen enough of you to judge. You take any disagreement over anything as a personal insult and attack. If the bra fits, wear it.



The problem is, online arguing is not "fighting," and you're not able to discern the difference between legitimate questions and insults/attacks. Face it, Fred. You're a hothouse hothead. You need to find a place where the owner/mods agree to protect you, and then you'll blossom just fine. You can stay here, but you will never get the rules you want, because we aren't like you, at least the good people here.



It's 3-4 SF nancies vs VNN regulars. We are on Donnie's side. He's making you all look ridiculous, and you're doing all the heavy work. It takes about one question to make you guys red in the face and sweating like pigs on the run from the butcher's knife. Your main value at this point is comedic. But you made yourself the joke, by your response. Real virtual men don't fall apart at light needling or rational questioning.



It's only obvious to you and 2-3 of your fellow SF paranoid, thin-skinned dimwits. To the rest of us, the opposite is obvious.



Troll = anyone beating Fred in an argument.

"Attack" = raising an argument Fred can't answer.

Clear solution: you and the other ninnies find a place where you can bleat to each other. That way your feelings will never be hurt, and no one will every be able to troll your threads by pointing out holes in your logic or raising obvious questions about your 'facts.'
Since one of our primary goals is and must remain to "Name the jew," it is imperative that we have credibility when we make the charge. Therefore I agree with your stringent rule against frivolously laying the charge. That's why I made two posts early in this thread which addressed the charges against the two Presidents, Eisenhower and Johnson.

I thought just simply saying, as I did, that there was almost surely not a single jew in Blanco County, Texas in 1908, when LBJ was born, and most likely no jew had ever set foot in Blanco County in 1908 would suffice to dissuade anyone of the opinion that LBJ was, in fact, jewish. Since my legal residence, where I spend a good deal of time, is only a few miles from the LBJ birthplace, and Texas history has been a lifelong avocation of mine, I thought my words might carry some gravitas. No such luck.

Nothing harms our cause more than overstatement of our case on vital points. Whenever I see someone saying "Rockets, not airplanes, hit the twin towers," or "LBJ was a jew," I am faced with deciding whether I am dealing with someone who lacks information, or an enemy. Make no mistake about it, there are as many of our enemies who take these ridiculous positions, while donning the appearance of being a WN as there are honest but ill-informed White people. Much of the time, I am unable to satisfactorily answer the question, so I treat them all the same.

My favorite retort to the folks who claim they can "Name the jew," solely on the basis of physiognomy, is this man:

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c44/oldman9x/life14.jpg

That hook-nosed gentleman is none other than Captain William Anderson (Devil Anse) Hatfield, late of the Confederate army, and the leader of the Hatfield faction of the infamous feud. His grandfather, along with thousands of others, including the McCoys, came to the hills of Western Virginia from the borderlands of England and Scotland, by way of Northern Ireland and Pennsylvania.

It is highly unlikely that any of his ancestors ever laid eyes on a jew, from the beginning of the world to date. Yet, there are folks posting here who will swear to their dying day that he is a yid, because of his prominent proboscis.

There has been much tripe posted on this thread, not all of it by the "LBJ was a jew" faction. That faction has certainly gotten the worst of it, simply because they have no case. Not even AL himself could win that argument! The gentleman who has gotten the better of it is undoubtedly a person who posts on another site, under a different moniker. The style is eerily similar. So much so that I am convinced of the identity.

There is nothing worse in a White man than habitual lying. Knowing this, real White man are as judicious in leveling the charge of "Liar" as they are in "Naming the jew." Over usage of either epithet is cause for concern about the one making the charge. It is a tactic dear to the heart of Jack Boot, himself.

If I had a web forum, I'd want a couple of "Donnies in Ohio" around, They act as a sieve, filtering out the unfit. Like fire, they also temper the worthy.

PS: Devil Anse was NOT a jew!

Since one of our primary goals is and must remain to "Name the jew," it is imperative that we have credibility when we make the charge. Therefore I agree with your stringent rule against frivolously laying the charge. That's why I made two posts early in this thread which addressed the charges against the two Presidents, Eisenhower and Johnson.

I thought just simply saying, as I did, that there was almost surely not a single jew in Blanco County, Texas in 1908, when LBJ was born, and most likely no jew had ever set foot in Blanco County in 1908 would suffice to dissuade anyone of the opinion that LBJ was, in fact, jewish. Since my legal residence, where I spend a good deal of time, is only a few miles from the LBJ birthplace, and Texas history has been a lifelong avocation of mine, I thought my words might carry some gravitas. No such luck.

Nothing harms our cause more than overstatement of our case on vital points. Whenever I see someone saying "Rockets, not airplanes, hit the twin towers," or "LBJ was a jew," I am faced with deciding whether I am dealing with someone who lacks information, or an enemy. Make no mistake about it, there are as many of our enemies who take these ridiculous positions, while donning the appearance of being a WN as there are honest but ill-informed White people. Much of the time, I am unable to satisfactorily answer the question, so I treat them all the same.

My favorite retort to the folks who claim they can "Name the jew," solely on the basis of physiognomy, is this man:

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c44/oldman9x/life14.jpg

That hook-nosed gentleman is none other than Captain William Anderson (Devil Anse) Hatfield, late of the Confederate army, and the leader of the Hatfield faction of the infamous feud. His grandfather, along with thousands of others, including the McCoys, came to the hills of Western Virginia from the borderlands of England and Scotland, by way of Northern Ireland and Pennsylvania.

It is highly unlikely that any of his ancestors ever laid eyes on a jew, from the beginning of the world to date. Yet, there are folks posting here who will swear to their dying day that he is a yid, because of his prominent proboscis.

There has been much tripe posted on this thread, not all of it by the "LBJ was a jew" faction. That faction has certainly gotten the worst of it, simply because they have no case. Not even AL himself could win that argument! The gentleman who has gotten the better of it is undoubtedly a person who posts on another site, under a different moniker. The style is eerily similar. So much so that I am convinced of the identity.

There is nothing worse in a White man than habitual lying. Knowing this, real White man are as judicious in leveling the charge of "Liar" as they are in "Naming the jew." Over usage of either epithet is cause for concern about the one making the charge. It is a tactic dear to the heart of Jack Boot, himself.

If I had a web forum, I'd want a couple of "Donnies in Ohio" around, They act as a sieve, filtering out the unfit. Like fire, they also temper the worthy.

PS: Devil Anse was NOT a jew!

Very well said, sir.As an aside I'd like to point out that a good many Reivers and other non-reiving Border families tend to have relatively large noses and deepset eyes (that often seem to glow).A side profile shows that,in most cases, the large nose that seemed suspicious to those unfamiliar with the type is more straight than hooked.

Off topic, but as a kid I vaguely recall reading something about Lee Oswald's mother having Jew relatives. Wish I had time to research .I've never read about any jews in the Oswald family tree, but there were a lot of jews around him during the last year or so of his life.

I have always, ever since the day Oswald was shot, believed that Oswald and Jacob Rubenstein(Jack Ruby) were pals. To me it was like the Sherlock Holmes case where the dog didn't bark. When I watched the shooting of Oswald on live TV, there were actually three dogs that didn't bark.

Reconstructing the scene, we have two Dallas cops, who are supposed to be protecting the prisoner Oswald, and Oswald between them. We have Ruby advancing across the room, gun drawn and pointing in their direction. Ruby takes several steps toward them with his gun clearly visible, yet the cops did not react at all until after the gun fired!

Oswald watched Ruby come at him with that gun in his hand, and did not flinch until the bullet hit him. Conclusion: 1)The cops knew Ruby was going to shoot Oswald, and, 2)Oswald thought Ruby was going to shoot the cops, not himself.

That's JMO, from watching the scene on TV, but I am just another "Conspiracy theorist," who thinks the same Mossad that Jack Ruby served also did 9/11.

When I read Victor Ostrovsky's books, I was convinced that Jack Ruby, who was terminally ill with cancer, was a sayanim, in service of the Mossad. And Oswald was a patsy.

Very well said, sir.As an aside I'd like to point out that a good many Reivers and other non-reiving Border families tend to have relatively large noses and deepset eyes (that often seem to glow).A side profile shows that,in most cases, the large nose that seemed suspicious to those unfamiliar with the type is more straight than hooked. You are right about the "Hooked" part. It was more straight. This is seen clearly here, in his nephew, Henry D. Hatfield, who was Governor Of WV from 1912-1916, and Senator in the late 1920's.
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c44/oldman9x/225px-Henry_Hatfield.jpg
"Doc" Hatfield practiced medicine in Huntington after he lost his Senate seat until he died in the early 1960's. I knew him well.

Hatfield is an English name. I think there are three different towns in England named Hatfield. Our Hatfields(My grandmother was one) came form the border area. The progenitor of the West Virginia Hatfields married a Scottish lass and went to Northern Ireland in the early 1700's. Much of the clan came to America in the 1750's, entering through Philadelphia and settling in the middle of Pennsylvania, where they raised hogs and corn and made corn likker.

Some of them served honorably in Washington's army, only to be thoroughly chagrined when one of his first acts in office was to levy a tax on their corn squeezins. They joined up with their neighbors in the "Whiskey Rebellion," but that fizzled when word came that old GW himself was going to lead the Army in putting them down.

They made a deal with the Governor of Virginia that they would move west of the Blue Ridge and fight off the injuns, keeping them out of the rich Tidewater, and, in return, the Virginia government would not interfere with their whiskey-making.

It worked out well for both sides. So well that the Hatfields, who never owned a slave, joined up with Mr. Lee's army, out of fear that the strong central government Honest Abe represented would come and bust up their stills.

You can read a lot of good stuff about these folks--in general, not specifically about the Hatfields---in Senator Jim Webb's book, "Born fighting: How the Scots-Irish Shaped America." One can't help but believe that Senator Webb has some good racial instincts after reading that book. Of course his Gook wife throws cold water on that. :D

PS:Since you know about the Reivers, you should have no trouble understanding the unpleasantness popularly known as the "Hatfield-McCoy Feud," which took place along the Kentucky/West Virginia border, and had many great similarities to the border raiding of 3 centuries earlier in the Mother country. The similarities are striking, if you get past the lies of the big city press and know what actually happened.

You can read a lot of good stuff about these folks--in general, not specifically about the Hatfields---in Senator Jim Webb's book, "Born fighting: How the Scots-Irish Shaped America."

That's a book I intend to look up.


PS:Since you know about the Reivers, you should have no trouble understanding the unpleasantness popularly known as the "Hatfield-McCoy Feud," which took place along the Kentucky/West Virginia border, and had many great similarities to the border raiding of 3 centuries earlier in the Mother country. The similarities are striking, if you get past the lies of the big city press and know what actually happened.

Hell,I don't even know how many feuds my family's been in.:D

Since one of our primary goals is and must remain to "Name the jew," it is imperative that we have credibility when we make the charge. Therefore I agree with your stringent rule against frivolously laying the charge. That's why I made two posts early in this thread which addressed the charges against the two Presidents, Eisenhower and Johnson.

Yep. I appreciate your chiming in, as they might listen to you. They're only pretending to not hate me out of fear of banning, which is yet another sign they fail to grasp the underlying spirit here.


I thought just simply saying, as I did, that there was almost surely not a single jew in Blanco County, Texas in 1908, when LBJ was born, and most likely no jew had ever set foot in Blanco County in 1908 would suffice to dissuade anyone of the opinion that LBJ was, in fact, jewish. Since my legal residence, where I spend a good deal of time, is only a few miles from the LBJ birthplace, and Texas history has been a lifelong avocation of mine, I thought my words might carry some gravitas. No such luck.

Yep - this is the thing. There's no awareness of context. Have these people ever been to rural Texas? I've been down through Texas at least a dozen times. There was not a lot of swindle-fodder out there in those days. Jews are city people. They need rubes and marks to work their monte on. People calling LBJ a jew, facts aside, don't seem to grasp that jews aren't the kind of people you find much out in the boonies. You can't cheat dirt. If you could, jews would be farmers. Just use common sense, people. How many jews are gonna hole up in bumfuck Texas and teach elementary school to a bunch of ragtag Mexicans? Does that seem like the kind of thing jews usually do? Does it fit their patterns?


Nothing harms our cause more than overstatement of our case on vital points. Whenever I see someone saying "Rockets, not airplanes, hit the twin towers," or "LBJ was a jew," I am faced with deciding whether I am dealing with someone who lacks information, or an enemy. Make no mistake about it, there are as many of our enemies who take these ridiculous positions, while donning the appearance of being a WN as there are honest but ill-informed White people. Much of the time, I am unable to satisfactorily answer the question, so I treat them all the same.

It certainly could be either. I think some of these are just simpletons. Any reference that seems to support the conclusion they want to draw = rock-solid proof. And if someone rolls his eyes, they start shrieking like monkeys spotting a leopard.


My favorite retort to the folks who claim they can "Name the jew," solely on the basis of physiognomy, is this man:

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c44/oldman9x/life14.jpg

That hook-nosed gentleman is none other than Captain William Anderson (Devil Anse) Hatfield, late of the Confederate army, and the leader of the Hatfield faction of the infamous feud. His grandfather, along with thousands of others, including the McCoys, came to the hills of Western Virginia from the borderlands of England and Scotland, by way of Northern Ireland and Pennsylvania.


Is that Wild Bill Anderson? I hope you've seen "Ride with the Devil." It has the best evocation of the mentalities at war of any 'Civil War' movie I've seen - and done by a Taiwanese, no less.


It is highly unlikely that any of his ancestors ever laid eyes on a jew, from the beginning of the world to date. Yet, there are folks posting here who will swear
to their dying day that he is a yid, because of his prominent proboscis.

LOTS of Aryans have big noses. Lots of them. The nose keeps growing as we age, unlike most other body parts. I think the ears might too, or earlobes.

Unwarranted confidence is common to all males. It is biological. It is a fact of life that must be overcome by learning the true value of one's opinion. This can be done through religion, but that's not the best way. The best way is by speculating with money. Very quickly that will teach a man whether he ACTUALLY knows what's he talking about or is simply a fool, full of himself.


There has been much tripe posted on this thread, not all of it by the "LBJ was a jew" faction. That faction has certainly gotten the worst of it, simply because they have no case. Not even AL himself could win that argument! The gentleman who has gotten the better of it is undoubtedly a person who posts on another site, under a different moniker. The style is eerily similar. So much so that I am convinced of the identity.

Hmm, interesting. Not sure what or who you mean.

The stuff Fred dug up could be useful, but not the way he uses it. He should be upfront about the lack of corroborating evidence, and frank about it being very far from conclusive. Because there were a lot of jews in Spain who converted out of fear. And they wound up, many of them, in Holland and England, and/or later emigrated to the New World, including South America, the islands, and North America. So it's not at all impossible that Huffman really was a converso line. But it hasn't been proved. And she was but one of four grandparents. And LBJ certainly wasn't raised jewy. And Texas is about as unjewy a state as can be found. And his background before politics hardly fits known jew patterns. That his political life was wholly dedicated to Israel makes him different from approximately .0001 of our political leaders.


There is nothing worse in a White man than habitual lying. Knowing this, real White man are as judicious in leveling the charge of "Liar" as they are in "Naming the jew." Over usage of either epithet is cause for concern about the one making the charge. It is a tactic dear to the heart of Jack Boot, himself.


All naming the jew means is, if someone is a jew, they should be called a jew. Not anything else. Same as we'd call a Lutheran or Martian or Croatian what it is, rather than some other vague or euphemistic escape term.


If I had a web forum, I'd want a couple of "Donnies in Ohio" around, They act as a sieve, filtering out the unfit. Like fire, they also temper the worthy.

Yes, indeed.

That's hardly fair or honest, Alex.

I admit that the evidence I presented isn't conclusive, but your boy Donnie simply ignored it and attacked me personally instead.

You drew first blood.

All I wanted him to do was speak to the facts, but that obviously was far too much to ask.

You didn't present any facts to address.

The entire basis for your extraordinary claim that LBJ was a Jew is that he had ancestors named Huffman.

That's it.

You can stack that one point atop itself to the height of Olympus Mons, and it is still proof of nothing.


Tell me how he got a PM I sent to you.

You sent it to me Fred, I'm Alex Linder.

Or you posted it as a visitor message on Scooter Robert's public profile, where it remains like immovable Gibraltar to this very day.


Take your pick.


I never asked you to ban him, only to put a bug in his ear to stop trashing this thread and derailing it, which he has admitted he was doing.

I "admitted" no such thing. Do you realize that your just saying random shit doesn't make it true?

I pointed out that this thread resides in the rightfully infamous Nutzpah lounge of naughty, toxoid VNN, and is not an activism thread. Alex (or is it I?) explained why.

I understand you view your (most recent) banishment from Warmfront as a grave development in worldwide White Nationalism. I don't.

And speaking of that PM, if I cared enough to Lewis & Clark my way back through this thread, and I don't, I could find the post where you denied ever writing or sending it. Awkward, itz!


I suppose maybe I am stupid and illitterate. Stupid for ever engaging that asshole and illitterate because I have large fingers, mistype words and don't use spellcheck because my PC has issues with that program.

Like Christ Jesus, we all have our crosses to bear.


You have defended him and his attacking style from the beginning. Instead of muzzling that dog, you set him upon the rest of us and let him know there would never be any repercussions no matter what he did.

That's Devil dog to you, Fred.

I am subject to the exact same (few) rules as any other poster. The difference is I actually follow them. Woof.



When we all see him as belligerant, antagonistic and disruptive, you just let it slide and ridicule the rest of us. If you are one and the same, that would sure explain alot.

If me were he, using "alot" should concern thee.


I don't have a problem with anyone disagreeing with me, when its in the interest of exploring the truth or finding answers.

You can't handle the truth!

Deep down in places you don't like to talk about you want me on this thread! You need me on this thread!


That isn't what's happened here. This started with denegrating remarks from Donnie and there has been no let up.

"None of this noble surrender bullshit. Tenacity is a White hallmark".

I draw my inspiration from those words, taken from Celtic Patriot's final address to hunkered Stormfronters grimly facing the inevitable.


Let him push my buttons? Fuck him. I have never been one to run from a fight, and I rachet up at every exchange, whether in person or in writing. That is my nature, to confront disrespect and treachery with anger and hostility. And, it is your way too.

Linder is the exact opposite of a hothead.

His style isn't to hurl obscenities at someone, he just dismantles their assertions. Usually while laughing his ass off, I suspect.

I'm a very easy going guy. I'm normally very slow to anger.

Anger can blind you. Remaining calm in any situation is always best. It's something than can be taught to some degree, but stress can be a motherfucker for some.




Everybody in this thread is wrong and Donnie is right? C'mon, that's an unreasonable position to stake out. His assinine acts are plain for all to see.

Everybody? Who are you speaking for, Fred?



What I don't understand is why he hasn't been reigned in at some point, it's as obvious as can be what he has been doing. Is Donnie here to test our patience?.

Just your arguments.


We new VNNF folks were inundated with Donnie types, we are very well aware of their tactics, MO, and evil intent.

My type is legion on VNN, Fred. And I'm far from the tip of that particular spear, so to speak.


We came here hoping not to have to deal with trolls. His actions fit the definition of internet troll, search for it yourself if you disagree. Why would you allow, even encourage, anyone to attack your newest members? It makes no rational sense to me.

You came heer because you had no other choice, get that part straight.

Where else are you going to bitch about being banned from Stormfront yet again?

Hey Donnie, congratulations on beating Fred.

I owe it all to clean living & naked pilates.

Now lets see if you can prove that chemtrails is the imagination of nutbars.

Let's not. I have no interest in the subject, because it's kinda goofy.

Your advocate and debating judge Mike Todd says the burden of proof lies on the accuser.

Judge Todd is a venerable jurist of some note.

Yes, the burden of proof indeed lies on the accuser.

Your theory is that the government(s?) control the weather, and manipulate it to maximize profits by keeping lines of commerce open.

The recent blizzards shutting down whole cites for days would point to the government having not perfected the whole process, I would think.

See, weather-control is what is known as an "extraordinary claim". Meaning that there is no peer-reviewed evidence of the claim, therefore extraordinary proof is needed to verify the claim.

To put it in terms you might understand better, you need a dead Bigfoot, John.


Lets see what you're made of farmer-boy.

My vocation is "man of leisure". I'm made of carbon, mostly.

Originally Posted by Stonewall:
Since one of our primary goals is and must remain to "Name the jew," it is imperative that we have credibility when we make the charge.

Yea, I tried saying that like 10 different ways.

I thought just simply saying, as I did, that there was almost surely not a single jew in Blanco County, Texas in 1908, when LBJ was born, and most likely no jew had ever set foot in Blanco County in 1908 would suffice to dissuade anyone of the opinion that LBJ was, in fact, jewish. Since my legal residence, where I spend a good deal of time, is only a few miles from the LBJ birthplace, and Texas history has been a lifelong avocation of mine, I thought my words might carry some gravitas. No such luck.

I thought that was weird myself. In all other matters, they seem to give great weight to your opinions. Their Yoda, you are.

Like I said, it just seemed weird that your word carried no weight in that specific matter.

I'm a huge history buff as well, btw.

Nothing harms our cause more than overstatement of our case on vital points.

Attention to detail should always be of a primary concern for us. The facts are wholly on our side. Our enemies have nothing but emotion and bayonet-points, administered liberally whenever necessary.

We don't need to invent phony Jews to point out just how utterly destructive the Pod People have been, and are today.

Fred would do better digging into the life of Rahm Emmanuel or Henry Kissinger. Or a hundred thousand other real Jews who are doing dirt today.

It's easy. The Tea-Party types hate Jon (Leibowitz) Stewart of "The Daily Show" with a passion. Why not spend one's time pointing out that he's a Jew?

There has been much tripe posted on this thread, not all of it by the "LBJ was a jew" faction. That faction has certainly gotten the worst of it, simply because they have no case. Not even AL himself could win that argument! The gentleman who has gotten the better of it is undoubtedly a person who posts on another site, under a different moniker. The style is eerily similar. So much so that I am convinced of the identity.

Who are you referencing here?


If I had a web forum, I'd want a couple of "Donnies in Ohio" around, They act as a sieve, filtering out the unfit. Like fire, they also temper the worthy.


Thanks. My importance has somehow gotten blown wayyyyy out of all proportion in this thread.

I honestly don't look at it as if it's my job to "test" anyone.

It just turns out that way, sometimes.

Funny story about LBJ: he's walking toward a waiting row of helicopters when a Marine guard points him to one, saying, "That's your helicopter, Mr. President." LBJ replies, "They're all my helicopters, son." To me that screams white asshole, not jew.

Hanski senior moderator:

"It is my understanding that Stormfront does not prohibit the discussion of conspiracy theories, but management does reserve the right to limit discussion of alternative theories. And if that weren't the case it would be an absolute free for all on this board.

Then there are those posters who spend practically every waking hour making inane posts and creating multiple threads regarding the latest conspiracy news. These same people cry censorship (or even accuse us of being a part of the greater conspiracy) when we ask them to tone it down, but they never seem to get the fact that their posts and threads often do more harm than good. And at some point you think they would accidentally stumble across and entertain fionula's:troll very pointed question: "Chemtrails? What do all the conspiracy theories have to do with White Nationalism? Can anyone tell me?"

joe 6 pack:troll also made an important point regarding the burden of proof. I would like to make an attempt at further clarifying his point.

Whenever an extraordinary claim is made in an attempt to overthrow a large body of knowledge then the burden of proof will be correspondingly greater. In short, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and the burden of proof falls squarely on the shoulders of those making said claims."

So talk about conspiracies is not strictly verboten, but the emphasis should be on factual evidence; not wild speculation. And if your entire raison d'être is all about the conspiracy then I would politely ask that you at least keep your discussions light, or better yet, ease off that stuff every now and then.
__________________

Here's another goodie:
In one of Johnson's early campaigns for a House seat, during a late night strategy session, he suggested to his staff that they should start a rumor that his opponent enjoyed carnal knowledge with his barnyard sows.
"Christ, Lyndon", one aid replied. "We can't call the man a pig-fucker, nobody would believe it!"
"I know that", Johnson retorted,"I just want to hear the sonuvabitch DENY it!"

Here's another goodie:
In one of Johnson's early campaigns for a House seat, during a late night strategy session, he suggested to his staff that they should start a rumor that his opponent enjoyed carnal knowledge with his barnyard sows.
"Christ, Lyndon", one aid replied. "We can't call the man a pig-fucker, nobody would believe it!"
"I know that", Johnson retorted,"I just want to hear the sonuvabitch DENY it!"

We could take over within 15 years if we had 10 men who thought like Johnson--maybe fewer on both counts.

We could take over within 15 years if we had 10 men who thought like Johnson--maybe fewer on both counts.

Or his opinion on mollifying an opponent, he said he'd

'rather have them inside the tent pissing out than outside the tent pissing in."

If you want to see how politics works--and in the South generally and Texas specifically--watch the ESPN documentary Pony Excess, on the late 70's/early-to-mid-80's football program at SMU.

Extrapolate to the larger, non-sports world.

Fred, I've said 100x this site is for men, not women or men who think like them. You think like them. Simple questions are interpreted by you as a personal attack. That is how women think. It's why they are not well suited for politics. It's why people who think like you and many of other expellees end up alone in a tiny room telling each other the same thing. They can't handle any disagreement. Their only technique for handling disagreement is to shout it down.

Except when I critiqued a claim you made on 911, which was when you immediately deleted that post (well duh) and forbid me to ever discuss such issues unless I went public all the way. After a few days, you allowed me to post in the Tard Coral if I ever wanted to comment on the idiocy some here purports, and only there.

All in all. Yes Alex, I agree; such women/men/Victor/Victoria are those who react as like so when confronted with "pesky facts", and don't realise their own hypocrisy.

And Donnie, dont you mind the bugs, there's a few in every crowd.

Except when I critiqued a claim you made on 911, which was when you immediately deleted that post (well duh) and forbid me to ever discuss such issues unless I went public all the way.It was probably not for the content of your post but the cunty quality of your coyness that was the annoyance.
Passive/Aggressiveness being another bitch-trait in need of purging.

It was probably not for the content of your post but the cunty quality of your coyness that was the annoyance.
Passive/Aggressiveness being another bitch-trait in need of purging.

And that means what, in non-feminine phrasing? Basic on-point critique sans emotional nonsense is "cunty quality of coyness", or passive-aggressive? That's reading whining and emotions into something that was not there.

It was probably not for the content of your post but the cunty quality of your coyness that was the annoyance.
Passive/Aggressiveness being another bitch-trait in need of purging.

Nah, it wasn't just him. Linder effectively shut down discussion of 9/11 by those who didn't follow the line of thinking that airplanes alone couldn't have demo'd the towers by requiring them to post with their real names (except in the Tard Corral).

http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1201773&postcount=433

... or "LBJ was a jew," I am faced with deciding whether I am dealing with someone who lacks information, or an enemy.

Oldman, you are a Christian, you see the world in terms of Good and Bad, black and white. This is my helpful character observation of you, it is also your character flaw. Yes there is Black and White, there are also very darks and very lights in terms of morals. Genocides are not pure absolutes, the are relative as is all science. Measurement has more power than judgement as it is technology which enables art in human history.

To be a Jew or not a Jew can be more complicated than the Christian doctrine of + or -.

With many Jews and part-Jews today, they are more complex enemies. Yes they are Jews, but to what biological degree. With the rate of intermarriage the Jew threat becomes more dangerous. There are numerous part-Jews out there who have a Jew grandparent or parent even. I don't think we need to Christian Identity ourselves into blindly thinking one-drop or no-drop with regards to identifying Jews. We need to use a scientific method to evaluate the degree of Jew in a threat.

You as a Christian will make a broad statement that LBJ cannot be a Jew, meaning full Jew, because your Christian Bible makes the broad distincition of Jew and Christian based on theological perspectives. But do you think logically and quantify to what actual biological degree LBJ may have been a Jew, in fact?

I think it is vital to our survival as a White Race, that we discern and encourage the discernment of to what biological degree a person is a Jew, in addition to being a Jew.

Whether Churchill, FDR, LBJ, Oliver Stone, Harrison Ford, have some Jew genes is vital to our overall accounts of history. Whenever I see some Christian state that some part-Jew cannot possibly be a real Jew and then go on to attack fellow Whites over it, I see the flaws in Christian doctrine. I see the same old Christianity cannibalizing the same self White Race.

If you Oldman want to believe Christ (a Jew) was a White, then surely it is okay for a WN to think LBJ was a Jew. If the belief serves a purpose, then the belief is valid.



.

Oldman, you are a Christian, you see the world in terms of Good and Bad, black and white. This is my helpful character observation of you, it is also your character flaw.

To be a Jew or not a Jew can be more complicated than the Christian doctrine of + or -.

With many Jews and part-Jews today, they are more complex enemies. Yes they are Jews, but to what biological degree. With the rate of intermarriage the Jew threat becomes more dangerous. There are numerous part-Jews out there who have a Jew grandparent or parent even. I don't think we need to Christian Identity ourselves into blindly thinking one-drop or no-drop with regards to identifying Jews. We need to use a scientific method to evaluate the degree of Jew in a threat.

You as a Christian will make a broad statement that LBJ cannot be a Jew, meaning full Jew, because your Christian Bible makes the broad distincition of Jew and Christian based on theological perspectives. But do you think logically and quantify to what actual biological degree LBJ may have been a Jew, in fact?

I think it is vital to our survival as a White Race, that we discern and encourage the discernment of to what biological degree a person is a Jew, in addition to being a Jew.

Whether Churchill, FDR, LBJ, Oliver Stone, Harrison Ford, have some Jew genes is vital to our overall accounts of history. Whenever I see some Christian state that some part-Jew cannot possibly be a real Jew and then go on to attack fellow Whites over it, I see the flaws in Christian doctrine. I see the same old Christianity cannibalizing the same self White Race.

If anything, you're the one being typically Christian in that you assume your own unfounded assertion as fact, then concoct some convoluted, pseudo-psychological rationale for why the other guy won't accept your claim that an apple is really an orange.

Don't bait with straw men.

Oldman, you are a Christian, you see the world in terms of Good and Bad, black and white. This is my helpful character observation of you

Talk about the kiss of death.

With many Jews and part-Jews today, they are more complex enemies. Yes they are Jews, but to what biological degree. With the rate of intermarriage the Jew threat becomes more dangerous. There are numerous part-Jews out there who have a Jew grandparent or parent even. I don't think we need to Christian Identity ourselves into blindly thinking one-drop or no-drop with regards to identifying Jews. We need to use a scientific method to evaluate the degree of Jew in a threat.

You as a Christian will make a broad statement that LBJ cannot be a Jew, meaning full Jew, because your Christian Bible makes the broad distincition of Jew and Christian based on theological perspectives. But do you think logically and quantify to what actual biological degree LBJ may have been a Jew, in fact?


CP, you were the one arguing that very few chess champions were jews just because most of them were half-jewish, so they could not be qualified as being jewish.

Stonewall argued that the likelyhood of LBJ being a jew is miniscule, beyond what you'd claim based on reasonable logic. Of course, LBJ could've been a jew, but nothing indicates or proves that he was. And Stonewall was, as I gathered, basically arguing that becase some people are too quick to base their "name the jew" reflexes on a mere phenotypical level they were more often wrong than right if primarily using that aspect as the yardstick.

It had little to do with Jesus.

I think it is vital to our survival as a White Race, that we discern and encourage the discernment of to what biological degree a person is a Jew, in addition to being a Jew.


Then is it too much for me to hope that you now, finally, agree that a quarter-jew or half-jew actually qualifies as being a jew?

If you Oldman want to believe Christ (a Jew) was a White, then surely it is okay for a WN to think LBJ was a Jew.

Apples and... well, mangos.

[QUOTE=Celtic_Patriot;1218089]Oldman, you are a Christian, you see the world in terms of Good and Bad, black and white. This is my helpful character observation of you

Talk about the kiss of death.

With many Jews and part-Jews today, they are more complex enemies. Yes they are Jews, but to what biological degree. With the rate of intermarriage the Jew threat becomes more dangerous. There are numerous part-Jews out there who have a Jew grandparent or parent even. I don't think we need to Christian Identity ourselves into blindly thinking one-drop or no-drop with regards to identifying Jews. We need to use a scientific method to evaluate the degree of Jew in a threat.

You as a Christian will make a broad statement that LBJ cannot be a Jew, meaning full Jew, because your Christian Bible makes the broad distincition of Jew and Christian based on theological perspectives. But do you think logically and quantify to what actual biological degree LBJ may have been a Jew, in fact?


CP, you were the one arguing that very few chess champions were jews just because most of them were half-jewish, so they could not be qualified as being jewish.

Stonewall argued that the likelyhood of LBJ being a jew is miniscule, beyond what you'd claim based on reasonable logic. Of course, LBJ could've been a jew, but nothing indicates or proves that he was. And Stonewall was, as I gathered, basically arguing that becase some people are too quick to base their "name the jew" reflexes on a mere phenotypical level they were more often wrong than right if primarily using that aspect as the yardstick.

It had little to do with Jesus.

I think it is vital to our survival as a White Race, that we discern and encourage the discernment of to what biological degree a person is a Jew, in addition to being a Jew.


Then is it too much for me to hope that you now, finally, agree that a quarter-jew or half-jew actually qualifies as being a jew?

If the belief serves a purpose, then the belief is valid.


No, that's what I like to call cannibalistic logic. I.e it eats itself. If belief in X serves the purpose of avoiding Y, it doesn't mean X is correct and/or that it can account for the continued equation. In essence, if you believe that roses will grow when you plant a two months old sour lettuce, it might potentially serve the purpose of making you happy with the prospects, or to make a buck, but in the end roses will not grow from sour lettuce.

If anything, you're the one being typically Christian in that you assume your own unfounded assertion as fact, then concoct some convoluted, pseudo-psychological rationale for why the other guy won't accept your claim that an apple is really an orange.

Don't bait with straw men.

I suggest you re-read what I wrote. Perhaps you will understand it.

As for truth and theology, Christian history is as much defined by heretics as by orthodoxy, that is the actual historical account. As for my views, I see all Christianity, including heretical branches, as a Jewish form of early Communism. With Moses being Marx.

It is somewhat unethical for a Christian such as Oldman to criticize a WN such as Fred over belief in who is a Jew or part-Jew or not. Christ was most likely a half-Jew and LBJ a quarter-Jew.



.

He sounds like Donnie.

Yes, it's my theory. Unlike most people I look up and observe the sky and I always see these jets (which are probably military) making tick-tack-toe, j hooks, and X patterns. I have been witnessing these patterns for almost ten years. After they spray it gets unusually warm.


Right, you're posioned with a mind-controlling chemical, but somehow anyone who is involved or in the future will spearhead this global operation are wearing invisible masks as a precaution?

Hanski senior moderator:

"It is my understanding that Stormfront does not prohibit the discussion of conspiracy theories, but management does reserve the right to limit discussion of alternative theories. And if that weren't the case it would be an absolute free for all on this board.

Then there are those posters who spend practically every waking hour making inane posts and creating multiple threads regarding the latest conspiracy news. These same people cry censorship (or even accuse us of being a part of the greater conspiracy) when we ask them to tone it down, but they never seem to get the fact that their posts and threads often do more harm than good. And at some point you think they would accidentally stumble across and entertain fionula's:troll very pointed question: "Chemtrails? What do all the conspiracy theories have to do with White Nationalism? Can anyone tell me?"

joe 6 pack:troll also made an important point regarding the burden of proof. I would like to make an attempt at further clarifying his point.

Whenever an extraordinary claim is made in an attempt to overthrow a large body of knowledge then the burden of proof will be correspondingly greater. In short, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and the burden of proof falls squarely on the shoulders of those making said claims."

So talk about conspiracies is not strictly verboten, but the emphasis should be on factual evidence; not wild speculation. And if your entire raison d'être is all about the conspiracy then I would politely ask that you at least keep your discussions light, or better yet, ease off that stuff every now and then.
__________________


He sounds like Donnie.

Your theory is that the government(s?) control the weather, and manipulate it to maximize profits by keeping lines of commerce open.

The recent blizzards shutting down whole cites for days would point to the government having not perfected the whole process, I would think.

See, weather-control is what is known as an "extraordinary claim". Meaning that there is no peer-reviewed evidence of the claim, therefore extraordinary proof is needed to verify the claim.

To put it in terms you might understand better, you need a dead Bigfoot, John.Yes, it's my theory. Unlike most people I look up and observe the sky and I always see these jets (which are probably military) making tick-tack-toe, j hooks, and X patterns. I have been witnessing these patterns for almost ten years. After they spray it gets unusually warm.

The above post by censor and race traitor Hanky is why SF can never be a site for thinking men who want to control their own destiny.

Weather manipulation has everything to do with white nationalism. If we want to control our destiny then we have to control our economy. Weather manipulation is one branch of zog economic manipulation. You say i need a dead bigfoot, you also claim that my concerns are extraordinary, you state in general terms that many cities have had heavy snowfalls.

The proof is in the sky and the abnormal effects it causes, making my claims and concerns reasonable. It should also be noted that the media uses emotional scare tactics to make storms worse than they actually are. Twenty years ago the news media had a five day forecast, today, they have a ten day forecast. Better technology? or actual manipulation of weather patterns by altering jet streams with chemicals?

See, weather-control is what is known as an "extraordinary claim". Meaning that there is no peer-reviewed evidence of the claim, therefore extraordinary proof is needed to verify the claim.Peer review? by who? our zoggie government occupied by all types of malcontents? I don't need anyone to think for me. I can see with clarity.

I would think someone like yourself who is involved in farming should have noticed some strange and unusual changes in the weather that is obviously not a result of a decision made by a God in the clouds. Farmers have a reputation for predicting weather, they are the original forecasters.

It is somewhat unethical for a Christian such as Oldman to criticize a WN such as Fred over belief in who is a Jew or part-Jew or not.

See, cannibalistic logic. You're reasoning assumes that a christian WN should take any fellow's claim as gospel. Thinking doesn't hurt CP, critical thinking certainly doesn't. Your drivel however does.

Talk about the kiss of death.


If you actually had a mind, then you could write. The trouble is your Talmud study has dulled your mind.


CP, you were the one arguing that very few chess champions were jews just because most of them were half-jewish, so they could not be qualified as being jewish.

I think you have lost your mind. I was stating that part-Jews are a threat that need to be identified as such.



.

If you actually had a mind, then you could write. The trouble is your Talmud study has dulled your mind.

I think you have lost your mind. I was stating that part-Jews are a threat that need to be identified as such.



Except when someone claims that there are a disproportionate amount of jewish chess-champions, then you are quick to point out that one cannot count the half and quarter jews as such as they are not jews that much. Come one Celtic Patriot, Keltic Man, Blue Spruce et al, I was wise to you after the second post you did on Stormfront. The proplem here on VNN is that there's no John Law doing something about it, allthough MuadDib (Wayne) did and does routinely call you out.

Right, you're posioned with a mind-controlling chemical, but somehow anyone who is involved or in the future will spearhead this global operation are wearing invisible masks as a precaution?

I never made the claim that chemtrails are poison. I said it was for weather manipulation and it was probably linked to the HAARP project.

This is a U.S. Government Computer System

This computer system operates as a world wide web server to provide information to the public concerning unclassified programs only. http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/haarp/images/DoN.gif You may freely access all of the files and images that have been made available on the various home pages hosted by this server. Spend as much or as little time as you wish but remember that this is a U. S. Government computer system. This system is monitored to ensure proper operation, to verify the functioning of applicable security features, and for other like purposes. Use of this service constitutes consent to such monitoring. Unauthorized attempts to upload or change information; to defeat or circumvent security features; or to utilize this system for other than its intended purposes are prohibited and may result in prosecution under the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act of 1986 or other applicable statutes and regulations.



http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/haarp/images/hpimage.jpg
http://www.haarp.alaska.edu/

We could take over within 15 years if we had 10 men who thought like Johnson--maybe fewer on both counts.

Lyndon Johnson allowed the attack on the USS Liberty to continue after he was informed about it.

We need less Lyndon Johnsons and more Patrick Henry leaders.


.

I never made the claim that chemtrails are poison. I said it was for weather manipulation and it was probably linked to the HAARP project.


Lion Axe always lies.

Hmm, your behaviour is quite similar to Celtic Patriot, please don't tell me you are yet another one of his sock-puppets?
And the FTS/CTS-thingy was answered in the rebuttal which you didn't bother to read.

Here Lion Axe essentially accuses another poster of being me.

Lion Axe had very little credibility, judgement, or mind, it has been proven. He really can't think. His thinking is warped from his extensive Talmud study. The Talmud of course being the ultimate C.S. Lewis novel.


.

I never made the claim that chemtrails are poison. I said it was for weather manipulation and it was probably linked to the HAARP project.

Ah, sorry, the HAARP aspect must be a recent off-shot of the chemtrails thingy. I assumed you were arguing the "mind-control"-theory. However, the weather affects us all, so I guess part of my previous argument remains. If it is bad for us then...

Lion Axe always lies.



Here Lion Axe essentially accuses another poster of being me.

Lion Axe had very little credibility, judgement, or mind, it has been proven. He really can't think. His thinking is warped from his extensive Talmud study. The Talmud of course being the ultimate C.S. Lewis novel.


.

Apart from your mandatory insanity, what the heck have C.S Lewis got to do with it? He was an amazing caretaker and delivered of aryan folklore. Don't bogart the Lewis with your judaic tom-foolery, you hear!

Weather manipulation has everything to do with white nationalism.

Obviously. And anyone who questions that is a jew, I might add.

Obviously. And anyone who questions that is a jew, I might add.

I never said that so don't insinuate I did. If you want to challenge me on my post then feel free.

YouTube - Holocaust Movie Mind Control

This historic thread just keeps getting historicaler and historicalerer with every post.

This historic thread just keeps getting historicaler and historicalerer with every post.

lol, you stole my post.

This historic thread just keeps getting historicaler and historicalerer with every post.

I thought it was a good video, and more important than whether or not LBJ was a heeb.

I thought it was a good video, and more important than whether or not LBJ was a heeb.

Peoples minds can also be altered through architecture.


http://www.syahdiar.org/images/2010/11/daewon-park-observatory-modern-architecture-building-concept.jpg
http://www.archithings.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/Undercurrent-Architects-Modern-Architecture.jpg (http://www.archithings.net/modern-leaf-house-australian-architecture-designed-by-undercurrent-architects/undercurrent-architects-night-view-2)
http://www.civilengineergroup.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/modern-architecture.jpg
http://www.architeria.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Stairs-Architecture-of-Otto-Bock-Building-in-Berlin-by-Gn%C3%A4dinger-Architects.jpg
http://www.inhabitat.com/wp-content/uploads/habitat67.jpg (http://www.inhabitat.com/2009/08/20/habitat-67-montreals-prefab-pixel-city/habitat67/)

Oldman, you are a Christian, you see the world in terms of Good and Bad, black and white. This is my helpful character observation of you, it is also your character flaw. Yes there is Black and White, there are also very darks and very lights in terms of morals. Genocides are not pure absolutes, the are relative as is all science. Measurement has more power than judgement as it is technology which enables art in human history.

To be a Jew or not a Jew can be more complicated than the Christian doctrine of + or -.

With many Jews and part-Jews today, they are more complex enemies. Yes they are Jews, but to what biological degree. With the rate of intermarriage the Jew threat becomes more dangerous. There are numerous part-Jews out there who have a Jew grandparent or parent even. I don't think we need to Christian Identity ourselves into blindly thinking one-drop or no-drop with regards to identifying Jews. We need to use a scientific method to evaluate the degree of Jew in a threat.

You as a Christian will make a broad statement that LBJ cannot be a Jew, meaning full Jew, because your Christian Bible makes the broad distincition of Jew and Christian based on theological perspectives. But do you think logically and quantify to what actual biological degree LBJ may have been a Jew, in fact?

I think it is vital to our survival as a White Race, that we discern and encourage the discernment of to what biological degree a person is a Jew, in addition to being a Jew.

Whether Churchill, FDR, LBJ, Oliver Stone, Harrison Ford, have some Jew genes is vital to our overall accounts of history. Whenever I see some Christian state that some part-Jew cannot possibly be a real Jew and then go on to attack fellow Whites over it, I see the flaws in Christian doctrine. I see the same old Christianity cannibalizing the same self White Race.

If you Oldman want to believe Christ (a Jew) was a White, then surely it is okay for a WN to think LBJ was a Jew. If the belief serves a purpose, then the belief is valid.



.

I don't think I have ever answered a post from you on this or any other forum. Since I agree with my friend Wayne--and he is my good friend---about your mental condition, I have not considered it worth my time. But this gargantuan straw man you have constructed here does merit comment. There is not a single iota of evidence anywhere supporting any of the statements you make about me in this post. It is entirely a construct of your own fevered imagination.

There is not a word--not a single syllable--- of any post of mine that even intimates that 1) I am a Christian, 2) I base any of my arguments on christian dogma or the bible, or, 3)That I believe Jesus of Nazareth was White, or part White, or anything else for that matter.


Furthermore, there is not a single word in my posts pertaining to part jews being jews or not jews, and there are NO attacks on ANY White person in my posts here. If you consider my statement of the simple fact that Blanco County, Texas was almost certainly juden-frei as of 1908 an attack on someone, then I completely understand Alex's discomfiture with the presence of some of the Stormfront rejects who have been cast ashore on his little cyber-space island.

Good god man, get a grip!

Further, deponent saith not.

Nah, it wasn't just him. Linder effectively shut down discussion of 9/11 by those who didn't follow the line of thinking that airplanes alone couldn't have demo'd the towers by requiring them to post with their real names (except in the Tard Corral).

http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1201773&postcount=433

Oh good, Georgie, you're back in this thread; perhaps NOW you can answer my 3 weeks old question:

http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1207503&postcount=4209

It's been 3 god damn weeks, Georgie. What's wrong? You can't find an answer? Have you lost your paperback NIST 9/11 report?

Except when I critiqued a claim you made on 911, which was when you immediately deleted that post (well duh) and forbid me to ever discuss such issues unless I went public all the way. After a few days, you allowed me to post in the Tard Coral if I ever wanted to comment on the idiocy some here purports, and only there.

So, you're allowed to post whatever you want here. Sounds like real suppression to me.

All in all. Yes Alex, I agree; such women/men/Victor/Victoria are those who react as like so when confronted with "pesky facts", and don't realise their own hypocrisy.

No one loses his job for backing the ZOGline on 9/11. So there's no reason you can't use your real name, if you're not a troll. But of course you are a troll. Your sole interest here is burying solid information about the producers of '9/11' the minute it appears, and I won't let you do that. I mean, I won't let you do that under your troll name, only your real name.

Instead of playing "who's the nigger in the woodpile", How about voting for the most heeb friendly "shabbos goy", my vote goes to LBJ, Anyone come up with a better choice? Oscar Shindler, J. McCain? W. Churchill? F.D.R. (does he even qualify?, you have to be gentile:D)

The Johnson's were so heeb friendly that they feared reprisals by the KKK .:eek:
Here's my candidates list of recommendations for most heeb friendly goy.
I nominate him for the distinguished title of "Honouary Heeb", and "Lifetime Heeb Protection award".

http://www.davidduke.com/images/lbj-uss-liberty-treason.jpg

A few weeks ago, the Associated Press reported that newly released tapes from US president Lyndon Johnson’s White House office showed LBJ’s “personal and often emotional connection to Israel.” The news agency pointed out that during the Johnson presidency (1963-1969), “the United States became Israel’s chief diplomatic ally and primary arms supplier.”

But the news report does little to reveal the full historical extent of Johnson’s actions on behalf of the Jewish people and the State of Israel. Most students of the Arab-Israeli conflict can identify Johnson as the president during the 1967 war. But few know about LBJ’s actions to rescue hundreds of endangered Jews during the Holocaust – actions that could have thrown him out of Congress and into jail. Indeed, the title of “Righteous Gentile” is certainly appropriate in the case of the Texan, whose centennial year is being commemorated this year.

Appropriately enough, the annual Jerusalem Conference announced this week that it will honor Johnson in February 2009.

Historians have revealed that Johnson, while serving as a young congressman in 1938 and 1939, arranged for visas to be supplied to Jews in Warsaw, and oversaw the apparently illegal immigration of hundreds of Jews through the port of Galveston, Texas.

A key resource for uncovering LBJ’s pro-Jewish activity is the unpublished 1989 doctoral thesis by University of Texas student Louis Gomolak, “Prologue: LBJ’s Foreign Affairs Background, 1908-1948.” Johnson’s activities were confirmed by other historians in interviews with his wife, family members and political associates.

Research into Johnson’s personal history indicates that he inherited his concern for the Jewish people from his family. His aunt Jessie Johnson Hatcher, a major influence on LBJ, was a member of the Zionist Organization of America. According to Gomolak, Aunt Jessie had nurtured LBJ’s commitment to befriending Jews for 50 years. As a young boy, Lyndon watched his politically active grandfather “Big Sam” and father “Little Sam” seek clemency for Leo Frank, the Jewish victim of a blood libel in Atlanta. Frank was lynched by a mob in 1915, and the Ku Klux Klan in Texas threatened to kill the Johnsons. The Johnsons later told friends that Lyndon’s family hid in their cellar while his father and uncles stood guard with shotguns on their porch in case of KKK attacks. Johnson’s speechwriter later stated, “Johnson often cited Leo Frank’s lynching as the source of his opposition to both anti-Semitism and isolationism.

http://www.davidduke.com/general/j-post-article-sheds-some-light-on-lbjs-treasonous-pro-zionist-policies_4690.html

Friend, ally, savior: Revealing LBJ’s Jewish ties

http://www.jweekly.com/images/jweekly/jweekly_logo.gif
"I sure as hell want to be careful and not run out on little Israel," Johnson said in a March 1968 conversation with his ambassador to the United Nations, Arthur Goldberg, according to White House tapes recently released.

Soon after the 1967 war, Soviet premier Aleksei Kosygin asked Johnson at the Glassboro Summit why the U.S. supported Israel when there were 80 million Arabs and only 3 million Israelis. "Because it is right," responded the straight-shooting Texan.

The crafting of U.N. Resolution 242 in November 1967 was done under Johnson's scrutiny. The call for "secure and recognized boundaries" was critical. In September 1968, Johnson explained, "We are not the ones to say where other nations should draw lines between them that will assure each the greatest security. It is clear, however, that a return to the situation of 4 June 1967 will not bring peace."

Goldberg later noted, "Resolution 242 in no way refers to Jerusalem, and this omission was deliberate." This historic diplomacy was conducted under Johnson's stewardship, as Goldberg related in oral history to the Johnson Library. "I must say for Johnson," Goldberg said, "he gave me great personal support."

Robert David Johnson, a professor of history at Brooklyn College, recently wrote in the New York Sun, "Johnson's policies stemmed more from personal concerns — his friendship with leading Zionists, his belief that America had a moral obligation to bolster Israeli security and his conception of Israel as a frontier land much like his home state of Texas."

http://www.jweekly.com/article/full/36262/friend-ally-savior-revealing-lbj-s-jewish-ties/

In recognition of Lyndon Johnson's efforts to save European Jewry as Hitler's noose tightened around their necks in the 1930s.

Appropriately enough, the annual Jerusalem Conference announced this week that it will honor Johnson in February 2009.
Historians have revealed that Johnson, while serving as a young congressman in 1938 and 1939, arranged for visas to be supplied to Jews in Warsaw, and oversaw the apparently illegal immigration of hundreds of Jews through the port of Galveston, Texas.
A key resource for uncovering LBJ's pro-Jewish activity is the unpublished 1989 doctoral thesis by University of Texas student Louis Gomolak, "Prologue: LBJ's Foreign Affairs Background, 1908-1948." Johnson's activities were confirmed by other historians in interviews with his wife, family members and political associates.

Adrian Levy served as mayor of Galveston from 1935 to 1939, (shit , who said there were no kikes in Texas? oh right, Levy is a gentile also:D) was a close friend of LBJ's, and probably played a role in smuggling Jews into Galveston. A Galveston library has some 10 inches of Levy's papers. We need to find a Levy descendant who may have more information and someone to look at those papers. (Pictured: Roosevelt, Johnson and Levy in 1937)


http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_FhXmbCq6o6g/SGIS3Z9GtvI/AAAAAAAAAb0/PGOZzcSIvow/s200/levy+and+lbj.jpg

“The title of Righteous among the Nations is awarded by a special Commission … that operates according to a well-defined set of rules and criteria. The Righteous Gentile, as defined by the Yad Vashem Law enacted by the Israeli Knesset in 1953, are non-Jews who during the Holocaust risked their lives. In some cases, the Commission also bestows the title on people who did not risk their lives, but took grave risks in order to assist Jews in danger of deportation. Johnson Saved Hundreds of Jews

http://lyndonjohnsonandisrael.blogspot.com/

Instead of playing "who's the nigger in the woodpile", How about voting for the most heeb friendly "shabbos goy", my vote goes to LBJ, Anyone come up with a better choice? Oscar Shindler, J. McCain? W. Churchill? F.D.R. (does he even qualify?, you have to be gentile:D)

The Johnson's were so heeb friendly that they feared reprisals by the KKK .:eek:
Here's my candidates list of recommendations for most heeb friendly goy.
I nominate him for the distinguished title of "Honouary Heeb", and "Lifetime Heeb Protection award".

http://www.davidduke.com/images/lbj-uss-liberty-treason.jpg



http://www.davidduke.com/general/j-post-article-sheds-some-light-on-lbjs-treasonous-pro-zionist-policies_4690.html

Friend, ally, savior: Revealing LBJ’s Jewish ties

http://www.jweekly.com/images/jweekly/jweekly_logo.gif


http://www.jweekly.com/article/full/36262/friend-ally-savior-revealing-lbj-s-jewish-ties/





http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_FhXmbCq6o6g/SGIS3Z9GtvI/AAAAAAAAAb0/PGOZzcSIvow/s200/levy+and+lbj.jpg


http://lyndonjohnsonandisrael.blogspot.com/

Good post! This is the kind of work we should be doing, rather than screaming, "LBJ was a jew." LBJ was much worse than a jew, as your post shows. He was a White traitor to his race.

As an amateur Texas historian, my specialty is the Texas Rangers and the frontier. I do have one book that is on point of this discussion, "Deep in the Heart: The Lives and Legends of Texas Jews," published by the Texas Jewish Historical Society. You can pick it up on Amazon for about $5, plus shipping.

Whoever said there were no jews in Texas knows nothing of Texas history. There were jews in all the port cities by the time of the War for Southern Independence. They were present in every city with a college or university within a few years after that war. They were involved in all the things jews involve themselves in, mainly selling merchandise, teaching in colleges, lawyering and moving money at interest. One exception in Texas were the Halff Brothers, who, in the late 1800's, had a ranching enterprise that covered a million acres in the coastal area near Galveston.

Jews being jews, both of the Halff brothers avoided service during the war. One of them went to Mexico to dodge service and smuggled cotton out of Texas and other contraband into Texas for the duration. The other was drafted into the confederate Army, refused to report, was arrested and jailed.

I am sure that the aforementioned book, which was published in 1990, would have proudly claimed LBJ as a tribesman if there had been any grounds for such a claim.

LBJ's aunt might have been a member of the Zionist organization, which was known in its early years as the Federation of American Zionists. The name Zionist Organization of America came later. There were chapters in several Texas cities, the closest to Blanco county being Austin and Waco. So far as I have been able to learn, there is no record of any of the tribe living in or even visiting Blanco County.

I have never seen any proof that the Johnsons were involved in the case of the child rapist/murderer, Leo Frank, but I would not be surprised to find that to be the case. LBJ's father and uncles---especially the father---were radicals from the beginning. Their love of things judaic probably had a religious basis, as the Johnsons left the Baptists,which were then still staunchly anti-semitic, and joined a judeophilic sect.

LBJ was the quintessential 20th century Democrat politician, being all things to all men all the time. He could out nigger Bilbo in East Texas, and extol Dubois in Austin. And he did.

LBJ, who actually hated everything about Texas that made Texas great, even went so far, as a young congressman, as to volunteer to write the foreword to one of the two greatest books ever written about Texas history, "The Texas Rangers: A Century of Frontier Defense," By WP Webb. The other book is "Rip Ford's Texas."

LBJ was a traitor to Texas and to the White race. That is worse than being a jew. A jew does what his genetics tell him to do. What the jew does to an Aryan society is natural, just as much as it is natural for a tapeworm to cling to a gut. What LBJ did, and what White traitors in politics are doing today is against nature, which makes them far worse than a jew. In nature, a howler monkey will protect the troop. A White race traitor is lower than a howler monkey. So why should we call them a jew?

My feelings were never hurt. I was pissed off. I'm unaccustomed to being continually harrassed for no valid reason. There are some mental issues here, but I don't think they're mine.


Fred, I think your tendency to overreact when being harassed is due to a hair-trigger response to a behavior pattern that you recognize...one similar to the angle of attack that jews use against Whites on the internet.

Those jewy little enhancements that are tacked on to every sentence - "sigh", "lulz", "shrug", "yawn", "zzzz", "did you take your medication?" and "you're insane" may seem frivolous and lighthearted on the surface, but they are used with the same malicious intent as "redneck" "white trash and "nazi" to emotionally guide onlookers. As with everything the jew does, it imagines these transparent manipulations to be clever.
You know this - and it upsets you.
While your response is visceral - step back and learn to recognize the patterns - and respond appropriately.
Dismissively.

Unfortunately, there are many Whites who have adopted this same feminized banter due to a Stockholm Syndrome-like lack of identity - perhaps it's been effectively used against them in the past, so they subconsciously integrate it into their repertoire.
They're not jews - it's merely an affectation - emulating what they perceive to be winning behavior.
Of course, Whites should never speak to each other in this fashion.
The jews spend every waking moment belittling and trivializing us in one form or another - we certainly shouldn't be helping them by proxy.

There's no need for ad hominem, profanity or screaming among Whites - our primary purpose in communicating should be to strengthen each other.
And to enlighten each other.
If you make a factual error, acknowledge it - so that other Whites can learn from it - and then move along - rather than becoming contentious and emotional - because at that point, you're playing the jews game and damaging yourself.

As far as arguing with the jews - words are merely tools they use to deceive, corrupt and express contempt - and they don't really give a shit about anything Whites have to say. The louder you scream, the more they laugh.
So save your breath.
The solution to the problem will not be verbal.

This historic thread just keeps getting historicaler and historicalerer with every post.


I'm genuinely afraid to ask if anyone thinks the Apollo Project lunar landings were hoaxed, because I'm damn-near positive we'll have at least a couple of people on this historic thread who will swear that they were.

You ever catch one of the myriad "paranormal"-type television programs that seem to be everywhere?

Seemingly earnest & lucid people chasing spooks (Casper spooks, not Da'Qwan spooks) with night-vision equipped HDTV thermal-imaging cameras, capturing blurry footage that shakes as if the cameraman is Michael J. Fox after 3 Red Bulls.

Or trying to find "evidence" that ancient aliens used Earth as a place to pick up chicks & thereby contribute their superior alien DNA (Earth: Come for the reproductive-age females. Stay for the easily-enslaved population), affording us those crucial extra I.Q. points needed to stop building the village latrines up-river, and build the Great Pyramids of Giza.

And just a few thousand years later, night-vision equipped HDTV thermal-imaging cameras with which to document the search for Great-Great (times X, etc)-Grandpa Kodos, who owes us an incredible amount of child support, thus completing the intergalactic circle of life.

This thread feels like that, sometimes.

Just curious why this thread has gotten like almost 6,000 posts and there are AT LEAST 1000 different topics in it? Yall could have split it into and talk about more in depth. Do yall SF people just like sticking together all in one post vs discussing different things in different and separate threads (or is all 6,000 posts SF related)?

Just a question?

Do yall SF people just like sticking together all in one post vs discussing different things in different and separate threads (or is all 6,000 posts SF related)?

Just a question?


No. No they are not.

Nah, it wasn't just him. Linder effectively shut down discussion of 9/11 by those who didn't follow the line of thinking that airplanes alone couldn't have demo'd the towers by requiring them to post with their real names (except in the Tard Corral).

http://www.vnnforum.com/showpost.php?p=1201773&postcount=433

I made the judgment call that Stiltskin is a troll. I might be wrong. But the small additional evidence since I made the restriction suggests I'm right.

There is no reasonable doubt that the Mossad produced '9/11.'

You'll notice Stiltskin (spinning gold into straw), doesn't care about the people he's trying to mislead, only outsiders who might be looking on. Otherwise he would be happy to keep spinning his lies in private. That's a strong clue to his motive.

The guy doesn't post on anything except 9/11 threads. That's odd in itself. And he won't even be around, and then someone will post a solid piece of evidence, and immediately he will jump in and do the equivalent of dumping 100,000 pounds of mud on top of the Kennewick discovery site.

I don't have to allow that. I won't allow that.

Same thing with Edgar Steele. Someone wants to play clever boy, they can do it somewhere else. My loyalty is to our race, and our cause, and I'm not letting any useless cunt who won't even stand under his own name bury the truth.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1219/1401270258_a7646454b1.jpg

Maybe those ET comments may come to fruition...



"All News Web has received information from government insiders close to the US President that Barack Obama has been given the go ahead to make an important "off the cuff" announcement regarding UFO visits and US contact with aliens.

"Allegedly DARPA has given this move the green light. The comments by the President will be made within the next month.

"Our sources claim this will not be outright admittance of UFO visits and contact with aliens, however the comments will come as close to admittance as any President has to date and will be made in the context of a speech on an entirely different matter


http://www.examiner.com/exopolitics-in-seattle/rumor-obama-to-announce-ufo-visits-and-us-contact-with-ets-2011

No one loses his job for backing the ZOGline on 9/11. So there's no reason you can't use your real name, if you're not a troll. But of course you are a troll. Your sole interest here is burying solid information about the producers of '9/11' the minute it appears, and I won't let you do that. I mean, I won't let you do that under your troll name, only your real name.

My nick here is easily checked to my SF nick, and for reasons you are well enough aware of and have repeatedly stated yourself, it can be unwise to go public with years of activity writing about racial awareness and critique of Israel's law, the Mishnah and such matters.

So, you're allowed to post whatever you want here. Sounds like real suppression to me.

You deleted the post and forbid be to post on these matters at all. Then, you assigned my postings concerning 911 to the Tard Coral. And you have little else to reasonably account for that censorship beyond explaining your personal feelings. And those are only there because you like the others are unable to debate on-point, which is understandable when one doesn't know much about the topic. I do indeed present those pesky facts that you and Fred and the rest of the "da twoof"-faith react so vehemently and disturbingly, as if basic debate about the information is something you are all allergic to.

An easy yardstick for determing when you've crossed over into cult'ish belief is when you equate debate with "burying the truth". That's a religion, Alex, that's not confident and soundly reached insight or knowledge of facts.

Fred, I think your tendency to overreact when being harassed is due to a hair-trigger response to a behavior pattern that you recognize...one similar to the angle of attack that jews use against Whites on the internet.

Those jewy little enhancements that are tacked on to every sentence - "sigh", "lulz", "shrug", "yawn", "zzzz", "did you take your medication?" and "you're insane" may seem frivolous and lighthearted on the surface, but they are used with the same malicious intent as "redneck" "white trash and "nazi" to emotionally guide onlookers. As with everything the jew does, it imagines these transparent manipulations to be clever.
You know this - and it upsets you.
While your response is visceral - step back and learn to recognize the patterns - and respond appropriately.
Dismissively.

Unfortunately, there are many Whites who have adopted this same feminized banter due to a Stockholm Syndrome-like lack of identity - perhaps it's been effectively used against them in the past, so they subconsciously integrate it into their repertoire.
They're not jews - it's merely an affectation - emulating what they perceive to be winning behavior.
Of course, Whites should never speak to each other in this fashion.
The jews spend every waking moment belittling and trivializing us in one form or another - we certainly shouldn't be helping them by proxy.

There's no need for ad hominem, profanity or screaming among Whites - our primary purpose in communicating should be to strengthen each other.
And to enlighten each other.
If you make a factual error, acknowledge it - so that other Whites can learn from it - and then move along - rather than becoming contentious and emotional - because at that point, you're playing the jews game and damaging yourself.

As far as arguing with the jews - words are merely tools they use to deceive, corrupt and express contempt - and they don't really give a shit about anything Whites have to say. The louder you scream, the more they laugh.
So save your breath.
The solution to the problem will not be verbal.

Outstanding grasp, superlative understanding of the entirety of the situation. Remarkable. You're right, I react from the gut instead of the head at times.

Thank you Vektor7, points of response known to me but sometimes I'm so overcome with hatred of the jew, that clear thinking alludes me. I'll try to keep my perspective, moving forward. I have been overly sensitive in my perceptions and overly aggressive in my responses to the perceived enemy.

I have work to do for some folks, I'll be keeping my head level. Thanks for caring.

Notice the new/infrequent posters pumping HAARP, etc? Same shit everywhere, Stormfront, Alex Jones, etc.

I just wonder how much the paycheck is?

Lyndon Johnson allowed the attack on the USS Liberty to continue after he was informed about it.

We need less Lyndon Johnsons and more Patrick Henry leaders.

We have ten thousand big-mouthed Henrys. We don't have one that can smile while he sticks a knife in your belly.

But agreed. . .Johnson was the ultimate in White treason, and is no model in whole. There are only certain aspects of Johnson's character that I admire, that would be helpful if directed to positive ends. But maybe it's a package deal.

The admiration I have for Johnson is very similar to that held by Ash toward the life form.

YouTube - Ash burns! Alien Re-edited

A relevant essay:



“Salus Populi Lex Suprema”

This essay is based on a talk given at The Occidental Quarterly Editor’s Dinner on July 26, 2008 in Atlanta, Georgia.

White people have a penchant for abstract thinking. This is one of the glories of our race, making possible advances in philosophy, mathematics, science, and technology. But it is also a danger, for white people can become so fixated on abstractions that we lose touch with reality.

This is particularly true in the realm of action. It is useful to for*mulate abstract principles of morality and prudence to guide action. The trouble comes when people fixate on the principles and lose touch with the real world in which they have to act. When that happens, ab*stract principles stop promoting success and start promoting failure.

Sometimes a general rule does not apply to a particular situation. Sometimes following a rule will lead to bad consequences. But the rule will not tell you that. You have to see it. You have to figure it out for yourself. It is a matter of concrete fact, not an abstraction. And people who focus only on abstractions do not see concrete realities, often at their own peril.

I want to share with you some thoughts about the necessity of our people using abstract principles in a much more mature and flexible way when thinking about political, economic, and racial issues.

The Greeks were very different from modern people. (By modern people I mean people of the last two centuries.) The Greeks had a much more mature view of things, a less categorical view of things. Two of my favorite Greek maxims were on the altar of Apollo at Delphi.

One was: “Moderation in all things, nothing in excess,” which of course is a self-contradiction, when you think about it. That also implies moderation in moderation. So there are times when it’s right to be im*moderate. And the maxim will not tell you when that is the case. That is a matter of concrete circumstances. You will have to see and under*stand them for yourself.

The other maxim was: “Know who you are.” This is knowledge of the concrete, not the abstract. This maxim is often translated as “Know thyself,” which sounds like a counsel of subjective, atomistic individualism, as if the men who fought at Thermopylae and Marathon needed to “get in touch with their feelings” or “find themselves.” But who we are is not merely subjective. It is defined by our relationships to others: to our family, community, homeland, nation, and race. Knowing who you are means knowing all those things too. Being true to yourself means being true to them as well.
Contrast the spirit of these maxims to Lord Acton’s oft-quoted dictum that “Power corrupts, and absolute power tends to corrupt absolutely.” Americans love this maxim, Southerners in par*ticular, because Lord Acton was a strong Southern sympathizer in our Civil War.

But it’s interesting to set the quote in the context of who Lord Acton was, the circumstances in which he made it, and the words that come before and after it.

It is often said that Acton made this statement in correspon*dence with Robert E. Lee. But that is not true. He actually wrote it in a letter to Bishop Mandell Creighton in April of 1887, expressing his op*position to the doctrine of papal infallibility. (Lord Acton was himself a life-long Catholic, from a recusant family that had adhered to Catholicism for generations despite the Reformation and the establishment of the Church of England.) The full statement reads as follows:


I cannot accept your canon that we are to accept Pope and King, unlike other men, with a favorable presumption that they did no wrong. If there is any presumption, it is the other way, against the holders of power, increasing as the power increases. Historic responsibility has to make up for the want of legal re*sponsibility. Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men . . .





Not only is Acton’s statement taken out of context, it is often turned into an absolute, categorical statement by omitting the words “tends to.”

Now Americans love this statement. When they hear it, their eyes glaze over, and they get a warm, gushy, virtuous feeling. They just know how bad power is. They feel superior to those who have it. They even feel glad they have none, and are thus in no danger of corruption.

Americans feel this way because this is a Whig nation: a nation born in opposition to monarchy, aristocracy, and tradition, and firmly wed*ded to individualism and the principles of the Enlighten*ment. America was settled mostly by Whigs. And with the American Revolution and the expulsion of the Loyalist minority, the United States became a firmly Whig nation. America is a totally Whig version of England. It is all Whig sail with no Tory anchor.

But even a minute’s reflection will show you how misleading and false Acton’s dictum is, as a guide to people in their personal lives, and in making decisions for their country and community and ethnic group. The most casual reading of history shows that many great men were good men, that power does not necessarily corrupt, that many good men exercised power for good purposes.

Was Charles Martel a bad man simply because he sought and used power? Remember that Martel used his power to unite the Franks and defeat the Moslems, who were on the verge of conquering Europe, which would have been catastrophic for our people. Would Lord Acton have deemed it better if the Franks didn’t have a powerful leader? Would it have been better if the Frankish lands had been divided and decentralized and incapable of uniting as the Moslems poured over the Pyrenees into France?

Was Pope Urban II a bad man, because he had power and helped rouse Europe to the Crusades? The crusades drove back the two pin*cers of Islam that were coming through Spain and the Balkans to take our continent from us.

And would it really matter even if Charles Martel and Urban II were somehow corrupted by their power, as long as they still used it for the common good? Acton’s dictum focuses exclusively on the effect that power has on the characters of those who have it. But what about the consequences of power for the larger community?

Charles Martel and Urban II are long dead, but every person of European descent owes them a great debt, a debt that increases with every new generation that is born. In light of that, the consequences of power on these men’s conscience matters very little.

Now some might feel a little frisson, a little thrill, of moral superiority as they say that it is right to disappear as long as one maintains one’s moral superiority. I don’t think so. I think it is better to survive and to triumph than to disappear. Those who feel otherwise will simply leave the world to people who feel differently, people who have no scruples about gaining and using power. Unfortunately, these people may have no scruples about anything else as well.

Because of the Whig sentiments that make Acton’s principle so ap*pealing to Americans, the founding stock of the nation has been en*gaged in unilateral disarmament from the inception of the country—disarmament in contrast to their rivals, who do not believe that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

The amazing thing to me is that this country is not even worse off than it is.

But there is no way that our people can win in the long run, so long as we remain enchanted and enslaved by a philosophy of power*lessness, by an abstract principle that tells us that coercive power is per se wrong and must never be used.

History is replete with tragic examples of the con*sequences of powerlessness.
Many American conservatives, Southerners in particular, find the doctrines of States’ Rights and decentralized government very attractive. But these very doctrines played a major and a decisive role in insuring the defeat of the South in the Civil War.

When the South seceded, when the Confederate government assembled in Montgomery, they were in a revolutionary situation. Things were fluid. Many new things were possible. And—as Lenin and Robespierre, alas, knew—in a revolutionary situation, you hit . . . and you hit hard. You go as fast and as far as you can while the time is favorable. You make the most of the opportunity before things solidify again.

But with the instinctive English desire to compromise, the South did just the opposite. Jefferson Davis had been a staunch Unionist and op*ponent of Secession until the late 1850s. And his government was made of people like him, who were relatively new converts to the idea of se*cession. There were no militant secessionists or Fire-eaters of any sig*nificance, none of the people who long before had prophetically seen the need to separate from an increasingly hostile North.

Even worse, in choosing their Vice President, they turned to a physi*cal weakling and pettifogging legalist, Alexander H. Stephens, who had been opposed to the whole idea of the Confederacy. Stephens was cho*sen for the admitted purpose of placating Southerners who had op*posed the Revolution.

As a result, the government was divided and hobbled from the start by its second-in-command. Stephens would spend the next four years disrupting the Southern war effort. He spent most of the war pouting at home, corre*sponding with people all over the South, attacking President Davis, urging that there be no draft, urging people not to support the army, warning that the central government was becoming despotic like the Lincoln govern*ment, and demanding more States’ rights and decen*tralization, in the middle of an invasion of the country.

Lincoln, representing the forces of evil in our society, was much wiser. He did not care about the Constitution. He understood that there was a crisis, and he meant to have his faction win. And he didn’t give a damn whether that required him to suspend the writ of habeas corpus, arrest members of Congress, shut down newspapers, impose a draft, or raise armies by presidential order. And he was quite frank about that.

In his correspondence, Lincoln made clear that he wanted to show that a republican government could be just as “strong”—just as harsh and coercive, capable of just as many atrocities—as a monarchical gov*ernment. By the way, that is expressly what he’s referring to in the Gettysburg Address when he says that the war is testing whether any government “so conceived . . . can long endure.”

Well, the tragedy is that there wasn’t more Jefferson Davis and Alex*ander H. Stephens in Lincoln, and more Lincoln in Davis. Things very likely would have ended very differently if the South had leaders who understood the necessities of a revolutionary situation, and were will*ing to use power to save the country at a time of invasion.

You hear another categorical statement frequently in American poli*tics today. We hear people like George W. Bush—the same George Bush who drew upon his profound mastery of world religions and history to tell us that Islam is a religion of peace—assuring us repeatedly that we must learn “the lesson of Munich”—that you never negotiate with dic*tators.

Well, the fact of the matter is that most of mankind has been ruled by dictators throughout most of recorded history. And if you adopted a policy of never negotiating with dictators, and always going to war with them, the United States would be engaged in perpetual war for perpetual peace. And we would be destroyed in the process.

The fact of the matter is that we have negotiated successfully with hundreds, if not thousands, of dictators in the more than two centu*ries the United States has been in existence. We’ve had many benefi*cial treaties with despots, with absolute monarchies, with dictator*ships. So there isn’t any “lesson of Munich” that you never negotiate with dicta*tors.

The people at Munich, the people who believed they could negotiate with Hitler, had learned “the lesson of August 1914”—that you always negotiate, that wars always occur because of failure to negotiate.

The tragedy of life is that concrete circumstances, individual person*alities, and particular details are what determine whether you should negotiate or whether you should fight. It is the height of folly to ignore these and focus on abstract lessons based on wholly different circum*stances, sometimes decades or centuries old.

Consider the issue of free trade. In October of 2007, a friend of mine attended a small financial seminar. He sat with a number bright young college students and recent graduates. When the issue of free trade came up, he pointed out what this means to America’s working people and increasingly the middle and professional classes: how free trade is destroying their jobs, pensions, health care, vacations, and ability to have and rear children, while undermining the nation’s economic and political independence.

Several of these young men, many of whom were working on their MBAs, actually conceded this was happening. But then they said we can’t ever abandon the “principle” of free trade. Free trade is the right principle, and we’ve got to hang on to the principle, even if it means the destruction of our nation and race.

Now is it conceivable that anywhere in China a group of comparable young men would be saying that China must be destroyed to adhere to the principle of free trade? Could you find any Chinaman this nutty? No. Only White Europeans are subject to such goofiness.
Consider also the issue of private property. During the time when Australia had an immigration policy designed to maintain its identity as a white and British nation, one of the largest groups that fought it were Anglo-Saxon farmers with large plantations. They didn’t want to have to hire free British immigrants. They wanted cheap labor. They wanted Chinese coolies who would work for less. Do we really want to respect that kind of private property right?

To save our people, it will be necessary not merely to change those who hold public power but also those who hold private power. A vast share of the nation’s wealth is held by our enemies. They are particularly heav*ily invested in the news and entertainment media. That has to change. But it cannot change except by the dramatic use of public power to change who holds private power.

Imagine that by some fluke a libertarian like Ron Paul were elected president. Imagine that he really could bring American troops home from Iraq and Afghanistan, block the drive for war with Iran, and end Israel’s ability to loot our treasury and control our foreign policy.

Private money and private media power would immediately be used to thwart his policies. He would be lucky to avoid impeachment or as*sassination. And, as a libertarian, his own principles would prevent him from doing anything about it. After all, his enemies have freedom of speech and the right to use their money however they wish.

In England when the Wars of the Roses were concluded by the bat*tle of Boswell Field, when Richard III was defeated by Henry VII and the Tudor dynasty was established, what was the first order of busi*ness? To take the lands and titles of the aristocratic families who had backed the losing side, and to give them to the able and devoted ser*vants of the winner. Henry VII understood that if his enemies retained their estates and could still call their tenants out against him, the civil wars that had wracked England would soon begin again.

If Henry VII had followed the advice of a Ron Paul or an Ayn Rand, he would have failed.

So will we.

Jews have a much more supple and realistic attitude toward abstract principles. A few months ago, a Jew published an article in which he said, quite brazenly, that when Jewish survival is at stake, abstract moral principles must be set aside. In my circles, much to my disap*pointment, this was met with a great deal of clucking about how bad the Jews are.

Quite the contrary. It shows how wise the Jews are. The survival of their people should be more important to them than abstract moral principles.

Our people’s survival should be just as important for us.

To wed ourselves to a philosophy of powerlessness, a philosophy of decentralized government, a philosophy that always stresses private property rights and free trade over the health of the community as a whole, will inevitably lead to our downfall. Yet these very policies are embraced by the finest element of our nation’s citizenry.

I am not a statist. I don’t like the idea of government power. I’m a typical Anglo-Saxon Whig. I’d rather live on a farm and not have to see anybody else, not even the smoke from my neighbor’s chim*ney.

But as a realistic person I know that it can’t be that way. And, as un*pleasant as it may be, in the kind of desperate life-or-death emergency our people are going to face some time in the next two generations, very firm action will be necessary if we are to survive. This will include state coercion on a scale that will make many in our movement un*happy. But the alternative will not just be military defeat, as with the South, but extinction. To stave off that day, we must learn to evaluate and apply all abstract principles by reference to the supreme principle of collective survival and flourishing.

Our people once knew this. Jews are famous for evaluating every*thing in light of their own collective interests: “Yes, but is it good for the Jews?” I certainly can’t condemn them for this. This is the key to their survival down through the millennia as a people scattered among other nations of the world, as well as to their current position of con*spicuous wealth and power.

The ancient Romans had the same principle: salus populi lex suprema. The welfare, or the salvation, of the people is the supreme law. We too must learn to evaluate all issues of political and economic policy by this standard.

Which brings me to The Occidental Quarterly, which does stand as a unique publication in the English-speaking world. It’s an indication of the degree of our dispossession that it is the only publication dealing with issues like this in a thoughtful way.

TOQ is in its eighth year of publication. The Nation, which was founded in July of 1865, just celebrated its 143rd anniversary. We hope that TOQ will last as long as The Nation has lasted, even longer. We hope that it will impart the same sort of continuity to our movement that our enemies have enjoyed. We hope that its lonely defense of the legitimacy of white racial consciousness will become the common sense of a new age.

Lenin is an example of someone who was supple, not to say cynical, in choosing whatever policies advanced his faction. One of Lenin’s publications while he was in exile, plotting revolution, was called Iskra, which is the Russian word for “spark.” Its motto was: “From the spark shall come the flame.”

I hope that TOQ, by providing a forum for the thoughtful discussion of ideas like this, could be a spark that will touch off a flame and enable our people to understand what must be done for our survival, and to deal with a revolutionary situation with revolutionary means.

Thank you.



Sam G. Dickson is a lawyer, writer, and white community organizer.

http://www.toqonline.com/blog/salus-populi-lex-suprema/

Does anybody actually watch a video and then read a 10K word C&P?

Does anybody actually watch a video and then read a 10K word C&P?

Sorry Fred, I didn't have a comic book reference handy. The video will have to do.

Sorry Fred, I didn't have a comic book reference handy. The video will have to do.
I just read your post. It is academic with the message of hope.

I'm waiting for a group to come along who is more prone to action, with great leaders and fire-breathing sargents. We have to fight at some point, I'd rather go for it now, before our citizenry is completely under the jewish thumb, nutered by hate laws and DHS secret prisons having been filled with our most courageous.

I believe massive white death is in the enemy's plans, and the longer we wait the more difficult the task will be.

Does anybody actually watch a video and then read a 10K word C&P?Only inquisitive people who are interested in learning something.

Outstanding grasp, superlative understanding of the entirety of the situation. Remarkable. You're right, I react from the gut instead of the head at times.

Thank you Vektor7, points of response known to me but sometimes I'm so overcome with hatred of the jew, that clear thinking alludes me. I'll try to keep my perspective, moving forward. I have been overly sensitive in my perceptions and overly aggressive in my responses to the perceived enemy.


I'm not your enemy, Fred.

If you are to be taken at your word, we want the exact same things, ultimately.

I mean that sincerely.

I will be 100% civil to you, and any other poster who is also civil with me.

We have ten thousand big-mouthed Henrys. We don't have one that can smile while he sticks a knife in your belly.


Nice turn of a phrase there, Len. That original?

So true.

Only inquisitive people who are interested in learning something.
Maybe that's why I read the TOQ article.

I'm not your enemy, Fred.

If you are to be taken at your word, we want the exact same things, ultimately.

I mean that sincerely.

I will be 100% civil to you, and any other poster who is also civil with me.
Okay, a truce and maybe some cooperative effort.

Okay, a truce and maybe some cooperative effort.

Great.

I'll help in any way I can.

Great.

I'll help in any way I can.
Okay then, let's hang 9/11 on mossad! :)

Okay then, let's hang 9/11 on mossad! :)

I'm positive they had prior knowledge of the attacks, most likely from early on in the planning stages.

Their network is so embedded in the region, there is no way they did not have prior knowledge.

Their intelligence is just too good to miss something of this magnitude.

They knew about it, and said nothing. They allowed it to happen, and it is not unlikely at all that they actively assisted in the plot in some way.

More than enough for me to have them all shot, if I were King.

But if I were such a hypothetical King, I wouldn't need any reason beyond their Jewishness and proximity to me to have them shot.

Wow, I'm getting all warm and fuzzy.

http://cache.cosmicchile.com/cosmicchile/images/large/melindas_advertisment_lg.jpg

I'm positive they had prior knowledge of the attacks, most likely from early on in the planning stages.



Of course there was prior knowledge. To what extent is debatable until Americans demand a real investigation.

The night before 9-11, my sister's former father-in-law, a big wig in the federal government, received a call from Washington DC, telling him to cancel his flight for the next morning to the nation's capital. After his visit to DC, he was to visit his son's inlaws (us) before returning home. As a result, all of our plans to show my sister's former father-in-law our hometown for that week were put on hold.

Not one person in my extended family believes that the higher ups in the federal government did not have prior knowledge of the event that was to unfold on 9-11.

I'm not your enemy, Fred.

If you are to be taken at your word, we want the exact same things, ultimately.

I mean that sincerely.

I will be 100% civil to you, and any other poster who is also civil with me.

Okay, a truce and maybe some cooperative effort.

There, you guys. Was that really all that difficult? :)

You deleted the post and forbid be to post on these matters at all.

That's a lie. Generally people who lie about one thing will lie about others. Especially when their lie is easy to prove.


Then, you assigned my postings concerning 911 to the Tard Coral. And you have little else to reasonably account for that censorship beyond explaining your personal feelings.

My personal feelings have nothing to do with anything. I haven't moved your posts at all, or deleted them. I have given you literally hundreds of pages and posts to make your case, and in the end, I tired of your by-that-point proven tactic of trying to bury any real evidence the moment it was posted. This subject is too important to allow anonymous stooges to mislead Whites as to the truth. And the moment you weren't able to do that, ie, you were restricted from ONE thread, you started crying censorship, even though you were perfectly free to post in that same thread, under your real name, or anywhere else without it. God, you're the new Solzhenitsyn, you are. What a hero.

Nah. Actually all you are is either an amateur or professional troll.


And those are only there because you like the others are unable to debate on-point, which is understandable when one doesn't know much about the topic. I do indeed present those pesky facts that you and Fred and the rest of the "da twoof"-faith react so vehemently and disturbingly, as if basic debate about the information is something you are all allergic to.

You lost the debate, and resorted to trolling, to prevent others from discovering the facts about '9/11.'


An easy yardstick for determing when you've crossed over into cult'ish belief is when you equate debate with "burying the truth". That's a religion, Alex, that's not confident and soundly reached insight or knowledge of facts.

I'm sorry you're not allowed to troll in the way you're accustomed. It must be odd for the shoe to be on the other foot.

You keep saying you have all the facts on your side, yet you refuse to lay them out? Maybe your case isn't as strong as you think. Maybe you don't have a case at all. Keep trying, though.

Guess no one can come up with another candidate for "Best Heeb Suppoter by a Standing POTUS". What about old hook nosed Harry, what are the chances he was a kike? His last name ended in "man" and he was the first one to acknowledge the illegal state of Israel. He also test nuked the japs for fun after the war was all but over, (pretty cold blooded to kill all those women and children).

http://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/resources/graphic/xlarge/truman-harry-mo.jpg

Kfar Truman, Israel -- In honor of Harry S. Truman's decision in 1948 to confer U.S. recognition upon Israel just eleven minutes after it became a state, this small village near Israel's international airport was renamed in 1950 after the still-sitting American president.
Miriam and Moshe Yaari, who had helped establish this community in 1949, have had nearly a half century to get used to Truman's name, but they confess they still wish the town bore the name given to it when it was founded: B'nai Har'el...........In Jerusalem, years later, Truman was accorded a far more enthusiastic honor: The Hebrew University named for him its Harry S Truman Research Institute for the Advancement of Peace.http://www.jewishsightseeing.com/israel/kfar_truman/israel_truman/sd05-05israel_trumant.htm

The POTUS who test nuked a bunch of women and children has something named after him about the advancement of peace? How Orwellian.

http://www.jewishhistory.org/wp-content/uploads/Truman-jacobson-picture-300x238.jpg

Eddie "Khazarian" Jacobson and Harry Truman in their haberdashery shop in Kansas City, Missouri that they co-owned.

http://www.jewishhistory.org/wp-content/uploads/truman_weizmann.jpg

Chaim Weizmann presents Truman with a Torah scroll.
The state was declared on May 15, 1948. And not two weeks later, Weizmann presented Truman with the traditional gift Jews give to heads of state: a Torah scroll. When Truman saw it, he said, “I always wanted one of those.”http://www.jewishhistory.org/president-harry-truman/




Dewey Stone, a Zionist businessman, had financed Truman's vice-presidential campaign in 1944, and businessman Abraham Feinberg, with jewelry magnate Edmund Kauffman, led fundraising for the otherwise penniless 1948 presidential campaign. "If not for my friend Abe, I couldn't have made the [whistle-stop train] trip and I wouldn't have been elected," Truman stated. "Feinberg's activities began a process that made the Jews into 'the most conspicuous fundraisers and contributors to the Democratic Party.'"

Key White House advisors ensured the domination of Zionist viewpoints in the highest circles of the Truman Administration. Jewish aides David Niles, administrative assistant to Truman, and Max Lowenthal, special assistant on Palestine to Clark Clifford, himself "Truman's key advisor on Palestine at the White House," were especially crucial. Niles was one of two presidential aides retained from the Roosevelt Administration, the other being Samuel Rosenman. Niles was Truman's chief political liaison with the Jewish community. Lowenthal was the Harvard-trained former counsel to the Senate Interstate Commerce Committee on which Truman had served, who specialized in drafting Zionist memoranda......Cohen attributes Truman's susceptibility to Zionist influence to a "unique set of circumstances that converged to determine the fate of Palestine," including Jewish friends, White House advisors, key Jewish Democratic Party fundraisers, and Zionist military prowess, which "should not be expected ever to repeat themselves." The circumstances were not at all unique, but have been practically a recipe for quasi-sovereign Jewish influence on foreign policy in Democratic administrations. http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13495.htm


James Forrestal (1st Secretary of Defense) was one of the major opponents of Israel during Harry's presidency, he was unceremoniously dumped (literally).
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d7/James_Forrestal.jpg
"...no group in this country should be permitted to influence our policy to the point it could endanger our national security."[11] (Forrestal on the heebs)
Forrestal's statement soon earned him the active enmity of some congressmen and supporters of Israel. Forrestal was also an early target of the muckraking columnist and broadcaster Drew Pearson, an opponent of foreign policies hostile to the Soviet Union, who began to regularly call for Forrestal's removal after President Truman named him Secretary of Defense.[12] Pearson told his own protege, Jack Anderson, that he believed Forrestal was "the most dangerous man in America" and claimed that if he was not removed from office, he would "cause another world war."...Truman abruptly asked for his resignation. His letter of resignation was tendered after Truman's dismissal on March 28, 1949.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Forrestal

Forrestal was later admitted to a Navy hospital for observation. The heebs tossed Forrestal from a sixteen story window at the hospital the day before his scheduled release.

The Most Important 9/11 Documentary You'll See

"TRUMAN'S CORRUPTION"

HE RECEIVED MONEY TO RECOGNIZE ISRAEL

Gore Vidal, in a Preface to Israel Shahak's book, "Jewish History, Jewish Religion," p. vii-viii, gives information about Jews giving money to President Truman just prior to his recognition of the Nation of Israel. If this is true, then Mr. Truman was guilty of bribery, an impeachable offense written into the Constitution as a violation requiring impeachment.

Harry S. Truman and the Jews (http://www.jewwatch.com/jew-occupiedgovernments-usa-truman.html)

Madrid skyscraper (Windsor Tower) caught fire in February 2005 but it did not fall though the fire raged for hours.

This is what a building on fire looks like. The difference between the WTC Twin Towers and the Madrid tower is amazing. One is definitely on fire throughout its whole length from top to bottom, the other has small weak oxygen-starved fires on six stories.

Fire started at the 21st Floor, spreading to all floors above the 2nd Floor. Fire duration: 18 ~ 20 hours

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hf="2f706167656974656d2f6c6f67696e706f7075703f6d6f64653d626173696326726571756573743d253246766964656f253246783468656f33" title="You must be logged to vote"> </span><span class="dmco_simplelink popup_ie_width width_496 dm_rate rating_5 linkable ajax_link action:popup" hf="2f706167656974656d2f6c6f67696e706f7075703f6d6f64653d626173696326726571756573743d253246766964656f253246783468656f33" title="You must be logged to vote"> </span></div><div class="dmco_text foreground2" id="rating_label">Vote!</div></div></div><div class="dmco_clear"><!--comment for IE6 height --></div><div class="dmco_html" id="fb_playground"><fb:like width="612px" colorscheme="none" font="Arial"></fb:like></div><div class="dmco_clear"><!--comment for IE6 height --></div><div class="dmco_html id_x3dhvp" id="twitter_playground"></div><div class="dmco_html column span-8 last video_description foreground" id="video_description">Madrid skyscraper (Windsor Tower) caught fire in February 2005 but it did not fall though the fire raged for hours. <br /><br />This is what a building on fire looks like. The difference between the WTC Twin Towers and the Madrid tower is amazing. One is definitely on fire throughout its whole length from top to bottom, the other has small weak oxygen-starved fires on six storeys. <br /><br />Fire started at the 21st Floor, spreading to all floors above the 2nd Floor. Fire duration: 18 ~ 20 hours <br /><br /><a class="link" target="_blank" href="http://www.youtube">http://www.youtube</a> (dot) com/watch?v=2KFCNMS5W3o</div><div class="dmco_html"></div><div class="dmco_box more_desc_box column span-8 last"><a class="dmco_simplelink foreground2 dmco_link icon icon_plus_small" style="display: none;" id="more_video_description" href="javascript:void(0);" title="more">more</a><a class="dmco_simplelink foreground2 dmco_link icon icon_minus_small" style="display: none;" id="less_video_description" href="javascript:void(0);" title="close">close</a></div><div class="dmpi_video_infos column span-8 last foreground"><div class="dmco_box misc_video_infos"><div class="dmco_text dmco_text_formatted channel_cont"><span class="channel_icon"></span> <a class="dmco_simplelink dmco_link" href="/us/channel/people/featured/1" title="People &amp; Family">People & Family</a></div><div class="dmco_text dmco_text_formatted uploaded_cont"><span class="upload_icon"></span>Uploaded on 11/03/07</div><div class="dmco_clear"><!--comment for IE6 height --></div></div><div class="dmco_box"><div class="dmco_text dmco_text_formatted tags_cont" id="video_infos_tags"><span class="tag_icon"></span> <span class="dmco_simplelink dmpi_tag_item background_5 tag_hoverable linkable" hf="2f7461672f6d6164726964" title="madrid">madrid</span> <span class="dmco_simplelink dmpi_tag_item background_5 tag_hoverable linkable" hf="2f7461672f77696e64736f72" title="windsor">windsor</span> <span class="dmco_simplelink dmpi_tag_item background_5 tag_hoverable linkable" hf="2f7461672f746f776572" title="tower">tower</span> <span class="dmco_simplelink dmpi_tag_item background_5 tag_hoverable linkable" hf="2f7461672f736b7973637261706572" title="skyscraper">skyscraper</span></div></div></div><div class="dmpi_box dmpi_subbox box_top_border column span-8 charts_box foreground visible_false"><div class="box_header"><div class="dmco_box left_title"><h2 class="dmco_title" id="box_charts_title">Statistics</h2></div></div><div class="box_content"></div></div><div class="dmpi_video_charts hidden column span-8 last"><script>Event.observe(window, "load", function(){DM_Widget_PageItem_Video_Charts.init("x3dhvp", 0);});</script><form action="/video/x3dhvp_madrid-skyscraper-burning-set-to-mu_people" class="dmco_form_container dmco_form dmco_form" method="post"><div style="display:none"><input class="dmco_form_input dmco_form_hidden " id="form_name" name="form_name" type="hidden" value="dm_component_form" /></div><div class="form_item " id="delay_cont"><span class="form_label">Time interval :</span><div class="form_input "><select class="dmco_form_input dmco_form_choice " id="delay" name="delay"><option value="hourly">Last Hour</option><option value="daily" selected="selected">Last Day</option><option value="monthly">Last Month</option></select></div></div><div class="form_item " id="filter_cont"><span class="form_label">Filter :</span><div class="form_input "><select class="dmco_form_input dmco_form_choice " id="filter" name="filter"><option value="all" selected="selected">Total views</option><option value="ext">External views</option><option value="int">Internal views</option></select></div></div></form></div></div><div class="dmco_box column span-4 last right_content" id="right_content_box"><div class="dmpi_masscast background_20 column span-4 last" id="player_middle_ad"><div id="mc_Middle" class="Middle"></div></div><div class="dmpi_masscast column span-4 last" id="sponsored_video"><div id="mc_Middle1" class="Middle1"></div></div><div class="dmpi_video_related column span-4 last" id="related"><div class="dmco_box inline_tabs" id="inline_tabs"><a class="dmco_simplelink href_2f72656c617465642f783364687670 type_related video_35363638353439 tabselected tab dmco_link" id="link_related" href="/video/x3dhvp_madrid-skyscraper-burning-set-to-mu_people" title="videos related to Madrid skyscraper burning - 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Of course there was prior knowledge. To what extent is debatable until Americans demand a real investigation.

The night before 9-11, my sister's former father-in-law, a big wig in the federal government, received a call from Washington DC, telling him to cancel his flight for the next morning to the nation's capital. After his visit to DC, he was to visit his son's inlaws (us) before returning home. As a result, all of our plans to show my sister's former father-in-law our hometown for that week were put on hold.

Not one person in my extended family believes that the higher ups in the federal government did not have prior knowledge of the event that was to unfold on 9-11.

One other piece of evidence that suggests that 9/11 was a combined Israeli/ZOG operation is the theory that a missile that hit the Pentagon. You can look at the pictures without any plane wreckage in them, (unbroken windows where the wings would have hit, too), see the crappy CCTV footage, it's abundantly clear that no jumbo jet hit that building. Was there a missile launched? At any rate, the damage to the Pentagon and the debris such an impact would create is not consistent with the impact of a jumbo jet.

It honestly draws a big blank for me. Why would the Jew have his fingerprints all over the operation if it was ultimately done by the government? Wouldn't they just let Uncle Sam do their dirty work and reap the rewards? If anyone can fit this piece of the puzzle together, please do.

One other piece of evidence that suggests that 9/11 was a combined Israeli/ZOG operation is the missile that hit the Pentagon. You can look at the pictures without any plane wreckage in them, (unbroken windows where the wings would have hit, too), see the crappy CCTV footage, it's abundantly clear that no jumbo jet hit that building. Who fired the missile? Where was it launched?

It honestly draws a big blank for me. Why would the Jew have his fingerprints all over the operation if it was ultimately done by the government? Wouldn't they just let Uncle Sam do their dirty work and reap the rewards? If anyone can fit this piece of the puzzle together, please do.

I agree that it was indeed a missile which hit the Pentagon.

Who keeps secrets the best? Hint: The same tribe that killed Kennedy. Mossad Killed Kennedy (http://www.afrocubaweb.com/news/mossadjfk.htm) If you want to keep a secret, have jews do the work. The USS Liberty crew got real blabby. Most whites could never keep a secret of this magnitude. It has also been suggested that the "mission" was compartmentalized to keep the players from seeing the whole picture. I would suggest that in the aftermath, even those compartments would understand what they had done to contribute and might spill the beans.

Mossad would necessarily have had to control the operation from start to finish for the secret not to leak out, just as the Kennedy assassination hasn't leaked for 57 years. They also are the best at disbursing false info and CTs which make any real investigation look like just another CT.

There were some rogues within the ZOG that facilitated mossad, such as the NORAD non-response and the USAF stand down order issued by Cheney. Also, the politicians, such as Pataki & Gulliani kept state investigators from performing their duty within their jurisdictions.

There was the cover-up too, which required local political co-conspirators at the top of the food chain. i.e. Gulliani & Pataki

The vault in building 6, is where the investigative records were kept for all major investigations on-going at the time. The FEMA vidiographer who went public took pics of the empty vault. The records had been removed. Who did that? 9/11 FEMA videographer at Ground Zero goes public (http://www.voltairenet.org/article160636.html)

Why was there never a genuine investigation?

Why was the forensic evidence destroyed?

What happened to the missing video frames at the Pentagon?

Why wasn't the plane dug up in Pennsylvania?

Where is the crash debris at Pentagon & PA?

Why was evidence fabricated? (passports, luggage, fake arabs)

Why didn't the feds trace the insider traders?

Why does the government block all investigations?

You would have to be blind, deaf & dumb, living on a desert island not to understand that there is something desperately wrong with this picture.

Forrestal was later admitted to a Navy hospital for observation. The heebs tossed Forrestal from a sixteen story window at the hospital the day before his scheduled release.

Of course, you can't prove that.

Of course, you can't prove that.
There are many who accept that idea as wholly rational.
http://www.google.com/search?q=Forrestal+was+murdered&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

I agree that it was indeed a missile which hit the Pentagon.

If that's true, then what happened to Flight 77?

I was suspicious of the claim that Flight 77 struck the Pentagon because of the lack of debris found, but after watching this video I find it more plausible:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4q35xHzjxB0

I'm positive they had prior knowledge of the attacks, most likely from early on in the planning stages.

Their network is so embedded in the region, there is no way they did not have prior knowledge.

Their intelligence is just too good to miss something of this magnitude.

They knew about it, and said nothing. They allowed it to happen, and it is not unlikely at all that they actively assisted in the plot in some way.

More than enough for me to have them all shot, if I were King.

But if I were such a hypothetical King, I wouldn't need any reason beyond their Jewishness and proximity to me to have them shot.

I think it goes a lot farther than merely knowing it was going to happen. Are you open to evidence they arranged the whole thing?

This was no Marine barracks bombing, where all you need is a bomb, truck, and driver. This required a great deal of access, technical knowledge, and coordination. More than the Muslims have ever demonstrated in anything. Hell, half the time they can't even pull off suicide bombings without screwing up. If you look at the thing practically, there's only two parties who could have done this: Mossad and the US government. And realistically, only one of them has a pattern of doing this sort of thing - Mossad. There simply isn't a single known fact about the WTC demolitions that controverts the assertion that the Mossad did it. Not a single one. Literally every single established fact about '9/11' points to Mossad.

There are many who accept that idea as wholly rational.
http://www.google.com/search?q=Forrestal+was+murdered&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

Do you understand what proving something means?

You two-digit IQ folks really don't help any cause you're associated with. You think you're helping something by making up with assertions what you can't prove with evidence, and then trying to shout down anyone who points out that the evidence isn't there.

It's possible Forrestal was murdered. It's possible the murderers were jews, or put up to it by jews. What I said was, you have asserted it without being able to prove it.

Again, do you even have the mental capacity to understand the difference between asserting something and proving it?

One other piece of evidence that suggests that 9/11 was a combined Israeli/ZOG operation is the missile that hit the Pentagon.


Among those investigating the events of 9/11, is this a widely held view?

Not intended as a flame, I'm just curious as to how prevalent the missile theory is.

If that's true, then what happened to Flight 77?

I was suspicious of the claim that Flight 77 struck the Pentagon because of the lack of debris found, but after watching this video I find it more plausible:


Watch your video at the 0:33 mark. Watch the wing slicing through the wall.

Then take a look at these two.

SEE these Pentagon photos: http://www.911review.org/Wget/investigate911.batcave.net/pentagon1.html

The Impossible Maneuvers of an Inept Rookie Arab Pilot (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/pentagon.html)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmP2Vy8K0i0&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.stormfront.org%2Fforum%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D617515&feature=player_embedded

I think it goes a lot farther than merely knowing it was going to happen. Are you open to evidence they arranged the whole thing?


Sure, I'm always open to reviewing evidence.

Literally every single established fact about '9/11' points to Mossad.

It doesn't constitute proof, but who benefits? Who benefits from having the world's sole remaining superpower declaring war on Islam and Arabs in general? Nobody benefits to the extent that Israel does. It would surprise me if big jew wasn't behind 9/11.

The original motto of the Mossad was "By way of deception, thou shalt make war." Fitting.

If that's true, then what happened to Flight 77?

I was suspicious of the claim that Flight 77 struck the Pentagon because of the lack of debris found, but after watching this video I find it more plausible:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4q35xHzjxB0


Yea, people tend to forget that an aircraft is basically a light-weight hollow tube.

I'm just curious as to how prevalent the missile theory is.

Very: http://www.911review.org/Wget/investigate911.batcave.net/pentagon1.html

Yea, people tend to forget that an aircraft is basically a light-weight hollow tube.
Watch his video at the 0:33 mark, and watch that wing slice through the concrete wall. Velocity makes a difference.

Watch your video at the 0:33 mark. Watch the wing slicing through the wall.


I haven't watched your video yet, Fred, but I rewatched the one I posted. It looks like it may be the wingtips shearing off where they extended past the length of the concrete block, rather than the wings cutting into the concrete. We are talking about what is essentially a hollow reinforced aluminum structure striking concrete at high speed, as mentioned by Donnie.

edit: In fact, in the last sequence (~ the 0:43 second mark), shot partially from overhead, you can see that the wings extend past the concrete block significantly.

I haven't watched your video yet, Fred, but I rewatched the one I posted. It looks like it may be the wingtips shearing off where they extended past the length of the concrete block, rather than the wings cutting into the concrete. We are talking about what is essentially a hollow reinforced aluminum structure striking concrete at high speed, as mentioned by Donnie.

edit: In fact, in the last sequence, shot partially from overhead, you can see that the wings extend past the concrete block, significantly.

The wing tip didn't shear, it cut through, watch it again. Play with the progress button until you get a clear idea. Then, open my links, I think you'll find them very convincing.

If that's true, then what happened to Flight 77?


There has been speculation that some or all of the flights were fabricated, and there is some evidence that the passenger lists were too.

You can find more on this here: http://pilotsfor911truth.org/

This site has a whole bunch of data which tends to disprove the official CT.
http://911review.org/

There has been speculation that some or all of the flights were fabricated, and there is some evidence that the passenger lists were too.



Do you agree that it was aircraft and not missiles that hit the towers?

I saw (admittedly on television) the second jet impact the WTC in real-time.

Think about '9/11' like you were a terrorist, sitting around with your circle of people. Someone says, "Hey! I know: let's hijack multiple airplanes simultaneously and crash them into important sites!"

How would you respond to that?

I was suspicious of the claim that Flight 77 struck the Pentagon because of the lack of debris found, but after watching this video I find it more plausible:
Another feature your video demonstrates is that the fusilage seems to completely collapse on impact. If you take a good look at the Pentagon photos I posted, These Pics (http://www.911review.org/Wget/investigate911.batcave.net/pentagon1.html) you'll find "purported" fusilage damage three buildings deep. Your video tends to further support the missile theory.

Do you agree that it was aircraft and not missiles that hit the towers?

I saw (admittedly on television) the second jet impact the WTC in real-time.

Yes, I believe it was planes, but I think they were 737s painted to look like AA aircraft, not the 757s or 767s which were reported. The engine found at the scene has also been identified as that of a 737.

Think about '9/11' like you were a terrorist, sitting around with your circle of people. Someone says, "Hey! I know: let's hijack multiple airplanes simultaneously and crash them into important sites!"

How would you respond to that?

You mean in America? Are you out of your fucking mind?

They wouldn't have the intel, expertise, training with sophisticated equipment, nor would they have access to have planted the explosives. Only mossad had all the ingredients necessary to have pulled it off and kept the hounds off the trail of those responsible. Even ZOG couldn't have done it and kept it quiet.

Also, they couldn't have gotten NORAD to stand down.

There has been speculation that some or all of the flights were fabricated, and there is some evidence that the passenger lists were too.

You can find more on this here: http://pilotsfor911truth.org/
On the fabricated passenger lists.

SEE THIS: http://pilotsfor911truth.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=4592

Among those investigating the events of 9/11, is this a widely held view?

Not intended as a flame, I'm just curious as to how prevalent the missile theory is.

It's pretty prevalent. Even a well known Jew, Howard Stern has made public statements to that effect.

YouTube - Howard Says a Missile Hit The Pentagon

You mean in America? Are you out of your fucking mind?

They wouldn't have the intel, expertise, training with sophisticated equipment, nor would they have access to have planted the explosives. Only mossad had all the ingredients necessary to have pulled it off and kept the hounds off the trail of those responsible. Even ZOG couldn't have done it and kept it quiet.

Also, they couldn't have gotten NORAD to stand down.
One thing more.

9/11 bares a striking resemblance to the 7/7 bombings and the USS Cole, and the embassy bombings, the King David Hotel, and any number of other known mossad false flag ops.

You mean in America? Are you out of your fucking mind?

They wouldn't have the intel, expertise, training with sophisticated equipment, nor would they have access to have planted the explosives. Only mossad had all the ingredients necessary to have pulled it off and kept the hounds off the trail of those responsible. Even ZOG couldn't have done it and kept it quiet.

Also, they couldn't have gotten NORAD to stand down.

Yep, that's pretty much how most would react.

They would immediately say, hey pal, I like the way you're thinking, but I really don't think we have the capacity for that big an event. There's no way we can do four at once without some kind of screwup. I mean, anyone who has taken an airline knows how spotty they are, how delays happen for no reason. If anything went wrong, we wouldn't be able to adjust.

My point is, no one would even think about something as gloriously huge as '9/11,' except as sheer fantasy. It's like a summer stock company putting on a full-scale broadway show: they simply don't have the wherewithal to pull it off.

My point is, '9/11' is the sort of thing that would only seriously occur to a party that already had 90% of the technics in its toolkit. You would never even think about trying such a difficult and mammoth project unless:

1) there was a huge upside to justify that downside
2) you had all the money, men and materials you needed in fairly easy reach

The Mossad is the only group that has these things AND has a huge incentive to use them to create a pretext for a war to entrench its nation's power in the middle east.

The Muslims can't even keep their own nuclear scientists from being murdered when they know the Israelis are coming for them, yet somehow they're able to pull off

multiple

simultaneous

airplane

hijackings

at

multiple

airports.

Doesn't it seem like likelier that a party that has already proved its extraordinary technical prowess would be the one behind such an unprecedented action? Especially when it had the strongest motive AND a decades-long history of lesser but similar actions?

YouTube - "NO PLANE HIT THE PENTAGON" only once aired report

The Mossad is the only group that has these things AND has a huge incentive to use them to create a pretext for a war to entrench its nation's power in the middle east.
9/11 has decidedly disadvantaged the muslim world, and enhanced the jews' world dramatically.

Don't you think they would have considered being caught? Video cameras everywhere, security, paper trails?

Here, we have a rag tag, pip squeak Afghanistan crowd taking on the most powerful military in the world. They would have had to understand that such a thing could mean Islamic genocide on a worldwide scale. And, as we now know, Al Qaeda never existed.

Al Qaeda Never Existed (http://www.google.com/search?q=cia+admits+al+qaeda+never+existed&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a)

If that's true, then what happened to Flight 77?


That video doesn't show the aftermath, only impact. So you can't use this video to make a conclusion as to how wreckage from a plane crash looks. This is how things look after an actual plane crash.
http://forum.globaltimes.cn/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=30273&thumb=1&d=1273801840

There really isn't much of anything resembling a plane, but there is a lot of debris.

Though in some cases, the plane sections are obvious:
http://forum.globaltimes.cn/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=30285&d=1273802615


The Pentagon looks nothing like a plane crashed there. Even some nearby windows are unbroken.

(Hi res photo)
http://www.osha.gov/as/opa/911/images/pentagon.jpg

The missile theory is hard to believe. I mean, missiles aren't available to anyone except the government. The government launches a missile against itself to aid world Jewry? It's hard to believe, even for someone like me that doesn't believe the official story.

What percentage of those investigating 9/11 could be considered White Nationalist?

Is the opinion that Israel was behind the attacks widely held, or do they blame the U.S. government?

YouTube - 9/11 Coincidences (16/19)

(Hi res photo)
http://www.osha.gov/as/opa/911/images/pentagon.jpg

The missile theory is hard to believe. I mean, missiles aren't available to anyone except the government. The government launches a missile against itself to aid world Jewry? It's hard to believe, even for someone like me that doesn't believe the official story.

Why would you think ZOG incapable of launching a missile from an airborne platform for their own purposes?

Do you realize that the specific impact area is precisely where auditors were working on the missing $3 trillion the Pentagon "lost?"

This picture shows that the front wall collapsed away from the camera. It remains substantially intact, other than having fallen over. You can see that the wall doesn't depict airliner damages.

What percentage of those investigating 9/11 could be considered White Nationalist?

Is the opinion that Israel was behind the attacks widely held, or do they blame the U.S. government?

Discovering and prosecuting these monsters (all jews, but a few) could be the catalyst which disengages us from the jew.

This crime is a jewish 'all-in' venture. If they are discovered here, there won't be any place they can hide. Jews in America would be slaughtered like chickens and israel would be utterly destroyed, ending zionism.

This is the very most important issue of our time, it has the capacity to cull every jew from the planet, or to at least weaken them so profoundly that they would cease to be a threat.

Every thinking white, and whites are the only ones looking, can see this for what it is, if they investigate it thoroughly enough.

This issue is the most important to whites, by far.

Why would you think ZOG incapable of launching a missile from an airborne platform for their own purposes?

Do you realize that the specific impact area is precisely where auditors were working on the missing $3 trillion the Pentagon "lost?"

This picture shows that the front wall collapsed away from the camera. It remains substantially intact, other than having fallen over. You can see that the wall doesn't depict airliner damages.

It's just too fanciful. Maybe I still hold a shred of goodwill toward ZOG.

If you know the way the military works, it's one huge bureaucracy. Ordering up a missile strike is not a one man job, nor a 5 man job nor even a 20 man job. I don't know exactly how many people would have to be involved, but it would be a big deal. Not the stuff that would allow anyone with getting away with it.

Maybe I'm wrong. The attempted sinking of the USS Liberty, and the withdrawl of the US jets mid flight as they were about to shoot down Israeli Mirages should tell me that ZOG is capable of allowing its military men to be killed if it benefits the Zionist Entity.

What percentage of those investigating 9/11 could be considered White Nationalist?

Is the opinion that Israel was behind the attacks widely held, or do they blame the U.S. government?

I'm not an expert, but from what I've seen, the "truthers" are 99% non-WN. And it seems to me very much that there's an active attempt by the usual suspects to channel disbelievers in the Official Theory into the preferred alternative, that the US Government was responsible, Bush and Cheney in particular. The Mossad is, from what I've seen, not mentioned except by WN - but it has begun to creep through to the truth people, mostly because they really are, many of them, looking for the truth. But usually when you see polls or just articles about OT doubters, the false alternatives are the OT and the Bush admin. With the Mossad safely off the page. A perfect parallel to JFK assassination theories, if you think about it.

THIS MAN SAYS IT BEST

It's just too fanciful. Maybe I still hold a shred of goodwill toward ZOG.

If you know the way the military works, it's one huge bureaucracy. Ordering up a missile strike is not a one man job, nor a 5 man job nor even a 20 man job. I don't know exactly how many people would have to be involved, but it would be a big deal. Not the stuff that would allow anyone with getting away with it.

Maybe I'm wrong. The attempted sinking of the USS Liberty, and the withdrawl of the US jets mid flight as they were about to shoot down Israeli Mirages should tell me that ZOG is capable of allowing its military men to be killed if it benefits the Zionist Entity.

I think CIA spooks, with their unlimited budget, made the flight which launched the missile. Probably a stealth bomber.

The missile theory is hard to believe. I mean, missiles aren't available to anyone except the government. The government launches a missile against itself to aid world Jewry? It's hard to believe, even for someone like me that doesn't believe the official story.



There are a lot of claims made over 9/11 that seem if not nearly impossible, then at least implausible.

As an example, I read where (not sure if I read this on one of our threads or at a linked site) someone theorized that the four hijacked planes were secretly landed, the crew & passengers disembarked (then eliminated, I would have to assume?) and similar jets outfitted with some sort of remote control were then used to resume the flights and stage the actual attacks, with the dozens of phone calls placed from the "hijacked" drones being fabricated (in real time) by the government/Mossad using voice-morphing technology.

To me personally, that sounds extremely unlikely, to the point of dismissal offhand.

I do realize that not everyone in the 9/11 movement believes the same things.

There is also a great deal of opinion being stated as fact, but that happens over any topic.

There are a lot of claims made over 9/11 that seem if not nearly impossible, then at least implausible.

As an example, I read where (not sure if I read this on one of our threads or at a linked site) someone theorized that the four hijacked planes were secretly landed, the crew & passengers disembarked (then eliminated, I would have to assume?) and similar jets outfitted with some sort of remote control were then used to resume the flights and stage the actual attacks, with the dozens of phone calls placed from the "hijacked" drones being fabricated (in real time) by the government/Mossad using voice-morphing technology.

To me personally, that sounds extremely unlikely, to the point of dismissal offhand.

I do realize that not everyone in the 9/11 movement believes the same things.

There is also a great deal of opinion being stated as fact, but that happens over any topic.

You must understand, they are putting out as many CTs as possible, hoping to confuse the issues and side track investigators. Some of them are purposefully made to look extremely redicules, so they will rub off one the ones that aren't.

I do not believe the phone calls were genuine, but that's a side track.

I do believe the planes were remotely controlled and that at least some of the manifest data is fabricated. The technology was available to take over those planes and cut communications at the same time.

Had they not been done in that way, assuming they were genuine airline flights, someone would have gotten off a mayday.

What percentage of those investigating 9/11 could be considered White Nationalist?

Is the opinion that Israel was behind the attacks widely held, or do they blame the U.S. government?

The most credible Official Theory (OT) debunkers almost have to stay away from the most effective means of debunking - going to the motives of the terrorists. They have to stick to the evidence, because this is supposed to be logical, and it supposed that combining politics with science would undercut their case, or at least leave them open to the usual smears masquerading as charges.

Take Steven Jones. He's no WN, he's a Mormon. He says it didn't happen the way the government says, and I can prove it, and, boom, he's out of a job at BYU.

Perhaps the main truther, Griffin, is actually a WASP-NWO type. A liberal Christian philosopher-theologian, something along those lines. The polar opposite of a WN - a WASP liberal. Interestingly, he comes out of Claremont Graduate School. That's part of the complex where I matriculated. Claremont is a sink of neoconservatism - CMC is one of the top neocon ungrad schools in the country, and the graduate school puts out a quarterly that pushes all agendas neoconniving: http://www.claremont.org/publications/crb/ . That's by way of background. Griffin is NOT a WN.

Then you've got Chris Bollyn. He does direct reporting on the Mossad connection. He gets attacked by police. Hmm, I'm sure there's no connection there. I'm sure the facts he's digging up about Israelis running our most inside DoD computers aren't true. Just as I'm sure the fact that the main debunker-debunker is the nephew of the guy who caught the Israeli spies has no meaning. Nor that the Fox series discussing this stuff was memory-holed.

At a certain point, you have to give in to the obvious. The obvious, in this case, is that although Muslims dislike the US and would like to cause some havoc in our lands as "we" have in theirs, when it comes to the human connections and technical ability it takes to do that on the scale and level of '9/11,' they are laughably out of their league. Only the Mossad could have done '9/11.' The most even our ZOG is capable of doing is standing aside, which "we" did, and help with the coverup.

I happily concede the point that Israel benefited most from 9/11, but it isn't like American support for Israel was wavering on September 10th.

Israel could use tactical nukes on it's neighbors, and we wouldn't do anything of substance to them.

I think that was true on September 10, 2001, too.

One effect invading Iraq had was to strengthen Iran's position; Iraq was a big enemy of Iran since the Iran-Iraq War. I don't see how a stronger Iran is in Israel's interest.

There are a lot of claims made over 9/11 that seem if not nearly impossible, then at least implausible.

As an example, I read where (not sure if I read this on one of our threads or at a linked site) someone theorized that the four hijacked planes were secretly landed, the crew & passengers disembarked (then eliminated, I would have to assume?) and similar jets outfitted with some sort of remote control were then used to resume the flights and stage the actual attacks, with the dozens of phone calls placed from the "hijacked" drones being fabricated (in real time) by the government/Mossad using voice-morphing technology.

To me personally, that sounds extremely unlikely, to the point of dismissal offhand.

I do realize that not everyone in the 9/11 movement believes the same things.

There is also a great deal of opinion being stated as fact, but that happens over any topic.

Yeah, there's a lot of shit being thrown out there to confuse people. 'Truthing' has become just another political thing, with the antis trying to lead the opposition and confuse honest men with limited time. One good way of doing that is raise all kinds of trivialities and irrelevancies to center stage. Some of the dumber but honest types don't see what's going on, and get drawn in.

Stick to the big picture: who had the means, motive, and opportunity?

Only jews. Only the Mossad.

The only technical analysis needed to sustain this, since Muslims can fly planes, is to demonstrate that the buildings were brought down by something other than the plane crashes themselves. Because no one, to my knowledge, has even pretended to believe that Muslims would have access to WTC to wire it for demolition.

The discovery of thermite proves these buildings were demolished. There simply isn't any plausible reason to believe anybody but connected Israelis-hebrews-double-citizens-jew-government-higherups had the opportunity to get into the WTC during those unexplained shutdowns in the weeks before 9/11 and place the charges that cut the steel.

The rest of the crap is extraneous. Not that it can't be used to prove the same thing, but it's not the most direct way of doing it. It's appendix material, and, as said, there are plenty of lies and wild claims flung about precisely to fool those with limited time to investigate the truth.

For the layman with limited time, patterns alone suggest the likely truth. Mossad has a unique history of technically-flavored false flags. It has a history of creating terrorist cells, buying informants, setting up false fronts - and all of these with Muslims. Mossad has fooled the US to act against Muslims before - Reagan's bombing of Libya for the La Belle disco murders was based on information the Mossad arranged to appear to be coming from Muslims.

9/11 is what jews do. Itz their business. Faking, fooling, lying, covering up - all in a race's work, for the jews.

You must understand, they are putting out as many CTs as possible, hoping to confuse the issues and side track investigators. Some of them are purposefully made to look extremely redicules, so they will rub off one the ones that aren't.

Yea, I'm sure that happens. "The False Front" is a very old, and very effective tactic. It's been used against WN many times.



I do not believe the phone calls were genuine, but that's a side track.

I do believe the planes were remotely controlled and that at least some of the manifest data is fabricated. The technology was available to take over those planes and cut communications at the same time.

Had they not been done in that way, assuming they were genuine airline flights, someone would have gotten off a mayday.



Understood.

What percentage would you think of those investigating 9/11 would agree that the planes were remotely piloted and the calls were faked?

Or is the focus more on the possibility of a controlled demolition at the WTC?

One effect invading Iraq had was to strengthen Iran's position; Iraq was a big enemy of Iran since the Iran-Iraq War. I don't see how a stronger Iran is in Israel's interest.

They work with what they're given. Circumstances were better for going after Iraq first, so they did. That done, they turn on Iran.

Yeah, there's a lot of shit being thrown out there to confuse people. 'Truthing' has become just another political thing, with the antis trying to lead the opposition and confuse honest men with limited time. One good way of doing that is raise all kinds of trivialities and irrelevancies to center stage. Some of the dumber but honest types don't see what's going on, and get drawn in.

Stick to the big picture: who had the means, motive, and opportunity?

Only jews. Only the Mossad.

The only technical analysis needed to sustain this, since Muslims can fly planes, is to demonstrate that the buildings were brought down by something other than the plane crashes themselves. Because no one, to my knowledge, has even pretended to believe that Muslims would have access to WTC to wire it for demolition.

The discovery of thermite proves these buildings were demolished. There simply isn't any plausible reason to believe anybody but connected Israelis-hebrews-double-citizens-jew-government-higherups had the opportunity to get into the WTC during those unexplained shutdowns in the weeks before 9/11 and place the charges that cut the steel.

The rest of the crap is extraneous. Not that it can't be used to prove the same thing, but it's not the most direct way of doing it. It's appendix material, and, as said, there are plenty of lies and wild claims flung about precisely to fool those with limited time to investigate the truth.

For the layman with limited time, patterns alone suggest the likely truth. Mossad has a unique history of technically-flavored false flags. It has a history of creating terrorist cells, buying informants, setting up false fronts - and all of these with Muslims. Mossad has fooled the US to act against Muslims before - Reagan's bombing of Libya for the La Belle disco murders was based on information the Mossad arranged to appear to be coming from Muslims.

9/11 is what jews do. Itz their business. Faking, fooling, lying, covering up - all in a race's work, for the jews.

At least you are honest about why you believe (or at least want everyone to believe you believe) that planes alone couldn't have brought down the towers. To you, the truth is less important than political expedience.

I happily concede the point that Israel benefited most from 9/11, but it isn't like American support for Israel was wavering on September 10th.

Israel could use tactical nukes on it's neighbors, and we wouldn't do anything of substance to them.

I think that was true on September 10, 2001, too.

American law forbids foreign aid to nuclear powers that have not signed the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, such as israel. Which is why America and israel both have a policy of no comment when israel's nuclear program comes up. But if they were to openly use those nukes the pro-palestine far left in america, and most of europe would make a big stink about it, which would lead to america openly making an exception for israel, which would lead to more talk of zionist/neocon control of the government.

So if israel does nuke them, brace yourself for yet another holocaust movie, and for swindler's list to play on nbc without commercial interruption and so on.

What happens if later today Israel deploys a nuclear weapon against Tehran itself, simply stating:

"We could not allow the holocaust-denying Ahmadinejad to carry out a plot we have uncovered to use suitcase nukes against various cites in North America and Europe, and that further we are sickened by the seemingly endless trickle of the dead & maimed of our brave American allies from Iraq & Afghanistan, their injuries courtesy of weapons provided by Iran.

Did we mention that the Iranians deny the Holocaust? We did? OK, I wanted to be sure, because six million Jews were gassed in the camps. Six million! We could not allow a new Muslim Hitler to destroy the world."

Hell, we should thank them. They were doing us a mitzvah.

My bet would be on nothing substantial.

It's not like anyone is going to retaliate, are they?

Israel benefited from it, but they didn't need 9/11, in my opinion.

At least you are honest about why you believe (or at least want everyone to believe you believe) that planes alone couldn't have brought down the towers. To you, the truth is less important than political expedience.

I do not understand what you are saying. If the planes brought down the buildings, I would say so.

Israel benefited from it, but they didn't need 9/11, in my opinion.

Then why do they have 25 of their top brains sitting around a table, writing a big report, saying they really, really want a war to reshape the middle east, and all they need to start it is a "New Pearl Harbor"?

At least you are honest about why you believe (or at least want everyone to believe you believe) that planes alone couldn't have brought down the towers. To you, the truth is less important than political expedience.

Now, George, I'm starting to misunderstand. You say you were deep into PhD physics work, and you've read up on 9/11, and you can't say for absolute sure that the planes brought down the WTC? Do you actually believe that?

Then why do they have 25 of their top brains sitting around a table, writing a big report, saying they really, really want a war to reshape the middle east, and all they need to start it is a "New Pearl Harbor"?


We had already had one war with Iraq over Kuwait just a few years prior, which eliminated Iraq as any sort of military threat. Why not reshape then?

Since 1947 Israel routinely invades/bombs/shells whomever they please, without regard to world opinion. They don't need a justification.

Yes, Bush wanted to take out Saddam Hussein for his own personal reasons (he believed that Hussein had actively sought to assassinate his father), and 9/11 offered him the perfect opportunity to do just that, even though Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11, and they knew from the U.N. inspections that Iraq did not have nuclear weapons.

We had already had one war with Iraq over Kuwait just a few years prior, which eliminated Iraq as any sort of military threat. Why not reshape then?

I don't know. Maybe they thought they could do all they needed with Saddam in power, later realized they couldn't.


Israel routinely invades/bombs/shells whomever they please, without regard to world opinion. They don't need a justification.

It's not quite that simple. Remember, they don't admit they have nukes. They prefer to operate by deception, and develop their malignancies by degree. Start using nukes on people, yes, they could get away with it, but really, as much as they are hated now, it would be off the charts after that. They don't want to bare-bones it unless they need to, is my guess. I mean, you open eyes when you start throwing nukes around. Right now they can keep up a steady whine about Iran, suck their Iraqi oil straw, go in and murder any Iranian technicals they don't like. They have it all their own way, and they don't really need to go further, or they would.


Yes, Bush wanted to take out Saddam Hussein for his own personal reasons (he believed that Hussein had actively sought to assassinate his father), and 9/11 offered him the perfect opportunity to do just that, even though Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11, and they knew from the U.N. inspections that Iraq did not have nuclear weapons.

Well, the war could certainly serve multiple motives, but the plans for it were in place before Bush the Dumberer came to power.

Ostrovsky writes about the Mossad planning to execute Bush I. It was to be in Spain, but was called off due to shifting circumstances. The deviousness of jews can never safely be underrated.

The deviousness of jews can never safely be underrated.


100% agreement there.

And since support for the "War on Terror" is wearing visibly thin, it scares the hell out of me.

[review of one of the two Ostrovsky books]

The Other Side of Deception: A Rogue Agent Exposes the Mossad's Secret Agenda

By Victor Ostrovsky. HarperCollins Publishers, Inc. (New York) 1994, 315 pp. List: $24; AET: $18 for one, $24 for two.
Reviewed by Andrew I. Killgore

Mossad case officer Victor Ostrovsky was in Larnaca, Cyprus in 1980 on an operation involving cooperation with Belgian authorities to halt shipments of arms by leftist Belgians to Palestinians. One night in the hotel he decided, on his own, to strike up an acquaintance with a Palestinian businessman from Amman who had just arrived from Libya.

To Ostrovsky's surprise, the Palestinian described to him a Mossad scheme to force down a plane flying top Palestine Liberation Organization leaders from Tripoli, Libya, to Lebanon. The Israeli intelligence agency's plan to capture PLO leaders would fail, the Palestinian businessman told Ostrovsky, because the PLO was aware of the Mossad's plan. Ostrovsky tried to warn his superiors that the Palestinians had knowledge of the plan, but failed to reach them in time to halt it.

The Palestinian, as it turned out, was right. When Israeli aircraft forced the small plane to land in Israel, the PLO leaders were not aboard, and the Israeli act of aerial piracy over international waters caused it great embarrassment.

Somehow the blame for that embarrassment fell on Ostrovsky, however, because he had broken Mossad rules in cultivating the Palestinian. His superiors chose to believe that his conversation with the Palestinian was the reason for their failure.

From that day forward, Ostrovsky was a marked man within the Mossad. At that point in his plummeting career as an Israeli spy, according to Ostrovsky's own account, he agreed to work with higher ranking Mossad officers (whether they were still in or outside the agency is hazy) to thwart hard-liners within Mossad who were planning, among other things, to arrange the assassination in southern Lebanon in 1982 of a relatively moderate Mossad director-designate to prevent his taking office.

That's how Ostrovsky, whose first book about life within the Mossad was By Way of Deception, begins his second book, The Other Side of Deception.

The author and his co-conspirators set out to discredit the Mossad-as-is by revealing its dirty tricks to the intelligence services of other nations, and to replace it with something less repulsive. They walk a fine line between hurting Mossad without harming Israel. In fact the conspirators seem dedicated to Israel, although the Canadian-born author eventually describes Israel, where he was raised by his grandparents, as "a nightmare of prejudice, wallowing in racism and waving the white and blue flag of oppression."

The Israeli government inadvertently boosted sales of Ostrovsky's first book by attempting, in vain, to suppress its publication in Canada, to which Ostrovsky had fled and where he had gone into hiding. The grisly picture of Mossad dirty tricks painted in his second book by Ostrovsky's almost novelistic writing style, plus a human reluctance to accept that anybody could be that bad, may leave the reader wondering, "Can all this really be true?"

For this reviewer the answer was supplied by Ostrovsky's account of Mossad's assassination of a German politician named Uwe Barschel. The account in his book, completed early in 1994, was confirmed in chilling detail in a January 1995 Washington Post article datelined Berlin and based upon German, Spanish and Swiss police investigations of the murder, and the possible motives for it.

According to Ostrovsky, Barschel, the premier of the north German state of Schleswig-Holstein, adamantly refused in 1987, during the Iran-Iraq war, to allow Israeli arms for Iran to be shipped from Schleswig-Holstein ports. Subsequently, he was accused, falsely it now appears, by one of his press aides of authorizing dirty tricks against his political rivals. Although Barschel asserted his innocence, he was forced to resign, leaving his career in ruins. Barschel, who had a wife and four children, then traveled to the Canary Islands (shades of publisher Robert Maxwell, who also ran afoul of Mossad, according to Ostrovsky, and came to an untimely end there).

In the case of Barschel, according to both Ostrovsky and the subsequent Washington Post account, the disgraced politician was lured to Geneva by a telephone call he received in the Canary Islands from a Robert Roloff (according to Barschel's widow, who insists that her husband was murdered) or Robert Oleff (according to Ostrovsky) who promised to provide Barschel information that could clear his name. Immediately after his arrival in Switzerland, however, Barschel was found dead and fully clothed in his Geneva hotel bathtub. His death was ruled a suicide at the time.

But the Post article reports that the case has been re-opened as a murder investigation because of evidence that "a third party" may have been involved and that the overdose of sedatives found in Barschel's stomach may actually have been forced through a tube inserted down his throat after he was dead. Just who the third party who went to such lengths to make a murder look like a suicide might be is unclear. The Israeli government, however, has issued a "formal denial" that it was involved. But in a Middle East where the "opposite test" rule is often applied, a denial, especially if it is "formal," is widely accepted as confirmation that the opposite is true.

In addition to his insider's account of how deaths such as Barschel's occur, Ostrovsky's assessments of the Palestinian, British, Soviet, Jordanian and other intelligence services make exciting reading: A personal touch is added by the fact that Ostrovsky constantly looks over his shoulder for "hit men." As others have corroborated, Mossad may not be very good overall at assembling and assessing intelligence, but it excels at assassination.

Among other kinds of dirty tricks in which Mossad also specializes, Ostrovsky asserts that it doctored the file of then-U.N. Secretary-General Kurt Waldheim to implicate him in Nazi crimes. The doctored file subsequently was "discovered" by then-Israeli Ambassador to the United Nations Benyamin Netanyahu to smear Waldheim.

The reason? Israel was unhappy with Waldheim's criticism of Israeli activities in southern Lebanon. (This is chillingly reminiscent of the great Hannah Arendt's memorable rumination on the "banality of evil" in her monumental Eichmann in Jerusalem.)

Ostrovsky also charges that Mossad framed Libya in the April 5, 1986 bombing of the West Berlin discothéque in which two U.S. servicemen and a Turkish woman were fatally injured. The background was that by planting an unmanned radio of its own in Libya, Mossad broadcast fraudulent orders for terrorist attacks to Libyan embassies around the world. Although the orders were rejected as false by the Spanish and French intelligence services, they were picked up and accepted as real by U.S. intelligence. As a consequence Libya was blamed by the U.S. for the La Belle discothéque attack. Ironically, according to Ostrovsky, even Mossad had no clue as to whom the real culprits were.

The tragic implication of the U.S. acceptance at face value of the intercepted radio signals rejected by the French and Spaniards is that American intelligence has been "conditioned" to accept as true anything that Israel claims. The subsequent American aerial attack on Tripoli, in which an adopted daughter of Muammar Qaddafi and American airmen were killed, seems to be one of the most obvious and extreme cases of the Israeli tail wagging the American dog.

Particularly shocking to American readers is Ostrovsky's claim that a right-wing clique within Mossad decided, unbeknownst to then-Prime Minister Yitzhak Shamir, to assassinate President George Bush when the president was in Madrid at the end of October 1991 for the opening of Arab-Israeli peace talks. Evidence was to be manufactured implicating the Palestinians. The clique believed that Shamir would have ordered the assassination himself if he hadn't been gagged by "politics" because the American president had frozen U.S. loan guarantees to Israel.

Three named Palestinian extremists were "taken" from Beirut to Israel's Negev desert and held incommunicado, according to Ostrovsky. Meanwhile Mossad-generated threats on the president's life, seemingly from Palestinians, were leaked. These were designed to throw suspicion on the organization of rogue Palestinian terrorist Abu Nidal. Names and descriptions of the three terrorists were leaked to Spanish police so that, if the plot was successful, blame would automatically fall on them.

Eventually, however, the assassination plot was called off, for reasons Ostrovsky does not explain. In a grisly conclusion to the story, however, the three Palestinian prisoners met the fate that had been decreed for them from the time the plot was hatched. In the Negev hideout where they were being held they were "terminated," to employ Ostrovsky's chilling word.

Ostrovsky also charges that Mossad murdered British press magnate Robert Maxwell, whose body was recovered from the seas around the Canary Islands. (At the time Maxwell had overextended his media empire by entering the successful bid, for which he couldn't come up with the cash, to buy The New York Daily News.)

And, as has been widely speculated in the press, Mossad murdered Gerald Bull in Brussels when the Canadian engineer rejected Israeli demands that he cease work for Iraq during the Iraq-Iran war on a super long-range gun.

Author Ostrovsky is not kind to his fellow North American Jews. He says Mossad divides them into three categories. First are the sayanim , volunteer spies for Israel. Second is the Israel lobby, which follows Mossad's guidance. And third is B'nai B'rith, which can be relied upon to "tarnish as anti-Semites whomever they can't sway to the Israeli cause." (The recent statement by Israeli journalist and ex-Mossad agent Josef Lapid on Canadian television that Mossad shouldn't have to assassinate Ostrovsky since some Canadian Jew surely could be found to do the job lends credence to this classification.)

The Other Side of Deception is a fast-paced, exciting book. On one level it can be read simply as a first-person adventure tale of one man dodging and running for his life from a bunch of killers justifiably famed for their competence at their trade. But what makes the narration totally absorbing is the realization that The Other Side of Deception is not a novel, but essentially true.

At a more cerebral level, the book also depicts Israeli officials and their American partisans as neither idealistic nor boring collectivist automatons, as depicted by the American media, but rather as fascinating, but dangerously misguided, individuals who are a menace to themselves and to all who choose to identify with them.

The Other Side of Deceptionis far more than information excitingly packaged. It is an insider's probing exposé of some Middle East realities that have been hidden too long from all but Israeli eyes.

Andrew I. Killgore is the publisher of the Washington Report on Middle East Affairs.

http://www.wrmea.com/backissues/0495/9504058.htm

The style, the symbols, the historical patterns, the technical capacity, the sheer grandglorious brazen arrogantry of the operation scream with one voice

MO- FUCKING - SSAD.

UN - FUCKING - DENIABLE.

100% agreement there.

And since support for the "War on Terror" is wearing visibly thin, it scares the hell out of me.

Even dummies now recognize the patterns, thanks to the internet. That's why they very rightly fear a US city being nuked, and it being blamed, as in the Ostrovsky review above, on some carefully selected al-patsies.

Why is there a "truth" movement in the first place if there isn't something incredibly fishy going on?

The truthers aren't pushing anything. They have no political agenda going in, 99% of them, unlike, say, the global warming or 'holocaust' liars. Many of them, including the most credible, are arguing AGAINST their own interests.

All the physical and circumstantial evidence points the same way.

Chapters One - Four

excerpted from the book

Final Judgment

The missing link in the JFK assassination conspiracy

by Michael Collins Piper

Wolfe Press, 1995, paperback

p1
Who killed John F. Kennedy? That question has plagued the world for a generation. What is it that we do know about the JFK murder that ties all of the differing theories together? What is it that all of the theories have in common?

The blame for the assassination has been placed on numerous power groups, perhaps working independently or together. Most often named have been the CIA (or rogue elements thereof), organized crime and the anti-Castro Cuban network.

Yet, one power in particular-Israel and its spy agency, the Mossad-links all of these forces together. Israel, however, is the central player whose role has been consistently ignored.

p6
GENERALLY ACCEPTED CONCLUSIONS

Our final judgment on a foundation composed of the following generally accepted conclusions about the nature of the JFK assassination conspiracy:

o That there was a conspiracy to kill John F. Kennedy;

o That the conspiracy itself involved elements of the U.S. intelligence community, the CIA in particular;

o That Organized Crime figures played a major part in the conspiracy;

o That anti-Castro Cubans were actively participating in the conspiracy, at the urging of and/or manipulation by the CIA and elements of Organized Crime;

o That somehow Lee Harvey Oswald (wittingly or unwittingly) was brought into the conspiracy and that the conspirators planted false evidence to link Oswald with Fidel Castro and the Soviets;

o That Oswald was directly involved in some manner of U.S. intelligence community activities and that he was a knowing participant in those activities;

o That Jack Ruby was either an active participant in the assassination conspiracy itself or was used in some fashion to manipulate Oswald prior to the assassination of JFK;

o That Ruby was actively involved in organized crime activities and that he was, as a consequence of that involvement, also linked with organized crime activities that operated in conjunction (or ran parallel) with U.S. intelligence community activities.

o That the Central Intelligence Agency was cognizant of the activities of both Oswald and Ruby and certainly manipulated both;

o That Oswald was executed by Jack Ruby for the purpose of silencing Oswald forever;

o That a major cover-up of the JFK assassination conspiracy was undertaken following the events in Dallas;

o That the cover-up involved elements of the federal government (including the CIA);

o That the Warren Commission and the House Assassinations Committee were deliberate participants in the cover-up;

o That the cover-up conspiracy was conducted for a wide variety of motivations-both ostensibly "patriotic" and otherwise- including-but not limited to:

a) burying intelligence community connections to the assassination conspiracy;
b) protecting Organized Crime elements involved;
c) preventing hostilities between the United States and foreign nations (whether it be the Soviet Union or Castro's Cuba); and
d) resolving questions about the assassination in the public's mind, both here and abroad.

o That the Controlled Media actively encouraged and/or participated in the cover-up due to its links to the CIA, the intelligence community in general, and Organized Crime. _____

p8
WHAT HAPPENED

Here, in essence, is the basis of the theory presented and documented:
-That during his presidency, John F. Kennedy alienated three major international power blocs: the American CIA, Organized Crime, and Israel and its American lobby.

o That in each case, Kennedy's continued tenure in the White House was perceived by each of these power groups as a threat to its very existence.

o That each of these major international power blocs was closely intertwined with the others, often on several levels.

o That when Kennedy's presence in the White House became so intolerable that these forces came together in a wide-ranging conspiracy that resulted in JFK's murder.

o That the power of these forces, together, over the American media played a vital role in the assassination conspiracy cover-up.

Final Judgment explores in detail the little-known behind-the-scenes war between John F. Kennedy and Israel and documents how U.S. policy toward the Middle East underwent a drastic reversal upon JFK's

A THEORY OF POWER POLITICS AT WORK

The conspiracy outlined here was a criminal enterprise involving power politics in its highest-and lowest-forms.

o Presents international intrigue above and beyond the then-crumbling U.S.-Israel relationship;

o Examines the tragic reality of American involvement in Southeast Asia-which Kennedy sought to prevent-the final result of which guaranteed:

(a) Israel's dominance in Middle East affairs as the United States became bogged down in Asia;
(b) Southeast Asian drug profits for Meyer Lansky's global drug racket (operating in conjunction with the Mossad's ally, the CIA); and
(c) Multi-billion dollar profits in arms production for the backers of Israel's ally-Lyndon Johnson-in the military-industrial complex;

o Explains how the CIA-so closely tied to Israel-was able to continue its subterranean covert activities in Southeast Asia and elsewhere after the elimination of JFK;

o Illustrates how certain special interests (the anti-Castro Cuban movement and Organized Crime) could be manipulated by another special interest-the CIA-Mossad alliance-in pursuit of a mutual goal: ending John F. Kennedy's presidency;

o Points out why the various elements involved in the conspiracy were working in conjunction with one another in covering up the facts about the assassination;

o Details how the Controlled Media-long a primary collaborator with the Lansky-linked pro-Israel lobby in the United States-promoted the Warren Commission's "lone nut" solution of the JFK murder and sought to silence critics of the "official" explanation;

o Reveals how the anger and disgust of one powerful man-in this instance, David Ben-Gurion of Israel-could result in a vendetta carried out by means of a far-reaching conspiracy orchestrated through his own sphere of influence;

o Describes how key American political power brokers-such as J. Edgar Hoover and, most particularly, Lyndon B. Johnson (both connected to the Israeli-linked Lansky Crime Syndicate)-were able to maintain their influence-and expand it correspondingly-upon the death of John F. Kennedy and

o Demonstrates how low-level operatives such as Lee Harvey Oswald and Jack Ruby - both with a diverse array of strange connections-were utilized by conspirators at the top.

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OFF WITH HIS HEAD: A MOSSAD PLOT TO KILL AN AMERICAN PRESIDENT

Would Israel's Mossad actually consider assassinating an American president perceived hostile to Israel? A former Mossad agent says "yes." According to ex-Mossad man Victor Ostrovsky, the Israeli spy agency hatched a plan to kill President George Bush.

Was President John F. Kennedy killed by a conspiracy orchestrated-at least in part-by Israel's spy agency-the Mossad? If so, this would not be the last time that the Mossad planned the assassination of an American president.

According to former Mossad agent Victor Ostrovsky, elements of the Mossad were plotting an attempt on the life of President George Bush. The reason: according to Ostrovsky, Bush is hated by the Mossad and considered an enemy of Israel.

This amazing revelation was published in the February 1992 edition of the Washington Report on Middle East Affairs. The author of the report was former Congressman Paul Findley (R-Ill.), himself a prominent critic of Israel. (Findley's best-selling book, They Dare to Speak Out: People and Institutions Confront Israel's Lobby, is a classic exposition of the way Israel Lobby has worked to silence American critics of the foreign nation.)

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Findley reports that Ostrovsky had learned through his sources in the intelligence community that because of President Bush's seeming intransigence toward Israel's demands, the Mossad had begun coordinating plans for the assassination of the American president.

Ostrovsky relayed this information to several members of the Canadian parliament, indicating that the Mossad, and not Israel's elected leadership, is "the real engine of policy in Israel."

One of those attending the meeting with Ostrovsky passed the information on to another former Republican member of the House of Representative, Paul N. (Pete) McCloskey of California. (McCloskey, like Findley, has been a forthright public critic of Israel and is associated with his fellow former lawmaker on the board of the Council for the National Interest, a Washington-based organization that promotes America's interests in Middle East policy-making.)

Upon learning of the potential threat to President Bush, exCongressman McKloskey himself flew to Canada where he met with Ostrovsky. According to Findley's account, here is what transpired: "Ostrovsky impressed McCloskey as a patriotic Zionist who believes the Mossad is out of control. Ostrovsky told him [McCloskey] the present leadership of the Mossad wants 'to do everything possible to preserve a state of war between Israel and its neighbors, assassinating President Bush, if necessary."

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A BAD HABIT: ISRAEL'S USE OF "FALSE FLAGS" IN GLOBAL TERRORISM - POINTING THE FINGER OF GUILT ELSEWHERE

Researchers in the JFK assassination controversy have repeatedly pointed out the false leads that continue to appear. Most believe that Lee Harvey Oswald, the alleged assassin, was indeed what he claimed to be-the patsy-and that false clues had been laid by the real conspirators to make it appear as though Oswald was an agent of the Soviets or Fidel Castro or both.

The use of such "false flags" by Israel's Mossad to cover up its own role in worldwide assassination conspiracies and other criminal activity has been documented time and again. "Arabs," "the Mafia," "right-wing extremists," and others have repeatedly taken the fall for crimes committed by the Mossad or carried out under its coordination.

The use of "false flag" operations by Israel and its Mossad has been documented repeatedly since the Jewish State first came into being.

This book contends that Israel and its primary collaborator, the CIA, utilized insidious "false flags" in orchestrating the assassination of John F. Kennedy and the subsequent cover-up: "the Mafia," "anti-Castro Cubans," "the Soviets," "Castro agents" and even "right-wing extremists" have all been fingered as those responsible for the JFK assassination. But the real hard evidence points in another direction entirely.

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THE U.S.S. LIBERTY-BLAMING THE EGYPTIANS

Israel, in fact, hoped to pin the responsibility on a "false flag" Egypt - and draw the United States into the impending 1967 war on the side of Israel. It is only because the Liberty did not sink and instead was rescued that the history books don't tell us today that "the Arabs" sunk an American spy ship and sparked another "Lusitania incident" that forced America to go to war.

THE NUCLEAR BOMB

The second instance to which Congressman Findley referred is of special interest inasmuch as the intended attack on an American air force reconnaissance plane was designed to protect Israel's secret development of nuclear weaponry.

It was Israel's nuclear offensive that led President John F. Kennedy into the "secret war" with Israel that he was conducting during the three years of his short-lived presidency... it was the very issue of Kennedy's intransigence and his opposition to Israel's nuclear development that became a central part of his standoff with Israel and its Mossad.
It was this conflict indeed that played a critical part in setting in final motion the assassination conspiracy that ended John Kennedy's life.

What follows is an overview of some other notable instances in which Israel utilized "false flags" in its international criminal endeavors.

THE LAVON AFFAIR

Perhaps the best-known instance in which Israel used a "false flag" to cover its own trail was in the infamous Lavon Affair. It was in 1954 that several Israeli-orchestrated acts of terrorism against British targets in Egypt were carried out. Blame for the attacks was placed on the Muslim Brotherhood, which opposed the regime of Egyptian President Gamul Abdul-Nasser.

However, the truth about the wave of terror can now be found in a once-secret cable from Colonel Benjamin Givli, the head of Israel's military intelligence, who outlined the intended purpose behind the wave of terror:

["Our goal] is to break the West's confidence in the existing [Egyptian] regime . . . . The actions should cause arrests, demonstrations, and expressions of revenge. The Israeli origin should be totally covered while attention should be shifted to any other possible factor. The purpose is to prevent economic and military aid from the West to Egypt."

Ultimately the truth about Israel's involvement in the affair became public and Israel was rocked internally in the wake of the scandal. Competing political elements within Israel used the scandal as a bludgeon against their opponents. But the truth about Israel's use of a "false flag" had come to international attention.

BLAMING 'RIGHT-WING EXTREMISTS'

A shadowy "right wing" group known as "Direct Action" was accused of the attack on Goldenberg's Deli in Paris on August 9, 1982. Six people died and 22 were injured.
The leader of "Direct Action" was one Jean-Marc Rouillan. It turned out that Rouillan had been operating in the Mediterranean under the cover name of "Sebas" and had been repeatedly linked to the Mossad. All references to Rouillan's Mossad links were deleted from the official reports issued at the time.

However, the Algerian national news service-which has ties to French intelligence-blamed the Mossad for these activities. Angry French intelligence officers were believed to have leaked this information to the Algerians. Several top French security officials quit in protest over this intra-intelligence community scandal.

This is just one of many such Mossad-orchestrated crimes in which others took the blame. There are others.

FALSE CLUES

On October 3, 1980 a synagogue on Copernicus Street was bombed in Paris. Four bystanders were killed. Nine were injured. The media frenzy which followed the incident was worldwide. Reports held that "right wing extremists" were responsible. Yet, of all of the "right wing extremists" held for questioning, none was arrested. In fact, all were released.

In the upper echelons of French intelligence, however, the finger of suspicion was pointed at the Mossad. According to one report: "On April 6, 1979, the same Mossad terror unit now suspected of the Copernicus carnage blew up the heavily guarded plant of CNIM industries at La Seyne-sur-Mer, near Toulon, in southeast France, where a consortium of French firms was building a nuclear reactor for Iraq.

"The Mossad salted the site of the CNIM bomb blast with 'clues' followed up with anonymous phone calls to police-suggesting that the sabotage was the work of a 'conservative' environmentalist group-'the most pacific and harmless people on earth' as one source put it."

Other Mossad-orchestrated false flag operations also took place on French soil.

BLAMING THE CORSICAN MAFIA

o On June 28, 1978, Israeli agents exploded a bomb under a small passenger car in the Rue Saint Anne, killing Mohammed Boudia, an organizer for the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO). Immediately afterward, Paris police received anonymous phone calls accusing Boudia of involvement in narcotics deals and attributing his murder to the Corsican Mafia. A thorough investigation subsequently established that Mossad special-action agents were responsible for the terrorist killing.

BLAMING THE NEO-NAZIS

o In October, 1976 the same Mossad unit kidnapped two West German students named Brigette Schulz and Thomas Reuter from their Paris hotel. Planted "clues" and anonymous phone calls made it appear that a Bavarian "neo-nazi" formation had executed the abduction. In fact, French intelligence established that the two German youths had been secretly flown to Israel, drugged, tortured, coerced into a false "confession of complicity" in PLO activities, and then anonymously incarcerated in one of the Israeli government's notorious political prisons.

BLAMING THE SOUTH KOREANS

o In February 1977 a German-born, naturalized U.S. citizen named William Jahnke arrived in Paris for some secretive business meetings. He soon vanished, leaving no trace. Paris police were anonymously informed that Jahnke had been involved in a high-level South Korean bribery affair and "eliminated" when the deal went sour.

A special team of investigators from SDECE, the leading French intelligence agency, eventually determined that Jahnke had been "terminated" by the Mossad, which suspected him of selling secret information to the Libyans. Along with other details of this sordid case, the SDECE learned that Jahnke had been "fingered" to the Mossad by his own former employer, the CIA.

BLAMING THE LIBYANS

One of Israel's most outrageous "false flag" operations involved a wild propaganda story aimed at discrediting Libyan leader Muamar Qaddafi, one of Israel's favorite enemies. In the early months of the administration of President Ronald Reagan, the American media began heavily promoting a story to the effect that a "Libyan hit squad" was in the United States for the express purpose of assassinating Reagan. This inflamed public sentiment against Libya and there were repeated calls for blood.

Suddenly, however, the "hit squad" stories vanished. In fact, it was ultimately discovered that the source of the story was one Manucher Ghorbanifar, a former Iranian SAVAK (secret police) agent with close ties to the Mossad. Even The Washington Post acknowledged that the CIA itself believed that Ghorbanifar was a liar who "had made up the hit-squad story in order to cause problems for one of Israel's enemies."

The Los Angeles Times itself had already blown the whistle on Israel's scare stories. "Israeli intelligence, not the Reagan administration," reported the Times, "was a major source of some of the most dramatic published reports about a Libyan assassination team allegedly sent to kill President Reagan and other top U.S. officials... Israel, which informed sources said has 'wanted an excuse to go in and bash Libya for a longtime,' may be trying to build American public support for a strike against [Qaddafi], these sources said
In other words, Israel had been promoting the former SAVAK agent, Ghorbanifar, to official Washington as a reliable source. In fact, he was a Mossad disinformation operative waving a "false flag" to mislead America.

This was yet another Israeli scheme to blame Libya for its own misdeeds, this time using one "false flag" (Iran's SAVAK) to lay the blame on another "false flag" (Libya). (In Chapter 18 we shall see yet another SAVAK crime carried out on behalf of Israel and its allies in the CIA.)

BLAMING LIBYA AGAIN

Israel's Mossad was almost certainly responsible for the bombing of the La Belle discotheque in West Berlin on April 5, 1986. However, claims were made that there was "irrefutable" evidence that the Libyans were responsible. A U.S. serviceman was killed. President Ronald Reagan responded with an attack on Libya.

However, intelligence insiders believed that Israel's Mossad had concocted the phony "evidence" to "prove" Libyan responsibility. West Berlin police director Manfred Ganschow, who took charge of the investigation, cleared the Libyans, saying, "This is a highly political case. Some of the evidence cited in Washington may not be evidence at all, merely assumptions supplied for political reasons."

BLAMING THE SYRIANS

On April 18, 1986 one Nezar Hindawi, a 32 year old Jordanian was arrested in London after security guards found that one of the passengers boarding an Israeli plane bound for Jerusalem, Ann Murphy, 22, was carrying a square, flat sheet of plastic explosive in the double bottom of her carry-on bag. Miss Murphy told security men that the detonator (disguised as a calculator) had been given to her by her finance, Hindawi. He was charged with attempted sabotage and attempted murder.

Word was leaked that Hindawi had confessed and claimed that he had been hired by Gen. Mohammed Al-Khouli, the intelligence director of the Syrian air force. Also implicated were others including the Syrian Ambassador in London. The French authorities warned the British Prime Minister that there was more to the case than met the eye-that is, Israeli involvement. This was later confirmed in repeated reports in the Western press.

BLAMING THE PLO

In 1970, King Hussein of Jordan was provided with incriminating intelligence that suggested the Palestine Liberation Organization was plotting to murder him and seize power in his nation. Infuriated, Hussein mobilized his forces for what has become known as the 'Black September' purge of the PLO. Thousands of Palestinians living in Jordan were rounded up, some of the leaders were tortured, and in the end, masses of refugees were driven from
Jordan to Lebanon.

New data, coming to light after the murder of two leading Mossad operatives in Larnaka, Cyprus suggested that the entire operation had been a Mossad covert action, led by one of its key operatives, Sylvia Roxburgh, who was also known as Sylvia Rafael and is believed to have been born Esther Paltzur.

Miss Roxburgh contrived an affair with King Hussein, known for his weakness for beautiful women, and served as the linchpin for one of the Mossad's major "cover and deception" coups designed to destabilize the Arabs.

In 1982, just when the PLO had abandoned the use of terrorism, the Mossad spread disinformation about "terror attacks" on Israeli settlements along the northern border in order to justify a full-scale military invasion of Lebanon. Years later, even leading Israeli spokesmen, such as former Foreign Minister Abba Eban, admitted that the reports of "PLO terrorism" had been contrived by the Mossad.

THE ISRAELI DIPLOMAT

It is also worth noting that the attempted assassination-in London-of Israeli Ambassador to England, Shiomo Argov, was initially blamed upon the PLO. The attempted assassination was cited by Israel as one of its excuses for its bloody 1982 incursion into Lebanon.
Yet, ironically, the diplomat in question was considered one of Israel's "doves" and inclined toward a friendly disposition of Israel's longtime conflict with the PLO. He was the least likely target of PLO wrath. What's more, one of the suspects in the crime was found carrying a "hit list" which actually included the name of the head of the PLO office in London.

In fact, it appears that the assassination attempt was carried out by the Mossad-under yet another "false flag"-for two purposes: (a) elimination of a domestic "peacenik" considered friendly toward the Palestinians; and (b) pinning yet another crime on the Palestine Liberation Organization.

WHO IS POINTING THE FINGER?

These instances cited here are but a handful of Mossad-orchestrated "false flag" operations blamed on a wide variety of alleged "suspects."

The evidence suggests that the assassination of John F. Kennedy was yet another "false flag" conspiracy by Israel's Mossad and its collaborators in the American CIA. In the JFK assassination, the "Mafia" and the "antiCastro Cubans" were set up as potential fall guys. Even Castro and the Soviets have been implicated. Everybody, it seems, has been fingered but the Mossad.

It was the Mossad and its allies in the CIA and in the controlled American media who have been doing all the fingering. Everybody being blamed by the Mossad and its CIA allies were implicated-one way or the other-and everybody, as a consequence, had a stake in the cover-up.

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New-York-based entertainment executive named DeWest Hooker who meet with Joe Kennedy in Palm Beach Florida in 1956

"[Joe] Kennedy said, 'I've done everything I can to fight the Jewish power over this country. I tried to stop World War II, but I failed. I've made all the money I need and now I'm passing everything I've learned on to my sons."

"I don't go with the 'loser',"[Joe] Kennedy told me. 'I've joined the 'winners.' I'm going to work with the Jews. I'm teaching my boys the whole score and they're going to work with the Jews. I'm going to make Jack the first Irish Catholic President of the United States and if it means working with Jews, so be it..."

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KENNEDY AND CRIME

It took the family of Chicago Mafia boss Sam Giancana to fill in the missing pieces of the puzzle. According to Sam Giancana (nephew of the Windy City mobster) and Chuck Giancana (brother of the mobster), JFK - and his father - had indeed double-crossed organized crime.

According to the Giancanas, Detroit's "Jewish Mafia," the so-called "Purple Gang" had put out a contract on Joe Kennedy's life for bringing illegal liquor through their territory without their permission during the Prohibition days. However, Kennedy Sr. had gone to Chicago to beg for his life and the Chicago Mafia bosses intervened on his behalf, saving his life. As the Giancana's put it: "Ever after, Kennedy was in Chicago's debt."

The relationship went much deeper, however. According to the Giancanas: "Kennedy's ties to the underworld intersected at a hundred points. Besides making a fortune in bootlegging, Kennedy had made a financial killing in Hollywood in the twenties-with the help of persuasive behind-the-scenes New York and Chicago muscle.

"When Prohibition came to a close, as part of a national agreement between the various bootleggers, Kennedy held on to three of the most lucrative booze distributorships in the country-Gordon's gin, Dewar's, and Haig & Haig-through his company, Somerset Imports."
The Giancanas also say that it was Sam Giancana who smoothed things over with Frank Costello on Joe Kennedy's behalf after Ambassador Kennedy had snubbed the New York mobster. According to the Giancanas, Kennedy was concerned about his son's burgeoning political career and it was at that point that he agreed to cut a deal with organized crime in order to ensure smooth sailing-and in order to get Frank Costello, in Kennedy's words, "off my back."

A PROMISE TO THE MOB

After Joe Kennedy begged for [Sam] Giancana's assistance at a meeting in Chicago, Giancana reportedly said, "I've heard nothing today that leads me to think that you can promise me anything in return for my assistance."

"Kennedy responded: "I can. And I will. You help me now, Sam, and I'll see to it that
Chicago-that you-can sit in the godamned Oval office if you want. That you'll have the President's ear. But I just need time."

Kennedy told Giancana, "He'll be your man. I swear to that. My son - the President of the United States - will owe you his father's life. He won't refuse you, ever. You have my word."

JFK, THE MAFIA AND MEYER LANSKY

It was during the 1960 Democratic Presidential primary campaign that the Kennedys once again turned to Giancana for critical Mafia support. In fact, according to the Giancanas, the Kennedys - father and son - actually met with Sam Giancana to work out a joint agreement of mutual support before - and after - the election. As Giancana summarized the agreement: ' "I help get Jack elected and, in return, fills off the heat. It'll be business as usual."

Mafia money poured into critical primary states such as West Virginia (where many local political leaders were on the Mafia "pad") and by convention time, JFK was virtually assured the presidential nomination. Although New Orleans Mafia boss Carlos Marcello preferred Texas Senator Lyndon Johnson, an agreement was cut, and a Kennedy-Johnson ticket was set in place. The Democratic ticket was ready for the fall election.

It turns out, too, that JFK himself was busy with other mob figures other than Sam Giancana, although the history books have discreetly ignored JFK's other crime connections, preferring instead to focus on the Italian-American "Mafia" figures.

According to FBI documents and wiretaps, JFK himself had "direct contact" with Meyer Lansky himself during the 1960 presidential campaign, presumably for the purpose of shoring up mob support for his presidential campaign-a pact that would ultimately prove to have been a proverbial deal with the devil.

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In a private letter to Jewish American historian Alfred Lilienthal, himself a vocal critic of Israel, Kennedy did, however, reveal his feelings toward the Middle East conflict. The letter, written on September 30, 1960, read in part: "I wholly agree with you that American partiality in the Arab) Israeli conflict is dangerous both to the U.S. and the Free World-66 In 'Lilienthal's judgment, Kennedy's comment was "one of the most significant and perspicacious Middle East statements" ever made by any American political figure.

But Kennedy had already cut his deals. Not only organized crime-but the Israeli lobby (of which Meyer Lansky was a critical supporter)-had their claims on John F. Kennedy.

After the election, they expected Kennedy to pay up. In the general election, it was a narrow Kennedy victory over the Republican candidate, Vice President Richard M. Nixon.
The role of the Chicago Democratic political machine (under the thumb of Mafia boss Sam Giancana) in stealing Illinois votes on behalf of the Kennedy-Johnson ticket is now well known and a widely accepted part of American political history.

Sam Giancana and his allies in organized crime-including Meyer Lansky and the Israeli lobby-were confident that they had themselves a president.

... Soon after JFK assumed the presidency, an unexpected war on organized crime began. Robert Kennedy, who had cut his teeth prosecuting mobsters as a counsel for the Senate's "rackets committee," was named attorney general and it was apparent that he was taking his new job seriously.

According to Sam Giancana, "It's a brilliant move on Joe [Kennedy] 's part. He'll have Bobby wipe us out to cover their own dirty tracks and it'll all be done in the name of the Kennedy 'war on organized crime.' Brilliant. Just fuckin' brilliant."

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... Angry at his campaign experiences with the Israeli lobby's fundraisers, Kennedy appointed a bipartisan commission in 1961 to recommend ways to broaden "the financial base of our presidential campaigns."

According to Seymour Hersh, "In a statement that was far more heartfelt than the public or the press could perceive, [Kennedy] criticized the current method of financing campaigns as 'highly undesirable' and 'not healthy' because it made candidates 'dependent on large financial contributions of those with special interests."

In 1962 Kennedy submitted five bills to reform campaign financing to Congress and in 1963 two more such bills. But none of those bills survived, having been beaten back by the very special interests that Kennedy sought to counter.

... There have been widespread rumors, for nearly a generation, that JFK was planning to issue interest-free money-so-called "greenbacks" independent of the stranglehold of the privately-owned Federal Reserve System. In fact, interest-free United States Notes were issued during JFK's presidency.

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There is no question, however, but that JFK-once firmly established in the presidency-fully intended to move against the Federal Reserve money monopoly. In fact, during his private meeting with DeWest Hooker, described earlier in these pages, JFK's father, Ambassador Joseph P. Kennedy, assured Hooker that an ultimate long-term aim of the Kennedy dynasty would be the destruction of what the senior Kennedy described as "the Rothschild-dominated Federal Reserve."

This alone could have assured JFK's removal from the White House.

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Assassinations_page/Chapters_One-Four_FJ.html

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New-York-based entertainment executive named DeWest Hooker who meet with Joe Kennedy in Palm Beach Florida in 1956

"[Joe] Kennedy said, 'I've done everything I can to fight the Jewish power over this country. I tried to stop World War II, but I failed. I've made all the money I need and now I'm passing everything I've learned on to my sons."

"I don't go with the 'loser',"[Joe] Kennedy told me. 'I've joined the 'winners.' I'm going to work with the Jews. I'm teaching my boys the whole score and they're going to work with the Jews. I'm going to make Jack the first Irish Catholic President of the United States and if it means working with Jews, so be it..."

Not to sidetrack (but what the hey, this is nutzpah). One has to wonder, at this point, whether even the circumstances surrounding the death of Joe jr. during WWII can be taken at face value.

HE ACTUAL TRAGIC MISSION

NAVY CROSS
Joe Kennedy saw his chance to become a hero. He was eager to go, and was a very experienced pilot. The system to be used was to load a B-24 with explosives, using two pilots, and the installation of an arming pin to prevent accidental ignition of the explosives. The target was Mimoyecques, France. A P-38 weather plane reported acceptable conditions, it was a go. Kennedy and his co-pilot Bud Willy took off at 5:55PM. The safety pin had been properly installed in the arming unit. Fourteen other aircraft gathered in formation with the "flying bomb". The lead plane was a B-17. There were two P-38s to accomplish aerial photography over the target. Also included were two Mosquito bombers, one to monitor weather, the other flown by Elliot Roosevelt, the son of the President of the United States. Another B-17 acted as a signal relay over the channel, with six P-51s as escort. The flying bomb was followed by two Lockheed Venturas which are believed to have been the "mother" guidance planes. This armada after hooking up in formation flew from Fersfield to Framingham, England, then to Beccles testing their RC equipment. Final test would be made with the B-24 flying alone on Radio Control. They flew from Beccles to Clacton, then took the final turn to head for the target. Both pilots were scheduled to bail out near Dover after preparing the plane to continue to the launch target guided by the mother plane. The actual flight plan called for a flyover Beccles but went further east than intended and flew over Blytheburgh. Kennedy made final preparations to set the plane on remote control. He removed the safety pin, and signaled O.K. with the code phrase "Stay Flush". These would be his last words as the plane exploded at 6:20PM over Blytheburgh.
AFTERMATH AND COVERUP
Joseph Kennedy Jr. was to be the first tragedy to strike the Kennedy Family. Very few parts of the B-24 were found, no bodies.The official crash report indicated the cause of the accident was unknown. Once the safety pin was removed ignition could have been triggered by any aircraft making radio contact with the aircraft. Joe was awarded the Navy Cross posthumously. The Navy Cross was also awarded to his brother in the PT-109 incident. After the accident there was an immediate coverup of the entire accident which was already clouded in secrecy. No information was released for almost 60 years, even now no real disclosure. One point that is pretty hard to swallow, the whole truth is that the mission was pointless. Through a huge intelligence failure it was later disclosed that the target launch site had been severely damaged by RAF raids a week before. They had dropped massive "Tall Boy" bombs on it. So- the disaster was probably unnecessary. It is largely believed this is the reason behind the coverup. 20 years after the war ended the case was opened up, which only raised more questions. Claims bordered on the ridiculous. The Germans claimed they shot the plane down, Joe was captured and later killed in an escape attempt. Other claims were that Joe parachuted and was captured by a Panzer division, and later Kennedy and Willy were both shot. Many articles were published which claimed mostly erroneous information. Finally Elliot Roosevelt, son of FDR, called all of the reports ridiculous and complete nonsense. He was there and saw first hand what happened. He witnessed the useless death of a potentially great American. After all, the U.S. had tried 19 RC bomb test and none of them were successful. Was this mission hushed up and so secret because it was not necessary?
In 1946 a destroyer, the USS Joseph P. Kennedy, JR. was launched. Destroyer number 850, it was the final tribute by the Navy to a gallant officer and his heroic devotion to duty. This ship is now a museum, permanently docked at Battleship Cove, Fall River, Massachusetts. It is a National Historic Landmark and member of the Historic Naval Ships Assoc, a tribute to an American Hero and to those who sailed on Destroyers.
http://www.b-29s-over-korea.com/kennedy_story/kennedy_story02.html
ALSO:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_P._Kennedy,_Jr.
(OPERATION APHRODITE)

Yea, I'm sure that happens. "The False Front" is a very old, and very effective tactic. It's been used against WN many times.

Understood.

What percentage would you think of those investigating 9/11 would agree that the planes were remotely piloted and the calls were faked?

Or is the focus more on the possibility of a controlled demolition at the WTC?

I believe coming to the "remote control" belief is more gradual by those who are investigating it, because the issue is more technical and therefore harder for the average dick to comprehend. Most come to it via another route and after considering the much publicized drones in use today. They ask themselves, "Why wouldn't they have used those means to control the aircraft?" or by finally realizing that the planes were equipped with silent alarms yet none were sounded.

Percentage? That's hard to ascertain, but it is certainly the more sophisticated fact-finders who do.

Controlled demo is widely accepted, especially given that the planes couldn't possibly have brought those buildings down by themselves, particularly and because of building 7's mysterious destruction, as well as the active Thermite/Thermate particles found throughout the rubble. Once they realize that the incindiaries were military grade, and rags had no means of producing them, the lights go on.

We had already had one war with Iraq over Kuwait just a few years prior, which eliminated Iraq as any sort of military threat. Why not reshape then?

The threat to Israel isn't military, it's demographic. Saddam, among other things, was paying $25,000 to families of suicide martyrs. Israel wanted us to crush the independent Arab regimes so the Palis would be demoralized enough that they'd accept any scraps in peace negotiations ("Bantustans"), leaving jews in full control of "Greater Israel" while technically ending the occupation.

For some, this is part of a plan to democratize the Middle East, to shake up the regimes that were put in place during the Cold War, supported by one side or the other that are now, what they think of as strangling the prospects for a Middle East peace solution. They want to go into Iraq, establish Iraq as a 'democratic beacon!'

"In that process, they will encourage people in Syria, in Iran and other countries to rise up and overthrow their regimes; that will in turn help bring about a democratic Palestinian Liberation Organization that will give Israel a true reliable partner to negotiate with, and thus, you can bring about peace in the Middle East. So, in their view, the road to Jerusalem goes through Baghdad, and we have the ability to do this.

http://www.counterpunch.org/fareed03142003.html

Yes, Bush wanted to take out Saddam Hussein for his own personal reasons (he believed that Hussein had actively sought to assassinate his father), and 9/11 offered him the perfect opportunity to do just that, even though Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11, and they knew from the U.N. inspections that Iraq did not have nuclear weapons.

Before 9/11 Bush told Cheney to tell Wolfowitz to STFU about Iraq. Bush had campaigned in favor of a "humble" foreign policy, which was worse for the neocons that even Clinton, whom they despised as gun-shy. Then again, they knew Bush was stupid, which Clinton definitely wasn't.

Remote Controlled Boeings on 9/11?

Flight 77 was steered into the nearly empty, recently reinforced and strengthened sector of the Pentagon

on this page LINKS (http://www.oilempire.us/remote.html)

* Boeing's "auto-land" system
* Pentagon renovation program - the Pentagon was hit in the nearly empty, under reconstruction sector
* The alleged pilot flunked flight school
* Robot Warplanes
* Articles about remote control possibility
* The Lone Gunmen - fictional show about remote control hijacking six months before 9/11 (on Fox TV)
* Dov Zakheim, the Project for a New American Century, Remote Controlled 9/11 Planes and the Pentagon's Missing Trillion Dollars

related pages

* Hijacking the hijackers (via remote control)
* The Complete No Planes on 9/11 Timeline
the "no plane" disinformation probably obscures the reality of remote controlled Boeings

Modern passenger jet planes have multiple alarms to call air traffic control in the event of a hijacking. This is similar to banks that have multiple alarms that can be discreetly activated to sound a silent alarm to call the police. It's probably not public knowledge how many there are on a plane or how they work in a bank - nor is that probably priviledged information the point...... Similarly, plane hijackings were extremely rare in the US before 9/11 due to adequate security, including the Air Force domestic air defense system. However, on 9/11, none of the commandeered planes sent out any alarms that they were being hijacked. If the planes were actually equipped with remote control technologies - which are not theoretical at all - it would have been easy to ensure the transponders would be automatically turned off once the external controllers "hijacked" the plane.

It doesn't constitute proof, but who benefits? Who benefits from having the world's sole remaining superpower declaring war on Islam and Arabs in general? Nobody benefits to the extent that Israel does. It would surprise me if big jew wasn't behind 9/11.

The first time I realised that 9/11 was a big jewy false flag I did so by analysing its aftermath, NOT its technicalities; I didn't even care about remote controlled airplanes or thermite. All I had to do was look at what happened prior to and following 9/11. It becomes clear as day when you focus on the motives instead of the technical tidbits that it was just a pretext for another proxy war for Israel.

It's just too fanciful. Maybe I still hold a shred of goodwill toward ZOG.

If you know the way the military works, it's one huge bureaucracy. Ordering up a missile strike is not a one man job, nor a 5 man job nor even a 20 man job. I don't know exactly how many people would have to be involved, but it would be a big deal. Not the stuff that would allow anyone with getting away with it.

Maybe I'm wrong. The attempted sinking of the USS Liberty, and the withdrawl of the US jets mid flight as they were about to shoot down Israeli Mirages should tell me that ZOG is capable of allowing its military men to be killed if it benefits the Zionist Entity.

I think your assertion that ZOG abides by the laws and all the bureaucracy they're attached to is wishful thinking.

I doubt they do abide by military bureaucracy; more likely than not their orders are off-the-records (and I think that actually qualifies as Black Operations).

That's not to say, however, that you're wrong; but then again, where are all the documents concerning the transportation and use of the missile that was used to "strike" the Pentagon? Maybe they're filed away? Shredded?

Or maybe they don't even exist?

Did the USS Liberty episode also leave behind a paper trail?

You have to ask yourself the correct questions to get the correct answers; that's my take on the subject, as cheesy as it may sound.

...the dozens of phone calls placed from the "hijacked" drones being fabricated (in real time) by the government/Mossad using voice-morphing technology.

To me personally, that sounds extremely unlikely, to the point of dismissal offhand.

Have you considered the possibility that perhaps those phone calls were recorded in a studio and then used as "evidence"?

I have never seen any cellphone work within an airborne airplane.

I'm not asserting that that's what happened; I'm just presenting a reasonable inquiry.

The question is, WHY WERE THESE FRAMES FABRICATED, if there was no skullduggery?

The Video Frames as Bait

A common interpretation of why the frames were released and what they show about the attack is exemplified in the video Painful Deceptions . It suggests that the frames were released in order to quell a growing chorus among skeptics that no plane hit the Pentagon. The images became public not long after French researcher Thierry Meyssan published his book, L'effroyable Imposture (The frightening Fraud), explaining his theory that the damage to the Pentagon resulted from a truck bomb rather than a plane crash. These theorists were quick to point out that, rather than supporting the official story, the frames show three things:

* The apparent plane mostly obscured by the foreground structure in the first frame is much too small to be a Boeing 757.
* The apparent vapor trail behind the apparent plane could not have been produced by the turbofan engines of a jetliner. It is consistent with the exhaust plume of a missile.
* The white color of the explosion in the second frame cannot be explained as the combustion of jet fuel. It indicates the use of explosives.

Ignoring or misrepresenting the physical and eyewitness evidence that a jetliner hit the Pentagon, theorists who seized on the video frames as evidence for the small plane and missile theories. The failure of officials to release additional frames, ones that might show the plane clearly and reveal the first moments of the explosion, seemed to validate the five frames. Although peculiarities in the timecodes on the bottom of the cropped versions of the frames were widely noted, few bothered to ask whether the imagery in the frames had been edited.

Painful Deceptions suggests that the Pentagon officials responsible for releasing the frames were simply too stupid to anticipate that skeptics would use them to attack the official story that Flight 77 hit the Pentagon. But were the people covering up such a meticulously planned crime really so careless? We will revisit this question after examining the images for tampering.

Motive for Fabrication

This evidence that the video frames were manipulated, though not conclusive, further discredits the idea that the release of these images was just a miscalculation on the part of people involved in the cover-up. The source of these images must have known that they show a vapor trail, an obscured aircraft that is clearly not a 757, and an explosion that could not have resulted from jet fuel combustion alone. It is unreasonable to think that this set of five frames is anything other than a planned part of the cover-up. They fueled theories that the Pentagon crash involved a small plane and a missile, rather than a jetliner such as Flight 77. The perpetrators have correctly predicted that controversy between people rejecting and insisting that Flight 77 crashed at the Pentagon would divide skeptics.
The Pentagon Video Frames as Bait (http://911research.wtc7.net/pentagon/analysis/videoframes.html)

Please note that the author didn't bother to post his name, smacking of disinfo.
http://911myths.com/Remote_Takeover.pdf

We had one of the JTF guys bragging that the JTF had been the ones who brought down JFK Jr's plane.

Not sure what happened in that case though. Haven't heard of anyone being arrested.

We had one of the JTF guys bragging that the JTF had been the ones who brought down JFK Jr's plane.

Not sure what happened in that case though. Haven't heard of anyone being arrested.

There is a plethora of info, some suggesting that it was the usual suspects. Interesting to note that he had political ambitions.
http://www.google.com/search?q=jfk+jr+murdered&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

Yep, that's pretty much how most would react.

They would immediately say, hey pal, I like the way you're thinking, but I really don't think we have the capacity for that big an event. There's no way we can do four at once without some kind of screwup. I mean, anyone who has taken an airline knows how spotty they are, how delays happen for no reason. If anything went wrong, we wouldn't be able to adjust.

My point is, no one would even think about something as gloriously huge as '9/11,' except as sheer fantasy. It's like a summer stock company putting on a full-scale broadway show: they simply don't have the wherewithal to pull it off.

My point is, '9/11' is the sort of thing that would only seriously occur to a party that already had 90% of the technics in its toolkit. You would never even think about trying such a difficult and mammoth project unless:

1) there was a huge upside to justify that downside
2) you had all the money, men and materials you needed in fairly easy reach

The Mossad is the only group that has these things AND has a huge incentive to use them to create a pretext for a war to entrench its nation's power in the middle east.Along that same vein a question I've seldom seen addressed is the choice of target.
Like you, in any investigation I like to put myself in the shoes of the alleged perpetrators and think about how I would pull off a caper.
In this case let us assume, for the sake of argument, that 19 Arab operatives from "Al-Qaeda" did gain control of not one but four commercial airliners, a feat, btw, not accomplished in the US since the infamous DB Cooper some thirty years earlier, I would have to ask myself, after pulling off this unprecedented feat, would I crash these planes into a strategically valuable target like a nuclear power facility or a hydro-electric dam or militarily essential installation causing untold death and destruction to the "The Great Satan" or would I fly my jihad jets into a jew owned, insured up the wazoo, white elephant of an office complex whose destruction would be more of a propaganda coup to my enemy than to the people I purportedly represent?
I think the answer is obvious.

Indian Point Nuclear Power Plant was directly under the flight path of the first plane to strike the WTC. If it were truly jihadists, wouldn't they have hit it and thereby taken NYC & New England off the American map?

One would think so. That would make for one helluva 'dirty bomb'.

One would think so. That would make for one helluva 'dirty bomb'.
It is also true, that if mossad and/or ZOG had done it, they would have avoided that target. There were too many jews and financial assets in the path of the destruction.

Do you understand what proving something means?

You two-digit IQ folks really don't help any cause you're associated with. You think you're helping something by making up with assertions what you can't prove with evidence, and then trying to shout down anyone who points out that the evidence isn't there.

It's possible Forrestal was murdered. It's possible the murderers were jews, or put up to it by jews. What I said was, you have asserted it without being able to prove it.

Again, do you even have the mental capacity to understand the difference between asserting something and proving it?
There are many things we take for granted without proof. I was merely stating that John Liberty isn't alone in his beliefs.

You see it as an attack on your assertion. It was not, it was only food for thought and a place to begin looking into it for any who were interested. I was curious, so I searched it and posted what I found.

Why don't you come off that 2-digit I.Q. crap? It isn't at all helpful.

It is also true, that if mossad and/or ZOG had done it, they would have avoided that target. There were too many jews and financial assets in the path of the destruction.

They really did pick "Hollywood" targets, didn't they? It's almost like the planners had minds of media moguls, not army generals.

We had one of the JTF guys bragging that the JTF had been the ones who brought down JFK Jr's plane.



I think he was probably just an inexperienced pilot.

They really did pick "Hollywood" targets, didn't they? It's almost like the planners had minds of media moguls, not army generals.
Yep, they were show-targets, not the most potent military ones. More symbolic than effective.

They really did pick "Hollywood" targets, didn't they? It's almost like the planners had minds of media moguls, not army generals.



It probably had more to do with the (extremely inexperienced) hijackers being able to actually find the target(s).

Approaching NYC from the air, it would be very easy to target the WTC complex.

The Pentagon would also be easy to identify from the air.

So would the nuclear reactor, they are huge and obvious. Right on the river.
These, if hit, would have destroyed 7,854 square miles of America, including all of NYC.

http://cmsimg.thejournalnews.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?Site=BH&Date=20101228&Category=NEWS01&ArtNo=12280329&Ref=AR&MaxW=318&Border=0

Impacts of a Terrorist Attack at Indian Point Nuclear Power Plant

.....Many question whether the NRC's security and emergency planning requirements at Indian Point are adequate, given its attractiveness as a terrorist target and the grave consequences for the region of a successful attack.

....We find that, depending on the weather conditions, an attack could result in as many as 44,000 near-term deaths from acute radiation syndrome or as many as 518,000 long-term deaths from cancer among individuals within fifty miles of the plant. These findings confirm that Indian Point poses a severe threat to the entire New York metropolitan area.

A 1982 study by Sandia National Laboratories found that a core meltdown and radiological release at one of the two operating Indian Point reactors could cause 50,000 near-term deaths from acute radiation syndrome and 14,000 long-term deaths from cancer. (This says nothing of the fuel rod storage units located there as well.)

"Worst-case" scenarios are precisely the ones that terrorists have in mind when planning attacks.

....since such attacks would most likely not occur at random, but would be timed to coincide with weather conditions that favor greater casualties.

For a successful attack at one of the two operating Indian Point reactors, we find that

* The number of near-term deaths within 50 miles, due to lethal radiation exposures received within seven days after the attack, is approximately 3,500 for 95th percentile weather conditions, and approximately 44,000 for the worst case evaluated. Although we assumed that the ten-mile emergency planning zone was entirely evacuated in these cases, this effort was inadequate because (according to Entergy's own estimate) it would take nearly nine and one half hours to fully evacuate the ten-mile zone, whereas in our model the first radiological release occurs about two hours after the attack.

The number of long-term cancer deaths within 50 miles, due to non-acutely lethal radiation exposures within seven days after the attack, is almost 100,000 for 95th percentile weather conditions and more than 500,000 for the worst weather case evaluated. The peak value corresponds to an attack timed to coincide with weather conditions that maximize radioactive fallout over New York City.

The economic damages within 100 miles would exceed $1.1 trillion for the 95th percentile case, and could be as great as $2.1 trillion for the worst case evaluated, based on Environmental Protection Agency guidance for population relocation and cleanup. Millions of people would require permanent relocation.
Impact of a Terrorist Attack on ONE reactor @ Indian Point Nuclear Power Plant (http://www.ucsusa.org/nuclear_power/nuclear_power_risk/sabotage_and_attacks_on_reactors/impacts-of-a-terrorist-attack.html)

I guess if an one jet airliner can take down a skyscraper all by itself than a nuclear containment dome shouldn't be a problem. right, jonathan shitskin? right, george witzgirl?

Those containment domes are single wall, they would be easy. If they were to breach the concrete ponds which hold the fuel rod storage, the entire plant could melt down and the contamination might never be controlled or cleaned up.

The radius for the initial exposure is 50 miles, the long term exposure would be 100 miles and the safety zone would likely be double that. Just imagine (if you can) what the real catastrophic costs would be, long term.

But still those dirty, freedom hatin', A-rabs would have rathered waste their golden, once-in-five-lifetimes, opportunity to take down WTCs #1, #2, & #7.

The last 10 years the Al Quaeda 'sleeper cells' in the US have sure been active. That enough should attest to the bullshit we are fed.
The next Israeli false flag surprise may be exponentially worse, 30,000 instead of a mere 3.